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Discovery Channel's "UNWRAPPING THE SHROUD: NEW EVIDENCE" ... December 14 At 10PM ET/PT
Reality TV website ^ | 11/28/2008 | Staff

Posted on 12/02/2008 1:50:41 PM PST by RGPII

The Shroud of Turin is one of the great enduring mysteries of all time, with its authenticity debated for years. Many believe it's the burial cloth of Jesus and the only physical link to Him, while others maintain that it is nothing more than an elaborate hoax. In fact, in 1988, a team of scientists radiocarbon dated the Shroud and concluded it was fake, dating back to the Middle Ages (1290-1360), long after Jesus was crucified. And that's where the story stood, unchallenged -- until now.

Discovery Channel's one-hour original special UNWRAPPING THE SHROUD: NEW EVIDENCE attempts to unravel the truth about the cloth on Sunday, December 14, 2008 from 10-11PM ET/PT.

The special event features the story of Ray Rogers, a respected chemist from the Los Alamos National Laboratory in New Mexico and member of the original team of scientists who examined the Shroud. Rogers came across a paper written by a husband and wife from Columbus, Ohio that claimed the 1988 radiocarbon dating was inaccurate. According to the couple, the test sample that was used had been taken from a section of the Shroud that had been repaired in the 16th Century, skewing the results. Expecting to prove this couple wrong, Rogers went back to examine the sample of the Shroud he tested years earlier, and what he found astonished even himself. In his last days (he had been battling cancer), Rogers made a video -- which before now has never been seen -- detailing his conclusions.

(Excerpt) Read more at realitytvwebsite.com ...


TOPICS: Apologetics; Ecumenism; History; Skeptics/Seekers
KEYWORDS: shroudofturin
One more story on this:

"A dying chemist took another look at the Shroud of Turin -- and came to surprising conclusions.

His story will be detailed in a new Discovery Channel special with the working title "Unwrapping the Shroud: New Evidence." The program will premiere at 10 p.m. Dec. 14.

The chemist, Ray Rogers, had worked at Los Alamos National Laboratory.

In 1988, he took part in tests on the shroud. The results revealed that it came from the Middle Ages and couldn't be the burial cloth of Jesus. But Rogers took another look at the cloth after suggestions that the test had been skewed.

According to Discovery, "What he found astonished even himself. In his last days (he had been battling cancer), Rogers made a video -- which before now has never been seen -- detailing his conclusions."

- Orlando Sentinel

Previously related stories on FR: A DETAILED CRITICAL REVIEW OF THE CHEMICAL STUDIES ON THE TURIN SHROUD

The Sudarium of Oveido: A study of Fiber Structures

Something to remember during this busy Holiday season and to mark one's calendar.

With the Shroud, even on religious forums I have visited, there certainly are real skeptics and I respect your opinions. That said, there is no reason to get into a heated discussion as I read in the above cited "Sudarium" thread. This is mainly a reminder for all interested to see the TV program and perhaps we can discuss it afterwards. It's the same thing for shows on JFK, UFOs etc.

1 posted on 12/02/2008 1:50:42 PM PST by RGPII
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To: RGPII

I’ll watch, but with a jaundiced eye I reserve for any program Discovery does which touches on the Christian faith.


2 posted on 12/02/2008 1:53:50 PM PST by skeeter (Its Barry's fault)
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To: RGPII
With the Shroud, even on religious forums I have visited, there certainly are real skeptics and I respect your opinions. That said, there is no reason to get into a heated discussion as I read in the above cited "Sudarium" thread.

Ping to follow the thread later

3 posted on 12/02/2008 1:59:29 PM PST by Alex Murphy ( "Every country has the government it deserves" - Joseph Marie de Maistre)
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To: RGPII

“Discovery Channel”

Bummer! I don’t get it here!#*+!!##!!


4 posted on 12/02/2008 2:07:14 PM PST by GonzoII ("That they may be one...Father")
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To: GonzoII
Google "Ray Rogers, Shroud" and you'll find a ton of info.

