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Reflecting on Hell: Sermon for the First Sunday in Advent
Voice of Catholic Radio on Long Island ^ | 11/27/05 | Fr. Joseph Pfeiffer

Posted on 11/29/2005 6:40:10 AM PST by murphE

Every soul that meets death in a state of mortal sin will be damned for eternity

Father Joseph Pfeiffer's sermon recorded on the first Sunday of Advent at St. Michael the Archangel's Roman Catholic Church in Farmingville, NY.

LISTEN HERE


TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Moral Issues; Prayer; Theology; Worship
KEYWORDS: advent; catholic; devil; evil; hell; sacraments; salvation; sin

1 posted on 11/29/2005 6:40:11 AM PST by murphE
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To: murphE
Every soul that meets death in a state of mortal sin will be damned for eternity

Uh-huh. Well, some of us believe that to be a heaping pile of fertilizer.

2 posted on 11/29/2005 7:01:40 AM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: theDentist

Well believe it ! before its too late !
Hate to have anyone stuck in a pit of stench,and fire ,for eternity!
God is JUDGE !
You need to read the book "SO HIGH THE PRICE"...


3 posted on 11/29/2005 7:07:53 AM PST by Rosary (Pray the rosary daily,wear the Brown scapular)
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To: theDentist

You don't have to believe in hell to go there.


4 posted on 11/29/2005 7:09:09 AM PST by murphE (These are days when the Christian is expected to praise every creed but his own. --G.K. Chesterton)
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To: Rosary; murphE

First, I think Earth, this existence, is hell. Death is a release. And I'll read the bible itself, not someone else's interpretation of it. A pit of stench and fire for eternity? There's that load again.


5 posted on 11/29/2005 7:22:50 AM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: theDentist; Rosary; murphE

First, I think Earth, this existence, is hell. Death is a release. And I'll read the bible itself, not someone else's interpretation of it. A pit of stench and fire for eternity? There's that load again.

Sounds like typical post modern hypnosis at work again. Where did you get your original manuscripts of the Bible? And how do you know which books belong to it? Oh what does it matter? You'll put your own liberal spin on whatever you read.

Uh-huh. Well, some of us believe THAT to be a heaping pile of fertilizer. "I think" is the arbiter of all truth. There is no bigger moral cop-out than the classic 1970's statement "Earth is Hell" it's just an excuse to take it easy in life and indulge yourself in giving into weakness.

6 posted on 11/29/2005 9:17:25 AM PST by Gerard.P (The lips of liberals drip with honey while their hands drip with blood--Bishop Williamson)
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To: murphE

Of course, all sin is mortal by definition. How can a holy God look upon sin? He cannot. We as sinners are covered by the merits of Christ, Who was the promised Messiah; Who lived a sinless life, voluntarily took the sins of the world upon Himself, died, and is risen. We are justified by faith in Him. Faith compels us to act to be reunited with Him.


7 posted on 11/29/2005 9:36:26 AM PST by GAB-1955 (Everything you read in the papers is true. Trust me.)
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To: Gerard.P
My my my. Aren't you full of yourself? And determining me to be a liberal by 3 or 4 sentences. You must have be able to see the politics, the hearts and the souls of every being on earth.

I'll read King James version, a gift from my Grandfather, if that meets with your high standards. And if it doesn't: tough sh**.

How you interpret the "Earth is Hell" statement is your opinion, not shared by all. And I'm sure you have no indulgences, being a living prophet. Shall we all genuflect to you now?

8 posted on 11/29/2005 9:54:04 AM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: theDentist

My my my. Aren't you full of yourself? And determining me to be a liberal by 3 or 4 sentences. You must have be able to see the politics, the hearts and the souls of every being on earth.

No. Just the obvious ones. It seems you don't like it when somebody applies your own "standards" to what you write but God forbid anyone question the subjective dung you decide to randomly spew.

I'll read King James version, a gift from my Grandfather, if that meets with your high standards. And if it doesn't: tough sh**.

Ah. I see. Since you have a sentimental attachment to something It, therefore is the most accurate and true translation. Smart. That's like traveling across the U.S. in a car and only using a Map from 1790 ad.

