Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

A Protestant Discovers Mary
NC Register ^ | March 13, 2010

Posted on 03/14/2010 12:14:46 PM PDT by NYer

Romano Guardini wrote in his book on the Rosary, “To linger in the domain of Mary is a divinely great thing. One does not ask about the utility of truly noble things, because they have their meaning within themselves. So it is of infinite meaning to draw a deep breath of this purity, to be secure in the peace of this union with God.”

Guardini was speaking of spending time with Mary in praying the Rosary, but David Mills, in his latest book, Discovering Mary, helps us linger in the domain of Mary by opening up to us the riches of divine revelation, both from tradition and Scripture. Mills, a convert from the Episcopal Church, former editor of the Christian journal Touchstone and editor of the 1998 book of essays commemorating the centennial of C.S. Lewis’ birth The Pilgrim’s Guide: C. S. Lewis and the Art of Witness, as well as the author of Knowing the Real Jesus (2001), has written a rock-solid introduction to the Blessed Virgin Mary, and done so with intellectual rigor and an affable tone.

His book begins with an introduction in which he describes how he came to discover the riches of the Church’s teachings on Mary: “I began to see how a sacred vessel is made holy by the sacred thing it carries,” he writes. “I began to feel this in a way I had not before. I found myself developing an experiential understanding of Mary and indeed a Marian devotion. Which surprised me. It surprised me a lot.”

Unfortunately, he notes, he did not learn about Mary from contemporary Catholics, nor in homilies, “even on Marian feast days.” It seems he learned on his own by reading magisterial documents and going back to Scriptures in light of those documents.

This book shares the fruit of that study. Mills examines the life of Mary, Mary in the Bible, Mary in Catholic doctrine, Marian feast days and the names of Mary. He includes an appendix full of references to papal documents and books on Mary.

Most of the book is done in a question-and-answer format, which usually works well, although at times it feels awkward. Would someone really ask, for instance, “What is happening in the liturgy on the Marian feast days?”

But most of the questions are natural. “What is the point of Marian devotion?” Mills asks. It is “to live the Catholic life as well as we can,” he answers. “This means going ever more deeply into the mystery of Christ, to become saintlier, more conformed to his image, by following Mary’s example and by turning to her for help and comfort.”

Next question: “Does devotion to Mary detract from our devotion to Christ?”

“Christians since the beginning of serious Marian devotion have been careful to emphasize Mary’s subordination to her son,” Mills replies. “In fact, they have said it so often that the reader begins to expect it. In the fifth century St. Ambrose put it nicely: ‘Mary was the temple of God, not the god of the temple.’”

David Mills, with the same radical clarity he showed in Knowing the Real Jesus, has written what has to be one of the best, if not the very best, short introductions to Catholic teaching on Mary, the Mother of God. Discovering Mary is ideal for those wanting to know more about her, whether they be skeptics, Protestants, or Catholics who don’t know the Mother of the Church well enough.

Franklin Freeman writes from Saco, Maine.


DISCOVERING MARY

Answers to Questions About the Mother of God

By David Mills

Servant Books, 2009

148 pages, $12.99

To order: servantbooks.org


TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Mainline Protestant
KEYWORDS: loony; loopy; sad; silly
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-100101-150151-200 ... 751-762 next last

1 posted on 03/14/2010 12:14:46 PM PDT by NYer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: netmilsmom; thefrankbaum; markomalley; Tax-chick; GregB; saradippity; Berlin_Freeper; Litany; ...

For your lenten reading list.


2 posted on 03/14/2010 12:16:13 PM PDT by NYer ("Where Peter is, there is the Church." - St. Ambrose of Milan)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NYer

3 posted on 03/14/2010 12:21:26 PM PDT by tflabo (Restore the Republic)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NYer

Thanks for posting this. As a new Catholic/recovering Protestant I know I need to learn more about Marian devotion—I just wasn’t raised to understand this. When I get a job I’ll be sure to buy this book.


4 posted on 03/14/2010 12:29:57 PM PDT by ottbmare (I could agree wth you, but then we'd both be wrong.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NYer
Don't know what I'd do without Mary ... Protestants can say the rosary too, if they like ... she's everyone's mother ...

