Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Italy's Padre Pio 'faked his stigmata with acid'
Telegraph ^ | October 24, 2007 | Malcolm Moore

Posted on 10/25/2007 9:24:05 AM PDT by NYer

click here to read article


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-50 ... 101-150151-200201-250 ... 951-985 next last
To: Mrs. Don-o

I am curious, would contact with the dead be a sin if it was not used to divine the future or influence future events? Just for say, a good chat?


151 posted on 10/25/2007 6:47:02 PM PDT by Xenophon450 (They say it's lonely at the top, then I am as lonely as can be.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: Mad Dawg

The answer was (to paraphrase) was “we can pray to Jesus, but we also pray to saints.”

The problem you have is that you were not able to infer from my next statements that I don’t agree with that answer. there is no evidenceIf I have to spell it out for you more clearly that I don’t agree with their answer, by stating that I don’t believe in praying to Christians who have died and are no longer among the living on earth, then I will clearly state it for you by saying so.


152 posted on 10/25/2007 6:49:44 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 147 | View Replies]

To: ears_to_hear
That my friend is the work of Satan.

We are all called to be "Saints", not just people like Padre Pio. Padre Pio did good works throughout his life and "carried his cross" as we are all called to do. Padre Pio is a sign of God's glory and presence, and was a witness to Jesus' passion. Very few people are called on by God in this way. God's presence is real and He continues to work in this world through His saints, and all who believe in Him.

Jesus Himself, our Lord and God incarnate, was accused of doing the work of Satan during his ministry on earth by His detractors.

"If Satan is divided against himself, how will his kingdom stand." Luke 11:18

Padre Pio was a strong witness to Jesus Christ, and God showed this through his signs, so how can one accuse Padre Pio of doing the work of Satan when Padre Pio is steering souls away from Satan and towards Jesus Christ? We need more saints to witness the Passion and death of our Lord Jesus Christ, in fact, we all should be steering souls towards God; and not be envious of saints that have done the Lord's work.

"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes in Me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go to the Father. And whatever you ask in My name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son" (John 14:12,13).
153 posted on 10/25/2007 6:51:13 PM PDT by khnyny (Although prepared for martyrdom, I preferred that it be postponed. Winston Churchill)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 105 | View Replies]

To: Secret Agent Man

**I don’t agree with their answer, by stating that I don’t believe in praying to Christians who have died **

Has anyone in your family died? Did you go to the funeral? Then you prayed to God FOR them, since they can no longer pray for themselves.

Please answer my question:

Has anyone in your family died? Did you go to the funeral?


154 posted on 10/25/2007 7:10:41 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 152 | View Replies]

To: Secret Agent Man
Okay. Thank you for the clear statement. I never claimed to be smart, It's all lies, I tell you lies!

You asked something like, "Why ask anyone to pray for you when you can ask Jesus directly?" An answer was attempted, and then you went to the "I see dead people" argument.

"Not agreeing" all by itself, doesn't move the ball, since you asked the question. If there is never any reason, in your view, to ask anyone to pray for one, then say so and prepare to defend it. Otherwise, I think, the situation is that EITHER Paul was wrong to ask those other people to pray for him, which would be consistent with your, "Why go to anyone when you can go right to Jesus?" argument, OR we have a Biblical precedent for asking others for prayer.

If the latter, then we can go on to the whether we can ask people in heaven for prayer or not. If the former, then we need go no further, but need to re-examine that question.

But IF you think Paul is wrong, I think you need to show us why. And if you think he is right not always to go to Jesus but sometimes in addition to going to Jesus also to ask others for their prayers, then I think you need to say that. Things are never as clear as we think they are, at least not to moi. Be kind to those afflicted with stupidity. And besides, the care and focus necessary to argue clearly often lowers the ambient temperature, which for most Christians would, I think, be considered a good thing. But then, it's been argued that my desire for clear, charitable, reasonable discussion is an indication that I have problems.

I'm sure I do.

And of course, I hope you understand that the Protestant trump card of Scripture will also come into play in a disputation with Catholics because we have a different view of Scriptural authority from that held by many Protestants.

155 posted on 10/25/2007 7:13:37 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 152 | View Replies]

To: AnAmericanMother

That’s the same book that I just finished. Fascinating, wasn’t it?

