The Messianic Jew & Charismatic Dispensationalism

The Messianic Literary Corner ^ | 11/30/2008 | Marshall Beeber

[mbeeber]

	The Messianic Jew & Charismatic Dispensationalism by Marshall Beeber In the nineteenth century a theological revolution called "Dispensationalism" rightly outlined the "Biblical Historical Perspective", thereby giving mankind a clearer picture of how God has provided and continues to provide salvation to man throughout history.  By acknowledgement of this perspective, an accord between Hebrew Old Covenant and New Covenant prophecy was forged, sweeping away many of the contradictions that divided Christian and Orthodox Jewish prophetic viewpoints.  Dispensationalists became God's instrument of change in the nineteenth and twentieth centuries,  leading the way in promoting the support of the establishment of the state of Israel and bringing to light the prophetic signposts for the "End of this Age". But when Dispensationalists took a theological stand against the excesses they found in contemporary "Charismatic" Christianity, they "Quenched the Holy Spirit" by denying the validity of most Charismatic Christian spiritual experiences.  The result of this schism today is an eschatology shared by both Fundamentalist and Charismatic Protestant Denominations, but a sharp disagreement on the exercise of the gifts of the Holy Spirit. The Dispensationalists claim they are protecting the kingdom of God from spiritual frauds and false theologies, while the Charismatics believe they have tapped into the "true baptism" of spiritual experience.  Both sides have valid arguments as well as excesses.  The Dispensationalists often times exude an overly dry manner in their presentation of scripture and worship, while the Charismatics often exude a "heart first" approach, which lends themselves susceptible to erroneous doctrine presented in an exuberant fashion. Today most Messianic Jewish fellowships and congregations are disciples of one of the two movements mentioned.  As prophetic events move us closer to Messiah Yeshua's (Christ Jesus) return, believers are reminded of the Hebrew prophet Joel's promise of "prophecy, dreams and visions" among the elect of Israel before the great and terrible "Day of the Lord".1  Dispensationalists believe these occurrences were only present in the times immediately following the "Day of Pentecost" and will be present during the times just preceding "Judgment Day", where Charismatics believe these expressions of the Spirit were present from the Day of Pentecost continuously to the present day.2 Nevertheless, as the great "Day of Judgment" approaches, both Fundamentalist and Charismatic Christians should have more to agree upon than disagree.  When Dispensationalists accept they are living in the days just preceding the "Second Coming of Christ", they must also accept the very teachings they originally postulated. So as the "Day of the Lord" draws near, even Dispensationalists must accept those movements of the Spirit prophesied by Joel and recited by Peter on the Day of Pentecost. I believe Messianic Jews (Hebrew Christians) and Gentile Christians from Fundamentalist, Charismatic and Reformed backgrounds will soon come to an understanding that events much greater than themselves will soon shape their understanding of the Lord's will in regards to commonly held beliefs and attitudes.  We will all witness the same wonderful signs, tribulations and persecutions, whereby our love for the Lord Yeshua and one another will be tried and refined.  It is then that Jewish and Gentile believers in Christ will finally be united in purpose and strength as we all await the "Coming of the Lord". 1. Joel 2:28-29 2. Acts 2:16-18 (Additional studies and commentaries are requested. Feel free to email MLC your materials for posting)

[topcat54]

BTW, I would recommend you get a hold of a nice book called Judaism is not Jewish: A friendly critique of the Messianic Movement by Baruch Maoz. Maoz is both Reformed and of Jewish heritage. You migth also look for material by Steve Schlissel on the subject of Jews and gentiles and the Church of God from a Reformed perspective.

[onedoug]

Why is a so-called messianic jew not a christian? Or, if supposedly (s)he is christian, how can (s)he claim to be a Jew?

[Lee N. Field]

Not sure you were watching, but it came up in a recent thread: "The Absurdity of Preterist Replacementarianism"

We (IMHO) never got a good answer from the individual that was pushing that idea.

[Uri’el-2012]

Why is a so-called messianic jew not a christian? Or, if supposedly (s)he is christian, how can (s)he claim to be a Jew?