Rosary for Peace
5 posted on 03/14/2010 12:36:41 PM PDT by mlizzy ("Do not wait for leaders; do it alone, person to person" --Mother Teresa.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NYer
Unfortunately, he notes, he did not learn about Mary from contemporary Catholics, nor in homilies, “even on Marian feast days.” It seems he learned on his own by reading magisterial documents and going back to Scriptures in light of those documents.

It's this way for a lot of us. A little something that was not taught well at all.

6 posted on 03/14/2010 12:48:32 PM PDT by Desdemona
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: ottbmare; Salvation
As a new Catholic/recovering Protestant I know I need to learn more about Marian devotion

It can be a challenge even for some of us cradle Catholics. I am reading a 'hot' book right now.

From Amazon.com

Editorial Reviews

Review

A Book That You Will Read More Than Once - You have my word! I COULD NOT put it down. It kept my interest from beginning to end... Do yourself a favor and get this book. I promise you will not be disappointed. --Fr. Neil Buchlein, Pastor of Ascension Catholic Church in Hurricane, West Virginia, and host of an Internet blog at blessedmotherschildren.com

A Real Page-Turner! This book needs to be read by every Catholic. It will inspire you! I cannot praise it enough. --David T. Little, President, World St. Thomas More Society

His Eminence Ricardo J. Cardinal Vidal, Archbishop of Cebu, Philippines, has granted the Church's Imprimatur, rarely given to books on prophecy, to this book. As an expert on Marian teaching and prophecy in the Catholic Church, Cardinal Vidal was uniquely qualified to have reviewed and approved this book as being without error in faith and morals. --Special Church Recognition

Product Description

Why is the world in so much turmoil today? What is going to happen in the near future? Are we living in the time of the Apocalypse? What is Heaven saying to us about our times? This book explains the big picture of the prophetic times in which we live and the apocalyptic times to come in the near future. An easily readable, well-researched, and inspiring book about the heavenly plan to bring peace to the world, this book uses solid sources like the Bible, the church s teachings, and heavenly prophecies to detail the coming times of the Apocalypse. As you turn each page with increasing hope, you will experience greater insight into God's urgent plan to bring his message to humanity while there is still time. You will find yourself referring to this book time and time again.

The author lists several of the many marian apparitions. Not sure why he left out the one at Zeitoun Egypt.

The book is quite interesting however. You may want to add it to your reading list.


7 posted on 03/14/2010 1:13:14 PM PDT by NYer ("Where Peter is, there is the Church." - St. Ambrose of Milan)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: NYer

Thank you for the post. Instead of giving up something for lent my journey is to find who Mary Magdelen was...So if you have anything on her I would greatly appreciate it.


8 posted on 03/14/2010 1:21:51 PM PDT by hstacey (An ounce of pretension is worth a pound of manure...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: NYer; Alamo-Girl; Quix; Dr. Eckleburg; xzins; stfassisi
In the fifth century St. Ambrose put it nicely: ‘Mary was the temple of God, not the god of the temple.’”

Bookmarked for future reference.

Thank you so very much for posting this article, NYer!

9 posted on 03/14/2010 1:27:52 PM PDT by betty boop (Moral law is not rooted in factual laws of nature; they only tell us what happens, not what ought to)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: ottbmare
Welcome with great joy to the faith.

I understand the difficulty with Marian devotion that most protestants have with the Catholic church...I have discovered that is is terminology and of tunnel vision.

A little meditation will take you a long distance to understanding why we hold Mary in such a position of reverence.

” The Word was made flesh and dwelt among us”.

Jesus, the word , took up earthly residence in the body of Mary to be en-fleshed. He was blood of her blood and flesh of her flesh.

Think of Mary being suffused with the Word of God every moment, every breath and every heart beat for 9 months.

This is why Mary is the role model for Catholic’s... we wish to be suffused with “The word of God” every moment of our lives and Mary is the example that it can be done.

It takes great humility, great submission, great openness.

We diminish as He increases.

10 posted on 03/14/2010 1:32:03 PM PDT by TASMANIANRED (Liberals are educated above their level of intelligence.. Thanks Sr. Angelica)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: NYer

**It seems he learned on his own by reading magisterial documents and going back to Scriptures in light of those documents.**

I think this is why many well-read celebrities become Catholics — they do the footwork — the reading!


11 posted on 03/14/2010 1:35:59 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NYer

Episcopal = sort of a protestant, separated by a body of water from Rome.

Title sort of misleading.


