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Vatican says other Christian churches "wounded" (Non-Catholics not fullly Christian)
Reuters ^ | 7-20-07 | Phil Stewart

Posted on 07/10/2007 8:00:34 AM PDT by Bladerunnuh

VATICAN CITY (Reuters) - The Vatican said on Tuesday Christian denominations outside Roman Catholicism were not full churches of Jesus Christ.

Protestant leaders said this was offensive and would hurt inter-religious dialogue.

A 16-page document by the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, which Pope Benedict once headed, described Christian Orthodox churches as true churches, but suffering from a "wound" since they do not recognize the primacy of Pope.

But the document said the "wound is still more profound" in Protestant denominations.

"Despite the fact that this teaching has created no little distress ... it is nevertheless difficult to see how the title of 'Church' could possibly be attributed to them," it said.

The Vatican text, which restates the controversial document

(Excerpt) Read more at reuters.com ...


TOPICS: Catholic
KEYWORDS: catholic; christian; pope; protestant; vaticandomination; viniusinvictus
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Well, to be honest, we Protestants have been thinking the same about Catholics for centuries, so I actually respect his honesty. He's not trying to blend all the different viewpoints together, so I'm all for that.
1 posted on 07/10/2007 8:00:34 AM PDT by Bladerunnuh
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To: Bladerunnuh

Me too, I don’t have a problem with this. I’m all for strength of your convictions. It’s when people compromise their faith for the sake of unity that is far worse.


2 posted on 07/10/2007 8:02:59 AM PDT by agrace
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To: Bladerunnuh
Any church that DOESN'T believe it's got it right should just take down the sign out front and sell the place for a nightclub.

Anti-Christians pretend that they want some sort of "let's all get along" Christianity, but what they really want is for it All To Go Away. This sort of slanted news article is just an attack on all Christians. Divide and conquer.

3 posted on 07/10/2007 8:03:39 AM PDT by AnAmericanMother ((Ministrix of Ye Chase, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment)))
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To: Bladerunnuh; ExtremeUnction; ripnbang; starlifter; CincinnatiKid; romanesq; ab01; stevem; ...
+

Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic Ping List:

Add me / Remove me

Please ping me to all note-worthy Pro-Life or Catholic threads, or other threads of interest.

4 posted on 07/10/2007 8:04:16 AM PDT by narses ("Freedom is about authority." - Rudolph Giuliani)
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To: Bladerunnuh

I agree. The current Pope is one that you can respect, even when you disagree with him. He’s going to be far better for his church than any other recent Pope.


5 posted on 07/10/2007 8:04:19 AM PDT by PAR35
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To: Bladerunnuh
The Pope is completely wrong. Protestant churches are the only actual Christian churches. True Protestants do not worship goddesses or saints... we worship Jesus Christ, making us actual Christians.
6 posted on 07/10/2007 8:05:58 AM PDT by Dr. Thorne (Compromise on your vote and you get a compromised government.)
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To: Bladerunnuh
Exactly! Tell it like it is.

And, as I told my 75 year old Mom a while ago "Mom, I am broudly in support of the aims of the Reformation" (Our family are Catholic on boths sides for the last 500 or 1000 years)

. That is Bible literacy (appalling among many Catholics), reform of corrupt church practices, careful review of doctrine, more direct unmittigated relationship with God, less focus on Saints, etc.

So yes, most Protestants in they are being honest would say that the Catholic church was 'damaged' which is why the Reformation was needed to start with, and that much of the damage remains.

7 posted on 07/10/2007 8:06:44 AM PDT by Jack Black
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To: Bladerunnuh

I really do wish Christians would stop fighting among themselves.

We have a common enemy that is threatening us with annialation and all we are doing is splitting ourselves up into smaller and smaller pieces.

I am saying “we” - but I am not a Christian - I am a Jew.

I view all Christians as my brothers/sisters and I really do hate family fights.

