Skip to comments.Homosexuality Is Sin
Posted on 05/04/2006 1:28:24 PM PDT by Conservative Coulter Fan
First of all, when we look to Christian teaching on Homosexuality, we often start at the beginning in the Book of Genesis, whereby God created Adam and Eve, man and woman. When the Pharisees asked Christ whether or not it was lawful for a man to put away his wife, he answered them saying, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female (see Genesis 1:27; Matthew 19:4-6) and Christ added, What therefore God hath joined together, let no man put asunder. Remember, Marriage isnt simply a sexual arrangement, but homosexuality is the ultimate corruption and perversion of Gods union of man and woman.
In Chapter 19, we learn of the destruction of two cities, Sodom (the word sodomy was derived from Sodom and the homosexual proclivities of that city) & Gomorrah, which was destroyed by God for their wickedness...their sexual immorality. The apostle Peter explained, And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an example unto those that after should live ungodly. He added, But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness... (See II Peter 2:6;10) Jude too, explained, Even as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, [homosexuality] are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
Despite the Bible providing the absolute and clearest denunciation of homosexuality as a grave and horrible sin that led directly to the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah, by God himself, there are still some false Christians who deny the very example God gave and the very warnings of the apostles. As Jude pointed out, ...there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ. (See Jude 1:4) Witness people who, in the name of Christ no less, have the audacity, the arrogance, to brush it aside and indeed bastardize the faith claiming those that repent not, those that live day by day in sin, are without fault! In fact, as Ill explain later, they curse those that speak the truth and deny Christ.
A further reading of Jude sheds even more light on the predicament. He says, But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves. He continued, Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever .... To execute judgement upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him. These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having mens persons in admiration because of advantage. .... How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts. These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit. (See Jude, Chapter 1)
So faux Christians, often use the word love, and they use it most unlovingly to scold righteousness and truth. They use the word sparingly, in abstraction, without defining or explaining what love is for the only logical conclusion we can draw is that they use love as a shield to fend off those who would speak truthfully and confront sin, in this case homosexuality, as a transgression and an affront to God Almighty. John inform us of love: By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. In other words obedience is love. He goes on, For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous. (I John 5:2-3) Those who disobey God, those that are wicked like the men of Sodom, are in open rebellion against God and they defy his commandments oblivious to his examples. The apostle Peter tells us, For so is the will of God, that with well-doing ye may put to silence ignorance of foolish men... (See I Peter 2:15) In the words of the Apostle Paul, Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness. (II Timothy 2:15-16)
Those blasphemers, like high priced attorneys with silver tongues representing Satan, the Father of lies, display no self-control, they are conceited in their minds, and they turn away from Christianity. Paul foretold of them, For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, Without natural affection, truce breakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, Traitors, heady, high-minded, lovers of pleasures more than of God; .... For this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts, Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. (See II Timothy 3:2-7) He added, But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived. (II Timothy 3:13).
Believe it or not, Ive come across complainers and false accusers who take issue with my use of scripture. They seem confounded by the use of the inerrant, inspired word of God. They utter indignities and hiss like serpents preparing to strike and deliver a deadly blow of venom. Paul tells we should use to instruct righteousness and correct. And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Jesus Christ. All scripture is given by the inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works. (II Timothy 15-17)
I apologize to those that forget that I make no claim to perfection, that even I err, for Im prone to make mistakes. I seek not to pleasure, to harass, and delight in the downfall of others. On the other hand, there is no toleration for evil, while sin may be forgiven, it isnt something that may be taken lightly. Have no illusions that by turning from God, you risk eternal damnation. Jesus Christ spoke repeatedly of the hell fire that awaits those who dont depart from iniquity. John proclaimed, Whosoever comitteth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin. Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him. Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. (See I John 3:4-8) We are also instructed, Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. If there come any unto you, and bring not his doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that abideth him God speed is a partaker of his evil deeds. (II John 1:9-11) Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way, shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins. (James 5:20)
Back to the sin of homosexuality, in the Book of Leviticus, it is regarded as an abomination by God and the Law went as far as to make it a capital offense. Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination. (See Leviticus 18:22) In Verse 26, God says, Ye shall therefore keep my statues and my judgments, and shall not commit any of these abominations; neither any of your nation, nor any stranger that sojourneth among you... God couldnt make it any clearer when he forbade homosexuality and roundly condemned it. Were not instructed to be indifferent, or to turn a blind eye, and clearly this secular dogma about inclusiveness is anathema in obeying the Lord thy God!
I'll end in the New Testament, Paul , For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold truth in unrighteousness .... Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them." (See Romans 1:18-32)
I just find it a turn off more than anything....
It's more repulsive than turn off.