And my standards are relevant only insofar as they conform to objective truth. If you say 2+2 is "kinda like more than 2 and less than 12" and I say 2+2=4, my standards in mathematics is in reality higher, whether you or your Grandfather agree.

How you interpret the "Earth is Hell" statement is your opinion, not shared by all.

Once again, the liberal idea is at work.. "there is no objective truth, only opinions."

And I'm sure you have no indulgences, being a living prophet.

Oddly, I claimed no such thing, yet another instance of liberalism, ad-hominem attacks and absurd exaggerations.

Shall we all genuflect to you now?

Only if I'm discovered to be royalty. But for now, don't worry about it.

9 posted on 11/29/2005 10:22:31 AM PST by Gerard.P (The lips of liberals drip with honey while their hands drip with blood--Bishop Williamson)
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To: Gerard.P

Boy, you should check your dosage.


10 posted on 11/29/2005 10:56:44 AM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: murphE

Very powerful.

Is he Trad? Our priest is and gives a somewhat similar homily.

Just one thing though: No mention of Divine Mercy? Or did I miss that?


11 posted on 11/29/2005 11:14:24 AM PST by OpusatFR (Yup. I'm a Rad Trad in a Novus world. lspa loving it!)
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To: OpusatFR
He is an SSPX priest. I'm not sure what you are asking about "Divine Mercy".
12 posted on 11/29/2005 11:25:32 AM PST by murphE (These are days when the Christian is expected to praise every creed but his own. --G.K. Chesterton)
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To: GAB-1955
Of course, all sin is mortal by definition

Here are the definitions of the kinds of sin, original,

ON OUR FIRST PARENTS AND THEIR FALL

and actual of which there are two kinds, mortal and venial:

ON SIN AND ITS KINDS

13 posted on 11/29/2005 11:37:23 AM PST by murphE (These are days when the Christian is expected to praise every creed but his own. --G.K. Chesterton)
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To: theDentist

Boy, you should check your dosage.

Interesting. In order to take your swipe, you have to abandon your philosophy of "opinions" and rely on the objective reality of cause and effect regarding medicine. Yet you deny this reality to God. When it comes to God and his revelation, the only thing that matters is your opinion. If you did that with medicine, you'd be dead. What will be the consequence of that attitude for your soul?

14 posted on 11/29/2005 11:59:28 AM PST by Gerard.P (The lips of liberals drip with honey while their hands drip with blood--Bishop Williamson)
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To: Gerard.P

My soul, my worry. Not yours. And since none of us know the absolute truth until after death, I'll take my chances. I have more faith in His judgement of me than yours.


15 posted on 11/29/2005 12:25:49 PM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: theDentist

Actually, Your soul is my worry despite what you think, and you have no power over my responsibilities before God. You can't exonerate me before Him. I'll be judged by whether or not I defend my faith.

When you attack, I defend. That's the dynamic.

Yet you, in your intolerant cry for tolerance feel no sense of restraint in trashing other people's beliefs as a "heaping pile of fertilizer." Again, hypocritical liberalism at it's best.

If you don't want to engage, keep it to yourself. You seem to act surprised that someone would attack your pseudo-philosophy for what it is after you toss the first bomb.


16 posted on 11/29/2005 1:38:15 PM PST by Gerard.P (Hell is the greatest compliment God has ever paid to the dignity of human freedom.-G. K. Chesterton)
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To: Gerard.P
LOL! You funny. :) It's called FREE Republic, which means I can post what I wish just as you can.
17 posted on 11/29/2005 1:40:54 PM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: theDentist

Just because you CAN post something doesn't mean you SHOULD.

You'll be held accountable for it at your judgement by God and you'll make a fool of yourself in the here and now.

You must have a "reason" for posting. You want to influence people towards your way of thinking. I'm simply going to point out how ludicrous your way of thinking is.

If you want to have a rational discussion on Hell, that is one thing I'm game for. If you are just going to bloviate, I'm going to take that for the attack that it is and react accordingly.

Your choice.


18 posted on 11/29/2005 2:31:55 PM PST by Gerard.P (Hell is the greatest compliment God has ever paid to the dignity of human freedom.-G. K. Chesterton)
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To: murphE

Death, Judgement, Heaven and Hell.

