Skip to comments.Church rejects Mormon couple as Cub leaders
Posted on 10/22/2010 2:42:31 AM PDT by Gamecock
click here to read article
It’s “We only worship one god, there is just a lot of them.”
repeat: I firmly believe in God. I also firmly believe that the evil one encourages religious secularism, animosity, hatred, ridicule and war. Just like politics, theres money involved; so, the leaders must keep their followers as followers.
Epic Fail, PD.
Mormonism has nothing in common with historical Christianity and in fact counters it.
Of course to a mormon it 'sounds' like historica Christianity because they've been spoonfed it from their 'living' prophets and extra biblical revelations from day one. Follow the prophet and check your brain at the door. Of course the book of mormon is true - even though we don't have a clue as to where they actually 'LIVED' during those times. Sure the prophet is a 'true' prophet, even though his prophecies don't come to pass or conflict with the prophecy of a previous prophet. And the only 'real' way to translate a document is to look at a smooth stone while stuffing your head into a hat.
Wow, I think I've posted about 50 times to you regarding stuff you've said on this forum and this is the first time I can remember that you ever responded to anything I've posted here.
No, Paragon, the fact is that what us ex-Mormons post here is the stuff we were taught in the LDS Church. You know, like the stuff about God being a man on another planet in a previous mortal existence and that if we were good little Mormons that someday we would be gods too.
Someday you'll be an ex-Mormon too.
I just pray it happens before you stand before God at the Judgment and he personally explains to you that if you thought you could become a God by your good works, that you will have an eternity in Hell think twice about that demonic doctrine.
Actually most of us ex-Mormons are not "Anti-Mormons" since we only want Mormons (for most of us that includes our own family members) to be saved and to go to heaven and we know that most of them are on the fast track to Hell. Believing you will someday earn the position of God is a sure fire way to end up in Hell.
One of the principle arguments against Christianity is how a perfect writing, the Bible, is used to create so many cults. It it were perfect and defined, only one religion would spring from its pages.
But it has fostered many religions; the cult members trash each other, claim superiority over other cults, and then claim the high ground is theirs after waging such poor behavior. They do not set a good example for those who seek spiritual guidance. It is like our political system!
I agree, which is why I oppose the LDS whitewashing of history and doctrine.
The vast majority of Christian denominations don’t do that.
They aren't even slow on the far, FAR front lines!
Thank you, Pan Yan!
Come on down. I’ll make a Danish feast like you’ve never had before. I use butter instead of lard however.
I’ll try to get a young goat shank so Elsie will feel at home.
Paragon Defender Maxims:
"The way to highlight the straw man is to embody him!" "Make the posters the issue, not the issues."
"Make the posters the issue, not the issues."
As of December 31, 2009, there were 51,736 LDS missionaries serving in 344 church missions throughout the world. Their work, often in cooperation with local members, resulted in 280,106 convert baptisms in 2009. Author David Stewart points out that the number of convert baptisms per missionary per year has fallen from a high of 8.03 in 1989 to just 4.67 in 2005. He argues that the number of converts would increase if Mormon missionaries made greater efforts in meeting new people; he points out that the average companionship spends only four or five hours per week attempting to meet new people.
How terrible it is that a handful of Christians post a handful of threads per week on FreeRepublic to counter the proselytizing efforts of the missionaries and public relations campaign of the mormon church. Don't you just feel SO sorry that the poor, persecuted mormons aren't able to have their message heard?
>>Sorry but Mormonism IS historical Christianity restored.<<
So Jesus originally said that he was Lucifers brother? The Bible tells us that Lucifer was originally a good angel that rebelled and was cast out and that Jesus was the Word, and the Word was God, and the Word was with God. Sounds very different from Mormon to me.
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
I suggest you get your facts straight. As pointed out, this is the Presbyterian Church in America, which does not condone homosexuality in any way, shape or form.
