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True Believer: A fabled portion of...Book of Mormon made a one-time believer of Christine Marie...
Salt Lake City Weekly ^ | Dec. 27, 2001 | Ben Fulton

Posted on 02/20/2011 8:16:14 AM PST by Colofornian

In one sense or another, everyone has faith. Faith that someone in your family will keep a promise. Faith that your next paycheck will clear the bank. Faith that there’s life after death, because thinking otherwise is too much to bear. Faith that, tomorrow, the sun will rise in the east, because it always has in the past. Christine Marie had, and still has, her Mormon faith. “The substance of things hoped for, evidence of things unseen,” as the book of Hebrews states. Those words still stand as the classic definition of a psychological mindset that lets religion, organized or not, exist.

Today, after her experience with Christopher M. Nemelka, Marie now knows that she took that faith a little too far. She’s embarrassed, but strong enough to learn from her mistakes.

Marie remembers vividly the first time she met Nemelka in the fall of 2000. It was at an LDS dance. She sat down next to him, on a bench. They talked. “He looked like someone I had seen in a profound dream, and I told him so,” she remembers.

A convert to the LDS church at 18, her faith in God, Jesus, and the truth of the church was unshakable. She had had miracles in her life, she said, in response to fasting and prayer. Nemelka told her at the outset that he was an atheist, that if a man of God was what she wanted, she should look elsewhere.

Marie remembers him telling her he was an atheist. He even tried to get her to leave the church. She also remembers him recanting his atheism later in their relationship, after a few dates. “He said he only told me he was an atheist to see if I could be easily misled. The truth was, he told me he had been called to translate the sealed portion of the Book of Mormon. He almost failed the first time because of his pride, so God took his calling away for a while,” Marie said.

Quiet, soft-spoken Marie, once crowned Mrs. Michigan in her home state, and now a single mother of four, had converted to the church despite a lot of heat from her family. To believe that Joseph Smith received gold plates from the angel Moroni and translated them into the Book of Mormon was the ultimate leap of faith. But she took it, and felt rewarded ever since. How far-fetched was it, then, to believe that someone else had received God’s calling to bring the sealed portion of the lost pages of the Book of Mormon into the world?

“God sent me that dream about him because I had been called to help him. He knew I was one of the elect the minute he looked into my eyes,” Marie remembers.

She was excited. Giddy, even. She was the one worthy enough to help him, as she put it, to “bring forth the sealed portion of the Book of Mormon and aid in the gathering of the elect in these last days.”

She asked him to e-mail her some of the portion he’d already translated. “Since I had experienced true miracles, I had every reason to believe he could be telling me the truth,” she remembers.

In March 2001, Nemelka was ordered to serve one year in the Salt Lake County Jail for violation of a restrictive order after visiting the house of an ex-wife. Marie stood by Nemelka. She received his revelations from jail.

“On the 20th day of April, 2001, I, being incarcerated in the Salt Lake County Jail, was feeling somewhat depressed in spirit, and selfishly thought of myself and the miserable state in which—as I perceived it—I was presently in due to my circumstances,” one revelation read. “In this self-preoccupation, I thought on all the wonderful sisters that the Lord had prepared to help me in the work that he had commanded me to do.

“And I thought on the sisters who I knew were chosen vessels, and who had sacrificed, even their whole lives, for the work and the will of the Lord. And I thought much about Selah who was struggling within herself because of the sacrifice she had made of her dear children for the Lord. And she was greatly desired by many of the men with whom it was necessary for her to associate with in her present calling to obtain financing for the translation, and also for my personal debts.”

“Selah” was the pseudonym Nemelka had assigned to Marie. The revelation went on to describe how the Lord had commanded Nemelka to take another woman, “Mariahla,” as his wife.

Marie remembers these revelations, and other letters from Nemelka, as instructions from God to help Nemelka in his religious endeavors after he’d persuaded her of his status as a prophet and translator of the sealed portion of the Book of Mormon. “He told me he owned nothing except his carpenter’s tools. He talked constantly about the Savior, about the prophets of old, about helping the poor and needy. He compared me often to Esther and acted as if he was amazed by my pure heart,” Marie said. No one knew the scriptures like he did. I felt the spirit when he talked. I could see nothing malevolent about him. I saw a man with extraordinary character, a man of God. Indeed, the man of my dreams.”

Speaking by phone from the Salt Lake County Metropolitan Jail, Nemelka comes across as a friendly, amiable man, but he also sounds frustrated. Never did he try to persuade Marie that he was a prophet of God, translating the sealed portion, he said. Never did he once ask or press Marie for money. It was Marie who projected a divine image onto him, convincing herself of his status as a prophet and man of God, he said. He ran with it and played on it, he admits. For that, he is sorry. And any money she gave him was money she volunteered, almost forced on him. He accepted it only after she told him her business was thriving and her children were being provided for.

“What I did do was I deceived her religiously. I played with her religious beliefs and mind, which I do not think a person should do,” Nemelka said.

The nature of faith, the bonds of trust, and the requirements of religious belief are but three questions surrounding this tale. Marie’s story of how she came to believe Nemelka may seem more like the stuff of a television mini-series, or a sketch from Ripley’s “Believe it or Not.” What’s all the more remarkable is that the story of Marie and Nemalka revolves around one of the most fabled, mythic strands of the LDS church: the sealed portion of the Book of Mormon.

Marie describes her experience with Nemelka in almost harrowing terms. She even visited a friend in Albany, New York, in attempts to sort it all out.

Keith Raniere, an Albany educator, acknowledges he never met or dealt with Nemelka firsthand. But he can vouch for the fact that the man had a deep grip on Marie. Her conversations about Nemelka consistently revolved around his demands on her, Raniere said. “It was like peeling back the layers of an onion in order to get to the core of rationality. There was no rationality to be had,” Raniere said.

Two of Nemelka’s family members speak in his favor. One is his brother, local attorney Joseph Lee Nemelka: “I can say that the majority of what has been said about him is misconstrued, blatantly false at the outset, or exaggerated,” he said. “That’s as much as I want to say.”

The other is Nemelka’s sister, Alesa Forrest, who believes that Marie might have fallen under her brother’s spell, but stops short of believing all of Marie’s account. “He’s a dynamic person. Many women who’ve come in contact with him, a lot of them fall in love with him,” Forrest said. “Even if my own husband came to me and said, ‘I’ve had a vision that God’s made me a prophet,’ I would question everything about it. That’s why I have such a hard time believing any woman would fall for that, especially a Mormon.”

Richard Dewey, a local book publisher and one of the few people who knew both Marie and Nemelka, has a hard time believing that Marie is acting out of scorn. On the other hand, he admires Nemalka, with whom he’s had business dealings. “I can’t conceive of her wanting to hurt him. She’s not a vengeful person at all,” Dewey said. “All I can chalk it up to is a big misunderstanding.”

One thing is certain: The sealed portion as written by Nemelka exists. Nemelka admitted he wrote it, not translated it. People besides Marie have read its pages. Dewey recalls Marie talking about it. “I thought it was kind of an elaborate joke—I don’t know what. She said it was very realistic-sounding, despite the strange premise. I told her there was no way it could be authentic.”

Dewey said he witnessed her sacrifices firsthand. Marie sold all her furniture and goods to move into a dumpy hotel in downtown Salt Lake City, where she lived almost like a homeless person, among near-homeless people. “Some of us tried to talk her into moving out of that hotel, but she wanted to live as meagerly as possible to give her money to Chris,” Dewey said.