How many people remember - or even know about - the Four Last Things?


19 posted on 11/29/2005 3:33:42 PM PST by livius
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To: Gerard.P

Just because people don't want to conform to your viewpoint of God, Hell, religion doesn't mean they should.
If you consider that an attack, so be it.


20 posted on 11/29/2005 3:45:37 PM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: theDentist

As I said, "DON"T WAIT till its too late and you meet God -you and all mankind WILL MEET HIM..and He says," DEPART FROM ME YE CURSED into the EVERLASTING FIRE-! THATS in the Bible.


21 posted on 11/29/2005 5:05:15 PM PST by Rosary (Pray the rosary daily,wear the Brown scapular)
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To: Rosary

Then you best heed your advice.


22 posted on 11/29/2005 5:06:10 PM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: livius
How many people remember - or even know about - the Four Last Things?

Not too many going by peoples' actions. I certainly never heard a sermon on the Four Last Things at my former parish. And sadly, even those of us who do know about these things don't always behave like we do, so we need to be reminded - often.

23 posted on 11/29/2005 5:37:19 PM PST by murphE (These are days when the Christian is expected to praise every creed but his own. --G.K. Chesterton)
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To: theDentist

Just because people don't want to conform to your viewpoint of God, Hell, religion doesn't mean they should.

Sure it does. Who should not conform to the concept that 2+2=4?

If you consider that an attack, so be it.

What would you call, Quote:"Uh-huh. Well, some of us believe that to be a heaping pile of fertilizer."? Is that an invitation to a philosophical/theological discussion?

24 posted on 11/29/2005 8:30:29 PM PST by Gerard.P (Hell is the greatest compliment God has ever paid to the dignity of human freedom.-G. K. Chesterton)
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To: theDentist

Just because people don't want to conform to your viewpoint of God, Hell, religion doesn't mean they should.

Sure it does. Who should not conform to the concept that 2+2=4?

If you consider that an attack, so be it.

What would you call, Quote:"Uh-huh. Well, some of us believe that to be a heaping pile of fertilizer."? Is that an invitation to a philosophical/theological discussion?

25 posted on 11/29/2005 8:31:18 PM PST by Gerard.P (Hell is the greatest compliment God has ever paid to the dignity of human freedom.-G. K. Chesterton)
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To: Gerard.P
Just because people don't want to conform to your viewpoint of God, Hell, religion doesn't mean they should.
Sure it does.

LOL! Are you also believing that only certain Christians will go to heaven, and that other such disciplines are damned? Like catholics, baptists, lutherans, evangelicals, etc?

26 posted on 11/30/2005 5:56:15 AM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: theDentist; Gerard.P
I'll read King James version, a gift from my Grandfather, if that meets with your high standards. And if it doesn't: tough sh**.

I guess all King James bibles aren't created equal, then:

Matt 5:22
But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

Matt 5:29
And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

Matt 5:30
And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

Matt 10:28
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Matt 18:8
And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire.

Mark 9:43
And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:

Rev 20:15
And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Rev 20:18
But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

27 posted on 11/30/2005 6:18:51 AM PST by jboot (Faith is not a work)
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To: jboot

Please find those passages where it says slavery is abhorrant.


28 posted on 11/30/2005 6:24:15 AM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: theDentist
Please find those passages where it says slavery is abhorrant.

There are none. Your point?

29 posted on 11/30/2005 6:30:36 AM PST by jboot (Faith is not a work)
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To: jboot
My point is that we all agree slavery is wrong, an abhorrant and demeaning practice. Yet the Bible had no problem with it. So was the Bible wrong?

The Bible says men should not eat certain foods (pork for example). Yet men have learned over the years to properly treat such foods to prevent disease, to prepare and eat it safely.

Remember, Hell was previously Hadees, and before that Sheol. Over the years, and the bible was translated from language to language to language, and words and meanings were not always accurate. It went from a state of "absence of God" to a physical place of fire and torture.

