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Tis the season for Smithmas; Whom do you worship? [Mormon Merry Smithmas]
Life After Ministry: Leading Mormons to the REAL Jesus Christ ^ | April 17, 2011 [original: December 2008] | Michelle Grim

Posted on 12/06/2011 6:06:40 AM PST by Colofornian

‘TIS THE SEASON for Smithmas

(Originally posted in December 2008)

Here we are with another Thanksgiving and Christmas season upon us! I love this time of year for the changing colors of the trees, the air smells like the season’s cold is getting ready to lay itself down upon us, and of course for the food. Yum!

Alas, I would be remiss if I were to go about my day in this glorious time without giving my favorite reason…Jesus!

While December 25th may not be the actual date of Jesus’ birth, it serves as a great reminder for us as to why we celebrate to begin with!

I was writing an article a few weeks ago when I noticed a pattern of sorts in my copy of the Gospelink Program I use for research on Mormonism. It has a section where you can store your favorite quotes and scriptures for easy access. Skimming through the file for a specific quote, I noticed how many entries I had placed in this folder for references in regards to Joseph Smith and the homage members pay to him.

I have written many times on the importance of Smith’s claims and the impact they have upon the members of the Church. I could write a book on the many letters we receive and how many times I’ve been told that they do not worship Joseph Smith, but as I’ve said before and will say again…you be the judge and read what they say! Below are a mere handful of examples of what they think of ol’ Joe.

1. Choice seer 9. Voice crying/wilderness 17. People studied at feet of
2. Joseph and God partners 10. Has more to boast of 18. Smith's greatness
3. Brings purpose to life 11. Is meek and lowly 19. Gospel according to Joe
4. Did more than anyone 12. Is needed, foreordained 20. Superior intelligence
5. Is god to all 13. Not always a prophet 21. Praise to the man
6. Helped save world 14.Not armed 22. Knowledge of God from
7. Holds keys of authority 15. Related to Jesus 23. Greater than Isaiah
8. Was a Mason 16. Smith's consent needed 24. Is both Jew and Gentile

For the sake of brevity, I will be posting only the vital parts of the actual document, but will include the exact location for the reader to do further investigation. If you cannot find the documentation in your own books or library you can read them at www.lds.org for verification. As always, I strongly encourage each member of the Church to read the actual document for proof as I have nothing to hide.

1. Joseph Smith: The Choice Seer, epilogue: “Ours is the song of praise to the man ordained from eternity past to part the veil and open the heavens, for through him the fulness of truth and the fulness of priesthood powers have come to earth again.” – Joseph Fielding McConkie.

2. Handbook of the Restoration [pamphlets], pg. 50; “…God chose this man. He spoke through him. The virgin, unsophisticated mind of the youth was a fertile field for the planting of spiritual seeds. They grew and matured into a perfect faith that brought Joseph into partnership with God. When that came to be, there was nothing unattainable, for as we are told of old, one man and God are a majority.” – Various Authors

3. Handbook of the Restoration [pamphlets], pg. 50-1; “If any man has received in his heart the witness of the divine truth embraced in the contributions of the Prophet Joseph, I charge him to be true,-true to his testimony, true to the Prophet, the founder, true to the cause… If any man has not received this witness, I appeal for his thoughtful, prayerful, sympathetic consideration. I offer to him…assurance that if he will receive and apply the teachings of Joseph Smith he will be made happy. Doubt and uncertainty will leave him…” – Various Authors

4. Discourses of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pgs. 22-3; “…He opened up communication with the heavens in his youth. He brought forth the Book of Mormon, which contains the fullness of the Gospel… In a word, he did more in from 14 to 20 years for the salvation of man than any other man save Jesus only, that ever lived. (JD 24:14-15.).” – Comment by Joseph F. Smith. Also D&C 135.

5. Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 363; “…God made Aaron to be the mouthpiece for the children of Israel, and He will make me be god to you in His stead, and the Elders to be mouth for me; and if you don’t like it, you must lump it. I have been giving Elder Adams instruction in some principles to speak to you, and if he makes a mistake, I will get up and correct him. (April 8, 1844.).”

6. The Doctrine and Covenants Speaks, 2:456; “One of Joseph Smith’s contributions to the salvation of men in this world was the bringing forth of “. . . the Book of Mormon, which he translated by the gift and power of God. . . . ” (D&C 135:3.).”

7. Doctrines of Salvation 1:192; “ONLY JOSEPH SMITH FULFILS ANCIENT PROMISES. Joseph Smith declared that he, with Oliver Cowdery, his companion, received the keys of the gathering of Israel. No one else ever claimed to have had them revealed to him. If Joseph Smith did not receive them, then someone must be empowered with this authority before the coming of the Lord…Malachi has said that the Lord would send Elijah before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord. The Prophet Joseph Smith said he (Elijah) came to him and Oliver Cowdery with the keys of that power. If he did not, and they have told a falsehood….”

8. Answers: Straightforward Answers to Tough Gospel Questions, pgs. 48-9; “Joseph Smith and many of the leading brethren of that day were Masons. The question implies that there is something secret or sinister in their Masonic affiliation. This was hardly the case. The Saints who built Nauvoo built a Masonic lodge there. It is among the buildings that have been restored in Nauvoo, and visitors are encouraged to visit it…It is not inconceivable that the Prophet, sensing something about the ancient roots of Masonry, inquired of the Lord about it. In that sense it may have been one of the influences that prepared the way for the revelations that restored the ceremonies of the temple…The idea that the kind of faith and courage common to our pioneer forebears grew out of rituals copied from a fraternal organization is ludicrous.”

9. Discourses of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 200; “In relation to the power over the minds of mankind which I hold, I would say, It is in consequence of the power of truth in the doctrines which I have been an instrument in the hands of God of presenting unto them, and not because of any compulsion on my part…Why do not my enemies strike a blow at the doctrine? They cannot do it: it is truth, and I defy all men to upset it. I am the voice of one crying in the wilderness, “Repent ye of your sins and prepare the way for the coming of the Son of Man…”

10. Discourses of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 31; “The Prophet’s Effectiveness – I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him; but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet. (HC 6:408-9.)”

