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Cardinal Egan Blasts Pelosi (in brilliantly scathing response) [Open]
CMR ^ | August 26, 2008 | Matthew Archbold

Posted on 08/26/2008 10:37:18 AM PDT by NYer

Wow! This is a brilliantly scathing response to Nancy Pelosi and her comments on Meet The Press Sunday concerning abortion. Here's the amazing statement in full.

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE: August 26, 2008

STATEMENT OF HIS EMINENCE, EDWARD CARDINAL EGAN CONCERNING REMARKS MADE BY THE SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

Like many other citizens of this nation, I was shocked to learn that the Speaker of the House of Representatives of the United States of America would make the kind of statements that were made to Mr. Tom Brokaw of NBC-TV on Sunday, August 24, 2008. What the Speaker had to say about theologians and their positions regarding abortion was not only misinformed; it was also, and especially, utterly incredible in this day and age.

We are blessed in the 21st century with crystal-clear photographs and action films of the living realities within their pregnant mothers. No one with the slightest measure of integrity or honor could fail to know what these marvelous beings manifestly, clearly, and obviously are, as they smile and wave into the world outside the womb. In simplest terms, they are human beings with an inalienable right to live, a right that the Speaker of the House of Representatives is bound to defend at all costs for the most basic of ethical reasons. They are not parts of their mothers, and what they are depends not at all upon the opinions of theologians of any faith. Anyone who dares to defend that they may be legitimately killed because another human being “chooses” to do so or for any other equally ridiculous reason should not be providing leadership in a civilized democracy worthy of the name.

Edward Cardinal Egan

Archbishop of New York


August 26, 2008
Wow! Wow! Wow!


TOPICS: Catholic; Religion & Politics; Theology
KEYWORDS: abortion; eagan; egan; pelosi
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To: G Larry

“Nancy, you might want to put some ice on that...”

No ice for her! (Soup Nazi mode off)


51 posted on 08/26/2008 11:20:16 AM PDT by dsc
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To: NYer

Sorry if I’m underwhelmed.

If the statement holds water then when she gets back to Washington DC and attends mass, she will publicly be denied the Holy Eucharist.

Until then, these are only words.


52 posted on 08/26/2008 11:22:30 AM PDT by netmilsmom (The Party of Darkness prefers to have the lights out. - Go Fierce 50!!!)
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To: NYer
Wow! Wow! Wow! is right. Cardinal Egan just hits it out of the park. These words will echo from now to November:

"In simplest terms, they are human beings with an inalienable right to live, a right that the Speaker of the House of Representatives is bound to defend at all costs for the most basic of ethical reasons. They are not parts of their mothers, and what they are depends not at all upon the opinions of theologians of any faith. Anyone who dares to defend that they may be legitimately killed because another human being “chooses” to do so or for any other equally ridiculous reason should not be providing leadership in a civilized democracy worthy of the name."

53 posted on 08/26/2008 11:23:43 AM PDT by Servant of the Cross (the Truth will set you free)
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To: NYer

It seems as though the CINO politicians miscalculated the extent to which the hierarchy would allow themselves to be complicit in the charade.

Pelosi did not realize she was opening up Pandora’s box, but she was and the immediacy and forcefulness of the bishops’ responses are stunning.

A new page has been turned. The myth that CINO pro-aborts are actually Catholic is being shattered.


54 posted on 08/26/2008 11:28:55 AM PDT by Notwithstanding ("You are either with America in our time of need or you are not" - Hillary from Senate well 9/12/01)
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To: Antoninus

She set her self up as a spokesperson for the Catholic Church on a national news show. She had to know what was coming.


55 posted on 08/26/2008 11:29:01 AM PDT by RinaseaofDs
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To: Ann Archy

Rush Limbaugh said this yesterday:

“Pope Benedict is going to hear about this if he hasn’t. He cares. He’s the pope. He cares about the Catholic Church. The most powerful woman in the United States of America has just lied about his church. Something has to happen here at some point. I don’t know what. I don’t know what steps publicly the Catholic Church takes in a situation like this. But the first thing that is going to happen is, American Catholics are going to hear about it on this program...”

http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_082508/content/01125109.guest.html


56 posted on 08/26/2008 11:31:02 AM PDT by Deo volente ("Obama and Biden: Windy and Windier"...Hugh Hewitt, 8/25/08)
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To: NeoCaveman

impressive.


