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Following The Truth: Ten Facts Most Catholics Donít Know (But Should!) (Catholic or Open)
CE.cpm ^ | July 9th, 2010 | Gary Zimak

Posted on 12/07/2011 8:24:20 AM PST by Salvation

Ten Facts Most Catholics Don’t Know (But Should!)

July 9th, 2010 by Gary Zimak

Every time I hear someone claim to be an “ex-Catholic”, a sense of sadness comes over me.  In just about every case, people leave the Catholic Faith due to a lack of understanding.  After all, if Catholics truly believed that they were members of the one, true Church founded by Christ (and necessary for their salvation), nobody would ever leave!  In an effort to help clarify what the Catholic Church teaches, I have compiled a list of 10 important facts that every Catholic should know.  More than simply Catholic trivia, these are important concepts that can help us to better understand and defend our beliefs.  In no particular order, these items have been compiled based upon my work at Following The Truth and my own study of the Catholic Faith.

1. Women Will Never Be Priests – Often incorrectly lumped in with the subject of married priests, this is a doctrine that has been infallibly decided and will not change.  In 1994, Pope John Paul II issued an Apostolic Letter, Ordinatio Sacerdotalis, in which he declared once and for all that “the Church has no authority whatsoever to confer priestly ordination on women and that this judgment is to be definitively held by all the Church’s faithful.”  Unlike the issue of married priests (which could possibly change), women’s ordination is an impossibility that will not happen.  It is not a “glass ceiling” or the Church’s attempt to hold back women.  Instead, it is an infallible recognition that men and women have different roles and that Christ instituted a male priesthood.

2. Fridays Are Still Days Of Penance – Ask almost anyone and they will tell you that Catholics are no longer required to abstain from meat on Fridays throughout the year.  However, the current Code of Canon Law (CIC) states that, with the exception of solemnities, “All Fridays through the year and the time of Lent are penitential days and times throughout the entire Church.” (CIC 1250)  Furthermore, “Abstinence from eating meat or another food according to the prescriptions of the conference of bishops is to be observed on Fridays throughout the year unless they are solemnities.” (CIC 1251)  In the United States, the bishops have declared that it is permissible to substitute some other form of penance, but we are still urged to fast from “something” in remembrance of the Lord’s death on the cross.

3. The Bible Is A Catholic Book – Did you ever wonder how the Bible came into being?  A little known, but easily documented fact is that the books of the Bible were compiled by the Catholic Church.  For many years after Christ ascended into Heaven, there was debate about which scriptural writings were inspired by God.  The canon of Scripture (the books of the Bible) was first formally decided at the Synod of Rome in 382.  This decision was upheld at the Councils of Hippo (393) and Carthage (397).  At these Catholic Church councils, the same 46 Old Testament and 27 New Testament books that appear in today’s Catholic Bibles were declared to be inspired by God.  As a side note, approximately 1200 years after this decision was made, Martin Luther and the Protestant reformers removed 7 books from the Old Testament.  As a result, most Protestant Bibles are still missing these 7 books.

4. The Mass Is The Same Sacrifice As Calvary – The biggest mistake that many Catholics make is treating the Holy Mass as “just another church service”, similar to those held by other religions.  In the Mass, Christ’s Sacrifice on the Cross is made present, its memory is celebrated and its saving power is applied.  The Council of Trent teaches that Christ left a visible sacrifice to His Church “in which that bloody sacrifice which was once offered on the Cross should be made present, its memory preserved to the end of the world, and its salvation-bringing power applied to the forgiveness of the sins which are daily committed by us.”  When we attend Mass, we are mystically transported to Calvary, where we can unite ourselves with the Lord’s Sacrifice to the Father!

5. Annulments Are Not Catholic Divorces – Unlike the legal process known as “divorce” (in which a marriage is terminated), a declaration of nullity (annulment) states that a valid marriage never existed.  This decision is based upon the finding that on the day that marriage vows were exchanged, some essential elements were lacking.  This process is completely in conformity with the Catholic teaching regarding the indissolubility of marriage.  Incidentally, the granting of an annulment does not render children illegitimate.