Nemelka remains steadfast in his position that Marie volunteered the money. “She set this up,” he said. “She’s the one who recommended her financing the sealed portion, my life and everything else. She did it. I never asked her for anything—never.

“My whole purpose, though, was to write the sealed portion. Get the sealed portion done. Sell it to the church. My whole idea was to sell it to the LDS church. I was going to sell it to them, because all the Mormons are looking for the sealed portion to come back. I thought I had a good talent for writing. I was going to write it up and sell it to them. They could do with it what they wanted. They probably would have kept it off the market.”

In the realm of Mormon folklore, few things rank as highly suspect as the Three Nephites or the sealed portion. The Three Nephites, according to lore, live immortally as the last of a righteous tribe that once existed on the American continent. As such, they have roamed the world through the centuries, turning good deeds wherever they went. Like the Jewish lore of Elijah at the Passover table, they could exist literally, or figuratively.

The sealed portion is another matter. It’s reputedly a blocked-off section of the original gold plates from which Joseph Smith was translating the Book of Mormon. Mormons teach that he could not access it and he was not authorized to translate it. In the Book of Jared in the Book of Mormon, the sealed portion is briefly cited as containing the entire history of the world, from Adam until Christ’s Second Coming. The sealed portion is different from the historical 116 pages given to Martin Harris by Joseph Smith and subsequently lost. The rest remains a mystery, one that infamous Mormon document forger Mark Hofmann even tried to deal in at one time.

“It’s a historical footnote. We know that a portion of the plates Joseph Smith had was sealed. We don’t know anything about what was in them, and they play no role in our theology,” said Daniel Peterson, associate executive director of the Institute for the Study and Preservation of Ancient Religious Texts, a parent organization of the Foundation for Ancient Research and Mormon Studies (FARMS) at Brigham Young University.

Peterson found Nemelka’s sealed portion mildly impressive, but far short of any potential to spark a following. Since the sealed portion exists as a sort of blank spot on Mormon theology, it’s fertile ground for anyone who wants to invent something, much like Jesus’ childhood, on which the Bible never took pains to elaborate.

“I don’t think I’m going to convert anytime soon,” Peterson said. “He writes reasonably well. I’m tipping my hat, I suppose, but it’s a good imitation of scriptural style.”

Nemelka may not be the first, and certainly not the only person, to dip his pen in this wide-open well. The Internet is full of people staking claim to the sealed portion. The Council of Patriarchs Sons Amman Israel, based in Arizona, has abridged and published a text called The Oracles of Mohonri: An account written by the hand of Mohonri Moriancumer upon the gold plates taken from the sealed portion of the Book of Mormon. California’s Brotherhood of Christ Church published what it calls The Sealed Portion of the Brother of Jared. “This amazing book has been anticipated for more than 170 years,” the jacket boasts. “The information contained here came from a man from the immediate post-flood period who was taught in the ancient religion of Enoch who lived in the seventh generation from Adam.”

Nemelka’s version finds its context in a preamble he penned before embarking on his sealed portion. It begins in the summer of 1984, when he worked as a security officer for the LDS church. Already disillusioned with the church, he ventured into the Temple’s upper room where the Twelve Apostles meet. Confronted with its opulence, he “wept bitterly.” Shortly afterward, a “tremendously bright light began to fill the room.” Not only did Nemelka see the personage of his late grandfather, but Joseph Smith and the gold plates to boot. His mission, he learned, was to “commence” the translation of the sealed portion, but only under the position and authority of Smith. The preamble ends with a rumble of stalwart righteousness: “Though I will endure many persecutions and trials, I will never deny that I have experienced that which I have described above, and if any man mock me or that to which I have testified, I will witness against him at the judgement bar of God … I solemnly testify.”

It’s signed Christopher M. Nemelka, Adam Ben Eli. The alias, Nemelka explained, kept matters in the original Mormon spirit of authenticity. If Joseph Smith used pseudonums, so would he.

“I set about in my own mischievous and arrogant way, of which I’m not proud of now, to prove that a person could actually write scripture and present it to people who were looking for certain scripture,” Nemelka said. “I was playing on the belief that LDS people have that one day the gold plates would be returned and the sealed portion would be translated. Basically, I set about to write a fictitious version of the sealed portion as I thought Joseph Smith would have written it had he continued to perpetuate his translation of the gold plates. Much to the chagrin of the LDS church and others, what I wrote was indeed well versed and quite appropriate for the scripture I was trying to portray. Anybody who reads it would just be totally amazed.”

Indeed, Nemelka’s version, titled “The Vision and Words of the Brother of Jared Written and Sealed up by Moroni, the Son of Mormon,” comes off as a fairly solid piece of Mormon rhetoric. Chapter One gets all the testifying out of the way to make way for Brother of Jared’s journey to the mount of “Shamir,” where he witnesses the “spirit body” of Jesus, then is whisked away to meet the Father and marvel at his spirit, followed by a meeting with his heavenly Mother. Chapter Four outlines the Brother of Jared’s further travels through the many worlds and kingdoms of the Father, where he “receives many mysteries and knowledge because of his faithfulness.”

It’s a stately, but leaden piece of writing designed to hit all the right notes with Mormon faithful, right down to its repeated use of “And it came to pass … ” and the liberal use of words like “behold,” “eternal” and “exceedingly.” It’s also a deft mix of Old Testament wrath (“you shall weep and wail and gnash”) matched with New Testament promise and redemption. It’s loaded with admonitions to obey God’s commandments—or else.

“My true intent was to somehow perpetuate a religion that would be based on true Christian principals of Christ-like love,” Nemelka explained in a phone interview from jail. “Where I made my greatest mistake, for which I’m now extremely sorry for, is that I used deception to perpetuate what I proposed as the truth, assuming at the time that Joseph Smith had done the same thing.”

Some might say it was a long, winding road to that realization. This isn’t the first time Nemelka’s name has ended up in a newspaper.

West High School’s 1980 senior-class president, Nemelka served an LDS mission in Argentina. He found his first wife in Paula Blades Nemelka. After two children, the couple divorced over religious differences in 1986. With his ex-wife remarried in Montana, and with Nemelka in custody of his children, he moved to Victor, Mont. After his ex-wife’s family secured a court order placing his children in the care of Montana’s Division of Family Services, in June 1991 Nemelka went through the doors of the state office and took his son, Josh. Then with Josh, his wife at the time, Jackie, and their two children, they all went to Oregon and Idaho. In Salt Lake City, Nemelka took his fatherly plight to the media and turned himself in to police. A daily newspaper splashed his story on the front page.

Charged with kidnapping of his son, Nemelka threatened a multi-million dollar lawsuit against the state of Montana for taking his children, then went on a hunger strike in jail after turning himself over to Montana’s Ravalli County law enforcement. Eventually, Nemelka’s son was returned to his mother in Montana. Nemelka was released from jail later that fall, and all charges against him and his wife were eventually dropped. Near the end of that ordeal, Nemelka admitted that he’d taken the law into his own hands, but for all the right reasons, just like the American patriots of the Boston Tea Party.

During 1991, Nemelka crossed paths with Kyle Williams, who also served an LDS mission in Argentina. Williams, who now works as a real estate title searcher in Tennessee while attending law school, remembers Nemelka as a happy-go-lucky person, very charismatic, somewhat mischievous, but with strong beliefs he was willing to stand up for. Nemelka and his family stayed at Williams’ house in Ammon, Idaho during their run from the law, Williams said, but left when the police showed up to ask questions.