57 posted on 08/26/2008 11:37:09 AM PDT by xsmommy
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To: Notwithstanding

I hope you’re right, all the way to the point of the host finally being drawn back from them when they present their bloody hands for communion.


58 posted on 08/26/2008 11:38:22 AM PDT by workerbee (Vote for Obama? No thanks, I already have a messiah.)
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To: RinaseaofDs
She set her self up as a spokesperson for the Catholic Church on a national news show. She had to know what was coming.

A HUGE mistake, and the consequences are just beginning, I hope.

It's one thing to spout pro-abortion views and claim to be Catholic, but when she tried to make herself the pope on national television and redefine perennial Church teaching, she went a million steps too far.
59 posted on 08/26/2008 11:39:06 AM PDT by Deo volente ("Obama and Biden: Windy and Windier"...Hugh Hewitt, 8/25/08)
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To: Antoninus

BUT Wuerl can deny her in Washington DC stating that she caused scandal to the church and therefore excommunicated herself.

That’s what I’m looking for.


60 posted on 08/26/2008 11:39:39 AM PDT by netmilsmom (The Party of Darkness prefers to have the lights out. - Go Fierce 50!!!)
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To: NYer

What this does in effect is ensure McCain settles on a pro-life VP.

Sorry, Ridge and Lieberman.


61 posted on 08/26/2008 11:46:39 AM PDT by bestintxas (It's great in Texas)
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To: InABunkerUnderSF

If I may be so bold.......

This is the equivalent of a two-by-four UPSIDE the head!

Snicker-snort!


62 posted on 08/26/2008 11:51:14 AM PDT by Tucker39 (Darwin, Huxley, Sagan, et al began believing in God and Creation after 5 seconds in Hell!)
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To: Deo volente
It's one thing to spout pro-abortion views and claim to be Catholic, but when she tried to make herself the pope on national television and redefine perennial Church teaching, she went a million steps too far.

In short, Edward Cardinal Egan, Archbishop of New York, has informed Speaker Pelosi that defining the positions of the Church is above her paygrade (and above her for good reasons!).

63 posted on 08/26/2008 11:51:19 AM PDT by RogerD (Educaiton Profesionul)
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To: NYer

OUCH Put some ice on that smackdown Nancy LOL!


64 posted on 08/26/2008 11:51:25 AM PDT by SevenofNine ("We are Freepers, all your media belong to us, resistence is futile")
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To: bcsco
I am just a clunky old convert to RC, but it is my understanding that to receive communion one has to be in a state of grace, absolved of any sin that would make one guilty of partaking the blessed sacrament in an unworthy manner.

What Pelosi has done here falls into what we learned in RCIA as the category of the "M" sin, one that places her soul in grave danger of condemnation. It is a category of wrongdoing that is close to the ultimate because it has the potential for leading others astray, thereby placing their souls in mortal peril. As a an elected leader and public official who claims membership in the Church, Pelosi (and others) have a special obligation to not oppose what is a clear and unambigous position of the Church in so public and visible a manner.

She can regain standing to accept communion in a worthy manner by confessing and repenting her sin, which is what the sacrament of confession offers. But until then the leaders of the Church have no choice but to publicly repudiate her false statements so as to make clear to those who might be swayed what the teaching of the Church is on this matter.

65 posted on 08/26/2008 11:55:20 AM PDT by chimera
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To: Antoninus

Excommunicating her would backfire. That’s what she wants, to become a martyr of the mean old bishops. The public smackdown is more effective, especially if the bishops (finally) keep doing it consistently, repeatedly to these high profile politicians. The repeated public statement that politician so-and-so should not present himself for Communion is as close as they can come to actual excommunication and if it is stated loudly and often enough and with some punch, like Chaput did, it’s the most effective strategy.


66 posted on 08/26/2008 11:57:53 AM PDT by Houghton M.
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To: NYer

“Wow” is right! Thank you, Cardinal Egan!


67 posted on 08/26/2008 12:01:26 PM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: chimera
She can regain standing to accept communion in a worthy manner by confessing and repenting her sin, which is what the sacrament of confession offers. But until then the leaders of the Church have no choice but to publicly repudiate her false statements so as to make clear to those who might be swayed what the teaching of the Church is on this matter.

