Posted on 05/31/2010 6:33:12 AM PDT by Cronos
1. Where does the Bible claim sola scriptura?
2. 2 Timothy 3:16-17 says "All Scripture is given by inspiration of God and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteous- ness; That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works." --> it doesn't say that Scriptura is sufficient, just that it is profitable i.e. helpful. the entire verse from 14 to 17 says "But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; and that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is given by inspiration of God (Greek: theopneustos = "God-breathed"), and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works"
3. Where else do we have the term "sola scriptura" in the Bible?
4. Matthew 15 - Jesus condemns corrupt tradition, not all tradition. At no point is the basic notion of traidition condemned
5. 2 Thessalonians 2:15 "So then, brehtern, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter"
6. 1 Timothy 3:14-15
14Although I hope to come to you soon, I am writing you these instructions so that, 15if I am delayed, you will know how people ought to conduct themselves in God's household, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of the truth.note that the Pillar and Foundation of the Truth is The Church of the Living God
Try John 10:35 - the scriptures cannot be broken And
John 5:39 search the scriptures. Here it shows that the Scriptures are to be the guidance. If you have traditions, what do you have for their basis? These two are intertwined. You cannot have me prove a negative, but you must prove the basis, origin and acceptance from The Creator before they can be accepted as doctrine.
“Sabbath commemorates a finished creation with rest, the last day of the week. In contrast, Sunday is the dawn of the new day, of a new covenant.”
Nowhere in the Bible does it teach this. Sure the disciples preached on the first day of the week (as well as the other days of the week) but if the first day (or eighth day if you prefer) were to be recognized as The New Day to worship from henceforth, it would have been proclaimed as clearly as the Sabbath one (Thou shalt . . . )
By the way why does the fourth commandment start with REMEMBER the the Sabbath as though mankind would forget?
Both Orthodox and Catholic Churches follow the same Apostolic Tradition. Which points do you find core doctrine different?
Is that supposed to mean something other than God hears prayers?
The Orthodox are just like the Protestants,and Moslem, divided, and basically agree to not disagree, so as to present themselves as a unified body.
That said, if you were to argue that a certain group of Orthodox are united worldwide and are the Apostolic Universal Church, well then, you have only two choices as to what Church follows apostolic oral tradition and correctly interprets scipture correctly, is the final authority on scripture "(2 Peter 3:16) "As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are certain things hard to be understood, which the unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, to their own destruction.(2 Peter 3:16).
The two choices are The Catholic Church or one of the Orthodox branches.
One would be better off with either choice, than with their own one man religion, being one man infallible authority of himself, as are the Protestant "bible only" interpreters (all of Protestantism).
As to which to pick Catholic or Orthodox that's your job to figure out. At least I've eliminated all the chaff for you. It's down to two.
Never doubt the Power of God. He used these "fallible Church councils and Patriarchs" to His Purpose.
Doesn't matter - Scripture is scripture, and is a unified whole.
Jesus condemned corrupt tradition, but yet said that He came to fulfil tradition.
No He didn't. He said that He came to fulfill SCRIPTURE. Look it up.
Holy Tradition of itself in no way contradicts Scripture -- how can it when Scripture was birthed from Tradition (how else would you know that The Acts of Paul are not scripture while Jude is?)
The Holy Spirit guided Christians into a knowledge of what was Scripture and what was not (John 16:13, I John 2:20,27), and this happened long before any councils.
How was scripture compiled? At councils in The Church through the grace of God and in the environment of Holy Tradition. If you discount Tradition, then on what basis do you say that you have an infallible collection of books? Or would you state that you have a fallible collection of infallible books?
The Holy Spirit who guided early Christians into all truth. Indeed, scholars now recognise that the entirety of the NT (and only the NT, not the "Gospel of Peter" and other nonsensical books) was widely recognised across early Christianity by 200 AD - long before any council. Indeed, the entirety of Catholicism's Sorellian myth is flat wrong.
Easy - you judge them by the Bible. Both fail the test, however.
The Unbelief of the Jews 22Then came the Feast of Dedication[b] at Jerusalem. It was winter, 23and Jesus was in the temple area walking in Solomon's Colonnade. 24The Jews gathered around him, saying, "How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Christ,[c] tell us plainly." 25Jesus answered, "I did tell you, but you do not believe. The miracles I do in my Father's name speak for me, 26but you do not believe because you are not my sheep. 27My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. 28I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand. 29My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all[d]; no one can snatch them out of my Father's hand. 30I and the Father are one." 31Again the Jews picked up stones to stone him, 32but Jesus said to them, "I have shown you many great miracles from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?" 33"We are not stoning you for any of these," replied the Jews, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God." 34Jesus answered them, "Is it not written in your Law, 'I have said you are gods'[e]? 35If he called them 'gods,' to whom the word of God came—and the Scripture cannot be broken— 36what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, 'I am God's Son'?
31"If I testify about myself, my testimony is not valid. 32There is another who testifies in my favor, and I know that his testimony about me is valid. 33"You have sent to John and he has testified to the truth. 34Not that I accept human testimony; but I mention it that you may be saved. 35John was a lamp that burned and gave light, and you chose for a time to enjoy his light. 36"I have testimony weightier than that of John. For the very work that the Father has given me to finish, and which I am doing, testifies that the Father has sent me. 37And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard his voice nor seen his form, 38nor does his word dwell in you, for you do not believe the one he sent. 39You diligently study[c] the Scriptures because you think that by them you possess eternal life. These are the Scriptures that testify about me, 40yet you refuse to come to me to have life.Again, this actually says that Jesus uses testimony of John as well as of JEWISH Scripture. Furthermore, this too, does not say Scripture is sufficient, it does not say SOLA Scriptura.
1) I Corinthians 4:6 - Now these things, brethren, I have figuratively applied to myself and Apollos for your sakes, so that in us you may learn not to exceed what is written, so that no one of you will become arrogant in behalf of one against the other. - NASV
2) NKJV says,.."not to think beyond what is written.."
3) KJV says, "..not to think of men above that which is written..."
4) The Greek Word (γράφω) translated "written" in the above texts is graphō. It literally means to 'engrave' or 'cut in' or to 'form letters with a stylus'. No wiggle room here to waffle around and say its somehow figurative.
5) Traditions are great EXCEPT when they contradict with that which is written. Notice what the KJV said again above "do not think of men above that which is written." Paul is saying no man is to exceed Scripture and no teaching of man is to contradict Scripture. So if your traditions are contrary to what has been written - its not of God - and it doesn't matter what 'church' is teaching it, or what 'man' is teaching it for that mattter.
When you elevate tradition and the teachings of men above Scripture you are treading on very dangerous ground. You leave yourself open to and subject to all sorts of error and false teaching. This was precisely why Paul was very clear not to 'exceed' that which is written.
Catholic tradition is largely the product of centuries of gradual development that followed the apostasy of much of Christianity after Constantine. What we know of today as "Catholicism," in fact, only appeared in its recognisable form after Augustine, in the 5th century.
It's interesting to see the parallels between Catholicism and Islam in this regard. Both consider themselves to have sprung forth unaided and in final form from a primeval source, yet both, in reality, are the product of a long period that saw the gradual development of a system of traditions which were then crystallised by the priestly caste and "retro-engineered" back onto their myth of primeval origin.
Pick one of these:
(1)Man shall not live by bread ALONE, but by every Word of God.
(2)Man shall not live by bread ALONE, but by the traditions of man.
(3)Man shall not live by bread ALONE, but by what my priest and church tell me is so.
Who exactly says that the Sabbath is destroyed? No one. As a Christian you don’t think the day your Saviour rose is a day of great joy and praise? And Christ rose on the 8th day.
Yes, God deputizes those to collect the prayers to bring them to him. the deputies are no more than carriers.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.