By Ruffin.............worth the buy, everyone.


156 posted on 10/25/2007 7:14:27 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 146 | View Replies]

To: Salvation

Pal, do you know the difference between the word “TO” and “FOR”??

You are right they can no longer pray for themselves. They also can no longer pray for you, or make any intercession for you. They could only do those things when they were alive on earth, in their body.


157 posted on 10/25/2007 7:19:58 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 154 | View Replies]

To: pillut48
God bless you in your inquiry. It seems to me that since Jesus is the Truth, looking for the truth of things is looking for Him. And He has promised that those who seek will find.

(And then he messes it all up by doing everything He can to show Himself to us. This is the only game of hide and seek where the searchers often try NOT to find the one hiding.)

158 posted on 10/25/2007 7:22:59 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 127 | View Replies]

To: Tolkien
Talking to the dead for any purpose is condemned by scripture, not just fortune telling.

A Saint or Angel is dead?

159 posted on 10/25/2007 7:27:23 PM PDT by frogjerk
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: All

Once again, an interesting subject on a thread title, completely off topic due to unbelievers hopping on and arguing.

If you don’t believe in saints, just say so. If you don’t believe in asking for the intercession of saints, go start some thread about that and for heaven’s sake leave us alone to discuss Padre Pio.

He was a fascinating man, who lived a very interesting life, and studying him is worthy to some of us.

If you disagree, why start a big argument here about the intercession of the saints? You aren’t changing any minds, you’re just engaging in boorish behavior. How long after this thread started did this argument start?

You are all giving protestants a very bad name. Boorish behavior, pointless argument, and petty bickering.

Please stop it.


160 posted on 10/25/2007 7:28:09 PM PDT by Judith Anne (Thank you St. Jude for favors granted.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 157 | View Replies]

To: Mad Dawg

Okay, you don’t do bible study that much.

You ask others to pray for you because God tells us that it has an effect and gives us examples - for ex. asking the elders of a church to come and pray over a sick person. However, if you READ THE BIBLE EXAMPLES you find that every example where a person asks another to pray for them, they are both physically alive on earth, and they are both living people, body and soul together!!!! There are NO examples where one person is physically alive asking a person that is not physically alive. Nobody was ever instructed or encouraged by Christ or any apostle to ask dead Christians to intercede for them.

And don’t try to say ‘but the dead Christians are alive in Christ’ - all that would prove is that you don’t understand the difference between when someone uses the term to mean physically dead as opposed to spiritually dead.


161 posted on 10/25/2007 7:28:22 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 155 | View Replies]

To: Tolkien
Talking to the dead for any purpose is condemned by scripture, not just fortune telling.

The Saints and Angels are not dead.

162 posted on 10/25/2007 7:31:14 PM PDT by frogjerk
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla

Great reply!


163 posted on 10/25/2007 7:31:42 PM PDT by tiki
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 145 | View Replies]

Comment #164 Removed by Moderator

To: Tolkien
Praying to dead people is necromancy. Forbidden by God.

This is why you pray to the Father and Jesus. They are not dead.

No where in the new testament are prayers offered to people, living or dead.

Have you looked up the definition of necromancy? Have you read the life of Padre Pio? Do you consider it your mission to convert Catholics, online? If not, why are you being so rude? Who asked you?

165 posted on 10/25/2007 7:35:25 PM PDT by Judith Anne (Thank you St. Jude for favors granted.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: Secret Agent Man

Why don’t you get off this thread? You’re giving protestants a bad name, along with a few of your friends. As far as I know, no one has invited you to share your special wisdom here.


166 posted on 10/25/2007 7:37:41 PM PDT by Judith Anne (Thank you St. Jude for favors granted.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 164 | View Replies]

To: TankerKC

But there are many directed at the saint/s themselves, which is why it is puzzling to me.


167 posted on 10/25/2007 7:38:52 PM PDT by pillut48 (CJ in TX --Soccer Mom and proud RUSH REPUBLICAN! WIN, FRED, WIN!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: Miss Didi

Why can’t you pray straight to God through Jesus alone?