“He [Nemelka] has real good stories. He makes it sound as if he did nothing wrong. He’s always right. I was caught in the middle of his friendship,” he said.

Nemelka sent him a copy of his sealed portion, but Williams never bothered to read it. “He told me he was doing it as a way of mocking the Mormons. He was a real interesting character,” Williams said. “I had hoped he would come to his senses and live a normal life, but he’s gone the other way. He’s continued with his religious nonsense.”

Jackie and Chris Nemelka divorced in 1993. During their marriage, Jackie remembers a man who always had to have something eccentric to work on. For several years their family lived in travel trailers, pulling up to move someplace new whenever Nemelka got bored with the situation. She remembers him sitting by the computer, or with note-pad in hand, writing his sealed portion.

“He was very impressed that he could write like that and have it sound so real,” she remembers. “He thought he was a lot like Joseph Smith. People would say he was like Joseph Smith—charismatic and outgoing—and I was like Emma, reserved and quiet.”

After finishing his version of the sealed portion, Nemelka floated it around certain circles in the Mormon fundamentalist community. It was a big hit, winning him the admiration of many. Along the way, two women offered to live with him and Jackie under a polygamous relationship. One of them was Vicky Prunty, current director of Tapestry Against Polygamy.

Prunty, who married Nemelka in a private ceremony, broke ties with him in 1996. “A lot of fundamentalists believed him. They were extremely angry with him when he leveled with them. I thought he was through with that sealed portion game. It’s really hard to put a finger on him. A lot of people would have to come together to put the pieces of his own personal puzzle together. He’s a very charismatic man. I know of some Mormon fundamentalists who actually called him ‘Charisma Nemelka.’”

How angry were some in the fundamentalist community? Angry enough to kill him, Nemelka remembers. For his own safety, he changed his last name to Stohl. Jackie Nemelka said he arrived at this name through a slight variation on her maiden name, Stoll.

“Yes, Christopher Stohl was an alias that I used after I ran away from religious persecution. I didn’t want anybody to know Chris Nemelka,” Nemelka said. “See, when I did that thing with the fundamentalist group, there were people who wanted to kill me. They were so mad. When I came out and told these other polygamists, fundamentalist guys, that I had really written the sealed portion, that I had done it just to show people that it could be done—they were very upset.”

The year 1993 marked not only the end of his marriage with Jackie, but Nemelka’s entire polygamy set up-with Prunty and another woman. Nemelka said it was his uncle, the late Joe Nephi Nemelka, who encouraged him to give up the practice. “I knew it was not right. It was wrong,” Nemelka said. “I could have perpetuated it as long as Joseph Smith did, but I knew it was wrong.”

Eager to burst Prunty’s image as an anti-polygamy crusader, Nemelka said it was she, along with the second wife, who most wanted to continue living with him in polygamy.

Prunty has her own version of events. At times she speaks fondly of him. She remembers the times she, Nemelka and her sister wives drove to Shriner’s Hospital to sing for sick children. As a family they did stuff like that. Preserving their polygamist set-up once Nemelka called it quits, however, was not her calling. She firmly believed he’d arranged it all under the sanctity of a religious calling.

“He sat us all down and said he didn’t believe in polygamy, but [said], ‘What man wouldn’t want to have sex with more than one wife?’” Prunty said.

Putting her life back together, Marie will not brook the argument that she’s simply a woman scorned. Certainly she was enamored of the man. But she’s been enamored of many men, and never thought of them as being called by God to translate the sealed portion.

“The fact is, he very strategically convinced me over a period of two months that he was receiving revelations and he was a prophet of God. When I believed he was translating the sealed portion, I gave willingly.”

Nemelka described his sealed portion dealings with Marie as a business transaction. Once he’d sold it to the church or some other interested party, she would collect the royalties. Nemelka said Marie planned to fund his organization, Widow’s Mite, as well.

“She was going to be financially independent and able to, you know, support the publication of the sealed portion; the Widow’s Mite Foundation. The Widow’s Mite Foundation was an incredible institution we were going to set up. But Christine wanted me. When she didn’t get me … she turned against me,” Nemelka said.

There seems to be ample evidence that Nemelka is a good salesman. In an April 2, 1993 letter to one of his wives, which Nemelka admitted to having penned, he wrote: “When I deal with people, I am amazed at the ignorance and stupidity of most. People are so easily manipulated and deceived. Knowing this has made me a near master of manipulation. I try only to use this art, however, to help people. Sometimes the things I do seem terrible at the time, but usually the manipulation works to accomplish that which I intended.”

Nemelka’s revelations from jail, styled after Joseph Smith’s revelations from his own jail time, seem to work in similar territory. In a March 16, 2001 revelation to Marie, Nemelka spoke of overhearing one of the Three Nephites, describes his judge as someone who “was wrought upon by forces that her spirit was too weak to control” and described Marie as a mysterious nameless “sister.”

“Yeah that’s, that’s all bullshit,” Nemelka said from jail. “All the revelations are bullshit, of course. I made ‘em up.”

But he did it all for Marie, and Marie alone, to comfort her. Marie needed the comfort of her religious convictions, and he could provide it with his writings. “My whole purpose was for good. Christine knew that—knew that with all her heart. That’s why she said, ‘I’m going to finance you.’ She’s the one who brought it up. She’s the one who said I don’t want you to work,” Nemelka said. “I wrote it under the inspiration and guise of being a prophet of God. That’s what she wanted me to be.”

The financial costs of the relationship is not clear. Marie believes she gave Nemelka in the neighborhood of $5,000. But Nemelka said Marie may have given him a few hundred dollars, “here and there,” while he was writing the sealed portion. For him, that’s inconsequential. Nemelka said he paid odd bills here and there for Marie, as well. And, he said, his current wife gave Marie $1,800 to pay back any amount he owed.

Marie produced a handwritten letter she said was written by Nemelka, and which Nemelka admitted to writing. “You have been quite spectacular and trustworthy in your timely payments to my Visa, which covers my child support,” the letter reads. “By using the Visa method, all transactions will be kept virtually out of my hands and name,” it continues. “So the world will have no cause against me if something happens to you, or if the media, which I am sure will one day be investigating, takes it upon itself to accuse me, as they did Joseph [Smith], of taking advantage of religious contributions for my own gain.”

Nemelka described the six-page letter as the outline of a “business arrangement” between him and Marie to make her co-proprieter of his sealed portion once it came out in book form.

Nemelka admitted to going back and forth from atheism to certain levels of belief regarding the LDS church. He was excommunicated for writing an unpublished paper on LDS temple ceremonies. Now that he’s in jail, he hopes to join the church once again as a believing member. Upon his scheduled March 2002 release, he plans to attend law school and help as many indigent people as he can with his legal work.

Williams, his old friend, thinks of Nemelka this way: “What he believed, really, was that Joseph Smith was doing the same thing that he’s doing. That Joseph Smith had a vision of improving people, of helping people, and that he used falsehood to further that purpose. He thought Joseph Smith invented the golden plates story and all that to further the ethics of Mormonism. Chris set out to do the same thing with his sealed portion.”

Jackie Nemelka, an ex-wife, has another view: “There are so many angles that he takes. One minute he claims he’s an atheist, the next he’s a prophet of God.”