Interestingly the liberal PC(USA), tho ones who are more "open minded" probably would not hesitate allowing cultists like the LDS be scout leaders.
Let's let them be Scout leaders! (If Mormons expect consistency that is.)
>>Believing you will someday earn the position of God is a sure fire way to end up in Hell.<<
That is after all what got Lucifer in trouble.
If they want a troop that allows mormons to be leaders, I'm sure they can do that.
BUT I am sure the mormons would be warmly welcomed to participate in the life of that church, up to the point where they would want to partake in the Lord's Supper, teach, or be the husband be installed in an office.
If you peruse Family Search Centers sponsored by the Mormon church, or various online Web sites, you will notice a pattern. Theres Mormon groups of people here that spend an inordinate amount of their time seeking their dead ancestors -- and yours. They go through the same regurgitated electronic and paper record shuffle daily.
To say they have a misguided obsession just doesn't aptly explain it. I mean, imagine you're part of a group that has less than 10 million active members worldwide...and only a few million that claim active access to your inner sanctum temple. And then, I as your "prophet" tell you that you only have to come up with the names and birth and death records of the billions of people who've ever lived...including pre-Gutenberg times (pre-1456).
And then you have to go into the temple and perform "works" on their behalf that will supposedly "save" them...and often it might involve your teen-age son being part of the process in acting as a "proxy."
You can witness many different tactics employed by Mormons seeking their dead that you might find quite interesting. The straw man proxy baptism is a big favorite (it's a "straw man" because there's really no unbaptized person there in that temple!!!) and is frequently preceded by cherry-picking records from other church denominations and has even included baptizing Jews from concentration camp lists!
Another temple favorite is for Mormons to "marry off" dead spirits in these temples using genealogical information, often times totally bogus historical information! ! (It's true)
Let me provide you with three examples as to how Mormons have "appended...[the] life history" of numerous individuals, including Jesus Christ, a Roman Catholic priest, and even a Mormon fundamentalist murderer!:
Did you know that these Mormon tactics include "sealing" records (rituals performed in the Mormon temple) -- that:
(a) Jesus is now "married"/sealed to Mary Magdalene, per our zealous Mormon match-makers?
(b) And Father Damien, a RC priest, was also posthumously "sealed" so that he, too, is now "married"
(c) And a fundamentalist Mormon killer who was divorced was posthumously "re-married" to his ex-spouse.
Documentation for all of these Mormon "religious" acts follow @ the end of this post, if you care to take the time to read them.
Prior to the dedication of the San Diego Mormon temple in 1993, local Mormon families were even "given a packet entitled Family Temple Preparation Material. Included in this written material were about seven pages devoted to "true stories" of temple patrons who were visited by the dead. They see dead people?
The Mormon church even includes accounts of supposed dead spirits visiting their leaders in their Sunday School lessons! Source: pp. 1-2 of LDS Sunday School Lesson
Sometimes they cruise the cemeteries of the dead seeking any fingernail remnant of informational DNA from the dead that could eventually be twisted into how, "Look, we've baptized more dead people who will accept the Mormon 'gospel' and become Mormons in the spirit world." Any record morsel will be devoured; just watch the progression of "genealogical research" that's unfolding in the Mormon church and see what I mean.
