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Pope Benedict's condom U-turn
Guardian ^ | November 21st 2010 | Andrew Brown

Posted on 11/21/2010 8:09:16 AM PST by Cardhu

Pope Benedicts XVI's change of heart on condoms marks a significant break with the damage done by one of his predecessors' most romantic, wicked and wrong-headed policies. The idea of an absolute ban on condoms makes no sense even within the framework of Catholic teaching. Since the purpose of the ban on artificial birth control is to make conception possible, it makes no sense at all in situations in which conception is utterly impossible. That is why Benedict chose a male prostitute as his example of someone who might use a condom to fight disease.

The really interesting question is whether his remarks are supposed to apply even in cases where conception would be possible: may a female prostitute demand that her customers use condoms (assuming for the moment that either party takes much notice of the pope's opinions)? May a wife whose husband is infected? May a husband who has married an HIV positive woman?

It is with questions such as these that the balance lies between regarding the Catholic ban on artificial contraception as merely the romantic wrong-headedness of celibate men, or something actively misogynistic and anti-human. The matter would be simpler, of course, if the Catholic church banned all birth control. But it doesn't. It is only opposed to the effective forms.

But once it has admitted that it is sometimes all right to have sex for reasons other than procreation – and this is conceded, indeed claimed, by everyone who defends "Natural family planning", then the case for condoms as harm reduction becomes unanswerable. Indeed, until today, the question was the easiest way to make any English catholic bishop squirm. They know that their own flock uses artificial birth control. They did not enjoy pretending to believe that poor Africans should risk dying horribly...

(Excerpt) Read more at guardian.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Catholic; Current Events; Moral Issues
KEYWORDS: catholic; condoms; liberalspin; pope
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"Pope Benedict XVI has cautiously but decisively removed the single most stupid and wicked policy of the Catholic church,"

"I say "pretending to believe" – there must be Catholic priests who believed in that aspect of their church's teaching but I have never knowingly met one."

1 posted on 11/21/2010 8:09:18 AM PST by Cardhu
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To: Cardhu

Why would anyone be dumb enough to rely on the commie Guardian for news about Christians?


2 posted on 11/21/2010 8:11:35 AM PST by vladimir998 (This is when the anti-Catholics start to lie to cover up how they got it all wrong.)
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To: Cardhu

Yesterday this article was totally discredited.


3 posted on 11/21/2010 8:14:11 AM PST by Hulka
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To: Cardhu
Here is the excerpt from the pope's book:
Pope Benedict XVI discusses condoms and the spread of HIV [book excerpt]
4 posted on 11/21/2010 8:17:14 AM PST by mlizzy (Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee ...)
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To: Hulka; vladimir998

Whatever you say if it comforts you.

But, you all seem to be fighting a losing battle and becoming the last holdouts against sanity in the Catholic Church.


5 posted on 11/21/2010 8:22:19 AM PST by Cardhu
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To: Cardhu
The article is not factual Cardu (and the writer of it a hater of Catholic beliefs to boot) ... THIS is from the pope's book:
Meanwhile, the secular realm itself has developed the so-called ABC Theory: Abstinence-Be Faithful-Condom, where the condom is understood only as a last resort, when the other two points fail to work. This means that the sheer fixation on the condom implies a banalization of sexuality, which, after all, is precisely the dangerous source of the attitude of no longer seeing sexuality as the expression of love, but only a sort of drug that people administer to themselves ... --Pope Benedict XVI

6 posted on 11/21/2010 8:27:20 AM PST by mlizzy (Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee ...)
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To: Cardhu

The international left hates the fact that there are shades of gray in Church doctrine. After all, it does significant damage to the perpetual talking point that we Christians insist on seeing everything in black and white.

The use of condoms for contraception is intrinsically sinful according to Catholic doctrine. The usage of condoms when related to the commission of other sinful acts, however, might very well be the lesser of two evils — still sinful yet necessary to avoid causing greater harm. As my tag line says, of two evils the lesser must always be chosen.

Such does not mean that the lesser of two evils is somehow acceptable when a non-evil alternative is available, merely that it is preferable to that which is greater. The Church has never approached these questions in the black-and-white manner in which it is often portrayed.


7 posted on 11/21/2010 8:29:08 AM PST by MWS (De duobus malis, minus est semper eligendum. - Thomas รก Kempis)
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To: Cardhu

You wrote:

“Whatever you say if it comforts you.”

It’s not about comfort. It’s about truth.

“But, you all seem to be fighting a losing battle and becoming the last holdouts against sanity in the Catholic Church.”

Natural Law is sanity. No person ever went morally wrong in choosing to obey God, And it wouldn’t matter if the “battle” were a losing one either. We love the Truth. Ultimate victory is already secured in Christ. Those with little faith or hope in Christ run from the battlefield. Go ahead and run. Go serve your real master. As for me and my fellow Catholics, we will serve God.


8 posted on 11/21/2010 8:32:34 AM PST by vladimir998 (This is when the anti-Catholics start to lie to cover up how they got it all wrong.)
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To: Hulka; Cardhu

But to bigots that doesn’t matter. Ever notice how the anti-Catholic bigots here seem to buy everything the leftist media gets wrong about anything Catholic? Liberals of the same feather...


9 posted on 11/21/2010 8:36:47 AM PST by vladimir998 (This is when the anti-Catholics start to lie to cover up how they got it all wrong.)
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To: mlizzy

But haven’t you yet realized mlizzy this is how the Catholic Church always changes course. Do you think that after persecuting Galileo for saying the earth is not the center of the universe they subsequently said sorry folks we were wrong.

