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Did Mary Have Other Children?
Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry ^ | Unknown | Matt Slick

Posted on 06/13/2011 3:57:07 PM PDT by HarleyD

One of the more controversial teachings of the Catholic church deals with the perpetual virginity of Mary. This doctrine maintains that Mary remained a virgin after the birth of Jesus and that biblical references suggesting Jesus had siblings are really references to cousins (Catechism of the Catholic Church, paragraph 510).

As the veneration of Mary increased throughout the centuries, the vehicle of Sacred Tradition became the means of promoting new doctrines not explicitly taught in the Bible. The virginity of Mary is clearly taught in scripture when describing the birth of Jesus. But is the doctrine of her continued virginity supported by the Bible? Did Mary lose her virginity after Jesus was born? Does the Bible reveal that Mary had other children, that Jesus had brothers and sisters?

The Bible does not come out and declare that Mary remained a virgin and that she had no children. In fact, the Bible seems to state otherwise: (All quotes are from the NASB.)

An initial reading of these biblical texts seems to clear up the issue: Jesus had brothers and sisters. But such obvious scriptures are not without their response from Catholic Theologians. The primary argument against these biblical texts is as follows:

In Greek, the word for brother is adelphos and sister is adelphe. This word is used in different contexts: of children of the same parents (Matt. 1:2; 14:3), descendants of parents (Acts 7:23, 26; Heb. 7:5), the Jews as a whole (Acts 3:17, 22), etc. Therefore, the term brother (and sister) can and does refer to the cousins of Jesus.

There is certainly merit in this argument, However, different contexts give different meanings to words. It is not legitimate to say that because a word has a wide scope of meaning, that you may then transfer any part of that range of meaning to any other text that uses the word. In other words, just because the word brother means fellow Jews or cousin in one place, does not mean it has the same meaning in another. Therefore, each verse should be looked at in context to see what it means.

Lets briefly analyze a couple of verses dealing with the brothers of Jesus.

In both of these verses, if the brothers of Jesus are not brothers, but His cousins, then who is His mother and who is the carpenters father? In other words, mother here refers to Mary. The carpenter in Matt. 13:55, refers to Joseph. These are literal. Yet, the Catholic theologian will then stop there and say, "Though carpenters son refers to Joseph, and mother refers to Mary, brothers does not mean brothers, but "cousins." This does not seem to be a legitimate assertion. You cannot simply switch contextual meanings in the middle of a sentence unless it is obviously required. The context is clear. This verse is speaking of Joseph, Mary, and Jesus brothers. The whole context is of familial relationship: father, mother, and brothers.

Psalm 69, A Messianic Psalm

There are many arguments pro and con concerning Jesus siblings. But the issue cannot be settled without examining Psalm 69, a Messianic Psalm. Jesus quotes Psalm 69:4 in John 15:25, "But they have done this in order that the word may be fulfilled that is written in their Law, they hated Me without a cause."

He also quotes Psalm 69:9 in John 2:16-17, "and to those who were selling the doves He said, "Take these things away; stop making My Fathers house a house of merchandise." His disciples remembered that it was written, "Zeal for Thy house will consume me."

Clearly, Psalm 69 is a Messianic Psalm since Jesus quoted it in reference to Himself two times. The reason this is important is because of what is written between the verses that Jesus quoted.

To get the whole context, here is Psalm 69:4-9, "Those who hate me without a cause are more than the hairs of my head; Those who would destroy me are powerful, being wrongfully my enemies, What I did not steal, I then have to restore. 5O God, it is Thou who dost know my folly, And my wrongs are not hidden from Thee. 6May those who wait for Thee not be ashamed through me, O Lord God of hosts; May those who seek Thee not be dishonored through me, O God of Israel, 7Because for Thy sake I have borne reproach; Dishonor has covered my face. 8I have become estranged from my brothers, and an alien to my mothers sons. 9For zeal for Thy house has consumed me, And the reproaches of those who reproach Thee have fallen on me."

This messianic Psalm clearly shows that Jesus has brothers. As Amos 3:7 says, "Surely the Lord God does nothing unless He reveals His secret counsel to His servants the prophets." Gods will has been revealed plainly in the New Testament and prophetically in the Old. Psalm 69 shows us that Jesus had brothers.

Did Mary have other children? The Bible seems to suggest yes. Catholic Tradition says no. Which will you trust?

Of course, the Catholic will simply state that even this phrase "my mother's sons" is in reference not to his siblings, but to cousins and other relatives. This is a necessary thing for the Catholic to say, otherwise, the perpetual virginity of Mary is threatened and since that contradicts Roman Catholic tradition, an interpretation that is consistent with that tradition must be adopted.

The question is, "Was Jesus estranged by His brothers?". Yes, He was. John 7:5 says "For not even His brothers were believing in Him." Furthermore, Psalm 69:8 says both "my brothers" and "my mother's sons." Are these both to be understood as not referring to His siblings? Hardly. The Catholics are fond of saying that "brothers" must mean "cousins." But, if that is the case, then when we read "an alien to my mother's sons" we can see that the writer is adding a further distinction and narrowing the scope of meaning. In other words, Jesus was alienated by his siblings, His very half-brothers begotten from Mary.

It is sad to see the Roman Catholic church go to such lengths to maintain Mary's virginity, something that is a violation of biblical law to be married and fill the earth.


TOPICS: General Discusssion; Mainline Protestant
KEYWORDS: brothers; cousins; mary; nameonebrother; relatives; stepchildren
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1 posted on 06/13/2011 3:57:11 PM PDT by HarleyD
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To: HarleyD; daniel1212

Something for your read.


2 posted on 06/13/2011 3:58:44 PM PDT by HarleyD
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To: HarleyD

I always thought Jesus had brothers.
In fact, I always wondered if he had sisters as well.


3 posted on 06/13/2011 3:59:41 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: HarleyD; drstevej; OrthodoxPresbyterian; CCWoody; Wrigley; Gamecock; Jean Chauvin; jboot; ...

Ping...


4 posted on 06/13/2011 4:01:41 PM PDT by HarleyD
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To: HarleyD

Um, the essay does not prove Mary had other children after Jesus. The essay does make a great case for Joseph having children who were his by another wife, who perhaps died in childbirth prior to Joseph’s betrothal with Mary. But the Bible really doesn’t make this issue plain. Joseph however is not a part of the New Testament story after childhood of Jesus (the incident where the twelve year old Jesus lagged behind at the Temple and was not missed until the parents were on the road appears to be the last mention of Joseph, IIRC).


5 posted on 06/13/2011 4:03:21 PM PDT by MHGinTN (Some, believing they can't be deceived, it's nigh impossible to convince them when they're deceived.)
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To: HarleyD
Of course! Mary was a stereotypical overbearing Jewish mom. Always bugging the Savior.

"Son, why do you have to spend so much time studying Torah at the synagogue? You don't even want to be a Rabbi. Why can't you be a lawyer like your brother Benny?"
6 posted on 06/13/2011 4:04:59 PM PDT by SoCal Pubbie
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To: MHGinTN

“The essay does make a great case for Joseph having children who were his by another wife, who perhaps died in childbirth prior to Joseph’s betrothal with Mary”

With all due respect, this is like the ‘Big Bang’ Theory. There is NO evidence of Joseph having had a prior wife ANYWHERE.
Yet there IS evidence that Mary had other children in this. They are always mentioned with Mary, not Joseph. Why do we just ASSUME that they MAY have been Joseph’s from a prior marriage? This is out of thin air.


7 posted on 06/13/2011 4:07:17 PM PDT by J40000
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To: HarleyD

No one, picking up a New Testament and reading it through, would conclude Mary remained a virgin. Neither would they conclude that Purgatory is real, that the Bishop of Rome reigns supreme, or that priests are needed to offer a literal sacrifice of the flesh and blood of Jesus each week (or more). Those require scripture to conform to tradition, rather than judge tradition in light of scripture.


8 posted on 06/13/2011 4:08:38 PM PDT by Mr Rogers (Poor history is better than good fiction, and anything with lots of horses is better still)
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To: HarleyD

Of course she did, there is no reason not to believe she and Joseph did not have children.


9 posted on 06/13/2011 4:08:41 PM PDT by svcw (Non forgiveness is like holding a hot coal thinking the other person will be blistered)
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To: J40000

Mentioned with Mary may be purely the result of Joseph having died and Mary raised the children and they are loyal to her for her dedication to them. James, brother of Jesus, did not believe in Him until after His resurrection, but then James becomes a prayer warrior for The Christ’s message. The author also fumbled a bit on the simile Jesus posed when He related that all who seek God’s Grace are His brothers and sisters.


10 posted on 06/13/2011 4:13:42 PM PDT by MHGinTN (Some, believing they can't be deceived, it's nigh impossible to convince them when they're deceived.)
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To: HarleyD; Salvation

>>It is sad to see the Roman Catholic church go to such lengths to maintain Mary’s virginity, something that is a violation of biblical law to be married and fill the earth.<<

I think that is a misinterpretation. The Bible is quite clear of a virgin birth of God’s Son. After that it will take some serious archaeological detective work to determine what happened. We know the last quote from Mary in the Bible is at the “water to wine” wedding and she says “do as He (Jesus) says.”

At least that is how I recall it. If someone knows otherwise I will gladly accept being corrected.

Salvation I ping you because I am pretty sure you know a lot about this kind of thing..


11 posted on 06/13/2011 4:14:53 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (Herman Cain 2012)
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To: HarleyD

The divinity of Jesus of Nazareth inheres in his being one of the three persons of the Trinity, the Godhead, and not in any sense on whether or not his mortal mother bore additional children. He is God, and nothing that any mortal has done or can do can alter that truth. No Christian believes that Messiah did not exist prior to his incarnation in a manner chosen by God to serve His purposes, or that God could not have achieved His purpose by some other means. We presume too much when we undertake to impose conditions on Jesus’ divinity on the basis of the imaginings of our innately sinful and errant minds.


12 posted on 06/13/2011 4:17:47 PM PDT by Elsiejay
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To: SoCal Pubbie

>>”Why can’t you be a lawyer like your brother Benny?” <<

He can walk on water and heal cripples, but can he spend a minute to talk to his mother? I am kvetching here and all he can think about is humanity! What, I am not part of humanity?

More Manachevitz, please. Did you know this was water this morning?

(am I going to be punished for that?)


13 posted on 06/13/2011 4:18:52 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (Herman Cain 2012)
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To: Mr Rogers; Joe 6-pack

He did plainly say, “Do this in memory of me.”


14 posted on 06/13/2011 4:20:17 PM PDT by definitelynotaliberal (There is no native criminal class except Congress. Mark Twain)
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To: Lancey Howard

I’m sure He did have sisters. I suppose it was the culture at the time, but, when Jesus fed the 5000, He only counted the men, not the women and children. I’ve always felt also, that Jesus had brothers and sisters because God loves His creation. Told us to go and multiply and I don’t believe God would have left Mary without other children. Also, back then women didn’t have jobs, relied heavily on husbands and their children. Especially as they grew older.


15 posted on 06/13/2011 4:21:40 PM PDT by MsLady (Be the kind of woman that when you get up in the morning, the devil says, "Oh crap, she's UP !!")
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To: Elsiejay

You raise good points. Are you aware that cells from a gestated child remain alive in the uterine tissue of the mother for possibly the rest of her life? If one believes Jesus was man AND God in His flesh, then cells from his time in Mary’s womb would also be ‘cells from God’. Would it be profane to have other children conceived in such a place? ... I’m asking, not preaching.


16 posted on 06/13/2011 4:24:14 PM PDT by MHGinTN (Some, believing they can't be deceived, it's nigh impossible to convince them when they're deceived.)
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To: HarleyD

These are aomong the stupidest threads I have seen on FR in a long time

Mary had a husband, Jesus talks about ‘brothers’

Mary and Joseph were ‘doing it’

What the heck is the problem with that, that it deserves 2 thousands years of speculation?


17 posted on 06/13/2011 4:25:15 PM PDT by Mr. K (CAPSLOCK! -Unleash the fury! [Palin/Bachman 2012- unbeatable ticket])
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To: freedumb2003

Of course not! It was the best wine the governor of the feast had tasted!


18 posted on 06/13/2011 4:25:15 PM PDT by MHGinTN (Some, believing they can't be deceived, it's nigh impossible to convince them when they're deceived.)
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To: HarleyD

Oh, goody, the literalists are at it again.

Just a note to the author: Catholic “tradition” and the selections as to what constituted the New Testament of the Bible were one and the same for 15 centuries, and the “Catholic” version of the New Testament hasn’t changed since then. Isn’t it highly unlikely that the Catholic Church just happened to miss, for 2000+ years, that the New Testament contradicted its teaching? But there are still those who think a smoking gun lurks somewhere . . .

This reminds me of the Sarah Palin email dump.


19 posted on 06/13/2011 4:28:13 PM PDT by Mach9
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To: HarleyD

**Did Mary Have Other Children?**

Simple answer — No. If anyone would have touched her, the Ark of the New Covenant, they would have died just like the people who touched the Ark of the Old Covenant died.

Also — look up in your Bible:

How many times is the word “brethren” used?

A lot!

They lived in family courts, usually with relatives around them. These relatives were called “brethren” or cousins. It’s the language of that day.


20 posted on 06/13/2011 4:28:14 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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