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Whence Comes Jewish Self-Hatred?
The Redneck Rastafarian ^ | 11/04/"'04" | The Redneck Rastafarian (Zionist Conspirator)

Posted on 11/04/2004 9:00:40 AM PST by Zionist Conspirator

This essay is being written on US Election Day of "2004." And while the outcome of that contest is not known at this writing to the author (a disadvantage not shared by the reader), one thing that has long been obvious is that the majority of the Jewish vote will go to the candidate preferred by Hamas, Islamic Jihad, and the Palestine Liberation Organization. Jews who are more concerned with the safety of Israel have been scratching their heads and shouting at their fellows to come to their senses. And one of these voices--Ms. Julia Gorin--has pointed out that the "Jewish vote" will probably go not only against the best interests of Israel, but even against the economic interests of American Jews domestically. It seems as if American Jews are literally trying to punish themselves and the Israelis for being Jewish.

At the risk of beating a dead horse (and without necessarily endorsing any particular economic doctrine), I wish to speculate here on the origins of so much of this mania that compels so many Jews to vote and work for their own destruction.

What is it that so many Jews hate? The answer is easy. They hate G-d, religion, and religiosity. And since these are `Am Yisra'el's gifts to the world, they hate `Am Yisra'el. They would deny it, of course. In fact, they would all insist they are "proud Jews." Trouble is, they're not proud of anything Jewish. Hence their venomous hatred of anything that reminds them of who they really are. And note please that most of their hostility is not aimed primarily at Ukrainians or Russian Orthodox or Hispanic Catholics or even Arab chr*stians, but precisely at that one segment of the chr*stian world that loves, supports, and recognizes the Jews as G-d's Chosen People. How embarrassing. Such folk would much rather be labelled "the Devil's people" by a Luther or Chmelnitzky than be idolized by crude bumpkins named Caleb and Jemimah who want to thank them for teaching them that the world was created in six days.

How do such sad specimens create a reality for themselves in which they can be "proud Jews" while hating and opposing everything in Judaism? Simple. They redefine Jewishness to mean something else. More specifically, rather than define it as anything positive, they define it exclusively as the negation of something else. And what is that something else? Why, chr*stianity of course. It seems chr*stianity is the very antithesis of Jewishness and that the sole concern of any "proud Jew" is to be as different from chr*stianity as possible. Very well then. So what constitutes this "chr*stianity," which Jews must fight at all costs? Let's take a look.

"Chr*stianity," it seems, teaches that the world was created in six days. Yuck. Ick. The veritable stuff of nightmares. Ah, but this is only the beginning. Chr*stianity, completely ignoring the "fact" that Charles Darwin found that All Men Are Brothers back when he discovered that life has no purpose, insists that not everyone is the same. Some people are special. Different. Chosen. This is obviously the philosophy that gave Hitler (yimach shemo vezikhro!) to the world.

Furthermore, chr*stianity doesn't appreciate that there's no such thing as right or wrong other than that it is wrong to believe in right or wrong. It has this pesky thing called "morality," which includes such irrational, outmoded taboos as prohibitions of adultery, incest, and homosexuality--taboos which science proved groundless the same day it proved that the universe weeps tears of pain when men force women to use separate restrooms. No sir, "proud Jews," like their founder Voltaire, know that aside from a theoretical "social contract" that has never really existed in which all people "agree among themselves" to pretend that some things are right and others wrong, no objective morality exists (except for those discovered by in the science lab, like the injustice of sexism or speciesism). Clearly chr*stianity is the bane of Jewish existence.

And why do these chr*stians hold such groundless beliefs? They believe in some Tyrant In The Sky who created the world and therefore has the right to define right and wrong (which "proud Jews" know only human beings have the right to do, provided they are the right human beings). Yet this "loving creator" of theirs is obviously merely an arbitrary dictator. And how are they so sure they know what this Tyrant wishes of them? It seems they have this Book which they like to "thump." I wouldn't be surprised if they don't take it out and dance with it and kiss it on occasion.

And of course, as fanatics who follow this invisible Tyrant who they believe created the universe, they actually have the gall to want to force their beliefs on others (something no "proud Jew" would ever do, of course, at least not to "indigenous peoples"). They don't even grant other people the right to their own imaginary beings and moral codes but think they have the "right" to invade other people's lands, exterminate or enslave them, and destroy their altars and idols! Could anything possibly be so un-Jewish? Why, there is even a whole Jewish festival (Chanukkah) dedicated to the right of any people to worship any "gxd" or idol whatsoever! Er, except for people that atheist scientists like to push around because they themselves must bow and scrape to politically powerful multiculturalists.