Marie’s upstate New York friend, Raniere, sees her experience as very on point given a world where someone purporting a religious doctrine can actually convince people to fly passenger jets into the World Trade Center. “The ‘scorned woman’ explanation is convenient, at best,” Raniere said. “My opinion of Christine is that she’s a very remarkable person, but not practical in this world. She’s very idealistic. The one upshot for her is that she’s come to a recognition of this and changed the impractical nature of her ideals. She assumes everyone’s honest because she’s so honest.”

And Nemelka steadfastly holds to the position that he “went on her dream that I was a prophet.”

“I’m even glad you’re doing the article, in a way,” he said. “I am, so that the sealed portion will never go anywhere. There’s a lot to it, a lot more than what you’ve got. In the wrong hands it could really wreak havoc on a Mormon church, which I don’t want to do.”


TOPICS: History; Other Christian; Religion & Culture; Theology
KEYWORDS: antimormonscreed; falseprophet; flamebait; inman; lds; mormon; mormonkazinsky; nemelka
Who is Christopher Nemelka?

Well, he's been making more Utah headlines in 2011, especially since his book converted the descendent of Joseph Smith's brother, Ida Smith...leading to the Lds church to promptly ex-communicate this former head of the BYU Women's Research Institute.

This 2001 article gives a good overview -- both of his background and the content of what he wrote.

Q Is Nemelka a former Lds missionary?
A Yes. Per this article, "West High School’s 1980 senior-class president, Nemelka served an LDS mission in Argentina."

Two other articles posted about Nemelka -- how he has Hyrum Smith's descendent -- the former head of the BYU Women's Research Institute -- now as a disciple of his...
See Is there an after-the-age-of-reason limit for very old LDS church members?...
And this thread posted by Jules8: Didn't do your homework

The Salt Lake City Weekly has run a few articles -- including the latter link -- and an earlier article led to the first link...a column by Mormon journalist Doug Gibson.

1 posted on 02/20/2011 8:16:17 AM PST by Colofornian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: Colofornian

IB4PDSPAM


2 posted on 02/20/2011 8:17:53 AM PST by Godzilla (3-7-77)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: All; Elsie; Jules8; Alex Murphy; Godzilla; greyfoxx39; svcw; ExGeeEye
Mormons, tell us if the following excerpts from this article doesn't sound like a rerun of Joseph Smith's route? [And if so, is not Nemelka a reincarnated Mormon "prophet" from another era?]

Nemelka Tale, Excerpt by Excerpt Joseph Smith Look-Alike, Right? How Nemelka has Joseph Smith down pat!
[1] "The truth was, he told me he had been called to translate the sealed portion of the Book of Mormon. He almost failed the first time because of his pride, so God took his calling away for a while,” Marie said. Why didn't Joseph Smith say, "Satan would try to tempt me (in consequence of the indigent circumstances of my father’s family), to get the plates for the purpose of getting rich. This he forbade me, saying that I must have no other object in view in getting the plates but to glorify God, and must not be influenced by any other motive than that of building his kingdom; otherwise I could not get them."
[2] The sealed portion as written by Nemelka exists. Nemelka admitted he wrote it, not translated it. People besides Marie have read its pages. Dewey recalls Marie talking about it. “I thought it was kind of an elaborate joke—I don’t know what. She said it was very realistic-sounding, despite the strange premise. I told her there was no way it could be authentic.” Hmm...We wonder how those closest to this Mormon "prophet" must have “...thought...it was kind of an elaborate joke...was very realistic-sounding, despite the strange premise....was no way it could be authentic.” Why that's just like the Book of Mormon!
[3] In the realm of Mormon folklore, few things rank as highly suspect as the Three Nephites or the sealed portion. The Three Nephites, according to lore, live immortally as the last of a righteous tribe that once existed on the American continent. As such, they have roamed the world through the centuries, turning good deeds wherever they went. Like the Jewish lore of Elijah at the Passover table, they could exist literally, or figuratively. The sealed portion is another matter. It’s reputedly a blocked-off section of the original gold plates from which Joseph Smith was translating the Book of Mormon. Mormons teach that he could not access it and he was not authorized to translate it. In the Book of Jared in the Book of Mormon, the sealed portion is briefly cited as containing the entire history of the world, from Adam until Christ’s Second Coming. Hey, if Smith couldn't translate the "sealed-off" portion, then what? Do Mormons think that "translators" and "seers" have gone by the wayside forever? (Every accusation the Mormons have made vs. Christians about supposedly "shutting off" the need for "living prophets" apply to THEM here! Their own arguments have come back to bite them! What? Have Mormons shut out the need for "translating" sealed portions of "revelations"? Say it ain't so, Joe! Say it ain't so!)
[4] “It’s a historical footnote. We know that a portion of the plates Joseph Smith had was sealed. We don’t know anything about what was in them, and they play no role in our theology,” said Daniel Peterson, associate executive director of the Institute for the Study and Preservation of Ancient Religious Texts, a parent organization of the Foundation for Ancient Research and Mormon Studies (FARMS) at Brigham Young University. Peterson found Nemelka’s sealed portion mildly impressive, but far short of any potential to spark a following. Since the sealed portion exists as a sort of blank spot on Mormon theology, it’s fertile ground for anyone who wants to invent something, much like Jesus’ childhood, on which the Bible never took pains to elaborate. “I don’t think I’m going to convert anytime soon,” Peterson said. “He writes reasonably well. I’m tipping my hat, I suppose, but it’s a good imitation of scriptural style.” Even Lds apologist Daniel Peterson a decade ago said Nemelka "writes reasonably well. I’m tipping my hat, I suppose, but it’s a good imitation of scriptural style.” [Sounds just like Joseph Smith!]
[5] Nemelka’s version finds its context in a preamble he penned before embarking on his sealed portion. It begins in the summer of 1984, when he worked as a security officer for the LDS church. Already disillusioned with the church, he ventured into the Temple’s upper room where the Twelve Apostles meet. Confronted with its opulence, he “wept bitterly.” Shortly afterward, a “tremendously bright light began to fill the room.” Not only did Nemelka see the personage of his late grandfather, but Joseph Smith and the gold plates to boot. His mission, he learned, was to “commence” the translation of the sealed portion, but only under the position and authority of Smith. The preamble ends with a rumble of stalwart righteousness: “Though I will endure many persecutions and trials, I will never deny that I have experienced that which I have described above, and if any man mock me or that to which I have testified, I will witness against him at the judgement bar of God … I solemnly testify.” It’s signed Christopher M. Nemelka, Adam Ben Eli. The alias, Nemelka explained, kept matters in the original Mormon spirit of authenticity. If Joseph Smith used pseudonums, so would he. Nemelka, just like Smith, apparently had other-worldly bright-vision visitors as a "'tremendously bright light began to fill the room.' Not only did Nemelka see the personage of his late grandfather, but Joseph Smith and the gold plates to boot. His mission, he learned, was to 'commence' the translation of the sealed portion, but only under the position and authority of Smith." [Well, what do you know? The Mormon god isn't limited by the scorched-earth Mormons from resending bright visitors to give bright visions with not-so-bright content!]
[6] It’s a stately, but leaden piece of writing designed to hit all the right notes with Mormon faithful, right down to its repeated use of “And it came to pass … ” and the liberal use of words like “behold,” “eternal” and “exceedingly.” It’s also a deft mix of Old Testament wrath (“you shall weep and wail and gnash”) matched with New Testament promise and redemption. It’s loaded with admonitions to obey God’s commandments—or else. “My true intent was to somehow perpetuate a religion that would be based on true Christian principals of Christ-like love,” Nemelka explained in a phone interview from jail. “Where I made my greatest mistake, for which I’m now extremely sorry for, is that I used deception to perpetuate what I proposed as the truth, assuming at the time that Joseph Smith had done the same thing.” Well, let's see, Joseph Smith did jail time over his escapades. As Joseph's wife later said, "It was secret things which...cost Joseph and Hyrum their lives..." (Source: Solemn Covenant, by B. Carmon Hardy, Univ. of Illinois) So, of course, Nemelka would pen a "stately, but leaden piece of writing designed to hit all the right notes with Mormon faithful, right down to its repeated use of 'And it came to pass … ' and the liberal use of words like 'behold,' 'eternal' and 'exceedingly.' It’s also a deft mix of Old Testament wrath ('you shall weep and wail and gnash') matched with New Testament promise and redemption. It’s loaded with admonitions to obey God’s commandments—or else. 'My true intent was to somehow perpetuate a religion that would be based on true Christian principals of Christ-like love,' Nemelka explained in a phone interview from jail. Ah, I'm sure at times even Joseph Smith had similar noble intent...as if he could "outdo" Jesus Christ, which, btw, he said he could...boasting he was the "only man" who knew how to keep a church together...something, he claimed, Christ didn't do.
[7] After finishing his version of the sealed portion, Nemelka floated it around certain circles in the Mormon fundamentalist community. It was a big hit, winning him the admiration of many. Along the way, two women offered to live with him and Jackie under a polygamous relationship. One of them was Vicky Prunty, current director of Tapestry Against Polygamy. Prunty, who married Nemelka in a private ceremony, broke ties with him in 1996. “A lot of fundamentalists believed him. They were extremely angry with him when he leveled with them. I thought he was through with that sealed portion game. It’s really hard to put a finger on him. A lot of people would have to come together to put the pieces of his own personal puzzle together." Joseph Smith was a polygamist who loved "private" (as in "very" private ceremonies); so, hey, why not a reincarnated "prophet" like Nemelka?
[8] There seems to be ample evidence that Nemelka is a good salesman. In an April 2, 1993 letter to one of his wives, which Nemelka admitted to having penned, he wrote: “When I deal with people, I am amazed at the ignorance and stupidity of most. People are so easily manipulated and deceived. Knowing this has made me a near master of manipulation. I try only to use this art, however, to help people. Sometimes the things I do seem terrible at the time, but usually the manipulation works to accomplish that which I intended.” Nemelka’s revelations from jail, styled after Joseph Smith’s revelations from his own jail time, seem to work in similar territory. In a March 16, 2001 revelation to Marie, Nemelka spoke of overhearing one of the Three Nephites, describes his judge as someone who “was wrought upon by forces that her spirit was too weak to control” and described Marie as a mysterious nameless “sister.” Nemelka was "amazed at the ignorance and stupidity of most...people are so easily manipulated and deceived. Knowing this has made me a near master of manipulation. I try only to use this art, however, to help people. Sometimes the things I do seem terrible at the time, but usually the manipulation works to accomplish that which I intended." Why, no wonder Hyrum Smith descendent Ida Smith immediately recognized Nemelka as a "prophet" reincarnated! How many times did Joseph Smith mutter similar thoughts to himself?

3 posted on 02/20/2011 8:19:35 AM PST by Colofornian
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To: All; Jim Robinson
Salt Lake City Weekly is an extreme liberal gay rag in the city. The gay community has long had an axe to grind against the LDS community in Utah. It's a continual campaign against Mormons.

I realize there is a camping against Mormonism here on FR as well, but I'm not sure this is the kind of source one would like to use and associate with.

Frankly, I'm surprised FR allows such liberal and lascivious sources to be posted here.

4 posted on 02/20/2011 8:27:59 AM PST by Ripliancum (Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you. -Eph. 4:31)
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P M


5 posted on 02/20/2011 8:35:09 AM PST by svcw (God in His own time not ours)
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To: Ripliancum

Not an anti-Mormon campaign — some of us truly believe that people who believe in M are sadly wasting their time in a fake religion. If Mormons didn’t post their M threads here, I bet those who post what you call antimormon stuff wouldnt post theirs. How about let’s all try that for awhile?


6 posted on 02/20/2011 8:38:13 AM PST by Moonmad27 ("I'm not bad, I'm just drawn that way." Jessica Rabbit)
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To: Ripliancum
Salt Lake City Weekly is an extreme liberal gay rag in the city.

(And here we would have thought that this SLC Weekly expose' on Nemelka would be welcomed by you...or do you think that false prophets should just be allowed to claim adherents like Ida Smith without shining a light into their background?)

What a strange posture you have taken, Rip! You? Are now defending Christopher Nemelka? Interesting. It's difficult to tell who are the false prophets and their defenders minus a scorecard.

But leave it to you and your spirit of Nauvoo to try the same thing that Mayor Joseph Smith did with the Nauvoo Expositor...only using a different approach.

7 posted on 02/20/2011 8:46:45 AM PST by Colofornian
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To: Colofornian
“My whole purpose, though, was to write the sealed portion. Get the sealed portion done. Sell it to the church. My whole idea was to sell it to the LDS church. I was going to sell it to them, because all the Mormons are looking for the sealed portion to come back. I thought I had a good talent for writing. I was going to write it up and sell it to them. They could do with it what they wanted. They probably would have kept it off the market.”

In the realm of Mormon folklore, few things rank as highly suspect as the Three Nephites or the sealed portion. The Three Nephites, according to lore, live immortally as the last of a righteous tribe that once existed on the American continent. As such, they have roamed the world through the centuries, turning good deeds wherever they went. Like the Jewish lore of Elijah at the Passover table, they could exist literally, or figuratively.

The sealed portion is another matter. It’s reputedly a blocked-off section of the original gold plates from which Joseph Smith was translating the Book of Mormon. Mormons teach that he could not access it and he was not authorized to translate it. In the Book of Jared in the Book of Mormon, the sealed portion is briefly cited as containing the entire history of the world, from Adam until Christ’s Second Coming. The sealed portion is different from the historical 116 pages given to Martin Harris by Joseph Smith and subsequently lost. The rest remains a mystery, one that infamous Mormon document forger Mark Hofmann even tried to deal in at one time.

“It’s a historical footnote. We know that a portion of the plates Joseph Smith had was sealed. We don’t know anything about what was in them, and they play no role in our theology,” said Daniel Peterson, associate executive director of the Institute for the Study and Preservation of Ancient Religious Texts, a parent organization of the Foundation for Ancient Research and Mormon Studies (FARMS) at Brigham Young University.

Ping to read later.

Nemelka remains steadfast in his position that Marie volunteered the money. “She set this up,” he said. “She’s the one who recommended her financing the sealed portion, my life and everything else. She did it. I never asked her for anything—never.

Maybe he asked her for a "pizza and a movie"?

8 posted on 02/20/2011 8:48:16 AM PST by Alex Murphy ("Posting news feeds, making eyes bleed, he's hated on seven continents")
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To: Ripliancum; Jim Robinson
Salt Lake City Weekly is an extreme liberal gay rag in the city...I'm not sure this is the kind of source one would like to use and associate with. Frankly, I'm surprised FR allows such liberal and lascivious sources to be posted here.

On the other hand, Jim, perhaps we should at least ponder for a moment Ripliancum's argument. After all, didn't special rights for homosexuals in Salt Lake City pass because of the endorsement of the Lds church?

And if so, should we apply Ripliancum's argument to Mormons? That perhaps we shouldn't be "associating" with those who are supporting special rights for homosexuals?

I mean, didn't we see the following article just over a year ago?

'Dramatic jump' with Utahns for gay rights -- an excerpt:

"When Salt Lake City embraced anti-discrimination ordinances for gay and transgender residents last fall -- snagging a landmark endorsement by the LDS Church and widespread support from city officials -- more shifted than public policy. Public opinion -- throughout Utah -- jumped, too. Support for some gay rights, short of marriage, climbed 11 percentage points across the state from a year ago, according to a new Salt Lake Tribune poll, and shot up by 10 percent among Mormons. Two-thirds of Utahns (67 percent) favor employment protections and safeguards for same-sex couples such as hospital visitation and inheritance rights, up from 56 percent in January 2009, when pollsters asked the same question. (This year's survey of 625 frequent Utah voters has an error margin of plus or minus 4 percentage points; last year's was 4.5 percent.) Opposition dropped, overall, from 40 percent to 23 percent. Among LDS respondents, it plummeted from 48 percent to 28 percent. "This isn't a gradual change of attitudes. This is a fairly dramatic jump," says Matthew Burbank, chairman of the University of Utah's political science department. "Clearly, the fact that the LDS Church was officially endorsing this position had an impact on people."

Why, if we were to apply Ripliancum's standard...tell us, Rip, how do we distinguish Mormons like you from those Mormons who supported the Lds church's endorsement of special civil rights for homosexuals at the expense of landlords and employers?

Unless, of course...oh, no, don't tell us...you actually supported the Lds church that landlords need to rent to cohabitating homosexual couples? Or that employers in Salt Lake City have to treat homosexual employees like minorities? And that ever since, the cascading of similar state-wide homosexual rights was set in motion...ne'er to stop?

9 posted on 02/20/2011 9:00:34 AM PST by Colofornian
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To: Ripliancum; Jim Robinson
I'm afraid now, Rip, that your association argument could work kind of like a very mild version of Haman in the book of Esther.

Haman wanted to get rid of just one people...just like you wanted to dump one source.

You constructed the gallows for the Salt Lake City Weekly.

Only the standard you set -- about not "us[ing] and associat[ing]" with sources that promote special rights for homosexuals, applies to the Lds church now, doesn't it? (Ever since November, 2009)

...lascivious sources...

Imagine, Rip, that you're a homeowner in Salt Lake City. For your entire life, Rip, you've carefully screened your tenets and haven't allowed cohabiters to rent -- heterosexual or homosexual. It's not the gender that bothers you; it's the lascivious lifestyle that you just don't want your property, set aside to the glory of God, to thumb its nose @ God.

Then along comes the Mormon church. Its endorsement is the SLC tsunami needed to cascade in and wash away your property standards and moral rights.

When you are finally challenged for the first time of either renting to heterosexual or homosexual couples -- and knowing you'll be fined if you cave -- you sell the property...no longer able to uphold your previous standards without being made the whipping boy of the SLC authorities...all because the Lds church caved on standards.

So does this mean, since you're no doubt consistent, that you advocate that ALL Mormon sources be banned from FR? I'm sure Jim has that power, if that's what you are advocating.

After all, I'm sure you're very one-faced, consistent, etc.

10 posted on 02/20/2011 9:12:57 AM PST by Colofornian
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To: All
Nemelka served an LDS mission in Argentina.

IOW, Nemelka is a member of the LDS priesthood. Perhaps Nemelka is just one of millions that Joseph Smith prophesied about in D&C 68:2-4: How there'd be millions of "prophets" -- replete with thei very own "scriptures!"

'Twas a November day 1831 - 170 years ago...when Smith said:

...this is an ensample unto ALL who were ordained unto this priesthood...and this is the ensample unto them,
that they shall speak as they are 'moved upon' by the Holy Ghost... [v. 4:] And WHATSOEVER they shall speak when moved upon by the Holy Ghost SHALL BE SCRIPTURE,
shall be the will of the Lord,
shall be the mind of the Lord,
shall be the word of the Lord,
shall be the voice of the Lord...

Do Mormons catch the "shall be scripture" part?

Smith wasn't speaking to just the upper-etchelon "priesthood" parties...no, v. 2 clearly say "ALL" ordained unto the Mormon priesthood!

Any plain, non-esoteric reading of D&C 68:2-4 makes it quite clear that Smith was saying all Lds ordained priests have "scripture-factory" producing power and authority.

11 posted on 02/20/2011 10:00:55 AM PST by Colofornian
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To: Colofornian
Tsk, tsk...Colo...you really don't expect mormons who have the propa...er...news ladeled out to them in Salt Lake by the Deseret News to appreciate an anti...er...non-LDS source, do you?

Why, that would be like the FR mormons posting in favor of the Flying Inmans right to free speech on FR to match their perceived right to free proselytizing on this site.

12 posted on 02/20/2011 10:06:46 AM PST by greyfoxx39 ("This administration has turned off America's beacon to the world for freedom and left darkness")
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To: Ripliancum
The gay community has long had an axe to grind against the LDS

The gay community always want to grind something.

13 posted on 02/20/2011 10:26:28 AM PST by dragonblustar ("... and if you disagree with me, then you sir, are worse than Hitler!" - Greg Gutfeld)
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To: svcw
There is Victory in the Cross
Darkness trembles at the Blood
Chains broken
People freed
Hearts healed
Hosanna Hosanna on the Highest
14 posted on 02/20/2011 11:11:32 AM PST by svcw (God in His own time not ours)
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To: svcw
There is Victory in the Cross
Darkness trembles at the Blood
Chains broken
People freed
Hearts healed
Hosanna Hosanna on the Highest

Hillsong-At The Cross

15 posted on 02/20/2011 11:18:49 AM PST by greyfoxx39 ("This administration has turned off America's beacon to the world for freedom and left darkness")
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To: Colofornian

“On the 20th day of April, 2001, I, being incarcerated in the Salt Lake County Jail, was feeling somewhat depressed in spirit, and selfishly thought of myself and the miserable state in which—as I perceived it—I was presently in due to my circumstances,” one revelation read. “In this self-preoccupation, I thought on all the wonderful sisters that the Lord had prepared to help me in the work that he had commanded me to do.

“And I thought on the sisters who I knew were chosen vessels, and who had sacrificed, even their whole lives, for the work and the will of the Lord. And I thought much about Selah who was struggling within herself because of the sacrifice she had made of her dear children for the Lord. And she was greatly desired by many of the men with whom it was necessary for her to associate with in her present calling to obtain financing for the translation, and also for my personal debts.”

“Selah” was the pseudonym Nemelka had assigned to Marie. The revelation went on to describe how the Lord had commanded Nemelka to take another woman, “Mariahla,” as his wife.
________________________________________________

Straight out of “the gospel according to Joey Smith”...

Joey Smith probably conned girls into thinking they were special with much the same hokey in order to get them into bed...


16 posted on 02/20/2011 11:33:01 AM PST by Tennessee Nana
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To: greyfoxx39

Very nice.
You will never understand Grace until you understand you do not deserve it. Grace is inviting to the unrighteous and terrifying to the righteous.


17 posted on 02/20/2011 5:03:04 PM PST by svcw (God in His own time not ours)
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To: Colofornian
Who is Christopher Nemelka?

Who knows?

But I'm pretty sure that we've found PD!!


One is his brother, local attorney Joseph Lee Nemelka: “I can say that the majority of what has been said about him is misconstrued, blatantly false at the outset, or exaggerated,” he said. “That’s as much as I want to say.”

