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Drowning in Apostasy
BibleProphecyBlog.com ^ | 9/17/2011 | Dr. Thomas Ice

Posted on 09/17/2011 10:09:58 AM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta

Beloved, while I was making every effort to write to you about our common salvation, I felt the necessity to write to you appealing that you contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all delivered to the saints. For certain persons have crept in unnoticed, those who were long beforehand marked out for this condemnation, ungodly persons who turn the grace of our God into licentiousness and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ. (Jude 3–4).

I will never forget what one of my church history professors told us one day in class in the late 1970s at Dallas Seminary. He said something like the following: Those of us who will follow Christ and His Word, as opposed to the rising emphasis upon religious experience, will increasingly become a smaller group until one day we will be on the outside of the American Evangelical Church looking in. My reaction to my professor was, “No, things will never get that bad within Evangelicalism.” Well, my professor was certainly right. I believe that just such a day has arrived! Like Jude, I would have loved to write about our common salvation, but the times are pressing in on biblical believers. We must contend earnestly for the faith!

New Testament Apostasy

The English word “apostasy” is a transliteration of the Greek noun apostasia and is made up of two smaller Greek words, which are apo and istemi. Apo means “from or away from,” while istemi means, “to stand.” Thus, taken together, the compound word has the idea of “to stand away from,” “depart from,” or “departure.” The verbal form aphistemi is used in 1 Timothy 4:1 and means, “to cause someone to move from a reference point, go away, withdraw.” [1] “But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith . . .” (1 Tim. 4:1a). Apostasy, as used in this article means to depart from the faith of biblical Christianity. In other words, to no longer believe what the Bible teaches about anything.

The following is a list of the seven major passages that deal with the last days for the church: 1 Timothy 4:1-3; 2 Timothy 3:1-5; 4:3-4; James 5:1-8; 2 Peter 2:1-22; 3:3-6; Jude 1-25. Every one of these passages emphasizes over and over again that the great characteristic of the final time of the church will be that of apostasy. The New Testament pictures the condition within the professing church at the end of the age by a system of denials.

Dr. Lewis Sperry Chafer, founder and first president of Dallas Theological Seminary, in an extremely insightful statement characterized the last days for the church in the following way:

"A very extensive body of Scripture bears on the last days for the Church. Reference is to a restricted time at the very end of, and yet wholly within, the present age. Though this brief period immediately precedes the great tribulation and in some measure is a preparation for it, these two times of apostasy and confusion — though incomparable in history — are wholly separate the one from the other. Those Scriptures which set forth the last days for the Church give no consideration to political or world conditions but are confined to the Church itself. These Scriptures picture men as departing from the faith (1 Tim. 4:1-2). There will be a manifestation of characteristics which belong to unregenerate men, though it is under the profession of "a form of godliness" (cf. 2 Tim. 3:1-5). The indication is that, having denied the power of the blood of Christ (cf. 2 Tim. 3:5 with Rom. 1:16; 1 Cor. 1:23-24; 2 Tim. 4:2-4), the leaders in these forms of righteousness will be unregenerate men from whom nothing more spiritual than this could proceed." (cf. 1 Cor. 2 :14). [3]

As can be observed from the above characterizations, apostasy occurs in two basic areas: 1) doctrinal defection from the Bible, and 2) immoral or ungodly behavior. The clear course of the last days for the church consists of constant warnings to the believer, especially to pastors and leaders, to be on guard within the flock against doctrinal defection, commonly known as apostasy. Such a characteristic provides for the believer today a clear sign that we are in the last days of the church age.

Christianity or Hinduism?

Caryl Matrisciana in her new video series exposing the new emerging Christianity entitled: Wide is the Gate says at the beginning of her presentation, “There are really only two basic worldviews. The Eastern mysticism of Hinduism . . . and the biblical worldview.” [4] I have long realized this myself when I learned in the 1970s that Hinduism was the polar-opposite of true biblical Christianity. Thus, any time one moves away from the Bible and its teachings by necessity one has to move in the direction of Hinduism and mysticism. My belief has been verified and strengthened over the years as we have seen metaphysical mysticism increasingly come into the Evangelical church during the last 40 years.

