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The Church Built on Peter
The Integrated Catholic Life ^ | June 29, 2011 | Fr. Roger Landry

Posted on 06/29/2011 5:46:53 AM PDT by Not gonna take it anymore

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To: CynicalBear
Give it up man. The RCC says EVERYTHING needed for salvation is tied to the RCC. The catechism of the RCC so states over and over.

It's amusing that you ignored not only my posting to you about this, but also the very words from the CCC that you posted.

The CCC has the articles (previously posted) that indicate that there is the possibility of salvation outside of the Church - only that Christ has not chosen to elaborate on it.

If you think that you can weasel your way into salvation on weasel words, then feel free to utilize them on your Judgement Day. Or else, you can tell Jesus that His Church is unable to do what He charged them to do. Have at it, and good luck to you.

141 posted on 06/30/2011 5:48:36 PM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
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To: MarkBsnr
>> but also the very words from the CCC that you posted.<<

I just quoted to you the catechism that states ALL authority for salvation comes through the RCC. Re Read the bold sections.

142 posted on 06/30/2011 5:56:14 PM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: CynicalBear

It says through, based upon Scripture and the words of Our Lord. Not by, as you intimated. Re read the Gospels for further illumination.

143 posted on 06/30/2011 5:58:52 PM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
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As I find so often, non Catholics want to separate Peter and Peter’s faith, as if that is even possible.

Peter is named rock by God, who only changes the names of people that He has great plans for in His salvation of our souls. That faith that Peter had was a gift from God, Jesus says “Blessed are you because flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father in heaven.”

God gave to Peter the faith he would need to be strong in the face of the persecution and doubts that would come once Jesus was crucified, rose and ascended to heaven.

The passage you quote from the catechism does not contradict that Peter is the first leader of the church, given that charge by Jesus and the faith he would need by God.

So non Catholics can say the Rock is Jesus, the rock is Peter’s confession or whatever. The truth is that it is all of the above.

Jesus leads His church, through the Holy Spirit.

144 posted on 06/30/2011 6:31:21 PM PDT by Jvette
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To: Former Fetus

I believe that Christ is the cornerstone and Peter, by his faith, is the rock upon which Christ founded His church.

145 posted on 06/30/2011 6:35:54 PM PDT by Jvette
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To: Iscool

One at a time.

The pope is called the servant of the servants of God. He serves the church not himself, all that he has for his use does not belong to him.

No one says they are of the pope. We are God’s children, brothers and sisters of Christ and it is Christ whom we worship and serve.

Christ’s church has certainly been divided, but not by us.

The rest is simply Paul explaining his call and gifts for the church, the body of Christ as well as his concern that certain of the faithful were aligning themselves with certain Apostles and not adhering to the one faith those Apostles preached. It does not mean anything else.

146 posted on 06/30/2011 6:43:22 PM PDT by Jvette
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To: MarkBsnr

Never in the New Testament is salvation contingent upon belonging to an organized institution. The RCC has placed itself between Christ and the people and will be punished for it.

147 posted on 06/30/2011 6:49:58 PM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: Iscool

I did not ignore that verse, we are discussing Peter, the fact that his name was changed to rock and what that means.

Now the passage is obscure? I thought all Scripture was self interpretive. Why, as a Christian can’t I just read it and instantly understand it?

No one says that Peter was the only Apostle that received the binding and loosing as we see in the Gospel of John, when Jesus appeared in the upper room, He says a similar thing when He tells those there, “Whatever you forgive will be forgiven, and whatever you do not forgive, will not be forgiven.”

It is however, only to Peter that He gives the keys of the kingdom. And it is only to Peter that God revealed the truth of who Jesus is.

148 posted on 06/30/2011 6:54:51 PM PDT by Jvette
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To: CynicalBear

No, they believe that Christians are subjects of the church with Christ as the head.

BTW, still no answer for me in your own words? That’s okay, I can wait.

