Palin to Rightly Divide USA all the More

The Magic City Morning Star ^ | Nov 19 09 | J. Grant Swank, Jr.

[yefragetuwrabrumuy]

I disagree strongly with this writer. They argue not for religion vs. no religion, but “my” version of religion vs. everybody else, no matter what they believe.

Among conservatives, there are some who are so single issue oriented that they see everybody else as the enemy.

But news to them, for example, if someone is anti-abortion, it *means* they are anti-abortion, not that all conservatives are anti-abortion, as it is not a litmus test for conservatism. To make matters worse, being anti-abortion *itself* does not mean the same thing to different people.

Does it mean banning all abortions all the time, even if the baby is dead and the mother is about to die, and that the mother is a 12 year old rape victim? There are some people who would say “yes”, but most would say “no”.

So the issue here is what do we mean when we say “conservative?”

Well, there is a spectrum within conservatism as well. Don’t neglect that a lot of conservatives are “status quo happy”, in that they don’t want much change at all, and for government to just not make things worse.

They are just the opposite from the large number of liberals who are just aching to change something, anything. Willing to gamble with the hope of it being better, because they think right now is so rotten.

And certainly, there are religious conservatives, both those who belong to and believe in religion, and those who want to integrate their religious beliefs into the government. Likewise, these are just the opposite of their liberal counterparts, for whom religion is just a social thing, and those who want to drive religion out of the government in any way, and force it into darkness.

Then, there are all sorts of other kinds of conservatives. Those who are very pro-business and pro-prosperity. Those who believe in a potent national defense and anti-crime policies. Those who lean heavily to federalism, and libertarianism. And certainly there is a ton of overlap here.

Lots of agreement and disagreement.

[freedomyes]

re joy, you speak truth.

[Yossarian]

No God, no need for morals and ethics, no need for civil society, no mortar to hold rational society together. Law of the jungle stuff...and in the end let’s just nuke it all!

You are confusing atheism and agnosticism. Atheism rejects the notion of God. Agnosticism states that their is no way to know if God exists or not IN THIS LIFE.

All agnostics I know, my former self included, figured we'd be finding out the truth of the situation once we kicked the bucket. There is still plenty of "face the wrath of an angry God" incentive factor to be good in this system.

-Yossarian (FORMER agnostic)

[freedomyes]

glad to know u r a former agnostic. congrats.

[mdmathis6]

I haven’t confused agnosticism and atheism...I don’t see the difference when it comes to understanding the lynch pins that undergird morals and ethics. Whether one doesn’t believe there is a God or if one kind of believes(but we can’t ultimately know for sure) but wants to keep his/her options open makes no difference in terms of having no solid point of reference in even having discussions of morality with those who are believers.

The only point of reference believers have with non believers are that we are all sinful men whereas nonbelievers,atheists and agnostics have no concepts of good or evil other than what they “borrow”(or cover themselves with a la “fig leaves”) from the cultural influences of believers. The most clever of the evil ones, connected and infested in the highest of our politics, certain church denominations, and media know of the restraining power of our Judeo Christian past; all of them recognize that it must all be pulled down so that their evil schemes can be brought to fruition.

I think many self avowed book writing atheists and agnostics are by and large patsies...the craftiest and most dangerous of the evil ones are those who promote such folk and give them utterance via the media and courts. They know what they are doing as they are, and some would acknowledge when pressed, in league with Satan. Indeed, some see Satan as the antidote against the “oppressive” EL.

You know what the story of Prometheus was really all about, don’t you?....Satan’s Apologetic(his personal mein kampf); a time diluted story of “his struggle” against our “cruel oppressor” who wanted to leave us humans completely “in the dark”, ignorant of our “true god like status”!