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To: driftless2
How in the world are public schools supposed to include God in the educational process?

They can't! It is IMPOSSIBLE for a government school to include or exclude God in a neutral manner. It is impossible for **any** school (private or government) to include or exclude God in a neutral manner.

Solution: ( How many times must I post this?)

Begin the process of privatizing K-12 education. Vouchers, tax credits, and charters can help build the private infrastructure needed. Eventually move toward complete separation of school and state.

Decisions regarding worldview ( godless or God-centered) must be privately decided between the parents, and the private teachers, and private principals who work for private schools.

61 posted on 02/15/2011 6:52:01 AM PST by wintertime
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To: wintertime
It is IMPOSSIBLE for a government school to include or exclude God in a neutral manner.

Why do they need to be neutral???

There is nothing in the Constitution or Bill of Rights that requires that.

For further reference, I repeat my post from yesterday, plus a comment from one reply.

For those who don’t know:

- The words “separation of church and state” do not appear in the Constitution or the Bill of Rights.

- The 1st Amendment says: “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.” {emphasis added}

- The words "separation of church and state" originate from a letter Thomas Jefferson wrote to the Danbury Baptist Convention who feared a state run religion would be implemented much like the church of England. They wanted to be assured they would not be forced by the state to practice any certain form of Christianity. Jefferson assured them they would be able to practice their brand of Christianity without state intervention. That letter has been twisted 180 degrees to prevent public displays of Christianity. It was never Jefferson’s intent.

- It wasn’t until the early 1960’s that prayer in public school was “outlawed” by a new interpretation of the U.S. Constitution.

- The history of the U.S. includes prayer and Bible readings in all sorts of public places, including schools and Congress.

- In 1782, the United States Congress passed the following resolution: “The Congress of the United States recommends and approves the Holy Bible for use in all schools.”

- William Holmes McGuffey, the author of the McGuffey Reader (used ofr over 100 years in U.S. public schools), declared: “The Christian religion is the religion of our country. From it are derived our notions on the character of God, on the great moral Governor of the universe. On its doctrines are founded the peculiarities of our free institutions. From no source has the author drawn more conspicuously than from the sacred Scriptures. From all these extracts from the Bible I make no apology.”

- Of the first 108 universities founded in America, 106 were distinctly Christian, including the first, Harvard University, chartered in 1636.

- In the original Harvard Student Handbook, rule number 1 was that students seeking entrance must know Latin and Greek so that they could study the Scriptures: “Let every student be plainly instructed and earnestly pressed to consider well, the main end of his life and studies is, to know God and Jesus Christ, which is eternal life, (John 17:3); and therefore to lay Jesus Christ as the only foundation of all sound knowledge and learning. And seeing the Lord only giveth wisdom, let every one seriously set himself by prayer in secret to seek it of him (Proverbs 2:3).”

{Certain excerpts from}

65 posted on 02/15/2011 7:05:04 AM PST by jda ("Righteousness exalts a nation . . .")
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To: wintertime
I do see your point but you are failing to see our point. In our worldview there is a neutral position. So we have no problem with the government neither promoting a theistic worldview or promoting a non-theistic worldview.

I do see your point and it is very logical from your worldview. I just disagree with it and do not believe that entirely privatizing education is the best course of action for our nation.

Perhaps though you may be right. As we become more pluralistic as a nation maybe we will have to completely separate government and schools.

I do have a question for you. If in your worldview there is no neutrality how do you support the United State of America? We have a secular government that is neutral to all religions.

In fact it is my understanding that pope pious the IX condemned as false in the syllabus of errors that the Church ought to be separated from the State, and the State from the Church and that it is also false every man is free to embrace and profess that religion which, guided by the light of reason, he shall consider true. He also condemned as false that some countries had wisely decided by law, in some Catholic countries, that persons coming to reside therein shall enjoy the public exercise of their own peculiar worship.(Syllabus Errorum,1964)

This seems the antithesis of American ideals. Don't get me wrong you have every right in this country to think however you want and to even try and get laws passed that support your worldview. It is one of the reasons I serve in the military because I believe that freedom is worth defending. I would however fight you or anyone else at the ballot box who tried to change our American ideal of religious freedom.

67 posted on 02/15/2011 7:22:20 AM PST by armordog99
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