Posted on **01/15/2010 3:55:47 PM PST** by **truthfinder9**

Interesting. From this book (sorry, not all of the formulas converted right):

Mathematical Signatures in Nature: A Sign of Design?

“[The Universe] is written in the language of mathematics, and its characters are triangles, circles, and other geometrical figures, without which it is humanly impossible to understand a single word of it...” – Galileo Galilei1

Math is the universal language, but it is not a human construct. Sure, we create symbols for numbers and mathematical computations, but math itself is more fundamental. 2 + 2 = 4 is universally true, universal in the sense that everywhere in the universe it is true. It does not matter what symbols we create to communicate “2 + 2 = 4” — the equation always remains true. In other words, what we call math is simply a way to describe or visualize the order that is the foundation of the universe’s structure and mechanics.

As we have discussed at length, such order cannot be produced by chance. The level of order is too sophisticated for a random cause. The patterns that are often revealed are too precise. Only intelligence produces such things. Let us look at some of the mathematical constructs that we have uncovered in nature.

Phi [M]

Phi (M = 1.6180339887...) is an irrational number like pi (p = 3.141592653...). Phi and pi are both ratios defined by particular Euclidean geometries, with phi being the division of a line “so that the ratio of the lesser part to the greater part is the same as the ratio of the greater part to the whole.2”

Phi’s abundance in the universe as earned it names such as the Golden Section, the Divine Proportion, the Golden Ratio and the Golden Mean. These names stem from the fact that phi can be found in many natural constructs such as in human and animal proportions (i.e. the arrangement of physical features). Phi relationships can be found in DNA, among the planets of the Solar System (as in Kepler’s Laws), and so on. Even in fractal geometry (used for the irregular geometries found in nature) we find phi in everything from coastlines to crystal formation.

Many argue that phi is also used by humans in such things as art, architecture and music for the balance it produces in designs. However, there are some caveats to this. For example, some claim one can find phi — not surprisingly — in the structure or design of the pyramids. Is phi intentional in the pyramids or merely the result of what is good geometrical design? It is probably the latter. Architecture is often designed with balance and stability which necessitates geometries that contain phi, though these geometries are not always necessary. Phi may be intentional in some structures, but it is accidental or inadvertent in others.

While there is always an amount of subjectivity in how one designs a structure, there is much more of this in artwork. Phi can be seen in certain art pieces, but many more do not exhibit phi. Art that uses geometry as a basis will naturally converge on phi (with phi not necessarily “encoded” in the painting by the artist). We can purposely incorporate phi or inadvertently do so through our use of the geometries we have discovered.

Either way we (intelligent designers) are using precise constructs. How do such precise relations appear repeatedly in nature?

Fibonacci Series

This is the Fibonacci series: 0, 1, 1, 2, 3, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34. . .etc. It is very simply explained as each number in the series being the sum of the previous two numbers. The ratio of each successive pair of numbers (starting with 3/2) in the series approximates phi (i.e. 8 divided by 5 is 1.6). The accuracy of these ratios’ approximations to phi increases considerably as you go through the series. Phi can also be used to estimate any number in the Fibonacci series: fn = Mn / 5½.

Why is this important? Because the Fibonacci series precisely describes the spiral patterns common in nature: In shells, hurricanes, whirlpools, spiral galaxies, DNA and plant life. Phi is all around us. For example: The ratio of scales in the opposing spirals around a pine cone is 5:8; bumps on a pineapple are 8:13; seeds in a sunflower are 21:34. All of these ratios are adjacent pairs in the Fibonacci series.

Biblical Indications of Phi?

Exodus 25:10 writes: “Have them make a chest of acacia wood — two and a half cubits long, a cubit and a half wide, and a cubit and a half high.” Here we find that “The ratio of 2.5 to 1.5 is 1.666..., which is as close to phi (1.618...) as you can come with such simple numbers and is certainly not visibly different to the eye. The Ark of the Covenant is thus constructed using the Golden Section, or Divine Proportion. This ratio is also the same as 5 to 3, numbers from the Fibonacci series.3”

God instructed Noah in Genesis 6:15 to build an ark this way: “This is how you are to build it: The ark is to be 450 feet long, 75 feet wide and 45 feet high.” Hence, 75 by 45 feet is also in the ratio of 5 to 3, or 1.666..., another “close approximation of phi not visibly different to the naked eye. Noah’s ark was built in the same proportion as ten arks of the covenant placed side by side.4”

These indications of phi may or may not have been intentional. However, they are more evidence of a trend for man to use the same logic embedded in the universe. As Gary Meisner writes, “The pervasive appearance of phi throughout life and the universe is believed by some to be the signature of God, a universal constant of design used to assure the beauty and unity of His creation.5”

Pi [p]

Pi is the ratio of the circumference of a circle to its diameter (p = 3.141592653...). Pi is just as fundamental as phi in the universe, but because it is more familiar, its presence does not seem as startling. Yet mathematicians have spent millennia computing its numbers and looking for patterns in the pi sequence. Perhaps not surprisingly, pi can be related to phi. One way is through trigonometric relations: 2 H cos (p / 5) = M and 2 H sin (p / 5) = Ö(3 - M). There are other relations as well.6

Pi in the Bible?

