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The Coalescing of the Christian Right with Apostolic Dominionism (the NAR)
Herescope ^ | April 8, 2010 | Rev. Dr. Orrel Steinkamp/Herescope

Posted on 05/31/2010 12:45:53 PM PDT by TwoLegsGood

The Coalescing of the Christian Right with Apostolic Dominionism

It is not about FREEDOM, it is about DOMINION

"The NEW BREED of Christian is poised to take over the earth, precinct by precinct. God's Army is rising up. It is time to put on the militant garb. The glint in the eye becomes fixed as the exhilaration of the hour sweeps through the masses. They can make a difference! The world has been waiting with bated breath for this LAST DAY GENERATION.

False prophets in their midst are caught in sin, under discipline, yet their tapes sell to believers of their false prophecies.

The call for unity is the common cause bringing them from every denomination. They are calling their unity "revival."

After all, when they have set up the Kingdom here on the earth - they will have fulfilled the mandate given to Adam to subdue the earth. A new sound is heard in the land. The music gets louder and the beat gets stronger (even bringing in rock, metal, and funk) but oddly enough the lyrics are always the same! - The choruses proclaiming the triumphant song of the conquerors!"

"The Kingdomizers Have Arrived!" Discernment Newsletter, May/June 1992

Note to Herescope readers:

What follows may be the most important article ever published by Discernment Ministries in its 21 year history.

The first edition of the Discernment Newsletter, published in May 1990 began chronicling the activities of a group of men calling themselves "prophets" and "apostles," claiming to have extra-biblical revelation and calling to build an elite army to take over the Earth.

This obscure cult infiltrated Pentecostal circles with its doctrines, but it wasn't until these "Kansas City Prophets," as they were called, connected with C. Peter Wagner from Fuller Theological Seminary, that they gained great momentum and helped to form the basis of what Wagner calls "The New Apostolic Reformation" (NAR).

By 1991, in a little booklet titled Joel's Army by Jewel Grewe, she warned about the extreme Dominionist doctrines of these men. The heresies of this movement continued to gain momentum, especially through the evangelical television media. Nevertheless, most of the leaders were not readily recognized in the mainstream evangelical world.

This coming month all is about to change.

These NAR leaders are having a great big "coming out party" on May Day in Washington, D.C. These New Order of the Latter Rain cult leaders are going to be standing prominently alongside Christian Right and Republican Right leaders in a great convergence that positions them front and center stage.

Their esoteric Dominionist doctrines are rapidly becoming integrated into the entire purpose of this event, albeit cloaked in the rhetoric of "saving America" patriotism.

And herein lies the problem. For, under the guise of moral causes, these men intend to change more than the declining culture of America.

They intend to build the Kingdom of God on Earth, "sphere" by "sphere," nation by nation.

-By Dr. Orrel Steinkamp The Plumbline, May/June 2010

In the last Plumbline,[1] I detailed the vast pervasive reach of the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR) and its myriads of affiliates around the globe. From that directory of affiliates we saw a voracious appetite for interlocking organizations.

At some point C. Peter Wagner (Convening Apostle of the International Coalition of Apostles decided rapid church growth Dominion over society could be accomplished inside a democratic process and without establishing a full blown theocracy.

Wagner and Company decided to employ the infiltration of churches, denominations (behind the scenes), expansion of cell churches, etc.[4]

In addition Church Growth strategies employ the "reclaiming” of the 7 spheres of culture, now named by “revelation” The 7 Mountains of Culture, to take over business, government, media, arts, education family and religion.[5]

In Wagner's book The Church in the Marketplace, he points to the importance of hither-to-unknown Market Place Apostles.

Indications are that he is well along and has millionaire "apostles" in place. He calls for a gigantic wealth transfer from the unrighteous to the righteous to finance Kingdom advance.[7]

But Jesus left no doubt that "My kingdom is not of this world."[8]

Jesus alone can consummate the kingdom when He comes on the clouds in power and great glory. Until that time the kingdom grows in the hearts of men and women (wheat among tares).

Neither does the Kingdom start and end with Uber-American patriotic Christian politics.

Having lived overseas for decades, I know that Christians in other countries often look at American Christian politics in bewilderment.

The kingdom of God is not identified with political might and control even as Jesus came not to be a political messiah in this first advent. Only Jesus the King can rule after His return, resurrection of believers, the final judgment and a new heavens and a new earth.

The Great Tea Party Convergence

Forays by NAR Apostles into the political scene in America have been until recently sparse.

But Lou Engle, the bobble head (ala Jews and the Wailing Wall) Apostle,[9] who has his own ministry to youth called "The Call," has been politically active in pro-life and homosexual issues.[11]

Some months ago Engle was able to pray for Gingrich and Huckabee with the laying on of apostolic hands.[12]

But very recently the political stars seem to have come suddenly into alignment. The American political landscape has suddenly changed. A tumult is appearing in the land with the passage of health care reform.

The Christian Right, with its years of courting political influence, is now poised to merge with the new Tea Party Movement.

In times of crisis, natural or caused, things seem to happen faster and opportunities, that would take years, seem to happen in months. There is the scent of rebellion in the air.

Martial Arts and Christian actor Chuck Norris[13] has called for a Second American Revolution. Appearing on Mormon Glenn Beck's radio program Norris promised, if things get any worse, he will run for president of the Sovereign state of Texas.[14]

Surely this is only bluster, but it reveals the mood of many.

Some political conservatives are stoking a political upheaval, and they need recruits. Christian Right people have for years worked the political Right. Now the time seems right (pun intended).

The New Apostolic Reformation, which has been called the largest protestant movement you have never heard of, apparently is ready for a "mating dance" with the Christian Right and by extension the Political Right.

Surely, the NAR must see this as a match made in heaven which they hope could eventually lead to Dominion.[16]

This "engagement party" will be held on the steps of the Lincoln monument: MAY DAY 2010: A Cry To God For A Nation In Distress, May 1, 2010.

Janet Porter, a long time Christian shock radio personality with a turbo powered presentation and longtime political right contacts, is openly promoting Dominion. She has been quoted as saying: "our goal is to take dominion in every area and occupy until Jesus comes." She has not been bashful, and has consigned Christians, who voted for Obama, to Hell. I am sure glad I didn't vote for Obama.