Of course not - it would all depend on which Universe with enough wriggle room to shed their past false belief and yet not make the uneducated faithful´s heads explode.

As you point to this excerpt as proof of no change the Church could also point to the same except in a court of law to deny that they opposed condoms in all cases and therefore, as they said it was, a last resort. Where´s the prohibition?

A great defense to the charge that they are encouraging an African holocaust knowing full well that the more more educated Europeans would simply ignore such nonsense.

Now everyone in happy.


10 posted on 11/21/2010 8:55:29 AM PST by Cardhu
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To: Cardhu; PadreL; Morpheus2009; saveliberty; fabrizio; Civitas2010; Radagast the Fool; ...
+

Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic List:

Add me / Remove me

Please ping me to note-worthy Pro-Life or Catholic threads, or other threads of general interest.

11 posted on 11/21/2010 8:57:44 AM PST by narses ( 'Prefer nothing to the love of Christ.')
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To: Cardhu
encouraging an African holocaust ...

HIV Researcher, a Self-described Liberal, director of Harvard's AIDS Prevention Research Project, Edward C. Green, Defends Pope's Recent Condom/AIDS Statement

"There's no evidence at all that condoms have worked as a public health intervention intended to reduce HIV infections at the "level of population."

It would seem that your anti-Catholic underwear is showing.

12 posted on 11/21/2010 9:09:32 AM PST by Servant of the Cross (NPR: Air America with government funding to keep them alive)
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To: vladimir998
Natural Law is sanity. No person ever went morally wrong in choosing to obey God, And it wouldn’t matter if the “battle” were a losing one either. We love the Truth. Ultimate victory is already secured in Christ. Those with little faith or hope in Christ run from the battlefield. Go ahead and run. Go serve your real master. As for me and my fellow Catholics, we will serve God.

The Great Condom War. Yes, I remember reading about it in my Bible, one of the signs that we are in the last days...{{{sigh}}}...

It's called "standing against the wiles of the devil"; this great spiritual battle that is being waged for the very souls of men. It's a very real and powerful battle that is being fought.

And the RCC is right out front on this battle, fighting over condoms. {{{sigh}}}

What is choosing to obey God? What would God have us to do during this time of great spiritual deception and war? Take a stand on condoms?{{{{sigh}}} I don't think so..

Does the RCC really love the Truth? What does God say about the Truth during the dispensation of the Grace of GOd? It's important to Him, is it to you?

As for me and my fellow Catholics, we will serve God.

If the RCC is truly serving God during this time, then you should know what He is commanding us during this time. Do you?

13 posted on 11/21/2010 9:20:55 AM PST by smvoice (Defending the Indefensible: The Pride of a Pawn.)
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To: vladimir998
Indeed.

Demonstrably a false and misleading article, but yet, there are those that cling to it.

Truly baffling. . .

14 posted on 11/21/2010 9:24:45 AM PST by Hulka
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To: vladimir998

The more virulent anti Catholic freepers would believe any source including Satan himself as being legit when it comes to villifying the Catholic Church.


15 posted on 11/21/2010 9:33:52 AM PST by lastchance (Hug your babies.)
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To: Servant of the Cross
It would seem that your anti-Catholic underwear is showing.

It seems be in fashion as I am in good company with the many bishops, priests, nuns and anyone who actually works on the front line helping the afflicted.

I can also point to studies which purport to show that the last Pope´s actions and also this one has been responsible for the spread of the AIDs scourge across Africa.

The reality is that only a very few Catholics care about what the Pope says about sexuality. Everyone has recreational sex except for the true believers on here that must have either ten children or a very frustrated wife or husband.

16 posted on 11/21/2010 9:34:36 AM PST by Cardhu
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To: Cardhu
“I say “pretending to believe” – there must be Catholic priests who believed in that aspect of their church's teaching but I have never knowingly met one.”

Well I have known scores, including all of the best-informed priests that I have known. I pity people who have only encountered priests who are too intellectually challenged to seek and absorb the proper formation, or too lazy to even bother to seek such formation. I can understand why such people would have problems with the Catholic Church because they have only met losers. Obtaining one’s understanding of Church teaching from the media is similar.

Claiming that the Pope is opening up things a bit on condom use is bizarre.

An analogous situation: A man, while drunk, decides to play Russian Roullette rather than shooting himself in the head with a fully loaded revolver. The Pope notes that the person playing Russian Roulette is not as disordered as the man attempting suicide, and the media responds by concluding that the Pope is saying that it is ok to play Russian Roulette in some situations. I can just about fathom how somebody could be dense enough to reach that conclusion, and with the media to intervene, I can understand how many people are misled. That said, do not think that Catholic teaching has been intelligently analyzed

17 posted on 11/21/2010 9:38:07 AM PST by Hieronymus (It is terrible to contemplate how few politicians are hanged. --G.K. Chesterton)
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To: smvoice

We have not ceased teaching against sexual vice, and for the sanctity of sex (virtuous, honorable sex)in marriage. Virtue and vice, goodness and evil, have a great deal to do with the spiritual battle that is being waged for the “very souls of men.”


18 posted on 11/21/2010 9:43:32 AM PST by Mrs. Don-o (What does the LORD require of you, but to do justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God)
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To: Hulka

And what does it say that they endorse a left-wing rag like the Guardian?


19 posted on 11/21/2010 9:45:25 AM PST by B Knotts (Just another Tenther)
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To: B Knotts

Good point.


20 posted on 11/21/2010 9:50:34 AM PST by Hulka
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