Posted on 01/15/2006 2:37:14 PM PST by NYer
Thanks for the help!
(After I posted the first one, I did some research and found the Didache at the Catholic Encyclopedia; see post 38. The Catholic Encyclopedia has a whole host of Patristic texts; you should check it out sometime.)
In my OCA Parish there is an Icon of Christ on a podium on the left near the Iconostasis, during confession the priest stands there, and you confess your sins.
In one ROCOR church I went to it was a little different. The priest was sitting behind an icon on the right side and there is an open bible and a cross. You kiss both before confession. The other ROCOR church I've been to it was the same scenerio but off to the left.
I generally find that when defending universal apostolic beleifs, such as confession, that the Catholic church has a more detailed answer for protestants than I can find searching only Orthodox sites, so that's why I asked. :)
That's a nice cartoon. Now explain why Rome erased the Second Commandment.
"and this was last used by Pius XII and the dogma on the Virgin Mary."
That is an interesting point. It appears that Pope John Paul II, of blessed memory, pulled out the big guns on the issue of women's ordination. In the Apostolic Letter "Ordinatio Sacerdotalis" on 22 May, 1994, he wrote:
"Wherefore, in order that all doubt may be removed regarding a matter of great importance, a matter which pertains to the Church's divine constitution itself, in virtue of my ministry of confirming the brethren (cf. Lk 22:32) I declare that the Church has no authority whatsoever to confer priestly ordination on women and that this judgment is to be definitively held by all the Church's faithful."
(http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/apost_letters/documents/hf_jp-ii_apl_22051994_ordinatio-sacerdotalis_en.html It's not a long letter.)
The language he uses bears all the hallmarks of infallibility; it is actually quite similar to the language of Pius XII's Apostolic Constitution "Munificentissumus Deus," wherein he formalized as dogma the doctrine of the Assumption. However, I think there is a slight difference in the way infallibility was used. Pius XII settled the issue for once and all; previously most people had believed it, but the belief was not formalized. With John Paul II it seems that the issue at hand was more "re-settled." By this I mean that the Church had always, always taught that only men could be priests as a matter of fact; it seems that JPII wrote the Letter to re-emphasize the point to combat the happy-dappy liberal notion that all (women, non-Catholics, ham sandwiches, etc) have an intrinsic right to priestly ordination. So, it seems (to me) that your assertion that the last pope to use infall. to define a doctrine was Pius XII is true, with some qualifications.
The above are just my observations, and if I have misinterpreted anything, am incorrect, not precise, etc, please correct me.
Not that this has anything to do with the thread at hand, but I thought it was interesting....thanks for listening.
I'm afraid you are incorrect. If you read the Greek you will find no reference made to the Sabbath....or "the Lord's day". Not a hint....or implication.
My comment was based on the quote, which was the number one item in the list. The truth is singular and unique. Even in the case of duals, because the same truth is represented. Alternative truths don't exist.
I was a "refugee" from massive liturgical abuse in my home parish that began in the 70's, and attended the Melkite cathedral from 1980 to early 1990. When the indult Tridentine Mass was allowed into the Archdiocese of Boston at that time, I felt it was important to return to my ancestral roots, so to speak (though, born in 1957, I had to learn the rite from scratch, just like I did with the Melkites!). I have been back to the Melkite cathedral a few times since then, and I'm still on friendly terms with Bishop John, the deacon and many parishioners. This is easy to do, since my wife is half-Syrian in ancestry and we know lots of Melkites socially. Funny, though, while I was hanging with the Melkites, we weren't married yet, and we seldom attended there together.
If the Latin Mass dies in Boston because of the intended closing of the church we're at, and the new site doesn't work out (it won't, for many reasons, a few of which are simply logistical), my family may be slinking back to the Melkites yet! ;-)
Aha! I knew I left out something ;)
Though I'm wondering where the infallibility of abortion shows up with respect to the early Church.
Please. Don't patronize. I had to read the text before I responded, didn't I? I know perfectly well that the word "Sabbath" isn't there. Though the implication of the Sabbath certainly is. Context fills in the gap. Just like it does when treating, for example, issues concerning the Trinity, a word not found in Scripture *at all*. If he wasn't talking about the Sabbath, what was the controversy over "this day or that"?
I've had to debate on this topic (abortion) last spring, and I came across that tidbit on a Catholic encyclopedia online while doing my research.
Good article to post.
I could be quite wrong, too....I am hardly an expert. There are much better informed FReepers than I, you can ask them for some input.
"I've had to debate on this topic (abortion) last spring, and I came across that tidbit on a Catholic encyclopedia online while doing my research."
Just out of curiosity, in what forum did you have to debate abortion: school, university, professional, political, online forum?
I think what really shocked me the most was the big fight between catholics at Fatimia. It was ok for a pagen religion that worships false God's to have it's cerimoney at the alter. When traditional catholics went there to make reparation, they were comfronted with violence, loud music, nuns saying different prayers durning the rosay. The rector said that the latin mass was in schism and would not allow it. The traditional mass served the church for years, centuries even, and now it is not valid. This is crazy. They arre telling us that there are more than one truth.
In ROCOR churches you can't even take communion if you don't attend confession. It's strongly encouraged and there is a minimum of at least once a year in the OCA.
Now if I can just convince my one freind that the Catholics don't secretly beleive an extra set of books called 'the false writings'.
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