18 posted on 02/20/2011 6:30:40 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Colofornian
It’s a stately, but leaden piece of writing designed to hit all the right notes with Mormon faithful, right down to its repeated use of “And it came to pass … ” and the liberal use of words like “behold,” “eternal” and “exceedingly.” It’s also a deft mix of Old Testament wrath (“you shall weep and wail and gnash”) matched with New Testament promise and redemption.

 
 
 
THE FIRST BOOK OF NEPHI

HIS REIGN AND MINISTRY
CHAPTER 16
 
The wicked take the truth to be hard—Lehi’s sons marry the daughters of Ishmael—The Liahona guides their course in the wilderness—Messages from the Lord are written on the Liahona from time to time—Ishmael dies; his family murmur because of afflictions. Between 600 and 592 B.C.
 
 
 1 And it came to pass after I, Nephi, had made an end of speaking to my brethren, behold they said unto me: Thou hast declared unto us hard things, more than we are able to bear.
  2 And it came to pass that I said unto them that I knew that I had spoken ahard things against the wicked, according to the truth; and the righteous have I justified, and testified that they should be lifted up at the last day; wherefore, the bguilty taketh the ctruth to be hard, for it dcutteth them to the very center.
  3 And now my brethren, if ye were righteous and were willing to hearken to the truth, and give heed unto it, that ye might awalk uprightly before God, then ye would not murmur because of the truth, and say: Thou speakest hard things against us.
  4 And it came to pass I, Nephi, did exhort my brethren, with all diligence, to keep the commandments of the Lord.
  5 And it came to pass that they did ahumble themselves before the Lord; insomuch that I had joy and great hopes of them, that they would walk in the paths of righteousness.
  6 Now, all these things were said and done as my father dwelt in a tent in the avalley which he called Lemuel.
  7 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, took one of the adaughters of Ishmael to bwife; and also, my brethren took of the cdaughters of Ishmael to wife; and also dZoram took the eldest daughter of Ishmael to wife.
  8 And thus my father had fulfilled all the acommandments of the Lord which had been given unto him. And also, I, Nephi, had been blessed of the Lord exceedingly.
  9 And it came to pass that the voice of the Lord spake unto my father by night, and commanded him that on the morrow he should take his ajourney into the wilderness.
  10 And it came to pass that as my father arose in the morning, and went forth to the tent door, to his great astonishment he beheld upon the ground a round aball of curious workmanship; and it was of fine brass. And within the ball were two spindles; and the one bpointed the way whither we should go into the wilderness.
  11 And it came to pass that we did gather together whatsoever things we should carry into the wilderness, and all the remainder of our provisions which the Lord had given unto us; and we did take aseed of every kind that we might carry into the wilderness.
  12 And it came to pass that we did take our tents and depart into the wilderness, across the river Laman.
  13 And it came to pass that we traveled for the space of four days, nearly a south-southeast direction, and we did pitch our tents again; and we did call the name of the place aShazer.
  14 And it came to pass that we did take our bows and our arrows, and go forth into the wilderness to slay food for our families; and after we had slain food for our families we did return again to our families in the wilderness, to the place of Shazer. And we did go forth again in the wilderness, following the same direction, keeping in the most fertile parts of the wilderness, which were in the borders near the aRed Sea.
  15 And it came to pass that we did travel for the space of many days, aslaying food by the way, with our bows and our arrows and our stones and our slings.
  16 And we did follow the adirections of the ball, which led us in the more fertile parts of the wilderness.
  17 And after we had traveled for the space of many days, we did pitch our tents for the space of a time, that we might again rest ourselves and obtain food for our families.
  18 And it came to pass that as I, Nephi, went forth to slay food, behold, I did break my bow, which was made of fine asteel; and after I did break my bow, behold, my brethren were angry with me because of the loss of my bow, for we did obtain no food.
  19 And it came to pass that we did return without food to our families, and being much fatigued, because of their journeying, they did suffer much for the want of food.
  20 And it came to pass that Laman and Lemuel and the sons of Ishmael did begin to murmur exceedingly, because of their sufferings and afflictions in the wilderness; and also my father began to murmur against the Lord his God; yea, and they were all exceedingly sorrowful, even that they did amurmur against the Lord.
  21 Now  it came to pass that I, Nephi, having been afflicted with my brethren because of the loss of my bow, and their bows having lost their asprings, it began to be exceedingly difficult, yea, insomuch that we could obtain no food.
  22 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, did speak much unto my brethren, because they had hardened their hearts again, even unto acomplaining against the Lord their God.
  23 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, did amake out of wood a bow, and out of a straight stick, an arrow; wherefore, I did arm myself with a bow and an arrow, with a sling and with stones. And I said unto my bfather: Whither shall I go to obtain food?
  24 And it came to pass that he did ainquire of the Lord, for they had bhumbled themselves because of my words; for I did say many things unto them in the energy of my soul.
  25 And it came to pass that the voice of the Lord came unto my father; and he was truly achastened because of his murmuring against the Lord, insomuch that he was brought down into the depths of sorrow.
  26 And it came to pass  that the voice of the Lord said unto him: Look upon the ball, and behold the things which are written.
  27 And it came to pass that when my father beheld the things which were awritten upon the ball, he did fear and tremble exceedingly, and also my brethren and the sons of Ishmael and our wives.
  28 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, beheld the pointers which were in the ball, that they did work according to the afaith and diligence and heed which we did give unto them.
  29 And there was also written upon them a new writing, which was plain to be read, which did give us aunderstanding concerning the ways of the Lord; and it was written and changed from time to time, according to the faith and diligence which we gave unto it. And thus we see that by bsmall means the Lord can bring about great things.
  30 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, did go forth up into the top of the mountain, according to the adirections which were given upon the ball.
  31 And it came to pass that I did slay wild abeasts, insomuch that I did obtain food for our families.
  32 And it came to pass that I did return to our tents, bearing the beasts which I had slain; and now when they beheld that I had obtained afood, how great was their joy! And it came to pass that they did humble themselves before the Lord, and did give thanks unto him.
  33 And it came to pass that we did again take our journey, traveling nearly the same course as in the beginning; and after we had traveled for the space of many days we did pitch our tents again, that we might tarry for the space of a time.
  34 And it came to pass that aIshmael died, and was buried in the place which was called bNahom.
  35 And it came to pass that the daughters of Ishmael did amourn exceedingly, because of the loss of their father, and because of their bafflictions in the wilderness; and they did cmurmur against my father, because he had brought them out of the land of Jerusalem, saying: Our father is dead; yea, and we have wandered much in the wilderness, and we have suffered much affliction, hunger, thirst, and fatigue; and after all these sufferings we must perish in the wilderness with hunger.
  36 And thus they did murmur against my father, and also against me; and they were desirous to areturn again to Jerusalem.
  37 And Laman said unto Lemuel and also unto the sons of Ishmael: Behold, let us aslay our father, and also our brother Nephi, who has taken it upon him to be our bruler and our teacher, who are his elder brethren.
  38 Now, he says that the Lord has talked with him, and also that aangels have ministered unto him. But behold, we know that he lies unto us; and he tells us these things, and he worketh many things by his cunning arts, that he may deceive our eyes, thinking, perhaps, that he may lead us away into some strange wilderness; and after he has led us away, he has thought to make himself a king and a ruler over us, that he may do with us according to his will and pleasure. And after this manner did my brother Laman bstir up their hearts to canger.
  39 And it came to pass that the Lord was with us, yea, even the voice of the Lord came and did speak many words unto them, and did achasten them exceedingly; and after they were chastened by the voice of the Lord they did turn away their anger, and did repent of their sins, insomuch that the Lord did bless us again with food, that we did not perish.


