Posted on 11/07/2010 6:51:51 AM PST by pastorbillrandles
For, behold, in those days, and in that time, when I shall bring again the captivity of Judah and Jerusalem,I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for my people and for my heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted my land.And they have cast lots for my people; and have given a boy for an harlot, and sold a girl for wine, that they might drink.(Joel 3:1-3)
The prophet Joel saw the Last days as an international trial , with the nations of the world in the docket, and the God of the Universe handing them a 4 count indictment.
The first charge was that the nations scattered God’s people without mercy, even furthering the affliction He had ordained for them because of their unfaithfulness.
The second count against the nations of the world was that they had participated in the partitioning of the Holy Land that God had given to Abraham ,Isaac and Jacob and their seed forever.
The Land was not theirs to mete out, nor for them to decide its fate. The God of the Bible, and of Abraham,Isaac and Jacob, and the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, He alone it is who owns the Holy Land, to dispose of as He sees fit. But the nations have a controversy with Him!(See Psalm 2:1-4!)
The third count is that the nations of the world have “cast lots” for God’s people. As we said earlier, now is the only time in history where this strange charge can even possibly be made.
Where do the Nations of the world meet together to “Cast Lots” for God’s people? There is indeed a congress of nations which casts lots regularly for God’s people, (among a few other things). I speak of the UN.
Interestingly, The UN is composed of 192 member states, 57 of which are Islamic, and virtually vote as a bloc. The member states are divided into several regional groupings of which turns are taken to serve on the UN security council.
Israel is the only state in the UN which is not put in a regional grouping, and thus which cannot serve on the UN human rights council! Libya has served on it!
Neither can Israel ever serve on the UN security council. In 2002 Syria was put on the US state dept list of terrorist states, yet in that same year Syria served on the security council.
The statistics are stunning, for example as of 2002,
* The Security Council had passed 175 total resolutions. 74 of these were neutral to Israel, 97 were against Israel, 4 went against perceived Arab interests.
*The U.N. General Assembly voted 7,938 times for Israel, but 55,642 times against her interests!
*The U.N. Security council(which Israel is barred from sitting on),has either “condemned”,”censured”, “deplored”, or “strongly deplored” Israel 49 times!
*The Security council has passed 131 resolutions, of which 43 were neutral. But 88 of them criticised or opposed Israel, and never an Arab state ,Arab body, nor even the PLO,which is the “father” of modern terrorism!
* The U.N. general assembly has passed 429 resolutions against Israel, and 56 against any Arab states. They have either “condemned”,”vigorously condemned”,”strongly condemned”,”deplored”,”strongly deplored”,”censured” or “denounced” Israel 321 times, and never the Arabs!
There is something dreadfully wrong here, this is more than bias and prejudice, it is satanic and will bring the world into Judgment!
Quoting best-selling author and Bible scholar Dave Hunt ,
“More than 60,000 Individual votes have been cast in the U.N. condemning Israel. Yet not once has the U.N. reprimanded those who have without provocation waged four wars of aggression against Israel with the declared intention of annihilating her. Nor have the terrorists been condemned by the U.N. In November 2003, Israel introduced its first request for a resolution since 1976, asking for a prohibition against Arab terrorists who deliberately target Israeli women and children. Its request was rejected and instead, the U.N. adopted a resolution demanding protection of Palestinian children from Israeli aggression. The U.N.’s adamant opposition to Israel and everything it does is in defiance of the God of Israel and His pledge to restore His people to their promised land.”(Dave Hunt, ‘The Battle For Jerusalem, Chapter 6 of ‘The Gathering Storm’, Mal Couch Gen Ed, 21st Century Press, Springfield, MO, 2005, p. 129]:)
Such groups include the Moonies (with a second incarnation), the JWs (recycled Arians), Mormons (we can all be gods, and service a heavenly harem on our equivalent of Kolob), and rabbinic Judaism (the pre-existent son of God did not come in the flesh).
Hey thanks RJR! Jews are a CULT! You grouped us with Moonies! Going to go buy a tambourine tomorrow and head to the airport to raise some cash.........thanks for your time and expertise on this subject.
Nope...Paul was explaining to the Gentiles how God turned to the Gentiles in the Age of Grace...Paul was pointing out how that prophecy in Isaiah was currently being fulfilled; that Israel indeed has been blinded and God will deal with them later...
I understand that is your opinion but nobody before Darby ever recognized the dispensationalist narrative supposedly given by Paul. Correct?
I imagine many, many people recognized it before Darby after getting out of the bondage of your religion and it's private interpretation of the scriptures...
Non Catholic Christianity for 1700 years hasn't accepted your religion as the one true religion so it doesn't bother me at all that your religion still rejects Israel as God's chosen people...
