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To: restornu

No disrespect to the Founders, but their distrust of organized religion has more to do with Enlightenment politics than a sincere desire to know Jesus. The idea of revolution is based upon an adolescent hostility towards any form of authority, and our American Revolution was no exception. Scripture and Tradition make it plain that the Christian cannot be a revolutionary; he is instead to submit to all Earthly authority as to God, for all authority on Earth is established by God. Should an Earthly authority demand more than the Christian can give, it is the Christian’s duty to simply refuse to comply, and to submit meekly to whatever consequences entail — but never to raise a hand against Caesar. This, not revolution, is the example set by the saints and martyrs.


3 posted on 12/25/2008 9:22:52 PM PST by B-Chan (Catholic. Monarchist. Texan. Any questions?)
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To: B-Chan

I really want to respond to your post but to keep it civil I’ll just say that I completely disagree.


4 posted on 12/25/2008 9:26:51 PM PST by randomhero97 ("First you want to kill me, now you want to kiss me. Blow!" - Ash)
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To: B-Chan; randomhero97
he idea of revolution is based upon an adolescent hostility towards any form of authority, and our American Revolution was no exception. Scripture and Tradition make it plain that the Christian cannot be a revolutionary; he is instead to submit to all Earthly authority as to God, for all authority on Earth is established by God.

I suggest that you read some Algernon Sidney and John Locke. The founding fathers did. (smile) It's too bad that you can't invite say, James Madison to hear you spout off about his 'apostasy.'

It was not the anti-Christian "enlightenment." It was and continues to be the natural progress of the liberated Christian mind in history, that brought a faithful understanding of natural law and natural freedom to mankind.

See also Deutoronomy, Joshua, and Judges, for the order of man blessed by God, free of authoritarianism. Once again, the founding fathers did.

8 posted on 12/25/2008 9:37:50 PM PST by unspun (PRAY & WORK FOR FREEDOM - investigatingobama.blogspot.com)
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To: B-Chan

You can meekly submit to a bad government if you like, but I’ll be damned if this Catholic does. I’m fairly certain Jesus would be right there with me and the rest of us.

But the best we can do is not assume Jesus is on our side just because we call ourselves Christian, but to pray we are on Jesus’ side and do the best we can.


11 posted on 12/25/2008 9:40:55 PM PST by DaGman
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To: B-Chan

No Christian is required to cooperate in evil. To resist a government like Stalin’s or Hitler’s is a positive moral action.

” Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.” Acts 5:29

Peter to no less an authority than the High Priest when told to stop preaching Jesus as the Messiah.


13 posted on 12/25/2008 9:41:58 PM PST by Robwin
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To: B-Chan
"No disrespect to the Founders, but their distrust of organized religion has more to do with Enlightenment politics than a sincere desire to know Jesus. The idea of revolution is based upon an adolescent hostility towards any form of authority, and our American Revolution was no exception."

If that revolution did not occur you wouldn't be able to spout the crap you are stating. Grow up .

14 posted on 12/25/2008 9:42:27 PM PST by blackbart.223 (I live in Northern Nevada. Reid doesn't represent me.)
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To: B-Chan

I submit to no religion.

Including yours.


26 posted on 12/25/2008 11:10:14 PM PST by AlmaKing
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To: B-Chan
Should an Earthly authority demand more than the Christian can give, it is the Christian’s duty to simply refuse to comply, and to submit meekly to whatever consequences entail —

Christians are not door-mats. Suggest you read C.S Lewis' quotations on war, etc., he does a good job of explaining why we have to fight and win at times.

29 posted on 12/25/2008 11:49:48 PM PST by Mogollon (Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God. -- Thomas Jefferson)
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To: B-Chan
Very good post,dear friend. The truth bothers people who think the US founding fathers were divinely inspired.

Many of them were freemasons and slave owners.

We can see what the fruits of all of this is today!

45 posted on 12/26/2008 6:58:06 AM PST by stfassisi (The greatest gift God gives us is that of overcoming self"-St Francis Assisi))
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To: B-Chan

“Scripture and Tradition make it plain that the Christian cannot be a revolutionary”

So the American Revolution and thus our nation was/is illegitimate?


132 posted on 12/26/2008 4:06:59 PM PST by HereInTheHeartland (I can't wait for January 20, 2013")
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To: B-Chan
"...Scripture and Tradition make it plain that the Christian cannot be a revolutionary...."

Interesting, but it seems an evangelical preacher named Patrick Henry, the "Firebrand of the Revolution," would beg to differ. Here is what Henry had to say,

"An appeal to arms and the God of hosts is all that is left us. But we shall not fight our battle alone. There is a just God that presides over the destinies of nations. The battle, sir, is not to the strong alone. Is life so dear or peace so sweet as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it Almighty God. I know not what course others may take, but as for me, give me liberty, or give me death."

The following year, 1776, he wrote this:

"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great Nation was founded not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. For that reason alone, people of other faiths have been afforded freedom of worship here."

237 posted on 12/27/2008 11:32:28 AM PST by inpajamas (Modern progressive liberalism is merely fascism without balls - http://skarbutts.wordpress.com/)
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