Sodomy is not a light or transient crime. It is an abomination (Lev. 18:22). It is the culmination of man's apostasy and hostility toward God and His Church (Rom. 1:18-32). For lawmakers and judges to approve of sodomy brings eternal damnation upon themselves (Rom. 13:2) and God's righteous judgment of death on the society as a whole (Gen. 19:24, II Pet. 2:6).
Therefore, such lawmakers and judges are not only anti-Christian by approving of sodomy, they make the civil government a vile cesspool from which the abominations vomit out across the land. By displaying such a contempt for the administration of Justice, such civil officials are not only the source of the defilement (Lev.18:24-25), they are the criminals (Rom.1:32), and a hostile enemy authorizing the destruction of the society in which we live (Jude 7).
Not only should Christian men fight for the safety of their families by demanding that these civil officials repent, or resign from office immediately, Christians should be demanding the strongest laws and punishments against sodomy be put into effect so as to cleanse the pestilence from our society. (Lev. 20:13)
Sodomy is an "abomination" (Lev.18:22), and those who engage in sodomy are so vile that their very presence defiles the land (Lev. 18:22,25). Through the administration of Justice, God gives the civil officials the authority to prevent society, the land, from being defiled. The civil officials swing the sword to "...execute wrath upon him that doeth evil" (Rom. 13:4) -- and in this case sodomites -- "...shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them" (Lev. 20:13).
Notice where it says "...their blood shall be upon them"? By the administration of Justice the sodomites' defilement is prevented from defiling society as a whole. (Lev. 18:24) The administration of Justice always protects the innocent people in society. And there is not a single text in all the New Testament to suggest that this penalty has been altered or removed, in fact, Romans 1:32 confirms it.
It should also be noted that because of the pro-active, intrinsic nature of God's judgments upon any society defiled by these abominations (Lev. 18:25-30), it is impossible for Christians to passively coexist in such a vile society. Our demand that the civil officials administer Justice is based upon the concern for and protection of innocent people, and what iniquities will come upon us all should Justice not be upheld. --Jim Rudd, Life and Liberty Ministries
Of course it is. Read the part of the Bible that says, adulters, homosexuals, murderers, liars, thieves, robbers, etc. will NOT inherit the kingdom of God...
Oh no you don't -- you're not drawing me into this debate. I'd rather debate legalization of pot with a Grateful Dead fan while chewing on broken glass.
7Now therefore there is utterly a fault among you, because ye go to law one with another. Why do ye not rather take wrong? why do ye not rather suffer yourselves to be defrauded?
8Nay, ye do wrong, and defraud, and that your brethren.
9Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate [HOMOSEXUALS], nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
11And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
12All things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any.
13Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats: but God shall destroy both it and them. Now the body is not for fornication, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body.
14And God hath both raised up the Lord, and will also raise up us by his own power.
15Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.
16What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.
17But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.
18Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.
19What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
20For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.
LOLOL...I want you to take a breather. Do me a favor...see if you can post some passages from Donkey Cons...excellent book.
Good job. I've bookmarked it.
Thanks for the post. Never can remember precisely which Book and verse, I just know it's there...
Thanks. Knew there were quite a few passages, but I never bothered trying to pinpoint them...
He never specifically mentioned a lot of things: child abuse, rape, necrophilia, bestiality, etc... He did say that He came not to abolish but to fulfil the law. And he extended the law to include intentions of the heart. So if anything, he would extend the sin of homosexuality to include homosexual lust. There's no possible way an honest person can claim he took no position on the matter.
And he did define marriage very clearly as being between a man and a woman.
'Effeminite' in Strong's concordance translates to ;
malakos mal-ak-os' of uncertain affinity; soft, i.e. fine (clothing); figuratively, a catamite:--effeminate, soft.
Catamite (according to merriam-webster)
Etymology: Latin catamitus, from Catamitus Ganymede, from Etruscan Catmite, from Greek GanymEdEs
: a boy kept by a pederast
One more step to go...
Etymology: Greek paiderastEs, literally, lover of boys, from paid- ped- + erastEs lover, from erasthai to love -- more at EROS
: one that practices anal intercourse especially with a boy
Yep..if you are currently engaged in the above....and happen to die.
But thank God....for forgiveness..otherwise I wouldn't be going to heaven. And neither would you.
You are absolutely right, on all accounts. We are all sinners in need of forgiveness...
What the heck am I doing on this ping list?
I truly do not give a damn if someone is a homo or not.
It ain't my business.
Thanks for the ping! Shows once again why the bible is being systematically removed from the public arena. It's very uncomfortable to be confronted with one's sin, and to know that God will judge our sin.
Fortunately, we have a savior.
And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience.
Among them we too all formerly lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest.