My point is, we have learned over the years men have found that the Bible is not 100% correct. It can be wrong. And if it can be wrong about slavery, about eating certain foods, about where and how plants shall be grown on farms, etc then it can also be wrong about hell (which may be in the afterlife and only 1 man has returned from death and he didn't stop in that particular place). I have no quarrel with boundaries that have been set for us to live our lives, but I do have doubts about a place of hellfire for men who live good lives but don't believe every word in the Bible.

30 posted on 11/30/2005 7:46:26 AM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: theDentist
Most of the hell quotes I provided were from the mouth of Christ. Was he lying? Or do you believe that the church put those words in His mouth to better control the masses?

You say that only one person has ever returned from the dead. On what basis do you make that claim? The bible? Remember, you claim that it is full of errors. If someone made up hell, they could also have made up heaven. Or the resurrection. Or salvation. Or Jesus. It could all be a sham.

You can't pick and choose the scripture you will believe on the basis of what you think is "right" or "wrong".

31 posted on 11/30/2005 8:37:47 AM PST by jboot (Faith is not a work)
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To: jboot
First off, I believe in Christ, and I have no doubt he was sent here. I have no doubt he spoke on behalf of God to give us guidance and a path to follow.

I also have no doubt that as time passed, and the Gospels were written and translated, that some meanings were slightly altered not out of deliberation but out of the errors of the translators themselves.

And I have no doubt that as the Church itself grew, the gospels were altered yet again, perhaps to have more control of the people, or perhaps to make a more consistent message throughout the 2nd Testament. Remember, the Council of Nicea did edit the Bible, threw out some books of Gospels.

You infer I should believe it all or ignore it all as a sham. I say I can believe the basic message, love Christ as I love myself and my family, and question the Bible as a part of the discovery of God's world.

And I will not pick and choose scripture basis of what you think is "right" or "wrong". Because you are as fallible as I.

32 posted on 11/30/2005 10:40:38 AM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: theDentist
If the Bible is not trustworthy, even its "basic message" has no foundation. It becomes nothing more than clever mythology. And because the basic message of scripture is not merely "love", but "how can wicked, sinful man be reconciled to a infinitely holy and just God", thinking of it as myth-or an error-filled hodgepodge-may be very tempting.

You imply that I think myself to be infalliable. I do not, not in the least. But I DO believe that the Bible is.

33 posted on 11/30/2005 11:15:33 AM PST by jboot (Faith is not a work)
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To: jboot

I didn't say it's not trustworthy. I said some aspects of it were likely altered from original meanings thru translations, through editing, and thru men. But if you are saying that the message remains absolutely accurate throughout from the moment word was put to paper over the last 2000 years, then you are welcome to that.

We just disagree.


34 posted on 11/30/2005 11:23:19 AM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: theDentist

Thank you for giving a reasoned post. If I may butt in, the Church teaches this:

The Bible is a complex set of books, difficult to read and understand. It should be read as instructed by the Church, and in the light of the overall teaching of the Church. Otherwise, puzzlements like yours over slavery, pork or Hell will be overwhelming and little or nothing good will come of your reading. Unfortunately, Protestantism encourages indiscriminate and independent reading of the Bible, and many branches of Protestantism tend to prefer literalist interpretations even when it is clear from the context that a literal interpretation is not appropriate, and thus they exacerbate the confusion. The result often is the conclusion that you have reached, that Bible is approximate or Hell should not be a serious concern for all men. This is a loss of Christian faith in general, not only a loss of Catholic faith. While I can only speak as Catholic, please do not take this as an attempt to convert you to Catholicism; I am attempting to convert you to Christianity.

What are the rules of reading the Bible? Like any text, divinely inspired or not, it should be read with knowledge of the context and the culture of the man who wrote a particular book. We need to look at the intended audience and the reason it is written. Besides universal teaching of Man in relation to God and to other men, the Bible contains engineering, medical or agricultural advice, highly metaphorical poetry, historical and genealogical accounts, and what not. It is natural that habits, customs and knowledge of the day will enter the narratives, and they will not be always sound social practice, science or engineering. This does not make the Bible approximate, -- without these narrative, poetic or metaphorical components it would not serve its purpose and so it would not be inerrant!

