Futurechurch to Pilla: Get Lost ("If JCU refuses to ban us what can the diocese do?")

http://www.cleveland.com/cuyahoga/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/cuyahoga/1082971852245443.xml ^ | April 26, 2004 | James F. McCarty

[Diago]

But in an e-mail to other Future Church leaders, one member said a priest close to Pilla told her the group should not expect any sympathy from Cathedral Square.

" 'It's not your church, it's Jesus' church,' " she quoted the priest as saying. " 'If you don't like the church, then leave.' "

Catholic reformers contest new edict 04/26/04James F. McCarty Plain Dealer Reporter An influential group of liberal-minded Catholic reformers is debating a response to Bishop Anthony Pilla, who recently banned the organization from meeting on Diocese of Cleveland property. Future Church, which claims more than 800 members locally, advocates allowing priests to marry and women to be ordained as the best ways to alleviate clergy shortages. The group had operated unrestricted in the Cleveland diocese for more than a decade. But the truce ended unexpectedly April 1 after Pilla issued an edict to all pastors. "Future Church is not an organization affiliated with the Catholic Diocese of Cleveland, nor does it have the support or approval of the bishop of the diocese," Pilla's warning read. "Future Church is an independent organization of individuals who promote an agenda that is not consistent with the teachings of the Roman Catholic Church," the statement continued, and the group's activities are "not appropriate" at church institutions or facilities. An internal debate over how to respond has been raging ever since via e-mail exchanges among Future Church leaders. Some members are urging the group's executive director, Sister Christine Schenk, to appeal directly to the Vatican's ambassador, the Papal Nuncio, in Washington, D.C. Others recommend a more deliberate approach, hoping to preserve some semblance of the status quo. "We're puzzled and saddened by the description of us as not being in line with Catholic teaching," Schenk said recently. "We have some of the best Catholics in the diocese as members." In a statement posted Friday on Future Church's Web site, Schenk said the group's beliefs are consistent with the church's teachings, and called on the bishop to open discussions on the issues of priestly celibacy, the inequality of women in the church and increased participation of all baptized Catholics in church ceremonies. Diocesan officials have declined to discuss Future Church or the bishop's edict. Spokesman Bob Tayek referred a reporter to Pilla's statement on the group as the final word on the controversy. But in an e-mail to other Future Church leaders, one member said a priest close to Pilla told her the group should not expect any sympathy from Cathedral Square. " 'It's not your church, it's Jesus' church,' " she quoted the priest as saying. " 'If you don't like the church, then leave.' " Future Church was founded in Cleveland in 1991 to oppose the decision by American bishops to allow laymen to administer communion at Sunday services when no priests are available. Its founders argued that a better way of dealing with the shortage of priests would be to let priests marry and women to be ordained. The group claims more than 5,000 members nationwide - including bishops, priests, nuns and lay parish leaders. Included among the diocesan properties deemed off-limits by Pilla is St. Mark Church in the West Park neighborhood of Cleveland, where Future Church has its offices. St. Mark's pastor, the Rev. Doug Koesel, did not respond to telephoned and written requests for comment. But e-mailed messages among Future Church members describe him as concerned about a growing alienation from Pilla among diocesan priests and predicting that the ban on the group could actually boost its standing in the community. In one e-mail to the group's leadership, Schenk weighed the potential outcomes: "My guess is that if pastors refuse to ban us and JCU and the CSJs [John Carroll University and the Sisters of St. Joseph, which host Future Church events] refuse to ban us, what can the diocese do? Kick out a priest for allowing discussion when they haven't kicked them out for sexually abusing kids?" To reach this Plain Dealer reporter: jmccarty@plaind.com, 216-999-4153 © 2004 The Plain Dealer. Used with permission. Copyright 2004 cleveland.com. All Rights Reserved.

[Diago]