19 posted on 02/20/2011 6:33:55 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Ripliancum
 
I realize there is a camping against Mormonism here on FR as well...
 




 
 The LDS Organization® prints Hundreds of Thousands of THIS yearly!


  17 It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound. When the light rested upon me I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the other—This is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!
  18 My object in going to inquire of the Lord was to know which of all the sects was right, that I might know which to join. No sooner, therefore, did I get possession of myself, so as to be able to speak, than I asked the Personages who stood above me in the light, which of all the sects was right (for at this time it had never entered into my heart that all were wrong)—and which I should join.
  19 I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: “they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof.”
  20 He again forbade me to join with any of them; and many other things did he say unto me, which I cannot write at this time. When I came to myself again, I found myself lying on my back, looking up into heaven. When the light had departed, I had no strength; but soon recovering in some degree, I went home. And as I leaned up to the fireplace, mother inquired what the matter was. I replied, “Never mind, all is well—I am well enough off.” I then said to my mother,
“I have learned for myself that Presbyterianism is not true.”
 
 
The LDS headquarters; in the heart of a modern  US city, visited by THOUSANDS daily, has this placed in prominent view:
 
 
...which reiterates the charge that "they were all wrong; they teach for doctrines the commandments of men".
 


 
There's 51,998 MORE of us where WE can from!!
 

20 posted on 02/20/2011 6:35:34 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Ripliancum
Frankly, I'm surprised FR allows such liberal and lascivious sources to be posted here.

IGNORE the CONTENT and KILL the MESSENGER!

21 posted on 02/20/2011 6:36:39 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Ripliancum
Frankly, I'm surprised FR allows such liberal and lascivious sources to be posted here.

 
 
2 Nephi 3:12 Wherefore, the fruit of thy loins write; and the fruit of thy loins of Judah shall write; and that which shall be written by the fruit of thy loins, and also that which shall be written by the fruit of thy loins of Judah, shall grow together,

2 Nephi 3:18 And the Lord said unto me also: I will raise up unto the fruit of thy loins; and I will make for him a spokesman. And I, behold, I will give unto him that he shall write the writing of the fruit of thy loins, unto the fruit of thy loins; and the spokesman of thy loins shall declare it.

Joseph Smith Translation Gen. 50: 27   Thus saith the Lord God of my fathers unto me, A choice seer will I raise up out of the fruit of thy loins, and he shall be esteemed highly among the fruit of thy loins; and unto him will I give commandment that he shall do a work for the fruit of thy loins, his brethren.

Joseph Smith Translation Gen. 50: 31    Wherefore the fruit of thy loins shall write, and the fruit of thy loins of Judah shall write; and that which shall be written by the fruit of thy loins, and also that which shall be written by the fruit of thy loins of Judah, shall grow together

 

Diaboli virtus in lumbis ist.          Diaboli virtus in lumbis ist.

22 posted on 02/20/2011 6:38:50 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Tennessee Nana
 
“On the 20th day of April, 2001, I, being incarcerated in the Salt Lake County Jail, was feeling somewhat depressed in spirit, and selfishly thought of myself and the miserable state in which—as I perceived it—I was presently in due to my circumstances,” one revelation read.
 
MORMONs should REALLY avoid jails!



JESUS: Hey Smith!  Remember that boast you made about doing more than even I had done to hold the 'church' together?

JOSEPH SMITH: Where am I?

JESUS: Don't you remember? A few seconds ago you were in that jail.

JOSEPH SMITH: Oh; yeah; but where am I NOW?

JESUS: Don't you remember? Does bang - bang ring a bell?

JOSEPH SMITH: Oh; yeah - that crummy gun I had was about USELESS!

JESUS: I hope you left instructions on how to hold your church together.

JOSEPH SMITH: Dang! I knew there was SOMETHING I was forgetting!

JESUS: Looks like there's a power struggle going on down there.

JOSEPH SMITH: Yeah; there was always SOMEone who wanted the power that I held - especially over the LADIES - wink wink.

JESUS: No need to worry about that now; remember what my friend Matthew wrote down?

JOSEPH SMITH: This? “At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels in heaven” (Matthew 22:30)

JESUS: That's it.

JOSEPH SMITH: I thought that was mistranslated.

JESUS: Nah - it was right.

JOSEPH SMITH: Oh well; it was fun while it lasted. My buds will still get it on with the girls.

JESUS: Uh; I'm sorry; in just a few more years; your followers will cavein to the United States government and abandon the 'Eternal Covenant' that you came up with.

JOSEPH SMITH: ME!? YOU are the one that told me to do that!

JESUS: Sorry; but you must have mistranslated what I told you. What part of Do NOT commit ADULTERY did you not understand?

JOSEPH SMITH: mumble....

JESUS: What did you say?

JOSEPH SMITH: Oh, nothing.

JESUS: Well; it was interesting talking to you; but now I must get back to perparing a place for those who believe in Me.

JOSEPH SMITH: Oh, yeah; the Celestial Kingdom.

JESUS: No...

JOSEPH SMITH: The Telestial one?

JESUS: Nope.

JOSEPH SMITH: SUREly not the TERRESTRIAL one!!

JESUS: Nope. Didn't you read that the mind of man had NOT conceived of it? Paul wrote it down in 1 Corinthians 2:9.

JOSEPH SMITH: I thought that was mistranslated.

JESUS: No; it wasn't.

JOSEPH SMITH: You SURE?

JESUS: Yes. Now I must be going: what did you say your name was again?

JOSEPH SMITH: Joseph Smith.

JESUS: Hmmmm. According to my Heavenly FAITHbook, you didn't sign in as one of my friends - sorry, I never knew you.

JOSEPH SMITH: But....



 

23 posted on 02/20/2011 6:41:58 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Elsie
 
 
faithbook
Hi,
The following person invited you to be their friend on Faithbook:
Jesus Christ
Jesus Christ
Invite sent:
Every day of
your life.
 


Faithbook is a great place to keep in touch with friends, relatives and loved ones who have passed on. But first you need to join! Sign up today to create a profile and connect with the people you used to know.
Thanks,
The Faithbook Team
Faithbook is free and anyone can join.
Sign Up

To sign up for Faithbook, follow the link below:
http://www.FAITHBOOK.com/
This message was intended for whosoeverwill@believer.net. If you do not wish to receive this type of email from Faithbook in the future, please click here to unsubscribe.
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24 posted on 02/20/2011 6:43:56 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Ripliancum

You know rip, this is just poisoning of the well on your part. This dude has such touted mormon apologists as Peterson jumping and speaking up - so it isn’t an article or subject limited to a specific newspaper. Have you no better apologetic to offer? After all, you have the lost plates restored - rejoice.


25 posted on 02/20/2011 7:50:54 PM PST by Godzilla (3-7-77)
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To: Godzilla
After all, you have the lost plates restored - rejoice.

You Hateful BIGOTS know that we MORMONs just HAVE to have things confirmed by WITNESSES!

Three - eight - whatever in the old days. 12 unanimous confirmers now - or 70; who really knows?

--MormonDude(No; it mattereth not that the witnesses stories keep changing; as we'll ALWAYS pick the one(s) that benefit the CHURCH!)

26 posted on 02/21/2011 3:57:32 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Elsie

bttt


27 posted on 02/21/2011 7:12:46 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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