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1 posted on 01/22/2009 9:29:46 PM PST by GonzoII
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To: GonzoII

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2 posted on 01/22/2009 11:02:00 PM PST by sageb1 (This is the Final Crusade, There are only two sides. Pick one.)
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To: GonzoII; kosta50; MarkBsnr; Forest Keeper; stfassisi; maryz; HarleyD

“And thus He became man that He might make man divine.”

In many senses, this is the encapsulation of the theology of The Church. Its a line, in any of its varied forms, that I particularly love. It is also completely rejected by the “elect” of Calvinism and so far as I can see, most of the ecclesial descendants of the Reformers of the 16th century save perhaps for some Anglicans and Lutherans.

Aquinas’ presentation of this theology in the context of a discussion of the Creed is particularly telling in this regard since it is, in my opinion, the defective or perhaps undeveloped Christology and Trinitarian theology of the protestants which leads them away from this mst basic Christian Truth.


3 posted on 01/23/2009 3:55:54 AM PST by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!)
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To: GonzoII
Valentinus believed that Christ was conceived by the Holy Ghost, but would have the Holy Spirit deposit a heavenly body in the Blessed Virgin, so that she contributed nothing to Christ's birth except to furnish a place for Him. Thus, he said, this Body appeared by means of the Blessed Virgin, as though she were a channel. This is a great error, for the Angel said: "And therefore also the Holy which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."[12] And the Apostle adds: "But when the fullness of time was come, God sent His Son, made of a woman."[13] Hence the Creed says: "Born of the Virgin Mary."

It's easy to see that many protestants treatment of the Blessed Mother comes from the Gnostic Valentinus.

As the old saying goes... "old heresies never die"

5 posted on 01/23/2009 5:12:14 AM PST by stfassisi (The greatest gift God gives us is that of overcoming self"-St Francis Assisi))
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To: GonzoII
This destroys also the error of Nestorius, who said that the Son of God only by an indwelling was united to man. This, too, is false, because by this Christ would not be man but only in a man, and that He became man is clear from these words: "He was in habit found as man."[16]

No matter how much you want that verse to mean what you claim, if just doesn't make it...The verse says Jesus had the habits of a man...

There is nothing in this chapter to prove Nestorius was wrong...And it appears Nestorius had a far better understanding of the issue than those who labled him a heretic...

I suspect Nestorius looked upon those in your church as heretics as well...

Php 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
Php 2:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

Pretty plain speech here...Difficult to twist it without being obvious...

We can learn something from all this. (1) Our faith is strengthened. If, for instance, someone should tell us about a certain foreign land which he himself had never seen, we would not believe him to the extent we would if he had been there. Now, before Christ came into the world, the Patriarchs and Prophets and John the Baptist told something of God; but men did not believe them as they believed Christ, who was with God, nay more, was one with God. Hence, far more firm is our faith in what is given us by Christ Himself:

That kind of ridiculous...Jesus didn't personally write the New Testament...Apostles and Disciples wrote what they heard Jesus say...Including Paul...

The OT Prophets wrote what they heard from God...What Peter wrote about Jesus is no more credible than anything written by OT Prophets...

Fact is; it's ALL credible and True...

(2) Our hope is raised up. It is certain that the Son of Man did not come to us, assuming our flesh, for any trivial cause, but for our exceeding great advantage. For He made as it were a trade with us, assuming a living body and deigning to be born of the Virgin, in order that to us might be vouchsafed part of His divinity.[19] And thus He became man that He might make man divine.[20]

Not even close...Is this what they teach you guys??? Jesus didn't come to trade anything with us...Jesus came to die...To be a sinless sacrifice to fulfill what the Law couldn't do...

He came in our image and He will redeem those that believe in Him to His image...

Our flesh is corrupt...Our flesh will have to be changed to get to Heaven just as Jesus' flesh had to be changed...

6 posted on 01/23/2009 5:56:45 AM PST by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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