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The Church Built on Peter
The Integrated Catholic Life ^ | June 29, 2011 | Fr. Roger Landry

Posted on 06/29/2011 5:46:53 AM PDT by Not gonna take it anymore

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To: Jvette; CynicalBear
Third, why do you think that Jesus says to Peter first, thou art Peter(rock, which we all agree)first and then says upon this rock I will build my church? It is clear in any reading of this passage that Jesus first calls Simon Rock, then says He will build His church upon this rock.

Clear to you but not to thhe Catholic Church. One of you is in error.

CATECHISM OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH

424 Moved by the grace of the Holy Spirit and drawn by the Father, we believe in Jesus and confess: 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God. On the rock of this faith confessed by St. Peter, Christ built his Church.


101 posted on 06/30/2011 10:23:44 AM PDT by OLD REGGIE (I am a Biblical Unitarian?)
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To: OLD REGGIE; CynicalBear; Jvette
typical unitarian response is to take something out of context, like the bible and then mould it to fit their philosophy

Why don't you, Old Reggie, explain to Cynical bear how a unitarian uses sola scriptura to prove that Jesus Christ is not God?

On what basis does a unitarian even consider scripture to BE scripture?

unitarians believe in the big ? in the sky

102 posted on 06/30/2011 10:29:47 AM PDT by Cronos ( W Szczebrzeszynie chrzaszcz brzmi w trzcinie I Szczebrzeszyn z tego slynie.)
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To: Cronos

I understand about languages that assign a gender to objects. I was born in Spain, my native language is Spanish, and my husband still gets confused when I refer to our car as “he” and his pick up truck as “she”. However, in the petros vs. petra controversy gender is just one factor, the meanings are different. Do you believe that Matthew wrote the gospel under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit? If so, you must agree that the Holy Spirit wanted Simon to be known as Petros (not Petra).


103 posted on 06/30/2011 10:31:28 AM PDT by Former Fetus
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To: Not gonna take it anymore
For those of you who think we Catholics are going to Hell, just remember to look after your own soul.

Hate is not cleansing.

You're confusing compassion with hate...And of course anything anti-Catholic seems to be hate to you guys...

Compassion for those who may fall into the trap of your religion...We are warning them ahead of time...

Some of you claim that once you become a Catholic, you can not leave the Catholic religion...Not unlike 'Hotel California'...

104 posted on 06/30/2011 12:02:32 PM PDT by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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To: Cronos
Peter was the first to baptise a gentile -- don't forget that.

Peter baptized them with water AFTER God baptized them with the Holy Spirit...

105 posted on 06/30/2011 12:24:07 PM PDT by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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To: MarkBsnr
Interesting viewpoint. If you actually read the Gospels, you will find that Peter was the foremost amongst the Apostles in the teaching of Jesus and in interaction with Him.

Peter was certainly the most colorful...It could be that Peter was the only one who kept falling off both sides of the fence and he made a good example for Jesus to teach us about...

You keep saying that Paul was only sent to the Gentiles. Why then, if you examine Paul's life, did he spend most of his time with the Jews? And Peter?

I don't argue with God like you do...

Gal 2:7 But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;
Gal 2:8 (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles:)

Peter was given the keys, and charged by Jesus to 'feed My sheep'. Nobody else was.

That charge was given to all the Apostles...And then to the disciples, bishops, pastors, etc...

And Catholicism is not a religion; we have the Faith handed down from the Apostles which was given to them from Jesus.

Weird statement...Faith comes from Jesus Christ to the individual Christian...Not thru anyone, even the apostles...

106 posted on 06/30/2011 12:41:33 PM PDT by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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To: MarkBsnr
Still denying the divinity of Christ and the Holy Spirit?

Hardly...I'm denying the divinity of your religion's Holy Father, your pope...

107 posted on 06/30/2011 12:43:18 PM PDT by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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To: Jvette
None of it contradicts that Peter was whom the Lord chose to lead His church and Scripture supports that truth, when one reads how Peter is the first and the foremost mentioned in nearly all of the NT.

There is no human leader of the church...

Luk 22:26 But ye shall not be so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve.

1Co 1:12 Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ.
1Co 1:13 Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?
1Co 1:14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
1Co 1:15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.
1Co 1:16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.
1Co 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.

108 posted on 06/30/2011 12:49:57 PM PDT by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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To: johngrace
This webster guy is totally out of context. I have a dictionary of early fathers qoutes. They firmly believed in a head of the church.

If that's true, they they were wrong...So what's the big deal???

109 posted on 06/30/2011 12:53:37 PM PDT by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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To: Jvette
Protestants dissent from the Church that it is in this passage Christ names Peter as the one to lead His church.

No...Protestants dissent because the verse doesn't say what you want it to say...

It's an obscure verse at best...There is nothing in scripture that indicates that Jesus built his church on the person of Peter the Apostle...

The keys, the binding and loosing, the feed the sheep were given to all the Apostles...Not just Peter..

Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;

You take a clear verse like the one posted and ignore it and then try to use an obscure verse like Matt. 16:18 to prove something that doesn't make any sense...

No one believes that Peter is anything other than Christ’s representative after His return to heaven. The Church does not teach anything other than that.

There's a bunch of us who don't believe that regardless of what your Church teaches...

110 posted on 06/30/2011 1:02:58 PM PDT by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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To: Jvette
Scripture does not record the entire history of the church, but we do see in Acts that Peter calls for a replacement for Judas. That is the foundation of Apostolic Succession. Immediately we see Peter taking the lead and we see how men were to be chosen to continue the work of the Apostles.

Peter was wrong...God picks all the Apostles himself...God did not make an exception for Peter's maneuvre...

111 posted on 06/30/2011 1:06:10 PM PDT by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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To: Not gonna take it anymore

Very interesting read.


112 posted on 06/30/2011 1:08:10 PM PDT by AnalogReigns
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To: Cronos
now to a person who only knows English this may seem like two different meaning intentions, but that is because English does not have gender assigned to inanimate objects

There are many bible/language scholars who disagree with your premise...

113 posted on 06/30/2011 1:09:23 PM PDT by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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To: OLD REGGIE

Appears they don’t even believe their own catechism...


114 posted on 06/30/2011 1:11:35 PM PDT by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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To: Former Fetus
Of course this was inspired by the Holy Spirit, yet that still requires two separate gender constructs for Petra (rock) and Petros (masculine line)

And, was it originally in Aramaic/Hebrew and translated into Greek? If yes, then in Aramaic, the word used is Cephas which has no such issue

And finally, the chances are better that Jesus original words WERE in Aramaic, not Greek

115 posted on 06/30/2011 2:25:23 PM PDT by Cronos ( W Szczebrzeszynie chrzaszcz brzmi w trzcinie I Szczebrzeszyn z tego slynie.)
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To: Iscool; Not gonna take it anymore; MarkBsnr

of course the difference is that we Christians unlike your group, don’t believe that God exists in modes...


116 posted on 06/30/2011 2:26:46 PM PDT by Cronos ( W Szczebrzeszynie chrzaszcz brzmi w trzcinie I Szczebrzeszyn z tego slynie.)
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To: Iscool; Not gonna take it anymore; MarkBsnr

Yup and Peter baptised the first gentile nonetheless, God’s spirit is involved irrespective of the baptiser


117 posted on 06/30/2011 2:27:39 PM PDT by Cronos ( W Szczebrzeszynie chrzaszcz brzmi w trzcinie I Szczebrzeszyn z tego slynie.)
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To: Iscool; Not gonna take it anymore; MarkBsnr
iscool: God baptized them with the Holy Spirit.

err Iscool, perhaps it's new to you but to us Christians, the Holy Spirit is God

118 posted on 06/30/2011 2:28:52 PM PDT by Cronos ( W Szczebrzeszynie chrzaszcz brzmi w trzcinie I Szczebrzeszyn z tego slynie.)
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To: Iscool

Not really. And you’re not a bible or a language scholar.


119 posted on 06/30/2011 2:29:51 PM PDT by Cronos ( W Szczebrzeszynie chrzaszcz brzmi w trzcinie I Szczebrzeszyn z tego slynie.)
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To: Iscool

Besides, Iscool, you never answered — you claimed to be Catholic, right? Supposedly a Catholic converting to the Baptists in 2007. Were you Catholic?


120 posted on 06/30/2011 2:38:02 PM PDT by Cronos ( W Szczebrzeszynie chrzaszcz brzmi w trzcinie I Szczebrzeszyn z tego slynie.)
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