Here's one good site I just found with some great info written by Rogers before his death.

5 posted on 12/02/2008 2:23:30 PM PST by SonOfDarkSkies
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To: RGPII

From : www.shroud.com

page:

http://74.125.45.132/search?q=cache:iSAujDdzsv4J:www.shroud.com/latebrak.htm+discovery+channel+shroud+special&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us

New Shroud Documentary To Air On Discovery Channel In December

A new documentary about the Shroud of Turin will air at 10:00 pm, ET, on December 14, 2008 on the Discovery Channel. (Check your local listings for the exact time in your area). The program will also eventually air on Channel 4 in the United Kingdom, although no date has yet been announced. The working title of the program is “Shroud of Turin” (although that will probably change by the air date) and the following brief description comes from the Discovery Channel’s website:

The Shroud of Turin was believed to be the burial cloth of Jesus. But in 1988, radiocarbon dating concluded it was a medieval hoax. New scientific evidence poses the first substantive challenge, reopening debate about the Shroud’s authenticity.
The producer attended the Ohio Shroud Conference in August to do research for the program, which has been in production for the past three months. A number of noted Shroud researchers were interviewed for the program, including Joseph Accetta, Peter Schumacher, Dr. Frederick Zugibe, Joe Marino and Sue Benford, Robert Villarreal, and Petrus Soons (to name only a few). In addition to appearing in the program, I also provided the producers with access to the interviews I shot with Ray Rogers in 2004, less than a year before his death. Considering the focus and subject matter of the program, it was extremely important that some of Ray’s own words be included. I should also point out that none of the participants have seen the final program yet, so it is impossible to predict how it will turn out. However, the producer and director have both shown excellent knowledge of the subject matter, a willingness to treat the subject fairly and a sensitivity to its serious nature. I am hopeful that will be reflected in the end result. I plan to include a review of the program in my January 21, 2009 update. In fact, if any of you wish to write and submit a review of the show once it airs, I would be happy to consider it for publication.

Posted November 26, 2008

www.shroud.com is the pre-imminent shroud website hosted by Barrie M. Schwortz, an official member of the 1977 STURP scientific team and an orthodox Jew...nevertheless he is convinced the shroud is the burial cloth of Jesus.


6 posted on 12/02/2008 2:43:31 PM PST by dascallie
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To: Swordmaker; shroudie

Ping!


7 posted on 12/02/2008 3:13:20 PM PST by NYer ("Run from places of sin as from a plague." - St. John Climacus)
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To: Salvation; narses; SMEDLEYBUTLER; redhead; Notwithstanding; nickcarraway; Romulus; ...

December 14 at 10pm - Discovery Channel.


8 posted on 12/02/2008 3:14:55 PM PST by NYer ("Run from places of sin as from a plague." - St. John Climacus)
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To: RGPII

A shroud story...just in time for Christmas............hooray!!


9 posted on 12/02/2008 3:17:30 PM PST by gitmogrunt ("Why didn’t we let the Serbs exterminate these vermin?.)
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To: RGPII

Interesting.


10 posted on 12/02/2008 3:20:28 PM PST by FourtySeven (47)
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To: RGPII

When one of these gay English channels does something about Christianity near a major holiday, do not expect anything good.


11 posted on 12/02/2008 3:33:14 PM PST by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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To: annalex

From what I can tell, I think it is positive about the Shroud related to Christianity. They have a few shows positive towards Christ. They make many shows.


12 posted on 12/02/2008 3:38:27 PM PST by RGPII
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To: GonzoII
Ooops. Sorry bout that. Here's the link... http://www.shroudstory.com/faq/
13 posted on 12/02/2008 3:43:04 PM PST by SonOfDarkSkies
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To: annalex

English?

oh, dear!


14 posted on 12/02/2008 3:45:49 PM PST by RGPII
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To: RGPII

I was wrong, they are an American company.

