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A Convert's Pilgrimage
Catholics United for the Faith / Lay Witness Magazine ^ | Jul/Aug 2005 | Christopher Cuddy

Posted on 05/25/2007 5:19:25 PM PDT by Titanites

My “pilgrimage” to the Catholic Church began when I was 18 years old. I was a first-semester college freshman enrolled at one of the most prestigious evangelical Protestant colleges in the country. I was a theology/philosophy double major, and my childhood heroes included men like Martin Luther, John Calvin, Jonathan Edwards, R.C. Sproul, and Greg Bahnsen. My grandfather was an evangelical pastor. My uncle was a Presbyterian elder. Reformation theology was deeply imbued in every aspect of my being.

My life’s dream was to become a Protestant seminary professor, so that I could help instruct a new generation of theologians and pastors. I stood with the famous Baptist pastor Charles Haddon Spurgeon in affirming that Reformed theology was just a “nickname for biblical Christianity.” My sole desire was to delve ever deeper into Reformed thought and to help others deepen their Calvinistic affirmations and convictions. As an eager student of Reformed theology (also known as “Calvinism”) I was deeply committed to the Protestant notions of justification by faith alone and the Bible alone as the sole source of authority for Christians. Further, I was a staunch adherent to the famous “five-points of Calvinism,” which stressed man’s total depravity in relation to God’s utter sovereignty.

I was also ardently anti-Catholic. I thought that the pope was the Antichrist, and that the Catholic Church was the “whore of Babylon.” Little did I know that things were about to change.

Tour Guide
Most pilgrimages are not traveled alone, nor are they usually completed without help. There is often a pilgrimage leader or guide—someone who has made the trip before, and is acquainted with many of the challenges that lay before the pilgrims. I had one such guide on my pilgrimage to the Catholic Church: Scott Hahn.

As an evangelical Protestant, Scott Hahn’s story had always been a puzzle to me. I had read Rome Sweet Home and listened to the tape of his conversion story while I was in junior high. To say that I found his story disturbing would be an understatement. He was someone from my own theological “mold,” so to speak: a committed Calvinist, Presbyterian, very anti-Catholic, very passionate about the Lord and His written Word. And yet he defected to Rome? How could this be?

My conclusion after reading his book and listening to his tape was that Scott Hahn was either a “flake” or a “fake.” Either he was too blind and ignorant of the full majesty and richness of the Reformed tradition, or he was a fake, someone out to make a big name for himself and willing to sell his soul to the devil in the process.

Through a series of providential events, I became acquainted with Scott Hahn shortly after I got settled in at college. He was visiting my college campus one evening in late September, and he invited me out to dinner so that we could “talk theology.” I admit that I was a bit intimidated at the prospect of talking theology with a Catholic theologian, but I agreed.

It couldn’t hurt anything, right?

Dr. Hahn and I immediately clicked. Not in a “Catholic-Protestant” kind of way, but in a real and vibrant “brothers in Christ” kind of way. Through the majority of our initial three-and-a-half hour conversation, distinctive Catholic beliefs were not brought up once. We spent most of our time talking about theological topics of mutual interest, and swapping stories of theological heroes we both shared. To my utter shock, I quickly discovered that Scott Hahn did not despise his former Protestant professors and colleagues. Quite the contrary, he explained that while he had changed his mind on certain issues, his respect for his Protestant mentors had only increased over the years. This surprised me, but I believed him. He had a real sincerity and zeal for God and His truth. Not once did I feel like he was trying to manipulate or cajole me into the clutches of Rome. In fact, I was shocked by how easily the conversation flowed and how much unity we shared in our doctrine and belief.

Toward the end of the conversation, we did get around to discussing some of our Catholic-Protestant disagreements. However, because it was late, we really didn’t get to examine the issues in a thorough fashion. At the end of our discussion, Dr. Hahn recommended several book titles and gave me his contact information in case I wanted to dialogue further.

I can still remember shaking his hand and saying goodbye after dinner. My mind kept replaying our conversation as I walked back to my dorm.

College Crisis
To be honest, I really didn’t expect the books that Scott Hahn recommended to be very persuasive. I flipped through several of the titles, and I shelved most of them thinking that I might get around to reading them when I had some “extra time” on my hands. One of the book titles did catch my eye, however: Catholic for a Reason. I looked at the subtitle: “Scripture and the Mystery of the Family of God.” My curiosity piqued, I opened the book and decided to read the introduction just to get a “feel” for what the book was arguing. Nothing more. I probably wouldn’t even read it for more than ten minutes. . . .