Second rule is that when the intended meaning is in doubt, one need to check how the intended audience of the day understood the passage. This is why the Catholics and the Orthodox insist on testing the understanding with the early Church fathers and oral tradition. For example, the early Church clearly believed in Hell as a real danger for many -- not just for criminally guilty -- so if you interpret biblical passages differently than that, you are not interpreting them right.

Thirdly, the Old Testament must be read in the light of the New Testament. In particular, we see Christ teaching us to read the Jewish law critically and to use reason. He repeats parts of the Jewish law making it our own, but He does not repeat all of it, and He often reinterprets the Jewish law differently even when he seems to approve of it. Later, the apostles decide to rescind parts of the Jewish law that deals with diet and ceremony. This does not point to the errancy of the Bible, merely to the fact that God gave some of His law to the Jews, and other parts of it to us Christians, and some laws pertain to certain historical epochs, while others hold for all eternity.

A few specific concerns you mention. Pork was prohibited to Jews alone, The Jewish rabbis always interpreted the prohibition not as a pragmatic one, to do with properties of meats, but as one teaching people that God's law is to be obeyed irrespective of reason. This is why Jews don't eat pork today, even though it is perfectly safe medically speaking. The dietetic laws of Moses were lifted by the Early Church because we are under new covenant and the old one simply does not apply. It was not lifted because the Apostles invented refrigeration.

Slavery is either mentioned as a fact of life in the scripture, or charity to the slaves (along with obedience to the civil laws) is urged. Or it is used metaphorically to illustrate the fact that to God we are not unlike slaves. If you have a specific passage that you think condones slavery expressly, show it to me.

Hell is punishment for sin, and the cardinal sin, as is clear from the Fall of Adam story, is disobedience to God. But Christ asks us positively very difficult things, -- to be like Him, to follow Him disregarding all else, and to give our property and lives to others. So, one who merely lives a good life, -- does not steal or murder, -- cannot be assured of salvation. Here the Protestant beliefs differ somewhat, as they would say that one who has professed faith in Christ can be assured of salvation, and we say that while this is so, works of obedience and charity need to prove that faith, and so presumption of being saved is sinful in itself. But no Christian tradition teaches that good life without faith is sifficient to avoid Hell.


35 posted on 11/30/2005 11:49:13 AM PST by annalex
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To: theDentist

Sad answer-Hell's no joke-


36 posted on 11/30/2005 4:41:23 PM PST by Rosary (Pray the rosary daily,wear the Brown scapular)
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To: Rosary

Well, I guess we'll all find out for sure after we've shuffled off this mortal coil.


37 posted on 11/30/2005 4:47:42 PM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: theDentist

First off, I believe in Christ, and I have no doubt he was sent here. I have no doubt he spoke on behalf of God to give us guidance and a path to follow.

He spoke on behalf of God? Just what is that supposed to mean? I smell Arianism repackaged in post-Tielhardian New Age/ College/ "ME-ism". I'm sensing someone has been unduly influenced by the dominated by liberalism university system. You really need to read some Chesterton or Aquinas and get back to reality.

38 posted on 12/01/2005 8:54:02 PM PST by Gerard.P (Hell is the greatest compliment God has ever paid to the dignity of human freedom.-G. K. Chesterton)
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To: theDentist

I don't need to find out..I already KNOW there is a dreadful,unescapable place.
As a Catholic Priest told one ,who also did not believe in Hell..."repeat -I may die this very night and go to Hell forever"..over and over...within that hour the man made his confession and BELIEVED! He did not wish to spead eternity,in a dark,place of stench of fire,torment,devils away from God ..till the end of time..


39 posted on 12/02/2005 3:08:09 PM PST by Rosary (Pray the rosary daily,wear the Brown scapular)
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To: Rosary

Well, good for you.


40 posted on 12/02/2005 4:14:40 PM PST by theDentist (The Dems have put all their eggs in one basket-case: Howard "Belltower" Dean.)
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To: murphE

http://www.osv.com/advent/


41 posted on 12/02/2005 4:38:33 PM PST by Coleus (Roe v. Wade and Endangered Species Act both passed in 1973, Murder Babies/save trees, birds, algae)
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