I don’t think Chist would like it either.


8 posted on 07/10/2007 8:07:42 AM PDT by Basheva
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To: Bladerunnuh

He also said non-Catholic Christian chruchs were “true churches.” As an evangelical, I’d say that’s generous, considering his position. One could hardly expect the Pope to say that all denominations were equally valid.


9 posted on 07/10/2007 8:07:53 AM PDT by keats5 (tolerance of intolerant people is cultural suicide)
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To: Bladerunnuh

The body of Christ is stronger for being organized into independent cells. The enemy can’t take us out in one blow.


10 posted on 07/10/2007 8:08:02 AM PDT by DManA
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To: Bladerunnuh
18 And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Jesus said He is the builder and it is His Church. He did not command the Apostles to go out and build their churches for Him. A huge distinction with an eternal significance.

11 posted on 07/10/2007 8:08:02 AM PDT by pgyanke (Duncan Hunter 08--You want to elect a conservative? Then support a conservative!)
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To: Bladerunnuh

It’s only causing “distress” among those who are insecure in their faith. I’m a Protestant. I think there are a lot of lost souls in Catholocism and in Protestantism.

The only quibble I have with what he said is that he doesn’t seem to recognize that the problem exists within the Catholic Church as well. When I watch O’Reilly talk about religion, for example, I ask myself how this guy can really call himself a Christian. Because he attends church services? Because mom & dad were Christians? He doesn’t seem to have any concept of what you’ve got to do to become a Christian.


12 posted on 07/10/2007 8:08:36 AM PDT by Brilliant
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To: Bladerunnuh

Why can’t everyone worship as they choose and everyone else stay the hell out of their lives INCLUDING the Vatican?!!!


13 posted on 07/10/2007 8:09:15 AM PDT by cubreporter
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To: Dr. Thorne

Catholics do not worship saints. They pray for the ‘intercession’ of saints, which is basically asking saints to pray for us, too.

Your statement is a common slur of Catholics along with the also incorrect statement that the worship the Pope.


14 posted on 07/10/2007 8:09:15 AM PDT by Jack Black
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To: grey_whiskers

You might want to see this...


15 posted on 07/10/2007 8:09:19 AM PDT by CarrotAndStick (The articles posted by me needn't necessarily reflect my opinion.)
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To: Bladerunnuh
I believe in the holy catholic (universal) church.......

We are all parts of the body but some parts are in question? I am guilty of saying the catholics are wounded and missing the key points also. But I do believe there is a remnant in each denomination and church. I trust I am part of that remnant and am getting pruned in the process.

16 posted on 07/10/2007 8:10:10 AM PDT by PeterPrinciple ( Seeking the truth here folks.)
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To: Bladerunnuh

Why can’t everyone worship as they choose and everyone else stay the hell out of their lives INCLUDING the Vatican?!!!


17 posted on 07/10/2007 8:10:16 AM PDT by cubreporter
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To: Bladerunnuh

To the Catholics Jesus is about love.... especially that kinky Opus Dei whip and chain stuff.

I dunno about you but around here we have a different name for grown men who like to hang around with other grown men that are into whips and chains, and it ain’t purty.

That’s all I’m saying about that.


18 posted on 07/10/2007 8:10:26 AM PDT by GovernmentIsTheProblem (The GOP is "Whig"ing out.)
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To: Dr. Thorne

“Protestant churches are the only actual Christian churches”

Well, I would agree that yes, you’re partly right, because only a handful of the people in SOME of the Protestant churches belong to Jesus’ actual church, but I like to cut the Catholics slack because it’s not like our Protestant churches are paragons of virtue. We have just as many rituals and nonsense, and many of our members are just living lies anyway. I think we’d all be shocked to see the actual numbers of Jesus’ servants on the earth. I imagine it’s probably less than 1 percent of the population. In Sodom, there was only one righteous man, only 8 people survived the flood, only Joshua and Caleb made it into the Promised Land from an original 2-3 million. None of us has any right to brag, but yes, I would agree that it is nearly impossible for a practicing Catholic to hear what he/she needs to hear to survive.


