Who Really Wrote the Book of Mormon?

http://www.christianbook.com/Christian/Books/product?p=1010185&item_no=605277 ^

[truthfinder9]

Was The Book of Mormon given to Joseph Smith by an angel or created from a work of fiction? Who was Solomon Spalding and did he have a connection with Joseph Smith? This book critically examines key historical documents, personal testimonies, and records of 19th-century Mormon history concluding that The Book of Mormon is an "adaptation of an obscure historical novel" written by Revolutionary War veteran Solomon Spalding during the War of 1812.

In twelve chapters, the authors lay out the evidence for the assertion that Sidney Rigdon, Oliver Cowdery, and Joseph Smith Jr. adapted and embellished the Spalding manuscript to create The Book of Mormon. Although based on public records and solid research, the book reads like "investigative history", demonstrating that Mormon claims to the "supernatural" revelation and transcription of The Book of Mormon are fraudulent.

[kentj]

Wanna bet how long this post lasts?

[kentj]

demonstrating that Mormon claims to the "supernatural" revelation and transcription of The Book of Mormon are fraudulent.


Duh!!! However there is serious head in the sand syndrome over the "facts" - but what the heck some people think Star Wars was a conflict between Hollywood and TV.

Me I think Daffy duck was the only messenger from well where ever - and all the rest are false.

[truthfinder9]

Why is it that posts on every other religion are left up, but ones on Mormonism are pulled? Is this a commie, liberal site? I thought it was "Free" Republic?

[kentj]

mystery to me but - it won't last long - this B of M is one of the biggest lines of Bs to ever be served so easy to disprove and yet the slop keeps getting served up - go figure?????

[stuartcr]

How would someone prove that it was handed over by an angel? Don't religious writings require faith?

[lugsoul]

I assume this book can be read without the aid of magic spectacles. Or a rune stone in a hat.

[romanesq]

I wish to participate in the magical evaporation of this thread.
I recently switched from the Church of Latter Day Saints to Scientology.
I had to go with the better original manuscript.
Tom Cruise made me do it.

[truthfinder9]

Well, the bible asks to be tested, the Book of Mormon asks to be accepted blindly.

[exnavy]

"mormomism", "muslimism", "jehova witnessism" all those ism's are in the same boat, and it's sinking.

[Fintan]

I always thought it was Donny & Marie...

[caseinpoint]

Would that include Methodism, Catholicism, Orthodoxism, Episcopalianism, Baptism (?), Lutheranism? There's a whole lotta isms floating around here. Are they all sinking?

Actually, the best test of any religion is whether it is producing fruits of the gospel and each person must judge this with the Light of Christ in them, and the gift of the Holy Ghost, if they have it.

[stuartcr]

How could you test either one?

[Hegewisch Dupa]

Good God - we haven't even figured out who; who wrote the book of love? yet.....

[nmh]

Some teenage who was lusting after females and wanted to rearrange Christianity to suit his liking.?

Polygamy.

[DX10]

The Mormon people are decent and God fearing. But their book will not stand up to a critical review. They have subscribed to "another gospel". The Apostle Paul gave strict warning against such. "But though we or an angel from heaven preach unto you any gospel other than that which we preached unto you, let him be anathema." (Accursed from Christ.) Gal 1:8 and repeated for emphasis in Gal 1:9.

[exnavy]

Personally I don't have a "religion", I do however have faith in our savior Jesus Christ.

[romanesq]

Easy now. Let ye throw the first stone whoeth hasn't thirsted for the pud.
This scripture brought to you by:
Pootey Tang.