168 posted on 10/25/2007 7:39:32 PM PDT by pillut48 (CJ in TX --Soccer Mom and proud RUSH REPUBLICAN! WIN, FRED, WIN!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: Secret Agent Man
Pal, do you know the difference between the word “TO” and “FOR”??

You are right they can no longer pray for themselves. They also can no longer pray for you, or make any intercession for you. They could only do those things when they were alive on earth, in their body.


You're so wrong. Saints perfrom miracles after they are dead in the physical body all the time.
169 posted on 10/25/2007 7:40:16 PM PDT by khnyny (Although prepared for martyrdom, I preferred that it be postponed. Winston Churchill)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 157 | View Replies]

To: Jim Robinson; Admin Moderator; Sidebar Moderator

I’m sick and tired of clicking on an interesting Catholic subject thread, and finding anti-Catholic arguments all over it. Isn’t there some kind of rule about this?

It began on post 19 0n this thread and has not let up. Can we get some kind of line drawn here, so that the original subject of the thread can be discussed without getting called names and being proselytized by people who have nothing but contempt for our church?


170 posted on 10/25/2007 7:42:45 PM PDT by Judith Anne (Thank you St. Jude for favors granted.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 166 | View Replies]

To: Secret Agent Man
why not pray directly to Jesus?

Then don't ever ask for prayers nor accept the prayers of anyone on earth because it would be worthless.

Does this make sense to you?

171 posted on 10/25/2007 7:46:21 PM PDT by frogjerk
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: pillut48

Yeah, I asked that at post 20 and here we are at 170...

I’m out. You guys can pray to whomever you want. I pray only to Jesus Christ. I ask close people to pray for me, but all those people are in the body, and I can actually communicate with them by calling them and having a two-way conversation, or write them (like Paul) and ask them to pray for me. I don’t ask departed Christians to pray for me because they can’t do anything for themselves, or for me.

If you want to pray to Christians no longer on this earth, whatever, but it is not biblical. No examples of this practice being done, taught or encouraged by Christ or the apostles. Show me the verses.


172 posted on 10/25/2007 7:46:34 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 168 | View Replies]

To: Mrs. Don-o

No, I get the different meanings of the word ‘pray’. :-)

My husband is from India, and he’s a Hindu, as is his family. No offense intended, but they also ask for intercessory prayers, pray to statues and pictures of their favorite gods, etc. I consider their religion to have idol worship in its center (I once got in trouble for pointing at a statue and asking who it was, and I ‘offended’ that particular god to my in-laws). Catholics also pray to statues of their favorite saints (I attended Catholic church as a child when we lived in Boston, although we were protestants) but it isn’t considered idol worship, correct?
Is it considered ‘rude’ or sacrilegious to point at a Catholic saint’s picture or statue? Or are they considered just statues...but then why is such a fuss made over them by some people?

I find these religious studies fascinating. Thanks for any input.


173 posted on 10/25/2007 7:47:47 PM PDT by pillut48 (CJ in TX --Soccer Mom and proud RUSH REPUBLICAN! WIN, FRED, WIN!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: Secret Agent Man

Oh, but when they are in heaven, they hear our prayers.

Where are you getting your information.

BTW, what do you think about stigmata and Padre Pio. Why don’t you get back to the subject or say, “Bye, bye.”


174 posted on 10/25/2007 7:48:21 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 157 | View Replies]

To: Secret Agent Man
No examples of this practice being done, taught or encouraged by Christ or the apostles. Show me the verses.

You don't even use the whole Bible. You don't have any respect for the subject. Go find some other thread to take off subject.

175 posted on 10/25/2007 7:49:21 PM PDT by Judith Anne (Thank you St. Jude for favors granted.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 172 | View Replies]

To: Secret Agent Man

**They also can no longer pray for you, or make any intercession for you.**

How do you know for sure?

How whose authority do you say this?

BTW, you did not answer my questions.

Has someone in your family died? Did you go to the funeral?


176 posted on 10/25/2007 7:49:48 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 157 | View Replies]

To: Salvation

I wasn’t the one who started to drift off-topic. Read NYer’s post answer. I was asking a question to his reply.


177 posted on 10/25/2007 7:50:15 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 174 | View Replies]

To: Salvation

Yes I have gone to funerals. And this proves what?


178 posted on 10/25/2007 7:51:02 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 176 | View Replies]

To: pillut48

You can find answers to these questions elsewhere on line, but you likely cannot be rude or persistent about it.

Why don’t you go use google, or the Catholic encyclopedia? This thread is about Padre Pio.


179 posted on 10/25/2007 7:51:04 PM PDT by Judith Anne (Thank you St. Jude for favors granted.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 173 | View Replies]

To: Secret Agent Man; NYer; Religion Moderator

**I wasn’t the one who started to drift off-topic. Read NYer’s post answer. I was asking a question to his reply.**

When you reference another FReeper you need to put their name in the “To” space.

Good-bye!


180 posted on 10/25/2007 7:52:09 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 177 | View Replies]

To: Campion

Moses and Elijah also appeared with Jesus during the Transfiguration, witnessed by Peter, James and John.


181 posted on 10/25/2007 7:53:22 PM PDT by pillut48 (CJ in TX --Soccer Mom and proud RUSH REPUBLICAN! WIN, FRED, WIN!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: tiki

I am so sorry for your loss, tiki. :*(
{{{{{{{{{{Condolences and healing hugs}}}}}}}}}}}}


182 posted on 10/25/2007 7:55:17 PM PDT by pillut48 (CJ in TX --Soccer Mom and proud RUSH REPUBLICAN! WIN, FRED, WIN!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: Secret Agent Man

Have you had someone in your family die?


183 posted on 10/25/2007 7:56:41 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 178 | View Replies]

To: NYer

I’m not big on Pio or stigmatas, but a document from 1919? Paint me skeptical of that too...

Presumably the church would have investigated him back then...they essentially locked him up in the monastery for fifty years.

And why carbolic acid? That cauterizes wounds,i.e. stops bleeding?


184 posted on 10/25/2007 7:57:32 PM PDT by LadyDoc (liberals only love politically correct poor people)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Salvation

Yes.


185 posted on 10/25/2007 7:57:35 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 183 | View Replies]

To: Barb4Bush

Okay. I get that. Can someone be a perfect Catholic and NOT ask saints to intercede for them? Can they just pray to Jesus straightforward, and not go through anyone else? Or would that be considered heresy in Catholicism?


186 posted on 10/25/2007 7:58:01 PM PDT by pillut48 (CJ in TX --Soccer Mom and proud RUSH REPUBLICAN! WIN, FRED, WIN!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]

To: pillut48
Why can’t you pray straight to God through Jesus alone?

Who said she couldn't?

By the way, my husband died 6 months ago. I talk to him all the time. Would any of you protestants like to accuse me of necromancy? Sometimes, I kiss his picture. Would you like to accuse me of idol worship?

187 posted on 10/25/2007 8:02:59 PM PDT by Judith Anne (Thank you St. Jude for favors granted.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 168 | View Replies]

To: pillut48
Okay. I get that. Can someone be a perfect Catholic and NOT ask saints to intercede for them? Can they just pray to Jesus straightforward, and not go through anyone else? Or would that be considered heresy in Catholicism?

Maybe in YOUR church people can be perfect protestants, but as far as I know, all Catholics are sinners, saved by the body and blood of Christ.

Why don't you ask your questions at a Catholic inquiry site? I'll tell you why--you don't want answers, you want people to admit you're right, and they're wrong.

I just admire "perfect" people so much..../sarc

188 posted on 10/25/2007 8:07:26 PM PDT by Judith Anne (Thank you St. Jude for favors granted.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 186 | View Replies]

To: Secret Agent Man

Read Revelations 5:8 and we’ll see who the fool is.


189 posted on 10/25/2007 8:07:42 PM PDT by frogjerk
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 164 | View Replies]

To: Secret Agent Man
Okay, you don’t do bible study that much.

That's a personal comment and not appropriate. How many hours a week do you think I spend studying Scripture? On what basis do you form your opinion of the amount or sufficiency of my Bible study,. You wouldn't be suggesting that everyone who studies the Bible "enough" would agree with you, would you?

If so, then you can just dismiss every disagreement with you on the same grounds. I've heard the argument before. When my daughter was five, she would say that everything she didn't like was "stupid." Among adults I usually get this kind of argument from liberal college professors.