The main reason for their programming seems to be to sneer at Christianity. I’d be happy to be proven wrong with this one.


15 posted on 12/02/2008 3:55:00 PM PST by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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To: Alamo-Girl; albee; AnalogReigns; AnAmericanMother; Angelas; AniGrrl; annyokie; Aquinasfan; ...
Shroud of Turin Documentary on Ray Rogers findings on December 14th... Discovery Channel. PING!

If you want on or off the Shroud of Turin Ping List, Freepmail me.


16 posted on 12/02/2008 6:09:37 PM PST by Swordmaker (Remember, the proper pronunciation of IE is "AAAAIIIIIEEEEEEE!)
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To: Swordmaker

Thanks for the ping!


17 posted on 12/02/2008 7:16:48 PM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: annalex

All the same, you do have a valid point. I think they did some show, “what Jesus’ family looked like” and that might have come from England.

And then, on the other hand, I’ve seen their shows speaking about Jesus of Nazareth and the show was rather straightforward, I do believe on Christmas day, they showed something like that one morning.

I find it hard enough to find the station anyway with all the satellite channels nowadays but this one sounded positive but we won’t know until we see it.

The other day, TBN was showing “Lillies of the field”, the original with Sidney Poitier(sp). There are some good shows to be found.


18 posted on 12/02/2008 7:24:44 PM PST by RGPII
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To: skeeter
you say “I’ll watch, but with a jaundiced eye I reserve for any program Discovery does which touches on the Christian faith...”

You might enjoy doing some homework before the program - if you aren't already familiar with the history and evidence concerning The Shroud.

As a portrait artist, I have studied The Shroud, for over 40 years, from the art angle. The many iconic paintings that were done for the churches, pre-dating what many would like to think about The Shroud, provide a strong testament. (Many iconic paintings were ordered destroyed, but many escaped.)

My favorite is the 6th Century Pantocrator. Here are some great links to start with:
(Remember - the painting was done in the 500’s)

http://www.shroudofturin4journalists.com/pantocrator.htm

http://www.travelpod.com/travel-photo/eric/israel_1975-76/206254740/ms15.jpg/tpod.html

and this is Barrie Schwortz’s Shroud Web site. He was one of the original examiners in 1978. I have corresponded with him for years. He started out as a skeptic.

http://www.shroud.com/

19 posted on 12/02/2008 8:22:03 PM PST by maine-iac7 ("He has the right to criticize who has the heart to help" Lincoln)
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To: maine-iac7

As well as the way it has been presented of comparing the Shroud of Turin to the original image of Divine Mercy. There use to be a website that had it superimposed so you could see it right on top, I can’t find it now.

This webpage does have it at the bottom of the article: http://www.faustina-message.com/zgromadzenie_anga.htm

I think some of us too are vaguely or well familiar with the Shrouds influence on early icons.

Back to the Divine Mercy, the original illustration is the important one here and if there is such a thing as Divine Inspiration, that may be a part of it.


20 posted on 12/02/2008 8:44:40 PM PST by RGPII
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To: RGPII

I wish the website http://www.faustina-message.com/zgromadzenie_anga.htm had the whole image but it is only the head. Perhaps someone knows where it might be elsewhere on the internet.


21 posted on 12/02/2008 8:45:51 PM PST by RGPII
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To: maine-iac7

Thanks for the link.


22 posted on 12/02/2008 8:49:39 PM PST by Jaded
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To: Jaded

Sure, if it makes you feel good to say that.


23 posted on 12/02/2008 9:00:25 PM PST by RGPII
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To: FourtySeven

Sure, if it makes you feel good to say that.


24 posted on 12/02/2008 9:01:55 PM PST by RGPII
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

Thanks a lot.


25 posted on 12/02/2008 9:17:02 PM PST by GonzoII ("That they may be one...Father")
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To: RGPII

http://www.shroud.com/examine.htm


26 posted on 12/02/2008 9:23:22 PM PST by GonzoII ("That they may be one...Father")
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To: FourtySeven

Then be watching.