19 posted on 07/10/2007 8:10:52 AM PDT by Bladerunnuh
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To: cubreporter
Why can’t everyone worship as they choose and everyone else stay the hell out of their lives INCLUDING the Vatican?!!

I totally agree.

20 posted on 07/10/2007 8:11:22 AM PDT by gunservative
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To: Bladerunnuh
I appreciate a man who speaks his mind based on his principles, and doesn't water down his own beliefs to be popular. It speaks of strong character.

I think he's wrong, but at the end of the day, that's OK because we are on the same side, after all. Catholics don't make a habit of sawing the heads off me and my Protestant pals for not recognizing the primacy of the Pope. The same cannot be said for certain other religions.
21 posted on 07/10/2007 8:12:02 AM PDT by JamesP81 (Keep your friends close; keep your enemies at optimal engagement range)
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To: DManA
The body of Christ is stronger for being organized into independent cells.

So you call the Christ Church of Al Qaeda home? Your statement makes no sense to a Christian. We are called to be one as Christ is One with the Father.

22 posted on 07/10/2007 8:12:56 AM PDT by pgyanke (Duncan Hunter 08--You want to elect a conservative? Then support a conservative!)
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To: Dr. Thorne
I guess you'll assert that no true Protestant would accept openly homosexual clergy?
23 posted on 07/10/2007 8:13:29 AM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: Dr. Thorne

Yeah right, goddeses, statues, saints, sure - one problem. Where was your church the first dozen or so centuries? All of the Saints your wanna be church does not have were the martyrs and leaders of Christ’s one church - The Holy and Catholic Church.

I was at a Lutheran funeral a while ago and during their creed I kept having to resist the urger to ask the pastor where that came from.

There is but one church of Christ and he started it and it is still going strong.


24 posted on 07/10/2007 8:13:58 AM PDT by CTK YKC
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To: Bladerunnuh

This will cause me to have many sleepless nights. Not.


25 posted on 07/10/2007 8:15:08 AM PDT by RoseyT
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To: pgyanke

“So you call the Christ Church of Al Qaeda home? Your statement makes no sense to a Christian.”

No, I’m going to have to agree with him also. God does the same thing in nature. He splits the gene pool into diverse bits and sprinkles them here and there. The same reason He knocked down the tower of Babel and didvided the peoples and languages. It’s better to have a million churches where one or two of them might get it right, than to have all your eggs in one basket and everyone is wrong (and dead).


26 posted on 07/10/2007 8:15:31 AM PDT by Bladerunnuh
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To: Bladerunnuh
Other Christian Churches view idol worshiping Vatican as wounded. There...I fixed it.
27 posted on 07/10/2007 8:16:13 AM PDT by rightwingextremist1776
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To: pgyanke
So you call the Christ Church of Al Qaeda home? Your statement makes no sense to a Christian. We are called to be one as Christ is One with the Father.

You do realize that the early church was organized on a cell basis, don't you? Oneness with God doesn't require us to put all our eggs in one temporal basket.
28 posted on 07/10/2007 8:16:46 AM PDT by JamesP81 (Keep your friends close; keep your enemies at optimal engagement range)
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To: Bladerunnuh
"not fully Christians"... what a laugh.

The Vatican wants their one world "church" with Rome as it's head. One day they are going to get what they are looking for as they ride the Beast. I hope they enjoy the trip, it will only last for approximately 3 1/2 years. Then this so-called one world "church" the Vatican is longing to establish will be swiftly decimated by the Antichrist after he has used it to solidify his political position in the world. Once that is accomplished, God's Word says that it is going to be swiftly destroyed! ALL of the wealth of Rome and this unified one world "church" along with all of it's land will be confiscated and the antichrist will declare that he alone is god, and the entire world must worship him or die.