[colorcountry]

Recently, Vernal Holley put the controversy in another light by minutely comparing parallels between the Book of Mormon and the existing Spaulding manuscript.16 The following are his documented conclusions, with which the author concurs after a personal analysis of Manuscript Found.17

1. The outlines of the Book of Mormon and the Spaulding text are "essentially the same."18

2. Both records claim to have been found in "the same way."

3. Both were "written for the same purpose."

4. Both "tell the story of the same ancient American inhabitants."

5. Both "have the same sea voyage."

6. Both "have light-skinned and dark-skinned people.

7. Both "tell of the same arts and sciences."

8. Both "have a comparable Christian theology."

9. Both "present a white God person."

10. Both "involve use of seer stones."

11. Both claim to "contain an abridged history of the extinct inhabitants of ancient America."19

12. Both describe how the record was deposited, protected supernaturally, and how its finder made a translation of it.

13. Both state that it "will come forth . . .when the Europeans (gentiles) inhabit this land (M.F., 3-4; I Nephi 13:35; 3:184-185).

14. Both "translators" testify of the truthfulness of the work and request that the readers read it "with a pure heart" (M.F., 2-3; Moroni 10:4-5; 10:4-5).20

15. Both have the earth revolving about the sun-something unknown until 1543 A.D. (M.F., 16; Helaman 12:13-15; 4:61-62).21

16. A theological address by an Indian chief in Spaulding's manuscript contains "the same thoughts" and they are "in the same order" as in a similar address in the Book of Mormon by King Benjamin (M.F., 26-32; Mosiah 1-4; 1-2).

17. Spaulding's leader teaches from a "sacred roll," while King Benjamin teaches from "plates of brass."

18. The religious section of Spaulding is written in the chiastic style, which is found throughout the Book of Mormon.22

19. Lobaska's rule over two empires and his golden age of peace parallels Christ's effect on the peoples in the Book of Mormon.23

20. Both include coins and fortifications.24

21. Both have similar scenes of bloodshed, even down to the final combats between enemy commanders.

22. Both depict a "little band" of warriors, 3,000 in M. F. and 2,000 Nephi-Lehis in the Book of Mormon.25

Besides these parallels, there are literally hundreds of identical or similar word combinations. In order to conserve space, only a few are listed below:26

rights of their country (M.F., 31; 3 Nephi 6:30; 3:35)

Crying with a loud voice (80; Alma 46:19; 21:48)

He put forth his hand and (28; Alma 30:51; 16:63)

An immense slaughter (101; Alma 49:21; 21:174)

mourning and lamentation (84; Helaman 7:15; 3:16)

according to their numbers (54; 3 Nephi 6:3; 3:4)

Even more surprising than these parallels, however, is the land area described in the two books. Holley emphasizes that Book of Mormon geography quite neatly matches the land described in Manuscript. Thus the "sea east" becomes Lake Ontario and the "sea west" becomes Lake Erie rather than, as Mormons have assumed, the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans. Locating the River Sidon has always been a difficulty for Book of Mormon scholars.27 With this model, however, the River Sidon handily becomes the present-day Genesee River.28

Another problem has been the width of the "small neck of land" in the Book of Mormon, which is described as "a day and a half's journey" from sea to sea (Alma 22:32; 13:76). The distance of thirty-seven miles between these two lakes fits the description much better than the distance of over one hundred thirty miles at the Isthmus of Panama. 67 ancient fortified earthworks have been found at this location.29

Spaulding lived in this area and had first-hand knowledge of the earthworks, names and geographical locations that are portrayed in his writings. By imposing the Book of Mormon descriptions on maps of these areas, the following modern place names are found to coincide with the cities and lands in the Book of Mormon:30

Modern B of M

Angola Angola

Boaz Boaz

Jerusalem Jerusalem

Jordan Jordan

Lehigh Lehi

Rama Ramah

St. Agathe Ogath

Alma Valley of Alma

Antrim Antum

Antioch Anti-Anti

Conner Comner

St. Ephrem Hill Ephraim

Hellam Helam

Jacobsburg Jacobugath

Kishkiminetas Kishkumen

Mantua Manti

Monroe Moroni

Minoa Minon

Moraviantown Morianton

Morin Moron

Noah Lake Land of Noah

Oneida Onidah

Oneida Castle Hill Onidah

Omer Omner

Ripple Lake Waters of Ripli- ancum

Sodom Sidom

Shiloh Shilom

Shurbrook Shurr

Tenecum Teancum

Holley bolsters his case for Spaulding authorship of the Book of Mormon with a quotation by Mormon archaeologist Joseph Vincent, who said:

If a sincere student of the Book of Mormon will conscientiously read and study the book itself and will plot out all the locations mentioned,...he will find that all Book of Mormon lands lie within a five or six hundred mile radius, and that this area could not possibly extend from Chile to New York.

