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‘Amazing Grace’ and the task of living our faith more deeply
Denver Catholic Register ^ | February 28, 2007 | Archbishop Charles Chaput

Posted on 02/28/2007 12:15:50 PM PST by Frank Sheed

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To: wagglebee; A.A. Cunningham; Frank Sheed; Salvation
I've always sort of liked the hymn and I get teary when the music only is played on bagpipes.

Thank you to AA.Cunningham, for posting the explanation of why this hymn does not conform to Catholic doctrine.

" Due to the Calvinistic nature of the lyrics, "Amazing Grace" is incompatible with the Catholic Mass and should never even be sung in a Catholic Church, not ot mention during Mass. Unfortunately many poorly catechized Catholics have never learned the theology contained within the lyrics. As explained numerous times by Colin Donovan, STL at EWTN: "

Following VCII, the hymn was introduced to the Latin Mass and grew in popularity. It is often played at the funerals of Catholic police and firefighters, both of which have bagpipe bands. Like freeper Salvation, I believe this hymn, though beautiful, should be abolished from all Catholic liturgies, and a clear explanation of its theological disconnect, provided to Catholics, as a form of education.

21 posted on 02/28/2007 6:13:37 PM PST by NYer ("Where the bishop is present, there is the Catholic Church" - Ignatius of Antioch)
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To: NYer

I don't recall ever hearing it played at a mass and generally when I have heard it sung it is usually only first verse (no mention of the Blessed Mother); however, I can't see how anyone isn't moved to hear it on bagpipes.


22 posted on 03/01/2007 4:55:30 AM PST by wagglebee ("We are ready for the greatest achievements in the history of freedom." -- President Bush, 1/20/05)
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To: wagglebee

I like the bagpipe version as well. Perhaps my weakness can be attributed to my mother's side of the family, which was Protestant.:) She converted in her late teens.


23 posted on 03/01/2007 7:21:53 AM PST by trisham (Hunter for president!)
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To: NYer; wagglebee; A.A. Cunningham; Salvation

Thanks for your explanation, A.A. Cunningham as I am one who decries what we have done to Catholic hymnody. I prefer Latin Chant every time or a gorgeous hymn like "Adoro Te Devote" or "Pange Lingua."

I don't believe I ever said I heard this at a Catholic Mass--I haven't. It is printed in the hymnals, however, and the lyrics are changed from those we have all "heard" at some point. It was this to which I was referring. The whole thing of "copy but copy badly" and not for the purpose of theology. The entire "Here I Am Lord!" is the "gay" anthem, for example, as the Hauugens school will freely admit.

As for the tune on bagpipes, I'd love to have bagpipes at my funeral. I would accept "Amazing Grace" because of its beautiful melody. It is a beautiful song. The lyrics would not be sung. "Holy God We Praise Thy Name" would be my personal choice, however. I'm sure a piper can do that.

F


24 posted on 03/01/2007 7:40:32 AM PST by Frank Sheed ("Shakespeare the Papist" by Fr. Peter Milward, S.J.)
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To: Frank Sheed; NYer; A.A. Cunningham; Salvation

I asked someone who plays bagpipes about this and I was told that the music/tune is most likely a Irish or Scottish bagpipe tune that was already in existence before the the lyrics of "Amazing Grace" was put to it. So, the reason that it sounds so good on bagpipe is that it was written for that purpose.

As you said, I would love to have bagpipes at my funeral and my feeling is that any singing will always detract from the sound of the bagpipes. My brother had bagpipes playing traditional Irish bagpipe music at his wedding and reception and it was very impressive.


25 posted on 03/01/2007 7:59:09 AM PST by wagglebee ("We are ready for the greatest achievements in the history of freedom." -- President Bush, 1/20/05)
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To: A.A. Cunningham
Nice shootin', Tex! Very good analysis.

One must consider two things when using hymns written outside of Catholic theological sensibilities: what did the writer wish to convey himself, and how can the words be reconciled with Catholic teaching. In the case of Amazing Grace, the words, however sincere, convey basic understandings fundamentally opposed to Catholic teaching. Understood at face value, such lyrics do not belong in a Catholic hymnal.

Can the words be understood with a different foundational mentality which can make them usable in a Catholic context? In the case of this hymn, probably not. The universal familiarity with this hymn, across all denominational lines, makes putting a "Catholic" spin on the lyrics virtually impossible, as the non-Catholic outlook inevitably weaves itself into the Catholic mindset.

Can the words be modified to bring the hymn closer to Catholic sensibilities? Certainly, and such modifications have been done. Indeed, such modifications present a perfect "teaching moment" when people hear the "Catholic" differences from the universally known tune. Unfortunately, such teaching moments are seldom seized upon in our cultural zeal to be (overly) ecumenical. We tend to settle for the "false irenicism" that even Vatican II condemned.

In a world where most western Catholics under 55 or so probably have enormous holes in their formation, it is imprudent, at the current beginning of a restoration of order to Catholic formation, to be muddying the waters with lovely sounding but theologically problematic hymns like Amazing Grace. Between such hymns, and the miserable, putatively "Catholic" Haugen/Haas/Schutte things found in OCP hymnals, we should have more than enough ammunition to demand the return of the Catholic classics, and new hymns that emulate their tone and theology. Settling for unedited hymns which speak of such things as the "utter depravity" of the human spirit and frozen moments in time when we "know we are saved" is something orthodox Catholics shouldn't be doing. Sentimentality and a spirit of "getting along" notwithstanding.
26 posted on 03/01/2007 8:27:42 AM PST by magisterium
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