I appreciate your detailed response. Does this mean then that she now cannot receive Communion until she repents her actions? Who adjudicates this? Her priest? I'm not Catholic so the workings of this are unclear to me.

68 posted on 08/26/2008 12:04:36 PM PDT by bcsco (Obama's just biden his time until McCain wins in November.)
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To: NYer
Wow! Wow! Wow!

WOW!

69 posted on 08/26/2008 12:05:05 PM PDT by Aquinasfan (When you find "Sola Scriptura" in the Bible, let me know)
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To: Ronin
It’s the ultimate reason abortion supporters are so shrill whenever anyone questions them. The guilt is inside their hearts and won’t go away no matter how shrill their various arguments are.

I liken it to whistling past the graveyard.

70 posted on 08/26/2008 12:06:48 PM PDT by OldMissileer (Atlas, Titan, Minuteman, PK. Winners of the Cold War)
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To: NeoCaveman

Depends on whether we want to make the base verb pingo, pingere or pingo, pingare. I see that pingare has made it into Italian as a neologism for computer pinging, so perhaps there’s a Latin verb pingare (my dictionary is not at hand), alongside pingere (to paint, draw).

So, pingemus would be “let us ping” (subjunctive active) and all you need to do is make it subjunctive passive: pingemur = “let us be pinged.” At least I think that’s right.

Or perhaps you wanted an imperative: “pinga” — (you) ping (someone)??


71 posted on 08/26/2008 12:16:27 PM PDT by Houghton M.
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To: Made In The USA

I suspect that deep down, below all the plastic surgery, Ms. Pelosi knows the Cardinal is right.

____________________

I suspect you are dead wrong.
Nancy has never demonstrated that she has a deep down better nature. She is ugly to the bone.


72 posted on 08/26/2008 12:22:59 PM PDT by Louis Foxwell
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To: y6162
NYer says:“Anyone who dares to defend that they may be legitimately killed because another human being “chooses” to do so or for any other equally ridiculous reason should not be providing leadership in a civilized democracy worthy of the name.”

Now Cardinal excommunicate her...do it...

If the Catholic church wants to really be respected she should stick to her guns and excommunicate all politicians who don't follow her rules and regulation on this abortion issue!

73 posted on 08/26/2008 12:26:32 PM PDT by Truth Defender (History teaches, if we but listen to it; but no one really listens!)
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To: bcsco
It is my understanding that the sinner must seek reconciliation (confession) of their own volition, either as a result of examination of conscience or clear instruction from a member of the clergy (i.e., a priest recommends you seek it). I believe that any ordained member of the presbyterate (priests) or episcopate (bishops) can hear confession and are empowered to grant absolution, which of course comes via grace and the one sacrifice of Christ.

Until Pelosi seeks forgiveness of her sin and receives the sacrament of reconciliation and repents of her sin, she should not take nor be offered the sacrament of communion because to do so while in a state of mortal sin would be receiving it in an unworthy manner, which further jeopardizes the state of her soul. Kind of like throwing gasoline on the fire, more or less.

74 posted on 08/26/2008 12:28:22 PM PDT by chimera
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To: Truth Defender

“If the Catholic church wants to really be respected she should stick to her gun..”

I don’t think the church is a she...is she? I would say ..respected..it should stick


75 posted on 08/26/2008 12:31:19 PM PDT by y6162 (uot)
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To: NYer; cpforlife.org
Egan: "Anyone who dares to defend that they may be legitimately killed because another human being “chooses” to do so or for any other equally ridiculous reason should not be providing leadership in a civilized democracy worthy of the name."

It's official.

76 posted on 08/26/2008 12:40:14 PM PDT by HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
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To: chimera
Until Pelosi seeks forgiveness of her sin and receives the sacrament of reconciliation and repents of her sin, she should not take nor be offered the sacrament of communion...

Well, that's a lot of "shoulds". But this is the Archdiocese of San Francisco. Will that happen? And if not, what then? I guess that's where I'm going with all this. It just seems that all this is left to her 'honor' for reconciliation.

