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End Times Prophetic Scriptures Of Isaiah [Caucus of Charismatics, Pentecostals & Dispys]
THE MESSAGE and AMPLIFIED BIBLE VERSIONS | 1 NOV 2007 | Bible & Quix

Posted on 11/01/2007 9:24:08 PM PDT by Quix

END TIMES PROPHETIC SCRIPTURES OF ISAIAH.—CHARISMATIC, PENTECOSTAL, DISPENSATIONALIST CAUCUS THREAD.

 

This is posted for hopefully a mutually beneficial iron sharpening iron dialogue, discussion amongst the above interest groups. We must avoid throwing rocks at others to protect the decorum and rights of a caucus thread.  We must police ourselves on that score first and foremost. I will ask for any post crossing that line to be removed promptly. Please spare us the hassle.

 

Lurkers are certainly welcome to ask questions in the thread or VIA FREEPMAIL. Keeping in mind the rules of a caucus thread, please feel free to ask.

 

The Isaiah Scriptures posted hereon and to follow are gleaned from the late John F Walvoord’s EVERY PROPHECY OF THE BIBLE. Those pages covering Isaiah are 99-120.

 

I’m choosing to post as well the verses in THE MESSAGE (MSG) version as well as THE AMPLIFIED VERSION (AMP). I choose THE MESSAGE because I believe it captures the original language’s forcefulness, idiom, down-to-earth-ness in plain common man language the best. And, the Amplified because it offers up the most plausible options when there’s more than one in a verse. I realize others would choose other versions for a variety of reasons. They are certainly welcome to do so, on their own thread! LOL . . . or on this one on their own posts!

 

With that, let the mutual edification begin.

 

I’ll likely begin my commentary later as I’m fading faster and faster tonight.

 

 

 


MSG ISAIAH 2:1-18

Isaiah 2 (The Message)

The Message (MSG)

Copyright © 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996, 2000, 2001, 2002 by Eugene H. Peterson

Isaiah 2

Climb God's Mountain

 1-5 The Message Isaiah got regarding Judah and Jerusalem: There's a day coming when the mountain of God's House
Will be The Mountain—
   solid, towering over all mountains.
All nations will river toward it,
   people from all over set out for it.
They'll say, "Come,
   let's climb God's Mountain,
   go to the House of the God of Jacob.
He'll show us the way he works
   so we can live the way we're made."
Zion's the source of the revelation.
   God's Message comes from Jerusalem.
He'll settle things fairly between nations.
   He'll make things right between many peoples.
They'll turn their swords into shovels,
   their spears into hoes.
No more will nation fight nation;
   they won't play war anymore.
Come, family of Jacob,
   let's live in the light of God.

 6-9God, you've walked out on your family Jacob
   because their world is full of hokey religion,
Philistine witchcraft, and pagan hocus-pocus,
   a world rolling in wealth,
Stuffed with things,
   no end to its machines and gadgets,
And gods—gods of all sorts and sizes.
   These people make their own gods and worship what they make.
A degenerate race, facedown in the gutter.
   Don't bother with them! They're not worth forgiving!

Pretentious Egos Brought Down to Earth

 10Head for the hills,
   hide in the caves
From the terror of God,
   from his dazzling presence.

 11-17People with a big head are headed for a fall,
   pretentious egos brought down a peg.
It's God alone at front-and-center
   on the Day we're talking about,
The Day that God-of-the-Angel-Armies
   is matched against all big-talking rivals,
   against all swaggering big names;
Against all giant sequoias
   hugely towering,
   and against the expansive chestnut;
Against Kilimanjaro and Annapurna,
   against the ranges of Alps and Andes;
Against every soaring skyscraper,
   against all proud obelisks and statues;
Against ocean-going luxury liners,
   against elegant three-masted schooners.
The swelled big heads will be punctured bladders,
   the pretentious egos brought down to earth,
Leaving God alone at front-and-center
   on the Day we're talking about.

 

 18And all those sticks and stones
   dressed up to look like gods
   will be gone for good.

 19Clamber into caves in the cliffs,
   duck into any hole you can find.
Hide from the terror of God,
   from his dazzling presence,
When he assumes his full stature on earth,
   towering and terrifying.

 20-21On that Day men and women will take
   the sticks and stones
They've decked out in gold and silver
   to look like gods and then worshiped,
And they will dump them
   in any ditch or gully,
Then run for rock caves
   and cliff hideouts
To hide from the terror of God,
   from his dazzling presence,
When he assumes his full stature on earth,
   towering and terrifying.

 22Quit scraping and fawning over mere humans,
   so full of themselves, so full of hot air!
   Can't you see there's nothing to them?

 

 

 

AMPLIFIED:

 

 

Isaiah 2

 1THE WORD which Isaiah son of Amoz saw [revealed] concerning Judah and Jerusalem.

    2It shall come to pass in the latter days that the mountain of the Lord's house shall be [firmly] established as the highest of the mountains and shall be exalted above the hills, and all nations shall flow to it.

    3And many people shall come and say, Come, let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, to the house of the God of Jacob, that He may teach us His ways and that we may walk in His paths. For out of Zion shall go forth the law and instruction, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.

    4And He shall judge between the nations and shall decide [disputes] for many peoples; and they shall beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks. Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.(A)

    5O house of Jacob, come, let us walk in the light of the Lord.