Conservative group fights Future Church 04/26/04James F. McCarty Plain Dealer Reporter Bishop Anthony Pilla is not alone in wanting to rid the Diocese of Cleveland of the liberal reform group known as Future Church. A loose-knit group of conservative Catholics calling itself Save Our Church has dedicated itself to preserving the traditional moral and theological teachings of the church - and to thwart Future Church wherever possible. David Webster, a former Baptist minister who is now Save Our Church's executive director, estimates that his group has 40 or 50 members, compared to the 800 Future Church claims as members. Webster, 59, of Lagrange, describes himself as a "reformed anti-Catholic." He communicates with his members via the Internet and occasionally holds meetings at their homes to pray for insight and knowledge, and to "get our hearts and minds straight." Most of all, they pray for the souls of Future Church members, whom Webster accuses of advocating witchcraft and abortion, of disavowing the existence of the Holy Trinity and of scheming to destroy the church in its present form - accusations that Future Church's executive director, Sister Christine Schenk, denies as ludicrous. Occasionally, the groups confront each other at Future Church events - a strategy Webster calls "prayerful protests." The tactic involves Save Our Church members kneeling in the back of the audience and praying the rosary. Sometimes the protesters wear sashes and carry signs. But their mutual opposition to Future Church does not mean Save Our Church and Pilla are allies. Criticizing the bishop as a "Force of Darkness," Webster has called on Pilla to retire, and has vowed to engage in "earnest and sustained prayer and fasting" until he complies. Webster has posted writings on his Web site accusing Pilla of mistreating sex-abuse victims and their families, of promoting homosexuality and dissident clergy, and of giving "foul-mouthed heretics" free rein in the diocese. "This man is a liar," Webster said in a recent interview. "Hiding things and being dishonest are the worst of things, and typical of this diocese." Diocesan spokesman Bob Tayek declined to describe the bishop's view of Save Our Church. Schenk said she has opened her arms to Save Our Church members but has been rejected. "It seems to me that it's a very ultra-conservative Catholic group that's having a temper tantrum because things are not going their way," Schenk said. "It's very hard to take them seriously." The two groups' latest run-in was last month, when Save Our Church organized a peaceful protest at the site of a Future Church event scheduled at St. Edward High School. But a persistent "underground warfare" phone campaign by Webster's followers persuaded the school to rescind an offer for retired Bishop Albert Ottenweller to speak at the Lakewood campus. The event was moved to the St. Joseph's Center on Rocky River Drive, where 230 people attended. Still, Webster considered it a victory. "We got one canceled," Webster said. "It was wonderful. They crawled back into their hole over there" at the St. Joseph center. To reach this Plain Dealer reporter: jmccarty@plaind.com, 216-999-4153 © 2004 The Plain Dealer. Used with permission. Copyright 2004 cleveland.com. All Rights Reserved.

[Diago]

Also a while back Mark Shea posted the AOL profile of the Futurechurch priest from St. Mark's, Father Doug, who refused comment in the above article:

http://www.markshea.blogspot.com/2002_12_01_markshea_archive.html

What follows is from his blog:

________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

You thought I was kidding about the FutureChurch part? Nope. Same addresses:


FutureChurch
15800 Montrose Avenue
Cleveland, Ohio 44111 USA
Phone: 216.228.0869 | Fax: 216.228.4872
E-mail: info@futurechurch.org

St. Mark Church
15800 Montrose Avenue
Cleveland, Ohio 44111
E-mail: doughk@aol.com

And by the way, if you have aol you may want to check out Father Doug's personal profile.

Name: you really wanna ask?
Cleveland, Ohio
Single 6'5", 250
sports, wrestling, cards, golf, piano, sci-fi, theatre, politics

Jeepers! What a hipster! How can somebody as in tune and spiritual as him bother with a bunch of screaming brats. Put a latte machine in the vestibule!

[Salvation]

This is beginning more and more to look like an issue calling for conservative Catholics to take ACTION!

[Salvation]

FutureChurch

A regional parish-based coalition seeking to address the priest shortage. FutureChurch claims the remedy is the ordination of married men and women. FutureChurch engages in educational presentations to parishes, grass-roots organizations, and the media. Its current project is a nationally-promoted dialogue on an "inclusive priesthood." Member of Catholic Organizations for Renewal.

From Our Lady's Warriors>Dissent>Dissenting Organizations

[Diago]

Everything that happens in this diocese is strange. About a month ago, rumours began that Bishop Pilla had submitted his retirement papers and/or he had asked that a coadjutor be appointed.

Still, on March 10, the parish bulletin at Diocese of Cleveland Cathedral was advertising a Futurechurch event:

http://www.saveourchurch.org/cathbishotten.pdf

Some believe the Vatican must have intervened here. We have been making a lot of noise about Futurechurch and several folks have told me they had contacted Cardinals in the US and in Rome.

Still, at teacher at the Diocese of Cleveland Semianry is set to be the keynote speaker at an upcoming Futurechurch event:

From the Call to Action website calendar of upcoming 2004 events:

http://www.cta-usa.org/calendar.html

June 8 - The Biblical Roots of Eucharist. George Smiga at Annual Celebration of Corpus Christi. FutureChurch, Cleveland. 216-228-0869.

*******So who is this George Smiga guy?

---

From the Cleveland Institute of Ecumenical Studies:

http://www.oldstonechurch.org/cleveland_ecumenical_institute.htm

Fr. George Smiga, S.T.D. received his doctorate from the Gregorian University in Rome and teaches as part of the scripture department of St. Mary Seminary and Graduate School of Theology in Wickliffe, Ohio. He is the author of Pain and Polemic: Anti-Judaism in the Christian Gospels. He is a priest of the Catholic Diocese of Cleveland and pastor of St. Noel Parish in Willoughby Hills. Fr. Smiga teaches annually for the Institute, and his courses are always well-attended.

[Desdemona]

Why does it always seem the Jesuits let the wrong people on campus?

This is really wierd.

[StAthanasiustheGreat]

Why would they appeal to the Nuncio, they are Heretics, not going to find a welcoming ear there.

[Diago]

John Carroll University on the guerrilla Girls shortly before they co-cponsored the pro-abortion march in Washingotn:

http://carrollnewsonline.com/files.php?id=520&cat=2

The office of public relations on campus (at John Carroll University) has issued a statement clarifying the mistake and reassuring concerned students and citizens that The Guerilla Girls On Tour is wholesome and fun, with a decidedly Christian message.

March for Women's Lives - Calendar of Events.

Guerrilla Girls On Tour!

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Date:

April 29, 2004

Time:

6:00 pm - 7:15 pm

Title:

Guerrilla Girls On Tour!

Description:

Performance of our signature "GUERRILLA GIRLS ON TOUR GIG" - an entertaining romp through our herstory.

Location:

Western Washington State University "Take Back The Night Rally"

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Bellingham

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WA

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[Diago]

Why would they appeal to the Nuncio, they are Heretics, not going to find a welcoming ear there.

Spin and lies from heretics. Of course they would never do this.

[Unam Sanctam]

" 'It's not your church, it's Jesus' church,' " she quoted the priest as saying. " 'If you don't like the church, then leave.' "

That's encouraging if it is a close associate of Pilla that said it. Now if they would only go further and realize that Jesus' Church should not be promoting homosexual activity or the left-wing ideologies of "gay pride" and "coming out", we would really be making progress.

[Diago]

From the parish bulletin at Christine Schenk's parish, encouraging folks to buy the pro-abortion Cleveland Plain Dealer:

"Too, there’s the religion coverage, including occasional news of our own two St. Malachi parishes and their ministries, provided by Karen Long and David Briggs."

http://www.stmalachi.org/communio/2002/03-10-02.htm

I bring this up because many believe that David Briggs, the PD religion writer, was likely involved in the internal Futurechurch discussion on how to react to the Diocesan statement. He is almost certainly the source of these e-mails which the PD obtained.

[Diago]

I will believe Bishop Pilla has converted when the gay triangle and rainbow gay pride banner are removed from his website. But in the meantime, this sure is an interesting development. Do you think FC will retract its statement in support of the Bishop Pilla:

" 4. The last reason is admittedly self serving: Were Bishop Pilla to be forced out, we would be leaving ourselves open to a new bishop who would most likely be much more conservative and legalistic given the Bishop appointments that have been made in this papacy. The well-known litmus test for being appointed a bishop under John Paul II is that the person must be opposed to birth control, optional celibacy and women priests. I have this information directly from several bishops who are in positions to know. Bishop Pilla is one of the few remaining "pastoral" bishops who were appointed under Archbishop Jean Jadot. If he doesn't outlast the Pope we can expect to have our next Bishop be less open to lay participation in decision making than Bishop Pilla. It will be a given...and something we need to prepare for, IMHO. In any case, why rush things, I say?"

http://www.stmalachi.org/communio/2003/01-26-03.htm#scandal

[NeoCaveman]

St. Mark's pastor, the Rev. Doug Koesel, did not respond to telephoned and written requests for comment. But e-mailed messages among Future Church members describe him as concerned about a growing alienation from Pilla among diocesan priests and predicting that the ban on the group could actually boost its standing in the community.

And Fr. Doug blocks people's email addresses from his mail box if they ask him a question critical of the heretical group known as Future Church

[NeoCaveman]

"We're puzzled and saddened by the description of us as not being in line with Catholic teaching," Schenk said recently. "We have some of the best Catholics in the diocese as members."

And by best she means new agers and Wisdom goddess worshippers.

[Diago]

Included among the diocesan properties deemed off-limits by Pilla is St. Mark Church in the West Park neighborhood of Cleveland, where Future Church has its offices.

This is getting interesting. Father Doug must be feeling some heat.

[Diago]

One thing puzzles me. The diocesan website states:

"The statement below has been used verbally by the Chancery for the past several years. Increased inquiries indicate that distribution of the statement in writing would help to clarify the situation..."

http://www.dioceseofcleveland.org/memo/april2004/chancellor_april2004.htm

And yet, despite the fact that the diocese is saying that they have been using the statement "for the past several years," everyone on every side seems shocked by the statement.

[NeoCaveman]

Father Doug must be feeling some heat.

No wonder he was so bitchy in his reply to me.

[NeoCaveman]

And yet, despite the fact that the diocese is saying that they have been using the statement "for the past several years," everyone on every side seems shocked by the statement.

Several options

1. He said it with a wink, and showed people his crossed fingers
2. No one heard him say it before due to the noise of the rainbow banner flapping in the wind.
3. He's making it up to get out of hot water with the pope.

If I was a betting man, and I am, I'd vote for #3

[Diago]

No wonder he was so bitchy in his reply to me.

Did Father Doug actually reply to you or did he simply block future e-mails. If he replied, what did he say? I am willing to pay for the U-Haul truck and I'll bring a couple friends and a six pack to help move Sister Schenk out.

[NeoCaveman]

His reply is #16 on this thread. It is in response to my email posted at #10.

And now he has me on his email block.

[Diago]

I'm not sured how I missed that. Very strange, as expected.

[johnb2004]

Criticizing the bishop as a "Force of Darkness," Webster has called on Pilla to retire, and has vowed to engage in "earnest and sustained prayer and fasting" until he complies.

Sounds fair to me.

[Diago]

bump