I was amazed to read a similar view back in the early 1890s by a pastor who had developed the same belief, but wrote of it in the late 1800s. Samuel J. Andrews wrote a book entitled Christianity and Anti-Christianity in Their Final Conflict. [5] Andrews believes that the polar-opposite of biblical Christianity is what he calls pantheism and the church of his day was moving in that direction. Pantheism, which means that everything is god, is an excellent single term description of Hinduism.

Andrews noted that there are three stages in the history of ideas. “First, their origin in the minds of individual thinkers, . . . Secondly, their popularization and general diffusion. . . . Thirdly, when generally diffused, these ideas find their embodiment in laws and institutions.” [6] Andrews believed that the nineteenth century in which he lived was the second stage of transition to Pantheism, which means that we are clearly in the third and final stage of transition.

When I look at the final form of the apostasy, which will occur during the seven year tribulation in which the antichrist will be dominate, it appears to be a false system along the line of pantheism. There will be false signs and wonders that will be the basis upon which the False Prophet supports the Beast or the antichrist as noted in Revelation 13:13–15. This is reiterated in 2 Thessalonians 2:9 when speaking of the man of lawlessness, “the one whose coming is in accord with the activity of Satan, with all power and signs and false wonders.” This will be the mysticism and magic of Satan himself. This deceptive apex is said to occur because unbelievers in the tribulation “did not receive the love of the truth so as to be saved” (2 Thess. 2:10). One other passage of note in 2 Thessalonians 2 is verse 7 that tells us that “the mystery of lawlessness is already at work” during the current church age preparing the world for the entrance of the antichrist who is currently being restrained from making a full appearance until after the rapture.

Conclusion

Such preparation explains why we are seeing all the world’s false religions and belief systems increasingly unite against Bible believing Christians. This is where the world is headed. Either one is for Christ or he will be against him. No middle ground.

The common denominator for all anti-Christians is human experience set against God’s revelation. Since biblical Christianity is rooted and grounded in the fact that the Second Person of the Trinity became a man and entered history in order that He might die for man’s sin as a substitutionary sacrifice in order to provide salvation to those who believe, it is important for unbelievers to shift focus away from the God-Man to human experience. Biblical Christianity has to be stripped of the historical facts of Scripture like creation, the fall, the flood, the call of Abram, the exodus, the conquest, the Temple, the incarnation, the death, burial, resurrection, and ascension of Christ, as well as His second coming. In its place is the self-discovery through some religious discipline of the inner self. Nothing more than human experience.

Human experience rather than God’s revelation is the common denominator that links all false religions and philosophies into a common bond. This is why the products of humanistic thinking is being brought into our Evangelical church through items such as psychology and psychotherapy, self-development, quietness and meditation exercises, Yoga, social justice, heath foods, and all kinds of metaphysical approaches that replace a biblical doctrine of holiness and sanctification. The gospel is taking a backseat to social programs and “do-goodism” since these metaphysical approaches seek to reform mankind instead of recognizing our sin and need for the Saviour. These kinds of trends being spearheaded by the emerging church within Evangelicalism are not making the gospel more relevant to the culture instead it is leading the way to hell by making the church no different than the world. It is also setting the stage for accepting the antichrist. Maranatha!

Endnotes

[1] W. F. Arndt, F. W. Danker, F. W. Gingrich, & Walter Bauer, A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and other Early Christian Literature, 3rd ed. (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 2000), p. 158.
[2] Taken from J. Dwight Pentecost, Things To Come: A Study in Biblical Eschatology (Grand Rapids: Zondervan Publishing House, 1958), p. 155.
[3] Lewis Sperry Chafer, Systematic Theology, 8 Vols. (Dallas: Dallas Seminary Press, 1948), vol. IV, p. 375.
[4] Caryl Matrisciana, Wide is the Gate: The Emerging New Christianity, Vol. 1 (Menifee, CA: Caryl Productions, 2011), @ the 4 minute mark of the DVD.
[5] Samuel J. Andrews, Christianity and Anti-Christianity in Their Final Conflict (Chicago: The Bible Institute Colportage Association, 1898).
[6] Andrews, Christianity and Anti-Christianity, p. 201.


TOPICS: Current Events; Evangelical Christian; General Discusssion
KEYWORDS: apostasy; chrisitan; christianchurch
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1 posted on 09/17/2011 10:10:02 AM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
One other passage of note in 2 Thessalonians 2 is verse 7 that tells us that “the mystery of lawlessness is already at work” during the current church age preparing the world for the entrance of the antichrist who is currently being restrained from making a full appearance until after the rapture.

Oh, Lord, another one of these? There isn't going to be any rapture. There is the Judgement for all men.

2 posted on 09/17/2011 10:20:35 AM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

the end times will feature those that deny Jesus is a King now, He is currently reigning from spiritual Jerusalem and His kingdom is spiritual. do these unbelievers sound familiar?


3 posted on 09/17/2011 10:26:23 AM PDT by one Lord one faith one baptism
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To: MarkBsnr
There isn't going to be any rapture. There is the Judgement for all men.

The judgment of God is the final act ...indeed there is a judgement of ALL men ...that includes Mary ... who is already in heaven ...so a rapture does not eliminate that .

4 posted on 09/17/2011 10:37:30 AM PDT by RnMomof7
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

We are also drowning in pointless speculation.

Be a Christian, and leave the rest up to God. It’s ALL you can do.


5 posted on 09/17/2011 10:40:28 AM PDT by Larry Lucido (I can only be series in a parallel universe.)
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To: Larry Lucido
Pointless speculation?

Is the Biblical doctrine of the Rapture from God or is it pointless speculation?

Looks like this is a timely article indeed.

6 posted on 09/17/2011 10:44:57 AM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
“But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith . . .” (1 Tim. 4:1a) '

Those who have " fallen from the faith " are either those who were never really saved in the first place but stayed in church to cause trouble, or those who were convinced by the judisers that going back into the law to be saved by self deeds of self righteousness was the way to go.

To fall from the faith simply means, to go back to the law.
They were Christians who thought that just by keeping the law, or a mixture of the law and grace would saved them.
It's either all Grace unmerited ( but merited by Jesus Christ alone ) or it's the law ( for the letter kills, but the spirit gives life ).
The only apostates are those who are trying to earn their salvation according to the law, and not by grace, read the book of Galatians to see what Paul was talking about.
The lascivious ones were the one's who were the one's who were not saved at all, those who lived according to the law, but, thought they were saved, religious, but, no form of Godliness in them, and they deny the power of GOD.
The power of God to save anyone is the Cross ( the shed blood ) of Jesus Christ and nothing else.
7 posted on 09/17/2011 10:56:41 AM PDT by American Constitutionalist (The fool has said in his heart, " there is no GOD " ..)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

What will happen will happen, and 99.999% of our expectations will prove to have been wrong. All that matters is being saved, period.


8 posted on 09/17/2011 11:01:04 AM PDT by Larry Lucido (I can only be series in a parallel universe.)
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To: Larry Lucido

What expectations might those be that you’re referring to?


9 posted on 09/17/2011 11:03:10 AM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

The article starts off good with scriptural backing, and then devolves into opinion about Hinduism, etc. If the author can learn to stay on scripture, he’ll have some great stuff.

As far as the rapture, it’s better to argue over something you can control. What a waste of time.


10 posted on 09/17/2011 11:08:59 AM PDT by aimhigh
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To: aimhigh
The article starts off good with scriptural backing, and then devolves into opinion about Hinduism, etc.

Not really. The anti-Christian, Godless, one-world religion that will exist during the Tribulation will have some form. The pantheism of Hinduism is as likely a possibility for that Tribulation belief system as any other.

As far as the rapture, it’s better to argue over something you can control.

Waste of time? What other Biblical doctrines are a waste of time to discuss?

A person may not be able to control when the Rapture happens, but he does control whether or not he will be part of the Rapture. And denying Biblical doctrine, and therefore being a part of the end-time apostasy spoken of in Scripture, is not a great place to start in controlling whether or not one will be part of the Rapture.

11 posted on 09/17/2011 11:15:36 AM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

Kill the apostates wherever you find them.

No, wait, that’s the other book.

Never mind.


12 posted on 09/17/2011 11:16:13 AM PDT by UnbelievingScumOnTheOtherSide (REPEAL WASHINGTON! -- Islam Delenda Est! -- I Want Constantinople Back. -- Rumble thee forth.)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
The anti-Christian, Godless, one-world religion that will exist during the Tribulation will have some form

The final one world religion will be Islam.

13 posted on 09/17/2011 11:36:59 AM PDT by aimhigh
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

New Apostolic Theogoly and Universalism are going stronge in the US

the big tent everyone gets saved crowd are rapidly growing...

and are out spoken and in the media and werll kinown groups...

More and more there are “christians” who are embracing unsaved moslems and others as “brothers” and forgetting the words of caution that both the LORD Jesus Christ and Paul admonished the early church and us with...

To deny the Trinity is to deny God...

To deny the shedding of Bood on the cross is to deny the death of the LORDE Jesus as our substitution...

To deny our sinful natures is to deny a need for a Saviort...

To declare that the Jews do not need to be saved is to deny that God loved the who;le world and sent His only begotten Son to die for all...

To declare that the LORD Jesus Christ did not come to be the Messiah is to deny the diety of Jesus who is indeed God come in the flesh...

Christians woulod do well to act like noble Bereans and search the scriptures to see if what these charlatans and false teachers and false prophets are saying is in the Bible...

When you find their words are not in there run for your lves away from the wolves...

“Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?” Matthew 7:15

“I know that false teachers, like vicious wolves, will come in among you after I leave, not sparing the flock. Even from your own number men will arise and distort the truth in order to draw away disciples after them. So be on your guard! Remember that for three years I never stopped warning each of you night and day with tears.” Acts20:29-31


14 posted on 09/17/2011 11:40:38 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: aimhigh
The final one world religion will be Islam.

Not necessarily. Between the Psalm 83 and Ezekiel 38 and 39 wars, Islam will be absolutely devastated as a credible, viable "religion". Any shreds of Islam that can be salvaged after God destroys five sixths of the Islamic armies that come against Israel in the Ezekiel 38/39 war will be continued by the few Muslim survivors, but it will be in no position to force itself on the world.

There are definitely other possibilities for the one-world religion of the Tribulation.

15 posted on 09/17/2011 11:43:28 AM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: Larry Lucido

Be a Christian, and leave the rest up to God. It’s ALL you can do.
___________________________________________

NO Larry

God has done all He is going to do...

He came and died on the Cross to save the whole world...

Now it is up to us the believers...

We must preach the Gospel and tell everyone about the LORD Jesus Christ and His death on the Cross and resurrection and their need to believe in Him to be saved...

THe LORD Jesus Christ is coming back for His unblemished Bride, the church...

We will rise to meet Him in the air...

The dead in Christ first...and then we who are still alive 1 Thessalonians 4:16

Before the LORD Jesus Christ left He gave us the “Great Commission”

“Go into all the world and preach the Gospel...He who believes and is baptised will be saved. he who does not believe will be damned Mark 16:15, 16


16 posted on 09/17/2011 11:52:06 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
>>Those of us who will follow Christ and His Word, as opposed to the rising emphasis upon religious experience, will increasingly become a smaller group until one day we will be on the outside of the American Evangelical Church looking in.<<

That surely is true today. It’s becoming more and more difficult to find a truly Biblicaly base church today.

17 posted on 09/17/2011 12:48:49 PM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
>>Any shreds of Islam that can be salvaged after God destroys five sixths of the Islamic armies that come against Israel in the Ezekiel 38/39 war will be continued by the few Muslim survivors, but it will be in no position to force itself on the world.<<

Agreed, but so many miss that. Catholicism has a better chance then Islam.

18 posted on 09/17/2011 12:54:45 PM PDT by CynicalBear
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Comment #19 Removed by Moderator

To: ps2
Here is another good article about the importance of studying prophetic Scriptures and recognizing the signs of Christ's return and knowing the season that we're in:

The Importance of Biblical Prophecy

20 posted on 09/17/2011 1:17:33 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: RnMomof7
There isn't going to be any rapture. There is the Judgement for all men.

The judgment of God is the final act ...indeed there is a judgement of ALL men ...that includes Mary ... who is already in heaven ...so a rapture does not eliminate that .

A rapture simply does not exist except in fantasies, and certainly not in Christian ones. Unless you follow the traditions of men, which most antiCatholics proclaim, yet practice.

Hint: Who came up with this unScriptural idea?

21 posted on 09/17/2011 1:34:21 PM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: Tennessee Nana; Iscool
To deny the Trinity is to deny God...

Iscool, you might find the words of TN wise.

22 posted on 09/17/2011 1:36:40 PM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: CynicalBear
That surely is true today. It’s becoming more and more difficult to find a truly Biblicaly base church today.

To the contrary. It's pretty easy to find one taught by the Lord Jesus Christ and commissioned by the Holy Spirit at Pentecost. Unless you scour the ranks of Protestant churches, that is...

23 posted on 09/17/2011 1:38:53 PM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
Not necessarily. Between the Psalm 83 and Ezekiel 38 and 39 wars, Islam will be absolutely devastated as a credible, viable "religion".

Last Sunday I spotted J. R. Church's Hidden Prophecies in the Psalms in the church library. Being interested in the history of the current dispensational interpretation, I consulted him on Psalm 83. Church, at least in this edition, equated that conflict with both Ezekiel 38-9 and Armageddon.

(Others reading this might profit from reading Har Magedon: The End of the Millenium.)

24 posted on 09/17/2011 1:49:57 PM PDT by Lee N. Field ("Whereever Darby and Scofield are preached, a veil lies over their minds.")
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To: MarkBsnr

Catholocism would be one of the worst of choices. I certainly don’t want to go back under the law as the Catholics do. Their Old Testament Priests, and Bishops, long robes and “sitting in the best seats”. Their rituals and rules aren’t what Christ died for. The veil was rent long ago my good man. Our only High Priest is Christ and access to Him is direct.


25 posted on 09/17/2011 1:50:43 PM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: Lee N. Field
I'd have to read the book myself to verify that Church actually equated the Psalm 83 war with Ezekiel 38/39 and Armageddon.

The link you gave goes to the Amazon site where the book can be purchased and gives no details of what the book actually says.

26 posted on 09/17/2011 1:55:58 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: MarkBsnr
A rapture simply does not exist except in fantasies, and certainly not in Christian ones. Unless you follow the traditions of men, which most antiCatholics proclaim, yet practice.

Hint: Who came up with this unScriptural idea?

The rapture, as the catching up of the church to be with the returning Christ in the air, certainly is scriptural.

The Scofield/LaHaye/Lindsay/Left Behind rapture, a secret transporter beam outta here on the nick of capital T Tribulation, involves a lot of creative interpretation, squinting just right, etc. Square theological peg, round scriptural hole. If one can make that work, one can make anything work.

(As an aside, having run temporarily through serious stuff, I'm finally reading the first Left Behind novel. The prose ranges from pedestrian to dire. I read the first page and thought "It was a dark and stormy night..." )

27 posted on 09/17/2011 2:02:53 PM PDT by Lee N. Field ("Whereever Darby and Scofield are preached, a veil lies over their minds.")
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To: CynicalBear
Catholocism would be one of the worst of choices. I certainly don’t want to go back under the law as the Catholics do. Their Old Testament Priests, and Bishops, long robes and “sitting in the best seats”. Their rituals and rules aren’t what Christ died for. The veil was rent long ago my good man. Our only High Priest is Christ and access to Him is direct.

No, no, that's fine. You may either follow the institution that the Lord Jesus Christ created and the Holy Spirit commissioned at Pentecost or you may spurn it. Your choice. In spite of the rationalizations that antiCatholic spew, there really is only one choice: you either go with what Christ has given us or else you do not.

28 posted on 09/17/2011 2:03:56 PM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: RnMomof7
"The judgment of God is the final act ...indeed there is a judgement of ALL men ...that includes Mary..."

Mary was judged and pronounced Kachiratomene.

29 posted on 09/17/2011 2:06:25 PM PDT by Natural Law (For God so loved the world He did not send a book.)
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To: Lee N. Field
The rapture, as the catching up of the church to be with the returning Christ in the air, certainly is scriptural.

My contention would be that it can tortured out of Scripture, wrung out and the molecules reassembled to provide support. I would question as to why such as thing did not exist in anyone's belief until Scofield magically happened on this blessed idea.

30 posted on 09/17/2011 2:08:15 PM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: Lee N. Field
The rapture, as the catching up of the church to be with the returning Christ in the air, certainly is scriptural.

My contention would be that it can tortured out of Scripture, wrung out and the molecules reassembled to provide support. I would question as to why such as thing did not exist in anyone's belief until Scofield magically happened on this blessed idea.

31 posted on 09/17/2011 2:08:15 PM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
The link you gave goes to the Amazon site where the book can be purchased and gives no details of what the book actually says.

As of this instant, used copies can be had from Amazon alternate vendors for $.01, plus Amazon's usual $3.99 shipping.

The cover style of the edition I saw made me think it dated from the '70s or '80s.

32 posted on 09/17/2011 2:08:15 PM PDT by Lee N. Field ("Whereever Darby and Scofield are preached, a veil lies over their minds.")
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
Christ said TIME would be shortened. This 7 year trib business is part of the Apostasy. This ‘time’ is likened to a woman in travail... labor, and Labor pains do not take 7 years. Everything Christ said that would take place in Matt 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21, the seal, trumps, and vials of Revelation, will happen in quick time, days/months not years.
33 posted on 09/17/2011 2:08:59 PM PDT by Just mythoughts (Luke 17:32 Remember Lot's wife.)
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To: MarkBsnr

I believe the closest reference to the Catholic Church is found in Revelation and the admonition is to “come out of her”.


34 posted on 09/17/2011 2:11:17 PM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: Just mythoughts
Sorry, not buying.

Seven years is seven years and that's how long the Tribulation will last.

Jesus will shorten the length of the days to save lives, but the Tribulation itself will last for seven years.

35 posted on 09/17/2011 2:12:32 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: CynicalBear
I believe the closest reference to the Catholic Church is found in Revelation and the admonition is to “come out of her”.

Such is your belief. We have Scripture; what do you have? The god in the mirror?

36 posted on 09/17/2011 2:13:38 PM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
Sorry, not buying. Seven years is seven years and that's how long the Tribulation will last. Jesus will shorten the length of the days to save lives, but the Tribulation itself will last for seven years.

It is NOT for sale it is what Christ said would be. Remember the ten virgins and half had to go BUY some 'oil'. Salvation is offered to those who will in this flesh age. Christ is returning for a harvest with a double edge sword not to offer tickets for a trip out of here.

37 posted on 09/17/2011 2:16:13 PM PDT by Just mythoughts (Luke 17:32 Remember Lot's wife.)
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To: MarkBsnr
I would question as to why such as thing did not exist in anyone's belief until Scofield magically happened on this blessed idea.

Exactly. You don't find it in the text, unless you come to the text expecting to find it.

Back in 2005, Calvin Seminary in Grand Rapids had a conference on preaching apocalyptic texts. I'm not sure the audio is still there (see here, scroll down to June 2005), but it's worth looking up, Gordon Fee's and G. K. Beale's especially. (The audio links are to a Realaudio stream, not sure how that's going to work now.)

38 posted on 09/17/2011 2:19:03 PM PDT by Lee N. Field ("Whereever Darby and Scofield are preached, a veil lies over their minds.")
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To: MarkBsnr
>> We have Scripture<<

LOL And the bodily assumption is in which passage from scripture exactly?

39 posted on 09/17/2011 2:19:37 PM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: Just mythoughts
Well, God knows your heart, but you now have your denial of Scripture out there for the entire world to see.

The article is right on the money. This world is drowning in apostasy and the blatant denial of Scripture by self-confessed "Christians" is inarguable proof of the inerrancy of Scripture.

Apostasy is one of the last signs before the removal of the Church and the beginning of the Tribulation. Thank you for giving those of us who know Christ as Savior stronger hope that our Redeemer is coming for us soon.

40 posted on 09/17/2011 2:22:23 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: CynicalBear
>> We have Scripture<<

LOL And the bodily assumption is in which passage from scripture exactly?

Pardon?

41 posted on 09/17/2011 2:27:44 PM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
Well, God knows your heart, but you now have your denial of Scripture out there for the entire world to see. The article is right on the money. This world is drowning in apostasy and the blatant denial of Scripture by self-confessed "Christians" is inarguable proof of the inerrancy of Scripture. Apostasy is one of the last signs before the removal of the Church and the beginning of the Tribulation. Thank you for giving those of us who know Christ as Savior stronger hope that our Redeemer is coming for us soon.

I am quoting the very WORDS of Christ HIMSELF. Matthew 24:21 (Christ answering the question from Matthew 24:3) quotes Daniel... For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

CHRIST SPEAKING 22 AND except those days (of Daniel) be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days (of Daniel) shall be shortened.

Who is denying the Scripture? The 'church' is NOT going any place, because here on God's green earth is where Christ promised He would return and set up His Kingdom.

The Redeemer expects the Church to be kindling a fire and be ready for Ephesians 6. Do you even know who the anti-Christ is and why God is allowing him his few moons to play Jesus?

42 posted on 09/17/2011 2:32:20 PM PDT by Just mythoughts (Luke 17:32 Remember Lot's wife.)
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To: Just mythoughts
Just to nail you down further, is the following true or is it false?

Brothers, we do not want you to be ignorant about those who fall asleep, or to grieve like the rest of men, who have not hope. We believe that Jesus died and rose again and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in him. According to the Lord’s own word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left till the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep. For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever." (1 Thessalonians 4:13-17)

That is a passage of Scripture which describes Jesus Christ coming to take His Church off the earth.

Is it true or is it false?

43 posted on 09/17/2011 2:38:07 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

AMEN, GN. THere is no “revival” that is going to be here in the last days of the Church the body of Christ. There is APOSTACY. As was very clearly stated to Timothy. If people are looking for some great revival to take place, they are looking the wrong way. And will be deceived. As is happening daily.


44 posted on 09/17/2011 2:47:20 PM PDT by smvoice (The Cross was NOT God's Plan B.)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
What Paul wrote is true. But you are not reading what Paul said. The dead are already ‘risen’ so naturally they would be first. ALLLL in the flesh when Christ returns will be changed in a twinkling of an eye ICorinthians 15:51-52 the end of this flesh age.

BUT the first supernatural being tossed down here upon us is NOT our LORD and Saviour but the great pretender to deceive all but the elect that he is Jesus. ONE of his lies is he has come to ‘rapture’ out IF they believe upon him.

Check out that word Paul uses ‘air’. Soul means ‘breath of life’ as in ‘air’, a different dimension not held by gravity.

45 posted on 09/17/2011 2:49:02 PM PDT by Just mythoughts (Luke 17:32 Remember Lot's wife.)
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To: Just mythoughts

Yes, Christ did say He would return and set up His Kingdom. And He will. In JERUSALEM. Where Israel will be a Kingdom of priests and a blessing to the Gentile nations. Now either you are Jewish and expect to endure to the end, to become a priest in the Kingdom on Earth. Or you are a member of the Church the Body of Christ, who has its promises in the HEAVENLIES. Which is exactly where Christ will take us when He returns to meet us in the air at the rapture of the Body of Christ. Or you are completely lost and will neither be raptured, nor a Jewish priest in His kingdom. Which leaves you pretty much...no place to go.


46 posted on 09/17/2011 2:53:16 PM PDT by smvoice (The Cross was NOT God's Plan B.)
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To: MarkBsnr

Oops. That was supposed to be the bodily assumption of Mary.


47 posted on 09/17/2011 2:55:49 PM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: smvoice
Yes, Christ did say He would return and set up His Kingdom. And He will. In JERUSALEM. Where Israel will be a Kingdom of priests and a blessing to the Gentile nations. Now either you are Jewish and expect to endure to the end, to become a priest in the Kingdom on Earth. Or you are a member of the Church the Body of Christ, who has its promises in the HEAVENLIES. Which is exactly where Christ will take us when He returns to meet us in the air at the rapture of the Body of Christ. Or you are completely lost and will neither be raptured, nor a Jewish priest in His kingdom. Which leaves you pretty much...no place to go.

I will NOT be raptured. It is NOT a doctrine of Christ, but people who seek a short cut in fear of a tribulation. Christ does not utter one Word of a quick trip out of here. IF people knew what the tribulation is they would NOT be hoping for rapture.

48 posted on 09/17/2011 2:57:34 PM PDT by Just mythoughts (Luke 17:32 Remember Lot's wife.)
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To: smvoice

Oh, FYI, Paul did write the book of Hebrews.


49 posted on 09/17/2011 2:58:26 PM PDT by Just mythoughts (Luke 17:32 Remember Lot's wife.)
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To: Just mythoughts
Wrong. The deceiver is here already. And has been since he was cast out of heaven. He is "the prince of the power of the air". He has deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ, miracles, signs, and wonders, intended to deceive, he blind men to the truth, he has a system of doctrine, his ministers preach a gospel, another Jesus, he has a communion table, a counterfeit righteousness, and a counterfeit Spirituality.

He is alive and well, and deceiving the world at this time. And will be until the 2nd coming of Jesus Christ.

50 posted on 09/17/2011 3:03:04 PM PDT by smvoice (The Cross was NOT God's Plan B.)
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