6. In Vitro Fertilization Is Morally Unacceptable – Many Catholics suffering from infertility utilize this process in the hopes of conceiving children, while remaining unaware that the Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC) declares it “morally unacceptable”(CCC 2377).  In the Vatican Instruction, Donum Vitae, the Church states “…in conformity with the traditional doctrine relating to the goods of marriage and the dignity of the person, the Church remains opposed from the moral point of view to homologous ‘in vitro’ fertilization. Such fertilization is in itself illicit and in opposition to the dignity of procreation and of the conjugal union, even when everything is done to avoid the death of the human embryo.”

7. There Is No Salvation Outside Of The Catholic Church – Originally stated by St. Cyprian, the Latin axiom “Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus” reminds us that there is no salvation outside of the Catholic Church.  This dogma was declared at the Fourth Lateran Council and is a source of confusion for Catholics and non-Catholics alike.  According to the Catechism, all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is His Body.  It does not mean that non-Catholics cannot achieve salvation.  Individuals who are unaware that the Catholic Church is the one, true Church may still achieve salvation through the merits of the Church, despite their lack of knowledge.

8. In An Emergency, Anyone Can Baptize – Although the ordinary ministers of Baptism are bishops, priests and deacons, anyone can baptize in an emergency, even a non-baptized person.  This extraordinary decision can be attributed to the necessity of Baptism for salvation and the Church’s desire to make it readily available to all.

9. Hell And Purgatory Still Exist –  Contrary to the belief of many Catholics, the Church still teaches that “the souls of those who die in a state of mortal sin, descend into hell, where they suffer the punishments of hell, eternal fire” (CCC 1035)  Furthermore, “all who die in God’s grace and friendship, but still imperfectly purified, are indeed assured of their eternal salvation, but after death they undergo purification, so to achieve the holiness necessary to enter the joy of heaven.” (CCC 1030)  This purification process, formally declared by the Church at the Councils of Florence and Trent, is known as Purgatory.

10. Catholics Don’t Worship Mary And The Saints – Many Catholics are confused about the role of the Blessed Mother and the Saints.  Should we pray to Mary and the Saints or should we go “right to the top” and pray to God?  In a nutshell, the Catholic Faith teaches that we must worship God alone.  Mary and the Saints are to be honored, not worshipped.  However, their intercession can be extremely powerful and emulating their virtues can put us on the road to Heaven.

While the above list only scratches the surface of the robust Catholic Faith, it provides a glimpse into the depth of Catholic teaching.  Further explanation on these and other topics can be found by examining the Code of Canon Law and the Catechism of the Catholic Church, both of which can be found online at the Vatican website (www.vatican.va).  Not only will studying the teachings of the Catholic Church enable us to better defend her when challenged, it will help us to become closer to Our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, who founded our Church 2,000 years ago.



TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; History; Theology
KEYWORDS: apologetics; catholic
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Gary Zimak is the founder of Following The Truth Ministries (http://www.followingthetruth.com), a lay apostolate created to assist Catholics in learning more about their Faith. He is a regular guest on EWTN Radio’s “Son Rise Morning Show”, Ave Maria Radio’s “Catholic Connection with Teresa Tomeo” and appears frequently on several other Catholic radio programs.  In addition to writing for CatholicLane. Mr. Zimak hosts a daily program on BlogTalkRadio and posts frequently on his blog, Facebook and Twitter.  He is a member of Catholics United For The Faith and the Knights of Columbus and resides in New Jersey.


1 posted on 12/07/2011 8:24:31 AM PST by Salvation
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To: nickcarraway; NYer; ELS; Pyro7480; livius; ArrogantBustard; Catholicguy; RobbyS; marshmallow; ...

Advent series ping.

Apologetics ping.


2 posted on 12/07/2011 8:28:04 AM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

As always, thank you Salvation, God Bless you.


3 posted on 12/07/2011 8:36:51 AM PST by thesaleboat (Pray The Rosary Daily (Our Lady, July 13, 1917))
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To: thesaleboat

Zimak is a great writer — not afraid to tell it like it is.

Have a wonderful day.