I found this on the web at the following site: http://yourgoingtohell.com/mormon.html

[bobjam]

I personally have found the Mormons I have met to be honest, pleasant and descent people. Many of them simply don't understand how the differences between Mormonism and the rest of Christianity are so much more serious than the differences between Catholics and Baptists.

[colorcountry]

I don't know. I just posted something I found on the web.

It is not my position since I've never read the Spaulding Manuscript and I have read the Book of Mormon.

Those opinions are not mine....

[colorcountry]

Another interesting find: http://www.irr.org/mit/bhrobert.html

B. H. Roberts, Studies of the Book of Mormon, 2nd edition (Salt Lake City: Signature Books, 1992), 377 pages, paperback, ISBN 1-56085-027-2.

---

A Mormon General Authority's Doubts About the Authenticity of the Book of Mormon

Incredible as it may seem to many Latter-day Saints, Brigham H. Roberts (1857-1933), an LDS General Authority widely considered Mormonism's greatest apologist and historian,1 expressed the grave doubt that the Book of Mormon is a translation of ancient scripture. Elder Roberts reached this conclusion after his research uncovered extensive evidence that Joseph Smith borrowed the basic plot and many details from other books. This evidence — long suppressed because it is considered harmful to the Mormon Church — is presented in detail in three essays by Roberts, now published as Studies of the Book of Mormon (Salt Lake City: Signature Books, 1992).

More than fifty years after his death, Roberts is still well known through his many writings. They include the — Introduction and Notes — to Joseph Smith's seven volume History of the Church, the six volume A Comprehensive History of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Outlines of Ecclesiastical History, and New Witnesses for God (3 vols). However, in 1922 Roberts became aware of troubling evidence that Joseph Smith borrowed much of the plot and other details of the Book of Mormon from other books readily available to him,2 in particular Josiah Priest's Wonders of Nature and Providence, and Ethan Smith's View of the Hebrews. For instance, it is often thought the Book of Mormon claim that the American Indians are descendents of Hebrew immigrants is a novel idea that young Joseph Smith could not have invented. But Roberts discovered from Priest's book, published in 1824, six years before the first edition of the Book of Mormon (1830), that it was the almost universal opinion of the ministers of New England and the Middle States, that the Indians were the descendants of the Hebrews (Studies, p. 153).

[Calm_Cool_and_Elected]

Who (or what) is Spaulding? Never heard of it before.

TIA, CC&E

[siunevada]

Who (or what) is Spaulding? Never heard of it before.

Here's more than you probably would ever want to know:

Book of Mormon Studies

Looks like the authors published another book later on:

In 1977 Wayne Cowdrey, Howard Davis, and Donald Scales published Who Really Wrote the Book of Mormon?, which discussed statements supporting the Spalding theory. Now Cowdrey and Davis have teamed with Hugh O'Neal and Arthur Vanick to produce The Spalding Enigma. Although some of the documentary evidence from the 1977 book is reproduced, this is not a revision of the earlier work, but is an entirely new book. It resolves some old problems, sheds light on others, and raises some new questions.

