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To: MHGinTN
Can you keep the law perfectly?

I dont have to. That is why G-d gives us provisions for forgiveness of sin.

In the desert, what did Moses do when the snakes were biting and killing so many?

He made a copper snake and raised it up for the people to see. It was a miracle of G-d and you have to know Hebrew to fully understand it. And no it wasnt picture of jesus.

which you are unable to fulfill.

It isnt about fulfilling the law. It is about loving G-d, walking in his ways, loving your neighbor as yourself and acting with kindness, justice and righteousness.

Micah 6: 6(N)With what shall I come to the LORD And bow myself before the God on high? Shall I come to Him with (O)burnt offerings, With yearling calves? 7Does the LORD take delight in (P)thousands of rams, In ten thousand rivers of oil? Shall I present my (Q)firstborn for my rebellious acts, The fruit of my body for the sin of my soul? 8He has (R)told you, O man, what is good; And (S)what does the LORD require of you But to (T)do justice, to (U)love kindness, And to walk (V)humbly with your God.

By your insistence upon your work to be righteous enough

I never said that.

You twist the meaning of God's Grace to fit your legalism scam.

scam? You call G-ds Torah a scam? You have no idea what the OT means.

You know Abraham was counted righteopus by his faith, before the law was given.

Not exactly. Abraham obeyed G-d when he told him to go to a land. Built an altar, offered sacrifices, went to Egypt, built another altar AND THEN believed G-d when he promised him physical decendants, then it was counted as righteousness.

Abraham's faith was in the Promises of God

Yes, the promises of decendants that would be many nations, not of a god-man savior. That is reading into the text your wishes not what is there.

but your own words show your faith is in your ability to be 'good enough'.

I never said that. Again you misquote me.

You faith is not in His propitiation for your sin nature inherited from Adam. There is no "original sin". We are each responsible for our own sin. Ezek 18. Adams sin has no bearing on us. That is a christian invention.

you are in fact the spirit of anti-Christ

If you believe that...leave me alone. You posted to me. You have zero Christian love in you, so dont waste my time or yours.

25 posted on 11/22/2010 6:48:46 PM PST by blasater1960 (Deut 30, Psalm 111...the Torah and the Law, is attainable past, present and forever.)
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To: blasater1960
By your own words yo affirm whom you serve. You are espousing the very spirit of denial of Jesus. And where you and your work for the spirit of anti-Christ are concerned, I indeed have zero love for you. When you insult my Savior, I am not bound to take another on the cheek so you can do it again unopposed.

But for readers whom you may fool with your endless chatter and denial of your own agenda to deny Jesus as Lord--which is clearly offered yet you deny it, Abraham displayed his faithing in the Promise of God in the very act of telling the young men who came along to the mountain that 'they' would return to them after the sacrifice was completed.

As to stating things not written by you, try it yourself, hypocrite. I apologize if I misinterpreted your inferences, but I do not make such an error in guile. You on the other hand ... You assert things I did not state as if I stated them. But you likely do not even realize when you deceive:

I did not state that the snake was a picture of Jesus; you tried to stand up a strawman so you could attack it.

You didn't bother to ask why I offered that scene as an edification, because you don't want to challenge anything in your tight little scam. For readers, however, the scene of the snake on the pole is God showing HOW TO EXERCISE SAVING FAITH IN A PROMISE FROM GOD. The great mystery of Jesus coming in the flesh was still a hidden secret, but in hindsight one could say that exercising of life-saving faith in a Promise from God prefigures the coming of Messiah. But I did not assert that.

I did not call the Torah a scam, nor did I impugn the Tanahk, since I stated that I believe Saul of Tarsus knew more about it than you ever will.

You have zero knowledge of my studies in Old Testament nor my understanding of Hebrew, yet you try to lord over me some imagined weakness you want to have for a crutch to your scam re-definition of saving faith. Believing God's Promise is what Christianity is all about. You want to sweep aside the reality of Christianity, the Lordship of Christ, go ahead. It is a hallmark of serving the anti-Christ, but don't let that slow you down! When I read the story of Abraham taking that boy to the mountain I see saving faith exhibited by Abraham, and it is directly related to Abraham believing so strongly that God would keep His Promise through Isaac that even if he slayed the boy on the altar, Abraham believe God would raise him up to fulfill His Promise. I'm truly sorry that you cannot allow your mind to see that in the details of the story for it is an essential aspect of saving faith, faithing (as in the verb form) so completely that only believing God's Promise is a given and how He will keep His Promise is completely left to Him for He is not a man that He should lie.

"There is no "original sin". We are each responsible for our own sin." That is exactly not what I stated!

I stated that we inherited a sin NATURE from Adam; we inherit as descendants of Adam a soul with a dead spirit. Perhaps you believe you inherited a different nature from some source other than Adam? You would do well to read the letters of Paul which address these issues and his references back to the Tanahk as his source for enlightnement. He even instructed Timothy to continue in his studies of the Tanahk and used the Berean's daily searching of the Tanahk as affirming work for the Gospel he preached to them and which lead to their receiving the Holy Spirit!

Saul of Tarsus was busy trying to shut up the very people who had witnessed the resurrection of Jesus, Jewish people! And when Jesus appeared to Saul on his way to Damascus 'to get more done', Paul made a 180 turnabout.

Following a period of study and prayerful meditation upon God's Word which Paul was very very familiar with, being a student of Gamaliel's rabbinical school (Acts 5:24 & 22:3 IIRC), Paul spent the rest of his life preaching the Gospel of God's Grace in Christ Jesus.

The resurrection was/is a real event and the risen Christ was witnessed by hundreds before His ascension. Though Paul tried to squelch the witnesses and even stood hold folks coats while they stoned a devout disciple of Jesus, the mere meeting of the risen Lord was enough to stop Saul in his tracks. And then Saul learned the gospel message.

You cannot squelch the truth of that Life giving message by twisting the meaning of faithing in God's Promises fulfilled in Jesus. And that must really frustrate you, eh? Not even Saul of Tarsus would be twisting the meaning of the law as you are doing. And we can say that with confidence because Paul explains his perspective on the law in his letter to the Romans and in his two letters to the Corinthians.

And to their credit, James and Peter also affirm the message of Grace in Christ ... and I will bet James was a far more observant Jew than you appear to be. He understood what gentiles were not under as concerning the law (yes, he was well acquainted with the Noachide covenant well before the coming of the law). James was a very learned and didn't actually fully accept the Lordship of Jesus until after he met Him following His resurrection! Peter was not a studied in the Tanahk as James, but Peter evidences the fire of the Holy Spirit following His encounter with the risen Lord. And after Pentecost, well, God affirmed Peter's position through the miracles written of in Doctor Luke's letters to Theophilus. You and your scam to deny Jesus as Lord are no match for what God has done and is still doing in people's lives.

I leave you with Paul's lament, as a devout Jew giving his life to share the Gospel of Grace:

Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

1 Corinthians 10:1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;

Romans 9:30-33 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith. But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness. Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone; As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. [Romans 10:1-4] Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.


26 posted on 11/22/2010 8:00:28 PM PST by MHGinTN (Some, believing they can't be deceived, it's nigh impossible to convince them when they're deceived.)
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