My feel for the book quickly turned into a full-fledged intellectual immersion. I couldn’t put the book down. In fact, I read the entire book in one sitting—twice, actually—and I immediately began pouring through the other titles Dr. Hahn had recommended. One book turned into two. Two turned into four. And soon I was completely enamored with the Catholic vision of God and reality. The result was actually pretty alarming: By the end of that month, I had worked my way through about forty books on numerous issues in Catholic theology, apologetics, and history. I don’t say this in a prideful way, but only to express how urgent all of this was to me. Never before had I come across such clear, intelligible, scripturally- saturated explanations of Catholic teaching. While I was intimately acquainted with the various facets of Protestant theology, I was almost completely ignorant of true Catholic teaching. I quickly learned that my understanding of Catholicism was extremely misinformed and that my ideas about Catholics were obviously wrong.

I didn’t know what to do.

It was late October when all of this finally came to a head. I was in a true crisis of faith. The only thing that I could do to keep my sanity was to keep studying, with the prayerful hope that everything would be worked out in the end. Thus, I threw all formal academic caution to the wind. I began skipping classes on a regular basis. I started missing meals. All of this for the sake of devoting more hours of the day and night to reading and studying Catholic theology. My grades—and my appearance—began to suffer. But I didn’t care: I needed the security of knowing where I stood in relation to the Catholic Church. This was absolutely essential to my personal peace and sense of well-being.

During this time, Dr. Hahn and I had several lengthy telephone conversations about the things I was reading. While encouraging, he wasn’t pushy. He merely answered my questions, and he encouraged me to keep reading and praying. The more I read, the more I prayed. And the more I prayed the more I felt that maybe . . . just maybe . . . the Catholic Church might be calling me “home.” It was time to make a decision.

Coming Home
I can still vividly remember the day. It was a slow afternoon. I was sitting in my dorm room, praying. I had just finished a chapter from a book by a Catholic theologian on the Church’s teaching on salvation. Never before had I heard the saving Gospel of Jesus Christ described as divine sonship. I had always thought that justification was mere legal acquittal. This theologian was telling me that it was much more than that: It was divine adoption. Salvation meant being made a son of God.

With tears in my eyes, I bowed my head and gave consent. While I knew that I still had so much to learn, the forty or so books that I had read were enough to persuade me that the Catholic Church really was the Church Christ had instituted. All doubts were gone.

It was time to come home.

I looked up, and my eyes were immediately drawn to the calendar hanging on the wall next to my desk. I looked at the date: It was October 31, 2002. I jerked out of my seat. I couldn’t believe it. October 31? It couldn’t be. . . .

But it was. I couldn’t help but smile at God’s ironic timing. Previously, October 31 had been a very special day to me. For it was on October 31, 1517 that the young Martin Luther had nailed his revolutionary “Ninety-Five Theses” to the Church door of Wittenberg, lighting the spark that ignited the flames of the Protestant Reformation.

On the anniversary of the beginning of the Protestant Reformation, I became Catholic. While I had yet to go through the RCIA program—I was officially received into the Catholic Church the following Easter Vigil—my heart had given consent to Catholicism.

My pilgrimage was over.

I was home.

Christopher Cuddy entered the Catholic Church at the Easter Vigil in 2003. He is a theology student at Franciscan University of Steubenville. He is also a research associate for the St. Paul Center for Biblical Theology and a staff apologist/writer for NextWave Faithful (www.nextwavefaithful.com).


TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Ministry/Outreach; Theology
KEYWORDS: calvinism; conversion; convert; cuddy; hahn
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1 posted on 05/25/2007 5:19:27 PM PDT by Titanites
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To: Titanites
Never before had I come across such clear, intelligible, scripturally- saturated explanations of Catholic teaching. While I was intimately acquainted with the various facets of Protestant theology, I was almost completely ignorant of true Catholic teaching.

I quickly learned that my understanding of Catholicism was extremely misinformed and that my ideas about Catholics were obviously wrong.