149 posted on 06/30/2011 6:56:58 PM PDT by Jvette
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To: CynicalBear; MarkBsnr

The Church claims nothing for herself that was not given to her by Christ.

In John Jesus says, “As the Father sent me, so I send you.”

God, through His Son Jesus has established His Church which is guided by the Holy Spirit.

He made this choice so that all people could hear and know of Jesus and come to believe in Him and be saved.

Everything anyone knows about Jesus came to them through the Church, His Church.

The Church has been ENTRUSTED with the fullness of His grace and truth to the extent that God wishes it to be.

Yes, ALL of it comes through the Church by the will of God.

150 posted on 06/30/2011 7:09:10 PM PDT by Jvette
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To: CynicalBear

James agrees with Peter who proclaimed that God had revealed to him that the Gentiles were to be included in the message.

Yep, Peter knew it first. :)

151 posted on 06/30/2011 7:12:53 PM PDT by Jvette
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To: Iscool

No where in that post did I say that Peter picked any Apostle.

Read it again.

It says that Peter calls for a replacement and then Judas is replaced.

152 posted on 06/30/2011 7:15:40 PM PDT by Jvette
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To: Jvette

Don’t wait for me dear. I quoted scripture which says that God is the Rock but you RCC folks insist on replacing Him with Peter. My words would never do.

153 posted on 06/30/2011 7:42:54 PM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: CynicalBear

Copping out eh?

got it:)

154 posted on 06/30/2011 7:58:50 PM PDT by Jvette
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To: Jvette
>> Copping out eh?<<

I’m near 63 years old dear. Been down this road more times then I care to remember. Those who are tied to an organization rather then to Christ alone need the earthly ties and I’ve become convinced that it’s futile on my part.

155 posted on 06/30/2011 8:17:51 PM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: CynicalBear

That’s okay, I forgive you :)

I am tied to Christ through the Church, in fact I receive Him in the Eucharist every time I attend Mass. It is the greatest blessing I could ever hope for.

I too sometimes feel that it is futile, though I do enjoy the debate.

It is up to the Holy Spirit as we both know.