Imagine . . . an invisible "G-d" that science assures us cannot exist, groundless sexual taboos instead of "scientific" ones against using gender-specific pronouns, a scientifically untenable creation story, and glorification of the genocide of indigenous nations and their quaint religious beliefs! And really . . . what sort of subhuman neanderthals give their kids names like "Jethro?"

That "new testament" is some savage book, isn't it?

By now the reader has seen my (hopefully) rapier-sharp point. All those "chr*stian" things that "proud Jews" hate so much are not chr*stian at all--they are Jewish! There is no six day creation in the "new testament." There is no warrior G-d Who rallies His unfairly chosen nation to conquer a land, enslave or exterminate its people, and destroy its native religions. There isn't even anyone named Jethro. All these things are from the TaNa"KH--every last one of them. And this is what so galls self-hating liberal Jews. They are so filled with guilt and self-loathing for introducing the Big Redneck In The Sky into human history that they are determined to exterminate Jewishness from humanity even at the price of their own lives. How sad, how pathetic, how utterly pathological is the liberal Jew who in order to be able to face himself in the mirror has to define "Jewishness" as war against Judaism. Yet without this redefinition, without this lie that the essence of Jewish identity is opposition to every idea Judaism gave the world, he would be filled with such shame that he might not be able to wait for the terrorists to take his life from him. How can one bear such "guilt?"

How could anyone who holds as his "prime directive" that one "gxd" is as good as another and that anyone has the right to worship anything or nothing according to his own choice call himself a "proud Jew" and live outside the psychiatric ward?

Even the old stereotype about "Jewish Communism vs. chr*stian Fascism" proves my point. The alleged "Jewishness" of Communism rests not on any shared content (does Communism contain a mitzvah to bless G-d after eating?) but exclusively on the sad fact that so many Jews have been prominent in radical movements. The "chr*stianity" of Fascism, however, rests on the the similarity of Fascist corporativism to the "Catholic" social teachings of Pope Leo XIII--teachings found nowhere in the "new testament" but pilfered from the Torah's laws for dividing 'Eretz Yisra'el among the Jews. Wow! Communism is "Jewish" by coloration but Fascism is "Jewish" by content!

Of course, there are still a few tricks the "proud Jew" can play with his heritage: selectively accepting or rejecting those things that fit his distorted self image, for example, or pretending that "historic Judaism" never actually believed any of this stuff but that only chr*stianity ever did. Or pretending that the primitive religion of the "Israelites" (as opposed to "Jews," a favorite distinction of chr*stian anti-Semites) had nothing in common with what we know as "Judaism" but is better represented by chr*stianity, while the rabbis, those sly dogs, were already "undermining" the Torah by "new" interpretations that "softened" and "liberalized" it. Or maybe there is the occasional claim that Jewish Oral Tradition (unknown to chr*stianity) makes the text mean something radically different than what it seems to on the surface, despite the importance of peshat (the plain sense) to all the great commentators and despite the fact that chr*stianity was governed universally by its own oral tradition until Luther . . . and that the heretical Qara'im (a Jewish sect that rejected the oral tradition and rabbinic authority) invented "protestantism" before any chr*stian did. And incidentally, why are the "reform," "conservative," "reconstructionist," "progressive," ad nauseum, "branches of Judaism" treated as though they accepted the Oral Law or rabbinic authority when they are even more radical than the Qara'im in their rejection of it?

And really, why do "proud" Jewish liberals object to J*sus? What did he ever say that offended them? Do they disagree with his heretical pronouncements that universal rationally-derived ethics overrule "irrational" and "man-made" Halakhah? Or that Jews should stop "discriminating" against Samaritans (whom the Men of the Great Assembly intolerantly barred not only from ever converting to Judaism but even of entering the World to Come)? Or that one should pray in one's closet and not in public? Or that a man is not defiled by what he eats (despite the plain fact that HaShem decreed otherwise) but by what "comes out" of him (and not in the old-fashioned, cultic sense!)? And then, of course, there's the fact that the most backward, illiterate, and provincial chr*stian in the world doesn't pray for the restoration of animal sacrifices, which this "rightwing" J*sus allegedly made obsolete. That must really hurt! I mean, right in the store!