12 posted on 03/14/2010 1:56:31 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: hstacey
Thank you for the post. Instead of giving up something for lent my journey is to find who Mary Magdelen was...So if you have anything on her I would greatly appreciate it.

I will keep you in mind. However, in the mean time, a word of caution. The bulk of material out there on this wonderful saint, has been compiled by left wing feminists and secularists. It is easy to get caught up in the bunk they are selling. Keep your eyes wide open and question any and all material you come across. She is quite popular with radical groups who use her to undermine the Truth. P.S. - Mary Magdalene is one of my patron saints and holds a special place in my heart.

13 posted on 03/14/2010 2:02:51 PM PDT by NYer ("Where Peter is, there is the Church." - St. Ambrose of Milan)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: NYer
In the fifth century St. Ambrose put it nicely: ‘Mary was the temple of God, not the god of the temple.’”

Not surprising coming from a man who went from being a pagan to a Bishop in your church in about 2 weeks time. Why not look how Mary's title has evolved over time.

Mary was called woman by Jesus

Mary was called woman by Paul

Mary was called suitable vessel by Ignatius

Mary was called new Eve by Justin Martyr

Mary was called advocate (intercessor, comforter) by Irenaeus

Mary was called ever virgin Mother of God by Origen.

All this evolution of her title in just 200 yrs, so "Temple of God" after another hundred years isn't surprising. It doesn't make it right, though.

14 posted on 03/14/2010 2:19:29 PM PDT by wmfights (If you want change support SenateConservatives.com)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NYer
Thanks for the word of caution. I am looking at older writings like early 20th century to avoid the BS so that's why it's hard to find stuff. I don't want any feminist BS spin.
15 posted on 03/14/2010 2:19:29 PM PDT by hstacey (An ounce of pretension is worth a pound of manure...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: aMorePerfectUnion
Depends on where he was in the Episcopalian Continuum.

He could have been a "low church" Piskie, which is indistinguishable from your average mainline protestant denomination.

He wasn't a "high church" Piskie, because in that case he wouldn't have had a problem with Mary to begin with. They've got Lady Chapels and Rosary Sodalities and devotions to the Immaculate Heart. My daughter was 14 when we converted, and she said she didn't notice much change . . . except that confirmation class was much better and the sermons were shorter.

16 posted on 03/14/2010 2:20:18 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: hstacey; NYer

Saint Anselem wrote this wonderful prayer to Saint Mary Magdalene ....

St Mary Magdalene, you came with springing tears to the spring of mercy, Christ; from him your burning thirst was abundantly refreshed through him your sins were forgiven; by him your bitter sorrow was consoled.

My dearest lady, well you know by your own life how a sinful soul can be reconciled with its creator, what counsel a soul in misery needs, what medicine will restore the sick to health.

It is enough for us to understand, dear friend of God, to whom were many sins forgiven, because she loved much.

Most blessed lady, I who am the most evil and sinful of men do not recall your sins as a reproach, but call upon the boundless mercy by which they were blotted out.

This is my reassurance, so that I do not despair; this is my longing, so that I shall not perish.

I say this of myself, miserably cast down into the depths of vice, bowed down with the weight of crimes, thrust down by my own hand into a dark prison of sins, wrapped round with the shadows of darkness.

Therefore, since you are now with the chosen because you are beloved and are beloved because you are chosen of God, 1, in my misery, pray to you, in bliss; in my darkness, I ask for light; in my sins, redemption; impure, I ask for purity.

Recall in loving kindness what you used to be, how much you needed mercy, and seek for me that same forgiving love that you received when you were wanting it. Ask urgently that I may have the love that pierces the heart; tears that are humble; desire for the homeland of heaven; impatience with this earthly exile; searing repentance; and a dread of torments in eternity.

Turn to my good that ready access that you once had and still have to the spring of mercy.

Draw me to him where I may wash away my sins; bring me to him who can slake my thirst; pour over me those waters that will make my dry places fresh. You will not find it hard to gain all you desire from so loving and so kind a Lord, who is alive and reigns and is your friend.

For who can tell, beloved and blest of God, with what kind familiarity and familiar kindness he himself replied on your behalf to the calumnies of those who were against you? How he defended you, when the proud Pharisee was indignant, how he excused you, when your sister complained, how highly he praised your deed, when Judas begrudged it.