[colorcountry]

Solomon Spaulding, born in Ashford, Connecticut, in 1761, was graduated from Dartmouth College in 1785, studied divinity, and for some years had charge of a church. His own family described him as a peculiar man, given to historical researches, and evidently of rather unstable disposition. He gave up preaching, conducted an academy at Cherry Valley, New York, and later moved to Conneaut, Ohio, where in 1812 he had an interest in an iron foundry. His attention was there attracted to the ancient mounds in that vicinity, and he set some of his men to work exploring one of them. "I vividly remember how excited he became," says his daughter, " when he heard that they had exhumed some human bones, portions of gigantic skeletons, and various relics." From these discoveries he got the idea of writing a fanciful history of the ancient races of this country.

The title he chose for his book was "The Manuscript Found." He considered this work a great literary production, counted on being able to pay his debts from the proceeds of its sale, and was accustomed to read selections from the manuscript to his neighbors with evident pride......

....In order to find a publisher Mr. Spaulding moved with his family to Pittsburg, Pennsylvania. A printer named Patterson spoke well of the manuscript to its author, but no one was found willing to publish it.

When the newly announced Mormon Bible began to be talked about in Ohio, there were immediate declarations in Spaulding's old neighborhood of a striking similarity between the Bible story .... The opinion was confidently expressed there that, if the manuscript could be found and published, it would put an end to the Mormon pretence.

A manuscript has since been found and the transcripts have been analysed. Mormons profess there are no similarities and Christian apologists claim there are many similarities. I haven't read Solomon's manuscript so I only have what I find on the internet to use as information. There seems to be some evidence that there is a connection between early Mormon founder Sidney Rigdon and Solomon Spauldings manuscript.

[siunevada]

And for comic relief, his distant cousin Captain Spaulding:

(Zeppo): There's something that I'd like to state that he's too modest to relate.
The Captain is a moral man. Sometimes he finds it trying.

(Groucho): This fact I'll emphasize with stress: I never take a drink unless somebody's buying.

(Crowd): The Captain is a very moral man.

(Zeppo): If he hears anything obscene, he'll naturally repel it.

(Groucho): I hate a dirty joke I do, unless it's told by someone who knows how to tell it.

(Crowd): The Captain is a very moral man. Hooray for Captain Spaulding, the African Explorer!

(Groucho): Did someone call me Schnorer?

(Crowd): Hooray hooray hooray! (Groucho does a strange dance)

[BJClinton]

romanesq, come out of the closet now. :)

[BJClinton]

There can be no serious discussion about Mormonism wihout South Park Republicans present.

[colorcountry]

dum dum dum dum

[colorcountry]

[Logophile]

Not this nonsense again. The Spaulding (or Spalding) theory was popular among anti-Mormons for many years -- until someone actually found a copy of the Spaulding manuscript. Here is an excerpt from the Encyclopedia of Mormonism about it:

The Spaulding Manuscript is a fictional story about a group of Romans who, while sailing to England early in the fourth century A.D., were blown off course and landed in eastern North America. One of them kept a record of their experiences among eastern and midwestern American Indian tribes. The 175-page manuscript was first published as a 115-page monograph in 1885, some seventy years after the death of its author, Solomon Spaulding (sometimes spelled Spalding). The only known manuscript was lost from 1839 until its discovery in Honolulu, Hawaii, in 1884. It was promptly published by both the Latter-day Saints and Reorganized Latter Day Saint churches to refute the theory of some critics that it had served as an original source document for the Book of Mormon, supposedly supplied to Joseph Smith by Sidney Rigdon. (Emphasis added.)

Note that the LDS Church published the manuscript when it was discovered.

This issue has been dealt with many times. Anyone who is interested in the truth can find a number of articles on this web page.

It seems that the critics of the Book of Mormon (including the professional anti-Mormons who make their living spreading lies about the LDS Church) will do and say almost anything in their attempt to discredit the book. What they will not do is read the book and ask God about it. The Book of Mormon itself promises that God will reveal the truth to those who sincerely seek it:

And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost. And by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know the truth of all things. (Moroni 10:4, 5).

I have nothing to add to this admonition, and would urge all to heed it.

As for the current discussion, I am not interested in wasting time on yet another flame war, so this will be my only post on this thread.