That's strange. Jesus Christ lives today, and you can easily talk to people who have been transformed by our Lord's vibrant, exuberant, and redemptive personality. All of "life, the universe, and everything" can be understood and appreciated when viewed through the lens of this one man's biography. The redeemed of the Lord experience great gladness in knowing that their sins are atoned for, that new birth / new life is possible, that God is present among us today, that the Eternal has intruded into time through Jesus of Nazareth, and continues to do so into our lives through that same Person. Our God is good, He has made Himself known, and life is deeply significant because of Jesus.
Jewish folks do a lot of overcompensating, since the most important event in all of recorded history happened in their back yard, on their watch -- and most of them missed it. Were asleep at the switch. To their eternal loss.
But they don't need to remain outside the party, in the cold with their noses pressed against the plate glass window. They got the first invitation, the first Christians were Jewish, and the invitation is still good. The founding pastor of my church is a Jewish man who got the point, and got with the program.
Come on in, the water's fine! We all (well, almost all of us) wish you well, for this life and for eternity.
So, do you believe today’s Jews are obligated to bring “burnt offerings” today and “forever”?
Christianity is only heretical if practiced by a Jew. Otherwise it is just avodah zarah, worship not commanded by God.
They will finally realize that Jesus was indeed the promised Messiah during the Tribulation period. That is not to say that even today there are Jews who come to the truth and become what are referred to as Messianic Jews. Those who have been “born again” having accepted Jesus as the Messiah. The Nation as a whole, however, have not and will revert and go through the last seven years of the 490 years promised them by God.
OK, that is a indirect way of saying ‘forever’ doesn’t mean ‘forever’ in Christian apologetics. Or perhaps dispensationalism is a forced view in order to have cake and eat it too.
Thanks for that clarification....appreciated and will use it correctly next time...magritte
No, it isn’t. The land still belongs to the Jews. Because of disobedience, God allowed squatters to force the Jews off of the land and to be dispersed “among the nations” until the “the age of the Gentiles be fulfilled”.
As per prophecy, the Jews once again repossessed the land in 1948. The age of the Gentiles will end at which time God will deal solely with the nation of Israel for a period of seven years. Woe unto any nation that comes against the nation of Israel. Read Ezekiel 38-39 and you will see what happens to them.
I really don’t think FreeRepublic is the place for Christian-Jewish dialog of this sort.
Orthodox Jewish people and fundamentalist Christians have a lot in common socially, politically, and even in love of G-d, but there are intractable theological differences, and it serves no reason to bring it up.
Yes, Christians think Jewish people are going to Hell. That’s fine, and most Orthodox Jewish people appreciate the concern for their eternal well being.
On the topic, I think the “cult” slur is novel, and the result of inexact typing, so I don’t take that as an insult.
Now, Reform folks DO think Orthodox and Lubavitchers, in particular, are a cult. If this was coming from them, I accept what they say as an intended insult.
Correction: to the best of my knowledge, that is NOT allowed on FR.
How can you say "nope" without disputing anything I wrote? The fact remains, Paul quoted a well-known passage predicting a "Deliverer" out of "Sion" more than 700 years before the coming of Christ. Such an event has already occurred. Has it not?
Frankly, that is a meaningless observation. There are millions of Mormons who have had a burning in the bosom and have been transformed, stopped doing drugs and alcohol etc. Does that make Mormonism valid? No. Same can be said of Islam. Mormonism, Islam and Christianity are ALL heretical offshoots of Judaism.
G-d is not done with the Jewish people. If you read the prohets, Joel, Zachariah, Ezekiel and Isaiah, the one consistent theme is this. G-d has exiled the Jewish people due to their sin. The Nations have afflicted the Jewish people but have gone way too far. G-d will bring back the Jewish people from the Nations. The Jewish people will be forgiven by G-d, cleansed and the world will be astonshed. The gentile nations will be judged for their abuses. The gentile nations will come to Israel to learn of G-d and the Law and reject the lies they have been taught all along.
That is a synopsis what the Tanakh (OT) teaches.
Or see Obadiah, were the fate of Esau/Edom is foretold. Or Zechariah 14...
Again, nope...
Sure, the deliverer showed up...But NOT as the Deliverer...That won't happen until He shows up again as a roaring Lion...And then, these scriptures will come into play...
Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
Isa 9:7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.
Those scriptures dont have anything to do with Jesus. Isaiah 9
And we will only know who the messiah is, AFTER he has accomplished ALL his messianic tasks, not before, not half way, no down payment, after. Otherwise, people will believe in false messiahs.
R. Tovia Singer, as well as other experts in this matter, say that the real messiah will be accepted by most non-Jews with relative ease. To me, however, it seems Christian eschatology has programmed Christians to launch suicidal attacks on the real messiah, viewing him as the anti-Christ. America seems likely to be the real messiah’s biggest opponent.
Yeah, got to wonder. Hopefully they will snap out of it when the messiah denies his divinity.
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