Pope Benedict XVI gives Communion to a US soldier during a Mass at the Nationals Park stadium in Washington, April 17, 2008. (AP Photo/L'Osservatore Romano, ho)
Posted on 04/18/2008 11:13:07 AM PDT by NYer
Amazing. One would think that after the multicultural musical mayhem that occurred yesterday at National's Stadium, that your average 'catholic' progressive would be basking in the glow of this liturgical train wreck for weeks. Not so. Some progressives are equally upset about the mass.
There are so many things that one could be upset about when it comes that liturgy that it would be the work of days to try and list them. Leave it to the Associated Press and their cadre of perpetual dissenters to uncover one I hadn't even thought of. The AP is upset that there were no Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion.
Amazing. One of the only things that went right in the liturgy is the one thing the AP and their cohort of typical dissenters will focus on.
But Pope Benedict XVI's Mass in the nation's capital Thursday was also different from a typical service in another way: Lay people were not asked to distribute Communion, which was administered exclusively by 300 priests and deacons.
Organizers of the Mass at Nationals Park were only following the letter of church law. But to some Roman Catholics, the ceremony was symbolic of what they see as Benedict's desire to erect clear boundaries between clergy and lay people.
"What he wants to do really is to reinforce the old categories and classifications — different roles for different people," said David Gibson, author of books on Benedict and the future of the U.S. church.
You absolutely have to love these guys. They are more disciplined than any political candidate that I can think of. They are never happy and never off message. Everyone to the right of Sr. Joan Chittister is wailing and gnashing their teeth over this embarrassing debacle and progressives still aren't happy.
Patty Olszewski, 51, of Potomoc, Md., was disappointed about the lack of lay Eucharistic ministers — she is one.These rad-trendies will always stick to the talking points and will never be satisfied no matter how crazy things get. Recognition of this fact should give the Pope and the hierarchy the message that there is no satisfying these people. It is time to move on. Put an end to this nonsense once and for all. Reform the liturgy. Now. Let the chips fall where they may.She describes herself as an anti-abortion Catholic who wishes the church would at least consider women priests and disagrees with church teaching against homosexuality. Even so, she said she's happy with her role and feels like she's contributing.
"In everyday life, you don't feel oppressed by any sort of hierarchy because it's so heavily populated by the laity," Olswewski said. "That's 'We the People.' The church is all of us."
WASHINGTON (AP) — For 46,000 Catholics, it was a Mass like no other, with the altar standing on centerfield at a ballpark and the presiding clergyman arriving in a bulletproof vehicle.
But Pope Benedict XVI's Mass in the nation's capital Thursday was also different from a typical service in another way: Lay people were not asked to distribute Communion, which was administered exclusively by 300 priests and deacons.
Organizers of the Mass at Nationals Park were only following the letter of church law. But to some Roman Catholics, the ceremony was symbolic of what they see as Benedict's desire to erect clear boundaries between clergy and lay people.
"What he wants to do really is to reinforce the old categories and classifications — different roles for different people," said David Gibson, author of books on Benedict and the future of the U.S. church.
"Men and women, priests and lay people. Each one has their role according to their talents, their ordained status in the church."
The clear division of roles doesn't sit well with all American Catholics, who are used to living in a democracy. Some would like a greater say in church affairs, including choosing their parish priests. Others cherish the distinct roles held by clergy and point to several examples of the two working together in harmony.
The pope has signaled his position through some relatively small gestures, Gibson said.
For example, the Vatican has issued a document reaffirming that only priests and deacons can touch and clean the chalice after Mass, something many lay people have done.
The Rev. John Wauck, a professor of literature at Rome's Pontifical University of the Holy Cross, warned against measuring appreciation for the laity by what they can and can't do in church.
"The life of the church doesn't take place in sacristies and parish meeting halls alone," Wauck said. "It takes place in homes, shops, sports fields, businesses, hospitals ... wherever there are Catholics."
He added: "The relationship between the clergy and the laity can't be seen in terms of a power struggle. Both are serving the church in their own way."
Because of the priest shortage in the U.S., lay people are increasingly being called upon to run the administrative side of parishes while leaving sacramental duties to clergy.
In 2005, nearly one-quarter of the nation's 217,000 parishes were without a resident parish priest. At the end of Pope John Paul II's pontificate, more lay people than clergy were working full-time in American parishes and many of those lay leaders were women.
Lay people also have taken more active roles on parish financial councils and high-profile panels like the church's National Review Board, which was formed in response to the clergy sex abuse crisis.
Even so, that board is advisory. Bishops still make policy decisions, and board members have left after complaining their advice was not heeded.
For distribution of the Eucharist, priests and deacons are known as "ordinary" ministers, meaning they should do the job when they are available.
At Thursday's Mass, 1,500 priests and deacons were in the stadium — five times the number needed, said Susan Gibbs, spokeswoman for the Archdiocese of Washington.
Another staple of parish life — altar boys and girls — also were missing from the Mass. Under papal liturgy guidelines, seminarians perform those duties.
But lay people also played high-profile roles, reading the Scripture and serving as cantors and petition readers.
"To me, it's almost seamless how we work together," said Gibbs, one of nine lay people on the archdiocese's papal planning committee. "Clergy bring pastoral teaching and direction. Lay people bring business skills, administrative skills."
Patty Olszewski, 51, of Potomoc, Md., was disappointed about the lack of lay Eucharistic ministers — she is one.
She describes herself as an anti-abortion Catholic who wishes the church would at least consider women priests and disagrees with church teaching against homosexuality. Even so, she said she's happy with her role and feels like she's contributing.
"In everyday life, you don't feel oppressed by any sort of hierarchy because it's so heavily populated by the laity," Olswewski said. "That's 'We the People.' The church is all of us."
Erin Johnson, 24, a parish youth minister from Gaithersburg, Md., believes "you either follow the traditions of the church, or you don't."
"I feel like I have plenty of opportunities to serve," said Johnson, who brought 30 teens to the Mass. "Each individual, every single one of us, has a place."
Sucks to be them.
>>Erin Johnson, 24, a parish youth minister from Gaithersburg, Md., believes “you either follow the traditions of the church, or you don’t.”
“I feel like I have plenty of opportunities to serve,” said Johnson, who brought 30 teens to the Mass. “Each individual, every single one of us, has a place.” <<
Erin has it right. The problem is that most of these nimrods want to be up on the Altar and not in the trenches.
What was my place in the church for the longest time? I cleaned bathrooms. Yeah! Public bathrooms. It needed to be done and families all took turns doing it.
Fill a need people.
She needs to re-consider her positions and getting herself back in line with the Magisterium before saying the church needs to consider anything. The hubris of some people simply amazing.
Hope they get a copy of the photo to that troop.
There is something deeply, psychologically amiss with people who always look for the bad instead of the good, in everything. From the comments, they seem to have a “It’s all about ME!” attitude.................
They also serve who sling a mop!
I guess the Eucharettes don’t understand the meaning of “extraordinary.” There were plenty of priest and bishops there to distribute the Eucharist. No Eucharettes were needed.
You are so right!!! There is much work to be done. Someone who truly seeks to serve God can find many ways of doing so.
>>Yup. I’m on the cleaning committee — along with Circuit Court Judges, doctors and other professionals. I get the cry-room — pooky diapers and all. ;-) <<
Ooooo, I don’t envy you.
I went into the Men’s bathroom the day after a Kids for Jesus Meeting to a toilet plugged up.
I literally looked away as I scooped it out with rubber gloves and a toilet brush.
Hey, Jesus hung for three hours for me. A little poo won’t get me down!
>>There is much work to be done. Someone who truly seeks to serve God can find many ways of doing so. <<
I always tell people, I would rather serve God by cleaning potties than teach CCD.
Our volunteers give up 9 months of their lives to be there every Wednesday and have all those little souls to teach.
I’ll take the bathroom detail anytime.
I personally don’t have a problem with properly trained laity serving the chalice while other clerics serve the host. What I have seen work best is two chalice servers for every host server (since taking a sip takes longer than distributing a piece of bread or waffer).
I do have a problem with the chalice not being offerred to all communicants in good standing.
>>Oy! Pass the Advil. <<
Lord Love YOU!
She needs to re-consider her positions and getting herself back in line with the Magisterium before saying the church needs to consider anything. The hubris of some people simply amazing. I don't know that I would call this hubris. There are things about the church that I wish were different, but I do not have the power to change. This lady did not say she was disobeying teh church, merely disagreeing.
The church has considered women priests.
So, what about the word “extraordinary” do these cretins not understand?
Oh, wait, I know. They think “extraordinary” means “real good.”
I don't think so but if you have a reference it would be interesting reading.
Ahh, but cleaning bathrooms is like bathing someone’s open wounds or cleaning them up after they have an accident.
You do it in private, and there’s no public glory!
EXACTLY my understanding as well. with all the clergy present at that Mass why in the world would they need a lay minister?
ping.
>>You do it in private, and there’s no public glory!<<
I like that.
Only me and Our Lord!
Yes. And categorically and authoritatively rejected the idea for all time.
What does it say about a person who, on the occasion of a Papal visit, just has to mention their disagreement when talking to a reporter?
It's called "dissent." If one has reservations, that is fine. People struggle with conscience. But to publicly pronounce one's opposition is to dissent.
Interesting - not the same guy.
I wonder how many wounded soldiers from Walter Reed were there?
Coop - any info?
It's called "dissent." If one has reservations, that is fine. People struggle with conscience. But to publicly pronounce one's opposition is to dissent.
******************
Well said.
Eucharettes
As a former Catholic who is considering a return to the Church, I choked with glee on this one.
DUH! Dinosaur media!
I had the same reaction when I first saw the word here on FR. Glad to hear you are considering returning. God bless you on your journey.
My prayers accompany you in this discernment process. Here is a relatively new site that may offer you encouragement.
The value of silent service is not recognized by all.
The rules, I believe, state that when the size of the congregation present reaches a certain limit, that only the hosts are distributed, probably for logistical reasons more than anything.
Unfortunately, Coop no longer posts on FR.
I didn't see the mass so I missed this. Can anyone fill me in or give me a link?
Get off my back,answer the poster if you can.
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