After looking over the "PR" side of how the Mormon church is presenting information about their genealogical work, I invite you to new threads coming within the next several days to a week -- a continuation of a series I call the Other- World Series -- which, coupled with Halloween, will shriek your socks off re: the Mormon relationship with the dead and the occult. (They see dead people? linked above was one of those articles already posted this month)
Documentation of Claims A/B/C above:
From article documenting (a) above: On May 27, 2010, Maria Magdelena was listed in New FamilySearch with her birth date as 1504 Israel, and death date as before 1540 Israel. Both years are likely inventions. Along with spouse Jesus Cristian, Maria Magdelena was baptized and confirmed a member of the LDS Church by proxy on April 8, 2010 in the Salt Lake City Utah Temple. She was subjected to initiatory temple ordinances on April 8, 2010; an endowment ceremony on April 9, 2010; and the marriage sealing to Jesus Cristian on April 9, 2010all rites were done in the Salt Lake City Utah Temple. Mary Magdalene is described in the New Testament as a faithful follower of Jesus. Because the concept of marriage is strongly emphasized in LDS teachings, the notion that a spousal relationship existed between Jesus and Mary Magdalene is common among Mormonsalthough that belief is not formal LDS doctrine. There is no reliable historical evidence to indicate that Jesus was marriedto Mary Magdalene, or anyone else. Source: Jesus Christ was baptized and sealed to Mary Magdalene
From column documenting (b) above: "It's blatantly wrong to seal a person who took a vow of celibacy as a Catholic priest and is so revered in his Catholic religion," said Radkey, a former Catholic. Source: Helen Radkey and Salt Lake Tribune strike again
Why is the Lds church playing "matchmaker" post-death with single RC priests? Answer: Lds say single people are shut out of the highest degree of glory in heaven. Therefore, if Father Damien was going to get there, they had to find a way to marry him off -- in the nether world!
This whole religious shenanigans brought this out in a Yahoo Question: Mormons "marry" dead Catholic priest posthumously to a woman he likely never was married to in life. Why?
This whole enterprise is a literal Mormon marriage machine for dead spirits...
From the article documenting (c) above: The LDS Church has disowned Mormon fundamentalists. In sharp contradiction, the LDS temple system systematically validates the plural marriages of dead ex-Mormon polygamists through its marriage sealing rituals. An example of many such individuals is Rulon Clark Allred, who was excommunicated from the LDS Church in 1940 for practicing polygamy...As though killers will share an eternal reward with their victims, Ervil Morrell LeBaron the Mormon fundamentalist behind the death of Rulon Allred was sealed by proxy in 2002 to Delfina Salido, from whom he was divorced. Source: Mormon Church Quietly Endorses Polygamous (Afterlife) Marriages of Excommunicated Fundamentalists
We need to understand that Mormons clarify their belief that marriages are forever by saying that applies only to those who reach the highest degree of glory. So Mormons believe murderers need proxy eternal marriage sealings 'cause they represent the highest degree of works-righteousness folks?
Truer words were never spoken. You do good work. Me? I cook. I just had fifteen artists for dinner last night. Danish frikadeller and red cabbage, scalloped potatoes and roast beef with Danish fried onions. A nice fresh strawberry topping for poppy seed cake.
The leader of the workshop donated the painting shown above to the foundation. He and the group were painting down on the edge of the Vermillion Cliffs near Lee's Ferry at the same place where dear wife fell and cracked her head open last month. She went along as well.
That artist has now officially left the religion. He doesn't do FR but he is extremely conservative.
“They just can’t go in the temple to watch it.” <-— This is kind of my point...
Don’t piss and moan that Christians are bigots for not welcoming Mormons when the family of someone marrying into the church can’t go into the Temple...
That, my friend, is bigotry..
I know, check my posting, I am one of the famous Anti’s and a proud Flying Inman.
I was having a little fun.
Logical disconnect is LDS SOP.
“Make the posters the issue, not the issues.”
You mean you all have come up with a valid issue?
Never seen it. Not once.
That is how one cut and pastes a document or other text.
How does one cut and paste an active argument?
Or are you just tossing philosophical terms out without any clue on how to properly use them in a sentence hoping it will make you sound intellectual enough that some poor schlep will buy your defective wares?
Looks like its over your head. So sorry.
I just KNEW you’d show up with your big list of rabbit holes to run through!
Sorry; but the above is DISINFORMATION from Salt Lake City.
NOW that you know HOW to do it; can we EXPECT you to actually post some data, evidence, facts that would support your side of the argument; or will you continue to infer that there MIGHT be something relavant in the voluminous amounts of rhetoric that your links point to?