4 posted on 12/07/2011 8:48:09 AM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: All
1. Women Will Never Be Priests
2. Fridays Are Still Days Of Penance
3. The Bible Is A Catholic Book
4. The Mass Is The Same Sacrifice As Calvary
5. Annulments Are Not Catholic Divorces
6. In Vitro Fertilization Is Morally Unacceptable
7. There Is No Salvation Outside Of The Catholic Church
8. In An Emergency, Anyone Can Baptize
9. Hell And Purgatory Still Exist
10. Catholics Don’t Worship Mary And The Saints

Ping for later. I can think of at least three that even some Cardinals don't know.

5 posted on 12/07/2011 9:06:10 AM PST by Alex Murphy (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2703506/posts?page=518#518)
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To: Salvation
I downloaded a CD from Matt Maher(Alive Again) the other day from iTunes. Been listening to it, been blessed by it. To me, it has the anointing of God. Then I found out he is a practicing Catholic. My first thought was, "Oh, no!" Then, "Cool!" He is singing, with gusto, the words of God. This is common ground that I can rejoice in and celebrate.

Then I read items 4,7, and 8 and have to shake my head. I will still celebrate the common ground, though.

6 posted on 12/07/2011 9:07:14 AM PST by bubbacluck (I'll pay more for tomatoes, thank you.)
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To: Salvation
Excellent post Salvation.

The following really stood out for me:

3. The Bible Is A Catholic Book – Did you ever wonder how the Bible came into being? A little known, but easily documented fact is that the books of the Bible were compiled by the Catholic Church. For many years after Christ ascended into Heaven, there was debate about which scriptural writings were inspired by God. The canon of Scripture (the books of the Bible) was first formally decided at the Synod of Rome in 382. This decision was upheld at the Councils of Hippo (393) and Carthage (397). At these Catholic Church councils, the same 46 Old Testament and 27 New Testament books that appear in today’s Catholic Bibles were declared to be inspired by God. As a side note, approximately 1200 years after this decision was made, Martin Luther and the Protestant reformers removed 7 books from the Old Testament. As a result, most Protestant Bibles are still missing these 7 books.

7 posted on 12/07/2011 9:14:01 AM PST by GOP Poet (Time for Bambi and his commie crew to go.)
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To: Salvation

You like to be in the middle of it! LOL!!!


8 posted on 12/07/2011 9:45:10 AM PST by johngrace (1 John 4!- declared at every Sunday Mass,Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: Salvation

And an “outstanding” ping for your post. Seriously. As always, thank you, friend.


9 posted on 12/07/2011 9:52:22 AM PST by sayuncledave (et Verbum caro factum est (And the Word was made flesh))
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To: Salvation

He made the There Is No Salvation Outside Of The Catholic Church way too simple.

The Vatican says that it “It follows that these separated churches and Communities, though we believe they suffer from defects, are deprived neither of significance nor importance in the mystery of salvation. In fact the Spirit of Christ has not refrained from using them as instruments of salvation, whose value derives from that fullness of grace and of truth which has been entrusted to the Catholic Church”

The fullness of grace and truth has been ENTRUSTED to the Catholic Church, but the Spirit of Christ is what saves. If a person does not know that the Church of Christ subsits in the Catholic Church, but Christ says they are saved, they are. Period.


10 posted on 12/07/2011 9:52:25 AM PST by netmilsmom (Happiness is a choice)
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To: Salvation
Thanks for posting this, Salvation!

It is kind of amazing how many people seem to think that the Bible was written by King James, and that they say (in effect) "if the KJV version was good enough for Jesus, it is good enough for all of us".

Yesterday, Father Mitch pointed out the obvious fact that if it was not for the Tradition of the Church, no one would even know what books belonged in the New Testament.    (He pointed out the plain fact that the New Testament does NOT contain a list of the books that belong in the New Testament. Several Councils of the Catholic Church (Tradition) were the vehicles used where the books of the New Testament were selected.)
11 posted on 12/07/2011 10:11:58 AM PST by Heart-Rest (The church is the pillar and bulwark of the truth. (1 Timothy 3:15))
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To: GOP Poet; Salvation
Authority - Scripture, Apostolic Tradition - Magisterium

Magesterial Quotes

Catechism of the Catholic Church

The Catechism of the Catholic Church, which I approved 25 June last and the publication of which I today order by virtue of my Apostolic Authority, is a statement of the Church's faith and of catholic doctrine, attested to or illumined by Sacred Scripture, the Apostolic Tradition and the Church's Magisterium. I declare it to be a sure norm for teaching the faith and thus a valid and legitimate instrument for ecclesial communion. May it serve the renewal to which the Holy Spirit ceaselessly calls the Church of God, the Body of Christ, on her pilgrimage to the undiminished light of the Kingdom!Read More

I. THE APOSTOLIC TRADITIONRead More

77 "In order that the full and living Gospel might always be preserved in the Church the apostles left bishops as their successors. They gave them their own position of teaching authority." (see note 35) Indeed, "the apostolic preaching, which is expressed in a special way in the inspired books, was to be preserved in a continuous line of succession until the end of time." (see note 36)Read More 78 This living transmission, accomplished in the Holy Spirit, is called Tradition, since it is distinct from Sacred Scripture, though closely connected to it. Through Tradition, "the Church, in her doctrine, life and worship, perpetuates and transmits to every generation all that she herself is, all that she believes." (see note 37) "The sayings of the holy Fathers are a witness to the life-giving presence of this Tradition, showing how its riches are poured out in the practice and life of the Church, in her belief and her prayer." (see note 38)Read More 79 The Father's self-communication made through his Word in the Holy Spirit, remains present and active in the Church: "God, who spoke in the past, continues to converse with the Spouse of his beloved Son. And the Holy Spirit, through whom the living voice of the Gospel rings out in the Church - and through her in the world - leads believers to the full truth, and makes the Word of Christ dwell in them in all its richness." (see note 39)Read More

II. THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN TRADITION AND SACRED SCRIPTURERead More

One common source. . .Read More

80 "Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture, then, are bound closely together, and communicate one with the other. For both of them, flowing out from the same divine well-spring, come together in some fashion to form one thing, and move towards the same goal." (see note 40) Each of them makes present and fruitful in the Church the mystery of Christ, who promised to remain with his own "always, to the close of the age". (see note 41)Read More

. . . two distinct modes of transmissionRead More 81 "Sacred Scripture is the speech of God as it is put down in writing under the breath of the Holy Spirit." (see note 42) "And [Holy] Tradition transmits in its entirety the Word of God which has been entrusted to the apostles by Christ the Lord and the Holy Spirit. It transmits it to the successors of the apostles so that, enlightened by the Spirit of truth, they may faithfully preserve, expound and spread it abroad by their preaching." (see note 43)Read More

82 As a result the Church, to whom the transmission and interpretation of Revelation is entrusted, "does not derive her certainty about all revealed truths from the holy Scriptures alone. Both Scripture and Tradition must be accepted and honored with equal sentiments of devotion and reverence." (see note 44)Read More

Apostolic Tradition and ecclesial traditionsRead More 83 The Tradition here in question comes from the apostles and hands on what they received from Jesus' teaching and example and what they learned from the Holy Spirit. The first generation of Christians did not yet have a written New Testament, and the New Testament itself demonstrates the process of living Tradition. Tradition is to be distinguished from the various theological, disciplinary, liturgical or devotional traditions, born in the local churches over time. These are the particular forms, adapted to different places and times, in which the great Tradition is expressed. In the light of Tradition, these traditions can be retained, modified or even abandoned under the guidance of the Church's Magisterium.Read More

III. THE INTERPRETATION OF THE HERITAGE OF FAITHRead More The heritage of faith entrusted to the whole of the ChurchRead More

84 The apostles entrusted the "Sacred deposit" of the faith (the depositum fidei), (see note 45) contained in Sacred Scripture and Tradition, to the whole of the Church. "By adhering to [this heritage] the entire holy people, united to its pastors, remains always faithful to the teaching of the apostles, to the brotherhood, to the breaking of bread and the prayers. So, in maintaining, practicing and professing the faith that has been handed on, there should be a remarkable harmony between the bishops and the faithful." (see note 46)Read More

The Magisterium of the ChurchRead More

85 "The task of giving an authentic interpretation of the Word of God, whether in its written form or in the form of Tradition, has been entrusted to the living teaching office of the Church alone. Its authority in this matter is exercised in the name of Jesus Christ." (see note 47) This means that the task of interpretation has been entrusted to the bishops in communion with the successor of Peter, the Bishop of Rome.Read More

86 "Yet this Magisterium is not superior to the Word of God, but is its servant. It teaches only what has been handed on to it. At the divine command and with the help of the Holy Spirit, it listens to this devotedly, guards it with dedication and expounds it faithfully. All that it proposes for belief as being divinely revealed is drawn from this single deposit of faith." (see note 48)Read More 87 Mindful of Christ's words to his apostles: "He who hears you, hears me", (see note 49) the faithful receive with docility the teachings and directives that their pastors give them in different forms.Read More

The dogmas of the faithRead More

88 The Church's Magisterium exercises the authority it holds from Christ to the fullest extent when it defines dogmas, that is, when it proposes, in a form obliging the Christian people to an irrevocable adherence of faith, truths contained in divine Revelation or also when it proposes, in a definitive way, truths having a necessary connection with these.Read More

89 There is an organic connection between our spiritual life and the dogmas. Dogmas are lights along the path of faith; they illuminate it and make it secure. Conversely, if our life is upright, our intellect and heart will be open to welcome the light shed by the dogmas of faith. (see note 50)Read More

120 It was by the apostolic Tradition that the Church discerned which writings are to be included in the list of the sacred books. (see note 90) This complete list is called the canon of Scripture. It includes 46 books for the Old Testament (45 if we count Jeremiah and Lamentations as one) and 27 for the New. (see note 91) The Old Testament: Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy, Joshua, Judges, Ruth, 1 and 2 Samuel, 1 and 2 Kings, 1 and 2 Chronicles, Ezra and Nehemiah, Tobit, Judith, Esther, 1 and 2 Maccabees, Job, Psalms, Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, the Song of Songs, the Wisdom of Solomon, Sirach (Ecclesiasticus), Isaiah, Jeremiah, Lamentations, Baruch, Ezekiel, Daniel, Hosea, Joel, Amos, Obadiah, Jonah, Micah, Nahum, Habakkuk, Zephaniah, Haggai, Zachariah and Malachi. The New Testament: the Gospels according to Matthew, Mark, Luke and John, the Acts of the Apostles, the Letters of St. Paul to the Romans, 1 and 2 Corinthians, Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, 1 and 2 Thessalonians, 1 and 2 Timothy, Titus, Philemon, the Letter to the Hebrews, the Letters of James, 1 and 2 Peter, 1, 2 and 3 John, and Jude, and Revelation (the Apocalypse).Read More

126 We can distinguish three stages in the formation of the Gospels: 1. The life and teaching of Jesus. The Church holds firmly that the four Gospels, "whose historicity she unhesitatingly affirms, faithfully hand on what Jesus, the Son of God, while he lived among men, really did and taught for their eternal salvation, until the day when he was taken up." (see note 99) 2. The oral tradition. "For, after the ascension of the Lord, the apostles handed on to their hearers what he had said and done, but with that fuller understanding which they, instructed by the glorious events of Christ and enlightened by the Spirit of truth, now enjoyed." (see note 100) 3. The written Gospels. "The sacred authors, in writing the four Gospels, selected certain of the many elements which had been handed on, either orally or already in written form; others they synthesized or explained with an eye to the situation of the churches, the while sustaining the form of preaching, but always in such a fashion that they have told us the honest truth about Jesus." (see note 101)Read More

128 The Church, as early as apostolic times, (see note 104) and then constantly in her Tradition, has illuminated the unity of the divine plan in the two Testaments through typology, which discerns in God's works of the Old Covenant prefigurations of what he accomplished in the fullness of time in the person of his incarnate Son.Read More

Note#182 We believe all "that which is contained in the word of God, written or handed down, and which the Church proposes for belief as divinely revealed" (Paul VI, CPG Sect. 20).Read More

Note#51 St. Nicholas of Flüe; cf. Mt 5:29-30; 16:24-26.Read More

Note#480 Cf. Phil 2:10; Acts 2:24; Rev 1:18; Eph 4:9; Pss 6:6; 88:11-13.Read More

THE PROFESSION OF FAITHRead More

Note#247 Pius XII, encyclical, Mystici Corporis:DS 3808.Read More

Note#17 Cf. 1 Pet 3:21.Read More

Catechism of the Catholic Church - PART 2 SECTION 1 CHAPTER 1 ARTICLE 2Read More

1150 Signs of the covenant. The Chosen People received from God distinctive signs and symbols that marked its liturgical life. These are no longer solely celebrations of cosmic cycles and social gestures, but signs of the covenant, symbols of God's mighty deeds for his people. Among these liturgical signs from the Old Covenant are circumcision, anointing and consecration of kings and priests, laying on of hands, sacrifices, and above all the Passover. The Church sees in these signs a prefiguring of the sacraments of the New Covenant.Read More

Note#64 GIRM 272.Read More

The mystagogy of the celebrationRead More

Note#79 Cf. LG 37; CIC, cann. 208-223; CCEO, can. 675:2.Read More

THE CELEBRATION OF THE CHRISTIAN MYSTERYRead More 1539 The chosen people was constituted by God as "a kingdom of priests and a holy nation." (see note 6) But within the people of Israel, God chose one of the twelve tribes, that of Levi, and set it apart for liturgical service; God himself is its inheritance. (see note 7) A special rite consecrated the beginnings of the priesthood of the Old Covenant. The priests are "appointed to act on behalf of men in relation to God, to offer gifts and sacrifices for sins." (see note 8)Read More

1555 "Amongst those various offices which have been exercised in the Church from the earliest times the chief place, according to the witness of tradition, is held by the function of those who, through their appointment to the dignity and responsibility of bishop, and in virtue consequently of the unbroken succession going back to the beginning, are regarded as transmitters of the apostolic line." (see note 34)Read More

2090 When God reveals Himself and calls him, man cannot fully respond to the divine love by his own powers. He must hope that God will give him the capacity to love Him in return and to act in conformity with the commandments of charity. Hope is the confident expectation of divine blessing and the beatific vision of God; it is also the fear of offending God's love and of incurring punishment.Read More

Catechism of the Catholic Church - PART 3 SECTION 2 CHAPTER 1 ARTICLE 3Read More

PART THREERead More Note#77 Cf. Lk 18:9-14.Read More

2659 We learn to pray at certain moments by hearing the Word of the Lord and sharing in his Paschal mystery, but his Spirit is offered us at all times, in the events of each day, to make prayer spring up from us. Jesus' teaching about praying to our Father is in the same vein as his teaching about providence: (see note 12) time is in the Father's hands; it is in the present that we encounter him, not yesterday nor tomorrow, but today: "O that today you would hearken to his voice! Harden not your hearts." (see note 13)Read More

2751 Finally, in this prayer Jesus reveals and gives to us the "knowledge," inseparably one, of the Father and of the Son, (see note 51) which is the very mystery of the life of prayer.Read More 2759 Jesus "was praying at a certain place, and when he ceased, one of his disciples said to him, 'Lord, teach us to pray, as John taught his disciples.'" (see note 1) In response to this request the Lord entrusts to his disciples and to his Church the fundamental Christian prayer. St. Luke presents a brief text of five petitions, (see note 2) while St. Matthew gives a more developed version of seven petitions. (see note 3) The liturgical tradition of the Church has retained St. Matthew's text: Our Father who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done on earth, as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us, and lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.Read More

Supporting Bible Passages

Genesis Chapter 17

14: Any uncircumcised male who is not circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin shall be cut off from his people; he has broken my covenant."Read More

Exodus Chapter 28

30: And in the breastpiece of judgment you shall put the Urim and the Thummim, and they shall be upon Aaron's heart, when he goes in before the LORD; thus Aaron shall bear the judgment of the people of Israel upon his heart before the LORD continually.Read More

Numbers Chapter 11

27: And a young man ran and told Moses, "Eldad and Medad are prophesying in the camp." 28: And Joshua the son of Nun, the minister of Moses, one of his chosen men, said, "My lord Moses, forbid them." 29: But Moses said to him, "Are you jealous for my sake? Would that all the LORD's people were prophets, that the LORD would put his spirit upon them!"Read More

Deuteronomy Chapter 17

8: "If any case arises requiring decision between one kind of homicide and another, one kind of legal right and another, or one kind of assault and another, any case within your towns which is too difficult for you, then you shall arise and go up to the place which the LORD your God will choose, 9: and coming to the Levitical priests, and to the judge who is in office in those days, you shall consult them, and they shall declare to you the decision. 10: Then you shall do according to what they declare to you from that place which the LORD will choose; and you shall be careful to do according to all that they direct you; 11: according to the instructions which they give you, and according to the decision which they pronounce to you, you shall do; you shall not turn aside from the verdict which they declare to you, either to the right hand or to the left. 12: The man who acts presumptuously, by not obeying the priest who stands to minister there before the LORD your God, or the judge, that man shall die; so you shall purge the evil from Israel.Read More

Deuteronomy Chapter 19

15: "A single witness shall not prevail against a man for any crime or for any wrong in connection with any offense that he has committed; only on the evidence of two witnesses, or of three witnesses, shall a charge be sustained.Read More

2 Chronicles Chapter 19 6: and said to the judges, "Consider what you do, for you judge not for man but for the LORD; he is with you in giving judgment. 7: Now then, let the fear of the LORD be upon you; take heed what you do, for there is no perversion of justice with the LORD our God, or partiality, or taking bribes." 8: Moreover in Jerusalem Jehosh'aphat appointed certain Levites and priests and heads of families of Israel, to give judgment for the LORD and to decide disputed cases. They had their seat at Jerusalem. 9: And he charged them: "Thus you shall do in the fear of the LORD, in faithfulness, and with your whole heart: 10: whenever a case comes to you from your brethren who live in their cities, concerning bloodshed, law or commandment, statutes or ordinances, then you shall instruct them, that they may not incur guilt before the LORD and wrath may not come upon you and your brethren. Thus you shall do, and you will not incur guilt.Read More

Isaiah Chapter 59

21: "And as for me, this is my covenant with them, says the LORD: my spirit which is upon you, and my words which I have put in your mouth, shall not depart out of your mouth, or out of the mouth of your children, or out of the mouth of your children's children, says the LORD, from this time forth and for evermore."Read More

Jeremiah Chapter 23

1: "Woe to the shepherds who destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture!" says the LORD. 2: Therefore thus says the LORD, the God of Israel, concerning the shepherds who care for my people: "You have scattered my flock, and have driven them away, and you have not attended to them. Behold, I will attend to you for your evil doings, says the LORD. 3: Then I will gather the remnant of my flock out of all the countries where I have driven them, and I will bring them back to their fold, and they shall be fruitful and multiply. 4: I will set shepherds over them who will care for them, and they shall fear no more, nor be dismayed, neither shall any be missing, says the LORD.Read More

Malachi Chapter 2

7: For the lips of a priest should guard knowledge, and men should seek instruction from his mouth, for he is the messenger of the LORD of hosts.Read More

Matthew Chapter 2

23: And he went and dwelt in a city called Nazareth, that what was spoken by the prophets might be fulfilled, "He shall be called a Nazarene."Read More

Matthew Chapter 10

19: When they deliver you up, do not be anxious how you are to speak or what you are to say; for what you are to say will be given to you in that hour; 20: for it is not you who speak, but the Spirit of your Father speaking through you.Read More