11. History of the Church 5:218; “Some of the company thought I was not a very meek Prophet; so I told them: “I am meek and lowly in heart,” and will personify Jesus for a moment, to illustrate the principle, and cried out with a loud voice, “Woe unto you, ye doctors; woe unto you, ye lawyers; woe unto you, ye scribes, Pharisees, and hypocrites!” &c. But you cannot find the place where I ever went that I found fault with their food, their drink, their house, their lodgings; no, never; and this is what is meant by the meekness and lowliness of Jesus.”

12. Doctrines of Salvation 1:184; “Joseph Smith was chosen to stand at the head of the work of the Lord in the last days, and his work was assigned to him through the fore-knowledge of our Eternal Father in the eternities before he was born. He came in the spirit of Elias to prepare the way for the coming of our Lord. No prophet since the days of Adam, save, of course, our Redeemer, has been given a greater mission.”

13. Discourses of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 179; “My enemies say that I have been a true prophet. Why, I had rather be a fallen true prophet than a false prophet. When a man goes about prophesying, and commands men to obey his teachings, he must either be a true or false prophet. False prophets always arise to oppose the true prophets and they will prophesy so very near the truth that they will deceive almost the very chosen ones. (HC 6:364.)”

14. History of the Church, 6:364-5; “…He that arms himself with gun, sword, or pistol, except in the defense of truth, will sometime be sorry for it. I never carry any weapon with me bigger than my penknife. When I was dragged before the cannon and muskets in Missouri, I was unarmed. God will always protect me until my mission is fulfilled.(Joseph Smith, History of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 7 vols., introduction and notes by B. H. Roberts [Salt Lake City: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 1932-1951], 6: 364 – 365.)”

15. Great are the Words of Isaiah, pg. 71; “Isaiah 11:10; The interpretation of this passage has been given by Joseph Smith in D&C 113:1-4. The stem of Jesse is Christ. The book of Revelation also identifies Jesus as such (see Rev. 5:5; 22:16). The rod is “a servant in the hands of Christ, who is partly a descendant of Jesse as well as of Ephraim” (D&C 113:4). That the servant is Joseph Smith himself seems evident.”

16. Journal of Discourses 7:289; “…no man or woman in this dispensation will ever enter into the celestial kingdom of God without the consent of Joseph Smith. From the day that the Priesthood was taken from the earth to the winding-up scene of all things, every man and woman must have the certificate of Joseph Smith, junior, as a passport to their entrance into the mansion where God and Christ are—I with you and you with me. I cannot go there without his consent. He holds the keys of that kingdom for the last dispensation—the keys to rule in the spirit-world; and he rules there triumphantly, for he gained full power and a glorious victory over the power of Satan while he was yet in the flesh, and was a martyr to his religion and to the name of Christ…”

17. Joseph Smith: Choice Seer, preface; “In assessing the marvelous impact of the Choice Seer’s work on this dispensation, we will turn first and foremost to the doctrinal teachings of Joseph Smith as set forth in his sermons, letters, revelations, translations, and narrations. In addition, we will rely occasionally on the clarifications and expansions of those who knew Brother Joseph firsthand and studied at his feet, as well as those apostolic and prophetic successors to whom is given the divine mandate to build on the doctrinal foundation he laid.”

18. Handbook of the Restoration: A Discussion of Gospel Themes, pg. 25-35; “Joseph Smith… That he was an extraordinary man is conceded by friend and foe…a restorer of the pure and uncorrupted gospel of Jesus Christ. At no time did he declare that he brought a new message of salvation to the world; his mission was to restore and declare, to expound and enlarge the old truth… the commentaries by the apostles, which constitute the latter part of the New Testament, are fragmentary and incomplete. Joseph, the Prophet, gave to the world in this day a large and rich interpretation of the gospel of Jesus Christ…The achievements of Joseph Smith are much greater than those of ordinary men; they appear to transcend usual human powers, and cannot be explained in terms of common experience… Space does not permit us to illustrate the divine power of Joseph Smith by the many principles of truth that he taught.”

19. Joseph Smith’s Idea of the Gospel, pg. 8; “Joseph Smith’s view of the gospel is based upon the assumption that, before the fall, Adam resided in the presence of God and, consequently, was enveloped in the life-giving, quickening powers that constitute God’s glory or presence. In this condition, his whole being was filled with intelligence and life, and corruption in every form was foreign to his nature. In the words of the Prophet, “All corruption is devoured by the fire.”

20. Divine Authority or the Question, Was Joseph Smith sent of God?, pg. 4; “How came Mr.Smith, if a deceiver, to think of all this? Did Martin Luther, Wesley, Whitfield, Swedenborg, or Irving think of this? Whence his superior intellect, his depth of understanding, his extensive foresight, that he should so far surpass all former impostors for 1700 years? John testifies that when the everlasting gospel is restored to the earth it shall be by an angel. Mr.Smith testifies that it was restored by an angel, and in no other way. This is another presumptive evidence that he was sent of God.”

21. LDS Hymn #27; Praise to the man, verses. 1, 2, 4;

“Praise to the man who communed with Jehovah!

Jesus annointed [sic] that Prophet and Seer.

Blessed to open the last dispensation,

Kings shall extol him and nations revere.

Hail to the Prophet, ascended to heaven!

Traitors and tyrants now fight him in vain.

Mingling with Gods, he can plan for his brethren;

Death cannot conquer the hero again.

Great is his glory and endless his priesthood.

Ever and ever the keys he will hold.

Faithful and true, he will enter his kingdom,

Crowned in the midst of the prophets of old.”

22. Encyclopedia of Mormonism, pg. 546; “Though Latter-day Saints extensively use the scriptures to learn about God, their fundamental knowledge concerning him is based upon the Prophet Joseph Smith’s first vision, the Prophet’s subsequent revelatory experiences, and individual personal revelation.”

23. Discourses of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 7; “In thirty nations are men and women who look upon him as a greater leader than Moses and a greater prophet than Isaiah; his disciples now number close to a million [the present figure is over 3.5 million]; and already a granite shaft pierces the sky over the place where he was born, and another is in course of erection over the place where he is credited with having received the inspiration for his Book. (John Henry Evans, op. cit., introduction.)”

24. Answers: Straightforward Answers to Tough Gospel Questions, pg. 48; “… Joseph Smith was told that he was a descendant of Abraham…He was also told that he was a lawful heir, “according to the flesh,” to the priesthood…Prophecy further identified him as a direct lineal descendant of Joseph of Egypt… More particularly, he is represented as being a descendant of Ephraim and as having some of the blood of Jesse… title page to the Book of Mormon, which was written by Moroni, says that it will come forth by the hand of a Gentile. Reference here is to his citizenship in a Gentile nation… Thus Joseph Smith was a literal descendant of the house of Israel while at the same time being a citizen of a Gentile nation.”

So we’ll ask the question again. Doesn’t this sound like worship? We’ve listed more than enough examples where various leaders have claimed Smith is greater than Moses or Isaiah, he is related to Jesus, has done more than any other man on earth except Jesus, people studied at his feet and don’t forget, he saved the world! The most startling evidence is taken from their hymn book, Praise to the Man. To the average member of the Church it may not seem as if you’re worshipping Joseph and I can remember thinking and feeling the same way. I encourage the members to take another look after reading this and then ask yourself; “who am I worshipping”?

We see in Hebrews 9:24-28; 10:1-4; “For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us: Nor yet that he should offer himself often, as the high priest entereth into the holy place every year with blood of others; For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself. And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation….For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins. But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year. For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.”

It is impossible for man to please God without the blood of Jesus Christ. This doesn’t mean that we work for salvation because Jesus died for us! It means that Jesus did all the work alone! If you love Jesus like you say you do, please, take one day in the next week and think about everything He did for you! Think about the time He spent on the cross, read the gospels, see what He said, where He walked, what did He do? These are the things we set our minds upon as members of the body of Christ. We think about what Jesus did, the various titles that are given to Him and why, people’s reaction to Him, the patience that He portrayed for people and His unselfish love. As a Mormon can you name Jesus’ favorite place to pray?

Why would you as a Christian place a mere human between yourself and Jesus? This is exactly what the LDS Church has done with Joseph Smith! Many times members of the Church don’t even use Joseph Smith’s last name. Most refer to him as just “Joseph” and everyone knows who is being spoken of; yet when was the last time you heard a Mormon use the name of just “Jesus”? If a Christian were to use just the name of Joseph when speaking about “religious” topics they would think of Joseph from the Bible, not Joseph Smith!

Oh, He so wants for you to know Him! For just one day think upon only Jesus, if you’re really a Christian this shouldn’t be a problem. See if you can name 24 facts about Jesus in regards to His birth, how He fulfilled an Old Testament prophecy, what if anything did He say about His own death, what significant things took place when He died, a miracle He performed and why, etc. Use just the Bible for your investigation and find out first hand if it really does contradict itself.

If you’re a Mormon know that we’re praying for you. If you’re a Christian who has a friend or family member who is LDS, let us know how we can pray for you and him/her! We’re not here to bash the LDS people or to bring shame upon them publicly; we are here to contend for the faith as it says in Jude 3 and to share the truth about God’s Son, Christ Jesus!

With Love in Christ;

Michelle Grim

1 Cor. 1:18


TOPICS: History; Other non-Christian; Theology; Worship
KEYWORDS: inman; josephsmith; lds; mormon; mormonism; mormons; smithmas; worship
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Mormons don't worship Joseph Smith?

Think again.

Go here:

Look here to see how Mormons substitute Joseph Smith for Jesus Christ this time of year: “Praise To The Man”: A Review Of The Annual Joseph Smith Memorial Sermons [Mormon Merry Smithmas]

From the article: Ours is the song of praise to the man ordained from eternity past to part the veil and open the heavens..." - Joseph Fielding McConkie

From Joseph Smith himself, as quoted in the article: He will make me be god to you in His stead...

Read #21 in the article for the words to a worship hymn sung to Joseph Smith..."Kings shall extol him and nations revere" (I thought Jesus Christ was to be worshiped -- not Joseph Smith!)...one of the lines is "Mingling with gods" (Don't tell me Mormons aren't polytheists!)

Joseph Smith quote from the article: “The Prophet’s Effectiveness – I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him; but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet. (HC 6:408-9.)”

1 posted on 12/06/2011 6:06:40 AM PST by Colofornian
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To: Colofornian

Of course they do. Anyone reading the words of their own leaders and “sacred” writings is either a liar or in denial.


2 posted on 12/06/2011 6:32:05 AM PST by svcw (God's Grace - thank you!)
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To: Colofornian
So, as this is similar to the you did yesterday, I'm guessing we can look forward to these daily “Smithmas” posts from you... in a similar vein that you cranked out so many haunted/ghost/evil related Mormon threads leading up to Halloween.

Tis the season for love and sharing and peace on earth. How sweet of you. /sarc

3 posted on 12/06/2011 6:47:08 AM PST by Ripliancum (Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you. -Eph. 4:31)
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To: Ripliancum

“So, as this is similar to the you did yesterday, I’m guessing we can look forward to these daily “Smithmas” posts from you... in a similar vein that you cranked out so many haunted/ghost/evil related Mormon threads leading up to Halloween.”

.............

Do you believe when a false prophet comes along, he ought to be exposed?

Deut. 18:9-22


4 posted on 12/06/2011 6:54:12 AM PST by lurk
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To: Colofornian

Based on what you have posted Joseph Smith was supposed to be the reincarnation or second coming of Jesus? Since he was born, lived and died what do the Morons do now Smith is gone? Wait for his return?


5 posted on 12/06/2011 7:03:52 AM PST by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: Ripliancum

DARN!!!

I was just about to post IBTWVM!

(In Before The Whining Victim Mormons)

You’re fast...


6 posted on 12/06/2011 7:32:41 AM PST by aMorePerfectUnion (You know, 99.99999965% of the lawyers give all of them a bad name)
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To: Colofornian

“Smithmas”? A saint’s first name is normally used for his feast day, as in Michaelmas and Martinmas for St. Michael and St. Martin, respectively, so shouldn’t it be “Josephmas”? In any case, I understand your point.


7 posted on 12/06/2011 7:39:32 AM PST by Fiji Hill
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
DARN!!!

I was just about to post IBTWVM!

(In Before The Whining Victim Mormons)

You’re fast...

He has his god status and celestial wives to defend...

8 posted on 12/06/2011 7:50:33 AM PST by dragonblustar (Allah Ain't So Akbar!)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

Based on what you have posted Joseph Smith was supposed to be the reincarnation or second coming of Jesus?
___________________________________________________

No, a direct descendant....


9 posted on 12/06/2011 8:02:55 AM PST by Tennessee Nana
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To: Colofornian

As to the makeup of families, Elder Hartman Rector Jr., a convert to the Church, quipped: “My wife and I had two children at the time the elders knocked on the door, and we were expecting our third, and that was all that we were going to have. That was one for me, one for my wife, and one unplanned; then we found out why we are here. Now we have seven, and expecting another. Joseph Smith is responsible for five of my children.”

Hartman Rector Jr., “The Prophet Joseph Smith,” transcript, Logan institute, 1972, 3.
___________________________________________________

Then I hope Joseph Smith is supporting them and not the taxpayers...


10 posted on 12/06/2011 8:18:22 AM PST by Tennessee Nana
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To: Colofornian

They’re just buttering up old Joe for when they stand before him he will see how they “worshiped” him and he will let them into heaven. ;-D


11 posted on 12/06/2011 8:18:43 AM PST by Ruy Dias de Bivar
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To: Tennessee Nana

Are the Mormons expecting another Joseph Smith to pop up any time now?


12 posted on 12/06/2011 8:40:18 AM PST by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: Ripliancum

I really think your tagline is ridiculous considering your bitter posts, LOL.


13 posted on 12/06/2011 9:12:22 AM PST by greyfoxx39 (If other churches were dead dunking mormons to save them mormons would be furious.)
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To: svcw
“. . . the Book of Mormon, which he translated by the gift and power of God. . . . ” (D&C 135:3.).”

WHO said Sacred Writings??



"Now the way he translated was he put the urim and thummim into his hat and Darkned his Eyes than he would take a sentance and it would apper in Brite Roman Letters. Then he would tell the writer and he would write it. Then that would go away the next sentance would Come and so on. But if it was not Spelt rite it would not go away till it was rite, so we see it was marvelous. Thus was the hol [whole] translated."
---Joseph Knight's journal.


"In writing for your father I frequently wrote day after day, often sitting at the table close by him, he sitting with his face buried in his hat, with the stone in it, and dictating hour after hour with nothing between us."
(History of the RLDS Church, 8 vols.
(Independence, Missouri: Herald House,1951),
"Last Testimony of Sister Emma [Smith Bidamon]," 3:356.

"I, as well as all of my father's family, Smith's wife, Oliver Cowdery and Martin Harris, were present during the translation. . . . He [Joseph Smith] did not use the plates in translation."
---(David Whitmer,
as published in the "Kansas City Journal," June 5, 1881,
and reprinted in the RLDS "Journal of History", vol. 8, (1910), pp. 299-300.

In an 1885 interview, Zenas H. Gurley, then the editor of the RLDS Saints Herald, asked Whitmer if Joseph had used his "Peep stone" to do the translation. Whitmer replied:

"... he used a stone called a "Seers stone," the "Interpreters" having been taken away from him because of transgression. The "Interpreters" were taken from Joseph after he allowed Martin Harris to carry away the 116 pages of Ms [manuscript] of the Book of Mormon as a punishment, but he was allowed to go on and translate by use of a "Seers stone" which he had, and which he placed in a hat into which he buried his face, stating to me and others that the original character appeared upon parchment and under it the translation in English."


"Martin Harris related an incident that occurred during the time that he wrote that portion of the translation of the Book of Mormon which he was favored to write direct from the mouth of the Prophet Joseph Smith. He said that the Prophet possessed a seer stone, by which he was enabled to translate as well as from the Urim and Thummim, and for convenience he then used the seer stone, Martin explained the translation as follows: By aid of the seer stone, sentences would appear and were read by the Prophet and written by Martin and when finished he would say 'Written,' and if correctly written that sentence would disappear and another appear in its place, but if not written correctly it remained until corrected, so that the translation was just as it was engraven on the plates, precisely in the language then used."
(Edward Stevenson, "One of the Three Witnesses,"
reprinted from Deseret News, 30 Nov. 1881
in Millennial Star, 44 (6 Feb. 1882): 86-87.)

In 1879, Michael Morse, Emma Smith's brother-in-law, stated:
 
 "When Joseph was translating the Book of Mormon [I] had occasion more than once to go into his immediate presence, and saw him engaged at his work of translation. The mode of procedure consisted in Joseph's placing the Seer Stone in the crown of a hat, then putting his face into the hat, so as to entirely cover his face, resting his elbows upon his knees, and then dictating word after word, while the scribes Emma, John Whitmer, O. Cowdery, or some other wrote it down."
(W.W. Blair interview with Michael Morse,
Saints Herald, vol. 26, no. 12
June 15, 1879,  pp. 190-91.)


Joseph Smith's brother William also testified to the "face in the hat" version:
 
"The manner in which this was done was by looking into the Urim and Thummim, which was placed in a hat to exclude the light, (the plates lying near by covered up), and reading off the translation, which appeared in the stone by the power of God"
("A New Witness for Christ in America,"
Francis W. Kirkham, 2:417.)


"The manner in which he pretended to read and interpret was the same manner as when he looked for the money-diggers, with the stone in his hat, while the book of plates were at the same time hid in the woods."
---Isaac Hale (Emma Smith's father's) affidavit, 1834.




14 posted on 12/06/2011 9:57:19 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

I dont think so

Just like the Moslems and Mohammad...

for the Mormons Joey Smirth was and is THE “prophet>>>

Whenever you read “the prophet” in Mormon literature and doctrines thats Joseph Smith...


15 posted on 12/06/2011 9:59:48 AM PST by Tennessee Nana
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To: Jack Hydrazine

I dont think so

Just like the Moslems and Mohammad...

for the Mormons Joey Smith was and is THE “prophet”

Whenever you read “the prophet” in Mormon literature and doctrines thats Joseph Smith...


16 posted on 12/06/2011 10:00:28 AM PST by Tennessee Nana
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To: svcw
D&C 135:3
 
 Joseph Smith, the aProphet and bSeer of the Lord, has done more, csave Jesus only, for the salvation of men in this world, than any other man that ever lived in it. In the short space of twenty years, he has brought forth the Book of Mormon, which he translated by the gift and power of God, and has been the means of publishing it on two continents; has sent the dfulness of the everlasting gospel, which it contained, to the four quarters of the earth; has brought forth the revelations and commandments which compose this book of Doctrine and Covenants, and many other wise documents and instructions for the benefit of the children of men; gathered many thousands of the Latter-day Saints, founded a great city, and left a fame and name that cannot be slain. He lived great, and he died great in the eyes of God and his people; and like most of the Lord’s anointed in ancient times, has sealed his mission and his works with his own eblood; and so has his brother Hyrum. In life they were not divided, and in death they were not fseparated!
 
http://lds.org/scriptures/dc-testament/dc/135.3?lang=eng
 
 

 
 
Fullness?
 
Just WHERE is it LOCATED in the BoM??
 

 
A 'great' city?
 
 
I hope he not be refering to Nauvoo!
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nauvoo,_Illinois
 
 

17 posted on 12/06/2011 10:09:41 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Ripliancum
So, as this is similar to the you did yesterday,

Yes, Ma'am; and we'll be doing it again tomorrow, and Thursday and Friday and ...


18 posted on 12/06/2011 10:12:14 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Ripliancum
Tis the season for love and sharing and peace on earth. How sweet of you.

Yes; it is.

Do approve of or denounce the following MORMON quotes?


 

Questions put to Joseph Smith: "'Do you believe the Bible?' [Smith:]'If we do, we are the only people under heaven that does, for there are none of the religious sects of the day that do'. When asked 'Will everybody be damned, but Mormons'? [Smith replied] 'Yes, and a great portion of them, unless they repent, and work righteousness." (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 119).
Joseph Smith: "for the teachers of religion of the different sects understood the same passages of scripture so differently as to destroy all confidence in settling the question by an appeal to the Bible" (from Pearl of Great Price 1:12). "What is it that inspires professors of Christianity generally with a hope of salvation? It is that smooth, sophisticated influence of the devil, by which he deceives the whole world" (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p.270).
 
 
Brigham Young stated this repeatedly: "When the light came to me I saw that all the so-called Christian world was grovelling in darkness" (Journal of Discourses  5:73); "The Christian world, so-called, are heathens as to the knowledge of the salvation of God" (Journal of Discourses  8:171); "With a regard to true theology, a more ignorant people never lived than the present so-called Christian world" (Journal of Discourses  8:199); "And who is there that acknowledges [God's] hand? ...You may wander east, west, north, and south, and you cannot find it in any church or government on the earth, except the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.24); "Should you ask why we differ from other Christians, as they are called, it is simply because they are not Christians as the New Testament defines Christianity" (Journal of Discourses  10:230).
Orson Pratt proclaimed: "Both Catholics and Protestants are nothing less than the 'whore of Babylon' whom the Lord denounces by the mouth of John the Revelator as having corrupted all the earth by their fornications and wickedness. Any person who shall be so corrupt as to receive a holy ordinance of the Gospel from the ministers of any of these apostate churches will be sent down to hell with them, unless they repent" (The Seer, p. 255).
 
 
Pratt also said: "This great apostasy commenced about the close of the first century of the Christian era, and it has been waxing worse and worse from then until now" (Journal of Discourses , vol.18, p.44) and: "But as there has been no Christian Church on the earth for a great many centuries past, until the present century, the people have lost sight of the pattern that God has given according to which the Christian Church should be established, and they have denominated a great variety of people Christian Churches, because they profess to be ...But there has been a long apostasy, during which the nations have been cursed with apostate churches in great abundance" (Journal of Discourses , 18:172).
 
President John Taylor stated: "Christianity...is a perfect pack of nonsense...the devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century." (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.167); "Where shall we look for the true order or authority of God? It cannot be found in any nation of Christendom." (Journal of Discourses , 10:127).
James Talmage said: "A self-suggesting interpretation of history indicates that there has been a great departure from the way of salvation as laid down by the Savior, a universal apostasy from the Church of Christ". (A Study of the Articles of Faith, p.182).
 
 
President Joseph Fielding Smith said: "Doctrines were corrupted, authority lost, and a false order of religion took the place of the gospel of Jesus Christ, just as it had been the case in former dispensations, and the people were left in spiritual darkness." (Doctrines of Salvation, p.266). "For hundreds of years the world was wrapped in a veil of spiritual darkness, until there was not one fundamental truth belonging to the place of salvation ...Joseph Smith declared that in the year 1820 the Lord revealed to him that all the 'Christian' churches were in error, teaching for commandments the doctrines of men" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, p.282).
 
 
More recent statements by apostle Bruce McConkie are also very clear: "Apostasy was universal...And this darkness still prevails except among those who have come to a knowledge of the restored gospel" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol 3, p.265); "Thus the signs of the times include the prevailing apostate darkness in the sects of Christendom and in the religious world in general" (The Millennial Messiah, p.403); "a perverted Christianity holds sway among the so-called Christians of apostate Christendom" (Mormon Doctrine, p.132); "virtually all the millions of apostate Christendom have abased themselves before the mythical throne of a mythical Christ whom they vainly suppose to be a spirit essence who is incorporeal uncreated, immaterial and three-in-one with the Father and Holy Spirit" (Mormon Doctrine, p.269); "Gnosticism is one of the great pagan philosophies which antedated Christ and the Christian Era and which was later commingled with pure Christianity to form the apostate religion that has prevailed in the world since the early days of that era." (Mormon Doctrine, p.316).
President George Q. Cannon said: "After the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was organized, there were only two churches upon the earth. They were known respectively as the Church of the Lamb of God and Babylon. The various organizations which are called churches throughout Christendom, though differing in their creeds and organizations, have one common origin. They all belong to Babylon" (Gospel Truth, p.324).
 
 
President Wilford Woodruff stated: "the Gospel of modern Christendom shuts up the Lord, and stops all communication with Him. I want nothing to do with such a Gospel, I would rather prefer the Gospel of the dark ages, so called" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 2, p.196).

19 posted on 12/06/2011 10:14:06 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Ripliancum
Is BrighamYoung lying?

"For unbelievers we will quote from the Scriptures - "Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God." Again - "Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh, is of God."

 I will now give my scripture - "Whosoever confesseth that Joseph Smith was sent of God to reveal the holy Gospel to the children of men, and lay the foundation for gathering Israel, and building up the kingdom of God on the earth, that spirit is of God; and every spirit that does not confess that God has sent Joseph Smith, and revealed the everlasting Gospel to and through him, is of Antichrist.......

 - BrighamYoung

 

 

 

Here's some MORE for MORMON's...

"Now if any of you will deny the plurality of wives, and continue to do so, I promise that you will be damned; and I will go still further and say, take this revelation, or any other revelation that the Lord has given, and deny it in your feelings, and I promise that you will be damned.

- JoD 3:266 (July 14, 1855)

 

 

It is true that the earth was organized by three distinct characters, namely, Eloheim, Yahovah, and Michael, these three forming a quorum, as in all heavenly bodies, and in organizing element, perfectly represented in the Deity, as Father, Son, and Holy Ghost.

Again, they will try to tell how the divinity of Jesus is joined to his humanity, and exhaust all their mental faculties, and wind up with this profound language, as describing the soul of man, "it is an immaterial substance!" What a learned idea! Jesus, our elder brother, was begotten in the flesh by the same character that was in the garden of Eden, and who is our Father in Heaven. Now, let all who may hear these doctrines, pause before they make light of them, or treat them with indifference, for they will prove their salvation or damnation.

I have given you a few leading items upon this subject, but a great deal more remains to be told. Now, remember from this time forth, and for ever, that Jesus Christ was not begotten by the Holy Ghost.

- JoD 1:50-51 (April 9, 1852)

 

 

The rank, rabid abolitionists, whom I call black-hearted Republicans, have set the whole national fabric on fire. Do you know this, Democrats? They have kindled the fire that is raging now from the north to the south, and from the south to the north. I am no abolitionist, neither am I a proslavery man; I hate some of their principles and especially some of their conduct, as I do the gates of hell. The Southerners make the negroes, and the Northerners worship them; this is all the difference between slaveholders. and abolitionists. I would like the President of the United States and all the world to hear this.

Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so.

- JoD: vol.10 p. 110: (March 8, 1863)

It looks like BrighamYoung was pretty good at bashings.

20 posted on 12/06/2011 10:15:54 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar
They’re just buttering up old Joe for when they stand before him he will see how they “worshiped” him and he will let them into heaven. ;-D

 

"He (Joseph Smith) is the man through whom God has spoken... yet I would not like to call him a savior, though in a certain capacity he was a god to us, and is to the nations of the earth, and will continue to be."
 - Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 8:321
 
 
"You call us fools; but the day will be, gentlemen and ladies, whether you belong to this Church or not, when you will prize brother Joseph Smith as the Prophet of the Living God, and look upon him as a god..."
- Herber C. Kimball, Journal of Discourses 5:88
 
 
"If we get our salvation, we shall have to pass by him [Joseph Smith]; if we enter our glory, it will be through the authority he has received. We cannot get around him [Joseph Smith]"
- (as quoted in 1988 Melchizedek Priesthood Study Guide, p. 142)
 
 
There is "no salvation without accepting Joseph Smith. If Joseph Smith was verily a prophet, and if he told the truth...no man can reject that testimony without incurring the most dreadful consequences, for he cannot enter the kingdom of God"
- Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 1, p.190
 
 
"I tell you, Joseph holds the keys, and none of us can get into the celestial kingdom without passing by him. We have not got rid of him, but he stands there as the sentinel, holding the keys of the kingdom of God; and there are many of them beside him. I tell you, if we get past those who have mingled with us, and know us best, and have a right to know us best, probably we can pass all other sentinels as far as it is necessary, or as far as we may desire. But I tell you, the pinch will be with those that have mingled with us, stood next to us, weighed our spirits, tried us, and proven us: there will be a pinch, in my view, to get past them. The others, perhaps, will say, If brother Joseph is satisfied with you, you may pass. If it is all right with him, it is all right with me. Then if Joseph shall say to a man, or if brother Brigham say to a man, I forgive you your sins, "Whosoever sins ye remit they are remitted unto them;" if you who have suffered and felt the weight of transgression—if you have generosity enough to forgive the sinner, I will forgive him: you cannot have more generosity than I have. I have given you power to forgive sins, and when the Lord gives a gift, he does not take it back again."
 - Orson Hyde, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p.154-155
 
 
 
"It is because the Lord called Joseph Smith that salvation is again available to mortal men.... If it had not been for Joseph Smith and the restoration, there would be no salvation,"
 - Bruce McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, p. 396, 670
 


They succeeded in killing Joseph, but he had finished his work.
He was a servant of God, and gave us the Book of Mormon.
He said the Bible was right in the main, but, through the translators and others, many precious portions were suppressed, and several other portions were wrongly translated; and now his testimony is in force, for he has sealed it with his blood.
As I have frequently told them, no man in this dispensation will enter the courts of heaven, without the approbation of the Prophet Joseph Smith, Jun.
Who has made this so?
Have I?
Have this people?
Have the world?
No; but the Lord Jehovah has decreed it.
If I ever pass into the heavenly courts, it will be by the consent of the Prophet Joseph.
If you ever pass through the gates into the Holy City, you will do so upon his certificate that you are worthy to pass.
Can you pass without his inspection?
No; neither can any person in this dispensation, which is the dispensation of the fulness of times.
In this generation, and in all the generations that are to come, everyone will have to undergo the scrutiny of this Prophet.
They say that they killed Joseph, and they will yet come with their hats under their arms and bend to him; but what good will it do them, unless they repent?
They can come in a certain way and find favor, but will they?
 Brigham Young,

--JOURNAL OF DISCOURSES, vol. 8, p. 224

21 posted on 12/06/2011 10:17:48 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: greyfoxx39
I really think your tagline is ridiculous considering your bitter posts, LOL.

Uh...

You've misspelled hypocritical.

22 posted on 12/06/2011 10:19:10 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: greyfoxx39

23 posted on 12/06/2011 10:20:27 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: greyfoxx39; Godzilla

24 posted on 12/06/2011 10:22:54 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

Jesus, our elder brother, was begotten in the flesh by the same character that was in the garden of Eden,

- Brigham Young
_____________________________________________

Now the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made.


25 posted on 12/06/2011 10:23:26 AM PST by Tennessee Nana
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To: Elsie

Yep, just a little logpside.

26 posted on 12/06/2011 10:32:49 AM PST by Godzilla (3/7/77)
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To: Tennessee Nana

http://www.ldschurchnews.com/articles/24762/Joseph-Smiths-birthday-commemorated.html
PULL QUOTE: we celebrate not only the birth of the Savior but also the birthday of our Prophet Joseph Smith.
http://www.ldschurchnews.com/articles/56330/Church-History-Museum-celebrates-Joseph-Smiths-birthday.html
PULL QUOTE: The festivities began on Joseph’s birthday, Dec. 23, and will run until Jan. 3.
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705379702/Remember-the-Prophet-Joseph-Smiths-birthday.html
PULL QUOTE: As the Doctrine and Covenants affirms, “Joseph Smith, the Prophet and Seer of the Lord, has done more, save Jesus only, for the salvation of men in this world, than any other man that ever lived in it.”
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/600137230/Vermont-group-observing-Joseph-Smiths-birthday.html
OBSERVATION: not even a mention of Jesus Christ


27 posted on 12/06/2011 10:42:29 AM PST by svcw (God's Grace - thank you!)
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To: Colofornian

When I was LDS, I would have said what we often hear here that Mormons don’t worship Joseph Smith. However, after I left, and became a real Christian, I started to see just how much devotion is given to Smith and how it really is worship.

Mormons themselves will often say they only worship God the Father not Jesus Christ (see McConkie also) but they fail to realize that Smith is mentioned and shown devotion FAR more than Christ ever is - all the way down to the Joseph Smith nativity at BYU.

Mormons don’t see that they worship Smith, just like they don’t see that they claim a false Christ. They are spiritually blind above all else.


28 posted on 12/06/2011 11:08:30 AM PST by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian "I once was lost but now am found, was blind but now I see".)
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To: Ripliancum

Merry Smithmas, Rip!

BTW, ‘tis the season to remember the birth of God incarnate, Jesus Christ, not the birth of a con-man Joseph Smith.


29 posted on 12/06/2011 11:10:01 AM PST by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian "I once was lost but now am found, was blind but now I see".)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

Smith claimed to be a direct decendant of Christ (who was a polygamist according to LDS prophets) and even greater than Christ (I can give you the quote if you wish).

I remember reading, when I was LDS, that Smith would return with Christ and help govern the theocratic (LDS) United States when Christ returned to Missouri.


30 posted on 12/06/2011 11:17:19 AM PST by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian "I once was lost but now am found, was blind but now I see".)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

Each LDS prophet is, in a way, another Joseph Smith. However, the LDS put Smith on a pedestal over all the others since he was the ‘chosen one’ to ‘restore’ the ‘only true and living church upon the face of the earth’.

Many do eagerly await his return in the clouds, though (sound familiar?).


31 posted on 12/06/2011 11:23:59 AM PST by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian "I once was lost but now am found, was blind but now I see".)
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To: Elsie

“Yes, Ma’am; and we’ll be doing it again tomorrow, and Thursday and Friday and ...”

THANK YOU!


32 posted on 12/06/2011 11:33:23 AM PST by PeachyKeen
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To: reaganaut

Why is it that the Mormons I meet are pretty decent people but they follow a set of teachings that is so corny?


33 posted on 12/06/2011 11:50:00 AM PST by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: Elsie

That last quote is ironic since Young had at least 3 black slaves with him in his hand cart trek and slaves were given as tithing in Deseret.


34 posted on 12/06/2011 11:50:29 AM PST by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian "I once was lost but now am found, was blind but now I see".)
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To: reaganaut
That last quote is ironic since...

Uh... you spelled HYP...

35 posted on 12/06/2011 12:39:58 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Ripliancum

I love this time of year. Our Ward is all aglow with the Spirit of Thanksgiving and Christmas. We celebrate the birth of our Savior and love and joy of the Season.

I feel sorry for the anti Mormons; they are missing out on all the Goodness.


36 posted on 12/06/2011 1:59:55 PM PST by Saundra Duffy ( For victory & freedom!!!)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

We believe that Joseph Smith was a Prophet of God - he was just a man - and we do not worship him. The anti Mormons around these parts just keep on posting and posting - copy and paste - the same old stuff day after day after day.

www.lds.org
www.mormon.org


37 posted on 12/06/2011 2:02:40 PM PST by Saundra Duffy ( For victory & freedom!!!)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

“Why is it that the Mormons I meet are pretty decent people but they follow a set of teachings that is so corny?”

If believing that Jesus Christ is my Savior is “corny” I am guilty as charged.


38 posted on 12/06/2011 2:05:09 PM PST by Saundra Duffy ( For victory & freedom!!!)
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To: reaganaut

“Smith claimed to be a direct decendant of Christ (who was a polygamist according to LDS prophets) and even greater than Christ (I can give you the quote if you wish).”

Oh, for God’s sake. It looks like you are saying that we believe that Christ was a polygamist. Please be more careful when speaking of our Savior, Redeemer, and Soon Coming King, Jesus Christ of Nazareth - the Great Jehovah of the Old Testament and Savior in the New Testament. As a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints I do not appreciate your comments about my Church and my Faith, not to mention my wonderful beautiful Savior Jesus Christ the Head of my Church.


39 posted on 12/06/2011 2:12:12 PM PST by Saundra Duffy ( For victory & freedom!!!)
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To: Colofornian
Wow, a new Three Minutes Hate!

Was it good for you too ?

40 posted on 12/06/2011 2:20:43 PM PST by jimt (Fear is the darkroom where negatives are developed.)
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To: Saundra Duffy

I don’t care if Mormons deify a dead rabbi from a couple thousand years ago and try to follow his example the best they know how. That part is great, but the mainstream Mormon beliefs that come out of the Book of Mormon and the DnC and other writings, such as becoming a god of your own planet, just strike me as odd.


41 posted on 12/06/2011 2:22:35 PM PST by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: Saundra Duffy

We celebrate the birth of our Savior and love and joy of the Season.

I feel sorry for the anti Mormons; they are missing out on all the Goodness.
_________________________________________________________

Sandy, Im not missing anything by not worshipping your false prophet the criminal and child rapist Joey Smith ..

But you as an anti-Christian are missing eternity with God by not worshipping the LORD Jesus Christ and Him only...


42 posted on 12/06/2011 2:47:39 PM PST by Tennessee Nana
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To: Saundra Duffy

It looks like you are saying that we believe that Christ was a polygamist.
________________________________________

Of course...

Because thats what mormons believe...


43 posted on 12/06/2011 2:50:23 PM PST by Tennessee Nana
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To: Saundra Duffy

Oh, for .... sake. (The Name dedacted)
__________________________________________

Sandy no Christian...no believer in the God of the Christian Bible would ever take His Name in vain...

We know however that you are not a believer and therefore do not care what you say about him...


44 posted on 12/06/2011 2:53:53 PM PST by Tennessee Nana
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To: Saundra Duffy

Please be more careful when speaking of our Savior, Redeemer, and Soon Coming King, Jesus Christ of Nazareth - the Great Jehovah of the Old Testament and Savior in the New Testament.
___________________________________________

Maybe you just cut and pasted this from your Mormon website for FARMS/FAIR/LDSInc withoput reading the words...

You might want to see my last post

HYPOCRITE !!!!

Meanwhile you pitiful mormons are adding more and more words from that Christian Bible you dont believe...

and Sandy unless you say that God is Triune and that the Trinity is Truth...

and that the LORD Jesus Christ is God and always has been God...

you are just giving lip service (keyboard service ???) to these words and terms...

They mean nothing to you...

I could say and write allahu akbar all day long and it would mean nothing...


45 posted on 12/06/2011 3:00:22 PM PST by Tennessee Nana
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To: Saundra Duffy

I do not appreciate your comments about my Church and my Faith,
_______________________________________

I couldnt care less about your dumb pagan religion or what you have faith in..

If you dont like the written truth about your chosen religion

then get out...


46 posted on 12/06/2011 3:03:43 PM PST by Tennessee Nana
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To: Jack Hydrazine

Whited sepulchres. MormonISM requires of them that they earn Salvation, so they learn from childhood to behave as best they can ... until, like Milt Rominy or Harry Reid they see an opportunity to use their outward good behavior as a foil to obtain from their fellow creatures. The secret pride they carry about puts them at emtity with God, but they don’t really believe that so they continue in the lie, with pride corroding their souls the more. They are not forgiven, just goody two shoes outwardly. You see, they are taught that they ‘can’ obtain salvation necause of the Mormon jesus, after all that they can do to earn it. Devilish trap that


47 posted on 12/06/2011 3:27:56 PM PST by MHGinTN (Some, believing they cannot be deceived, it's impossible to convince them when they're deceived.)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar
They’re just buttering up old Joe for when they stand before him he will see how they “worshiped” him and he will let them into heaven

I hadn't thought of that before.

Interesting spiritual psycho-analysis. And probably spot on; I just can't say for certain 'cause I don't know individual Mormons' motives for Smith veneration.

Certainly, for those who believe what other Lds leaders have taught -- that they need Smith's consent to enter (celestial) heaven -- I'd say that would be a "butter up" motivator if there e'er was one.

Interesting how Mormons replace the Subject of John 14:6 (Jesus) with both "Consenter" Smith and the Mormon church (Lds first President Marion Romney called the Mormon church "the way, the truth, and the life").

48 posted on 12/06/2011 3:30:51 PM PST by Colofornian (JoePologists: Those who defend the personality cults of Joe Smith and Joe Paterno)
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To: Saundra Duffy

Your bitterness is oozing out, Sandy. Have a cookie and a cup of tea.


49 posted on 12/06/2011 3:31:46 PM PST by MHGinTN (Some, believing they cannot be deceived, it's impossible to convince them when they're deceived.)
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To: Saundra Duffy
We believe that Joseph Smith was a Prophet of God - he was just a man - and we do not worship him.

Another round of Praise to the Man shall we.

50 posted on 12/06/2011 3:43:50 PM PST by Godzilla (3/7/77)
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