And, more than all this, what can I say, how can I find words to tell, about the burning love with which you sought him, weeping at the sepulchre, and wept for him in your seeking?

How he came, who can say how or with what kindness, to comfort you, and made you burn with love still more; how he hid from you when you wanted to see him, and showed himself when you did not think to see him; how he was there all the time you sought him, and how he sought you when, seeking him, you wept.

But you, most holy Lord, why do you ask her why she weeps?

Surely you can see; her heart, the dear life of her soul, is cruelly slain.

O love to be wondered at;

O evil to be shuddered at;

you hung on the wood, pierced by iron nails, stretched out like a thief for the mockery of wicked men; and yet, ‘Woman,’ you say, ‘why are you weeping?’ She had not been able to prevent them from killing you, but at least she longed to keep your body for a while with ointments lest it decay.

No longer able to speak with you living, at least she could mourn for you dead. So, near to death and hating her own life, she repeats in broken tones the words of life which she had heard from the living.

And now, besides all this, even the body which she was glad, in a way, to have kept, she believes to have gone.

And can you ask her, ‘Woman, why are you weeping?’

Had she not reason to weep?

For she had seen with her own eyes—if she could bear to look—what cruel men cruelly did to you; and now all that was left of you from their hands she thinks she has lost.

All hope of you has fled, for now she has not even your lifeless body to remind her of you.

And someone asks, ‘Who are you looking for? Why are you weeping?’

You, her sole joy, should be the last thus to increase her sorrow. But you know it all well, and thus you wish it to be, for only in such broken words and sighs can she convey a cause of grief as great as hers. The love you have inspired you do not ignore,

And indeed you know her well, the gardener, who planted her soul in his garden. What you plant, I think you also water.

Do you water, I wonder, or do you test her?

In fact, you are both watering and putting to the test.

But now, good Lord, gentle Master, look upon your faithful servant and disciple, so lately redeemed by your blood, and see how she burns with anxiety, desiring you, searching all round, questioning, and what she longs for is nowhere found.

Nothing she sees can satisfy her, since you whom alone she would behold, she sees not.

What then?

How long will my Lord leave his beloved to suffer thus?

Have you put off compassion now you have put on incorruption? Did you let go of goodness when you laid hold of immortality?

Let it not be so, Lord.

You will not despise us mortals now you have made yourself immortal, for you made yourself a mortal in order to give us immortality.

And so it is; for love’s sake he cannot bear her grief for long or go on hiding himself. For the sweetness of love he shows himself who would not for the bitterness of tears.

The Lord calls his servant by the name she has often heard and the servant knows the voice of her own Lord.

I think, or rather I am sure, that she responded to the gentle tone with which he was accustomed to call, ‘Mary’. What joy filled that voice, so gentle and full of love.

He could not have put it more simply and clearly:

‘I know who you are and what you want; behold me; do not weep, behold me; I am he whom you seek.’

At once the tears are changed; I do not believe that they stopped at once, but where once they were wrung from a heart broken and self-tormenting they flow now from a heart exulting. How different is, ‘Master!’ from ‘If you have taken him away, tell me’; and, ‘They have taken away my Lord, and I do not know where they have laid him,’ has a very different sound from,

‘I have seen the Lord, and he has spoken to me.’

But how should I, in misery and without love, dare to describe the love of God and the blessed friend of God? Such a flavour of goodness will make my heart sick if it has in itself nothing of that same virtue.

But in truth, you who are very truth, you know me well and can testify that I write this for the love of your love, my Lord, my most dear Jesus.

I want your love to burn in me as you command so that I may desire to love you alone and sacrifice to you a troubled spirit, ‘a broken and a contrite heart’.

Give me, 0 Lord, in this exile, the bread of tears and sorrow for which I hunger more than for any choice delights.

Hear me, for your love, and for the dear merits of your beloved Mary, and your blessed Mother, the greater Mary.

Redeemer, my good Jesus, do not despise the prayers of one who has sinned against you but strengthen the efforts of a weakling that loves you.

Shake my heart out of its indolence, Lord, and in the ardour of your love bring me to the everlasting sight of your glory where with the Father and the Holy Spirit you live and reign, God, for ever. Amen.


17 posted on 03/14/2010 2:31:21 PM PDT by stfassisi ((The greatest gift God gives us is that of overcoming self"-St Francis Assisi)))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: stfassisi

What a beautiful prayer. It touched my heart...Thanks.


18 posted on 03/14/2010 2:43:15 PM PDT by hstacey (An ounce of pretension is worth a pound of manure...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: stfassisi

“prayer to Saint Mary Magdalene”

I think you mean “prayer of”. You don’t pray to anyone but God.


19 posted on 03/14/2010 2:47:41 PM PDT by AppyPappy (If you aren't part of the solution, there is good money to be made prolonging the problem.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: AppyPappy
It's prayer in the old sense - as in, "I pray thee" or, as often shortened, "prithee".

You'll find it in Shakespeare AND in the King James' Bible.

We 'pray' -- that is, humbly ask -- those who are righteous and stand among the elders and martyrs offering the prayers (in the other sense) of the faithful, to add their prayers to ours and present them before the Throne of Grace.

A lawyer includes a "prayer for relief" on behalf of his client when he files a "pleading" with the court, but his client isn't praying to him in the worshipping sense, nor is he praying to the judge.

20 posted on 03/14/2010 5:14:41 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: hstacey
An interesting place to look is at TAN Books -- I see a couple of titles, Mary Magdalen in the Visions of Anne Catherine Emmerich - The Great Magdalens

Thomas A. Nelson is a very traditional Catholic publishing house, and they offer a variety of works that you can be quite sure will not err on the side of feminism or secularism.

It's important to remember, however, that private revelation (such as that of Bl. Anne Catherine Emmerich) is neither binding nor required to be believed. It is useful for instruction and edification of the faithful, but that's as far as it goes. You don't want to fall in the ditch on the other side of the road.

Apropos of this, a relic of St. Mary Magdalen visited the U.S. last fall and reposed at our parish church for a day -- under 24-hour guard by the Knights of Malta and the Knights of the Holy Sepulchre. We went and venerated her relic and it was an amazing experience -- to be so close to the body of someone who actually knew Jesus, who saw Him after his Resurrection . . . awe inspiring.

21 posted on 03/14/2010 5:23:53 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: ottbmare

God bless you. Welcome home!


22 posted on 03/14/2010 5:27:49 PM PDT by big'ol_freeper ("Anyone pushing Romney must love socialism...Piss on Romney and his enablers!!" ~ Jim Robinson)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: AnAmericanMother

There is not enough evidence that they are there. Sainthood is not given by God. It’s given by the church.

A “saint” may be sleeping until the time of the Second Coming.


23 posted on 03/14/2010 5:30:45 PM PDT by AppyPappy (If you aren't part of the solution, there is good money to be made prolonging the problem.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: wmfights

Might want to do a search on “woman” in your redacted Bible. You will find that what you are claiming is a derogatory is associated with the final triumph. How folks can read the Bible and be so ignorant is amazing.

Book of Revelation 12:1-18:[3]

1 And a great sign appeared in heaven: A woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of twelve stars. 2 And being with child, she cried travailing in birth: and was in pain to be delivered. 3 And there was seen another sign in heaven. And behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns and on his heads seven diadems. 4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven and cast them to the earth. And the dragon stood before the woman who was ready to be delivered: that, when she should be delivered, he might devour her son. 5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with an iron rod. And her son was taken up to God and to his throne. 6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she had a place prepared by God, that there they should feed her, a thousand two hundred sixty days.

7 And there was a great battle in heaven: Michael and his angels fought with the dragon, and the dragon fought, and his angels. 8 And they prevailed not: neither was their place found any more in heaven. 9 And that great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, who is called the devil and Satan, who seduceth the whole world. And he was cast unto the earth: and his angels were thrown down with him. 10 And I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying: Now is come salvation and strength and the kingdom of our God and the power of his Christ: because the accuser of our brethren is cast forth, who accused them before our God day and night. 11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of the testimony: and they loved not their lives unto death. 12 Therefore, rejoice, O heavens, and you that dwell therein. Woe to the earth and to the sea, because the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, knowing that he hath but a short time.

13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman who brought forth the man child. 14 And there were given to the woman two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the desert, unto her place, where she is nourished for a time and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent. 15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth, after the woman, water, as it were a river: that he might cause her to be carried away by the river. 16 And the earth helped the woman: and the earth opened her mouth and swallowed up the river which the dragon cast out of his mouth. 17 And the dragon was angry against the woman: and went to make war with the rest of her seed, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ. 18 And he stood upon the sand of the sea.’’


24 posted on 03/14/2010 5:38:33 PM PDT by big'ol_freeper ("Anyone pushing Romney must love socialism...Piss on Romney and his enablers!!" ~ Jim Robinson)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: AppyPappy
The Bible is evidence enough - Revelation - not to mention the Transfiguration.

Christ Himself said that God is the God of the living, not of the dead, and all live to Him. Abraham, Isaac, Jacob - and Moses and Elijah, who were seen conversing with Christ on Mt. Horeb.

The Church does not and has never claimed to "give" sainthood. She simply recognizes those whose life and works show forth uncontradicted evidence of sainthood -- as mentors and good examples for the faithful.

25 posted on 03/14/2010 5:46:37 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: hstacey

Mary Magdalene is a special devotion of mine, because my birthday is her feast day, July 22. Be careful in what you believe, of all that is written. Look for materials that are faithful to the Scripture, limited as the mentions are.

One book I like is “The Spear,” by Louis de Wohl. This book is about Longinus, the centurion who (in tradition) pierced the side of Jesus with the spear. In this book, Mary Magdalene is conflated with Mary of Bethany, which is a “reasonable but not required” interpretation of the Gospel accounts. It is a very touching book, and it has helped to inspire my personal devotion to Martha and Mary (of Bethany, and of Magdala, one or the other or both, whichever they was ;-).


26 posted on 03/14/2010 6:05:57 PM PDT by Tax-chick (Aw, CUSSWORDS!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: Tax-chick

Thank you so much for the information. Mary Madalene touched me after a prayer I made to both she and the Blessed Virgin. It was real and very powerful. So this is my quest and any information you have is greatly appreciated. I’m not looking at books or publications which are current as the feminist slant urks me...


27 posted on 03/14/2010 6:12:26 PM PDT by hstacey (An ounce of pretension is worth a pound of manure...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: AnAmericanMother

That must have been amazing...Thanks so much for the information.


28 posted on 03/14/2010 6:13:54 PM PDT by hstacey (An ounce of pretension is worth a pound of manure...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: hstacey

It is hard to get past the feminist and pro-prostitution slant of much modern “scholarship.” That’s why I mentioned the De Wohl book, which is well within the reasonable bounds of the Scriptural accounts.

From the Gospels, we know that Mary of Magdala loved Jesus with an intense and personal love, and that He returned her love in a personal way. That’s enough for me to consider her a guide and an intercessor. All the other Marys of the Gospels may be separate people or not, but we know that Mary Magdalene was shown a special mercy and a special live by Jesus.


29 posted on 03/14/2010 6:17:58 PM PDT by Tax-chick (Aw, CUSSWORDS!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: NYer; informavoracious; larose; RJR_fan; Prospero; Conservative Vermont Vet; ...
+

Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic List:

Add me / Remove me

Please ping me to note-worthy Pro-Life or Catholic threads, or other threads of general interest.

30 posted on 03/14/2010 6:18:50 PM PDT by narses ("lex orandi, lex credendi, lex vivendi")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: betty boop; Amityschild; Brad's Gramma; Cvengr; DvdMom; firebrand; GiovannaNicoletta; Godzilla; ...

I understand the logic of Mary as the ‘temple of God.’

I do NOT find that at all a BIBLICAL label, however.


31 posted on 03/14/2010 6:36:19 PM PDT by Quix (BLOKES who got us where we R: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: big'ol_freeper; wmfights
And in Koine Greek (and I understand also in Aramaic) "woman" is a term of respect. "Woman, behold thy son!" Remember also that Jesus asked Mary Magdalen when she saw Him in the garden (and thought he was the gardener), "Woman, why weepest thou?"

For what it's worth, in Scots Gaelic the old time Highlander addressed his mother as "O Woman" - "A Bhean". I went and checked my Gaelic Testament and it's the same in the Gospels.

32 posted on 03/14/2010 6:36:25 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: TASMANIANRED; Amityschild; Brad's Gramma; Cvengr; DvdMom; firebrand; GiovannaNicoletta; Godzilla; ..

No. It’s NOT merely terminology and tunnel vision.

There is horrific and very serious idolatrous blasphemy in the name of Mary on the part of major percentages of those within the Roman Catholic et al/Vatican edifice.

Ya’ll’s own documents indict you horrifically.

Ya’ll’s own behaviors and attitudes worsen the picture.

. . . including hereon.


33 posted on 03/14/2010 6:38:34 PM PDT by Quix (BLOKES who got us where we R: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: wmfights

Not surprising coming from a man who went from being a pagan to a Bishop in your church in about 2 weeks time. Why not look how Mary’s title has evolved over time.

Mary was called woman by Jesus

Mary was called woman by Paul

Mary was called suitable vessel by Ignatius

Mary was called new Eve by Justin Martyr

Mary was called advocate (intercessor, comforter) by Irenaeus

Mary was called ever virgin Mother of God by Origen.

All this evolution of her title in just 200 yrs, so “Temple of God” after another hundred years isn’t surprising. It doesn’t make it right, though.

#####################

INDEED.

And it is just THAT SORT OF EVOLUTIONARY

!!!!!!!!!!!!!RELIGION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

that resulted in a 2 foot thick curtain hiding the Holy of Holies that was rent when Christ was on The Cross.

It was JUST THAT sort of RELIGION that Christ was MOST hostile to.

And, re Mary, your labels did not include the most horrifically blasphemous and idolatrous that are available from their own officially approved documents.


34 posted on 03/14/2010 6:41:54 PM PDT by Quix (BLOKES who got us where we R: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: Quix

I wasn’t addressing you.

I pray for my protestant brethern.

I won’t dispute with them.

John 17:21 That they all may be one, as thou, Father, in me, and I in thee; that they also may be one in us; that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. 22 And the glory which thou hast given me, I have given to them; that they may be one, as we also are one: 23 I in them, and thou in me; that they may be made perfect in one: and the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast also loved me.


35 posted on 03/14/2010 6:41:59 PM PDT by TASMANIANRED (Liberals are educated above their level of intelligence.. Thanks Sr. Angelica)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: AnAmericanMother

For all of us men without “woman” we have no life if “woman” does not cooperate with the divine. In Mary’s case her cooperation was her “yes”.

I often call my wife “woman”. Usually when she does something that brings joy to my heart. eg. “Woman, if it weren’t for you I’d be lost. Thank you for putting that in perspective”.

It is only one who disdains God’s creation or opposes His divine plan that would find “woman” offensive or degrading.


36 posted on 03/14/2010 6:43:47 PM PDT by big'ol_freeper ("Anyone pushing Romney must love socialism...Piss on Romney and his enablers!!" ~ Jim Robinson)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: NYer

No one has ever claimed that one that calls himself a protestant is saved.. sounds like this guy is wandering in a spiritual fog ...absolutely lost


37 posted on 03/14/2010 6:45:49 PM PDT by RnMomof7
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Quix
Lord have mercy, what a terrible thing to say about your fellow Christians.

Please try to have some charity and humility. As C.S. Lewis said, at the Last Judgment there will be surprises. It's so much easier to endure them if you've been charitable.

38 posted on 03/14/2010 6:48:50 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: AppyPappy
Most blessed lady, I who am the most evil and sinful of men do not recall your sins as a reproach, but call upon the boundless mercy by which they were blotted out...

sure does not sound like it is to God

39 posted on 03/14/2010 6:50:35 PM PDT by RnMomof7
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: Quix; Alamo-Girl; Amityschild; Brad's Gramma; Cvengr; DvdMom; firebrand; GiovannaNicoletta; ...
I do NOT find that at all a BIBLICAL label, however.

Well it's not at all surprising, dear brother in Christ, that you find the description of Mary as "the temple of God" ISN'T "biblical."

I readily concede: It ISN'T, in the sense that that particular "label" is not to be found explicitly stated in the biblical texts.

But that does NOT make it specifically UNbiblical, either. What biblical truth does it contradict?

And even you conceded it's "logical."

40 posted on 03/14/2010 6:51:22 PM PDT by betty boop (Moral law is not rooted in factual laws of nature; they only tell us what happens, not what ought to)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Tax-chick

Thanks, I’ll look for the DeWohl book...


41 posted on 03/14/2010 6:53:24 PM PDT by hstacey (An ounce of pretension is worth a pound of manure...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: Quix

Does it help that St. Paul calls the body of any Christian a “Temple of the Holy Spirit”?

Or, when Mary visits her cousin Elizabeth, according to Luke, “And when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, the baby leaped in her womb. And Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit, ...” Mary, of course, has already been visited by and filled with the Holy Spirit.

This is just what occurs to me immediately from the Bible. I’m sure a lot more could be made of it.


42 posted on 03/14/2010 6:55:42 PM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Cicero; Amityschild; Brad's Gramma; Cvengr; DvdMom; firebrand; GiovannaNicoletta; Godzilla; hope; ..

Paul calling believers temples of Holy Spirit

is an indictment

AGAINST

all the Marian excesses vs a support of them.

It is a declaration that all believers are equal before The Cross and before God in such regards.

NO special stature or status for Mary inherent there, at all.


43 posted on 03/14/2010 6:58:04 PM PDT by Quix (BLOKES who got us where we R: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: Quix
The title of this thread is misleading : "A Protestant Discovers Mary."

The author is now a Roman Catholic..."Mills, a convert from the Episcopal Church..."

The only thing Protestants discover about Mary is that she was a simple Jewish girl blessed by God to carry the Christ child to term.

Beyond that, Jesus tells us if we are looking for His mother and brothers and sisters we must look to His many followers who are His true family.

Mariology is pagan. It is the most obvious error of the church in Rome. And Rome will have to account for every person it leads into idolatry.

44 posted on 03/14/2010 6:58:34 PM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Quix
Paul calling believers temples of Holy Spirit is an indictment AGAINST all the Marian excesses vs a support of them. It is a declaration that all believers are equal before The Cross and before God in such regards. NO special stature or status for Mary inherent there, at all.

AMEN!

45 posted on 03/14/2010 6:59:25 PM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: Quix; Cicero

Quix, Doesn’t make sense to me.

Not an indictment. Otherwise, you could not claim to be a charismatic and enflamed with the gifts, fruits and charismatic gifts of the Holy Spirit.


46 posted on 03/14/2010 7:00:56 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: AnAmericanMother; Quix
But the opinion of C.S. Lewis is not superior to Scripture nor the clear reading of the Second Commandment which forbids us to kneel in prayer to anyone but the Triune God.

Scripture tells us there is only "one God and one mediator between God and men, Christ Jesus."

47 posted on 03/14/2010 7:05:17 PM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 38 | View Replies]

To: Salvation; Quix

“for, behold, from henceforth all generations shall call me blessed.”

—Luke 1:48


48 posted on 03/14/2010 7:05:41 PM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

To: betty boop; Amityschild; Brad's Gramma; Cvengr; DvdMom; firebrand; GiovannaNicoletta; Godzilla; ...
The Pharisees could trace all their 100’s of embellished laws back to the 10 Commandments if pressed to do so.

Nevertheless, Christ as God censured them most fiercely for layering on top of God's commandments commandments of men . . . and engineering excuses thereby to render God's law and will of no effect.

RELIGION does that.

The tedious rationales for a lot of the Marian stuff

SOUNDS logical to a point, particularly when one puts one’s self as best as one can within the frame of reference and skin of a Roman Catholic et al.

However, building such enormous sky-scrapers of EXTRABIBLICAL MARIAN STUFF [to put it politely] on top of the

Biblical toothpick ‘foundation’ of “Mary full of Grace . . . “

is horrific.

From Mary ‘temple of God’ we end up by incremental evolutionary steps to

“6 - ‘As Mother of the Word Incarnate, Mary was elevated to a certain equality with the Heavenly Father.’”

ni•hil ob•stat (n h l b stät , -st t , n -)
n.
1. Roman Catholic Church An attestation by a church censor that a book contains nothing damaging to faith or morals.
2. Official approval, especially of an artistic work.

WITH

RICHARD CARDINAL CUSHING’S IMPRIMATUR

--John Ferraro's TEN . . . MEDITATIONS . . . OF THE ROSARY

That level of UNMITIGATED IDOLATROUS BLASPHEMY is screamingly outrageous, to me. I have difficulty understanding how even any Roman Catholic et al/Vatican associate who puts God first would fail to see it similarly.

49 posted on 03/14/2010 7:08:27 PM PDT by Quix (BLOKES who got us where we R: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: AnAmericanMother

No.

As Scripture declares . . .

OPEN REBUKE IS BETTER THAN SECRET LOVE.


50 posted on 03/14/2010 7:10:23 PM PDT by Quix (BLOKES who got us where we R: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 38 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-100101-150151-200 ... 751-762 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson