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Rev. 18:3: Evolution...Primordial Heresy as Royal Science of Man Becoming God
Renew America ^ | July 18, 2011 | Linda Kimball

Posted on 07/19/2011 5:07:06 AM PDT by spirited irish

From the days of Adam right down to our own time, the devilish belief that man is God has danced across history, seducing millions in its path. Early Church Father John of Damascus identifies barbarism as the primordial heresy, the idea that man is god:

"Barbarism is that which prevailed from the days of Adam down through ten generations to the time of Noah. It is called barbarism because of the fact that in those times men had no ruling authority or mutual accord, but every man was independent and a law unto himself after the dictates of his own will." (John of Damascus, "The Fount of Knowledge," cited in Political Apocalypse, Ellis Sandoz, p. 131)

After studying civilizations across the whole span of history, noted historian Arnold Toynbee concluded that the paramount religion of mankind is self-worship...of man as god. Tal Brooke concurs, noting that historically there has always been an exoteric polytheism-pantheism for the general masses and a high level esoteric "advaitic" monism for the higher initiate. For initiates then:

".... the Great Lie (is) the foundation stone of Hinduism, Buddhism, Sufism, Jainism, Sikhism, Taoism, the Kabala, the Greek Hermetic, Eleusinian and Gnostic beliefs, Neo-Platonism, all the occult creeds from Theosophy and the Masonic orders to the Rosicrucian's (and) the New Age movement. The Great Lie is...the belief that man is God, that his true identity is the immortal self...that as God, he will never die (and) Sin and depravity are...illusions since this inner divinity is at man's core." (The Great Lie, Tal Brooke, SCP Journal, Vol. 29:2-29:3, 2005)

The Book of Revelation pinpoints Babylon as the post-flood center both of an organized religion based on the primordial heresy and as the first utopian or heaven on earth project. Babylon embraced the Great Lie. Its inhabitants claimed the title, "I AM." They were earmarked by their "advaitic monism," science of magic-transformism, exalted priesthood, gnosis, secret initiations, sorcery, astrology, channeling, psychic-powers, familiar spirits, and hedonism. But the root source of this evil religion and its occult power was the Great Dragon himself....Lucifer.

God abhors these practices and sternly reminds His people through the prophet Isaiah (45:18-19) not to be seduced by Babylon's deadly delusion:

"I AM the Lord, and there is none other. I have not spoken in secret, neither in a place of darkness." "I said not to the seed of Jacob..." seek me in the monistic 'one thing'....chaos, the formless void, Kant's deified reason,' Hegel's Geist, Marx's dialectical matter, Natural Selection, the Force, the Overmind, Absolute Spirit, the Christ consciousness or the "thought-universe" of quantum mechanics.

Primordial Heresy as Modern Ideology

"Exalting mankind to the status of deity...dates from the farthest reaches of antiquity, but its development into an ideology embracing the masses is a characteristic of modernity." (Herbert Schlossberg, cited in The Seduction of Christianity, Dave Hunt and T.A. McMahon)

Toynbee pinpointed the bloody French Revolution as the first orchestrated reappearance of the primordial heresy, and in tacit agreement with the findings of early Conservative intellectuals, of the entire "nightmare of destruction in which America and other nations participated" from WWI through WWII as further manifestations. (The Conservative Intellectual Movement in America, George H. Nash, p. 31)

Primordial heresy as modernist ideology takes many forms:

" rationalism, positivism, naturalism, materialism, evolutionism, social Darwinism, Natural Selection, empiricism, Hegelianism, Marxism, scientific socialism, scientism, Secular Humanism, Tran humanism, Freudianism, existentialism, progressivism, liberalism, utopianism, revolutionary activism, fascism, communism, national socialism, determinism, reductionism, nihilism, deconstructionism, moral relativism, antitheism, behaviorism and underlying them all, atheism."

In his book "Utopia: The Perennial Heresy," Catholic philosopher and historian Thomas Molnar (1910-2010) notes that the two recurring themes of modern ideologies are monism and evolutionary conceptions. At the root of these two themes there is:

" defiance of God, pride unlimited, a yearning for enormous power and the assumption of divine attributes with a view to manipulating and shaping mankind's fate." (p. 227)

In order for god-men to create a new world and a new man:

"the order of being must be obliterated (and reinterpreted) as essentially under man's control." Taking control "requires the decapitation of being — the murder of God." (Eric Voegelin, "Science, Politics and Gnosticism," p. xv)

Fundamentally, Darwinism is materialist monism and as the pillar of natural science is the devilish idea by which naturalist god-men have "decapitated God" and seized control of the order of being.

In short, Darwinism is powerful magic wielded by a cult religion's sorcerers:

"(Darwinism is) nothing but a kind of cult, a cult religion....It has no scientific validity whatsoever. Darwin's so-called theory of evolution is based on absurdly irrational propositions, which did not come from scientific observations, but were artificially introduced from the outside, for political-ideological reasons." (Jonathan Tennenbaum, "Towards 'A New Science of Life,' Executive Intelligence Review, Vol. 28, No. 34, Sept. 7, 2001)

Indeed, Daniel Dennett tacitly agrees, for he describes Darwinism as a 'universal acid.' In other words, Darwinism is the "acid bath" in which God the Father and His entire order of being are in process of dissolution, a diabolical conjuration requiring the conceptual dismantling of:

" human individuality through the dissolution of individual conscience and consciousness, and then to replace these with the collectivity (monism) and coalesced consciousness (i.e., the Force, Christ Consciousness)." (Molnar, 227, emphasis added)

"...they seek my soul to destroy it..." Psalm 63:9

In this light, when Daniel Dennett, the Wizard of Reductionism claims that there really is no you, that soul, spirit and free will are illusions caused by chemical interactions in the brain and Tom Wolfe, Sorcerer of Naturalism waves his magic wand and intones, "Sorry, but your soul just died," they speak as sorcerers (Acts 13:6-10) conjuring away man's "individual conscience and consciousness" through words that destroy. (The Spiritual Brain: A Neuroscientist's Case for the Existence of the Soul, Beauregard and O'Leary, p. 4)

Return of the Primordial Heresy: A Brief Timeline

"The leading principle of Utopian religion is the repudiation of the doctrine of Original Sin." (H.G. Wells, A Modern Utopia, 1905)

Repudiating Original Sin necessitates the obliteration of the transcendent God and His order of being, a project already underway by the time of Descartes. In her book "Total Truth," Nancy Pearcy, a senior fellow at the Discovery Institute, writes that one of the great ironies of history is that the enduring impact of Descartes philosophy has been precisely the opposite of what he had intended. Descartes had intended the defense of the human soul over and against the dehumanizing mechanistic and materialistic conception of the universe. Instead, the soul — and its citadel mind — was reduced to a shadowy substance totally irrelevant to the material realm known by natural science. The immortal soul became a kind of ghost only tenuously connected to the physical body. The novelist Walker Percy speaks of the:

"dread chasm that has rent the soul of Western man ever since the famous philosopher Descartes ripped body loose from mind and turned the very soul into a ghost that haunts its own house." ("Total Truth," Nancy Pearcey, p. 103)

After the success of Newtonian physics natural science began to be viewed as the way of progress and enlightenment and nature described as a cosmic machine, governed by deterministic energies working through natural laws as strictly as the gears of a clock. Though soul and spirit are crucial for reason, conscience, morality, belief, faith, prayer, theorizing, science, and religion, there was no room for them in the mindless cosmic machine.

The mechanistic conception gave rise to rationalism, determinism, positivism and scientific materialism (atheism), which grant naturalistic science a monopoly on so-called "real" knowledge while trivializing everything else to personal belief and social constructs.

"Evil thoughts...generated evil deeds." (George H. Nash, The Conservative Intellectual Movement, p.48)

"Observing the modern intellectual crap, it is time that someone knocked at the door of...Immanuel Kant and told him the fatidic words from that famous Brazilian comic samba — Here, take back your child." (The Father of the Crap, Olavo de Carvalho, Mar. 5, 1998, www.olavodecarvalho.org/ )

The German philosopher Immanuel Kant was a pivotal figure in the obliteration of man's immortal soul. Kant desired to cut loose from God, and being morally defective he eagerly embraced the Enlightenment's mechanistic image of man and the universe. Thus he took it upon himself to recast mind and freedom as "autonomous self" and the material realm as the deterministic Newtonian world machine. In praise of the cosmic machine he wrote:

"(it is) necessary that everything which takes place should be infallibly determined in accordance with the laws of nature." (Total Truth, p. 104)

Though Kant saw the need for reason and morality, which presupposes the soul (mind and free will), he nevertheless sought autonomy from God the Father, thus negating the existence of his own soul....and reason. Undeterred, Kant went on to define self-autonomy as being subject only to laws imposed on himself by himself. In short, Kant would be sovereign and influenced by nothing but his own deified reason. This is a variant of idealist monism that teaches that reality and creative powers exist within man's mind. As one theologian commented:

"The creation of universal (moral) law was traditionally the function of God alone, and this function is now arrogated to the individual human rational will." Thus it can be said that "Kant has made reason into God." (ibid, p. 105)

It is crucial to realize Kant's dichotomy is outright contradictory. For if mindless nature really is the deterministic machine of Newtonian physics, then mind (i.e., reason), morality, belief, and science are not possible in that man is nothing but a puppet dancing to the mindless tunes of mindless nature. Even Kant admitted that this was a paradox that he was unable to resolve. The trick, he said, is to enter into a charade. We will be swindlers who on one hand will publicly pretend to be fully caused and determined by nature while on the other we will quietly participate in a spiritual world where we conceive of ourselves as free moral agents.

According to Kant's swindle the material realm is the realm of publicly verifiable scientific facts which in our own time are for example, Darwinism, atheism, man as evolved ape, determinism, and moral relativism while the spiritual is the politically-incorrect realm of belief, faith, religion, special creation, God the Father and moral absolutes. Kant's swindle is behind the Orwellian-speak or politically-correct cognitive dissonance that has become pandemic in our own day through the efforts of contemporary Kantians: social scientists, evolutionary biologists, Hollywood, media, higher education, jurists, and sorcerers such as Sam Harris, Daniel Dennett, and Richard Dawkins.

Following Kant's lead, a legion of neo-pagan ideologues openly advocated total integration into mindless nature. What these malcontents sought was salvation from God the Father, Original Sin, Universal Moral Law, sexual ethics, and their own immortal souls by immersing themselves into the "forces and rhythms of nature." Lester Crocker summarizes the Enlightenment premise:

"There existed in the eighteenth century a widespread desire to equate the moral with the physical world...." What was desired above all was, "total integration of man in nature, with refusal of any transcendence, even though it was admitted that his more complex physical organization gave him certain special abilities and ways of thinking. The important thing, as La Mettrie, d'Holbach, and others made clear, is that he is submitted to the same laws; everything is response to need — mechanically, some added, like a tree or a machine. Man merely carries out natural forces — without any freedom whatsoever — in all he does, whether he loves or hates, helps or hurts, gives life or takes it." (Monsters from the Id, E. Michael Jones, p. 5, 7)

In his influential "History of Jacobinism," Abbe Barruel commented:

"With Voltaire, man is a pure machine; Frederick the Great maintains..."I know that I am an animal organized, and that thinks; hence, I conclude that matter can think, as well as that it has the property of being electric." La Mettries' "man-machine, or his man-plant, only caused the Sect to blush from the open manner in which he had said what many of them wished to insinuate." (ibid, p. 6, 7)

The Enlightenment was in effect a diabolical effort to murder God the Father and obliterate His order of being, allowing for reality to be replaced with escapist fantasy: the cosmic machine and soulless machine-man, fully caused and determined by unseen forces of nature, with Newtonian physics as its guide.

Though Kant and others had speculated on a naturalistic origin of the universe, the picture was not complete until Darwinian materialism replaced God the Father and creation ex nihilo with a counterfeit: spontaneous generation of mindless matter from nothing.

The roots of evolution stretch back to the ancient Upanishads of India and to ancient Greece, and in its modern version evolution describes the progress (transmigration) of a divine spark or energy as it inhabits in succession the bodies of different beings over the course of millions and billions of years. In the words of Emergent Church leader Rob Bell:

"There is an energy in the world, a spark, an electricity that everything is plugged into. The Greeks called it zoe, the mystics call it 'Spirit,' and Obi-Wan called it 'the Force'.....This energy, spark, and electricity that pulses through all of creation sustains it, fuels it, and keeps it growing. Growing, evolving, reproducing..." (Love Wins, pp. 144-145)

For initiates and adepts however, evolution magically transforms man into god:

"the evolution of man into superman — was always the purpose of the ancient Mysteries, and the real purpose of modern Masonry is not the social and charitable purposes to which so much attention is paid, but the expediting of the spiritual evolution of those who aspire to perfect their own nature and transform it into a more god-like quality. And this is a definite science, a royal art, which it is possible for each of us to put into practice..." (The Meaning of Masonry, W.L. Wilmhurst, p. 47)

Charles Darwin received the idea of evolution from his grandfather Dr. Erasmus Darwin who was a neo-pagan monist known to attend séances. As master of the famous Masonic Canongate lodge in Edinburgh he had close ties with both the Jacobin Masons, the organizers of the bloody revolution in France, and with the infamous Illuminati, whose diabolical cause was overthrow of the Church and destruction of Christendom. Thus Erasmus Darwin was an important name in European Masonic anti-religious organizations engaged in revolutionary activism. Erasmus Darwin mentored his grandson Charles:

"Dr. Erasmus Darwin (1731-1802) was the first man in England to suggest those ideas which were later to be embodied in the Darwinian theory by his grandson, Charles Darwin (1809-1882) who wrote in 1859 Origin of Species." (Scarlet and the Beast, Vol. II, John Daniel, p. 34)

Pope Leo XIII issued a famous bull in 1884 entitled Humanum Genus in which he discussed the evil undertakings of the Free Masons and the Illuminati:

"...the partisans of evil seems to be combining together, and to be struggling with united vehemence, led on or assisted by that strongly organized and widespread association called the Freemasons. No longer making any secret of their purposes, they are now boldly rising up against God Himself." They intend nothing less than "the utter overthrow of that whole religious and political order of the world which the Christian teaching has produced, and the substitution of a new state of things in accordance with their ideas (that) shall be drawn from mere naturalism." (Humanum Genus, Encyclical on Freemasonry)

Neo-Pagan God-men Remake Mankind as Apes

"Instead of Adam, our ancestry is traced to the most grotesque of creatures; thought is phosphorous; the soul complex nerves, and our moral sense a secretion of sugar." (Disraeli, quoted by John Passmore "A Hundred Years of Philosophy," p. 36)

With the triumph of natural science and Darwinism in the nineteenth century, the murder of God and the obliteration of His order was cast in the cement of "enlightened" pseudo-science. Westerners would be cut off from God the Father and their own souls, thereby disrupting:

"the bio-psycho-spiritual unity of human consciousness...." (Authenticating the Activities of Jesus, Bruce Chilton and Craig A. Evans, 1999)

The modern secular "scientistic" West has almost succeeded in obliterating the souls of its' citizens and now seeks obliteration of the two sexes:

"Little Johnny went to school; There to learn a brand new rule; No longer could the boys be boys Or have their special trucks and toys; Only six, so young and tender, It's time for him to unlearn gender." (Here At School the Slant is Gay, cited in Our Gay Pride President, David A. Noebel, http://www.worldviewweekend.com/worldview-times/article.php?articleid=7292 )

Primordial Heresy as Natural Religion of Science

The Christian Truth which had been undermined and displaced by primordial heresy developed as ideology and natural religion was no mere philosophical truth but the Truth of Life and salvation. Once there began to:

"gain ground, among the multitudes who have been nourished by that Truth, the conviction that it is no longer credible, the result will be...a spiritual catastrophe of enormous dimensions." (Nihilism: The Root of the Revolution of the Modern Age, Eugene Rose, pp. 44-45)

The climate of naturalist scientism established by eighteenth-century rationalists was extended by nineteenth-century positivists and evangelists of the idea of collective progress (monism), giving birth to the first natural religion of science: scientific socialism and/or Marxist Communism.

Fyodor Dostoevsky had a bitter foretaste of the demonically malignant effects of scientific socialism, "a spiritual catastrophe of enormous dimensions." This evil religion, said Dostoevsky:

"....is that terrible scourge of mankind, a scourge worse than plague, famine and war, an evil that didn't exist until this century... one that has its own priests and slaves; a tyrant that is worshipped with unprecedented awe and adulation before which science itself fawns and cringes." (The Restitution of Man: C.S. Lewis and the Case Against Scientism, Michael D. Aeschliman, p. 37)

Toward the close of the nineteenth century thinkers like Nietzsche foresaw the spiritual catastrophe that would eventuate in the genocidal "nightmare of destruction in which America and other nations participated" from WWI through WWII.

Rev. 18:3 The West....drunk on the Primordial Heresy of Babylon

Today the Christian West is dead, leaving it with no moral defense against either jihadist fanatics and the imposition of Sharia on one hand or the approach of the satanic New Age on the other.

The contemporary West is drunk on the primordial heresy of Babylon. As progressive Christian Liberalism, it is the carrier of the devilish occult spiritual virus into the embattled Body of the Church where it acts to divide Christians against themselves. Peter Jones, author of "Spirit Wars: Pagan Revival in Christian America" connects progressive Christian Liberalism to ancient devilish Gnosticism, saying they are kindred-spirits.

As the natural religion of America's bipartisan (left-right) Ruling Class, it leads them to pray:

"to themselves as saviors of the planet and as shapers of mankind in their own image." (The Ruling Class, Angelo M. Codevilla, p. xix)

The Primordial Heresy is at the root of the 'scientific' religion of New Age Transnational Progressives, the Masters of the Universe, who with their Transcended Spirit Masters, aspire to complete control of the world and every man, woman, and child. Lee Penn notes that evolution is absolutely central to New Age theology, a syncretistic, monistic stew of Liberal Christianity, Theosophy, Spiritism, the Ancient Mysteries, Buddhism, Wicca, Goddess worship, and adulation of Lucifer. In the newest version of that "terrible scourge of mankind, a scourge worse than plague, famine and war," New Age god-men envision a spiritualized version of Marxist Communism that includes:

1. Praise for Lucifer

2. Progressive adepts as gods

3. Advocacy for global depopulation

4.Utter contempt for authentic Roman Catholics, Protestant Christians, and faithful Jews

5. Forecasting a pending (and for them, desirable) "selection" of mankind, in which the progressives enter the New Age and the reactionaries face extinction. For the New Age Apostles of "progressive" Social Darwinism, these casualties are a necessary price to pay for human evolution." (False Dawn: The United Religions Initiative, Globalism, and the Quest for a One-World Religion, Lee Penn, pp. 5,7, 23-26)

The West's suicide looms in tandem with a rising spiritual catastrophe as the demonic in modern ideological movements penetrates ever deeper into the souls of Westerners, materializing and disordering them. On a daily basis, evolutionist ideologues and other secular naturalists in control of media, institutions of learning, Hollywood, law, and politics reinforce the demonic closing of souls to God the Father. Thus every day witnesses the spread of barbarism as more and more Westerners become "independent and a law" unto themselves.

"One Ring to rule them all...One Ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them." J.R.R. Tolkien

Though all of the ideologies have gone into the casting of the One Ring, none are so mesmerizing nor powerfully attractive as evolution, the Primordial Heresy as the royal science of becoming God.

copyright 2011 Linda Kimball

Additional Source:

The Ascendancy of the Scientific Dictatorship: Illuminating the Occult Origin of Darwinism, Phillip D. Collins, Feb. 24, 2005

Related Essays

Occult Pagan Revival Signals Death of the West and America

Progressive Satanic Revolt: From Nothingness to Worship of Satan

Darwinism: Devilish Gnostic Myth Disguised as Science

The Original Lie: Basis for America's Ruling Class

Rise of the Modern Moloch State

Linda writes on culture and worldview


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KEYWORDS: communism; darwinism; ideology; lindakimball; scientism
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1 posted on 07/19/2011 5:07:09 AM PDT by spirited irish
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To: little jeremiah; wagglebee

ping


2 posted on 07/19/2011 5:19:34 AM PDT by spirited irish
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To: YHAOS; hosepipe; Alamo-Girl; betty boop; metmom; Matchett-PI

ping


3 posted on 07/19/2011 5:22:16 AM PDT by spirited irish
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To: spirited irish
The writer is curiously selective about his descriptions of certain religions in order to maintain his thesis.

The essence of one of the hundreds of varieties of religions collectively called Hinduism is not man putting himself in the place of God but coming to understand that all things that can be named, including God, are illustrative of the illusion of separateness. The main point isn't that, at the most fundamental, man is really God. It is that what we call "man" and "God" and "the world" and "iron sulfate" are all illusion and have no independent existence at all. Freedom consists in realizing this and becoming liberated from the cycle of (illusory) rebirth.

Classical Buddhism posits only a tendency to exist, not a specific personal being, that is propagated through time because of continued desire. The answer is not becoming God, but extinction without remainder through the elimination of desire.
4 posted on 07/19/2011 5:34:52 AM PDT by aruanan
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To: aruanan

The author distinguished between the exoteric version and the esoteric version for the initiate. If you are of the exoteric school it makes sense that you are unaware of the initiate’s esoteric “advaitic monism.”


5 posted on 07/19/2011 5:43:07 AM PDT by spirited irish
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To: spirited irish
in those times men had no ruling authority or mutual accord, but every man was independent and a law unto himself after the dictates of his own will

I didn't realize the Libertarian Party was that old.

6 posted on 07/19/2011 5:46:55 AM PDT by tbpiper (Sarah Palin is the antivenin for the Obama poison)
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To: tbpiper

Re the Libertarian Party, it is as old as “pride,” :)


7 posted on 07/19/2011 5:53:15 AM PDT by spirited irish
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To: tbpiper

Amazing how there really is nothing new, isn’t it?


8 posted on 07/19/2011 5:57:06 AM PDT by spirited irish
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To: spirited irish

I wonder where (if anywhere) he would fit a religion that believes we are all ‘gods in embryo’ and will become gods ourselves one day?


9 posted on 07/19/2011 11:45:49 AM PDT by reaganaut ( "I once was lost, but now am found; was blind but now I see")
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To: spirited irish

Jesus invented “evolution”... when he said “you MUST be born again”..

A metamorphosis from one state into another.. i.e. butterfly..
Evolving from human into something else.. i.e. spiritual creature..

Whether a metaphorical illusion/allusion or a literal transformation..
Whats the difference.. a change can occur..

A change happening fleshly or spiritually is still a change..
What, really, do you know for sure, and how sure are you that you know it?..

“Faith” is not lost in either option..
The fleshly oriented see “it” one way, the spiritually inclined see “it” another way..

Could be the “reference”(born again) could be both metaphorical and literal.. like a coin has two sides..

Whatever is “IS”..... and whatever ain’t...... AIN’T..


10 posted on 07/19/2011 12:05:53 PM PDT by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited to include some fully orbed hyperbole...)
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To: Alamo-Girl; betty boop

magical spirit ping..


11 posted on 07/19/2011 12:10:00 PM PDT by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited to include some fully orbed hyperbole...)
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To: spirited irish
It seems the author is fixated on the fact that natural science has a million and one useful applications while their supernatural explanations for physical phenomena have never been of any use to anyone.

These poor deluded fools cannot even be consistent in if acceptance of evolution is “humanism” and worship of humans as neo Gods - or a degradation of humanity as “just an animal”.

12 posted on 07/19/2011 12:20:47 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: allmendream

Your premise slightly restated:

It seems Kant was fixated on the fact that natural science has a million and one useful applications while their supernatural explanations for physical phenomena have never been of any use to anyone.

Poor deluded fool. His “fixation” cost him his soul...and reason.


13 posted on 07/19/2011 12:48:09 PM PDT by spirited irish
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To: spirited irish
So only by supposing that supernatural forces are accountable for physical phenomena can our souls be saved and our minds be subject to reason- despite such a premise being of no practical use to anyone ever?

That may be dogma among the fanatics, but it isn't usually Christian dogma among the vast majority of denominations that see no conflict at all between evidence and reason and Scripture.

14 posted on 07/19/2011 12:52:45 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: hosepipe

Jesus invented “evolution”... when he said “you MUST be born again”..

A metamorphosis from one state into another.. i.e. butterfly..
Evolving from human into something else.. i.e. spiritual creature..

Spirited: To be born again does not mean that man evolves into “something else.” Man is man and will never become other than man. In terms of evolution and/or metamorphosis, Jesus Christ was speaking of a this-worldly moral and/or ethical transformation in preparation for eternity.


15 posted on 07/19/2011 1:00:38 PM PDT by spirited irish
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To: spirited irish
[ Man is man and will never become other than man.]

So you mean... man is flesh and will remain flesh for eternity?..
Heaven, whatever that is, is a paradise of flesh?..
and Hell is a prison of flesh?..

Jesus is flesh.?, you and I are flesh.?.. and thats just the way it “IS”?..

Interesting... my thought is you might need a BIGGER God..
My God is not fleshly.. if yours is..... then it is..

I'm not trying to steal away a fleshly God from fleshly people..

It appears to me that Jesus was attempting to "WEAN" people away from a fleshly identity to a spiritual identity..

And did.. sometimes, with a few, somewhat...

16 posted on 07/19/2011 2:36:30 PM PDT by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited to include some fully orbed hyperbole...)
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To: hosepipe

John 4:23 “But the hour is coming, and is now here, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father seeks such as these to worship him. 4:24 God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.”


17 posted on 07/19/2011 2:48:50 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: allmendream

Exactly..


18 posted on 07/19/2011 3:00:21 PM PDT by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited to include some fully orbed hyperbole...)
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To: allmendream

“So only by supposing that supernatural forces are accountable for physical phenomena can our souls be saved and our minds be subject to reason”

Spirited: Physical phenomena cannot account for the “immaterial” mind anymore than they can account for consciousness. If they could then rocks ought to be thinking, dreaming “physical phenomena.”

But then as materialist monism fades, neo-platonist monism rushes into the void and lo, it teaches that rocks do in fact “think” because everything that exists is “god.”

Not long before he died, Antony Flew rejected naturalism, saying that “physical phenomena” cannot and will never account for the soul, mind, and consciousness.

Flew had come to see the danger of dogmatic atheism to be the way it automatically closes itself off from certain questions, such as “why does the world exist?” A no-nonsense acceptance of “brute” (i.e., physical phenomena) facts is no explanation and should not be accorded special authority, noted Flew.

Flew came to see that the realm of science is not science itself but philosophy, thereby refuting Kant’s contradictory dichotomy. Thus philosophical issues carry more weight than the merely scientific.

The fact that nature obeys laws, that intelligently organized and purpose-driven beings came to be, the very existence of something rather than nothing...these philosophical issues in tandem with a renewed study of the classical philosophical arguments and a deep respect for the Apostle Paul in conjunction with certain scientific findings (i.e. fine-tuned universe) culminated in Flew’s acceptance of God.

Flew thought of God as self-existent, immutable, immaterial, omnipotent, and omniscient but not personal even though the resurrection was clearly on his mind.

Flew ended his last book with these words: “Some claim to have made contact with this Mind. I have not-—yet. But who knows what could happen next? Someday I might hear a Voice that says, ‘Can you hear me now?”

The resistance of naturalists to supernatural explanations is not “scientific” but psychological. For the claim that Jesus was alive, after having been dead, involves a miracle that entails the falsity of naturalism.

Whether you like it or not, the spiritual realm is intruding into the natural on a daily basis. Near death experiences and the Transcended spirit-guides of many globally-powerful progressives are just two examples of many.

Flew obviously sought God. And since He said that all who seek will find, I believe that at the very end, Flew did indeed find Him.


19 posted on 07/19/2011 3:18:27 PM PDT by spirited irish
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To: hosepipe

So you mean... man is flesh and will remain flesh for eternity?..
Heaven, whatever that is, is a paradise of flesh?..
and Hell is a prison of flesh?..

Spirited: God the Father likes matter for He created it, which of course includes the bodies in which our souls are embedded. After He rose from the dead, Jesus “modeled” for us the resurrection body all of us will have one day after all things have been made new, which includes this earth. It will be made new.

Gnosticism rather than Christian theism is dominant today. Your disparaging remarks regarding “flesh” are very Gnostic.
Gnostics hated Yahweh to the extent of consigning Him to hell. In His place they exalted the Devil.


20 posted on 07/19/2011 3:33:39 PM PDT by spirited irish
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To: spirited irish
Spirit guides? Really?

LOL!

Your battlelines are drawn clearly in your own mind, but they are a delusion.

You are not battling atheism by making futile arguments against science.

Science is not atheism. Science is based upon presupposing natural causes for natural phenomena and has shown its worth. It is not “psychological” for scientists to reject supernatural causation any more than it is “psychological” for a chess player to insist that bishops move only on the diagonal.

Science without methodological naturalism is nothing but the half baked loony tunes “spirit guide” soft headed mushy nonsense you seem to prefer.

Science need not address the “immaterial” mind, the spirit, the soul, spirit guides or any such immaterial fancies. Science addresses the “material” mind - the one that needs blood, consumes a large amount of our nutritional resources, and must be of a large size in order to be physically capable of human level cognition.

21 posted on 07/19/2011 3:50:18 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: spirited irish

[ Gnosticism rather than Christian theism is dominant today. Your disparaging remarks regarding “flesh” are very Gnostic. ]

My disparaging remarks regarding flesh is very biblical..
Some, maybe most, chistians are very fleshly..

All sheep pens are fleshly.. John ch 10...
Thats why Jesus calls them “out” of them..

Some sheep pens are not sheep pens at all...
BUT Pig, Vampire, Vulture, Lion, and Goat pens..
masquerading as sheep pens..

The Gnostic’s may not been wrong about literally everything..
The Gnostics were just some kind of pen themselves..
You know just a denomination.. a sect...

Could be sheep pens are just spiritual “holding tanks”.. i.e. drunk tanks..
Many are drunk on the wine of a fleshly world..
They need to sober up...


22 posted on 07/19/2011 3:51:08 PM PDT by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited to include some fully orbed hyperbole...)
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To: hosepipe

My disparaging remarks regarding flesh is very biblical..
Some, maybe most, chistians are very fleshly..Could be sheep pens are just spiritual “holding tanks”.. i.e. drunk tanks..
Many are drunk on the wine of a fleshly world..
They need to sober up...

Spirited: We are in agreement.


23 posted on 07/19/2011 3:56:37 PM PDT by spirited irish
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To: allmendream

Science addresses the “material” mind - the one that needs blood, consumes a large amount of our nutritional resources, and must be of a large size in order to be
physically capable of human level cognition

Spirited: The brain is material. The mind is immaterial. The brain and its’ processes can be observed. Dreams, memory, thought, will, etc., cannot be seen, measured, or “sensed” in any way. But then like Kant you really do know this. Like him, you pretend to be “caused and determined” by “physical phenomena.”

Your resistance has nothing to do with “science.” Your pretense is psychological.


24 posted on 07/19/2011 4:04:51 PM PDT by spirited irish
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To: spirited irish
Someday they may well be able to do all to “see” and “measure” and “sense” dreams, memory, thought, will, etc.

They can poke around in the memory center of someones brain and trigger memories.

Someone without a particular section of the brain loses syntax.

Etc.

A God of the gaps argument with the physical processes of cognition.

My resistance to what exactly? Resistance to adopting holistic “spirit guides” and quackery into science? Resistance to accepting a God that perforce must work in the ‘gaps’ of reality of what we do not yet understand fully? Resistance to rejecting a God who the Heavens proclaim the glory of?

Consider such foolishness resisted.

25 posted on 07/19/2011 4:26:43 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: allmendream

Empirical and/or natural science is but one way of knowing. There are many others, philosophy being one. Yet you zealously cling to the one way in exclusion to all others, even going so far as to hope that one day empiricists will finally be able to “see” the unseen.

This one way of knowing which people like you have enthroned is like a pass to an inner-circle of the supposedly best and brightest. Therefore to speak of this one way of knowing with anything less than total reverence and awe is to be accused of blasphemy.

Antony Flew came to see this, and when he dared to elevate philosophy above empiricism the “inner circle” immediately turned upon him and like ravening dogs conceptually “gnawed” him to death.

For all whose conception of self rests upon empiricism, this one way of knowing is in every meaning of the word a religion....a natural religion of science whose deities are “empiricism” and/or dogmatic materialism (matter) and Pride.


26 posted on 07/20/2011 2:39:57 AM PDT by spirited irish
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To: spirited irish
The author distinguished between the exoteric version and the esoteric version for the initiate. If you are of the exoteric school it makes sense that you are unaware of the initiate’s esoteric “advaitic monism.”

Oh, geez! Ha ha ha. Nice try, but about on the same level of argumentation as that of the author. The author did a whole lot of making pronouncements but little if any distinguishing between anything in any way that could be remotely called analytical. The "article" is a pastiche of quotes loosely assembled around a theme. Many statements are true in themselves but the author makes the grave error of assuming that their assembly makes for something larger that is true or even more true than the sum of its parts. This is, at least, the parts to the whole fallacy. Or that their juxtaposition to her characterization of them somehow validates what she claims they say. There is little development of any thought. The form is statement followed by a quote with similar language to the statement as support for the statement, again and again and again.

To support her thesis, she even quotes, without remark, Darwinists' false claims about Darwinism's importance to the practice of science, but any port in a time of polemical storm.
Fundamentally, Darwinism is materialist monism and as the pillar of natural science is the devilish idea by which naturalist god-men have "decapitated God" and seized control of the order of being.
Darwinism has never been the "pillar of natural science." Darwinism is the Johnny-come-lately of natural science. Its proponents are a very small tail-if that-desperately trying to claim that it has caused each and every movement of the dog. Darwinism is not "materialist monism." It may be that its proponents wish it could explain everything and claim it explains everything, but that's not the same as monism. It may be materialist, but assertions to the contrary, it is not monism, applying only to matters of biology and, except in a fanciful sense, to nothing else at all.
27 posted on 07/20/2011 4:45:35 AM PDT by aruanan
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To: aruanan

Your angry reaction is understandable, for the author dared touch upon your salvation system, which for you is sacred.

That you deny that Darwinism is monism merely displays your lack of knowledge. Monism is reductionism, which means that it reduces all else to one thing, in the case of Darwin to mindless matter. In the case of Kant to his own mind.

Buddhism is monism. It reduces the material realm to form and self to nothingness.

Buddha did not want God to exist, for which reason he built his monist system with heavy reliance upon the Upanishads. As Ravi Zacharias notes, Buddha’s system proposes a nowhere land for non-beings.

God the Father endowed all men with free will. Thus we are free to choose Him and the salvation He offers or we can reject His offer and choose instead the offer proposed by Buddhism, Marxism, Scientology, Theosophy or any number of man-made systems.


28 posted on 07/20/2011 5:06:08 AM PDT by spirited irish
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To: spirited irish
For those whose conception of reality rests upon mysticism and “spirit guides” this one way of NOT knowing anything is in every meaning of the word a religion... a religion of superstitious nonsense where the deities are mystical revelations only known to the Gnostic few and their “spirit guides” and the pride they feel in ‘knowing’ what is absolutely useless.
29 posted on 07/20/2011 6:40:08 AM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: allmendream

In case you did not understand the connection between Darwinism, the Upanishads, the ancient Greeks, and Erasmus Darwin, here it is: spiritism.

Spiritism, that is contact with and revelations from spirits, was widespread before and after the time of Erasmus Darwin and his grandson Charles. In fact, since the age of Nimrod, men have been receiving revelations from the spirit dimension.

You have a mind, allmendream. Mind is spirit, and it is open to influence from the unseen realm. In fact, the Early Church Fathers were extremely knowledgable in all things spiritual for the times in which they lived were earmarked by spiritism.

Dreams, especially nightmares, are caused by spirits, noted the Church Fathers. In this light, how very Kantian, and peculiar, that you call yourself allmenDREAM.


30 posted on 07/20/2011 8:28:40 AM PDT by spirited irish
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To: spirited irish
Science is not from revelations from spirits. Evolution through natural selection of genetic variation, the theory formulated by Darwin, was not formed through contact with spirits or revelations from “the spirit dimension”.

Mind is matter. Spirit is spirit. I AM a soul. I have a mind and a body. Age diminishes the mind - Age doesn't diminish the soul. Physical damage diminishes the mind - it doesn't diminish the soul.

Spirtisim and Spirit guides may be your religious fixation, but it is not now and never will be science, or replace science as a way of gaining useful knowledge about the physical world.

It is, and will remain, the domain of cranks, loons and con-men who, for a nominal charge, will put you in touch with your “spirit guides”.

A ridiculous God of the gaps argument is all you have.

It is amusing that you think such loony tunes nuttery is equivalent to science or will ever replace it, or that science itself is dependent upon “revelations from the spirit dimension”.

31 posted on 07/20/2011 8:39:22 AM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: allmendream

You are peculiarly insistent on abolishing yourself.

Materialism is an ancient superstition, thus the scientism based on it abolishes man in the same way as it abolishes reason. Your very stance nullifies your own reason, but your pride blinds you to this reality.

In the words of Michael D. Aeschlimann:

“By implicitly undercutting the validity of rational thought, the modern naturalists render meaningless and self-contradictory all that they have to say..”

In other words, by “materializing” your mind you undercut and render meaningless all that you say.


32 posted on 07/20/2011 8:51:21 AM PDT by spirited irish
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To: spirited irish
By reliance upon “revelations from the spirit dimension” and reliance upon “spirit guides” you undercut and render meaningless all that you say.

Methodological naturalism is the method of science.

Presupposing physical causes for physical phenomena has led to scientific and technological advancement and knowledge.

Presupposing supernatural causes for physical phenomena is an ancient superstition, the most ancient (Thunder is caused by the battles of the Gods donchaknow). It is absolutely worthless and has led nowhere but to delusion and quackery and “spirit guides” and looking for “revelations from the spirit dimension” rather than logic reason and evidence.

Nice gig if you can find enough credulous people to lap up your claptrap - but other than charlatans and con-men - nobody has ever benefited thereby.

33 posted on 07/20/2011 9:00:25 AM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: allmendream

“Presupposing physical causes for physical phenomena has led to scientific and technological advancement and knowledge.”

Spirited: The mind is not reduceable to “physical phenomena,” for which reason Flew utterly rejected this stupid claim and Sir John Eccles labeled it a superstition.

Those who cling to the materialist superstition do so for psychological reasons. For some, it is the allure of belonging to an “inner circle.” Many are they who sell their souls for admittance to the inner circle. Some cling for religious reasons. Submerging self (soul/mind) into the monist one-thing, be it matter or form (i.e., cosmic ocean) is salvific. For others, it is all about the heady power that comes from manipulating the minds of others.

Like Kant, your publicly stated belief of being caused and determined by nature does not jive with your private spiritual interaction.


34 posted on 07/20/2011 11:07:00 AM PDT by spirited irish
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To: spirited irish
The mind is most certainly reducible to physical phenomena. Without a physical brain there is no thought memory or will. The degradation of the physical brain diminishes the capacity and capability of the mind, but it doesn't diminish the soul.

Materialism is the opposite of superstition. Superstition is that there are ‘magical’ causes for physical events, not that there are understandable and predictable physical laws behind them.

I was created by God “from dust” and “to dust” I will return. I was also created through physical cellular processes involving DNA. No magic was necessary. The physical processes involving DNA were both necessary and sufficient to create my physical body and my physical mind.

Your superstitious nonsense about “spirit guides” and “revelations from the spirit world” will never replace science, because that crap is absolutely useless - the domain of nutjobs and the undereducated. Science, meanwhile, has a million and one useful applications, and only grows more useful as we figure out more and more about how physical processes are responsible for physical phenomena.

35 posted on 07/20/2011 11:15:24 AM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: allmendream
It seems the author is fixated on the fact that natural science has a million and one useful applications while their supernatural explanations for physical phenomena have never been of any use to anyone.

Maybe I'm missing your point, but if we honestly look around, faith in God has brought quite a bit of good into the world, such as Mother Theresa (and those who served with her), Billy and Franklin Graham, The Salvation Army. So it would seem these 'supernatural explanations' do have some very positive ramifications.

36 posted on 07/20/2011 1:51:05 PM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: MEGoody
You are missing my point.

None of the good Mother Theresa did was dependent upon her ascribing supernatural causation to physical phenomena.

She didn't say that people were hungry because the devil lived in their bellies - she fed people real physical food to alleviate their real physical hunger.

Science supposes that there are physical causes to explain physical phenomena. That is a big no no to those who would rather rely upon a supernatural explanation - Magic, god (a lower case ‘god of the gaps’), “spirit guides”, etc, etc.

37 posted on 07/20/2011 1:58:04 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: allmendream

The “god” you describe is an immanentist dead-god of forces and energies. In “causing” you to come into existence it made you like itself: mindless. Where there was to be an embedded soul and its’ citadel mind, there is only the interaction of chemicals and the firing of neurons.

For you, liberty has been purchased at the price of your immortal soul. But in willfully choosing “liberty” you are now cursed by the knowledge of Yahweh’s Universal Moral Law and your own immortal soul, which you are compelled to deny. I doubt not that you are tormented by the yawning void of nothingness just below your feet.


38 posted on 07/20/2011 2:45:28 PM PDT by spirited irish
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To: spirited irish

That is exactly what you fail to comprehend with your infantile ‘god of the gaps’ theology - I do not deny the soul that God gave me - nor do I need “spirit guides” or “revelations from the spirit dimension” in order to know things about the physical world.

I doubt not that you are tormented by the fact that what you call knowledge is useless and leads nowhere, while science grows by leaps and bounds enriching us in our commerce and our knowledge of of the ultimate glory of God.

The less educated someone is, the more likely they are to be a creationist.


39 posted on 07/20/2011 2:59:11 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: allmendream

“The mind is most certainly reducible to physical phenomena”

In other words, there is no “you.” There is only the movement and interaction of chemicals and the firing of neurons empowered and moved by the unseen energies of nature to which all things are reduceable.

In other words, the material body and materialized “mind” of the machine-man called allmendream is possessed by unseen energies.

There is nothing new about any of this. Early Church Father Athanasius described the condition of the souls of the ancients as “materialized.” This means that because their souls were for the most part closed to the transcendent personal, living Triune God, they had become materialized——filled with darkness and disorder, for which reason they believed very peculiar ideas. Ideas that bear a striking resemblance to those you believe.

In fact, when you claim that your mind is material, you are unwittingly confessing that your soul is at least partially closed to God the Father Almighty.

This does not have to be a terminal condition. The remedy for saving your soul still lies within reach.


40 posted on 07/21/2011 6:27:49 AM PDT by spirited irish
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To: allmendream
None of the good Mother Theresa did was dependent upon her ascribing supernatural causation to physical phenomena.

On the contrary. Mother Theresa believed in God, and thus ascribed the very existence of matter and energy to a spiritual cause. Without her faith in God, she would very likely not have done the things she did.

She didn't say that people were hungry because the devil lived in their bellies - she fed people real physical food to alleviate their real physical hunger.

Indeed, because she believed the God who created her had told her to.

That is a big no no to those who would rather rely upon a supernatural explanation.

Perhaps I misunderstood your original point, then. My impression of what you were saying is that any belief in the supernatural (i.e. God) was silly.

Believers in Christ know that God created the laws under which the physical realm operates, i.e. when your body needs fuel, you experience hunger. But that is because God created things to work that way.

If your intent was not to mock belief in God in general, then I apologize for the misunderstanding.

41 posted on 07/21/2011 9:03:15 AM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: spirited irish

I will pray for you. You have lost your way and dwell in the darkness of ignorance of your own making.

Spirit guides guide you nowhere but to Satan.


42 posted on 07/21/2011 9:47:18 AM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: MEGoody

I believe in God.

God created me “from dust”, but not through using magical supernatural powers. DNA and cellular processes were both necessary and sufficient to create my body and my brain. That doesn’t mean that God did not create me. I was created by God “from dust” and “to dust” I will return.

Right now stars are forming through gravity and nuclear fusion. God created those stars, just as HE created all things - but he didn’t need magical supernatural forces to do so. Gravity and nuclear fusion are both necessary and sufficient to explain the creation of Stars. Yet God created those stars.

I believe and worship God, why would I mock him?

I mock the ‘god of the gaps’ who created a shoddy reality that supposedly needs constant supernatural intervention in order for things to ‘work’.

That is not God.


43 posted on 07/21/2011 9:52:14 AM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: allmendream
God created me “from dust”, but not through using magical supernatural powers.

This seems to be a contradiction. Are you saying God is of the "natural" and not "supernatural"? If God is supernatural, then of course, creation of the materials from which you are made and the processes by which you were physically formed came about through supernatural powers.

44 posted on 07/21/2011 11:44:20 AM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: MEGoody

Do you think stars forming right now off in the universe are not created by God unless he added something supernatural?

I of course have a eternal soul that is spirit, as God is spirit.

But that is not and never should be the realm of science.

But my physical body and physical brain have no need of supernatural intervention for their formation and function. They are all understandable chemical reactions on a larger and more complex scale than what we see in the humble flatworm.

Do you think that stars need magic added in order to be created by God?

Do you really?


45 posted on 07/21/2011 11:55:06 AM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: allmendream
Do you think stars forming right now off in the universe are not created by God unless he added something supernatural?

God created the materials from which the stars are forming from nothing. He also created the natural processes which allow the stars to form. So although the stars are forming through natural processes, it would not have happened without supernatural power to begin with. Is there some part of that with which you do not agree?

I'm unclear why you are taking such a "mocking" tone in calling God's supernatural power "magic." Perhaps I am misconstruing and you would care to clarify.

46 posted on 07/21/2011 12:31:12 PM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: MEGoody; allmendream
I'm unclear why you are taking such a "mocking" tone in calling God's supernatural power "magic." Perhaps I am misconstruing and you would care to clarify.

Ignore him, Goody. He's just trying to get a rise out of you.

He believes a magician enabled a virgin to get pregnant and give birth once. That violates his uniformitarianism, but of course, that was different. That was a "miracle." [/sarcasm]

47 posted on 07/21/2011 2:40:51 PM PDT by Zionist Conspirator (Ki-hagoy vehamamlakhah 'asher lo'-ya`avdukh yove'du; vehagoyim charov yecheravu.)
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To: MEGoody; allmendream

Do you think stars forming right now off in the universe are not created by God unless he added something supernatural?

I of course have a eternal soul that is spirit, as God is spirit.

But that is not and never should be the realm of science.

But my physical body and physical brain have no need of supernatural intervention for their formation and function. They are all understandable chemical reactions on a larger and more complex scale than what we see in the humble flatworm.

Do you think that stars need magic added in order to be created by God?

Spirited: “God is ceaselessly at work in the things which he has created. It is not with respect to his substance that we are in him (for) we are certainly different from him, we are not in him in any other way except that he brings it (our existence) about; and this is his work, whereby he contains all things. It is through his ordering that in him we live and move and are. Hence...if he withdrew this work of his from things, we would neither live nor move nor be.” (Bede, Commentary on the Acts of the Apostles 17.28a)

Bede has defined the stark differences between the natural theology of Liberal Christianity and its’ dead-god of immanentism and the living, personal Triune God of Christian theism.

The former is a nature religion of science. It is monistic, scientistic, evolutionary, and elevates man as divine. Monism teaches Hermetic continuity between man and the immanentist god-force.

The latter is dualistic. It teaches the existence of two realms: the natural realm and the supernatural realm. There is NO continuity between these two realms. Dualism refers to man’s created condition as well. Here we speak of mind/body dualism. The body is matter but the soul, when open to the supernatural realm, transcends the material realm.

allmendream very clearly rejects the supernatural realm which places him in the only remaining category: monism.

He has previously stated that his mind is materialized. This makes sense within materialist monism which teaches that all that exists is matter. However, dogmatic materialism and Liberal Christianity are becoming “spiritized” by Eastern monism (i.e., Theosophy, Hinduism, Buddhism), which accounts for the “new spirituality” sweeping across post-Christian America. Thus AMD speaks of a non-supernatural hence immanentist dead-god of forces incapable of endowing him with an immortal soul.


48 posted on 07/21/2011 3:55:49 PM PDT by spirited irish
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To: spirited irish; GodGunsGuts; Fichori; tpanther; Gordon Greene; Ethan Clive Osgoode; betty boop; ...

ping


49 posted on 07/21/2011 4:35:15 PM PDT by metmom (Be the kind of woman that when you wake in the morning, the devil says, "Oh crap, she's UP !!")
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To: hosepipe
Jesus invented “evolution”... when he said “you MUST be born again”..

A metamorphosis from one state into another.. i.e. butterfly.. Evolving from human into something else.. i.e. spiritual creature..

On the contrary, the second birth is not evolution. It is a rebirth, a new creation. We are dead in our sins. When the new birth occurs it is not merely reforming the old nature.

50 posted on 07/21/2011 4:42:30 PM PDT by metmom (Be the kind of woman that when you wake in the morning, the devil says, "Oh crap, she's UP !!")
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