Skip to comments.Finders Keepers? - The Evangelical notion that Christians can't lose their salvation is unbiblical.
Posted on 06/27/2010 3:10:25 AM PDT by GonzoII
You're discussing religion with an Evangelical friend. For 20 minutes you've responded as best you can to her pointed arguments against Catholic doctrines like Mary's perpetual virginity, praying to saints, venerating statues, and purgatory. She's unconvinced. You're frustrated. It doesn't look like there's much of a chance you'll agree on anything.
Then comes the jackpot question. "Look," she says earnestly, "we can disagree about many things, but what's most important is that we know we can be saved by Jesus Christ. Tell me, if you were to die tonight, do you know for sure if you'd go to heaven?"
This is the "all-important" question for Evangelical and Fundamentalist Protestants. Although your friend is completely sincere in asking this question (as she's been coached to do by her pastor and the anti-Catholic radio preacher she listens to in the afternoon), you realize that if you don't answer correctly, you'll walk into a sort of theological ambush.
If you respond that Christians can't, apart from a special revelation from God, have metaphysical or absolute certainty concerning their salvation, a completely biblical and theologically precise answer, your Evangelical friend will gleefully spring a "trap" on you, based on 1 John 5:13: "These things I write to you, that you may know you have eternal life, you who believe in the name of the Son of God."
"See?" she smiles confidently. "The Bible disagrees with you!" She then proceeds to inform you that if you "confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and believe in thy heart that God hath raised him up from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For, with the heart, we believe unto justice; but, with the mouth, confession is made unto salvation" (Rom. 10:9-10).
(Excerpt) Read more at envoymagazine.com ...
Correction on above: Gal. 5:1-4, not 14.
That is just really awesome and makes my day!
I’ve been doing some google searches the last few days, looking for a group or forum of people who love to read their bible, especially those who have done so numerous times. Not too many people read theirs, and some say they wouldn’t bother even if they had all the time in the world. I just don’t understand that way of thinking. I love my bible and I enjoy reading it. It’s my most precious possession.
It’s just nice to know that others read their bible too. It makes me feel less alone, if you know what I mean. I’ve never met anyone in real life who has actually read all of it, let alone numerous times, so my heart is singing a bit this morning. :)
4 people now! LOL! It’s like a dying breed almost, you know? Like Americans who have never read the Constitution. It’s just so nice to see your reply. Thanks!
The Bible tells me that the church - (not the Bible) is the pillar and foundation of the truth.
This discussion is ongoing all over the religion board. And I always fail to get a cogent response to one question I have.
To wit: Why do "Bible only" Christians come away from the same authority with disagreement? If the Bible is supposed to be a rule book, why no consensus on what it demands?
Count me as #4 then, I am still fascinated by the trivial details. and plan on another read of every single little word again. I learn more each time I read it.
“If you don’t keep the Commandments, Bud,” you never converted in the first place. If you have been born again - made a new creation by the power of God - do you think you can uncreate yourself?
A changed life is the result of salvation, not the procedure by which we earn it.
Because we are fallible humans. If we were perfect, with perfect understanding, we wouldn't be here.
I have also read every word of our Constitution. Seems that people state it says this or that, so I decided to read every word of it.
Then why did we need a new religion two thousand years ago when G-d had already provided one?
Wisdom (beautiful book), Ecclesiasticus (or Sirach, one of my favorites), Tobias (Tobit, journey along to a great marriage), Judith, and Baruch, too.
"we can't keep the law."
Then you make Christ sound silly for commanding us to to keep it. And I'm talking about the Ten Commandments not the old Jewish precepts aside from the Decalogue.
The "Ten Commandments" are "old Jewish precepts." They never applied to non-Jews, and do not today.
Your words are a perfect illustration of a most ironic situation I have noticed over the years. The more "antinomian," "faith only" a chr*stian is, the greater his sentimental attachment to the "superseded" (G-d forbid!) Jewish laws and rituals, because he finds them in the Bible. The less antinomian and more "action" oriented a chr*stian is (and the more he defends "law" in the abstract), the more hostile he is to the "superseded" Jewish law.
Liturgical chr*stians are trying to have it both ways. If you need a savior, then get a savior and dispense with law altogether. If you believe you have the responsibility to keep "the law," then you don't need a savior (in the traditional chr*stian sense) at all.
Ultimately, as I've remarked several times, all Catholic/Orthodox arguments against Protestantism are Jewish arguments against chr*stianity.
The bible AND the constitution? I’d shake your hand if I could reach through the computer. :)
I learn something new each time too. I could live to be 100 years old and read my bible 100 times and still have a ton to learn. The bible is so rich.
What amuses me is that, after the first few times through, I thought I knew just about everything. I was “enlightened”!
Now I know better. I’m like Job when God speaks to him. (I literally tremble when I get to that part.) Job had nothing to say when God spoke, and I have nothing to say either except that there is only one God, and he is worthy of our love and obedience and worship. And that I love him. That’s all I know.
Gosh, you wouldn’t happen to know Hebrew too, would ya? That would be the trifecta!
This is posted in religion. Why are you seeing it if you are browsing in news?
Once saved — always saved has never made biblical sense either.
Man has a free will and can turn on God at any time.
I have my articles set to “All”. The Religion Forum shows on that setting. He may have it set that way too.
Incidentally, I purchased a Bible on MP3 by Alexander Scourby that is great. Listening to the Bible is a great plus, also, because Mr. Scourby pronounces all the tough names for me, and I can carry it and listen while I drive!
We are declared (past tense) righteous, and we now (present tense) have perfect righteousness before God, not personally, but legally
Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress,or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
As it is written,For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor power, nor things present, nor things to come,
Nor height,nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord". (Romans 8:34-39).