Delusions of adaquacy given out in the temple daily.
Narcissistic personality disorder is characterized by dramatic, emotional behavior, in the same category as antisocial and borderline personality disorders.
Narcissistic personality disorder symptoms may include:
* Believing that youre better than others
* Fantasizing about power, success and attractiveness
* Exaggerating your achievements or talents
* Expecting constant praise and admiration
* Believing that youre special and acting accordingly
* Failing to recognize other peoples emotions and feelings
* Expecting others to go along with your ideas and plans
* Taking advantage of others
* Expressing disdain for those you feel are inferior
* Being jealous of others
* Believing that others are jealous of you
* Trouble keeping healthy relationships
* Setting unrealistic goals
* Being easily hurt and rejected
* Having a fragile self-esteem
* Appearing as tough-minded or unemotional
Although some features of narcissistic personality disorder may seem like having confidence or strong self-esteem, its not the same. Narcissistic personality disorder crosses the border of healthy confidence and self-esteem into thinking so highly of yourself that you put yourself on a pedestal. In contrast, people who have healthy confidence and self-esteem dont value themselves more than they value others.
When you have narcissistic personality disorder, you may come across as conceited, boastful or pretentious. You often monopolize conversations. You may belittle or look down on people you perceive as inferior. You may have a sense of entitlement. And when you dont receive the special treatment to which you feel entitled, you may become very impatient or angry. You may insist on having the best of everything the best car, athletic club, medical care or social circles, for instance.
It may have been 100 years, that doesnt mean it still isnt in your scriptures.
To Whom It May Concern:
Press dispatches having been sent for political purposes, from Salt Lake City, which have been widely published, to the effect that the Utah Commission, in their recent report to the Secretary of the Interior, allege that plural marriages are still being solemnized and that forty or more such marriages have been contracted in Utah since last June or during the past year, also that in public discourses the leaders of the Church have taught, encouraged and urged the continuance of the practice of polygamy
I, therefore, as President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, do hereby, in the most solemn manner, declare that these charges are false. We are not teaching polygamy or plural marriage, nor permitting any person to enter into its practice, and I deny that either forty or any other number of plural marriages have during that period been solemnized in our Temples or in any other place in the Territory.
One case has been reported, in which the parties allege that the marriage was performed in the Endowment House, in Salt Lake City, in the Spring of 1889, but I have not been able to learn who performed the ceremony; whatever was done in this matter was without my knowledge. In consequence of this alleged occurrence the Endowment House was, by my instructions, taken down without delay.
Inasmuch as laws have been enacted by Congress forbidding plural marriages, which laws have been pronounced constitutional by the court of last resort, I hereby declare my intention to submit to those laws, and to use my influence with the members of the Church over which I preside to have them do likewise.
There is nothing in my teachings to the Church or in those of my associates, during the time specified, which can be reasonably construed to inculcate or encourage polygamy; and when any Elder of the Church has used language which appeared to convey any such teaching, he has been promptly reproved. And I now publicly declare that my advice to the Latter-day Saints is to refrain from contracting any marriage forbidden by the law of the land.
President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
President Lorenzo Snow offered the following:
I move that, recognizing Wilford Woodruff as the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and the only man on the earth at the present time who holds the keys of the sealing ordinances, we consider him fully authorized by virtue of his position to issue the Manifesto which has been read in our hearing, and which is dated September 24th, 1890, and that as a Church in General Conference assembled, we accept his declaration concerning plural marriages as authoritative and binding.
The vote to sustain the foregoing motion was unanimous.
Salt Lake City, Utah, October 6, 1890.
35. Others were tortured and refused to be released, so that they might gain a better resurrection.
36. Some faced jeers and flogging, while still others were chained and put in prison.
37. They were stoned ; they were sawed in two; they were put to death by the sword. They went about in sheepskins and goatskins, destitute, persecuted and mistreated--
38. the world was not worthy of them. They wandered in deserts and mountains, and in caves and holes in the ground.
