Posted on 10/29/2004 2:41:11 AM PDT by AncientAirs
"why, when you are wrong, don't you have the decency and honor to simply admit it?"
Sinky, that you? What is this, the old "generate support for self by creating additional identities" ploy?
You haven't showed that anyone is wrong on the question of the pre Vat II practices of the Church, or any other element of tradition.
Was wondering how the discussion got sidetracked from shaking hands at Mass to singing.
In post 14 bornacatholic reports on some questionable apocolyptic writing on Angels singing, and that is supposed to end all discussion on singing at Mass, and I assume, shaking hands?? Both nice ploys to ignore the Eucharist and the sacrifice. Sounds like a nice protestant grip and grin meeting.
My post has nothing to do with intellectuals....just mho. I am so tired of going to Mass and hearing Protestant songs, me-me-me songs, foot stomping barn dance songs, songs written by homosexuals, etc. I want to run screaming from church every Sunday but somehow manage to block out enough to concentrate on why I went there in the first place. To worship God.
I don't mind greeters at the church as long as they just nod and say "good morning" or something, however, I sure wouldn't miss them if they weren't there. I'm tired of all the noise in church. I actually turned around and shushed a couple of women that were gossiping loudly before Mass began. How anyone is supposed to pray with that racket going on is beyond me. I wish our priest had the nerve to gently remind people to shut up!!
I would love to go to our "music director" and suggest something other than the "worship aides" they print up in addition to the really bad misselette. I don't have enough knowledge to even give any suggestions. Any help? Any books out there that discuss this? My parents are about to open a bookstore in our church. If we get enough people to read about it, maybe some change could be made. Ideas?
You probably won't believe me because everybody has to find out for themselves, but there isn't any help. Apparently everything is unfolding as planned since the new Mass was introduced. Just like liberals don't seem to "get it" in the world of politics, neither do they "get it" in the world of religion - and they never will.
When I made that discovery I just left the Novus Ordo Church and went to the indult Tridentine Mass, and didn't look back. I recognize the shortcoming, that it is just tolerated within the Church, but it is better than sitting through what you describe.
No, those people won't change, you'll have to do some soul searching.
Wow. That wasn't the answer I wanted but I believe you! I grew up in this church and came back after 10 years of being in other states. Despite the poor music, etc., it's still so much better than the churches I attended before. The liturgical abuses are virtually nil which is a welcome change. In other words, I'm not going to give up yet. I'll just start attending meetings and bring copies of threads like this one to share with everyone I can. I don't have much of a plan but have to start somewhere. If you do ever hear of anything or run across some great article about this subject, would you please FReepmail me? Thank you!! :-)
H.T. HENRY
The expert in Congregational Singing chosen to write the entry "Singing, Congregational" for the Catholic Encyclopedia is more credible than Buckley.
All the citations within the entry prove it so.
Gregorian chant and choral singing are not in any way the same thing as browbeating parishoners to refrain from contemplation and croak along with puerile and musically retarded ditties.
And every citation you've produced has been by somebody bemoaning the *lack* of singing and calling for "reform."
Looks to me like Buckley is well supported.
Pope Pius XII gave additional directives on sacred music in his encyclical, Musicae Sacrae Disciplina (MSD), issued in 1955. MSD encouraged the restoration of chant and studies on polyphony, and repeated the remarks of Pope Pius X on the need for holiness and true art in sacred music. He took note of popular religious singing and permitted hymns in the vernacular to be sung at "low Masses"2. Vernacular musical texts, however, were not permitted at the sung "high Mass" because of a requirement that all liturgical texts be sung in Latin.
Nevertheless at Masses that are not sung solemnly these hymns can be a powerful aid in keeping the faithful from attending the Holy Sacrifice like dumb and idle spectators. They can help to make the faithful accompany the sacred services both mentally and vocally and to join their own piety to the prayers of the priest. (MSD §64)
Buckley is wrong. So are you.
Give it up, sinky. Everything you post just digs you in further.
"Vernacular musical texts, however, were not permitted at the sung "high Mass" because of a requirement that all liturgical texts be sung in Latin."
Yeah...by the choir.
"aid in keeping the faithful from attending the Holy Sacrifice like dumb and idle spectators."
My, he had a high regard for contemplation, didn't he? Still, he wouldn't have written that except to change the situation that obtained: that the parishoners weren't singing.
"They can help to make the faithful accompany the sacred services both mentally and vocally"
They don't want to? Well, we'll make them!
"Buckley is wrong. So are you."
Nah, you are, and everything you post just further undermines your position.
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