156 posted on 06/30/2011 8:44:24 PM PDT by Jvette
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To: MarkBsnr; Quix; Joya; All
on this rock " Jesus The Christ "I will build My church , colossians staes that Jesus is the first born of all creation and in hebrews 12 the word of God says you have come to The Church of the first born Jesus Christ ! Not Peter a man born into sin and who denied Christ 3 times . ---Amuzgo de Guerrero (AMU)--- Amuzgo de Guerrero ---العربية (AR)--- Arabic Life Application Bible ---Български (BG)--- 1940 Bulgarian Bible Bulgarian Bible ---Chinanteco de Comaltepec (CCO)--- Chinanteco de Comaltepec ---Cakchiquel Occidental (CKW)--- Cakchiquel Occidental ---Kreyol (CPF)--- Haitian Creole Version ---Čeština (CS)--- Slovo na cestu ---Dansk (DA)--- Dette er Biblen på dansk ---Deutsch (DE)--- Hoffnung für Alle Luther Bibel 1545 ---English (EN)--- 21st Century King James Version American Standard Version Amplified Bible Common English Bible Contemporary English Version Darby Translation Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition English Standard Version GOD’S WORD Translation Good News Translation Holman Christian Standard Bible King James Version The Message New American Standard Bible New Century Version New International Reader's Version New International Version New International Version 1984 New International Version - UK New King James Version New Living Translation Today's New International Version Worldwide English (New Testament) Wycliffe Bible Young's Literal Translation ---Español (ES)--- La Biblia de las Américas Castilian Dios Habla Hoy Nueva Biblia Latinoamericana de Hoy Nueva Traducción Viviente Nueva Versión Internacional Reina Valera Contemporánea Reina-Valera 1960 Reina-Valera 1995 Reina-Valera Antigua Traducción en lenguaje actual ---Français (FR)--- La Bible du Semeur Louis Segond ---Κοινη (GRC)--- 1550 Stephanus New Testament 1881 Westcott-Hort New Testament 1894 Scrivener New Testament SBL Greek New Testament ---תירביע (HE)--- The Westminster Leningrad Codex ---Ilonggo (HIL)--- Hiligaynon Bible ---Hrvatski (HR)--- Croatian Bible ---Magyar (HU)--- Hungarian Károli ---Íslenska (IS)--- Icelandic Bible ---Italiano (IT)--- Conferenza Episcopale Italiana La Nuova Diodati La Parola è Vita ---Jacalteco, Oriental (JAC)--- Jacalteco, Oriental ---Kekchi (KEK)--- Kekchi ---Latina (LA)--- Biblia Sacra Vulgata ---Māori (MI)--- Maori Bible ---Macedonian (MK)--- Macedonian New Testament ---Mam, Central (MVC)--- Mam, Central ---Mam, Todos Santos (MVJ)--- Mam de Todos Santos Chuchumatán ---Plautdietsch (NDS)--- Reimer 2001 ---Náhuatl de Guerrero (NGU)--- Náhuatl de Guerrero ---Nederlands (NL)--- Het Boek ---Norsk (NO)--- Det Norsk Bibelselskap 1930 Levande Bibeln ---Português (PT)--- João Ferreira de Almeida Atualizada O Livro ---Quiché, Centro Occidenta (QUT)--- Quiché, Centro Occidental ---Română (RO)--- Romanian Romanian ---Русский (RU)--- Russian Synodal Version Slovo Zhizny ---Slovenčina (SK)--- Nádej pre kazdého ---Shqip (SQ)--- Albanian Bible ---Svenska (SV)--- Levande Bibeln Svenska 1917 ---Kiswahili (SW)--- Swahili New Testament ---Tagalog (TL)--- Ang Salita ng Diyos ---Українська (UK)--- Ukrainian Bible ---Uspanteco (USP)--- Uspanteco ---Tiêng Viêt (VI)--- 1934 Vietnamese Bible ---汉语 (ZH)--- Chinese Union Version (Simplified) Chinese Union Version (Traditional)Page Options Add parallel<<<= =>>>Show resources Show Commentary Colossians 1:13-18 King James Version (KJV) 13Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son: 14In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins: 15Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: 16For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: 17And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. 18And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence. Hebrews 12:22-24 New King James Version (NKJV) 22 But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angels, 23 to the general assembly and "Church of the "Firstborn" who are registered in heaven, to God the Judge of all, to the spirits of just men made perfect, 24 to "Jesus" the Mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks better things than that of Abel.
157 posted on 06/30/2011 8:44:27 PM PDT by Jedediah
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To: Jvette
>>I am tied to Christ through the Church<<

I belong to Jesus Christ directly.

1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus

158 posted on 06/30/2011 9:12:58 PM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: Jedediah
Hey Dear Bro, silly rabbit.

You've been at this long enough to know . . .

any time you use "<" or ">" in a posting window, you will automatically trigger the html function. The result--



Your choice is to:

1. take ALL the html triggering codes and symbols out--sometimes time consuming and tricky--or

2. code paragraphs properly with < p > without spaces between the "p" and the carets.

Anyway--I don't think I have it in me to try and decipher your mass of text for you tonight.

I *THINK* I agree with what I can read of your post, though.


159 posted on 06/30/2011 9:26:25 PM PDT by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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Nope, unlike unitarians, even “biblical unitarians”, I believe that Jesus Christ is Lord, God and Savior. Do you dispute that Jesus who we Christians (as opposed to unitarians) consider God, doesn’t mean it when he renames someone?

160 posted on 06/30/2011 11:09:29 PM PDT by Cronos ( W Szczebrzeszynie chrzaszcz brzmi w trzcinie I Szczebrzeszyn z tego slynie.)
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