2 posted on 05/25/2007 5:26:56 PM PDT by Titanites
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To: Titanites

**and my childhood heroes included men like Martin Luther, John Calvin,...**

I don’t see how one can have both Luther and Calvin as heroes. Don’t their doctrines disagree with each other?

It would be like having both President Jefferson Davis of the C.S.A. and Lincoln as heroes. Or the Emperor Maximilian of Mexico and Juarez.


3 posted on 05/25/2007 5:31:45 PM PDT by Macoraba
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To: Macoraba
I don’t see how one can have both Luther and Calvin as heroes. Don’t their doctrines disagree with each other?

Disagreement with Luther's doctrine doesn't seem to prevent many Protestants's from viewing Luther as a "hero" because of his role in the so-called Reformation.

4 posted on 05/25/2007 6:36:18 PM PDT by Titanites
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To: Titanites; Lady In Blue; Salvation; narses; SMEDLEYBUTLER; redhead; Notwithstanding; ...
I was also ardently anti-Catholic. I thought that the pope was the Antichrist, and that the Catholic Church was the “whore of Babylon.” Little did I know that things were about to change.

Indeed!

5 posted on 05/25/2007 6:43:13 PM PDT by NYer ("Where the bishop is present, there is the Catholic Church" - Ignatius of Antioch)
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To: LiteKeeper
By the end of that month, I had worked my way through about forty books on numerous issues in Catholic theology, apologetics, and history. I don’t say this in a prideful way, but only to express how urgent all of this was to me. Never before had I come across such clear, intelligible, scripturally- saturated explanations of Catholic teaching. While I was intimately acquainted with the various facets of Protestant theology, I was almost completely ignorant of true Catholic teaching. I quickly learned that my understanding of Catholicism was extremely misinformed and that my ideas about Catholics were obviously wrong.

And here is your reading assignment :-)

6 posted on 05/25/2007 6:50:49 PM PDT by NYer ("Where the bishop is present, there is the Catholic Church" - Ignatius of Antioch)
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To: Titanites
Never before had I heard the saving Gospel of Jesus Christ described as divine sonship. I had always thought that justification was mere legal acquittal.

An important point that would be a revelation to many of the sons of Luther.

7 posted on 05/25/2007 6:52:40 PM PDT by livius
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To: Titanites

**I thought that the pope was the Antichrist, and that the Catholic Church was the “whore of Babylon.”**

Regardless of their many doctrinal disagreements that is the one thing that ALL protestants have in common!


8 posted on 05/25/2007 6:56:48 PM PDT by Macoraba
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To: Titanites; Alex Murphy; LiteKeeper; Gamecock; Dr. Eckleburg
Outstanding article!

I had just finished a chapter from a book by a Catholic theologian on the Church’s teaching on salvation. Never before had I heard the saving Gospel of Jesus Christ described as divine sonship. I had always thought that justification was mere legal acquittal. This theologian was telling me that it was much more than that: It was divine adoption. Salvation meant being made a son of God.

This about says it all.

9 posted on 05/25/2007 6:56:57 PM PDT by NYer ("Where the bishop is present, there is the Catholic Church" - Ignatius of Antioch)
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To: Titanites; LiteKeeper; Gamecock; Dr. Eckleburg
I quickly learned that my understanding of Catholicism Calvinism was extremely misinformed and that my ideas about Catholics Calvinists were obviously wrong.

There. Fixed it.

10 posted on 05/25/2007 7:29:07 PM PDT by Alex Murphy (FR Member Alex Murphy: Declared Anathema By The Council Of Trent)
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To: Titanites

**I was home.**

Wonderful words. And what a feeling that must be for converts. The story of a lady in our parish — she was Lutheran and had moved to the little town close to Salem. She set out a plan to follow down the main road reasearching locations and attending each church in the path. When she got to the Catholic Church, her words, “I knew I was home.” And she searched no more. She was received into the Catholic Church this last Easter Vigil and is already active in parish activities.


11 posted on 05/25/2007 7:32:22 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: Titanites

A fellow convert’s welcome to Mr. Cuddy. May Our Lord bless and keep him as he begins what will no doubt be a lifetime of significant contribution to the Church Christ founded. We are truly blessed to have him!


12 posted on 05/25/2007 7:36:05 PM PDT by Ronaldus Magnus
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To: Alex Murphy

Alex, it looks like he already “fixed” it.


13 posted on 05/25/2007 7:39:43 PM PDT by vladimir998 (Ignorance of Scripture is ignorance of Christ. St. Jerome)
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To: vladimir998
A Convert's Pilgrimage [Christopher Cuddy]

From Pastor to Parishioner: My Love for Christ Led Me Home (to the Catholic Church) [Drake McCalister]

Lutheran professor of philosophy prepares to enter Catholic Church

Patty Bonds (former Baptist and sister of Dr. James White) to appear on The Journey Home - May 7

Pastor and Flock Become Catholics

The journey back - Dr. Beckwith explains his reasons for returning to the Catholic Church

Famous Homosexual Italian Author Returned to the Church Before Dying of AIDS

Dr. Francis Beckwith Returns To Full Communion With The Church

Catholic Converts - Stephen K. Ray (former Evangelical)

Catholic Converts - Malcolm Muggeridge

Catholic Converts - Richard John Neuhaus

Catholic Converts - Avery Cardinal Dulles

Catholic Converts - Israel (Eugenio) Zolli - Chief Rabbi of Rome

Catholic Converts - Robert H. Bork , American Jurist (Catholic Caucus)

Catholic Converts - Marcus Grodi

Why Converts Choose Catholicism

The Scott Hahn Conversion Story

14 posted on 05/25/2007 7:41:17 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: Titanites
Nothing is more amusing to the convert, when his conversion has been complete for some time, than to hear the speculations about when or whether he will repent of the conversion; when he will be sick of it, how long he will stand it, at what stage of his external exasperation he will start up and say he can bear it no more. For all this is founded on that optical illusion about the outside and the inside which I have tried to sketch in this chapter. The outsiders, stand by and see, or think they see, the convert entering with bowed head a sort of small temple which they are convinced is fitted up inside like a prison, if not a torture-chamber. But all they really know about it is that he has passed through a door. They do not know that he has not gone into the inner darkness, but out into the broad daylight. It is he who is, in the beautiful and beatific sense of the word, an outsider.

-G. K. Chesterton

15 posted on 05/25/2007 7:42:27 PM PDT by marsh_of_mists
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To: Macoraba
the one thing that ALL protestants have in common!

Wrong!

16 posted on 05/25/2007 7:46:03 PM PDT by LiteKeeper (Beware the secularization of America; the Islamization of Eurabia)
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To: Alex Murphy

Amen!


17 posted on 05/25/2007 7:46:47 PM PDT by LiteKeeper (Beware the secularization of America; the Islamization of Eurabia)
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To: Alex Murphy

Trying to mess things up again?? LOL!


18 posted on 05/25/2007 8:03:27 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: Titanites

I will keep this thread in mind whenever another thread is accused of “bashing Catholics”.


19 posted on 05/25/2007 8:11:08 PM PDT by ikka
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To: Macoraba
Regardless of their many doctrinal disagreements that is the one thing that ALL protestants have in common!

You're wrong.

20 posted on 05/25/2007 8:27:02 PM PDT by GoLightly
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To: Salvation
Trying to mess things up again?? LOL!

Trying to make things "personal"?

21 posted on 05/25/2007 8:31:42 PM PDT by GoLightly
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To: GoLightly

I realized it could be taken that way when I hit the post button. Guess I should have phrased it differently. I just thought they way he messed up the words was funny.


22 posted on 05/25/2007 9:01:16 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: ikka; Religion Moderator

**I will keep this thread in mind whenever another thread is accused of “bashing Catholics”.**

I almost hate to say this. This thread is not the first thread in which Catholic bashing appears, and unfortunately, it will not be the last one. It’s almost as though, it’s OK to make fun of Catholics and belittle their beliefs.

But, then, that is almost funny, because most Protestant churches have gone back to the Catholic Church to get their beliefs. So, go figure?


23 posted on 05/25/2007 9:06:01 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: Salvation
I almost hate to say this. This thread is not the first thread in which Catholic bashing appears, and unfortunately, it will not be the last one. It’s almost as though, it’s OK to make fun of Catholics and belittle their beliefs.

Please, point out all of the "Catholic bashing" in this thread.

24 posted on 05/25/2007 9:18:01 PM PDT by GoLightly
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To: Salvation

Do yourself a favor & don’t use Christopher Cuddy as an authority on Calvinist teachings.


25 posted on 05/25/2007 9:21:33 PM PDT by GoLightly
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To: Salvation

Many thanks for this list...


26 posted on 05/25/2007 9:37:12 PM PDT by TASMANIANRED (Taz Struck By Lightning Faces Battery Charge)
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To: Salvation; Alex Murphy; LiteKeeper

I wouldn’t say there was any Catholic bashing here. LiteKeeper and Alex Murphy are just keeping us on our toes. There is disagreement and then there is Catholic bashing. IMHO, LK and AM don’t fall into that group (Catholic bashing).

Guess Alex isn’t quite as anathemized as he would like.


27 posted on 05/25/2007 9:50:33 PM PDT by StAthanasiustheGreat (Vocatus Atque Non Vocatus Deus Aderit)
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To: Macoraba

Actually, most Protestants I have known do NOT think the Pope is the anti-Christ and the Church the “whore of Babylon.”

As a convert to Catholicism, I have many years behind me full of Protestant Bible study, and truth be told, not once was the Catholic Church discussed in anything but a respectful manner.

Sometimes Catholics have misconceptions about Protestants, just like sometimes Protestants misunderstand Catholics.


28 posted on 05/26/2007 3:54:27 AM PDT by Miss Marple (Prayers for Jemian's son,: Lord, please keep him safe and bring him home .)
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To: Macoraba

You have made a broad and sweeping generalization about all Protestants that doesn’t appear to be logical. While in the past many did believe that of what you claim, and some may still do, it’s a major stretch to argue that we all think that way.

I have been impressed with the quality of the posts of many of your fellow Catholics and what seems to me to be a genuine individual and collective Christian witness. They set a good example for you to follow.


29 posted on 05/26/2007 4:50:58 AM PDT by Upbeat
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To: marsh_of_mists

Where is that quote from GKC? The Catholic Thing?


30 posted on 05/26/2007 5:11:07 AM PDT by Remole
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To: Titanites; Macoraba
Disagreement with Luther's doctrine doesn't seem to prevent many Protestants's from viewing Luther as a "hero" because of his role in the so-called Reformation.

Precisely. Most of the students and faculty at said Evangelical Protestant college wold pick Calvin over Luther if they had to, but they recognize that Luther's contribution to the Reformation.

31 posted on 05/26/2007 5:47:33 AM PDT by GCC Catholic (Pray for your priests and seminarians...)
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To: Macoraba
**I thought that the pope was the Antichrist, and that the Catholic Church was the “whore of Babylon.”** Regardless of their many doctrinal disagreements that is the one thing that ALL protestants have in common!

Where do you get these ideas? From a few Internet sites? There are always folks who will say such things, but do you honestly believe ALL Protestants go around calling the Pope the Antichrist? Expressing a disagreement with Catholic theology is not the same as calling Catholics members of the "whore of Babylon."

32 posted on 05/26/2007 8:06:30 AM PDT by Flo Nightengale (long-time lurker)
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To: Titanites
Never before had I heard the saving Gospel of Jesus Christ described as divine sonship. I had always thought that justification was mere legal acquittal. This theologian was telling me that it was much more than that: It was divine adoption. Salvation meant being made a son of God.

Have to wonder what this fella had been reading all that time...Apparently his Theology and Philosophy classes didn't include a bible...

33 posted on 05/26/2007 8:31:41 AM PDT by Iscool (OK, I'm Back...Now what were your other two wishes???)
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To: Iscool

The usual comment on the thread I see. I think it is pretty safe to say that this individual is familiar with Sacred Scripture.

While perhaps it is a stretch to say most Protestants believe the Pope is the antiChrist and the Church the Whore of babylon, there are some who do (a vocal small minority).

However, that comment along I do not think discount what he has to say. Have you ever read Scott Hahn? He uses scripture a great deal, perhaps not in the interpretation you would prefer, but scripture is the focus of his writings.


34 posted on 05/26/2007 10:38:18 AM PDT by StAthanasiustheGreat (Vocatus Atque Non Vocatus Deus Aderit)
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To: StAthanasiustheGreat
However, that comment along I do not think discount what he has to say. Have you ever read Scott Hahn? He uses scripture a great deal, perhaps not in the interpretation you would prefer, but scripture is the focus of his writings.