Porter apparently is the matchmaker. She is the organizer of the MAY DAY event. For her years in the pro life struggle we can only commend her.

But now she has assumed a role much greater than herself and the Kingdom of God, unless of course you see the Kingdom of God as a political kingdom.

Janet Porter has taken the initiative to organize the May Day event. She has coaxed James Dobson to come out of semi retirement. A bevy of traditional evangelical leaders will now include three of the most prominent NAR Leadership: Chuck Pierce heir apparent (see the last Plumbline), Dutch Sheets who appears to be third in line to the throne (if no palace intrigue occurs), and Cindy Jacobs, (the most prominent of all the prophets and prophetess (Apostolic Council of Prophetic Elders[23]).[24]

At the rally on the Lincoln monument the 7 Mountains Scheme of Dominion will be publicly prayed.[25]

How was this all arranged?

It appears that Janet Porter herself had the leading role. It took place at Cindy Jacobs "Convergence 2010: A Cry To Awaken A Nation.”[26]

All the NAR heavies were there, including Peter Wagner, Lance Wallnau (who only lectures on 7 Mountains Dominionism), Ed Silvoso, and Jim Garlow (recently appointed to Newt Gingrich's Renewing American Leadership (ReAL) organization[29]).

During the conference Porter prayed publicly that God would grant control of the media. She suggested taking over CBS and renaming it the Christian Broadcasting System. It appears that the media is the first of the Seven Mountains to be conquered for the kingdom.

Where will this leave CBN, TNN and God TV which now reaches 212 countries? In passing, Cindy Jacobs did not disappoint the conference thrill seekers. She told of the Seraphim coming into her room and catching it on fire.[31]

But, before the MAY DAY 2010 conference, a Freedom Federation Summit is scheduled for April 15, National Tax Day and hosted by Liberty University.[32] This will be a more overtly political event. Many political operatives will be there, including our own Minnesota Governor Tim Pawlenty (Republican candidate wannabe), Governor Perry of Texas, the newly elected Governor of Virginia Bob McDonnell and Ken Cuccinelli (Virginia Attorney General attempting to block health care reform), Newt Gingrich, Gary Bauer, Neocon Frank Gaffney, Ann Graham Lotz, and of course Jonathan Falwell.

But significantly in the list of dignitaries invited for the very first time are Lou Engle[33], Rick Joyner,[34] and Lance Wallnau, an “apostle” promoting the 7 Mountains Dominion teaching.[35]

Also listed are Cindy Jacobs, Bishop Harry Jackson (touted as a "modern day Martin Luther King"[36]), and Samuel Rodriguez[37], all NAR Apostles.

Sarah Palin, having been prayed for by an Apostle named Thomas Muthee in Alaska regarding the "7 Mountains scheme", will be there in spirit.[38]

All of this will give the NAR a respected place in Christian Right and national politics. But the agenda of NAR goes beyond social values and politics. This agenda is to infiltrate, to dominate.

Samuel Rodriguez is an apostle who is also a passionate speaker/orator. He heads Wagner's National Christian Hispanic Leadership Council and has also been invited to the Freedom Federation Summit at Liberty University April 15. Speaking earlier at a Rick Joyner's Oak Initiative gathering at Fort Mill, with great emphasis, Rodriguez rallied the crowd asserting that the Oak Initiative, Joyner's political action group, is...

"the New Jerusalem and also Washington DC. We will mobilize for cultural reformation, not just engagement. We will not be held hostage by a donkey or an elephant." How better to express the Dominion Mandate.[39]

Rachel Tabachnick commented:

"Imagine for a moment that a very large block of the evangelical world decided to reorganize into a hierarchy somewhat like the Roman Catholic Church with leaders (Apostles) in authority over each nation, region and city....

Peter Wagner has streamlined this ideology and named it the NAR. Wagner is the presiding apostle of the ICA which includes 40 nations and prayer warrior community networks in all 50 states and worldwide."[40]

The merging of Christian Right Politics and Apostolic/Prophetic Dominionism is a giant leap forward for the Dominion Mandate they espouse.

“Apostle” Jim Laffoon has written:

"Have you ever wondered why we have spent two thousand years reaching the the same nations OVER and OVER and OVER again? It's because we've only set the goal of reaching them, and not understanding what it is to rule them... Before it is all done, God will give us hundreds of Apostles and Prophets... for they will equip the greatest army of professionals... the world has ever seen.... We believe that the Kingdom of God can come upon the earth as it is in heaven... We believe we will produce a generation that will not only reach but rule. We are called to change history. We are called to produce a generation that will rule. I believe one day we will leave our children Nations and Regions and Continents."[41]

The Truth:

"A wonderful and horrible thing is committed in the land; The prophets prophesy falsely, and the priests bear rule by their means; and my people love to have it so: and what will ye do in the end thereof?" (Jeremiah 5:30-31)...

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ENDNOTES scroll down

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TOPICS: Apologetics; Charismatic Christian; Religion & Politics; Theology
KEYWORDS: antichrist; chucknorris; dominionism; lakeland; nar; theocracy
The NAR is the biggest modern religious movement that "nobody has ever heard of."

Will repost the links in Dr. Steinkamp's endnotes of this article next so the links can be accessed.

1 posted on 05/31/2010 12:45:54 PM PDT by TwoLegsGood
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To: TwoLegsGood
Endnotes: 1. Rev. Dr. Orrel Steinkamp, “Chuck Pierce, The Kabbalist Apostle and Heir Apparent for the NAR,” The Plumbline, Vol. 15, No. 2, March/April 2010, posted at: http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/orrel40.pdf

2. International Coalition of Apostles, http://www.apostlesnet.net/. For a brief overview, see these webpages: http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/allfalseapostles.html and http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/newapostolic.html

3. Dominion is a crucial concept to understand the significance of this article. See this paper for a broad overview of the modern streams of Dominion theology in the evangelical world: http://www.discernment-ministries.org/ChristianImperialism.htm

Also read the 10-part series that begins here: http://herescope.blogspot.com/2007/07/as-in-heaven-so-on-earth.html.

An analysis of the current Dominionism in the NAR written by an outside critic, "The 'Lions In the Pews' - Palin's Churches and the Third Wave," by Rachel Tabachnick, 9/24/08 is posted here: http://www.talk2action.org/story/2008/9/24/82239/9750/

4. To understand how they were able to infiltrate, read the series of articles at Herescope that begin here: http://herescope.blogspot.com/2007/02/networking-church.html. Also see this series: http://herescope.blogspot.com/2007/03/networking-for-army.html.

For history see this: http://herescope.blogspot.com/2007/04/early-networks.html

5. See these posts for crucial background information: http://herescope.blogspot.com/2007/06/neo-kuyperian-spheres.html, http://herescope.blogspot.com/2007/06/7-m-mandate.html, http://herescope.blogspot.com/2008/01/seven-spheres-of-influence.html, and http://herescope.blogspot.com/2007/07/cultural-mandate.html

6. Marketplace transformation has been described as a “businessman with the unusual assignment to ‘change the economies of nation.” (Paul Cuny bio posted at http://www.elijahlist.com/words/display_word/8362. See these posts for an overview of this movement: http://herescope.blogspot.com/2006/02/new-breed-for-marketplace.html, http://herescope.blogspot.com/2006/03/apostolic-transformation-worldview.html, and http://herescope.blogspot.com/2006/04/nation-or-nations.html

7. A transcript of C. Peter Wagner’s remarks on this topic is posted here: http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/arise.html

8. See this description of the Gospel of Salvation versus the “gospel of the kingdom” that is being preached by this movement: http://herescope.blogspot.com/2008/02/gospel-of-kingdom.html

9. This comment has to do with Lou Engle’s odd prayer demeanor, which many have noticed, including this reference at http://www.joelstrumpet.com/?p=498:

“Lou Engel is one of the admittedly weirdest and most unique individuals that I have ever met. When he speaks, he rocks back and forth like an Orthodox Jew at the Wailing Wall. His voice is like a grissly bear with a hoarse voice.”

10. Lou Engle is rising to fame. We wrote about him in conjunction with another controversial Washington, D.C. Mall event in August 2008: http://herescope.blogspot.com/2008/07/gods-dream.html , noting that “TheCall, an organization linked to Mike Bickle, Lou Engle and many other New Apostolic Reformation leaders, including many of the old “Kansas City Prophets.” But this is no fringe operation. TheCall and its personnel is interconnected with many mainstream evangelical organizations, including Campus Crusade for Christ.”

Lou Engle’s association with Mike Bickle and the Kansas City Prophets is ongoing and current: http://www.elijahlist.com/words/display_word_pf.html?ID=8502 And his association with the radical heresy of the “New Breed” is still ongoing and current: http://www.elijahlist.com/words/display_word_pf.html?ID=7854 See this important booklet for historical and theological details on the significance of “Joel’s Army” and Dominionism: http://www.discernment-ministries.org/JoelsArmy1.htm and http://herescope.blogspot.com/2006/02/emergent-new-breed-leaders.html

11. See, for example, the article http://www.religiondispatches.org/archive/election08/654/“the_call”_warns_of_antichrist_legislation_in_california_and_beyond/

12. See this article: http://www.alternet.org/module/printversion/145796 13. Additional Chuck Norris documentation can be found in the booklet “My Life in ‘THE WAY’” by Gaylene Goodroad. See this information: http://herescope.blogspot.com/2010/03/my-life-in-way.html and scroll down to the bottom of the page to access her e-book: http://mylifeintheway.blogspot.com

14. See Chuck Norris’s article “I may run for president of Texas” posted at WorldNetDaily 3/9/10: www.wnd.com/index.php?pageId=91103 15. Referring to a comment by Bill Berkowitz, a critic of Dominionism among the Right, where he said: “Imagine that, and you've just dreamed up the New Apostolic Reformation, the largest religious movement you've never heard of,” http://www.alternet.org/news/145796/, March 1, 2010, and “Heads Up: Prayer Warriors and Sarah Palin Are Organizing Spiritual Warfare to Take Over America.” http://www.alternet.org/story/145796/heads_up%3A_prayer_warriors_and_sarah_palin_are_organizing_spiritual_warfare_to_take_over_america_ 16. All Dominionists are agreed on a common core theology that teaches that man can build “the kingdom of God on earth,” based on false eschatology the political, economic and social efforts of mankind will usher in the “Kingdom of God” and “King Jesus.” See this post for a further explanation: http://herescope.blogspot.com/2008/02/creating-heaven-on-earth.html

See also this post: http://herescope.blogspot.com/2005/09/cor-and-compulsory-salvation-are-you.html which explains the Coalition on Revival, an organization that developed the “sphere documents” about how to take over American society. The Coalition on Revival was a key forerunner to the present-day merger of NAR and conservative Right political structures, and key documentation about its roots and agendas can be found in Al Dager’s historical book VENGEANCE IS OURS: THE CHURCH IN DOMINION available here: http://home.etcable.net/hestervanboven/Books.htm

17. See info at this website for the event: http://www.mayday2010.org/ and read a critical commentary summary here http://www.rightwingwatch.org/category/subjects/may-day-2010

Dr. James Dobson promotes the event here: http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/dobson-teams-porter-may-day-prayer-rally and here: http://f2a.org/mayday/Dobson_60_PSA.mp3

18. See Janet (Folger) Porter's radio website here: http://www.mayday2010.org/ and note that she is a regular columnist for WorldNetDaily here: http://www.faith2action.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=70&Itemid=150 19. Listen to the “New Apostolic Reformation” hyper-spiritual warfare prayer of Janet Porter on the video excerpt posted at this link: http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/janet-porter-prays-control-over-media . This prayer took place at NAR “apostle” Cindy Jacob’s Generals International “Convergence 2010: A Cry to Awaken A Nation” conference held March 4-6 in Dallas, TX.

Janet Porter’s prayer is an example of the “spheres” or “mountain” cultural mandate to take over the media, one of the first 7 spheres/gates/mountains targeted to be seized.

Janet Porter’s extreme Dominionism has been noted by both concerned Christians and the Far Left: http://pjmiller.wordpress.com/2010/03/11/may-day-2010-dominionism-plus-another-manifesto/ and http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/porter-our-goal-take-dominion-every-area-and-occupy-until-jesus-comes 20. This is a reference to Janet Folger’s WorldNetDaily October 28, 2008 column "You cannot be a Christian and vote for Obama,” http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=79276 See also commentary on this from the Left at http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/vote-obama-go-hell

21. The Committee behind this event includes a list of who’s who on the Religious Right, including many political leaders, evangelical leaders, major organizations, AND significantly, key leaders of the New Apostolic Reformation. See http://www.mayday2010.org/ The point here is that by being part of this event, the NAR leaders, who were formerly consigned to the wacky fringe of the charismatic movement, are becoming mainstream by their high profile engagement with this May Day event. And these event organizers are apparently finding common ground with the Dominionism of the NAR leaders, a disturbing turn of events. 22. http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/orrel40.pdf

23. Apostolic Council of Prophetic Elders information is posted here: http://www.generals.org/prophetic/prophetic-words-reports/prophetic-single-view/article/what-is-the-apostolic-council-of-prophetic-elders/ 24. Who are Chuck Pierce, Dutch Sheets and Cindy Jacobs? For those who don’t know these names, and may not understand why their presence at this event is so alarming, research their background, beliefs and practices here: http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/newapostolic.html and http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/thirdwaveteachings.html, and http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/narbook.html 25. http://threshingfloor-radio.com/blog/index.php/2010/03/sarah-palins-deadly-delusions/ 26. See footnote 19 for documentation on this point.

27. The "Convergence 2010" conference was sponsored by Cindy Jacobs' United States Reformation Prayer Network (USRPN). Its speakers included: Peter Wagner, Lance Wallnau, Ed Silvoso, Janet Porter, Harry Jackson, Jaeson Ma, Thomas Hall, Jim Garlow, Cheryl Sacks, Jim Hennesy, Robert Madu, Mike Jacobs, Cindy Jacobs. This conference was part of an intriguing strategy called “ROOT 52” USRPN National Prayer Strategy, described as “a 52-week prayer strategy to bring the nation back to it's covenantal roots.” A letter to “Intercessors” from Cindy Jacobs dated 3/10/10 is cached here: http://tinyurl.com/yaazw6a

The Elijah List, chief organ of the NAR, advertised the conference here: Http://www.elijahlist.com/words/display_word_pf.html?ID=8394.

28. Jim Garlow's bio is posted here: http://www.skylinechurch.org/skyline/?p=53 He is connected to Emergent Church leader and mystic Leonard Sweet. They recently participated together at the “North American Conference on Biblical Preaching,” a Global Pastors Conference sponsored by the Billion Soul Network, which has given the controversial Sweet a comfortable mainline evangelical home base.

See http://www.preach.tv/ The program for this event indicates that this is heavy on mysticism, a key ingredient for building Dominionist fervor: http://www.preach.tv/index.php?page=program

29. The group’s website is http://www.torenewamerica.com/ . See this news account, “Newt Gingrich Steps Up Efforts to Mobilize Religious Conservatives,” by Dan Gilgoff, 3/20/09, U.S. News & World Report, http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/religion/2009/03/20/newt-gingrich-steps-up-efforts-to-mobilize-religious-conservatives.html and this press release: http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/newt-gingrich-names-dr-jim-garlow-to-chair-renewing-american-leadership-87906477.html. Newt Gingrich, Jim Garlow, David Barton, Lance Wallnau, Bishop Harry Jackson, Mike Huckabee, political leaders, and a group of other key individuals supporting this May Day event, are taking “The Next Great Awakening Tour” focusing on Dominionism in America this summer, for a mere $3375 per person. (The much-prophesied “great outpouring of wealth had better happen quickly!)

See: http://www.skylinechurch.org/images/NGAtourBrochure.pdf .

Another significant player helping the New Apostolic Reformation to mainstream itself is Tony Perkins of Focus on Family, also on this tour. See this interesting history by critic Bill Berkowitz, "Will Religious Right’s ‘Mandate to Save America’ corral the Tea Party crowd?" 2/18/10: http://www.talk2action.org/story/2010/2/18/114135/151

30. See footnote 19. Note that Janet Porter apparently suggested to Alan Colmes on his radio program that this “footage of her prayer was obtained illegally and that Generals International is considering suing whoever obtained and posted the footage.” http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/janet-porter-defends-her-insanity. Other critical articles about Porter are archived here http://www.rightwingwatch.org/category/subjects/may-day-2010

31. The video of Cindy Jacobs doing this is posted here: http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/prophetic-intercession-future-religious-right.

Note: this is the type of kooky stuff that comes out the NAR, thus illustrating the strange bedfellows who are now politically aligned.

32. Go to http://www.freedomfederation.org/content/summit. See this post for more details: http://www.rightwingwatch.org/print/5018

33. Lou Engle has risen to prominence as a key individual in this barrier-crossing Dominionism movement. His recent activities are summed up by critic Sarah Posner in an October 29,2008 article “'The Call' Warns of Antichrist Legislation in California and Beyond,” http://www.religiondispatches.org/archive/election08/654/“the_call”_warns_of_antichrist_legislation_in_california_and_beyond/?page=entire. Janet (Folger) Porter interviewed Lou Engle on her January 7, 2010 radio show: http://www.worldviewweekend.com/worldview-radio/episode.php?episodeid=15511 and http://www.worldviewweekend.com/~janetfolger/2010-01-06.mp3

34. For a peek at Rick Joyner’s vitriolic call for Dominionism, see this post: http://herescope.blogspot.com/2008/02/dread-champion-army.html

35. Hear Lance Wallnau describing his 7 Mountain Mandate at the video on this webpage: http://www.talk2action.org/story/2008/9/24/82239/9750/ To understand the myth about the “7 Mountain Mandate” originating from Bill Bright and Loren Cunningham, read this post: http://herescope.blogspot.com/2007/06/neo-kuyperian-spheres.html

36. Bishop Harry Jackson was called “the modern day Martin Luther King” at Cindy Jacobs' recent Convergence 2010” conference. See documentation here: http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/harry-jackson-modern-day-martin-luther-king

37. Samuel Rodriguez can be seen here on this video footage posted at Rick Joyner’s Morning Star website. http://www.morningstarministries.org/Groups/1000049558/MorningStar_Ministries/Media/VIDEO_The_Oak/VIDEO_The_Oak.aspx He is part of Rick Joyner’s The Oak Initiative, http://www.theoakinitiative.org, as are others in this movement such as Lance Wallnau and Janet Porter: http://tinyurl.com/yhbtad6. Rodriguez, a Hispanic leader, is a frequent topic of discussion at the Right Wing Watch website: http://www.rightwingwatch.org/search/node/Samuel%20Rodriguez, even though he was one of the signers of the recent “A Covenant for Civility,” http://www.sojo.net/index.cfm?action=action.display&item=100308-civility-covenant as is Bishop Harry Jackson. This is yet more evidence that the Dominionist movement is converging both Left and Right politically, despite the strong “Religious Right” rhetoric. See this Herescope post: http://herescope.blogspot.com/2010/03/covenant-for-civility.html

38. See Bill Berkowitz’s article at http://www.alternet.org/news/145796/, “Heads Up: Prayer Warriors and Sarah Palin Are Organizing Spiritual Warfare to Take Over America,” 3/1/10. Independent research has corroborated his account, and there are many reasons for concerns.

39. See footnote 36 and watch the video posted here http://www.morningstarministries.org/Groups/1000049558/MorningStar_Ministries/Media/VIDEO_The_Oak/VIDEO_The_Oak.aspx 40. See the Bill Berkowitz article cited at footnote 38, where he quotes NAR researcher Rachel Tabachnick: http://www.alternet.org/news/145796/

41. Jim Laffoon, “The Dark Underside of the Latter-Rain,” www.talk2action.org/story/2010/1/28/122133/576

2 posted on 05/31/2010 12:46:24 PM PDT by TwoLegsGood ("...my sin is ever before me" - King David)
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To: TwoLegsGood

www.deceptioninthechurch.com/orrel40.pdf

www.deceptioninthechurch.com/allfalseapostles

www.deceptioninthechurch.com/newapostolic

www.discernment-ministries.org/ChristianImperialism


3 posted on 05/31/2010 12:49:32 PM PDT by TwoLegsGood ("...my sin is ever before me" - King David)
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To: TwoLegsGood

I have no idea how to link to this article’s links, sorry everyone.

Dumb on html tags


4 posted on 05/31/2010 12:50:18 PM PDT by TwoLegsGood ("...my sin is ever before me" - King David)
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To: RJR_fan

Ping.


5 posted on 05/31/2010 12:50:34 PM PDT by Genoa (Luke 12:2)
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To: TwoLegsGood

Well, the last pseudo christian group of similar size “The Jesus Seminar” doesn’t play well anymore so a new group of moonbats was needed.


6 posted on 05/31/2010 1:05:44 PM PDT by MrEdd (Heck? Geewhiz Cripes, thats the place where people who don't believe in Gosh think they aint going.)
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To: Genoa
Well, the post-mil believers can be divided into two camps, with some overlap: Although I appreciate God's sovereign moments of revival, I am far happier to see His kindness transforming my family over the course of decades. "What happens in MY house is more important than what happens in the WHITE house." After all, I can do something with and for my family!
7 posted on 05/31/2010 1:32:14 PM PDT by RJR_fan (Christians need to reclaim and excel in the genre of science fiction.)
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To: TwoLegsGood

Theonomy... dominion theology...post-millennialism...NAR...Reconstructionism...and affiliates have been pretty much discredited. A small minority of Christians yet adhere to these teachings, but the number dwindles almost daily. The Bible does not teach the notion that Christians are charged with forcing the rest of the world to Christianize. Rather, it teaches that Christians are to spread the good news that Jesus died for sins, and are to teach those who believe in Him to follow Him as disciples. Most Christians understand this. The Dominionists ultimately will understand it as well.


8 posted on 05/31/2010 1:33:48 PM PDT by Guyin4Os (A messianic ger-tsedek)
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To: Guyin4Os
Be sure and wrap that talent up carefully before you bury it, so you can keep it neat and shiny and unmarked for the One who entrusted you with it. After all, He doesn't really expect us to do / achieve anything with the riches entrusted to us, does He?
9 posted on 05/31/2010 1:37:49 PM PDT by RJR_fan (Christians need to reclaim and excel in the genre of science fiction.)
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To: RJR_fan
He doesn't really expect us to do / achieve anything with the riches entrusted to us, does He?

You think our Lord expects us to force the world's governmental, academic and artistic institutions to become "Christian?" Or do you think that the "talent" Jesus gives each of us is the responsibility to share the good news and make disciples?

10 posted on 05/31/2010 1:43:48 PM PDT by Guyin4Os (A messianic ger-tsedek)
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To: Guyin4Os
Our generation has been emasculated by the unbiblical dogma that "Lord" really means "guru." One of the primary titles ascribed to God by the whole canon of Scripture is Lord. This is intensified in the NT -- He is the Lord of Lords, the One who reigns above all earthly potentates. The kings of the earth need to wise up, and recognize that they are not the ultimate authorities in the universe. Read Psalm 2.

When the church assembles to pray, we become God's mobile home on earth, and His court is in session. We direct the course of macro history by our prayers, even as we shape the destinies of our children through faithful obedience.

The church invented the university. And we should now eschew scholarly activity? Where do I sign up for my lobotomy, so that I can be a better Christian?

During eras of spiritual soundness, Christians set the standards for excellence in the arts. We once set the pace. Now, our "artistic" endeavors are pallid, second-rate imitations more often than not. But that's all right. God doesn't REALLY expect us to do anything serious with the talents entrusted to us. Mediocrity is good enough for Him, in this era of grace. Quality doesn't matter.

Frankly, it is a stinking REPROACH upon the people of God that the only big-name novelist who honors Jesus Christ in my favorite genre is the Mormon, O. S. Card.

11 posted on 05/31/2010 1:57:19 PM PDT by RJR_fan (Christians need to reclaim and excel in the genre of science fiction.)
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To: Guyin4Os
Our generation has been emasculated by the unbiblical dogma that "Lord" really means "guru." One of the primary titles ascribed to God by the whole canon of Scripture is Lord. This is intensified in the NT -- He is the Lord of Lords, the One who reigns above all earthly potentates. The kings of the earth need to wise up, and recognize that they are not the ultimate authorities in the universe. Read Psalm 2.

When the church assembles to pray, we become God's mobile home on earth, and His court is in session. We direct the course of macro history by our prayers, even as we shape the destinies of our children through faithful obedience.

The church invented the university. And we should now eschew scholarly activity? Where do I sign up for my lobotomy, so that I can be a better Christian?

During eras of spiritual soundness, Christians set the standards for excellence in the arts. We once set the pace. Now, our "artistic" endeavors are pallid, second-rate imitations more often than not. But that's all right. God doesn't REALLY expect us to do anything serious with the talents entrusted to us. Mediocrity is good enough for Him, in this era of grace. Quality doesn't matter.

Frankly, it is a stinking REPROACH upon the people of God that the only big-name novelist who honors Jesus Christ in my favorite genre is the Mormon, O. S. Card.

12 posted on 05/31/2010 1:58:00 PM PDT by RJR_fan (Christians need to reclaim and excel in the genre of science fiction.)
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To: TwoLegsGood
I'm not interested in a Theocracy in the United States, be it Christian or Muslim. Though our country was founded on principles which are derived from Judeo-Christian values, there is NO 'State Religion', or 'State belief system'.

Frankly, I like it that way.

13 posted on 05/31/2010 2:19:30 PM PDT by SuziQ
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To: RJR_fan

There are some Christian artists out there in a classical tradition of Swift and John Donne... but Twilight does rankle me.

Excellent work brings you before Kings.

However those in the NAR believe simply because they are Christian that they don’t have to do the excellent work. Believe me, they are a bunch of the biggest wanna bees towards the arts you have ever seen... most of the names in the NAR have kids that they want to be big famous and rich musicians, artists etc., it is a dullard’s jealousy in the NAR — of excellence. They think they can pray their way to worldly fame in the arts. Sorta like the jealousy of Salieri to Mozart in AMADEUS. The NAR are frightening.

Did anyone mention that they believe they can kill Christians who do not believe the way they do in their “coming Civil War”? Oh yeah, they are also the dread Joel 2 Army. Deluded antichrists all.


14 posted on 05/31/2010 2:45:33 PM PDT by TwoLegsGood ("...my sin is ever before me" - King David)
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To: SuziQ

It may be that there will be an overreaction to Obamanation that allows for these dullard Dominionists.


15 posted on 05/31/2010 2:47:24 PM PDT by TwoLegsGood ("...my sin is ever before me" - King David)
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To: Guyin4Os

The problem is that the NAR not see their murderous folly until Isaiah 25, when the Hand of the Lord rests at the End of Time.

When the Lord promises that He will send “strong delusion” on those who “do not tremble at His word”, He means He will cause them to “believe a lie” and believe that they are “Christians” when they are ... not.


16 posted on 05/31/2010 2:51:21 PM PDT by TwoLegsGood ("...my sin is ever before me" - King David)
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To: TwoLegsGood

I can’t honestly say I’ve ever heard of any of these people, with the exception of the political and entertainment figures named.

But, one name with which I am familiar is in your endnotes, and that name is Chuck Pierce. I’ve found his “prophecies” disturbing for many years, right up there with Kim Clement, opposite sides of a coin though they may be.

That man is some sort of ringer, for something other than the God of the Bible. That’s my sincere impression.


17 posted on 05/31/2010 2:58:17 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry
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To: RegulatorCountry
Chuckie Pierce is a liar of the first order.

A couple of years ago, an enterprising Christian writer named Wyatt Roberts did a little research on Chuckie’s “prophecies for the month” on the Elijah List.

http://wyattroberts.blogspot.com/2008/05/chuck-pierce-teacher-of-kabbalah.html

He was sickened to find out that Chuckie ripped off the Kabballah for his “Prophetic Words of the Month” in his own newsletter and the Elijah List.

This nutcase Pierce actually stole the language and meaning of the Kabballah, in all its pseudo Hebrew language, and said it was a prophetic word from the Lord for Christians..

I believe this is why Wagner and friends quietly relegated Chuck to African hinderparts during the Lakeland revival -- and why Wagner switched from making Pierce heir apparent to the NAR kingship — rather making Dutch Sheets his new best boy. The NAR are touchy about criticism. Especially when their prophets are proved to be lying frauds like Pierce.

Oh, and Pierce wrote much of the Foursquare Church’s demon focussed “Cleansing Stream” materials for Jack Hayford and friends in the early 90’s. (That went real well for the man who started Cleansing Stream... it is amazing how anyone touching this movement falls into sexual immorality, but this is the fruit of false prophets of Jezebel.)

18 posted on 05/31/2010 3:18:31 PM PDT by TwoLegsGood ("...my sin is ever before me" - King David)
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To: TwoLegsGood

Dutch Sheets is another name I’ve encountered and didn’t respond at all positively to his writing, but this NAR business is news to me.

Are these the people on all the prophecy sites going on about “movements” and “breakthroughs” and “Latter Rain?”

They sound more New Age than Christian if so, imho.


19 posted on 05/31/2010 3:37:13 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry
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To: RegulatorCountry

Exactly.


20 posted on 05/31/2010 3:54:23 PM PDT by TwoLegsGood ("...my sin is ever before me" - King David)
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To: RJR_fan
Kingdom HERE! folks assert that God continues to work, mostly quietly and incrementally, as His people seek to obey Him. This crowd stresses the preaching of the gospel, and the Christian education of children. As we become more competent servants of God, our influence flavors our milieus.

And aren't put off by the idea that we might be in the early or middle of church history somewhere, facing thousands of years of future before Christ returns.

Kingdom NOW! folks assert that God has been asleep for quite a while, but now, at this critical moment in History, He's back on the job. Some kind of a wave of mystical experiences is about to smite the earth, and provide a non-stop dog and pony show for the faithful. These folks tend to stress ecclesiastical circuses, like the Todd Bentley Show.

Muenster redux, but on a very scary scale.

21 posted on 05/31/2010 4:24:36 PM PDT by Lee N. Field ("I'm so thankful for the active obedience of Christ. No hope without it." -- J. Gresham Machen)
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To: SuziQ
I'm not interested in a Theocracy in the United States, be it Christian or Muslim.

It wouldn't be a theocracy in any proper sense, this nation not being in any genuine sense in covenant with God.

there is NO 'State Religion', or 'State belief system'. Frankly, I like it that way.

Moi too.

22 posted on 05/31/2010 4:27:52 PM PDT by Lee N. Field ("I'm so thankful for the active obedience of Christ. No hope without it." -- J. Gresham Machen)
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To: TwoLegsGood
Did anyone mention that they believe they can kill Christians who do not believe the way they do in their “coming Civil War”? Oh yeah, they are also the dread Joel 2 Army. Deluded antichrists all.

Another good excuse for stocking up on ammo.

Can you document this from their sources?

23 posted on 05/31/2010 4:29:56 PM PDT by Lee N. Field (An armed society is a polite society. So keep your soi-disant "prophets" off my lawn.)
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To: TwoLegsGood
There are some Christian artists out there in a classical tradition of Swift and John Donne... but Twilight does rankle me.

Excellent work brings you before Kings.

Isn't Twilight the work of a Mormon lady? My kids just discovered Bryan Davis, a Christian fantasy novelist who writes for the YA market. His books are showing up in regular libraries. Bryan is the home-schooling father of seven kids with a passion for reaching kids with the gospel. He donates generously of his time, conducting workshops for writers.

Twenty-some years ago, I spent an hour a week walking around the abortion clinic and asking God to put an end to this evil. After a few months, the focus of my prayer clarified, and I began asking God to raise up Christians who excelled in the arts. The only way to overcome the culture of death is to celebrate life so winsomely that the merchants of death will be exposed in all their sleaziness.

See my tagline!

24 posted on 05/31/2010 5:16:10 PM PDT by RJR_fan (Christians need to reclaim and excel in the genre of science fiction.)
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To: RJR_fan

Twilight rankles me because its author is Mormon.

With you on the Christian sci fi. C S Lewis didn’t do it for me in his series. And Philip Dick is pretty moral but then he flipped out. One of the lead false prophetesses of the NAR, who owns GODTV, Wendy Alec is a nutcase writer of much gobbledegook in the name of her small “j” Jesus.


25 posted on 05/31/2010 5:38:47 PM PDT by TwoLegsGood ("...my sin is ever before me" - King David)
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To: Lee N. Field

Ah yes, the Muenster rebellion.

What the forefathers of the Baptists were doing before they came to the US.

Heard some of this stuff locally a while ago. Not to worried about them.


26 posted on 05/31/2010 5:42:49 PM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: TwoLegsGood

Kansas City Prophets ping


27 posted on 05/31/2010 6:01:27 PM PDT by Alex Murphy (Pretentiousness is so beneath me.)
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To: Lee N. Field
Here are a smattering of quotes. Lee, go read Joel 2 yourself. Joel 2 is about an army that God "sends" but it is an army that is against His own people for purification in Joel 2:25. The NAR jumbles this all up an declare that being in the Joel 2 army is a "good thing" and that they are this army! They even have hymns about it! How can they be of God but used against His own people, though? There is an answer. It has to do with "strong delusion" that God will send. The NAR people will beliee they are "Christians" who are allowed to add to the word of God their own twisted ideas, in a world where false prophecy is okay, where they can mythologize scripture to mean anything they want it to mean. So they will believe with all their heart that they are "God's" as they storm over any Christian who does not agree with their doctrine. It is the great Apostasy.

SUPERNATURAL BEINGS

By Jewel van der Merwe

JOEL'S ARMY ERROR! The DAY OF THE LORD is interpreted by the "prophets" to mean that Christ will come to His Church and INCARNATE [God in flesh] an ARMY of believers thus giving them SUPERNATURAL qualities to execute judgment on the Church. THE DAY OF THE LORD is also construed to mean a time of judgment starting at the Church.

The key text they love to quote is I Peter 4:17: "For the time is come that judgment must begin at the House of God."

The common orthodox interpretation of the text that God will punish the righteous when they sin and punish the ungodly at the coming judgment is quite adequate and clear. Ever since the inception of the Church, the Holy Spirit has been in the business of judging and purging the Church. God's sovereign judgment will continue to chasten, cleanse and purge the Church until the judgment seat of Christ when the saints will receive their rewards and the records of service set straight.

The DAY OF THE LORD as seen through the eyes of the NEW WAVE "prophets" will be a time when JOEL'S ARMY led by the "prophets" will pour out God's wrath on the church. Then for the first time in two thousand years the "pure church" will come forth. In other words, the "blood of Christ" did not avail, nor will it in the LAST DAYS because JOEL'S ARMY and the "prophets" will do what the blood could not, i.e., cleanse the Church. If indeed it takes JOEL'S ARMY to purify the Church, then all the preaching of the Cross from the early Church to the present was in vain. And rather than the "cross" being God's final answer to "walking in newness of life" . . . . we do well to look for another.

The JOEL'S ARMY doctrine as it applies to the Church and the world is not only in total conflict with the "Gospel of Christ", but is a radical new rendition of the doctrine of redemption and purification. By all analysis, it is "another gospel" and poses a real threat to unstable churches in that it is yet another great deception beguiling the Church.

CLEANSING ACTION

The following is a further account of Jack Deere's "bloody slaughter on the church by Joel's Army" that will turn the scene of the church to blood and darkness before perfection. "The Scripture never encourages us to warn the unbeliever of the wrath that is to come. When the prophets speak to God's people, they warn God's people about what's to come. And then he says to God's people, not to the unbelievers, but he says to God's people, let the land, those who live in the land of Palestine, let them tremble' now how could that be? Our Lord Jesus is coming back, we all believe that, but why should God's people tremble?. . He's going to come TO the Church. He's going to come TO the Church before He comes FOR the Church. I Peter 4:17 says that judgment is near and that it's going to begin with the House of God. . . The Lord Jesus before He comes and visits judgment upon the earth, He's going to come and VISIT IT UPON HIS CHURCH. And no one, no one, in His Church is going to escape that judgment.....

"You really want the DAY OF THE LORD TO COME? Woe to you, woe to you who long for the DAY OF THE LORD. THAT DA Y will be darkness, not light.... He's coming in judgment. He's coming to PURIFY HIS CHURCH. He will not come back for that BRIDE. He will come to PURIFY THAT CHURCH and make it HIS BRIDE and that's why judgment is going to come......

"How is God going to bring judgment upon His Church and then judgment upon the land after His Church? He's going to do it with a LARGE AND MIGHTY ARMY. Now what is this ARMY like? He says, first off in verse 3, well first of all He said that this ARMY is totally unique. This ARMY, there's never been one like it and there never will be one like it in ages to come. . . When this ARMY comes, He says it's large and it's mighty. It's so mighty that there's never been anything like it before. .. 'begin the slaughter and begin it in the temple and begin it with the elders, the leaders of my people'. And they walk through the land and they start and they begin to slaughter and you know God has already started that? He has already started with the biggest names in His household? He has already started the slaughter . .and it is coming now among the Church. He'll start with the leaders, but He'll move out into the Church. That's why when He says in verse 2, "It's a day not of rejoicing and happiness, it's a day of darkness and gloom. It's a day of clouds and blackness, like dawn spreading across the mountains.... You really want the Day of the Lord to come? Woe to you, woe to you who long for the DAY OF THE LORD. That Day will be darkness, not light." (Jack Deere, VMI, Joel's Army, 1990).

http://www.velocity.net/~edju/JoelsArmy1.htm

They all in one way or another taught forms of Latter Rain or Manifest Sons theology. Paul Cain taught in true Manifest Sons style that ‘if you have intimacy with God they can’t kill you…the life sap from the Son of the living God keeps you from cancer, keeps you from dying, keeps you from death...’ Speaking of the Latter Rain ‘Joel’s Army’, which he and his fellow prophets were calling out from the church under the apostleship of John Wimber, he said, ‘They will have the kind of imperishable bodies that are talked about in the 15th chapter of Corinthians…This army is invincible’.

Similar teaching about this elite Joel’s Army was propounded by Jack Deere and John Wimber on behalf of the Vineyard Churches.

http://www.swordpdp.com/article005.asp

Bob Jones

Jones was called the 'Resident Seer' of KCP's ministries. He teaches false doctrine, false prophecies and visions, occult dreams and 'revelations'. At one time he was in a mental hospital, where, he claims, he was visited by demons regularly. Sadly, they do not appear to have left him. Whilst there in the mental institution, Jones claims that Jesus came to him and told him "that to get his mind back he must either kill OR forgive twelve people he hated" -

and this man is revered as a 'prophet' of God!!

http://www.christiandoctrine.net/doctrine/articles/article_00093_the_kansas_city_prophets_web.htm

Jack Deere speak of an invincible army. He says, "...they won't be able to kill this army." John Wimber also stated, "those in this army will have the 'kind of anointing ... his kind of power ... anyone who wants to harm them must die".

http://www.letusreason.org/Latrain10.htm

The next point concerning the Scriptures is that the Bible is not the final authority for Truth. Rather, the “spirit” is their final authority, followed by the witness of the corporate ministry. The Bible becomes secondary to this “spirit” and corporate ministry.

Just to illustrate this point, Sam Fife has said that in these last days that whatever the corporate spirit in them leads them to do – whether or not they have scripture to stand on – that is what they will do. In a private conversation, I asked him if he felt the spirit leading him to kill someone, would he do it? His answer was in the affirmative…

…Sam makes it clear that since Jesus went into oblivion and does not now exist as an individual entity apart from his spiritual body (the Church), that we should not expect to see him come again at the second advent. When Sam speaks of the Lord’s coming again, he is referring to the appearing of Christ IN a group of people, God’s elect.

http://www.discernment-ministries.org/JoelsArmy1.htm

The imminence of such a supernatural manifestation was shared with Charismatic Christians overseas. Latter Rain “prophets” from the Vineyard Ministries International visited England as part of their world outreach. Their “prophetic” message was that God is raising an army in these last days to execute judgment and dominion throughout the Earth. They declared that the time is at hand for God to pour out His Spirit (the Latter Rain) on the Church in an unprecedented scale, in fulfillment of Joel 2:28, marking the beginning of the great “new thing” God is doing on the earth.

Vineyard Ministries have held conferences overseas and throughout the U.S.A. Churches and denominations have been proselytized and preyed on with a “gospel” that leaders claim is ordained to bring forth:

1. the greatest revival the church has ever known;

2. the greatest baptism of the Spirit the Church has ever experienced;

3. the greatest Army (Joel's Army) distinguished by invincibility, immortality and divinity;

4. the greatest purging (inquisition) in the history of the Church;

5. the greatest ministry – the Prize of all Ages; and

6. the greatest miracles, supernatural signs and wonders, far exceeding that of the Apostles and Prophets of old.

28 posted on 05/31/2010 6:30:31 PM PDT by TwoLegsGood ("...my sin is ever before me" - King David)
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To: Guyin4Os
Theonomy... dominion theology...post-millennialism...NAR...Reconstructionism...and affiliates have been pretty much discredited. A small minority of Christians yet adhere to these teachings, but the number dwindles almost daily.

They're not all the same.

The difference between the old theonomists and the new dominionistas is this: Theonomy in the Rousas Rushdoony school is a conservative calvinist thing. When we calvinists go off the deep end, it tends be be because somebody's followed a bad argument to its logical conclusion. We don't go in for "new words of the spirit".

These new guys, with their so called prophets and apostles giving them new stuff all the time, they could go absolutely anywhere, and quickly.

29 posted on 05/31/2010 7:13:11 PM PDT by Lee N. Field (An armed society is a polite society. So keep your soi-disant "prophets" off my lawn.)
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To: TwoLegsGood

Thanks for the links, I’ll follow them down.


30 posted on 05/31/2010 7:13:42 PM PDT by Lee N. Field (An armed society is a polite society. So keep your soi-disant "prophets" off my lawn.)
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