27 posted on 12/03/2008 4:02:13 AM PST by RGPII
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To: Jaded; maine-iac7

thanks for the Lynx.


28 posted on 12/03/2008 4:03:07 AM PST by RGPII
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To: RGPII

Too much sugar?


29 posted on 12/03/2008 6:40:58 AM PST by Jaded
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

thanks for putting in link


30 posted on 12/07/2008 3:06:20 PM PST by mel
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To: RGPII

Can’t wait to see this Saturday


31 posted on 12/12/2008 11:29:38 AM PST by mel
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To: RGPII; Soliton; 2ndMostConservativeBrdMember; afraidfortherepublic; Alas; al_c; american colleen; ..
Ray Rogers Shroud of Turin Fraud on Tonight (Discovery)
 
12/14/2008 5:51:26 PM PST · by Soliton · 24 replies · 302+ views

32 posted on 12/14/2008 6:53:43 PM PST by Coleus (Abortion and Physician-assisted Murder (aka-Euthanasia), Don't Democrats just kill ya?)
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To: RGPII

We DVR’d the program, and are watching it right now.


33 posted on 12/14/2008 8:42:01 PM PST by SuziQ
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To: RGPII

Seems to me, years ago, I watched a special on the shroud, and one of the experts that was on the team...or perhaps it was the photographer...I don’t remember, but he was a Jewish Man, who doesn’t believe in Jesus...and he stated that the Shroud was NOT a fake. That there was no explaination for the image.

So, there doesn’t seem to be a lot of agreement on this team of experts!


34 posted on 12/14/2008 9:30:34 PM PST by tuckrdout (~ 'Daily example is the most subtle of poisons.' ~)
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To: annalex
The main reason for their programming seems to be to sneer at Christianity. I’d be happy to be proven wrong with this one.

It was rather interesting. A couple who had read about the results of the Carbon 14 dating had questioned the findings, because they'd done research showing that the areas of the Shroud that were subjected to the dating, could have been taken from an area of the Shroud that had been re-woven in the middle ages. To them, that explained why the spread of time of the dating was so broad.

Rogers, who was one of the original scientists on the study, at first dismissed the couple's findings, because they were not even scientists. He complained to the photographer, and said that he could prove them wrong in 5 minutes. The photographer just told him to go for it. Rogers was shocked to find that the couple WAS right!

The final part of the show mentioned that the reliquary for the Shroud had been treated with a substance that would keep insects from attacking it. That treatment would keep the Carbon 14 dating from being accurate, but there are some areas of the Shroud that were removed before it was returned to the treated reliquary; the ones that were from the areas that were burned in a fire in the 15th century. It's possible that these areas, when the carbon from the fire is removed, could go through the dating process again. It will be interesting to see if Church officials, and the scientists, will agree to do it.

35 posted on 12/14/2008 10:23:26 PM PST by SuziQ
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To: SuziQ

The only reason to have the show, it seems, was to air again the false and discretited Carbon 14 dating to lend some new legitimacy to it.


36 posted on 12/15/2008 12:36:05 AM PST by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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To: annalex
Actually this show called into question the legitimacy of the Carbon 14 data, upon which all of the negative stories about the Shroud were recently based. Ray Rogers, who verified the existence of the re-weaving, called for new Carbon 14 testing from the parts of the Shroud which had not been repaired before.

Some of the pieces that had been damaged in the fire in the 15th Century were original to the Shroud, and those had been removed before the Shroud was put back in its new treated reliquary. He suggesed that those be used. Remains to be seen if any will.

37 posted on 12/15/2008 5:03:29 PM PST by SuziQ
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To: SuziQ; Swordmaker

Carbon dating is probalby the least interesting thing about the Shroud. I’d like someone to explain how the image got on it in the first place, given the microscopic nature of the image on the fibers of the shroud, and its photographic proportions, inconsistent with the idea of a body being wrapped.


38 posted on 12/15/2008 6:37:52 PM PST by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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