~ Wilford Woodruff, 4th LDS President
This enough color and font work for ya, son?
You think getting bitten by a MOOSE hurts?
Just wait ‘til I sic Casper, Jack, Ellie Mae and Gracie on your old flabby butt!
You must be STUFFED!
(Unless they wuz them starvin' kind. I hear they have very little meat on them.)
Yeah; we know...
My question is if all our issues are invalid why bother to respond at all...
While the Church employs an independent auditing department which provides an annual report to the Church, it has not published full financial reports since 1959.
Businessmen and attorneys..where are the theology degrees?
Yep, but Lucifer is the name everyone understands at this point.
How anyone would want to be in the same league as Lucifer by thinking they can be god and even the same as god at some point is beyond me. Just that point alone should scare anyone from ever thinking that being a Mormon is good. Its just plain horrifying if you ask me.
No kidding. Three of them were Mormon Muffins. Still licking my chops. Four more of the cuties were from Chicago and Madison WI. Three from SLC. And a special conservative lady from Oklahoma. Also included were three gay men from San Francisco.
I'm so tolerant when they buy big.
From the 1994 LDS Conference report:
On the other hand, the whole design of the gospel is to lead us onward and upward to greater achievement, even, eventually, to godhood. This great possibility was enunciated by the Prophet Joseph Smith in the King Follet sermon (see Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pp. 342-62) and emphasized by President Lorenzo Snow. It is this grand and incomparable concept: As God now is, man may become! (See The Teachings of Lorenzo Snow, comp. Clyde J. Williams, Salt Lake City: Bookcraft, 1984, p. 1)
Of course, even Hinckley tried to dodge the fact of this teaching when he hedge in a Time magazine interview a few years later, climing he was 'not sure this was still taught, though he was familiar with the philosophy behind the Snow couplet.'
Really now?!? Which month?
Just how did Jesus "lose" His Bride ???
What are you looking at?
Just watched a documentary that touched on that very subject. So far DNA testing shows this assertion to be...bzzzz.... wrong!
Links please ... I could use it.
Well, I would if I could. It was a documentary on one of the cable stations. I wasn’t paying attention to what station it was as I was at a friend’s house.
Dear Mormons who may be reading this thread,
If you peruse the Free Republic religion forums you will notice a pattern. Theres a group of Christians who spend a great deal of time posting from Official Mormon Sources - both the Book of Mormon as well as Mormon Prophets and Church materials.
You will also notice that many of these Christians are former Mormons who have left Mormonism and come to know the real Jesus Christ and His Gospel of Grace.
They have a passion to reach other Mormons to share what they learned about Salvation by grace and apart from human works.
Of course, they are attacked regularly by a very small group of Mormons who have zeal, but no knowledge beyond what the Mormon Church has told them. They also continually have a difficult time identifying any:
Logical support - that any reasonable person could understand that would validate their Mormon claims.
Consistently, this small group of Mormon posters are forced to face that their faith is based on little more than feelings that cannot be verified.
People deserve more than feelings.
The best they have been able to do is construct ad hominem attacks against Christians, which is always a sign that they have no facts, evidence of logical arguments. You have certainly witnessed this here many times as you read these threads, so I am not telling you anything you havent seen with your own eyes.
After reading both sides on this thread and others, you may very well be wondering about what you were taught when you joined the LDS church.
You also may be wondering how to resolve the lack of facts, evidence and illogical nature of Mormon claims. Many have approached those of us who are Christians asking where to find out more and some, even, to ask how to leave the Church and learn more about Christs Gospel of Grace.
Here are a few links to get you started in your quest to know the Biblical Christ.
You should also feel comfortable private freepmailing any Christians on this thread to ask questions about the concerns you have. We always do our best to directly answer your questions with facts, evidence and logical support from the Bible.