    6Surely [Lord] You have rejected and forsaken your people, the house of Jacob, because they are filled [with customs] from the east and with soothsayers [who foretell] like the Philistines; also they strike hands and make pledges and agreements with the children of aliens.(B)

    7Their land also is full of silver and gold; neither is there any end to their treasures. Their land is also full of horses; neither is there any end to their chariots.(C)

    8Their land also is full of idols; they worship the work of their own hands, what their own fingers have made.

    9And the common man is bowed down [before idols], also the great man is brought low and humbles himself--therefore forgive them not [O Lord].

    10Enter into the rock and hide yourself in the dust from before the terror of the Lord and from the glory of His majesty.

    11The proud looks of man shall be brought low, and the haughtiness of men shall be humbled; and the Lord alone shall be exalted in that day.

    12For there shall be a day of the Lord of hosts against all who are proud and haughty and against all who are lifted up--and they shall be brought low--(D)

    13[The wrath of God will begin by coming down] against all the cedars of Lebanon [west of the Jordan] that are high and lifted up, and against all the oaks of Bashan [east of the Jordan],

    14And [after that] against all the high mountains and all the hills that are lifted up,

    15And against every high tower and every fenced wall,

    16And against all the ships of Tarshish and all the picturesque and desirable imagery [designed for mere ornament and luxury].

    17Then the loftiness of man shall be bowed down, and the haughtiness of men shall be brought low; and the Lord alone shall be exalted in that day.

    18And the idols shall utterly pass away (be abolished).

    19Then shall [the stricken, deprived of all in which they had trusted] go into the caves of the rocks and into the holes of the earth from before the terror and dread of the Lord and from before the glory of His majesty, when He arises to shake mightily and terribly the earth.(E)

    20In that day men shall cast away to the moles and to the bats their idols of silver and their idols of gold, which they made for themselves to worship,

    21To go into the caverns of the rocks and into the clefts of the ragged rocks from before the terror and dread of the Lord and from before the glory of His majesty, when He rises to shake mightily and terribly the earth.

    22Cease to trust in [weak, frail, and dying] man, whose breath is in his nostrils [for so short a time]; in what sense can he be counted as having intrinsic worth?


 

 

 


 

 

 

MSG: There's a day coming when the mountain of God's House
Will be The Mountain—solid, towering over all mountains.

 

Clearly this is to be AFTER the GREAT TRIBULATION. I assume it is to be during the Millenium. I suppose it is conceivable that it might be after satan is bound up for good at the end of the Millenium.

 

In any case, it is a clear Scriptural assertion that Jerusalem, God’s Dwelling Place (in some sense) and The Mountain of God shall be the highest mountain on the planet. No other mountain will dare begin to rival it.

Sounds like some awesome geographic rearrangements at a minimum!

 

MSG: All nations will river toward it,
   people from all over set out for it.

 

This, too, is a familiar Scriptural assertion of that future era. Tribute is to be brought to Jerusalem. Countries without worshipful tribute bearing delegations to Jerusalem will suffer lack of rain etc. These issues are all very tangible, daily life aspects with somewhat familiar priorities, themes, practices.

 

MSG: They'll say, "Come,
   let's climb God's Mountain,
   go to the House of the God of Jacob.
He'll show us the way he works
   so we can live the way we're made."

 

This is a precious hope; a precious dream . . . to live as we were made to live.

 

Praise God for that day those IN CHRIST shall see.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


TOPICS: Apologetics; Charismatic Christian; Evangelical Christian; Ministry/Outreach
KEYWORDS: endtimes; future; isaiah; prophecies
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Please share any Scriptural, Holy Spirit led insights that you believe to be fitting to this thread.
1 posted on 11/01/2007 9:24:11 PM PDT by Quix
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To: Quix

Thanks for the ping! I’ll be meditating on this.


2 posted on 11/01/2007 9:56:34 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Quix
I perceive three separate events in the prophesy. The first, the wrath of God:

And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand? – Revelation 6:12-17

Second, the millennial reign of Jesus Christ on earth:

And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him [was] called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. His eyes [were] as a flame of fire, and on his head [were] many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. And he [was] clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

And the armies [which were] in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

And he hath on [his] vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS. – Revelation 19:11-16

Third, the new heaven and new earth:

And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it. And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb [is] the light thereof.

And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it. And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.

And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.

And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither [whatsoever] worketh abomination, or [maketh] a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life. – Revelation 21:22-27

Maranatha, Jesus!!!

3 posted on 11/01/2007 10:26:26 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Alamo-Girl
AMEN! AMEN! AMEN! Thanks so much for the Scriptures and commentary.

I perceive three separate events in the prophesy. The first, the wrath of God:

And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

Have often pondered such verses. It seems to me that the sun becoming dark is easily volcanoes and/or meteors and/or nukes. Certainly other possibilities are in God’s quiver but I think those are the most plausible.

The moon becoming as blood could certainly be because of a certain mixture and/or variety of dust in the air. The red full moon recently was certainly a sobering spectacle on that score. It was redder than I’ve ever seen it before, in my 60 years. But I think we haven’t seen how red it can appear, yet.