But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Is telling a homo he's a sinner soon to be considered a Hate Crime?
List? Haven't read the article yet but will.
It has led to arrests in Canada and Sweden. That is the ultimate goal of hate crime legislation. Oh, and remember the Philadelphia 11 who were arrested for peacefully protesting with signs that had Bible verses condemning homosexuality written on them. Some teenagers were suspended from school just recently for wearing t-shirts that said, "homosexuality is a sin."
It truly is. It's driven by the homo's along with the left. Then we've got butch hildabeast.
Do you care if your children (or other peoples' children) are taught in school - even grade school - that "gay is good", that Abraham Lincoln and other dead historical figures were gay, that they might be gay, and how to perform homosexual sex?
Do you care if "hatespeech" laws are enacted making it a crime to say anything negative about homosexuality (including letting people know that they are more likely to catch AIDS if they indulge in same sex acts)?
Homosexual acts are a sin.
Homosexual urges, like any other temptation, are not.
Since homosexual acts are often acts of passion, they might be less "evil" than other actions that are deliberate choosing of evil.
I have enough problems controlling my temptations to sin than to criticize another who gives in.
However, I do oppose the so called "Gay agenda". But the gay agenda is actually less dangerous than other agendas, such as materialism, immodesty, ignoring poor people, heterosexual promiscuity etc.
Hate any form of liberal agenda that is currently being rubbed in our childrens faces.
But where I part ways with you and Fred Phelps is when you claim that we should kill them.
Neither one of you are conservative.
And you should change your name. Ann Coulter would call you a kook.
Phelps is a kook, at best. At worst, he's a wolf in sheep's clothing.
Sin is sin, no matter what the "law" says is worse. It's all the same, and we all must ask for forgivness for it. Such is calling for the death of others that do not think as you do.
Matt. 22:34 " When the Pharisees heard that he had silenced the Sadducees, they gathered together,
35 and one of them, a lawyer, asked him a question to test him.
36 "Teacher, which commandment in the law is the greatest?"
37 He said to him, " 'You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.'
38 This is the greatest and first commandment.
39 And a second is like it: 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.'
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets."
If you prefer the KJV;
34: But when the Pharisees had heard that he had put the Sadducees to silence, they were gathered together.
35: Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying,
36: Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37: Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38: This is the first and great commandment.
39: And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40: On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
Did CCF say that homosexuals should be killed? I must have missed that part.
Yes. But to be fair to Fred Phelps, I don't know if he is as extreme as CCF, who has advocated killing homosexuals based on Levitical law.
He never specifically mentioned a lot of things: child abuse, rape, necrophilia, bestiality, etc...
Actually did mention beastiality:
Ex 22:19 Whosoever lieth with a beast shall surely be put to death.
Neither shalt thou lie with any beast to defile thyself therewith: neither shall any woman stand before a beast to lie down thereto: it is confusion.
And if a man lie with a beast, he shall surely be put to death: and ye shall slay the beast.
Cursed be he that lieth with any manner of beast. And all the people shall say, Amen
25But if a man find a betrothed damsel in the field, and the man force her, and lie with her: then the man only that lay with her shall die.
26But unto the damsel thou shalt do nothing; there is in the damsel no sin worthy of death: for as when a man riseth against his neighbour, and slayeth him, even so is this matter:
27For he found her in the field, and the betrothed damsel cried, and there was none to save her.
That was a cheap shot. CCF never said we should kill them. CCF only points out that, "For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold truth in unrighteousness .... " In context, there are many more things "worthy of death" than just homosexuality, " Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them." (See Romans 1:18-32)
The point is about God's final judgment. Speaking the truth about the sin of homosexuality has a purpose, and that is ultimately to lead them to Christ. But at least to lead them to an understanding of God's righteousness and holiness. "The commandments of the Lord are true, and righteous altogether..." It is not to become the final arbiter of their life. That's God's job.
You can view the harsh punishment of the OT as symbolic of the eternal punishment all sinners will receive at the final judgment. All will face God's judgment of death. Some will face it with a stand in -- a substitute, Christ Jesus our Lord. God will look at them and see the inputed righteousness of Christ.
Remember how Jesus said He came to save sinners, not the righteous? Well He wasn't saying that some are righteous. He was saying that knowledge of sin is the first step towards being saved. There is no potential for saving faith without the knowledge of sin.
The final judgment of all sin is death. "The wages of sin is death." Please understand, that's what I believe is the point of this post by CCF. It is more loving to speak that truth than it is to offer all the approving sentimentality in the world, because the free Gift of eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord begins with the knowledge of your own sin.
Jesus. I believe the charge was that Jesus never specifically mentioned those things.