[EveningStar]

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[TheBigB]

Chuck Norris.

[colorcountry]

I don't really know. I don't think Spaulding's manuscript is such a problem. It is an example of how Joseph Smith may have written the BOM....there are other examples.

I think Christian apologist use Spaulding as an example that there was an abundance of thought concerning the ancient history of America, Jews, which religion was correct, etc... This is a way to show that a man in his 20's in America, in the early 1800's would have been exposed to these very ideas and could well have used them or incorporated the ideas into a book and religion of his own.

The LDS have long used the argument that it would have been impossible for a young, uneducated man to have written the book without the intervention of God. These examples show that it is possible.

[Mrs. Don-o]

I heard there were 4 things mentioned in the Book of Mormon which actually didn't exist in North America in the time referenced:

• horses
  
• iron implements
  
• elephants
  
• wheat

  Plus nobody has ever found any archaeological evidence for the titanic battles that were allegedly fought: not an bronze arrowhead nor a semitic thighbone.

  Can anybody confirm or deny this?

[colorcountry]

Anyone who is interested in the truth can find a number of articles on this web page.

Why is your truth more valid than anyone elses? Those who wish to ascertain the truth would be wise to look at all the information available.

Thank you for your link to "your" truth.

[BenLurkin]

I am flattered to be on your South Park Ping list, however I am also chagrined to say that I have never seen a complete episode of the show. In fact, I'm not sure how I got on the South Park ping list.

Please do not take offense that I now request to be removed from same. It is not meant as any gesture of hostility or disrespect.

[stuartcr]

I have never read the book.

[EveningStar]

A couple years ago, I created the original ping list by going to existing South Park threads and adding names from those threads. Every so often someone will ask me, "How the hell did I get on this list?" LOL. :)

No offense is taken. You're off the list. Have a good day. :)

[CounterCounterCulture]

Stan: That's nice, guys. We're just gonna stay out of this one.

...

Kyle: Cartman, just stay out of it.

...

Stan: [admonishing] Stay clear, guys, stay clear.

Kyle: Yup. I'm not seeing anything.

...

Professor Chaos: Oh boy, General Disarray, muh maybe we just oughtta stay outta this one.

;-)

[headsonpikes]

Angola Angola

Boaz Boaz

Jerusalem Jerusalem

Jordan Jordan

Lehigh Lehi

Rama Ramah

St. Agathe Ogath

Alma Valley of Alma

Antrim Antum

Antioch Anti-Anti

Conner Comner

St. Ephrem Hill Ephraim

Hellam Helam

Jacobsburg Jacobugath

Kishkiminetas Kishkumen

Mantua Manti

Monroe Moroni

Minoa Minon

Moraviantown Morianton

Morin Moron

Noah Lake Land of Noah

Oneida Onidah

Oneida Castle Hill Onidah

Omer Omner

Ripple Lake Waters of Ripli- ancum

Sodom Sidom

Shiloh Shilom

Shurbrook Shurr

Tenecum Teancum

---

Just a coincidence, I'm sure!

[Gamecock]

So James 1:27 means nothing to you?


"Religion that is pure and undefiled before God, the Father, is this: to visit orphans and widows in their affliction, and to keep oneself unstained from the world."

[trubluolyguy]

Who really wrote the book of Mormon?



Speaking siply as a layman.....Some guy looking in a hat?

[trubluolyguy]

Who really wrote the book of Mormon?



Speaking simply as a layman.....Some guy looking in a hat?

[EveningStar]

[Calm_Cool_and_Elected]

Thanks for the info. My husband and I had many discussions with some Mormon "elders" (they were about 19 yrs old) a few yrs ago and they could not answer our questions. They came back a few days later with a "big gun" from the Ward who accused us of reading anti-Mormon literature. We basically told them that it didn't matter where the questions came from because they were valid questions and they really needed to be addressed. He refused and we asked them to leave.

CC&E