The stars falling as untimely figs is very descriptive, to me. It seems highly likely that refers to meteors falling—but in great abundance with LOTS of thuds and thumps. I’m reminded of big hail stones on a trailer roof . . . . Or fruit being blown off onto a tin roofed shop building in a strong wind. Living things are likely to be devastated from the thumps.

The Heavens rolled up or departed as a scroll when it is rolled together has long been mystifying. I have long felt that THAT action will be a great surprise to every living human on earth—probably most of all—to the scientists. Some have speculated rather confidently that it must refer to the actions of the atmosphere in an atmospheric nuclear bomb detonation. Plausible to a point, I suppose. But I think it’s much more dramatic. I think the description will turn out to have been literally amazingly accurate.

In a sense it seems preposterous to think so given the distances astronomers commonly work with. But do we really know as much as we think we know? If the earth is as God’s footstool . . . . whether purely metaphorically or both that and ‘literally’ in some mysterious sense . . . what if the whole kit and kabootle is a big encased snowflake globe on God’s mantle . . . what if we really finally see behind the BIG curtain? What do I know. But I still think that the Heavens rolled back like a scroll will turn out to be much more dramatic than a mere few nukes or some such.

And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand? – Revelation 6:12-17

I’m seeing, speculating on something this reading I haven’t before . . . How is it that EVERY person hid themselves in the dens and the rocks . . . HIDE US FROM HIM WHO SITS ON THE THRONE . . . AND FROM THE WRATH OF THE LAMB? Not now is it that they hide . . . but how is it that all peoples everywhere KNOW who it is that is God and The Lamb? Supernatural revelation to their spirits and minds? Quite Plausible. Or, as might fit the verse—DO THEY LITERALLY SEE THE FATHER ON THE THRONE AND THE LAMB slain from the foundation of the world on His throne beside The Father? Is that PART of what the Heavens rolled back like a scroll might mean—seeing behind THAT curtain?

Certainly this passage makes abundantly clear that the events described are GOD’S WRATH. This is not some tin-horn dictator like Pol Pot shredding his serfs or his enemy’s serfs right and left. This is several orders of magnitude DIFFERENT!

Second, the millennial reign of Jesus Christ on earth:

And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him [was] called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. His eyes [were] as a flame of fire, and on his head [were] many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. And he [was] clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. And the armies [which were] in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

And he hath on [his] vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS. – Revelation 19:11-16

I want to check out the MSG version on that passage . . .

MSG 11-16Then I saw Heaven open wide—and oh! a white horse and its Rider. The Rider, named Faithful and True, judges and makes war in pure righteousness. His eyes are a blaze of fire, on his head many crowns. He has a Name inscribed that's known only to himself. He is dressed in a robe soaked with blood, and he is addressed as "Word of God." The armies of Heaven, mounted on white horses and dressed in dazzling white linen, follow him. A sharp sword comes out of his mouth so he can subdue the nations, then rule them with a rod of iron. He treads the winepress of the raging wrath of God, the Sovereign-Strong. On his robe and thigh is written, King of kings, Lord of lords.

I don’t see any great revelatory differences in that translation . . . some subtle embellishments. The many crowns . . . plausible as stated but it seems likely that a host of angels would have to keep that many crowns stacked as The Lord navigated. Seems more plausible that they represent layers, regions, worlds, galaxies of authority over all reality. I agree that a long sharp sword literally coming out of his mouth would seem rather ungainly to walk about with. Seems much more plausible that every word he speaks will have the power and reality splitting impact of a fierce sword.

The bit with the horses has long fascinated me. A massive army of horses coming out of . . . space? Certainly God COULD/CAN DO ANYTHING HE WANTS TO—HIS SAND BOX. And, I realize that most folks have seen that as symbolic. But the bigger part of me expects it to be literally just like described. I happen to think God likes horses. And, like an artist who likes blue . . . and uses it a lot. I think God wants to use horses, BIG horses in that scene. We shall see. Heaven only knows emphatically.

Third, the new heaven and new earth:

And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it. And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb [is] the light thereof.

Ahhhhh . . . this seems to be the era where the earth is moved out of it’s place . . . perhaps? Evidently? The sun and moon are not only needed . . . are not even around? What a glorious era, for sure!

And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it. And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.

The nations of them which are saved is an interesting phrase. Aren’t all ungodly nations obliterated at this point? In any case, the humble are now exalted in God’s eternal New Jerusalem, if I read it accurately.

And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.

And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither [whatsoever] worketh abomination, or [maketh] a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life. – Revelation 21:22-27

Sounds like pretty exclusive real estate, to me! What a day that will be! Ruling and reigning with our Lord!

Maranatha, Jesus!!!

INDEED!

4 posted on 11/02/2007 8:28:25 AM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix
Thank you so much for your encouragements and for sharing your insights!

I have no speculation as to how these prophesies will be manifest to us from our perspective as mere mortals. I do however aver that it is important to be aware of current events (signs of the times) - comparing them with Scripture.

And in the morning, [It will be] foul weather to day: for the sky is red and lowring. O [ye] hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky; but can ye not [discern] the signs of the times? - Matt 16:3

Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. - Matt 24:42

For instance, science concludes there are 1080 particles in the known universe. And yet science also says that those 1080 particles could be multiply imaged from as little as a single particle in a fifth, time-line, dimension.

Science can deduce this much - but God knows "all that there is" all at once.

The very hairs on our head are numbered. We don't know them, but God does:

But the very hairs of your head are all numbered. - Matt 10:30

From our perspective "in" space/time, the extent of the physical creation is so vast that we can barely comprehend it at all.

The Creator is not bound by the Creation.

So if He chooses to literally roll up the cosmos like a scroll, He will. Ditto for Christ's coming on a horse.

Or, they could be metaphors. We'll see.

Maranatha, Jesus!!!

5 posted on 11/02/2007 10:02:00 AM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Alamo-Girl

I

THOROUGHLY agree

yet again!

How

DO

you DO that! LOL.

THX BIG.


6 posted on 11/02/2007 10:25:30 AM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix

LOLOL! Thank you for your encouragements, dear brother in Christ!


7 posted on 11/02/2007 10:37:54 AM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Quix; Uncle Chip; Iscool; DarthVader; Alamo-Girl

MSG:
Zion’s the source of the revelation.
God’s Message comes from Jerusalem.

QX: It seems clear from this section that God is going to set it up such that His priority, main communications originate out from the restored, ?New? ?Heavenly? . . . Jerusalem—at least in terms of from the perspective of the rest of the earth at that future time.

MSG:
He’ll settle things fairly between nations.
He’ll make things right between many peoples.

QX: Ahhhh . . . no more Machiavellian geopolitics. No more ‘fleshly might makes right.’ No more weak serfs and victims of the strong.

MSG:
They’ll turn their swords into shovels,
their spears into hoes.

QX: Clearly another marker indicating emphatically a future time. Given the closeness of the world government, the clock is ticking. History as we have known it is fading away. The thousand years of peace under Christ’s rule advances steadily. We can look up confidently as our REDEMPTION DRAWS NIGH.

MSG:
No more will nation fight nation;
they won’t play war anymore.

QX: Praise God INDEED! The Long awaited time advances closer on the bright horizon after the darkness worse than ever before & worse than ever shall be.

MSG:
Come, family of Jacob,
let’s live in the light of God.

QX: The family . . . of . . . Chang? Iversen? Nishtone? . . . OF JACOB! Clearly, God is still focused, in part, in very significant part . . . on the children of Jacob. His plans for them include a fitting place in the NEW JERUSALEM RULING THE WHOLE EARTH.

Thankfully, CHRISTIANS HAVE BEEN GRAFTED IN to that chosen Branch. And our King of Kings and Lord of Lords IS THE Branch SUPREME.

PTL.

MARANATHA!


8 posted on 11/02/2007 12:16:58 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix; Alamo-Girl; Dr. Eckleburg

The Christians have not been grafted in, the Gentiles have. You see there are distinctions


9 posted on 11/02/2007 12:20:11 PM PDT by 1000 silverlings (Everything that deceives also enchants: Plato)
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To: 1000 silverlings

True, Christian gentiles have been grafted in.

Though this is not a thread for contentious postings.


10 posted on 11/02/2007 12:24:56 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix
Clarity is not contentious

Gentiles who have come to know and accept Yah'shua
are the ones spoken of as grafted in


11 posted on 11/02/2007 12:31:37 PM PDT by Uri’el-2012 (you shall know that I, YHvH, your Savior, and your Redeemer, am the Elohim of Ya'aqob. Isaiah 60:16)
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To: XeniaSt; Quix

Thank you


12 posted on 11/02/2007 12:34:38 PM PDT by 1000 silverlings (Everything that deceives also enchants: Plato)
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To: XeniaSt; Quix; 1000 silverlings; Dr. Eckleburg; Alamo-Girl
Gentiles who have come to know and accept Yah'shua are the ones spoken of as grafted in

What of the Jews who have not accepted Yah'shua?

13 posted on 11/02/2007 3:33:40 PM PDT by wmfights (LUKE 9:49-50 , MARK 9:38-41)
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To: Quix; Joya

Appreciate the thread. Will try to read / reply soon.

Bookmark for later reading.


14 posted on 11/02/2007 9:35:12 PM PDT by Joya
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To: wmfights; XeniaSt; Quix; 1000 silverlings; Dr. Eckleburg; Freedom'sWorthIt
What of the Jews who have not accepted Yah'shua?

After the fullness of the Gentiles has come in, the blindness that has been upon the Jews may be lifted

For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this [is] my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. As concerning the gospel, [they are] enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, [they are] beloved for the fathers' sakes. – Romans 11:25-28

If not then, then certainly when Christ appears in power, the Jews who have not accepted Yah’shua will realize what has happened, what should have been theirs.

Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they [also] which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen. - Revelation 1:7

For it is written, [As] I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God. - Romans 14:11

My musing is that at one point or the other, they would become jealous thus fulfilling the prophesy of the Song of Moses:

They have moved me to jealousy with [that which is] not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities: and I will move them to jealousy with [those which are] not a people; I will provoke them to anger with a foolish nation. - Deuteronomy 32:21

But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by [them that are] no people, [and] by a foolish nation I will anger you. - Romans 10:19

I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but [rather] through their fall salvation [is come] unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy. - Romans 11:11

My musings is also that somewhere between Israel becoming jealous, the millennial reign of Christ on earth and the new heaven and earth, this promise to seed of Israel will be kept:

But this [shall be] the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

Thus saith the LORD, which giveth the sun for a light by day, [and] the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The LORD of hosts [is] his name: If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the LORD, [then] the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever.

Thus saith the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD. - Jer 31:33-37

Maranatha, Jesus!!!
15 posted on 11/02/2007 10:04:48 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Alamo-Girl

If not then, then certainly when Christ appears in power, the Jews who have not accepted Yah’shua will realize what has happened, what should have been theirs.

Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they [also] which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen. - Revelation 1:7
For it is written, [As] I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God. - Romans 14:11

My musing is that at one point or the other, they would become jealous thus fulfilling the prophesy of the Song of Moses:

They have moved me to jealousy with [that which is] not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities: and I will move them to jealousy with [those which are] not a people; I will provoke them to anger with a foolish nation. - Deuteronomy 32:21
But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by [them that are] no people, [and] by a foolish nation I will anger you. - Romans 10:19

I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but [rather] through their fall salvation [is come] unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy. - Romans 11:11

My musings is also that somewhere between Israel becoming jealous, the millennial reign of Christ on earth and the new heaven and earth, this promise to seed of Israel will be kept:

= = =

INDEED.

thanks much. Praise God.


16 posted on 11/02/2007 10:33:32 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix
Thank you for your encouragements, dear brother in Christ!
17 posted on 11/02/2007 10:35:27 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Quix; All

ISAIAH 2 AMP:

14And [after that] against all the high mountains and all the hills that are lifted up,

15And against every high tower and every fenced wall,

= = =

I often think of our skyscrapers of our era . . . we have seen how a couple can fall . . . I suspect we shall see a lot more fall . . . whether by quakes or terror or whatever.


18 posted on 11/04/2007 8:54:48 PM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix

6-9God, you’ve walked out on your family Jacob
because their world is full of hokey religion,
Philistine witchcraft, and pagan hocus-pocus,
a world rolling in wealth,
Stuffed with things,
no end to its machines and gadgets,
And gods—gods of all sorts and sizes.
These people make their own gods and worship what they make.
A degenerate race, facedown in the gutter.
Don’t bother with them! They’re not worth forgiving!

= = =

and no end to its machines and gadgets . . .

never an era like that more than this one that we clearly know of — least-wise not since Adam.


19 posted on 11/04/2007 8:55:44 PM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix
THE MESSAGE VERSION AMPLIFIED NEW LIVING TRANSLATION
1-5 The Message Isaiah got regarding
Judah and Jerusalem: There's
a day coming
when the mountain of God's House
Will be The Mountain—
solid, towering over all mountains.
All nations will river toward it,
people from
all over set out for it.
They'll say, "Come,
let's climb God's Mountain,
go to the House of the God
of Jacob.
He'll show us the way he works
so we can live
the way we're made."
Zion's the source
of the revelation.
God's Message comes from
Jerusalem.

He'll settle things fairly
between nations.
He'll make things
right between many peoples.
They'll turn their swords
into shovels, their spears into hoes.
No more will nation fight nation;
they won't play war anymore.

Come, family of Jacob,
let's live in the light of God.

3And many people shall come and say,
Come, let us go up to the mountain
of the Lord, to the house
of the God of Jacob,
that He may teach us
His ways and that we may walk
in His paths.
For out of Zion
shall go forth the law
and instruction,
and the word of the Lord
from Jerusalem.

4And He shall judge
between the nations
and shall decide [disputes]
for many peoples;
and they shall beat their swords
into plowshares and their spears
into pruning hooks.
Nation shall not
lift up sword against nation,
neither shall they
learn war any more.(A)

5O house of Jacob,
come, let us walk
in the light of the Lord.

3 People from many nations
will come and say,
“Come, let us go up
to the mountain of the Lord,
to the house of Jacob’s God.
There he will teach us his ways,
and we will walk in his paths.”
For the Lord’s teaching
will go out from Zion;
his word will go out
from Jerusalem.

4 The Lord will mediate between nations
and will settle international disputes.
They will hammer their swords into plowshares
and their spears into pruning hooks.
Nation will no longer fight against nation,
nor train for war anymore.

A Warning of Judgment
5 Come, descendants of Jacob,
let us walk in the light of the Lord!

TESTING html coding

28 posted on 11/17/2007 11:31:28 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix; Religion Moderator

Feel free to delete posts 20-27 if and when convenient.


29 posted on 11/17/2007 11:33:15 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Alamo-Girl; All
THE MESSAGE VERSION AMPLIFIED NEW LIVING TRANSLATION
1-5 The Message Isaiah got regarding
Judah and Jerusalem: There's
a day coming
when the mountain of God's House
Will be The Mountain—
solid, towering over all mountains.
All nations will river toward it,
people from
all over set out for it.
They'll say, "Come,
let's climb God's Mountain,
go to the House of the God
of Jacob.
He'll show us the way he works
so we can live
the way we're made."
Zion's the source
of the revelation.
God's Message comes from
Jerusalem.

He'll settle things fairly
between nations.
He'll make things
right between many peoples.
They'll turn their swords
into shovels, their spears into hoes.
No more will nation fight nation;
they won't play war anymore.

Come, family of Jacob,
let's live in the light of God.

3And many people shall come and say,
Come, let us go up to the mountain
of the Lord, to the house
of the God of Jacob,
that He may teach us
His ways and that we may walk
in His paths.
For out of Zion
shall go forth the law
and instruction,
and the word of the Lord
from Jerusalem.

4And He shall judge
between the nations
and shall decide [disputes]
for many peoples;
and they shall beat their swords
into plowshares and their spears
into pruning hooks.
Nation shall not
lift up sword against nation,
neither shall they
learn war any more.(A)

5O house of Jacob,
come, let us walk
in the light of the Lord.

Quix Commentary

1. People from MANY nations.
Not all—because we know from
Other Scripture that those who
Do NOT come, get no rain.

2. Let us go UP TO
--Mt Sinai?
NO!
--The mountains of Lebanon?
NO!
--Mt Everest?
NO!
--Mt of Olives?
Not by that name anyway!
--Mt Ararat?
NO!
The Mountain of The Lord!

ALL other mountains have been
Brought low.

Clearly, Almighty God is making a
HUGE statement as THE SOURCE;
--THE SUPREME SOURCE;
--THE ONLY REAL SOURCE;
--THE ONLY TRULY HOLY, LOFTY SOURCE;
--THE HIGHEST SOURCE.

THE MOUNTAIN OF THE LORD;
KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS!
WHO ALONE IS THE SOURCE OF
--ALL TRUTH;
--ALL GOOD;
--ALL POWER;
--ALL WISDOM;
--ALL RIGHTEOUSNESS;
--ALL LOVE;
--ALL JUSTICE;
--ALL BEAUTY;
--ALL PEACE;
--ALL HOPE;
--ALL JOY;
--ALL FAITH;
--ALL IN ALL!

3. To the house of
Who’s God?

--the global community’s?
NO!
--Ishmael’s?
NO!
--India’s?
NO!
--China’s?
NO!
--The International Christian Community’s?
NO! Functionally, yes as Christ is our Lord.
But that’s not the label God chooses here.

THE HOUSE OF JACOB’S GOD!

Why such an emphasis?

Evidently God still has a fondness for
Blessing HIS BUDDY Abraham’s chosen
Blood offspring.

JACOB’S GOD. Abraham, Isaac and Jacob’s GOD!

4. AND THERE
JACOB’S GOD WILL TEACH US HIS WAYS!

BLESSED BE THE NAME OF THE LORD!

His laws will be inscribed on our hearts! YEA!

5. And we WILL WALK IN HIS PATHS!
Gone will be the waywardness; doublemindedness;
Doing that which we would not and avoiding that
Our better selves would prefer we did.
Single-mindedly we will joyfully serve The Lord!

6. For The Lord’s teaching will go out from where?
--FROM ZION! BEAUTIFUL, BEAUTIFUL ZION!

--not from New York!
--NOT from Harvard! (boy was that a long time ago!)
--Not from Beijing, Brasilia, London, CNN Center,
--FROM ZION—HIS FAVORITE’S TURF! PRAISE GOD!

7. HIS WORD WILL GO OUT FROM JERUSALEM!

David’s city!
NOT Mecca, nor Bombay!
David’s city. God’s chosen City of God’s chosen people!

Somehow, of all creation . . . the crucial address will be

JERUSALEM! JERUSALEM! JERUSALEM!
LIFT UP YOUR GATES AND SING!

8. THE LORD will MEDIATE BETWEEN NATIONS.

--NOT the globalists, socialists, communists who’ve been wiped
From the planet AND from memory.
--NOT the UN!
--NOT flesh-driven, ego driven, greed driven diplomats.
--NOT international conglomerates.

BUT THE LORD GOD ALMIGHTY! YEA GOD!

9. AND WILL SETTLE INTERNATIONAL DISPUTES.

Interesting.
One might have conjectured that after The Great Tribulation,
Given Christ setting up HIS RULE . . . there would be no
International disputes. But, evidently there will be.

YET THE KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS WILL
SETTLE ALL SUCH! YEA!

No quibbling. No argument. No end runs around agreements.
No second guessing His fairness; His Wisdom; His authority.
Settled. Done. Recognized as all together good. Fini.

10. HAMMER SWORDS INTO PLOWSHARES!

WHAT A LONGED FOR DAY THAT WILL BE!

PEACE, PEACE, TRUE PEACE, AT LAST
A THOUSAND YEARS OF PERFECT PEACE!

No fighting between nations at all.
No training for war at all.
How mind-bogglingly wonderful!

11. COME DESCENDANTS OF JACOB
LET US WALK IN THE LIGHT OF THE LORD.

Knock off the rebellion and waywardness.
DOABLE with His law written in their/our hearts.

LET US WALK IN THE LIGHT OF THE LORD!

BLESSED BE THE NAME OF THE LORD!

30 posted on 11/17/2007 6:58:52 PM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix

Thank you oh so very much for that inspiring sermon and especially for those Scriptures!


31 posted on 11/17/2007 10:59:06 PM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: Alamo-Girl
THE MESSAGE VERSION AMPLIFIED QUIX’s COMMENTARY
The abuse of oppressors and cruelty of tyrants— all their whips and cudgels and curses— Is gone, done away with, a deliverance as surprising and sudden as Gideon's old victory over Midian. 4For the yoke of [Israel's] burden, and the staff or rod for [goading] their shoulders, the rod of their oppressor, You have broken as in the day of [Gideon with] Midian.(B) The abuse of the oppressors.
The yoke of ISRAEL’S BURDEN.
This is a pretty clear focus.
Israel has sinned and been disciplined.
But now the discipline is to be lifted.
At that future point, the discipline
Will have been lifted—as surprisingly
And suddenly as Gideon’s victory of old.

Sounds clearly like yet another emphatic
And dramatic victory of God of The Angel Armies
Over the enemies of HIS CHOSEN ones.
Throughout Scripture, this has been
The sort of thing God has exalted in.

He persistently seems to love
dramatic cliff-hanger rscues
of HIS KIDS—HIS CHOSEN KIDS.

The boots of all those invading troops,
along with their shirts
soaked with innocent blood,
Will be piled in a heap and burned,
a fire that will burn for days!
5For every [tramping] warrior's
war boots and all his armor
in the battle tumult and
every garment rolled in blood
shall be burned as fuel for the fire.
The boots of invading troops . . .
Shirts soaked in innocent blood . . .

Quite a picture of the aftermath
Of God’s victory over those who
Oppressed Israel.

Not per se those who oppressed
Africa, Muslims, South America,
But who oppressed ISRAEL.

For a child has been born—for us!
the gift of a son—for us!
6For to us a Child is born,
to us a Son is given;
Ahhhh, THE CHILD is born.
The Messiah. A child FOR US.
Sure, fine, for the whole world.
But this is THE LONG PROMISED ONE.
OUR VERY JEWISH MESSIAH.
OUR ANOINTED ONE.
BLESSED IS HE WHO COMES
IN THE NAME OF THE LORD.
He'll take over
the running
of the world.
and the government
shall be upon His shoulder
HE WILL take over the running
Of the world.

Not as an idle Board member or
Consulting CEO Emeritus.
NO! AS THE BOSS.
THE SUPREME BOSS.

Not just the Jewish World.
The western world.
But the WHOLE WORLD.
Actually, all that is.
WHAT A DAY THAT WILL BE.
SOONER than many imagine.

His names will be:
Amazing Counselor,
Strong God,
Eternal Father,
Prince of Wholeness.
and His name shall be called
Wonderful Counselor,
Mighty God, Everlasting Father
[of Eternity], Prince of Peace.(C)
No equivocating bureaucrat here.
Counselor. Strong God. Father.
Ahhhhhhh, Daddy, sooooo many
Need YOUR WHOLENESS.
Bind up the brokenhearted,
For Good, Daddy. Forever, Daddy.
His ruling authority will grow,
and there'll be no limits
to the wholeness he brings.
7Of the increase of
His government and of peace
there shall be no end,
His AUTHORITY will grow and
Encompass all. There will be NO
Limit, boundary, lack, insufficiency
To the PEACE AND WHOLENESS
HE BRINGS to all creation,
Plagued since the fall.
RESTORATION AND ADVANCEMENT
--HIS WHOLENESS—
THE ORDER OF THE DAY, EVERY DAY.
He'll rule from the historic
David throne
over that promised kingdom.
He'll put that kingdom
on a firm footing
and keep it going
With fair dealing and right living,
beginning now and lasting always.
upon the throne of David
and over his kingdom,
to establish it
and to uphold it
with justice
and with righteousness
from the [latter] time forth,
even forevermore.
GOD OF THE ANGEL ARMIES seems to
Love to tie up loose ends and
To finish WHAT HE STARTED.

He’s not interested in a
Hollywood prop.
Nor a modern improvement
Perhaps from Laz-Y-Boy.
He wants the real thing.
Whether His taste or symbolism,
I expect the real thing.

I don’t think it’s put the way
It is put in this verse for
Mere symbolism.
I may be wrong, certainly.

In any case, HE WILL RULE
IN THAT POSITION OF AUTHORITY
OVER THAT KINGDOM OF ISRAEL.
That seems abundantly clear.

It is also true that such rule
Will be over all that is--
With Israel (spiritual & literal)
as priests and joint heirs
Over all other nations and worlds.

But this verse alone makes very
Certain and explicit Israel’s
Place in such matters—after all
Has been said, done and conquered,
By THE KING OF KINGS
AND LORD OF LORDS.

And not just any even average
Good ruler-ship.
Perfect ruler-ship with
Perfect Justice, Peace, Love
AND FOREVERMORE.
Beginning “now” and forevermore
Is interesting. It is as though
In the spiritual dimension, because
God has decided it in His timeless sphere
Even before it happens, it is still
NOW AND FOREVERMORE.

The zeal of God-of-the-Angel-Armies
will do all this.
The zeal of the Lord of hosts
will perform this.(D)
The ZEAL of the
GOD OF THE ANGEL ARMIES
WILL PERFORM IT.
It’s not an idle hobby.
It’s not an optional
When He gets around to it.
HIS ZEAL WILL
PERFORM IT AND THAT
PERFECTLY.
BLESSED BE THE NAME OF THE LORD
BLESSED IS HE WHO COMES
IN THE NAME OF THE LORD
MARANATHA!

32 posted on 11/18/2007 11:02:56 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix
Thank you so much for sharing all of your insights and especially for those beautiful Scriptures!

Maranatha, Jesus!!!

33 posted on 11/18/2007 8:19:23 PM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: Quix

Why do you quote from the Message and the Amplified???


34 posted on 11/19/2007 3:58:59 AM PST by Uncle Chip (TRUTH : Ignore it. Deride it. Allegorize it. Interpret it. But you can't ESCAPE it.)
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To: Uncle Chip

I believe that Peterson captures the idiom; the vernacular; the tone; the character; the spirit of the original in modern language better than any other I know of. It has brought me closer to God a number of times. It has made Scripture be more alive and God-breathed to me many times.

I like the Amplified for giving the plausible additional, robustness of meanings verse by verse.


35 posted on 11/19/2007 6:41:56 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Uncle Chip

Still trying to figure out the column width things better though! obviously.


36 posted on 11/19/2007 6:42:58 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix

I like your new posting style — it is more readable


37 posted on 11/19/2007 6:56:17 AM PST by Uncle Chip (TRUTH : Ignore it. Deride it. Allegorize it. Interpret it. But you can't ESCAPE it.)
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To: Quix
They are both loose translations that are often more opinion than translations. Even Eugene Peterson admits that and does not recommend his translation as a study bible.

Here for example is how he translates Luke 4:4:

"4Jesus answered by quoting Deuteronomy: "It takes more than bread to really live."

The most important part of that verse he left out.

38 posted on 11/19/2007 7:05:34 AM PST by Uncle Chip (TRUTH : Ignore it. Deride it. Allegorize it. Interpret it. But you can't ESCAPE it.)
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To: Uncle Chip

Thanks, thanks.


39 posted on 11/19/2007 7:13:21 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Uncle Chip

But I have the KJV internalized and mostly greatly memorized.

And, have read the NIV a lot as well as others. I still find THE MESSAGE an abiding blessing.

What versions do you prefer and why?


40 posted on 11/19/2007 7:14:28 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Uncle Chip

I think the Amplified provides a balance to that aspect of THE MESSAGE.


41 posted on 11/19/2007 7:15:33 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: 1000 silverlings

gentile believers...hence christians...you see there are distinctions...to say all gentiles are grafted in would say that all gentiles are saved....the tree represents Gods chosen people....the graft represents the church....only those saved through grace are going to be grafted in.....hence it is save to say only christians will be grafted in.


42 posted on 11/19/2007 7:22:47 AM PST by meganoita
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To: Quix

im sorry but if your going to study biblical prophecy your going to need a real bible..not someones opinion on the matter....word for word translation would then obviously be the best thing and what other than the NASB or MKJV offers that?


43 posted on 11/19/2007 7:22:48 AM PST by meganoita
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To: meganoita

You may be mixing threads up.

This is a caucus thread . . . not for contentious postings etc.


44 posted on 11/19/2007 7:26:57 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: meganoita

I respect your opinion.

And do not wish to make this caucus thread contentious about translations.

There are at least as many opinions about translations as there are translations.

There are threads about such.

I believe each translation is BOTH translation AND paraphrase. It’s impossible to translate without paraphrasing.

I believe each quality effort offers nuances others have missed here and there.

The best translations are still OPINIONS on the matter. I don’t find COMMITTEES opinions necessarily more accurate, faithful to the original or anointed.

Perhaps you’d like to start a prophecy thread using your preferred translations.


45 posted on 11/19/2007 7:31:56 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: meganoita

And, I think it would be perfectly fine to offer verses from those translations

in a collaborative, mutually supportive exploring together dialogue hereon.


46 posted on 11/19/2007 7:53:26 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix
In churches that I have been in, the Amplified was used by the women's groups because of its verbosity. It expounds on and expands the verses with words that may or may not be true to the text.

I always want to know what the original Author meant, not what the translator would like you to think he meant. The translator is supposed to remain faithful to the author's text, but so many translations today add to and take away from the text, like Luke 4:4.

I prefer a version that is as close as possible to the Traditional Greek and Hebrew Texts underlying the KJV and thus prefer the KJV.

47 posted on 11/19/2007 8:08:32 AM PST by Uncle Chip (TRUTH : Ignore it. Deride it. Allegorize it. Interpret it. But you can't ESCAPE it.)
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To: Uncle Chip

Certainly don’t want a KJV only/bashing thread here.

KJV has translation problems, too. We don’t have the originals. All translations are flawed. All bring something to the table.

It’s not translations that lead us into all truth

. . . HOLY SPIRIT does that.


48 posted on 11/19/2007 8:18:59 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix; Alamo-Girl

ping


49 posted on 11/19/2007 8:36:03 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix
It’s not translations that lead us into all truth . . . HOLY SPIRIT does that.

Then why is there scripture at all??? And how would you be able to say that unless you read it in the scripture???

The scripture is a product of the Holy Spirit, and thus through scripture the Holy Spirit leads us to all truth.

Darth Vader said he would start a thread on this when he returns --

50 posted on 11/19/2007 8:39:00 AM PST by Uncle Chip (TRUTH : Ignore it. Deride it. Allegorize it. Interpret it. But you can't ESCAPE it.)
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