I've read little bits and pieces of his work...I've also read that he continues to use some of your church documents as authorative which were proven years ago to be some of the documented forgeries of your church history...

As I see it, many, if not most of the Reformed churches are 'throwbacks' of the Catholic church...They don't like everything you guys teach but they never really cut the umbilical cord connected to your church...

I believe that's where Scott Hahn came from...He always was a Catholic...I'm not from that bunch...

35 posted on 05/26/2007 10:53:22 AM PDT by Iscool (OK, I'm Back...Now what were your other two wishes???)
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To: Iscool

WOW. I know you didn’t have a positive view of Catholicism, but I didn’t realize you didn’t view even many of the Reformed Churches favorably either.

What documents which were forgeries does he use? I’ll admit I don’t recall too many Church documents from his books, but I’ll readily admit I haven’t read all of them. I like Scott Hahn, but I have some criticisms.

Which Reformed Churches aren’t throwbacks? Or is it not really a cut and dry course iyho.


36 posted on 05/26/2007 10:58:22 AM PDT by StAthanasiustheGreat (Vocatus Atque Non Vocatus Deus Aderit)
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To: Iscool
I can assure you of two things:

-The theology classes that Chris would have taken as a college freshman were quite Scriptural (and also quite Calvinist). I suspect the philosophy classes were as well. I know this because I took several of them (the ones that made up the required humanities core).

-Having met and spoken to both Chris and Dr. Hahn personally, there was a time in both of their lives that the last thing they would have wanted to have been labeled is "Catholic." As a matter of fact, Dr. Hahn quite freely admits that in his youth and college days, he was very anti-Catholic. If you have never done so, you should read Rome Sweet Home to get his own take on it.

I've also read that he continues to use some of your church documents as authorative which were proven years ago to be some of the documented forgeries of your church history.

Examples? Otherwise it's hearsay. Besides that, it doesn't detract from the fact that he does use Scripture a great deal.

37 posted on 05/26/2007 11:21:39 AM PDT by GCC Catholic (Pray for your priests and seminarians...)
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To: GCC Catholic
Otherwise it's hearsay. Besides that, it doesn't detract from the fact that he does use Scripture a great deal.

Sure it does...Especially since scripture takes a back seat when it comes to the historical writings of your magisterium and your church fathers...

The theology classes that Chris would have taken as a college freshman were quite Scriptural (and also quite Calvinist). I suspect the philosophy classes were as well. I know this because I took several of them (the ones that made up the required humanities core).

And the Theology classes you took, did they not teach you from the bible that, " Salvation meant being made a son of God."

It's all over the bible...Why would a student of Christianity not know that???

38 posted on 05/26/2007 11:48:40 AM PDT by Iscool (OK, I'm Back...Now what were your other two wishes???)
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To: StAthanasiustheGreat
Which Reformed Churches aren’t throwbacks? Or is it not really a cut and dry course iyho.

Don't know...

I have an aunt, about 83 years old...Been Episcopalian since I can remember...Her oldest son, recently passed, was a farmer without a college education, was also a lifelong member...

Her younger son, now around 50 grew up in the same church...Went to college, switched between different Reformed religions...

The aunt and eldest son were/are conservative Christians...Believe the scripture from cover to cover...As good a Christians as Christians are able to be...

The educated son, who studied religion and philosophy in college has an entirely different approach to Christianity...Especially the bible...I guess he got educated out of it...Doesn't like to talk of heaven and hell...Has no personal salvation testimony...

I said that to say this: I can't say that all Reformed churches or their individual assemblies are tied to the Catholic church...It does seem that regardless of that affilitation, liberalness and and lack of respect of (and spiritual knowledge in) the scriptures is more than evident in my little acre of the world...

I'm reminded of that verse in Amos:

Amo 8:12 And they shall wander from sea to sea, and from the north even to the east, they shall run to and fro to seek the word of the LORD, and shall not find it.

Everyone's looking for the word of God...But they don't look where it is...The Holy Scripture...

39 posted on 05/26/2007 12:05:15 PM PDT by Iscool (OK, I'm Back...Now what were your other two wishes???)
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To: Iscool

Hmm, I don’t know if I would have considered Episcopalians reformed. Reformed to me is the Calvinist Predestination guided denominations.

Just trying to figure you out, that’s all. Figured its a better way and technique then being combative. LOL.

I await your response. God bless.


40 posted on 05/26/2007 12:13:05 PM PDT by StAthanasiustheGreat (Vocatus Atque Non Vocatus Deus Aderit)
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To: Miss Marple
As a convert to Catholicism, I have many years behind me full of Protestant Bible study, and truth be told, not once was the Catholic Church discussed in anything but a respectful manner.

Thank you for making that important point.

As a Protestant, only one time were differences mentioned by our longtime pastor; specifically, the criticism of Protestants to neglect the importance,(sanctity), of the Virgin Mary.

"And the critics are right," he added.

He then proceeded to teach of the extraordinary life of this wonderful and gracious lady.

41 posted on 05/26/2007 12:13:31 PM PDT by HoosierHawk
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To: StAthanasiustheGreat
IMHO, LK and AM don’t fall into that group (Catholic bashing).

Honestly StAth, that's one of the nicer things anyone's ever said about me here. Many, many thanks!

Guess Alex isn’t quite as anathemized as he would like.

ROTFL!

42 posted on 05/26/2007 12:39:13 PM PDT by Alex Murphy (FR Member Alex Murphy: Declared Anathema By The Council Of Trent)
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To: Alex Murphy

Wow, it’s the truth. There are anti-Catholics on the site, you aren’t one of them. You just like to keep us on our toes. And you post lots of good news stories, so I appreciate what you do, even if we don’t see eye to eye. God Bless


43 posted on 05/26/2007 12:46:15 PM PDT by StAthanasiustheGreat (Vocatus Atque Non Vocatus Deus Aderit)
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To: StAthanasiustheGreat
Have you ever read Scott Hahn? He uses scripture a great deal, perhaps not in the interpretation you would prefer, but scripture is the focus of his writings.

When you read his stuff you should always have your Bible open next to it because he misquotes and takes scripture out of context to support his personal theology

44 posted on 05/26/2007 12:59:34 PM PDT by ears_to_hear
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To: Salvation

Is holding a different opinion or debating the same as “bashing” ?

As a conservative I can not understand playing the victim card, salvation. Better to step up and explain or defend what you believe than to whine IMHO


45 posted on 05/26/2007 1:02:14 PM PDT by ears_to_hear
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To: Iscool
And the Theology classes you took, did they not teach you from the bible that, " Salvation meant being made a son of God."

We talked about sonship, but we also talked a whole lot about imputed righteousness and forensic justification too. I'm sure he had a far better background though than I did, that he knew it, but in never really sunk in until that point that he mentioned; I fall in the "Catholic with mediocre catechesis" category. I was far too busy taking it all in that freshman year of college.

That said, really understanding that salvation meant being a son of God had a profound effect on my life, and has truly been a great gift.

46 posted on 05/26/2007 1:21:02 PM PDT by GCC Catholic (Pray for your priests and seminarians...)
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To: ears_to_hear

“... Better to step up and explain or defend what you believe than to whine IMHO.”

Using emotionally laden words is a form of bashing. Whining implies a certain childish behavior.

It might be better not to choose words that are pointedly angry.

When I choose to bash, I don’t make any attempt to claim it isn’t. When I’m angry, it shows and I don’t pretend I’m not.

To do so, is rather slippery and dishonest. Anger is enough of a sin without adding that to it! LOL!


47 posted on 05/26/2007 2:42:43 PM PDT by OpusatFR
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To: Remole
It's from his book The Catholic Church and Conversion, chapter 4.
48 posted on 05/26/2007 7:26:29 PM PDT by marsh_of_mists
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To: Flo Nightengale

I think it was his abrasive way of saying that the countless Protestant demoninations are so different the only thing they have in common in their schism from the Catholic Church.


49 posted on 05/26/2007 7:27:50 PM PDT by marsh_of_mists
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To: marsh_of_mists
Protestant demoninations are so different the only thing they have in common in their schism from the Catholic Church.

I was raised a Methodist, but have attended services at numerous churches over the years. Whether Methodist, Presbyterian, Baptist, Nazarene, Wesleyan, Lutheran, etc., I never witnessed these horrible divisions I'm always seeing claimed. The important things are those which unite us, primarily our belief in the resurrected Lord Jesus.

50 posted on 05/26/2007 8:38:19 PM PDT by Flo Nightengale (long-time lurker)
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