What do the "proud Jews" object to in this J*sus? And what to the "neanderthal" rednecks see in him?

It is my opinion that the "proud Jews" who attempt to chr*stianize Judaism so that they may fight against it actually suffer from a profound and advanced case of "J*sus envy."

Personally, I never understood why Yehoshu`a Bin Nun's Redneck Fan Club was so attached to the Liberal from Nazareth. If it weren't for the fact that all Jews are obligated by the Torah (regardless of how mixed up their thinking), I would gladly propose a deal: liberal Jews could take the Nazarene, whom any internally consistent and clear thinking redneck neanderthal would gladly trade for HaShem 'Ish Milchamah, Slayer of Myriads of Heathens. No, seriously. I think some neshamot must have gotten mixed up during gilgul!

Anyway, at the risk (again) of beating a dead horse, this is what I think of "proud Jews" who want to punish themselves for being too rich, too chosen, and descended from the inventors of Bible-Thumping Megalomania.

And now excuse me. I'm thinking of changing my name to Jethro!


TOPICS: Activism; Apologetics; Current Events; Ecumenism; General Discusssion; History; Humor; Judaism; Ministry/Outreach; Moral Issues; Religion & Culture; Religion & Politics; Theology
KEYWORDS: ignorance; jews; liberalism; oxymoron
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Just in case there was anyone left unoffended by my last article . . . !
1 posted on 11/04/2004 9:00:43 AM PST by Zionist Conspirator
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To: SJackson; Alouette

Ping


2 posted on 11/04/2004 9:02:23 AM PST by Zionist Conspirator (Kill 'em all; let HaShem sort 'em out!)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
It's not self hatred, it's fear and loathing of dealing with the reality check that is a put off for liberal jews.

I guess they look at the perceived and inevitable Evangelicals' hidden agenda; specifically, getting the world to Armageddon, and Jesus comes and converts all the Jews and rules Israel. That kind of agenda is not as bad as Muslims converting the infidels by force, nevertheless it has similar elements.

3 posted on 11/04/2004 9:06:18 AM PST by i.l.e.
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Yehuda; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; ...
If you'd like to be on this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.
4 posted on 11/04/2004 2:21:18 PM PST by SJackson ( Bush is as free as a bird, He is only accountable to history and God, Ra'anan Gissin)
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To: SJackson

Was the Jewish vote up to 23% from 2000? I read that percentage somewhere else, maybe Safire.


5 posted on 11/04/2004 2:49:38 PM PST by xJones
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To: Zionist Conspirator

Being a Jew constitutes a religion, therefore, you love God, even if you are a jew that is a communist atheist. Jews here will tell you that.


6 posted on 11/04/2004 2:53:18 PM PST by cynicom (<p)
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To: xJones
Sorry, I meant to say that the 2000 Jewish vote was 19-20%, depending on who you read, and this election's Jewish vote was maybe 23% from what I've read so far.

How did Reagan ever get the alleged 40% of the Jewish vote in 1980? Watershed year in 2004.....

7 posted on 11/04/2004 2:56:30 PM PST by xJones
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To: cynicom

Are Jews Normal?
by Rabbi Manis Friedman

If you ask someone coming out of a church “Do you believe in G-d?” the worshiper is shocked. “What type of question is that? Of course I do, that’s why I’m here.”

But when you walk into a synagogue on Yom Kippur and ask a Jew, “Do you believe in G-d?” the Jew is quiet. “I don’t know, I’m not a rabbi.” “Do you consider yourself religious?” They break into laughter and assure you that they’re the furthest thing from religious. “Are you kidding? Do you know what I eat for breakfast?”

So you ask the logical question. “What are you doing in a synagogue?” But the Jew is shocked. “What type of question is that? It's Yom Kippur!"

To be sure, the worshiper and the Jew are shocked for very different reasons. The worshiper is shocked that you question his belief. The Jew is shocked that you question his Jewishness. Judaism is not a religion that we practice, nor a belief that we prescribe to - it's who we are and what we are.

While the Jew may insist “I don't want to be religious, I don't want to believe in G-d,” on Yom Kippur he’s in a synagogue. Why? G-d wants me here, so here I am.

But isn’t this hypocrisy? On the contrary, Torah views this very irrationality as the essence of the Jew. It is this insanity that makes us Jewish.

Subjective opinions to an objective truth; I am a Jew even if I’m not religious, and G-d is G-d even when I don’t believe.


