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To: Salvation

In the First Chapter of Romans it says God has spoken to everyone and all are without excuse to know who He is.

When God has unveiled Himself to people, if they have not been saved, they have made a conscience decision not to believe.


4 posted on 06/26/2011 6:15:49 PM PDT by Ecliptic
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To: Ecliptic
We got that, too.

And speaking of the holy Scriptures, he has added, “Which are able to make you wise,” that is, they will not suffer you to have any foolish feeling, such as most men have. For he who knows the Scriptures as he ought, is not offended at anything that happens; he endures all things manfully, referring them partly to faith, and to the incomprehensible nature of the divine dispensation, and partly knowing reasons for them, and finding examples in the Scriptures. Since it is a great sign of knowledge not to be curious about everything, nor to wish to know all things. And if you will allow me, I will explain myself by an example. Let us suppose a river, or rather rivers (I ask no allowance, I only speak of what rivers really are,) all are not of the same depth. Some have a shallow bed, others one deep enough to drown one unacquainted with it. In one part there are whirlpools, and not in another. It is good therefore to forbear to make trial of all, and it is no small proof of knowledge not to wish to sound all the depths: whereas he that would venture on every part of the river, is really most ignorant of the peculiar nature of rivers, and will often be in danger of perishing, from venturing into the deeper parts with the same boldness with which he crossed the shallows. So it is in the things of God. He that will know all things, and ventures to intrude into everything, he it is that is most ignorant what God is. And of rivers indeed, the greater part is safe, and the depths and whirlpools few, but with respect to the things of God, the greater part is hidden, and it is not possible to trace out His works. Why then are you bent on drowning yourself in those depths?

[...]

“Which are able,” he says, “to make you wise unto salvation.”

For the Scriptures suggest to us what is to be done, and what is not to be done. For hear this blessed one elsewhere saying, “You are confident that you yourself art a guide of the blind, a light of them which are in darkness, an instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes.” Romans 2:19-20 You see that the Law is the light of them which are in darkness; and if that which shows the letter, the letter which kills, is light, what then is the Spirit which quickens? If the Old Covenant is light, what is the New, which contains so many, and so great revelations? Where the difference is as great, as if any one should open heaven to those who only know the earth, and make all things there visible. There we learn concerning hell, heaven, and judgment. Let us not believe in things irrational. They are nothing but imposture. “What,” you say, “when what they foretell comes to pass?” It is because you believe it, if it does come to pass. The impostor has taken you captive. Your life is in his power, he manages you as he will. If a captain of robbers should have under his power and disposal the son of a king, who had fled to him, preferring the desert, and his lawless company, would he be able to pronounce whether he would live or die? Assuredly he would, not because he knows the future, but because he is the disposer of his life or death, the youth having put himself in his power. For according to his own pleasure, he may either kill him, or spare his life, as he has become subject to him, and it is equally at his disposal to say whether you shall be rich or poor. The greater part of the world have delivered themselves up into the hands of the devil.

And furthermore, it contributes much to favor the pretenses of these deceivers, that a man has accustomed himself to believe in them. For no one takes notice of their failures, but their lucky conjectures are observed. But if these men have any power of prognosticating, bring them to me, a believer. I say not this, as magnifying myself, (for it is no great honor to be superior to these things,) and indeed I am deep-laden with sins; but with respect to these matters, I will not be humble-minded; by the grace of God I despise them all. Bring me this pretender to magic; let him, if he has any power of prognosticating, tell me what will happen to me tomorrow. But he will not tell me. For I am under the power of the King, and he has no claim to my allegiance or submission. I am far from his holes and caverns. I war under the king. “But some one committed theft,” you say, “and this man discovered it.” This is not always true, certainly, but for the most part absurdities and falsehoods. For they know nothing. If indeed they know anything, they ought rather to speak of their own concerns, how the numerous offerings to their idols have been stolen, how so much of their gold has been melted. Why have they not informed their Priests? Even for the sake of money, they have not been able to give information when their idol-temples have been burnt, and many have perished with them. Why do they not provide for their own safety? But it is altogether a matter of chance, if they have predicted anything. With us there are prophets, and they do not fail. They do not speak truth in one instance and falsehood in another, but always declare the truth; for this is the privilege of foreknowledge.

Cease, then, from this madness, I beseech you, if at least you believe in Christ; and if you believe not, why do you expose yourselves? Why do you deceive? “How long will you halt on both your hips?” 1 Kings 18:21, Septuagint Why do you go to them? Why enquire of them? The instant you go to them, the instant you enquire, you put yourself in slavery to them. For you enquire, as if you believed. “No,” you say, “I do not enquire, as believing, but making trial of them.” But to make trial, whether they speak the truth, is the part not of one who believes that they are false, but of one who still doubts. Wherefore then do you enquire what will happen? For if they answered, “This will happen, but do so and so, and you will escape it”; even in that case you ought by no means to be an idolater; yet your madness were not so great. But if they foretell future events, he that listens to them will gain nothing more than unavailing sorrow. The event does not happen, but he suffers the uneasiness, and torments, himself.

If it were for our good, God would not have grudged us this foreknowledge. He who has revealed to us things in heaven, would not have envied us. For, “All things,” He says, “that I have heard of the Father I have made known unto you”; and, “I call you not servants, but friends. You are my friends.” John 15:15 Why then did He not make these things known unto us? Because He would not have us concerned about them. And as a proof that He does not envy us this knowledge, such things were revealed to the ancients, because they were babes, even about an ass, and the like. But to us, because He would not have us concerned about such things, He has not cared to reveal them. But what do we learn? Things which they never knew, for little indeed were all those things of old. But what we are taught is this, that we shall rise again, that we shall be immortal, and incorruptible, that our life shall have no end, that all things will pass away, that we shall be caught up in the clouds, that the wicked shall suffer punishment, and numberless other things, and in all these there is no falsehood. Is it not better to know these than to hear that the ass that was lost is found? Lo, you have gotten your ass! Lo, you have found him! What is your gain? Will he not soon be lost again some other way? For if he leave you not, at least you will lose him in your death. But the things which I have mentioned, if we will but hold them fast, we shall retain perpetually. These therefore let us pursue. To these stable and enduring goods let us attach ourselves. Let us not give heed to soothsayers, fortune-tellers, and jugglers, but to God who knows all things certainly, whose knowledge is universal. Thus we shall know all that it befits us to know, and shall obtain all good things, through the grace and lovingkindness, etc.

St. John the Chrysostom, Homily 8 on Second Timothy

7 posted on 06/26/2011 6:36:53 PM PDT by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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To: Ecliptic

It is a good thing that evolutionists are not detectives. Why? Because God has given countless, indisputable clues and evidence regarding His creation, yet they apparently have missed them all. If I was a defendant in a court case, I would hope the prosecution were all evolutionists.


10 posted on 06/26/2011 7:10:26 PM PDT by DennisR (Look around - God gives countless, indisputable clues that He does, indeed, exist.)
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To: Ecliptic

if they have not been saved>>

I thought baptism took care of that.


11 posted on 06/26/2011 7:36:32 PM PDT by Coleus (Adult Stem Cells Work, there is NO Need to Harvest Babies for Their Body Parts!)
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