Like I said... enjoy the ride.

29 posted on 07/10/2007 8:17:21 AM PDT by Jmouse007
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To: Bladerunnuh

Not to worry. My E-Free Pastor says we are part of the true church so it looks like we are alright.


30 posted on 07/10/2007 8:23:08 AM PDT by blue-duncan
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To: Brilliant

Heck, I’m Catholic and I think there are a lot of lost souls in Catholicism. Thank goodness BXVI is closing the cafeteria.


31 posted on 07/10/2007 8:27:33 AM PDT by Malacoda (A day without a pi$$ed-off muslim is like a day without sunshine.)
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To: blue-duncan

>>Not to worry. My E-Free Pastor says we are part of the true church so it looks like we are alright<<

I love you!!!!


32 posted on 07/10/2007 8:28:31 AM PDT by netmilsmom (To attack one section of Christianity in this day and age, is to waste time.)
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To: Jmouse007

>>”not fully Christians”... <<

Did you see that this was added by the OP?


33 posted on 07/10/2007 8:29:59 AM PDT by netmilsmom (To attack one section of Christianity in this day and age, is to waste time.)
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To: CTK YKC
I was at a Lutheran funeral a while ago and during their creed I kept having to resist the urger to ask the pastor where that came from.

Do you mean the Nicene Creed that predates the formation of the RCC as it split from the Eastern /Greek Orthodox?

34 posted on 07/10/2007 8:30:38 AM PDT by ikka
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To: ikka

Yes I mean the Nicene creed that does not pre-date the Catholic church unless it was written before Peter was the Holy See of Rome.

There are 22 Catholic churches, not just the Eastern and Roman churches. When you look at what PBXVI said he was not talking about any of the 22.


35 posted on 07/10/2007 8:33:18 AM PDT by CTK YKC
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To: Bladerunnuh

Now if they’d just just condemn evolution and higher criticism!


36 posted on 07/10/2007 8:37:34 AM PDT by Zionist Conspirator ("Ve`attah, hirgu khol-zakhar bataf; vekhol-'ishah yoda`at 'ish lemishkav zakhar harogu!")
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To: Dr. Thorne
We don't worship goddesses or saints....you have been brainwashed by hatred and jealousy.

I know you won't answer, but what denomination do you belong to and attend Church every Sunday? I'll bet you say you don't attend Church, and that you are a Christian.

37 posted on 07/10/2007 8:41:12 AM PDT by Suzy Quzy (Hillary in '08.....Her PHONINESS is GENUINE !!!!)
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To: Brilliant

So, what do you see as the problem with the Catholic Church?


38 posted on 07/10/2007 8:43:00 AM PDT by Suzy Quzy (Hillary in '08.....Her PHONINESS is GENUINE !!!!)
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To: Bladerunnuh

How so?


39 posted on 07/10/2007 8:44:38 AM PDT by Suzy Quzy (Hillary in '08.....Her PHONINESS is GENUINE !!!!)
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To: rightwingextremist1776

What IDOL do we Catholics worship?


40 posted on 07/10/2007 8:46:15 AM PDT by Suzy Quzy (Hillary in '08.....Her PHONINESS is GENUINE !!!!)
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To: cubreporter
Why can’t everyone worship as they choose and everyone else stay the hell out of their lives INCLUDING the Vatican?!!!

Scratch the surface of nearly any religious person hard enough, and eventually you find one of two things: either an "I'm right, and everybody who doesn't agree with me is wrong" mentality, or a "There are many paths to the truth," kind of person who views a choice of religion in the same way that one picks out a brochure at a travel agency.

The latter type of person is go-along, get-along, the former type of person just varies in his willingness to say what he really thinks.

41 posted on 07/10/2007 8:46:27 AM PDT by hunter112 (Change will happen when very good men are forced to do very bad things.)
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To: CTK YKC

If you read creed in the Lutheran hymnal you would see that catholic is spelled with a lower case c.