Am I right in concluding from your second paragraph that you are conceding that it is appropriate to ask SOME others to pray for you? So you are abandoning the argument about why one should ask for the prayers of others when one can go to Jesus directly? In fact, you are saying or implying that that question was a red herring and the real issue is elsewhere.

As for your third paragraph, I haven't even entered the discussion at all, and seeing that the tone of the thread is antagonistic, I don't propose to enter it.

My comment was, and nothing you have subsequently said has argued against it, that you changed the subject from our initial question about intercession to a NEW and DIFFERENT question about the any kind of communication with the saints in heaven. And I didn't raise that argument for anything other than accountability. You raised the question; an answer was attempted; you ignored the answer and raised another question. That was all I said. You can reasonably infer other things from my frank (and grateful) declaration that I am a Catholic, but I haven't taken a particular stand in this discussion yet. I have only noted a particular effort at what looked like a dodge and not like a discussion among Christians.

Our having a different notion of Scriptural authority from ours does not necessarily imply that we don't study Scripture "that much".

190 posted on 10/25/2007 8:09:14 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 161 | View Replies]

Comment #191 Removed by Moderator

To: TankerKC

Clinton? FDR? Alan Greenspan?


192 posted on 10/25/2007 8:11:09 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: Campion
What about Romans 3:10 and 3:23??

"...there are NONE righteous, no, not one..." KJV

"For ALL have sinned and and come short of the glory of God." KJV

If Mary never sinned, wouldn't that say, "For all EXCEPT Mary, the mother of Jesus, have sinned and come short of the glory of God."?
193 posted on 10/25/2007 8:11:19 PM PDT by pillut48 (CJ in TX --Soccer Mom and proud RUSH REPUBLICAN! WIN, FRED, WIN!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 104 | View Replies]

To: Secret Agent Man

http://www.scripturecatholic.com/saints.html

I. We are One Family in Christ in Heaven and on Earth
Eph. 3:14-15- we are all one family (”Catholic”) in heaven and on earth, united together, as children of the Father, through Jesus Christ. Our brothers and sisters who have gone to heaven before us are not a different family. We are one and the same family. This is why, in the Apostles Creed, we profess a belief in the “communion of saints.” There cannot be a “communion” if there is no union. Loving beings, whether on earth or in heaven, are concerned for other beings, and this concern is reflected spiritually through prayers for one another.

Eph. 1:22-23; 5:23-32; Col. 1:18,24 - this family is in Jesus Christ, the head of the body, which is the Church.

1 Cor. 12:12,27; Rom. 12:5; Col. 3:15; Eph. 4:4 - we are the members of the one body of Christ, supernaturally linked together by our partaking of the Eucharist.

Rom. 8:35-39 - therefore, death does not separate the family of God and the love of Christ. We are still united with each other, even beyond death.

Matt. 17:3; Mark 9:4; Luke 9:30 - Jesus converses with “deceased” Moses and Elijah. They are more alive than the saints on earth.

Matt. 22:32; Mark 12:27; Luke 20:38 - God is the God of the living not the dead. The living on earth and in heaven are one family.

Luke 15:7,10 – if the angels and saints experience joy in heaven over our repentance, then they are still connected to us and are aware of our behavior.

John 15:1-6 - Jesus is the vine and we are the branches. The good branches are not cut off at death. They are alive in heaven.

1 Cor. 4:9 – because we can become a spectacle not only to men, but to angels as well, this indicates that angels are aware of our earthly activity. Those in heaven are connected to those on earth.

1 Cor. 12:26 - when one member suffers, all suffer. When one is honored, all rejoice. We are in this together as one family.

1 Cor 13:12; 1 John 3:2 - now we see in a mirror dimly, but in heaven we see face to face. The saints are more alive than we are!

Heb. 12:1 - we are surrounded by a great glory cloud (shekinah) of witnesses, our family in heaven. We are not separated. The “cloud of witnesses” (nephos marturon) refers to a great amphitheatre with the arena for the runners (us on earth), and many tiers of seats occupied by the saints (in heaven) rising up like a cloud. The “martures” are not mere spectators (“theatai”), but testifiers (witnesses) who testify from their own experience to God’s promises and cheer us on in our race to heaven. They are no less than our family in heaven.