8 posted on 11/04/2004 2:56:40 PM PST by hlmencken3 (Think good and it will be good!)
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To: cynicom

I think we can safely assume that Jewish neocons don't bring in votes. If we threw over abortion rights and gay marriages we might have a chance.


9 posted on 11/04/2004 3:01:15 PM PST by xJones
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To: hlmencken3

Waiting for the usual suspects to run up the anti-semetic flag. They always appear.


10 posted on 11/04/2004 3:01:18 PM PST by cynicom (<p)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

Though not Jewish, I yet try to keep and make as many mitzvot as I can.


11 posted on 11/04/2004 3:01:54 PM PST by onedoug
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To: Zionist Conspirator

Though not Jewish, I yet try to keep and make as many mitzvot as I can.


12 posted on 11/04/2004 3:04:47 PM PST by onedoug
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To: xJones

Kristol, Wolfowitz and others are not there as Americans. they have their own agenda....


13 posted on 11/04/2004 3:24:32 PM PST by cynicom (<p)
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To: cynicom

Peace be on thee, Louie and read your FRmail. You may want to get bounced, but I hear the cooler is cold and creepy:)


14 posted on 11/04/2004 3:27:11 PM PST by xJones
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To: cynicom

Yep. I'm amazed that FR will ban people for pointing out that Sumner Redstone and George Soros are actually Murray Rothstein and George Schwartz, or for joking about Yiddish, but saying 'Jews hate G-d' or 'Jews are of their father the devil', etc, is considered acceptable!


15 posted on 11/04/2004 3:41:06 PM PST by hlmencken3 (Think good and it will be good!)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
J*sus, chr*stianity

What's the reason you don't spell out the words Jesus and Christianity? Is that your way of saying they are obscene words?

16 posted on 11/04/2004 3:53:45 PM PST by Grey Ghost II
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To: i.l.e.
I guess they look at the perceived and inevitable Evangelicals' hidden agenda; specifically, getting the world to Armageddon, and Jesus comes and converts all the Jews and rules Israel. That kind of agenda is not as bad as Muslims converting the infidels by force, nevertheless it has similar elements.

Traitor, you told!!:)

Yes, to my astonishment, I have learned in the last few years that quite a few Jewish Americans believe Evangelicals practically sit up nights working on our Armageddon planning sessions. I can hear it now, "Yee Haw, and pass the grits! Let's bring on the Jews, and they'll get killed, but we can get the 2nd Comin' over with!"

And that belief is right on par with the firm belief of Saudis that think Jews slaughter gentile children for their blood.

It's ignorance, willfully blind ignorance, and the inability to see that we can make up our own shibboleths.

17 posted on 11/04/2004 3:54:48 PM PST by xJones
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To: Grey Ghost II
What's the reason you don't spell out the words Jesus and Christianity? Is that your way of saying they are obscene words?

Get lost! It is the Jewish time-honored tradition to leave out some vowels, and they write G-d, when referring to the G-d of Abraham, Issac, and Jacob. Do you have a problem with that? I'm a Baptist and you can tell me on the forum if you do.

18 posted on 11/04/2004 4:00:07 PM PST by xJones
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To: xJones

There have been numbers ranging from 22% to 25% based on the exit polls. Depends on who's putting them out. The only non-exit poll data I've seen was from the AJC which put the number in the upper 20s, a 13% pickup of Gore voters from his 80% in 2000, added to GWBs 19% in 2000.


19 posted on 11/04/2004 4:11:53 PM PST by SJackson ( Bush is as free as a bird, He is only accountable to history and God, Ra'anan Gissin)
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To: xJones
Get lost! It is the Jewish time-honored tradition to leave out some vowels, and they write G-d, when referring to the G-d of Abraham, Issac, and Jacob. Do you have a problem with that? I'm a Baptist and you can tell me on the forum if you do.

N0, @nd I don't h@ve a pr%blem with Ebonics e1ther.

20 posted on 11/04/2004 4:15:00 PM PST by Grey Ghost II
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Comment #21 Removed by Moderator

To: hlmencken3
Subjective opinions to an objective truth; I am a Jew even if I’m not religious, and G-d is G-d even when I don’t believe.

You mean G-d's Sovereignty does not depend on whether or not I acknowledge it? I'm shoched--shocked!

22 posted on 11/04/2004 4:23:29 PM PST by Zionist Conspirator (Kill 'em all; let HaShem sort 'em out!)
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To: cynicom
Kristol, Wolfowitz and others are not there as Americans. they have their own agenda....