42 posted on 07/10/2007 8:47:52 AM PDT by DManA
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To: Basheva
I am saying “we” - but I am not a Christian - I am a Jew.

I view all Christians as my brothers/sisters and I really do hate family fights.

"And truly, in the first place, it seemed to everyone a most unworthy thing that we should follow the custom of the Jews in the celebration of this most holy solemnity, who, polluted wretches, having stained their hands with a nefarious crime, are justly blinded in their minds. It is fit, therefore, that, rejecting the practice of this people, we should perpetuate to all future ages the celebration of this rite in a more legitimate order, which we have kept from the first day of our Lord's passion even to the present times. Let us then have nothing in common with the most hostile rabble of the Jews. We have received another method from the Savior. A more lawful and proper course is open to our most holy religion. In pursuing this course with a unanimous consent, let us withdraw ourselves, my much honored brethren, from that most odious fellowship. It is indeed in the highest degree preposterous, that they should superciliously vaunt themselves, that truly without their instruction, we cannot properly observe this rite. For what can they rightly understand, who, after the tragic death of our Lord, being deluded and darkened in their minds, carried away by an unrestrained impulse wherever their inborn madness may impel them.

...

May God preserve you, my beloved brethren."


43 posted on 07/10/2007 8:49:07 AM PDT by GraniteStateConservative (...He had committed no crime against America so I did not bring him here...-- Worst.President.Ever.)
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To: GraniteStateConservative

And your point is?????

Yes, I do know the history .....but that’s not the way forward. Going backward is not going forward.


44 posted on 07/10/2007 8:53:17 AM PDT by Basheva
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To: Jmouse007
One day they are going to get what they are looking for as they ride the Beast. I hope they enjoy the trip, it will only last for approximately 3 1/2 years. Then this so-called one world "church" the Vatican is longing to establish will be swiftly decimated by the Antichrist after he has used it to solidify his political position in the world.

God's word says nothing of the sort. The "Great City" spoken of in Rev 17-18 is clearly identified for you in Scripture; compare Jeremiah 25:10-14 and Rev 11:8. Note also that ancient Jerusalem, like Rome, is a city built on seven hills.

It helps to actually read and interpret scripture in context.

45 posted on 07/10/2007 8:53:24 AM PDT by Campion ("I am so tired of you, liberal church in America" -- Mother Angelica, 1993)
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To: Basheva
I don’t think Chist would like it either.

Yup, in fact Jesus was Jewish not Catholic.

46 posted on 07/10/2007 8:57:22 AM PDT by AxelPaulsenJr (Fred Thompson for President)
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To: Suzy Quzy
Let’s start with the ones of the Virgin Mary and go from there. Hey, I wasn’t the one who stated my Church was perfect. If you are the leader of a religion and are going to throw rocks at all the others, then just be prepared to receive some your way...
47 posted on 07/10/2007 8:59:02 AM PDT by rightwingextremist1776
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To: Suzy Quzy
Let’s start with the ones of the Virgin Mary and go from there. Hey, I wasn’t the one who stated my Church was perfect. If you are the leader of a religion and are going to throw rocks at all the others, then just be prepared to receive some your way...
48 posted on 07/10/2007 8:59:04 AM PDT by rightwingextremist1776
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To: rightwingextremist1776

You actually believe we WORSHIP Mary or her STATUES? REALLY?? HONESTLY BELIEVE THAT NONSENSE???


49 posted on 07/10/2007 9:00:18 AM PDT by Suzy Quzy (Hillary in '08.....Her PHONINESS is GENUINE !!!!)
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To: pgyanke
A huge distinction with an eternal significance.

Yup, purgatory is a long time, isn't it?

50 posted on 07/10/2007 9:00:44 AM PDT by AxelPaulsenJr (Fred Thompson for President)
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