No matter what, all the PRO-GAY legalization, all the brainwashing efforts, all the trying to normalize same sex acts.....
IN THE END
SAME SEX ACTS WILL ALWAYS BE A SIN
I think you limit your perspective with that theory. Certainly the exes can shed some light on the pattern and thinking involved. But too often exes offer excuses which leads to over sympathizing with sin and even blaming outside things for something that starts as a sin of the heart. So I would disagree with the condition itself not being sin. Coveting is sin that manifests itself outwardly as greed, theft and things like that. Lust is a sin that manifests itself outwardly as sexual immorality, pornography, homosexuality etc. The line between an initial temptation and a sinful dwelling on the idea is crossed very early.
Many who get caught up in homosexuality do so not because of any inward attraction so much as they get caught up in a social group that practices it. Loneliness leads to keeping bad company leads to corrupting good morals. You bring up alcoholics. Good example. They don't crave alcohol until after the fact. That's is precisely what happens with some people who practice homosexuality.
You do a disservice to them by telling them the lust is not sin. They are not victims. They are sinners who need to grieve over their sin and repent. Being embarrassed and ashamed of it is a good thing. When others say, "that's disgusting" they are simply reacting to an obvious truth. Not everyone believes the gospel, but everyone can perceive that homosexuality is disgusting and unnatural. They are not hateful to say so. You would do well to have at least as much compassion for others as you do for homosexuals.
CCF is away for the weekend, so he is not here to defend himself.
I don't see that quoting the Bible is the same as advocating death. Let's wait and see what CCF says about it before any more assumptions. I accept what the Bible says about homosexuality, but I don't advocate death for homosexuality.
"You would do well to have at least as much compassion for others as you do for homosexuals."
O'h but I do. Lust is a sin. The state of homosexuality in and of itself is not sinful just as hetrosexuality in and of itself is not sinful. Someone can be homosexual and celibate. Do you see where I am coming from. It's in no way a defense of sin but an understanding.
I think you err in a fatal way by equating heterosexuality with homosexuality. Can you fathom claiming the state of mind of a rapist is not sinful in and of itself? How about someone attracted to children. I understand that is a very difficult thing to overcome (unfathomable to me). But the desire itself is sin.
Is it sin to desire your neighbors wife? Homosexual is a word like adulterer. You can't separate it from the act and even the desire.
How about this: is bestiality a state of being? What makes someone want to do that? You will never define it in terms of a Christian worldview if you insist on seeing it as an unsinful state of being.
Heterosexual is what all humans are. No one is homosexual. There is only the disordered desire, which is always a sin. Sin starts as a desire in the heart.
If it were a state it couldn't be overcome. So there is a contradiction. Can someone overcome heterosexuality? They can deal with lust and not act on it, but they are still hetersexual. I just have an issue with your premise because I think it is an obstacle by providing an exuse. There is no exuse for our sin. Compassion must be pure to be of real value. A broken and contrite heart is the point where all sinners start to have hope. I think the state-of-being theory hinders that goal.
exuse = excuse. I have no excuse for my sloppy typing.
My compassion is stronger for the innocent than for the guilty. That means I mourn for the kids who have to be subjected to this subject endlessly just because the government requires their attendance at school. I grieve for the children who are adopted by homsexual couples and have no chance to even develop a normal, strong moral character or concept of right and wrong. I hurt for the family members of those who choose to live in this sin, because they are often corrupted and desensitized by constant exposure to it, and by society's constant demand that they be "loving," which really means that they celebrate it as a normal diversity. If they aren't corrupted too, they are left scorned by a society that has it's values turned upside-down. My strongest compassion is for them, the ones trying to hold onto what is good, moral and roght. I feel for the parents who are pressured to not instruct their children in the way they should go on this subject. I stay awake thinking of the kids in government social services who receive these lessons in perversity as part of their counseling sessions. It's not that I have no sympathy for the sins of the homosexual, particularly those who came on this sinful desire through over-exposure to it themselves, or worse, through being sexually abused as children. I have tremendous sympathies for some of those. But I have way less sympathy for those out and proud and selling it to other innocents. And even less (yes even less) for those who claim the name of Christ while they scornfully condemn the few truth speakers left in the world.
We are all born heterosexual. Biological fact.
Homosexuality is an abnormal state/condition of heterosexuality.
Feelings associated with an 'abnormal' state or condition very definitely can be overcome. All feelings are rooted in behavior and all behaviors can change with the desire to change. Alcoholics, drug addicts, gambling addicts, same sex attracted, beastail attracted, incetuous etc., etc. are all abnormal states/conditions. The abnormal feelings associated with them CAN be overcome with the desire to overcome them. Not easy though.
An understanding heart through the grace of God can overcome anything.