1 Peter 2:9; Rev. 20:6 - we are a royal family of priests by virtue of baptism. We as priests intercede on behalf of each other.

2 Peter 1:4 - since God is the eternal family and we are His children, we are partakers of His divine nature as a united family.

1 Cor. 1:2; Rom. 1:7 - we are called to be saints. Saints refer to both those on earth and in heaven who are in Christ. Proof:

Acts 9:13,32,41; 26:10; 1 Cor. 6:1-2; 14:33; 2 Cor. 1:1; 8:4; 9:1-2; 13:13; Rom. 8:27; 12:23; 15:25,26, 31; 16:2,15; Eph. 1:1,15,18; 3:8; 5:3; 6:18; Phil. 1:1; 4:22; Col 1:2,4,26; 1 Tm 5:10; Philemon 1:5,7; Heb. 6:10; 13:24; Jude 1:3; Rev. 11:18; 13:7; 14:12; 16:6; 17:6;18:20,24; Rev 19:8; 20:9 - in these verses, we see that Christians still living on earth are called “saints.”

Matt. 27:52; Eph. 2:19; 3:18; Col. 1:12; 2 Thess. 1:10; Rev. 5:8; 8:3-4; 11:18; 13:10 - in these verses, we also see that “saints” also refer to those in heaven who united with us.

Dan. 4:13,23; 8:23 – we also see that the angels in heaven are also called “saints.” The same Hebrew word “qaddiysh” (holy one) is applied to both humans and angels in heaven. Hence, there are angel saints in heaven and human saints in heaven and on earth. Loving beings (whether angels or saints) are concerned for other beings, and prayer is the spiritual way of expressing that love.


194 posted on 10/25/2007 8:12:26 PM PDT by khnyny (Although prepared for martyrdom, I preferred that it be postponed. Winston Churchill)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 172 | View Replies]

To: pillut48
What about Romans 3:10 and 3:23?? "...there are NONE righteous, no, not one..." KJV "For ALL have sinned and and come short of the glory of God." KJV If Mary never sinned, wouldn't that say, "For all EXCEPT Mary, the mother of Jesus, have sinned and come short of the glory of God."?

Since None and All are being used, Jesus must be included in the none that are righteous and sinners...which is absurd.

195 posted on 10/25/2007 8:13:20 PM PDT by frogjerk
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 193 | View Replies]

To: PAR35

Not all protestants. I learned that in my Baptist training as well, “we are His body, and He is our soul”—to quote a Michael Card song. :-)

Of course, other protestant religions may not emphasize that.


196 posted on 10/25/2007 8:14:54 PM PDT by pillut48 (CJ in TX --Soccer Mom and proud RUSH REPUBLICAN! WIN, FRED, WIN!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 121 | View Replies]

To: khnyny
Luke 15:7,10 – if the angels and saints experience joy in heaven over our repentance, then they are still connected to us and are aware of our behavior.

One of my favorite verses.

197 posted on 10/25/2007 8:16:20 PM PDT by frogjerk
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 194 | View Replies]

To: tiki; Secret Agent Man
Thanks! It's obvious SAM didn't bother to consider my answer. There was no mention of the internet in Scripture since the internet didn't exist at that time. Similarly there was no mention in the gospels of praying to the saved in heaven for intercession with Christ, because:
1) Before the crucifixion, there were NO saved in Heaven;
2) Christ was not in Heaven, he was on the earth.
198 posted on 10/25/2007 8:16:30 PM PDT by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (No Covenant with Death: Giuliani Shall Not Pass!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 163 | View Replies]

To: pillut48

Thank you for that fantastic link to prayers to the saints.


199 posted on 10/25/2007 8:17:46 PM PDT by GinaLolaB
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: Judith Anne
Are all protestants so weaselly?

Please don't one or two spoil it for the rest. We have many great Protestant brothers and sisters we can learn much from and share our faith with in Christ.

200 posted on 10/25/2007 8:18:35 PM PDT by frogjerk
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 191 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-50 ... 101-150151-200201-250 ... 951-985 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson