Posted on 06/23/2007 3:17:51 PM PDT by NYer
Unless you're thinking mid-1940s East Coast priestly ordination, your eyes aren't deceiving you with that shot above.
Then again, said conjure wouldn't have taken place on a football field: it's a scene from the aforementioned liturgy last weekend at which 60 permanent deacons were ordained for the Santa Barbara region of the archdiocese of Los Angeles, with Cardinal Roger Mahony as ordaining prelate.
Glad Tidings in the archdiocesan weekly:
The ordination of 60 men to the Permanent Diaconate at Santa Barbara City College's La Playa Stadium represented the largest single group of deacons ordained at one time in the history of the Archdiocese of Los Angeles, and possibly in the country. Held a week following the ordination of seven deacons in Los Angeles, the celebration also represented the successful efforts led by pastors of the Santa Barbara Region (Ventura and Santa Barbara Counties) to draw forth more men to ordained ministry in their local parish communities.
"This is one of the most glorious days of my 40 years of priesthood," declared Santa Barbara Region Auxiliary Bishop Thomas Curry, who oversaw the formation process that began in 2002, and who delivered the homily at the ordination Mass. "Your presence is testimony to the good work of God that is present in all of you."
Referring to the day's second reading from the Acts of the Apostles (Peter's speech to the disciples), Bishop Curry reminded the deacons and the assembly of the Synod's first pastoral initiative, which "speaks to our call to evangelize, to testify to the power and goodness of the risen Lord. As deacons, believe that God has called you to continue the renewal of the Church by testifying to the faith and power of God manifested in you."
The celebration began with the 60 deacon candidates --- the 56 married men accompanied by their wives --- processing into La Playa Stadium to the sounds of "Joyful, Joyful, We Adore Thee," in front of more than 3,000 cheering family, friends and parishioners from around the region. Several wiped tears from their eyes as they made their way down the middle of the football field and to their places.
"This is an important and historic occasion," noted Cardinal Roger Mahony in his opening remarks. "We gather with great joy as you receive the sacred order of deacon. And we are so proud of you in this region, for the initiatives you have taken to bring forth the laity into this service."
The formation process took place at Our Lady of Sorrows Church in Santa Barbara, and was led by Jesuit Fathers Luis Quihuis and Thomas McCormick, pastor and associate. According to Father Quihuis, the process was launched at the behest of pastors in the region who saw a shortage in Spanish-speaking priests and deacons in their area, where the 38 parishes are between 40 and 200 miles from downtown Los Angeles....
Pastors were invited to identify and recommend deacon candidates, "all of whom were actively involved in their parishes," said Father Quihuis. The candidates were divided into groups of English- and Spanish-speaking, who met respectively on alternate Saturdays (9 a.m.-4 p.m.) or on alternate Saturdays (2-6 p.m.) and Thursdays (7-9:30 p.m.).
In addition to the ongoing service component, the first two years of the formation process were heavily Scripture-based, "to provide a solid foundation to build on," said Father Quihuis. Christology, systematic theology, church history and homiletics were also included in the process, with married candidates' wives --- also involved in service to the church --- encouraged to participate.
All of the 60, Bishop Curry told them in his homily, "are a light shining in the darkness, evidence of the grace of God, the vitality of God, the goodness of God in his people."
No comment.
LOL. It’s always good to know when to hold one’s tongue. Good to see you.
On the other hand, in our modest little diocese, we ordained three PRIESTS today.
That makes 4 priests and 56 helpers.
Way to go! Auguri to the newly ordained.
:-)
Good to be back in the forum. I missed all of you.
Last deacon I talked to, when I tried to bring up my concerns with liturgical abuses and heresy, said, “I don’t even want to talk to you.”
They are DU leftists first, second and third, and priest or deacon maybe fourth or fifth.
I’m struggling to meet a deadline and concentrated right through the 30 minutes that confession is offered this week. The odds of getting a priest to hear my confession outside that time are worse than zero. Another week without the sacriments, thank you very much Bishop Michael Driscoll, Protector of Sodomites.
There as no Corpus on the Cross!
**All of the 60, Bishop Curry told them in his homily, “are a light shining in the darkness, evidence of the grace of God, the vitality of God, the goodness of God in his people.”**
Can you imagine that, if all these deacons become orthodox priests..........what the injection of 60 new priests would do for that Archdiocese??????
We need to pray for them as well as Cardinal Mahony.
**They are DU leftists first, second and third, and priest or deacon maybe fourth or fifth.**
I have not found this to be true. Very orthodox deacons who were ordained this year. (three — but 25 priests for our Archdiocese preparing for the priesthood next year -— yay!)
Pray that they will be orthodox. (And read my tagline!)
“I have not found this to be true.”
I was talking about the ones I’ve encountered here, not your’n.
Back in the mid 80s we had three married deacons. Bad! One called adoration of the Blessed Sacrament “cookie worship”!!!
One told me I was too old fashioned, out-of-touch and said I should read the V2 documents. He loaned me a copy. Later I showed him where it said that Latin was to be maintained. He was not amused!
These deacons only lasted one year. It was almost 15 years later until we got another married deacon.
Congrats! We had 4 in the Diocese of Baltimore, which I think is down from recent and previous classes.
One was from my parish and we still have 2 more from my church at Mount St. Mary’s.
God bless your new priests.
For those not familiar with the Los Angeles Archdiocese, the ordaining prelate, Cardinal Mahoney, has been an activist in the "rights" of illegal immigrants -- almost from the day of his ordination.
These are married permanent deacons, so there’ll be no priests in that crowd! It’s all part of Mahony’s plan to eliminate priests in his Archdiocese.
My experience with these permanent deacons has been miserable. They’re not very bright, a lot of them are elderly and most of them were formed in the worst practices of Vatican II, to say nothing of the fact that they appear to have a fuzzy grasp of doctrine; and furthermore, in many cases, you get the impression that it is their wives who want to be the “deacons,” and the guys are just their way of achieving it.
One of the problems with the whole diaconate thing is that it is not very clear what they are supposed to do. If they actually performed a useful service, such as running parish charitable activities or even doing the bookkeeping and scheduling, I could see the point; but instead they seem to be up on the altar, fighting with Father to get to the pulpit and preach, and trying to nudge him over when they get to elevate the chalice.
They were intended as an end-run around clerical celibacy, getting people used to the idea of a married clergy, and also as a way of deemphasizing the sacramental priesthood. I think in some parishes and dioceses they have been very successful in doing that.
Thank you! I believe our bishop, Bp. Victor Galeone, is from Baltimore.
Our first bishop in St Augustine, Bp. Augustine Verot, came to us via Baltimore, where he had been involved in the Council of Baltimore. He was from France originally. In any case, St Augustine, Fl seems to have a pretty steady connection with Baltimore!
Their meteoric rise in numbers has paralleled the plummeting numbers of priests. All they do is read the Gospel, dispense Communion (with a horde of EEMs) and deliver an abyssmal homily once per month.
3 years, 8 months, and 2 more days...
My dad volunteers as a deacon in two separate parishes in our diocese. He deacons at 2 - 4 Masses each weekend (more than the average priest says in our diocese). At several of these Masses, he assists aging, infirm, or foreign priests who due to illness, age, or English limitations are not capable of either standing to give out Communion or to give the homily.
On Saturdays at least onces a month, he does Baptisms. Like many Deacons, he refuses to do private Baptisms as the Church does discourages private Baptisms; Baptisms are to be communal events for new members to the Church.
During the week, he does marriage intake interviews and baptism intake interviews. He often encounters problems with the to-be-married couples as the vast majority of them see fit to cohabitate before marriage. For those, he tells them what the Church expects of them and tells them that they must go to Confession and refrain from that particular sin prior to marriage. He tells the parents of Baptismal infants that they too should be attending Church weekly with their child. He attempts to teach all of them about Catholic morality.
My point is not solely to praise my father; my point is that he is emblematic of the vast majority of Deacons whom I've met and interacted with, and I daresay I have interacted with many, many more Deacons than most on this thread, so all the negativity toward Deacons here is unfounded and, frankly, not Catholic. as there is no such thing as an "orthodox" Catholic or a non-orthodox Catholic. A Catholic respects and follows the rules and practices set forth by the Church, and that goes both on the conservative and liberal side of the equasion.
As so many of you are fond of saying on other threads, the Catholic Church is not a democracy. The Roman Catholic Church has deacons, and as it is not a democracy, you are welcome to accept deacons as a fact of the Roman Catholic Church or to join one of the ultra-conservative schismatic wanna-be catholic churches.
Oh, and you're wrong on each and every count here. Their rise in numbers occurred after the drop-off in priestly vocations and is not a parallel event. As far as for what "all they do" is, you should do some research. To oversimplify, as you did, basically all they DO NOT do is consecrate (hence they do not "say Mass") and hear confessions.
Is it true, as I have led to believe, that should their wives die, these deacons cannot remarry — and could at that time become a celibate priest?
I do believe the deacons do have outlined duties. Their ordinations are the first of three ordinations steps.
deacon
priest
bishop
They can read the Gospel and preach at a weekend/Sunday Mass (if the priest so chooses.) They also have other things that they can say during the Mass.
They can perform Baptisms, Marriage and officate at a funeral. Deacons can also officiate at a Communion Service.
They can assist in elevating the host at Mass and act as and ordained Minister of Holy Communion. (Better to receive from them rather than a lay EMHC!!)
They can lead certain things in a parish at the pleasure of the priest.
It has not been my experience that they are trying to “take over” the priest’s duties. Their duties are totally on a different level and are totally at the discretion of the administrative or parochial priest of the parish.
Deacons cannot perform
Confirmation
The Holy Sacrifice of the Mass — consecration of the Holy Eucharist
Reconciliation
Annointing of the Sick
Why can you say such things about someone who has been ordained in the first step of Holy Orders?
Don’t berate them, please pray for them instead.
There is a page in the Pieta Prayer Book about how to speak of priests. I believe the same would apply to deacons.
Thank you, cammie! See my recent posts here!
We need priestly vocations. Deacons are a visible symbol of the decline in priestly vocations in the American Church. Their emergence has coincided with dwindling vocations and is not a reason for celebration. They perform many of the functions hitherto performed by priests but which, because of dwindling numbers, dwindling morale or involvement with other activities, now fall to lay people. Most of the activities you list, aside form the actual baptism (and even that in emergency) can be performed by non-ordained lay people, and are in many places.
I'm glad your father is a good deacon. I figured someone would take it personally. Most of the deacons whom I've known are well intentioned men, I think. However, their preaching is invariably awful and for me, it carries no gravitas.
Please pray for these deacons. Some will become excellent priests when they are ordained in the second level of Holy Orders.
And please remember that the diaconate is an ordained position.
WOW!!
Here are four pages about the Sacrament of Holy Orders from the Catechism of the Catholic Church.
Let's learn about this before we start talking about deacons that we have known. We need to pray for all deacons just as we pray for our priests and bishops.
The married men are permanent deacons (meaning they can never be ordained to the priesthood). You’re referring to the diaconate that is the order before the priesthood, which is different.
The permanent diaconate was a VatII invention. When they started talking about it, at first it sounded as if the deacons would actually do something useful (such as the early deacons did, that is, handle parish charities, etc.) in order to free up the priest for things that were more on the spiritual and liturgical side. Instead, the permanent diaconate turned out to be mostly liturgical and in practice actually took away some religious functions that were normally done by the priest, and in addition added yet another source of poorly instructed, Protestant-style preaching.
And it was widely seen in the 1970s as preparing for the (in their opinion) happy day of the “priestless church,” since the deacons do most things Protestant ministers do and hence would be perfect for the new quasi-Protestant church. I think they were seriously hoping that by the “withering away” of the priesthood, they would end up by getting rid of the Mass and the Eucharist altogether, and everything would be reduced to a symbolic level - which was all the arch-heretics thought it was, anyway. The EEMS were another effort to reduce the importance and visibility of the priest, and reduce the reality of the Eucharist and make it seem like a Protestant “memorial meal,” which even little old ladies could hand out.
This, of course, doesn’t mean that most of the people who go into it have that intention. But part of the objective of certain people (both in Vatican II Rome and in the dioceses, particularly in the US) in stuffing the sanctuary with this mysterious new order, the permanent deacon, and squadrons of laypeople was to fundamentally change the perception of what the Mass was and also to marginalize the priest, who people like Roger Mahony obviously regard as a serious stumbling block on the way to the “New Church.”
I still believe,that if a wife dies, these men can re-enter the siminary and be ordained a priest.
I’ll check on it with my priest. (Or with my deacon)
I’ve never seen a study, but I’d wouldn’t be in the least surprised if dioceses that have a high percentage of permanent deacons have a very low rate of priestly ordinations. I think filling the church up with deacons says a lot about the Bishop in question, and his attitudes (it has been shown time and again) are crucial in getting priestly vocations.
Some additional posts by other FReepers verifying my statement from another thread. (I don’t believe it’s OK to copy and paste posts from another thread.)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1687448/posts
Whether they can, or if they are permitted to (depending on lax interpretation, perhaps), study for the priesthood after their wife dies, I don’t know - originally, this was not supposed to be a possibility, but some bishops may ignore that the way they ignore everything else that Rome says.
I’m not criticizing them as individuals, btw, since I am sure they and their wives (who play way too important a role) are quite sincere. But the institution is not the same as the diaconate on the way to the priesthood, and was an invention of Vatican II. Or the “spirit” thereof.
Yes. We have personally known Permanent Deacons who were widowed and eventually became priests.
Excellent observation! Then again, this is the Archdiocese of Los Angeles. Cardinal Mahony should really consider switching to the ECUSA. He would be much happier there.
Perhaps you didn't read far enough into the article.
... the 60 deacon candidates --- the 56 married men accompanied by their wives ...
If anything, these men would be an injection for the Byzantine Church. It wouldn't take much for them to switch rites.
Yup! Install them in the 'priestless' parishes and, because he can't ordain women, put a female Lay Ecclesial Minister in charge. This then reduces the priest to nothing more than a sacramental minister.
We have this here in the Albany Diocese. The brother of an elderly priest likened the process to castration. It's a bitter pill to swallow after one has devoted their life in service to Christ. The bright side is that these bishops are now aging; it's only a matter of a few more years before they are out of office. Then begins the cleanup. Of course, the damage wrecked over many decades will take a long time to undo, if ever.
I think that's very perceptive of him. I heard a priest say that once, too. This must be a real ordeal for good, faithful priests.
You are being extremely unfair. I now a class of deacons in my diocese who are upright, orthodox men of proven vocation and scrupulous when it comes to liturgical matters.
Don't make a standard out of your experience. It would only take one such man to prove you wrong.
-Theo
Wow. I see your true colors shining through.
If you don't want me to comment on your "stuff," don't make it public. Send it via private e-mail to whomever you are commenting to. If your post is public and I want to comment on it, and if my comments fall within the guidelines of this forum -- and they usually do, because I self-edit in order not to come out sounding foolish, like you -- I will comment on them, whether you like it or not.
-Theo
Is it true, as I have led to believe, that should their wives die, these deacons cannot remarry — and could at that time become a celibate priest?
Yes that is true. Deacons are not permitted to remarry after the death of their wives, and yes they may continue on to the priesthood. And those who are ordained as deacons while single (those ordained into the "permanent diaconate," which is different than becoming a deacon on your way to priesthood) may not marry. I know one man who became a permanent deacon as a single schoolteacher. After he retired from teaching at 55, he retired to Orlando and three years later became a priest in that diocese, where he still serves.
As you are re-writing Church history, please be sure to inform Rome that its tradition, Acts 6:1-6, the writings of Sts. Irenaus, Clement of Rome, and Ignatius, and its reference to St. Stephen the Martyr as the first deacon are all wrong, as they all refer to the service of deacons in the early Church, but clearly the emergence of deacons has only coincided with dwindling vocations. /sarc
>> There as no Corpus on the Cross! <<
That’s for when there is a sacrifice made. These men are married.
Yes, your current Bishop is chock full of Baltimore street cred; St. Charles Seminary, Mount St. Mary’s and Loyola.
I’m betting that he has to restrain himself from calling everyone “hon” - local colloquial affectation if you’re not familiar.
Verot, as well, following in the footsteps of Mother Seton’s friend/confessor/mentor John DuBois, himself a Sulpician also.
New Advent has material about Verot, but some of it it confusing.
www.thefirstparish.org
Clears some of this up.
Verot was also a pastor in Ellicott City (called “Ellicot’s Mill’s” in his time) which is a very cool little old town not so far from me.
Agreed.
For the most part, my experience with deacons has been very positive. I have encountered a few that I didn’t particularly like, but I wouldn’t tar the entire ministry with the same brush.
A nearby parish that I am familiar with has a young married deacon and the guy is just fantastic! I don’t know how he stretches himself out over work and family life and makes it happen, but he does. The priest of that particular parish is somewhat “liberal” and I think this young man has a moderating influence on the pastor. So, that can work both ways.
My own parish has an 85 year old deacon. He is the treasure of our church. A very quiet, pious and holy man. He has been a widow for many years and his position as a deacon disqualifies him from remarrying. We have a “one-pastor” rule for our church, which includes over 2,000 families, and it’s obvious to me that our pastor relies on our deacon for counsel and support, which is a different kind of counsel that he might get from someone that he has to work with on a board or committee.
Visiting seminarians moving through the ranks also have to become deacons before they are priests, at least every seminarian that has moved through our parish has. Effectively, a visiting seminarian within our church might also serve for some period of time with our parish as an ordained deacon.
I took that line to mean 56 married Permanent Deacons and 4 Celibate Permanent Deacons.
Truthfully, I believe large Permanent Deacon classes should be the norm. I believe the reason why they aren’t is because folks keep lobbying against Celibacy and not promoting the Permanent Diaconate as the distinct Vocation it is.
Most people think it’s “Priest-Lite”, if they knew it was a servile position within the Church, I think you’d have orthodox Catholic men climbing over each other to apply.
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