Seeing as how you don't speak our language well enough to qualify for naturalization, you're obviously not an American either.

23 posted on 11/04/2004 4:26:31 PM PST by Zionist Conspirator (Kill 'em all; let HaShem sort 'em out!)
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To: hlmencken3
Yep. I'm amazed that FR will ban people for pointing out that Sumner Redstone and George Soros are actually Murray Rothstein and George Schwartz, or for joking about Yiddish, but saying 'Jews hate G-d' or 'Jews are of their father the devil', etc, is considered acceptable!

If you are thinking that my article is saying that "Jews are of their father the Devil" (chas vechalilah!) then I will assume it is because you do not understand my sarcasm because you are a newbie.

Have you seen my web site? Have you read the other article I posted here explaining why G-d had to use a chosen nation rather than a "universal" religion or body as His eternal messenger to mankind?

24 posted on 11/04/2004 4:30:59 PM PST by Zionist Conspirator (Kill 'em all; let HaShem sort 'em out!)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

Oh no! I was not aiming at you. I was pre-empting the seemingly inevitable stuff - like from sausagedog and davey crockett...

apologies for causing you distress


25 posted on 11/04/2004 4:35:59 PM PST by hlmencken3 (Think good and it will be good!)
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To: hlmencken3
apologies for causing you distress

Thank you and apologies to you also for misunderstanding.

Vendyl Jones, huh? But what do you do with his "the true Jewish calendar is the solar 'Jubilees' one rather than the Rabbinic one?"

26 posted on 11/04/2004 4:41:01 PM PST by Zionist Conspirator (Kill 'em all; let HaShem sort 'em out!)
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To: cynicom
Kristol, Wolfowitz and others are not there as Americans. they have their own agenda....

What would that agenda be?

I believe you were ranting yesterday on that Jewish invention, Communism, and Jewish Presidential candidate, John Kerry.

Can you provide any facts?

Kristols just a writer, but the idea of an apparent traitor in government is important. Spit the facts out, maybe we can have Wolfowitz arrested.

27 posted on 11/04/2004 4:41:29 PM PST by SJackson ( Bush is as free as a bird, He is only accountable to history and God, Ra'anan Gissin)
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To: xJones

STOP WHINING!!!!!!!!!!!!!


28 posted on 11/04/2004 4:44:37 PM PST by CouncilofTrent (Quo Primum...)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

LOL

Vendyl has a lot of what I consider odd views, including some that don't seem da'as Torah. But he speaks frequently with rebbeim like Benjamin Blech and Adin Steinsaltz, so I cut him a lot of slack. Few do more at promoting the Noahide laws!


29 posted on 11/04/2004 4:51:20 PM PST by hlmencken3 (Think good and it will be good!)
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To: SJackson
Not to be argumentative, but wasn't modernism communism/socialism outlined by Marx (who was jewish)?
30 posted on 11/04/2004 4:52:18 PM PST by CouncilofTrent (Quo Primum...)
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To: hlmencken3
LOL

Vendyl has a lot of what I consider odd views, including some that don't seem da'as Torah. But he speaks frequently with rebbeim like Benjamin Blech and Adin Steinsaltz, so I cut him a lot of slack. Few do more at promoting the Noahide laws!

I hope your admiration of H. L. Mencken (mach shemo) has similar limits.

31 posted on 11/04/2004 4:54:16 PM PST by Zionist Conspirator (Kill 'em all; let HaShem sort 'em out!)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
You know, you pathetic, semi-literate little worm, I tanned your pretentious hide

Stop it now, Cynicom served in the U.S. Air Force, is a Korean War vet and retired with the rank of Captain. He's no "little worm", and don't call an American vet names, that's against FR rules, or don't you know that?

You go looking for anti-semites in all the wrong places. Go over to Liberty Forum, they've a LOT of real anti-semites.

32 posted on 11/04/2004 4:55:48 PM PST by xJones
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To: CouncilofTrent
Not to be argumentative, but wasn't modernism communism/socialism outlined by Marx (who was jewish)?

I thought it was actually "outlined" by Adam Weishaupt, who was "catholic."

Sheesh! There are actually schmucks out there who think pointing out that Karl Marx was Jewish really proves that Abraham and Moses were up to no good???

33 posted on 11/04/2004 4:56:09 PM PST by Zionist Conspirator (Kill 'em all; let HaShem sort 'em out!)
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To: CouncilofTrent

Whining? I thought I was mourning. I really had hoped the Jewish vote would be higher this year.


34 posted on 11/04/2004 4:57:07 PM PST by xJones
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To: CouncilofTrent
Not to be argumentative, but wasn't modernism communism/socialism outlined by Marx (who was jewish)?

Without getting into a longwinded conversation, both Marx and Engels were baptised and raised as Lutherans. Marx's parents were Jews who converted 2-7 years prior to his birth per most sources, I'm not sure about the date of Engels parents conversion. Marx attended a Lutheran school, and dabbled in religous writing in his late teens, though he wasn't very good at it. Before and after Marx cast off all religion, he was a virulent anti-Semite.

35 posted on 11/04/2004 4:58:34 PM PST by SJackson ( Bush is as free as a bird, He is only accountable to history and God, Ra'anan Gissin)
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To: xJones
How did Reagan ever get the alleged 40% of the Jewish vote in 1980?

Because Carter was thought by some to be Anti-Semitic, which he is.

36 posted on 11/04/2004 5:01:54 PM PST by Nonstatist
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To: Zionist Conspirator

Indeed!

He gets something of a bad rap, and knew when he'd turned into a caricature of himself. That's when he retired to scholarly pursuits on the English language.

Besides, who can resist zingers at the pompous political classes?


37 posted on 11/04/2004 5:03:15 PM PST by hlmencken3 (Think good and it will be good!)
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To: xJones
Stop it now, Cynicom served in the U.S. Air Force, is a Korean War vet and retired with the rank of Captain. He's no "little worm", and don't call an American vet names, that's against FR rules, or don't you know that?

I can imagine that all those Jewish North Koreans he fought really soured him on the Jews. But at least now I suppose we know why he's been on here for six years while many others are long gone for saying the same things. I knew he was getting a lot of slack.

You go looking for anti-semites in all the wrong places. Go over to Liberty Forum, they've a LOT of real anti-semites.

You cannot seriously be insisting that the garbage he's been posting attacking the Jews is any different from that offered by all those banned FReepers who make up Liberty Forum and Original Dissent. I'm sorry, but I've been fighting garbage like that for almost twenty-eight years non-stop and my lack of patience with the "Communism is Jewish" crowd makes no exceptions for anyone.

38 posted on 11/04/2004 5:04:21 PM PST by Zionist Conspirator (Kill 'em all; let HaShem sort 'em out!)
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To: hlmencken3
Indeed!

He gets something of a bad rap, and knew when he'd turned into a caricature of himself. That's when he retired to scholarly pursuits on the English language.

Besides, who can resist zingers at the pompous political classes?

No one could be more pompous than someone who believes the world is utterly meaningless attempting to lead a moral/ideological crusade. Then there's that little fact that he called white Southern anti-evolutionists "gaping primates who believe degraded nonsense" while championing the rights of Black Southern Fundamentalists (because, I suppose, "that's different").

39 posted on 11/04/2004 5:09:30 PM PST by Zionist Conspirator (Kill 'em all; let HaShem sort 'em out!)
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To: xJones
ZC may be thinking of comments like Simple, Jews brought us communism, Kerry is a Jew and a communist. One votes for their own., which go undefended. Like it or not that plays into several cookie cutter anti-Semitic canards, both the Judiasm=Communism myth, as valid as Catholicism=National Socialism, the dual loyalty charge, also expressed earlier on this thread (Wolfowitz isn't an American, he has another agenda), as well as the rather distasteful (especially to Christians, how can you evangelize?) concept of the last century that the taint of Judiasm carries forward at least 2 generations, thus Kerry is a Jew. Of course those perceived as good guys, like Barry Goldwater, aren’t Jews.

It’s also worth noting that holding some antisemitic views doesn’t necessarily make one an antisemite.

40 posted on 11/04/2004 5:11:50 PM PST by SJackson ( Bush is as free as a bird, He is only accountable to history and God, Ra'anan Gissin)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

Mencken came from a time, not yet abandoned by the left, when all the world was thought explained by Darwin, Freud and Marx. He only got around to discounting Marx.

A man of his time, he was misanthropic, not just anti-semitic. At his core was the belief that no panacea exists for the world's ills, and that politicians and preachers who claim so are contemptible frauds.

He was personally mild and generous and had a circle of friends that was mostly Jewish! He also devoted a lot of personal time to encouraging black writers.

And, btw, my mother's last name was Menken and my first two initials are H. L. !


41 posted on 11/04/2004 5:35:03 PM PST by hlmencken3 (Think good and it will be good!)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
If you don't hate, or loath, or think the Christianity is wrong, why to spell it with the asterix (Chr*stianity) - exactly like polite people spell f*ck?
42 posted on 11/04/2004 5:35:52 PM PST by Neophyte (Nazists, Communists, Islamists... what the heck is the difference?)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

your personal attack wasnt neccessary! I was asking a simple question with NO MOTIVE and you go on a rant. Also, you probably be Catholic and a communist.


43 posted on 11/04/2004 6:14:49 PM PST by CouncilofTrent (Quo Primum...)
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To: xJones

sorry. took your comment out of context i guess.


44 posted on 11/04/2004 6:15:49 PM PST by CouncilofTrent (Quo Primum...)
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To: SJackson

Thanks for the info. Too bad ZC wasn't so polite!


45 posted on 11/04/2004 6:18:16 PM PST by CouncilofTrent (Quo Primum...)
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To: SJackson
Marx's parents were Jews who converted 2-7 years prior to his birth per most sources, I'm not sure about the date of Engels parents conversion. Marx attended a Lutheran school, and dabbled in religous writing in his late teens, though he wasn't very good at it. Before and after Marx cast off all religion, he was a virulent anti-Semite.

I don't understand this. I am utterly anti communist. Marx is the FATHER of it. Marx's father, and mother, were not just Jewish (the father, for economic reasons, cast it off (Adam Perlman's dad also rejected his jewishness interestingly). BOTH parents were from famous lines of Talmudic Scholars.

Marx was an antisemite b/c of his view of how a subset of Jews used money to further 'capitalism'. What I don't understand is why the impact of the Talmudic parents of Karl Marx gets no attention whatsoever to explain the root of his messianic desire to REPLACE the Talmud w/ his own religious tradition. Can you please help me understand this univeral treatment?

46 posted on 11/04/2004 6:26:47 PM PST by gobucks (http://oncampus.richmond.edu/academics/classics/students/Ribeiro/laocoon.htm)
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To: Neophyte
If you don't hate, or loath, or think the Christianity is wrong, why to spell it with the asterix (Chr*stianity) - exactly like polite people spell f*ck?

You'd have to ask ZC specifically as to his reasons, but your assertations about hating Christianity is pure nonsense.

In general Jews observe a prohibition against destroying (erasing) God's name. Destroying, not writing, though destruction is an issue easily forseen if writing in a casual context on durable material. You'll get disagreement about the internet, but many (most) Rabbis consider the internet a non-permanent format, thus not subject to the prohibitions. Others would anticipate the possibility that neophyte might print out the thread, and later destroy it, a forseeable act to be avoided.

I can't speak for ZC, but I'd presume he extends this honor to the spelling of Christianity as well.

These allegations of hatred and allusions to profanity are ludicrous.

47 posted on 11/04/2004 6:30:09 PM PST by SJackson ( Bush is as free as a bird, He is only accountable to history and God, Ra'anan Gissin)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
sorry. I have to change my last sentence in my reply.


EDIT: You probably CAN'T be Catholic and Communist
48 posted on 11/04/2004 6:35:11 PM PST by CouncilofTrent (Quo Primum...)
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To: gobucks
His grandparents were certainly observant Jews, and he came from a line of scholars.

I'm not sure there's a factual basis to credit his dad's conversion to the necessity of securing employment (I think he was a lawyer), though it was quite common at the time. In any case there's no indication that Karl, baptised and raised as a Lutheran, felt anything but contempt for Judiasm. Or that he had any knowledge of or respect for his grandparents (I'll leave the parents out, in limbo) faith. While I'm aware of the popularity of casting communism as a religion, I'm doubt he viewed himself as replacing Judiasm or Christianity with his new faith, rather casting aside the false values of those faiths. I don't see any Talmudic connection, nor messianic desires at all.

49 posted on 11/04/2004 6:38:51 PM PST by SJackson ( Bush is as free as a bird, He is only accountable to history and God, Ra'anan Gissin)
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To: SJackson

And, has been pointed out before, Marx certainly wasn't a Marxist.


50 posted on 11/04/2004 6:56:46 PM PST by hlmencken3 (Think good and it will be good!)
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