77 posted on 08/26/2008 12:41:30 PM PDT by bcsco (Obama's just biden his time until McCain wins in November.)
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To: bcsco
I guess it comes down to whether or not the Archdiocese will have the courage to pursue the matter further. Ideally the Bishop or Archbishop would put the word out to his priests that neither they nor the laypeople of their parish who dispense communion should offer it to Pelosi when she presents herself for the sacrament. If they do, then there should be sanctions imposed.

You can see why the Church hierarchy has shied away from confronting this issue. Say the bishop does put forth such an order, and the local churches obey it. Pelosi then repents and receives absolution for her sin. How are the priests and laypersons who were ordered not to dispense communion to her to know of her repentance (confession is supposed to be private) and she is now allowed to receive the sacrament? I guess the bishop could rescind the order if he were informed of her reconciliation (or granted it himself), but I would guess the penitent individual would have to grant permission for the information to be made public. I don't know.

In any case, the Church has to take a stand on this. They just can't keep looking the other way while these public leaders who claim allegiance to the church so wantonly flaunt their disobedience to a fundamental teaching of the church of the Lord. If their words are to carry any moral weight, the leaders of the Church have to take a public stand and back their words with actions. I guess we'll see what happens.

78 posted on 08/26/2008 1:06:20 PM PDT by chimera
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To: netmilsmom

Do you really think it will be broadcast?


79 posted on 08/26/2008 1:13:30 PM PDT by Jaded (does it really need a sarcasm tag?)
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To: NYer

Thank you Tom Brokaw for the interview.

You have roused a sleeping giant of faithful Catholics who are finally scandalized enough to speak out and condemn the positions (not the persons) of elected officials who claim to be Catholic merely to get a Catholic vote.

Seeing the Democrats passed an even more pro-abortion platform than 2004 let us pray that Catholics who have stayed in this party and voted for these people PLEASE LEAVE NOW!

Ronald Reagan left and so did I many years ago.

And this a reminder to The Republican Party too. You cannot abandon more American children to the abortion industry any longer. 50,000,000 surgical abortions alone in ENOUGH!-—

50,000,000 children who were not loved and protected by all Americans beg for justice and for the lives of all the children waiting in the womb to be born!!

Huge protest sign to be taken down (MUST SEE PICTURE)

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2008/aug/26/huge-protest-sign-be-taken-down/


80 posted on 08/26/2008 1:17:23 PM PDT by victim soul
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To: NYer

Thank you Tom Brokaw for the interview.

You have roused a sleeping giant of faithful Catholics who are finally scandalized enough to speak out and condemn the positions (not the persons) of elected officials who claim to be Catholic merely to get a Catholic vote.

Seeing the Democrats passed an even more pro-abortion platform than 2004 let us pray that Catholics who have stayed in this party and voted for these people PLEASE LEAVE NOW!

Ronald Reagan left and so did I many years ago.

And this a reminder to The Republican Party too. You cannot abandon more American children to the abortion industry any longer. 50,000,000 surgical abortions alone in ENOUGH!-—

50,000,000 children who were not loved and protected by all Americans beg for justice and for the lives of all the children waiting in the womb to be born!!

Huge protest sign to be taken down (MUST SEE PICTURE)

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2008/aug/26/huge-protest-sign-be-taken-down/


81 posted on 08/26/2008 1:17:33 PM PDT by victim soul
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To: Coleus; nickcarraway; narses; Mr. Silverback; Canticle_of_Deborah; TenthAmendmentChampion; ...

Click here to watch a 1-minute
Ultrasound commercial. Make
sure your speakers are on.
RealPlayer required, it's Free

Pro-Life PING

Please FreepMail me if you want on or off my Pro-Life Ping List.


82 posted on 08/26/2008 1:18:25 PM PDT by cpforlife.org (A Catholic Respect Life Curriculum is available FREE at CpForLife.org)
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To: chimera
Thanks for a very reasoned and comprehensive reply. Yes, I understand the ramifications for the Church. And I can understand why the Church would want to keep a code of silence on whatever transpires.

They just can't keep looking the other way while these public leaders who claim allegiance to the church so wantonly flaunt their disobedience to a fundamental teaching of the church of the Lord. If their words are to carry any moral weight, the leaders of the Church have to take a public stand and back their words with actions.

Pelosi herself put them in this position. Whatever action they take, they need to insure she understands the gravity of her sin. That in itself makes it a personal matter between herself and her Church. Perhaps we may never know what the results turn out to be.

83 posted on 08/26/2008 1:21:17 PM PDT by bcsco (Obama's just biden his time until McCain wins in November.)
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To: marshmallow
It's almost like he cut and pasted a post from the FR Religion forum.

One could only hope.

84 posted on 08/26/2008 1:22:41 PM PDT by mockingbyrd (official Mad Dawg groupie.)
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To: NYer

Pelosi and Biden hear from Catholic bishops

http://online.worldmag.com/2008/08/26/pelosi-and-biden-hear-from-catholic-bishops/

Head of Vatican’s Highest Court: Ministers Have “Obligation to Deny” Communion to Pro-Abortion Politicians

8/20/2008 7:42:00 PM
By John-Henry Westen -www.LifeSiteNews.com
http://catholiccitizens.org/press/pressview.asp?c=47697

Many have noticed the interest generated by Fr. Malloy’s recent letter to the editor published in the San Francisco Chronicle. So, it seems like a good time to reiterate official Church position on abortion: “Therefore, by the authority which Christ conferred upon Peter and his Successors, in communion with the Bishops—who on various occasions have condemned abortion and who in the aforementioned consultation, albeit dispersed throughout the world, have shown unanimous agreement concerning this doctrine—I declare that direct abortion, that is, abortion willed as an end or as a means, always constitutes a grave moral disorder, since it is the deliberate killing of an innocent human being. This doctrine is based upon the natural law and upon the written Word of God, is transmitted by the Church’s Tradition and taught by the ordinary and universal Magisterium. . . No circumstance, no purpose, no law whatsoever can ever make licit an act which is intrinsically illicit, since it is contrary to the Law of God which is written in every human heart, knowable by reason itself, and proclaimed by the Church.” -Pope John Paul II; “Evangelium Vitae,”paragraphs 57 & 62, March 25, 1995. (emphasis added).

Thousands march around Denver Planned Parenthood

http://blog.christianitytoday.com/ctpolitics/2008/08/thousands_march.html

An industry of racism
By Alveda King

http://www.denverpost.com/guestcommentary/ci_10268350

Obama and Democrats Slap Archbishop Chaput
8/24/2008 12:17:00 PM
By www.thecatholicthing.org -Austin Ruse

http://catholiccitizens.org/press/pressview.asp?c=47733

Archbishop scolds pro-choice Biden
Valerie Richardson and Julia Duin
Tuesday, August 26, 2008
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/aug/26/archbishop-condemns-bidens-pro-choice-stance/


85 posted on 08/26/2008 1:22:56 PM PDT by victim soul
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To: NYer

Nice. Way to go, Cardinal Egan. Only one thing left to do:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y75OwTuQpqI


86 posted on 08/26/2008 1:27:26 PM PDT by Claud
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To: HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
It's a start. A bit soft IMO.

There are about 190 dioceses in the US IIRC? We've had 3 or 4 Bishops responses hit the national press.

I'm hoping what someone previously commented comes true; about the sleeping giant being roused from a very long slumber.

87 posted on 08/26/2008 1:28:25 PM PDT by cpforlife.org (A Catholic Respect Life Curriculum is available FREE at CpForLife.org)
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To: Antoninus

She has excommunicated herself ipso facto.

She should refrain from taking The Eucharist until she goes to Confession and makes a firm promise of amendment.

Just like any other Catholic who is living in mortal sin.

AS a public figure, I believe her penance should be to make a public statement to the errors of her ways.

She has arrogantly and scandalously continued to lead many people into an occasion of sin by her continued resolve to protect NARAl, abortionists, and population controller Planned Parenthood.

Did she make her statements to Browkaw Sunday before or after Holy Mass? Egads!!


88 posted on 08/26/2008 1:30:02 PM PDT by victim soul
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To: Jim Robinson; Lead Moderator; Admin Moderator; Sidebar Moderator

This belongs in News/Activism not Religion!

Please move it where it belongs, and where more people will see it.