Is the Messiah Jewish ?

or is he Greek ?

shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach Adonai

[onedoug]

I’m with One God and not into polytheism at all. Thanks.

[topcat54]

Is the Messiah Jewish ? or is he Greek ?

Still not a very good answer.

Christian refers to Messiah’s people, not Messiah. Messiah was the savior of the world, not merely Israel or the Jewish people. The apostle Paul, the Jewish missionary to the gentiles, tells us that there is neither Jew nor Greek distinction in the Body of Christ. To categorize the body along racial lines defies the teaching of Paul and the other apostles, as well as Christ, "And other sheep I have which are not of this fold; them also I must bring, and they will hear My voice; and there will be one flock and one shepherd." (John 10:16) Apparently Jesus forgot to add "with two different names".

Additionally, in God’s sovereign plan to save the nations He brought Messiah into a mixed culture. The language of the NT is Greek, not Hebrew. Jesus is in every place referred to as christos, not moshiach. Christos is the biblical transliteration of the way Jesus is referred to in the Bible. That irony is lost of some folks who get a kick out of transliterating Hebrew words for us.

The Greek language was one of God’s ways of bringing true biblical ecumenism into His body, the Church. It is baffling that after 2000 years we have a subgroup of Christians trying to impose racial distinctions within the body for no good reason. And the irony is that many of the neo-judaizers are gentile by heritage.

Besides being offense to real cultural Jews, the term "messianic Jew" most inappropriate to the body of Christ. You have many people claiming to be messianic Jews who are really gentiles. And at its heart it is fundamentally divisive and sends mixed signals to those both with and without of the Church.

[Uri’el-2012]

I’m with One God and not into polytheism at all. Thanks.

Yah'shua answered, .. 'HEAR, O ISRAEL! THE LORD OUR GOD IS ONE LORD;

shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach Adonai

[xzins]

Messiah = Christ

Messianic = Christian

[Uri’el-2012]

Messiah = Christ

Messianic = Christian

Yes..

shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach Adonai

[topcat54]

Dispensationalists became God's instrument of change in the nineteenth and twentieth centuries, leading the way in promoting the support of the establishment of the state of Israel and bringing to light the prophetic signposts for the "End of this Age".

Indeed, many dispensationalists advocated a "hands off" policy wrt Hitler’s Germany and the Jewish people, believing that divine wrath against the Jewish people should not be opposed. These same dispensationalists saw Mussolini as the anti-Christ and knew they were in the "last days". This is documented in Armageddon Now by Dwight Wilson.

Many dispensationalists today are at the forefront of bring unconverted Jews from places like Russia and Ethiopia back into the land of Israel knowing full well that two thirds of them and their descendents will be slaughtered in the futurist "great tribulation".

Many dispensationalists believe that the "apple of God’s eye" will yet suffer divine wrath in the not too distant future, after the Church has been raptured to safety.

Some dispensationalists advocate a "two covenant" view of the present age suggesting that Jewish people to not need to have faith in Christ in order to obtain eternal life.

One noted dispensationalist does not believe that Jesus came as the Messiah of Israel, so, technically, Israel never rejected Him as their Messiah.

Dispensationalists are the theological Barach Obama of change.

[xzins]

So, as I understand the rules, it is OK to find the most extreme examples of any theology and consider them to be the norm.

Do I have that right?

[topcat54]

So, as I understand the rules, it is OK to find the most extreme examples of any theology and consider them to be the norm.

I was not suggesting they are necessarily the norm. But it is true that all these ideas were or are tolerated, if not accepted, within the fundamentalist/dispensationalist camp. I’m not at all convinced that they are extreme within the general framework of dispensational theology.

But that does bring up an interesting and related topic, who is to say what is "the norm" when it comes to dispensationalism?

Hagee has lots of followers. Why is he not the norm? Is the "leaky dispensationalism" of John MacArthur the norm, or the hard core version of Tommy Ice?

Do the progressives down at DTS get a vote as to what should be considered "the norm" vs. extremism.

[xzins]

I’d take what comes out of Dallas and Grace as representative, and I would personally trust MacArthur.

The Calvary Chapel movement and many Bible Churches have reasonable Christian teachers who hold to dispensational views.

[onedoug]

Well, how you get two from one is not math for me. Thanks.

[topcat54]

I’d take

With all due respect, you have reduced the matter to one of personal taste. Perhaps that is the best we can do with dispensationalism.

The Calvary Chapel movement

Wasn’t it Chuck Smith that predicted Jesus would return in 1988? Is that the norm of dispensationalism?

[xzins]

Chuck Smith did not predict the return of Jesus in 1988. I’ve read the statement and background, and it’s merely a continuing disinformation campaign.

You asked my opinion, so I gave it.

Would you prefer I state my opinions with words that mask that fact????

Dallas and Grace. What’s hard to understand about that?

[topcat54]

Chuck Smith did not predict the return of Jesus in 1988.

He most certainly did. "Since a generation of judgment is forty years and the Tribulation period lasts seven years, I believe the Lord could come back for His Church any time before the Tribulation starts, which would mean any time before 1981. (1948 + 40 – 7 = 1981)." And, "I’m convinced that the Lord is coming for his church before the end of 1981." Rapture in 1981 followed seven years later by Christ’s return in 1988. It was the same tune sung my Hal Lindsey and Edgar ("88 Reasons") Whisenant. While he may have used guarded terms in an attempt to deflect future criticism, the faithful knew exactly what he meant.

Dallas and Grace. What’s hard to understand about that?

But Dallas and Grace are not the dispensational institutions they were one or two decades ago. In fact, many dispensationalists that judge "the norm" by the likes of Lewis Chafer, Charles Ryrie, and John Walvoord believe that both Dallas and Grace have sold out to covenant theology in some very important areas.

How is it that the dispensationalism of modern Dallas and Grace are almost unrecognizable wrt to the classic dispensationalism of earlier generations? From what I know of the Calvary Chapel types, they would butt heads with the modern scholars at DTS. What is it about the teaching at modern Dallas or Grace that we should regard it as "the norm"?

BTW, I’m not trying to put you on the spot. I just appreciate your responsiveness.

[topcat54]

You asked my opinion, so I gave it.

While I appreciate your candor, I was not looking for an opinion. I was looking for an objective response to the question of who speaks for dispensationalism, that is, who defines "the norm".

[topcat54]

For us as Jewish Christians,

Doesn't he realize that is an oxymoron? Christian is a gentile term, to be used only when speaking of gentiles, unless you are a gentile turned messianic Jew.

[mbeeber]

Hello Onedoug, Your question was: “Why is a so-called messianic jew not a christian? Or, if supposedly (s)he is christian, how can (s)he claim to be a Jew?” “Messiah” is the English term that comes from “Moshiach” —itÂ’s a Hebrew word meaning “the anointed one.” (המשיח). There were a number of moshiach’s in Jewish history, including King David and Judas Maccabeus. All were “types” of the ultimate “Moshiach”, Yeshua or Jesus of Nazareth, who shed His blood as a offering for the sins of all mankind, and will one day site upon the “Throne of David” in Jerusalem as King of all the earth. To avoid any semantics, Messiah means Christ. A Messianic Jew is a Christian Jew. Paul, Peter and myriads of Jews believing in the diety and Messiah-ship of Jesus are Messianic Jews. They are also Christian Jews. As a gentile in Christ, you are a Messianic Gentile. As far as election, we are all one in Christ. There are some Messianic Jews that may take issue with my statment “A Messianic Jew is a Christian Jew”. They are being factous and are not speaking from a Christ centered perspective, but rather a foolishly contrived pseudo Messianic perspective. Feel free to refer to me as a Messianic Jew, Hebrew Christian or Jewish Christian. All that matters is that Jesus knows who I am and I know that He knows. I hope that answer lays to rest your question. In Christ, Marshall