1 Kings 7:23 writes: “He made the Sea of cast metal, circular in shape, measuring ten cubits from rim to rim and five cubits high. It took a line of thirty cubits to measure around it.” We know that circumference equals pi times diameter (c = pd). So from 1 Kings 7:23 we produce 30 = p10. Solving for p we get 3. Since p actually equals 3.141592653..., some people reason that the Bible is wrong. Is it?

First we must recognize that the Bible commonly uses rounded figures. These are descriptions, not architectural blueprints. Secondly, it has been shown by some that since the Hebrew does not have digits — all letters are also numbers — the relevant Hebrew in this passage can be calculated to find pi.7 The calculation comes out to 3.14150943... This is only a difference of 0.0000832 with actual pi, making the Bible’s description of pi the most accurate in antiquity.

Perhaps the Hebrews did not specifically calculate pi, but they managed to come very close “accidentally.” Another caveat is that many have tried to abuse the Hebrew and find endless “codes” hidden in the Bible. It can be shown how and why these codes are nonexistent8 or at least cannot be attributed the variety of meanings that some people claim the codes produce. While certain numbers, sequences, etc., in the Bible and elsewhere have been attributed particular meanings and usages, there is a big difference between what can be defined as pseudoscientific numerologies and scientific patterns. The latter are constant and repeatable (pi and phi) the former are inconsistent and variable (“Bible codes”).

Universal Language

So it seems mathematical patterns are inherent to the very structure of the universe. While we use our language of mathematics to describe these patterns and all of the precise fine-tuning found in the universe, the mathematical ratios themselves seem to be design evidences: A universal language, unchanging throughout time or place; too precise and nonnrandom to be products of chance.

We have also seen how biblical writings show examples of these mathematical constructs, both in usage and understanding. Once again the Bible shows a level of knowledge and accuracy that matches and surpasses other cultures contemporary to the Hebrews.

1. Mario Livio, The Golden Ratio (New York, NY: Broadway, 2003), pp. 241-242.

2. Miranda Lundy, Sacred Geometry (New York. NY: Walker, 1998), pp. 24-25.

For more on how phi is defined, see the websites “Phi: The Golden Number” at www.goldennumber.net by Gary Meisner, “The Golden section ratio: Phi” at www.mcs.surrey.ac.uk/Personal/R.Knott/Fibonacci/phi.html by Ron Knott and “Phi: That Golden Number” at jwilson.coe.uga.edu/emt669/Student.Folders/Frietag.Mark/Homepage/Goldenratio/goldenratio.html by Mark Freitag.

3. - 5. Gary Meisner’s “Phi in the Bible” at goldennumber.net/bible.htm.

6. Gary Meisner, “Pi, Phi and Fibonacci Numbers” at goldennumber.net/pi-phi-fibonacci.htm. More on the Fibonacci series in Ron Knott’s “Fibonacci Numbers and the Golden Section” at www.mcs.surrey.ac.uk/Personal/R.Knott/Fibonacci/fib.html.

7. Jochen Katz, “Pi in the Bible” at answering-islam.org.uk/Religions/Numerics/pi.html.

8. Randall Ingermanson, Who Wrote the Bible Code? A Physicist Probes the Current Controversy. Colorado Springs, Colorado: Waterbook, 1999. The author maintains additional information and appendices to his book on-line at www.rsingermanson.com. More on the Bible codes can be found at www.reasons.org/resources/apologetics/biblecode.shtml?main and at www.answering-islam.org.uk/Religions/Numerics/.

To: **truthfinder9**

an example of a Fibonacci Series

To: **truthfinder9**

Another of nature's miracles... The first three digits of Pi, when written backwards, spells PIE: ** **

To: **truthfinder9**

Check out the overtone series in sound...Scale, chord etc are all based on it....Number of vibrations/sec are also math sequences. Used to tune instruments and are the basis for all brass instruments.

BTW Pythagorean made many theories based on it,that could not be verified until about fifty years ago.

BTW Pythagorean made many theories based on it,that could not be verified until about fifty years ago.

4
posted on **01/15/2010 4:02:07 PM PST**
by hoosiermama
(ONLY DEAD FISH GO WITH THE FLOW.......I am swimming with Sarahcudah! Sarah has read the tealeaves.)

To: **NewJerseyJoe**

P4L

5
posted on **01/15/2010 4:44:52 PM PST**
by NewJerseyJoe
(Rat mantra: "Facts are meaningless! You can use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!")

To: **NewJerseyJoe**

Not sure what P4L means....

Bump with wife's eyes rolling as I relate the basics, I'm fascinated by stuff like this.

Bump with wife's eyes rolling as I relate the basics, I'm fascinated by stuff like this.

To: **WhoisAlanGreenspan?**

P4L = "ping for later"

Reminder for me to come back and look at the thread another time.

7
posted on **01/15/2010 5:34:51 PM PST**
by NewJerseyJoe
(Rat mantra: "Facts are meaningless! You can use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!")

To: **truthfinder9; Jeremiah Jr; null and void; Yehuda; cyn; freema; Diego1618; 444Flyer; Armageddon**

Everywhere, signs...

06726 Tsiyown {tsee-yone'}

the same (regularly) as 06725; TWOT - 1910; n pr loc

AV - **Zion** 153, Sion 1; 154

>>>

06725 tsiyuwn {tsee-yoon'}

from the same as 06723 in the sense of conspicuousness [compare

05329]; TWOT - 1887a; n m

AV - **title **1, **waymark** 1, **sign** 1; 3

1) **signpost, monument, market**

Mark 13:28-29 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near: 29 So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors.

Games of the XXX Olympiad

8
posted on **01/15/2010 5:54:39 PM PST**
by Ezekiel
(The Obama-nation began with the Inauguration of Desolation.)

To: **truthfinder9**

Prooving yet again, that while God made everything from nothing, man can make nothing out of just about anything... or not.

To: **delacoert**

bumo

To: **brivette**

Either a genetic mix between mole and fitchet or a typo of bump. I'm guessing the latter.

To: **NewJerseyJoe**

That's what my rolling fascinated wife's eye was all about. I guess you're just into scientific notation.

Just saying, happy Friday.

Just saying, happy Friday.

To: **delacoert**

I'll agree to your 'not', in the sense of a bunch of fish stuck in a fish bowl next to the bookcase.

We assume half of the activity going on around us is obscured by the bookcase and from what we can see this is what we've come up with so far.

We assume half of the activity going on around us is obscured by the bookcase and from what we can see this is what we've come up with so far.

To: **hoosiermama**

Right you are, hoosiermama! The ratio of frequencies for different intervals are as follows: octave 1:2, perfect fifth 2:3, perfect fourth 3:4, major second 4:5. I know this because I'm a math geek AND a musician.

A trumpet's valves are set up as follows: Valve #1 adds six inches, valve #2 adds three and valve #3 adds nine. The valve combinations for a chromatic scale from C# (concert B) to G (concert F)would be 123, 13, 23, 12, 1, 2 and open. A trombone is similar except it uses a slide.

To: **Ten Beers Gone**

It found it interesting that the progression of vocal harmony parallels the sequence....First singing was in octaves, then it progressed to parallel fourth/fifth, later chords using M/m thirds and finally the M/m seconds....My question as a college students was where do we progress from here? We've fairly well reached the end.

15
posted on **01/15/2010 7:16:13 PM PST**
by hoosiermama
(ONLY DEAD FISH GO WITH THE FLOW.......I am swimming with Sarahcudah! Sarah has read the tealeaves.)

To: **Jeremiah Jr; null and void; Yehuda; cyn; freema; Diego1618; 444Flyer; Armageddon**

*And God remembered Rachel...*

16
posted on **01/16/2010 12:12:34 AM PST**
by Ezekiel
(The Obama-nation began with the Inauguration of Desolation.)

To: **Ezekiel**

A math teacher was arrested today at JFK International Airport as he attempted to board a flight while in possession of a ruler, a protractor, a compass, a slide-rule & a calculator.

At a morning press conference, Attorney General Holder said he believes the man is a member of the notorious Republican Al-Gebra movement. He did not identify the man, who has been charged by the FBI with carrying weapons of math instruction.

“Al-Gebra is a problem for us,” Holder said. “They derive solutions by means & extremes, & sometimes go off on tangents in search of absolute values.” They use secret code names like ‘X’ and ‘Y’ & refer to themselves as “unknowns”, but we have determined that they belong to a common denominator of the axis of medieval with coordinates in every country.

As the Greek philanderer Isosceles used to say, ‘There are 3 sides to every triangle’.

When asked to comment on the arrest, Obama said, “If God had wanted us to have better weapons of math instruction, he would have given us more fingers & toes.” White House aides told reporters they could not recall a more intelligent or profound statement by Obama. It is believed that the Nobel Prize for Physics will follow.

17
posted on **01/16/2010 7:32:51 AM PST**
by null and void
(We are now in day 360 of our national holiday from reality. - 0bama really isn't one of US.)

To: **null and void**

ROFL! Magnificent.

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