89 posted on 08/26/2008 1:32:28 PM PDT by cpforlife.org (A Catholic Respect Life Curriculum is available FREE at CpForLife.org)
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To: quadrant

I think you can blame Father Drinan and Charlie Curran for her weasely ways of thought.

What kind of woman encourages other women to kill their children so that they can have a career?

As though women can’t do both - be a mother and be a part of the work force?

Women and their children deserve better than abortion. So does our nation.


90 posted on 08/26/2008 1:35:20 PM PDT by victim soul
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To: NYer

Botox sure is lucky the Church did away with that “Burning at the Stake” business.


91 posted on 08/26/2008 1:35:22 PM PDT by Rome2000 (Peace is not an option)
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To: NYer
Front page of the USCCB.

Cardinal Justin Rigali, Philadelphia
Bishop William E. Lori of Bridgeport, Conn

92 posted on 08/26/2008 1:39:32 PM PDT by Jaded (does it really need a sarcasm tag?)
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To: netmilsmom
Dear netmilsmom,

“If the statement holds water then when she gets back to Washington DC and attends mass, she will publicly be denied the Holy Eucharist.”

Unfortunately, Cardinal Egan is the Archbishop of New York, not the Archbishop of Washington or of San Francisco. He has no authority to prevent Ms. Pelosi from receiving the Blessed Sacrament in either her home archdiocese, San Francisco, or the archdiocese in which she works, Washington, DC.

Nonetheless, it was a loud, public, pointed, clear rebuke offered by the cardinal, and I, for one, appreciate it greatly.


sitetest

93 posted on 08/26/2008 1:41:43 PM PDT by sitetest (If Roe is not overturned, no unborn child will ever be protected in law.)
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To: Antoninus
Dear Antoninus,

From what I've read, Cardinal Egan was displeased that Mr. Giuliani received Communion at the pope's Mass in New York. Apparently, there had been a private conversation that had ended with the conclusion that Mr. Giuliani should refrain from the reception of the Blessed Sacrament.

I think that Cardinal Egan felt that he'd been made a fool of. He is a proud man, and may now be taking a more jaundiced view of “private arrangements” with pro-abortion “Catholic” politicians.


sitetest

94 posted on 08/26/2008 1:55:01 PM PDT by sitetest (If Roe is not overturned, no unborn child will ever be protected in law.)
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To: NYer

Thank you for your beautiful statement, your Eminence.

I will keep you in my prayers tonight.

JLL


95 posted on 08/26/2008 2:20:33 PM PDT by Juana la Loca
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To: Ann Archy
Thanks!

What I find most interesting about Egan's comments is that there is almost nothing "religious" about them at all. He doesn't even use the word "God" anywhere in his statement.

Anyone who dares to defend that they may be legitimately killed because another human being “chooses” to do so or for any other equally ridiculous reason should not be providing leadership in a civilized democracy worthy of the name.

He's not even calling her out for her misrepresentations of Catholic doctrine. This is a remarkable, brutally clear statement that Nancy Pelosi isn't even fit to serve in any capacity in a civilized nation.

96 posted on 08/26/2008 2:29:24 PM PDT by Alberta's Child (I'm out on the outskirts of nowhere . . . with ghosts on my trail, chasing me there.)
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To: y6162; Truth Defender
I don’t think the church is a she...is she? I would say ..respected..it should stick

Yes, the Church is a "She", The Church is the Bride of Christ and Holy Mother to the faithful.

97 posted on 08/26/2008 2:36:27 PM PDT by murphE (I refuse to choose evil, even if it is the lesser of two)
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To: NYer

Heard it on Rush. Glad to see it in print. I brilliant response to a terrible remark made by the pelosi.


98 posted on 08/26/2008 2:58:25 PM PDT by LauraJean (sometimes I win sometimes I donate to the equine benevolent society)
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To: NYer

Thank you, Archbishop Eagan!


99 posted on 08/26/2008 3:08:31 PM PDT by fetal heart beats by 21st day (Defending human life is not a federalist issue. It is the business of all of humanity.)
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To: sitetest

Dear sitetest,

I have the feeling she is guilty of hearing what she wants to hear. I, too, have been guilty of that in some areas. This, however, isn’t one of them.

Sincerely,

Me


100 posted on 08/26/2008 3:08:33 PM PDT by Constitutions Grandchild
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