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Apocalypse soon
SignOnSanDiego ^ | October 4, 2008 | Sandi Dolbee

Posted on 10/07/2008 8:41:53 PM PDT by Alex Murphy

The pages of failed end-of-the-world prophecies could make up a whole new testament. Now there's the Rev. David Jeremiah, an East County mega-pastor and TV evangelist who says the end is coming, in the words of a familiar church song, “soon and very soon.”

In a new book that hit bookstores this week, Jeremiah offers 10 “prophetic clues” he says point to an imminent conclusion many Christians have clung to for 2,000 years – the Rapture (when the faithful will be summoned instantly into Heaven), followed by the Tribulation (a seven-year period of turmoil), Armageddon (the final battle of good versus evil) and the Second Coming of Jesus (to reign on Earth).

Jeremiah doesn't set a date in “What in the World Is Going On?” (Thomas Nelson; $22.99). But his urgency is clear: “His return is close at hand,” he writes, adding that Christians should be motivated “as never before to live in readiness.”

“I have no intention of setting any dates or saying this is when this is going to happen,” Jeremiah says, settling back on a couch in his office at Turning Point, his international television and radio ministry headquartered in Lakeside.

“All I'm saying is some of the things that the word of God prophesied would take place as we near this time are happening in ways you cannot contradict.”

The 67-year-old senior pastor of Shadow Mountain Community Church in El Cajon, where he preaches to 7,000 people at weekend services, says he was motivated to write this book after so many people kept questioning him about world events.

He reached out to other biblical prophecy scholars for their thoughts. Among them was Tim LaHaye, co-author of the best-selling “Left Behind” series of Christian apocalyptic novels. In 1981, Jeremiah followed LaHaye as senior pastor of Scott Memorial Baptist Church, which later became Shadow Mountain.

The 10 signs Jeremiah settled on range from the emergence of Israel as the dominant country-of-residence for Jews and the rise in power of Russia and Iran to the world's reliance on Middle Eastern oil and the coming together of countries under the European Union.

“I'm not a sensationalist,” says Jeremiah, a grandfather and two-time cancer survivor who is a well-known speaker at evangelical venues like the Billy Graham Training Center.

“I would be the last person in the world to try to draw sensationalist truths from the Scripture,” he adds. “You can get a crowd if you know how to frame your stuff, but I'm past all that. I don't need to do that. But what I do know is this: This is a different day unlike anything that I've ever known, unlike anything the world has ever known. So what does that mean?”

What it means for him is that conversion efforts need to be jump-started like a battery in a long-idled sedan.

“We've forgotten that there's an urgency about what we've been called to do,” he says. He leans forward on the couch, as if to emphasize his impatience. “I think it puts an urgency and a seriousness into our walk.” Jeremiah is particularly tough on Islam in his book. Islamic terrorism is among the signs he says are pointing toward the end times.

“One of the most baffling and unsettling puzzles about Islam is the constant contention on the part of some Muslim leaders that they are a peace-loving people,” he writes. “Yet even as they make the claim, Islamic terrorists continue to brutally murder any person or group with whom they find fault.”

Jeremiah does not believe Allah and God are the same. He also believes that Islam hates Jews and Christians.

“Experts say that 15 to 20 percent of Muslims are radical enough to strap a bomb on their bodies in order to kills Christians and Jews,” he writes. “If this number is accurate, it means about 300 million Muslims are willing to die in order to take you and me down.”

His solution: convert Muslims to Christianity.

Jeremiah says he is not trying to be incendiary; he's just being true to his convictions. “I'm not intolerant,” he insists. “I just believe totally what I believe, and if I have to go along in order to get along, water down what I believe, I'll never do that.”

But Khaleel Mohammed, associate professor of religious studies at San Diego State University and a voice for moderate Islam, says Jeremiah isn't helping matters.

“It's not constructive in any way for the Christian or the Muslim,” Mohammed says. “Everything he is saying is so divisive.”

Mohammed also thinks Jeremiah's portrait is one-sided; after all, thousands of Muslim civilians have died in the American-led invasion of Iraq.

“I'm not denying there are Christians and Muslims agitating against each other, but I don't think it's religious,” Mohammed says. Still, he adds, the future lies in interfaith cooperation, a move the “old guard” on both sides is resisting. “They are just fighting against the tide. ... Among Muslims, you'll find preachers who are as nonsensical as Jeremiah.”

Scholars who study end-times prophecies say Jeremiah's book, and others like it, should be handled with care.

“I would say the odds are enormous, if not overwhelming, that he, like every other Christian prophet over the last 2,000 years, will be wrong,” says Richard Landes, associate professor of history at Boston University and director of the Center for Millennial Studies.

Jews and Muslims also have their doomsday beliefs, Landes says, but apocalypticism has been particularly rampant in Christianity. It was, after all, Jesus himself who forewarned his followers in the New Testament to “keep watch” and “be ready” for his return.

Ever since, Christians have watched for signs of the Second Coming, scanning the Bible for clues and codes, says Jon Stone, a religious studies professor at Cal State Long Beach.

Stone acknowledges there is a built-in audience for books like Jeremiah's. “I think people like to be in on a secret, to know something other people don't know,” he explains. “This is, by far, the biggest secret in terms of religious things.”

Jeremiah is planning a series of sermons at Shadow Mountain this fall on living with confidence in a chaotic world. He plans to tell the congregation, among other things, that this is the time for the faithful to hang together, to focus on the church and the Bible.

Jeremiah says biblical prophecy isn't a popular pulpit topic. “A lot of buddies of mine say they don't ever preach on prophecy because they think it's irrelevant. ... Well, if they read the Bible, they will find out that if you study prophecy, it gives you incredible insight as to how you should live your life today.”

He resists efforts to be coaxed into being more specific about when all this is going to happen. It's not about that, he repeats. “It is about the awareness of what the events that are happening in the world today mean and how we can look at it through the third lens of the Bible and make more sense of it than we would otherwise.”


TOPICS: Apologetics; Evangelical Christian; Islam; Ministry/Outreach
KEYWORDS: endtimes
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To: Marysecretary
The word Rapture isn’t in the Bible. It talks about a taking away, which is the same thing.

Taking away by whom or unto whom? Christ did not promise anybody He was going to take anybody away.

151 posted on 10/08/2008 6:27:22 PM PDT by Just mythoughts (Isa.3:4 And I will give children to be their princes, and babes shall rule over them.)
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To: Marysecretary
Depends on when you believe we’ll be zapped. I think Christians WILL go through much of the tribulation. I’m not a pretrib believer, but a pre-wrath believer. We will NOT go through the wrath of God, but we may go through the wrath of anti-christ.

What is the tribulation? IF as Christ said I have foretold you all things would that not include how to NOT be taken in by or taken over by a tribulation. And IF as Christians we are followers of Christ and He set the standard and was completely and totally innocent yet gave His life for to all who would life eternal, would His followers be hunting for the 'safe' escapes. Didn't Christ say I give you power over your enemies?

Christ also said that *time* meaning the length of time allotted for the tribulation would be cut short. So as this time is reference to a woman in labor once that final stages begins only an intervention with medication slows it or stops it. Things will move very quickly once that time begins.

152 posted on 10/08/2008 6:33:44 PM PDT by Just mythoughts (Isa.3:4 And I will give children to be their princes, and babes shall rule over them.)
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To: Marysecretary
And the mark is already in process of being created and used on people and animals. It’s interesting, even if a bit scary, to read about it and know it’s happening even now.

The mark already exists, it is what is in the mind that leads the peoples to received that mark. Christ called it deception.

153 posted on 10/08/2008 6:43:41 PM PDT by Just mythoughts (Isa.3:4 And I will give children to be their princes, and babes shall rule over them.)
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To: Just mythoughts; Star Traveler; Lee N. Field; Alex Murphy; Gamecock
The disciples were of Judah ...

Are you talking about The Twelve? Where does the Bible teach this? I can’t seem to find anywhere where any of the apostles’ tribal affiliation is mentioned (except Paul). Since at least some of the apostles were from the region around Galilee ("of the Gentiles", cf. Mark 1:16), it unlikely there were all from Judah.

It’s pretty clear just from reading the NT (and the OT as well) that the word "Israel" often means more than just the northern tribes. You apparently don’t have a position on that truth. The entire nation was often referred to as "the house of Israel" (Ex. 16:31). This was the common usage at the time of Christ. When speaking to the woman of Canaan, Jesus told her, But He answered and said, "I was not sent except to the lost sheep of the house of Israel." (Matt. 15:24). Jesus was ministering first to His Jewish brethren ("the house of Israel"), from which He called the Twelve and others, and not primarily to the surrounding gentile communities.

As much as I would like to engage you on this matter, serious discussion is difficult with this sort of defective starting point on your part.

154 posted on 10/08/2008 7:47:17 PM PDT by topcat54 ("The selling of bad beer is a crime against Christian love.")
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To: topcat54
Are you talking about The Twelve? Where does the Bible teach this? I can’t seem to find anywhere where any of the apostles’ tribal affiliation is mentioned (except Paul). Since at least some of the apostles were from the region around Galilee ("of the Gentiles", cf. Mark 1:16), it unlikely there were all from Judah.

I should have written House of Judah meaning NOT of the House of Israel.

It’s pretty clear just from reading the NT (and the OT as well) that the word "Israel" often means more than just the northern tribes. You apparently don’t have a position on that truth. The entire nation was often referred to as "the house of Israel" (Ex. 16:31). This was the common usage at the time of Christ. When speaking to the woman of Canaan, Jesus told her, But He answered and said, "I was not sent except to the lost sheep of the house of Israel." (Matt. 15:24). Jesus was ministering first to His Jewish brethren ("the house of Israel"), from which He called the Twelve and others, and not primarily to the surrounding gentile communities.

The word Israel was first used when Jacob was renamed. Christ's usage of the 'lost sheep' of the House of Israel refers to a specific time after the civil war the two houses split and were identified as two different kingdoms. House of Israel and the House of Judah. One of the punishments for the whoring after other gods by the House of Israel would be they would forget who they were. And they are also called Ephraim as he was the largest of the ten tribes sent north to the Assyrian king. They have NOT returned and will not return until Christ Himself rejoins those two sticks. And the majority of them still do not know who they are, they are stilllllll lost. Christ identified who he was talking about when he used the term 'lost sheep'.

This is not about my point or having a point, it is to understand why the first instruction Christ would give to His disciples would be to go but to those lost sheep of the House of Israel.

When Christ gave this instruction these people He chose to be His disciples did not say Master where do we find these lost sheep of the House of Israel? So how did they know what and who Christ was talking about??? And why would Christ waste the time and words over a very short 3 1/2 year time frame of teaching, to make it the first instruction????

I can't take seriously people who downplay even the very WORDS that came from the mouth of Christ.

As much as I would like to engage you on this matter, serious discussion is difficult with this sort of defective starting point on your part.

OK.

155 posted on 10/08/2008 8:41:14 PM PDT by Just mythoughts (Isa.3:4 And I will give children to be their princes, and babes shall rule over them.)
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To: Just mythoughts

They’re planting, for now, microchips into animals and some people are having them done for information about their health conditions. What’s to stop them from planting them in people without their permission some day? We have to be aware...


156 posted on 10/08/2008 9:39:28 PM PDT by Marysecretary (.GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL)
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To: Marysecretary
No, it’s not egotism. We’re watching the signs of the times and reading prophecy which SEEMS to indicate to us that the end times are here or near.

Perhaps egotism isn't the right word. I guess temporocentrism is more accurate. It just seems anyone interested in this topic always sees the end approaching rapidly.

It's like reincarnation buffs. They always seem to say they'd been born previously as Joan of Arc or Napolean. Never a postal clerk. I think seeing the end as near is simply more interesting.

157 posted on 10/09/2008 2:12:57 AM PDT by SupplySider
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To: Marysecretary
They’re planting, for now, microchips into animals and some people are having them done for information about their health conditions. What’s to stop them from planting them in people without their permission some day? We have to be aware...

Yes I do know microchips are being implanted in animals and humans. But the device does not make the mind think one way or another. Lets look at what is a great deception getting planted around this globe say the 'green' movement. Now this movement has become a religious wave and the object of worship is NOT the Creator but His creation and the ideology is claimed by these prophets of green they can control climate changes.

Their religion is promoted through the assistance of the four established institutions of society. Political, education, economic and last and certainly not least religious. How long do you think it will take to have the majority of this earth willing to join the 'green' club? Whatever reason, be it a political, educational, economic or religious motive allll entities lead to the same end a Godless society by the establishment of that system whispered into the woman's ear in the beginning, "For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

The movement has permeated our whole society and to speak against it gets one 'marked' as to be against a good and noble cause of perfecting our climate while protecting our environment over greed and exploitation of the earth and its creatures. The movement is against US our standard of living and what we stand for and not about a prevention of climate change or environmental protection.

No I am not claiming the green movement is the mark, what I am doing is using it, the movement as an analogy as to what kind of club/system is being described wherein to participate, either out of fear or lack of God's knowledge people willingly participate.

Somewhere in this thread someone spoke of taking the mark to feed a family, which reminded me of what God had Amos His prophet to pen. Amos 8 the whole chapter but specifically verse 11.

Behold, the days come, saith the Lord GOD, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the LORD:

158 posted on 10/09/2008 2:36:04 AM PDT by Just mythoughts (Isa.3:4 And I will give children to be their princes, and babes shall rule over them.)
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To: topcat54
“last trumpet” of 1 Cor. 15. Or that the “last trumpet” of 1 Cor. 15 is really not the “last trumpet” because they are plainly other “last trumpets” in the book of Revelation (which supposedly all happens after the “rapture”, according to the popular theory).

There is no 'last' trumpet in 1 Cor. 15...It is the 'last trump' of a trumpet...The noise a trumpet makes is obviously a 'trump'...

It's no wonder you got things all messed up...You claim trump means trumpet...Obviously not...Doesn't make much sense in English, or Greek...'The last trumpet of the trumpet'???

Hey, if you try to discern what it actually says instead of what you'd like it to say, you'd get a far better understanding...When you claim it says the 'last trumpet of the trumpet', you're not giving the Holy Spirit much to work with...

159 posted on 10/09/2008 6:29:32 AM PDT by Iscool (If Obama becomes the President, it will be an Obama-nation)
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To: topcat54
All orthodox Christians agree that at Christ’s return, all the saints are resurrected and receive their glorified bodies.

I suspect such are in short supply here.

160 posted on 10/09/2008 8:10:27 AM PDT by Lee N. Field (What part of "and I will raise him up on the _last_ day" is hard to understand?)
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To: Iscool; Lee N. Field
There is no 'last' trumpet in 1 Cor. 15...It is the 'last trump' of a trumpet...The noise a trumpet makes is obviously a 'trump'...

I take it you didn't actually look at the Greek, and are just relying on the archaic language of the KJV to invent a doctrine.

If you are happy doing theology this way, then go for it. There’s nothing else I can say if you won’t listen to reasonable arguments from Scripture.

161 posted on 10/09/2008 8:20:18 AM PDT by topcat54 ("The selling of bad beer is a crime against Christian love.")
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To: Just mythoughts; Star Traveler; Lee N. Field; Alex Murphy; Gamecock
I should have written House of Judah meaning NOT of the House of Israel.

Doesn’t matter. The idea that all the disciples where from Judah is still not in the Bible. I'm not sure what driving this extra-biblical hobby horse of yours.

162 posted on 10/09/2008 8:28:58 AM PDT by topcat54 ("The selling of bad beer is a crime against Christian love.")
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To: topcat54
I take it you didn't actually look at the Greek, and are just relying on the archaic language of the KJV to invent a doctrine.

And whose version of the Greek are you referring to???

The King James translators looked at all the Greek that is available...You got something new???

163 posted on 10/09/2008 9:02:24 AM PDT by Iscool (If Obama becomes the President, it will be an Obama-nation)
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To: Alex Murphy

There is no physical place called Armageddon. The correct meaning of the word is the sorrow of King Josiah.


164 posted on 10/09/2008 9:05:04 AM PDT by Hoodat (Obama's only connection to the descendants of American Slaves is that his muslim ancestors sold them)
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To: Iscool; Lee N. Field
And whose version of the Greek are you referring to???

It doesn't matter. There is no significant textual variance in the verses in question.

The King James translators looked at all the Greek that is available...You got something new???

KJV English was well suited for how the language was spoken 400 years ago. We do not speak that brand of English for the most part. The authors would be horrified to find out the erroneous interpretations that have suggested in modern days based on faulty understanding of KJV English.

That is why reliable modern translations, Like the New KJV, have modernized (corrected) these types of words and phrases. But apparently you wish to cling to unsupportable theories. Have fun.

165 posted on 10/09/2008 9:21:46 AM PDT by topcat54 ("The selling of bad beer is a crime against Christian love.")
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To: Hoodat
Huh? Suggest you get a different dictionary.

"Har Magedon, the End of the Millenium"

166 posted on 10/09/2008 9:28:18 AM PDT by Lee N. Field (What part of "and I will raise him up on the _last_ day" is hard to understand?)
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To: Lee N. Field

Perhaps you should employ one yourself. The literal translation is Mount of Meggido. There is no such place. However, Meggido is where King Josiah was killed. The Mount part represents the nationwide sorrow that erupted after the passing of Israel’s most righteous king.


167 posted on 10/09/2008 9:44:25 AM PDT by Hoodat (Obama's only connection to the descendants of American Slaves is that his muslim ancestors sold them)
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To: topcat54
KJV English was well suited for how the language was spoken 400 years ago. We do not speak that brand of English for the most part. The authors would be horrified to find out the erroneous interpretations that have suggested in modern days based on faulty understanding of KJV English.

That is why reliable modern translations, Like the New KJV, have modernized (corrected) these types of words and phrases. But apparently you wish to cling to unsupportable theories. Have fun.

I don't know if you are trying to fool yourself or someone else...

1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

You see any archaic words in there??? NO??? Your arguement just left, without you...

BTW, the NKJB says exactly the same thing...

168 posted on 10/09/2008 10:10:59 AM PDT by Iscool (If Obama becomes the President, it will be an Obama-nation)
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To: XeniaSt; Star Traveler; Lee N. Field; Alex Murphy; Gamecock
Paul warns against the pride of a Gentile follower of Yah'shua.

It’s too bad that historical revisionism gets used as a club against fellow Christians.

For 2000 years most Jewish converts to Jesus Christ have had no problem identifying themselves as Christians and members of His Church. That is until a small sub-group of believers, some being ethnic/cultural Jews, decided that a new name was needed for their sub-group. The invented the belief system of Messiah Judaism and started calling them selves Messianic Jews (even though most the adherents to this new fangled sect are not ethnic or cultural Jews). They gave the impression that somehow they (and they alone) were getting back to authentic, first century Christianity (oops, I meant) Messianic Judaism. They utilized many techniques to give this impression, such as the prominent use of those annoying transliterations of names from one language to another. (Question, do Chinese-speaking Messiah Jews transliterate “Yah'shua” and "Sha-ul" into Mandarin?)

And so, some of them apparently like to castigate anyone who questions the theological presuppositions and foundations of their innovations by labeling them prideful, anti-Semitic, and other similar unfaltering names, perhaps not realizing how prideful they themselves can appear by such tactics.

And so, rather than build up the one new man that Paul speaks of in Ephesians 2, the commonwealth made up of Jews and gentiles together without regard to past religious distinctions, we have this group of self-described Messianic Jews (mainly gentiles) who are attempting to rebuild the religious wall that Paul says has been torn down. Some of them act as if those Christians down through the ages (whether Jews or gentile) who have wished to be identified as the true sons of Abraham, the spiritual Israel of the Bible, are somehow encroaching upon their sacred territory. They have invented concepts like "gentile Christianity" to berate faithful followers of Our Lord down though the centuries.

They seem to forget the words of Paul, "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise." (Gal. 3:28,29)

169 posted on 10/09/2008 10:42:13 AM PDT by topcat54 ("The selling of bad beer is a crime against Christian love.")
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To: Hoodat

I’m guessing you didn’t read the linked document.


170 posted on 10/09/2008 10:45:07 AM PDT by Lee N. Field (What part of "and I will raise him up on the _last_ day" is hard to understand?)
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To: Iscool; Lee N. Field
You see any archaic words in there??? NO??? Your arguement just left, without you...

Nobody except The Donald and Bridge players use the word "trump" anymore.

The Greek of that passage literally says, "... in the last trumpet (noun) he shall be trumpeting (verb) ..." which has been rendered in various ways by various translators. It could just as easily be translated, "... at the last trumpet which shall be trumpeting ..." It’s a matter of emphasis. The sound will be unmistakable and unavoidable. It is the last sound anyone will hear before being ushered in the presence of a Holy God for judgment day.

171 posted on 10/09/2008 10:56:08 AM PDT by topcat54 ("The selling of bad beer is a crime against Christian love.")
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To: topcat54

Resolved: the dispensational exegesis of any given passage is best ignored unless an amil/postmil/historic premil scholar can be found who agrees with it.


172 posted on 10/09/2008 11:13:52 AM PDT by Lee N. Field (Larkin. Lindsay. LaHaye. Co-incidence? I thnk not.....)
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To: topcat54
It could just as easily be translated, "... at the last trumpet which shall be trumpeting ...

By you maybe...But that's not what the verse says...

But more accurately, it would be (if someone was so inclined to change it like you do) 'the last trumpeting of the trumpet'...It speaks of the last noise a trumpet makes, NOT the last trumpet...

If you can't expound on what the verse actually says, you are devoid of the meaning of the verse...

173 posted on 10/09/2008 4:26:11 PM PDT by Iscool (If Obama becomes the President, it will be an Obama-nation)
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To: Marysecretary

I was under the impression that children under a certain age would be raptured and then grow to maturity during the millennium. They would have a chance to accept Christ or reject him like everyone else.


174 posted on 10/10/2008 8:28:19 AM PDT by Niuhuru (Fine, I'm A Racist and Proud Of It!)
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To: Niuhuru
I was under the impression that children under a certain age would be raptured and then grow to maturity during the millennium. They would have a chance to accept Christ or reject him like everyone else.

Chapter and verse? There is nothing like that implied anywhere in any scripture (well, Biblical scripture).
175 posted on 10/10/2008 8:37:45 AM PDT by aruanan
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To: aruanan

“I was under the impression that children under a certain age would be raptured and then grow to maturity during the millennium.”

Where is there anything in Scripture to support a Rapture? Only in the minds of those who would like to think they will be taken out. Noah was taken through, not out. Same for us. Those taken out were taken to judgement. Same is true for those “taken out” in Matthew to support the “Left Behind” series of LeHay & Jenkins.


176 posted on 10/10/2008 8:50:38 AM PDT by GGpaX4DumpedTea
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To: Niuhuru

Well, I’m no expert. I’m sure that babies born before the rapture would go up. I can’t say about the ones born afterwards. I really don’t know.


177 posted on 10/10/2008 9:10:24 AM PDT by Marysecretary (.GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL)
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To: Iscool
By you maybe...But that's not what the verse says...

That's exactly what the Greek says. The adjective "last" is used to modify the noun "trumpet", not the verb.

Check out the Greek and see for yourself.

178 posted on 10/10/2008 9:35:52 AM PDT by topcat54 ("The selling of bad beer is a crime against Christian love.")
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To: GGpaX4DumpedTea
Where is there anything in Scripture to support a Rapture? Only in the minds of those who would like to think they will be taken out. Noah was taken through, not out. Same for us. Those taken out were taken to judgement. Same is true for those “taken out” in Matthew to support the “Left Behind” series of LeHay & Jenkins.

Yep. And when Jesus explained the parable of the tares, he said the angels were sent throughout the world to gather the evil and burn it, leaving the good in place.
179 posted on 10/10/2008 10:05:08 AM PDT by aruanan
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To: topcat54
G4536
σάλπιγξ
salpigx
sal'-pinx
Perhaps from G4535 (through the idea of quavering or reverberation); a trumpet: - trump (-et).

Whether you call it a trumpet or a trump, makes no difference as long as you know what's being discussed...

We're talking about the 'last' of the sounds being trumpeted...

1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

The trump, the 'sound' will be the last sound heard...

The trumpet in this verse is a verb which combined with the others in the group are as follows...

G4537
σαλπίζω
salpizō
sal-pid'-zo
From G4536; to trumpet, that is, sound a blast (literally or figuratively): - (which are yet to) sound (a trumpet).

So to summarize, in the GREEK, you get this:

1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

This has nothing to with your idea of the 'last trumpet will sound'...

Trumpet in the New Testament has little to do with the Hebrew translated trumpet of the Old Testament...There commonality is of producing a loud sound...None of the Angels in Revelation are blowing tuba's or French horns...

In Revelation the emphasis is on the Angels and their number and then the sound they are making...

Rev 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

AND

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign forever and ever.

There's the seventh 'trumpet'...And for those of you who somehow reject the Millenial reign of Jesus Christ, you can see the kindgoms of THIS world become the kingdoms of our Lord...Jesus will reign on earth for a thousand years...

180 posted on 10/11/2008 2:01:37 AM PDT by Iscool (If Obama becomes the President, it will be an Obama-nation)
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To: Marysecretary
Neither really do I.
181 posted on 10/11/2008 7:30:13 AM PDT by Niuhuru (Fine, I'm A Racist and Proud Of It!)
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To: Iscool
Whether you call it a trumpet or a trump, makes no difference as long as you know what's being discussed...

What is being discussed is the last trumpet being sounded at Christ’s return for the physical resurrection and general judgment of all men.

Certain futurists have devised a scheme where they need to invent several “last trumpets” in order to fit their theory. The language of 1 Cor. 15 does not support the notion.

We're talking about the 'last' of the sounds being trumpeted...

That may be what you are talking about, but the Greek of 1 Cor. 15 is not talking about any such thing. As I made clear before, you have failed miserably to properly analyze the Greek in the verse, because you are starting with your faulty understanding of KJV language.

182 posted on 10/13/2008 7:08:21 AM PDT by topcat54 ("The selling of bad beer is a crime against Christian love.")
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