Matthew Chapter 23

1: Then said Jesus to the crowds and to his disciples,Read More

Luke Chapter 7

18: The disciples of John told him of all these things. 19: And John, calling to him two of his disciples, sent them to the Lord, saying, "Are you he who is to come, or shall we look for another?" 20: And when the men had come to him, they said, "John the Baptist has sent us to you, saying, `Are you he who is to come, or shall we look for another?'" 21: In that hour he cured many of diseases and plagues and evil spirits, and on many that were blind he bestowed sight. 22: And he answered them, "Go and tell John what you have seen and heard: the blind receive their sight, the lame walk, lepers are cleansed, and the deaf hear, the dead are raised up, the poor have good news preached to them. 23: And blessed is he who takes no offense at me."Read More

Luke Chapter 10

16: "He who hears you hears me, and he who rejects you rejects me, and he who rejects me rejects him who sent me."Read More

Luke Chapter 24

13: That very day two of them were going to a village named Emma'us, about seven miles from Jerusalem, 14: and talking with each other about all these things that had happened. 15: While they were talking and discussing together, Jesus himself drew near and went with them. 16: But their eyes were kept from recognizing him. 17: And he said to them, "What is this conversation which you are holding with each other as you walk?" And they stood still, looking sad. 18: Then one of them, named Cle'opas, answered him, "Are you the only visitor to Jerusalem who does not know the things that have happened there in these days?" 19: And he said to them, "What things?" And they said to him, "Concerning Jesus of Nazareth, who was a prophet mighty in deed and word before God and all the people, 20: and how our chief priests and rulers delivered him up to be condemned to death, and crucified him. 21: But we had hoped that he was the one to redeem Israel. Yes, and besides all this, it is now the third day since this happened. 22: Moreover, some women of our company amazed us. They were at the tomb early in the morning 23: and did not find his body; and they came back saying that they had even seen a vision of angels, who said that he was alive. 24: Some of those who were with us went to the tomb, and found it just as the women had said; but him they did not see." 25: And he said to them, "O foolish men, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken! 26: Was it not necessary that the Christ should suffer these things and enter into his glory?" 27: And beginning with Moses and all the prophets, he interpreted to them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself. 28: So they drew near to the village to which they were going. He appeared to be going further, 29: but they constrained him, saying, "Stay with us, for it is toward evening and the day is now far spent." So he went in to stay with them. 30: When he was at table with them, he took the bread and blessed, and broke it, and gave it to them. 31: And their eyes were opened and they recognized him; and he vanished out of their sight. 32: They said to each other, "Did not our hearts burn within us while he talked to us on the road, while he opened to us the scriptures?" 33: And they rose that same hour and returned to Jerusalem; and they found the eleven gathered together and those who were with them, 34: who said, "The Lord has risen indeed, and has appeared to Simon!" 35: Then they told what had happened on the road, and how he was known to them in the breaking of the bread.Read More

John Chapter 5

39: You search the scriptures, because you think that in them you have eternal life; and it is they that bear witness to me; 40: yet you refuse to come to me that you may have life.Read More

John Chapter 8

17: In your law it is written that the testimony of two men is true;Read More

John Chapter 16

12: "I have yet many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. 13: When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.Read More

John Chapter 21

25: But there are also many other things which Jesus did; were every one of them to be written, I suppose that the world itself could not contain the books that would be written.Read More

Acts Chapter 2

42: And they devoted themselves to the apostles' teaching and fellowship, to the breaking of bread and the prayers.Read More

Acts Chapter 8

30: So Philip ran to him, and heard him reading Isaiah the prophet, and asked, "Do you understand what you are reading?" 31: And he said, "How can I, unless some one guides me?" And he invited Philip to come up and sit with him.Read More

30: So Philip ran to him, and heard him reading Isaiah the prophet, and asked, "Do you understand what you are reading?" 31: And he said, "How can I, unless some one guides me?" And he invited Philip to come up and sit with him.Read More

Acts Chapter 17

10: The brethren immediately sent Paul and Silas away by night to Beroe'a; and when they arrived they went into the Jewish synagogue. 11: Now these Jews were more noble than those in Thessaloni'ca, for they received the word with all eagerness, examining the scriptures daily to see if these things were so. 12: Many of them therefore believed, with not a few Greek women of high standing as well as men.Read More

11: Now these Jews were more noble than those in Thessaloni'ca, for they received the word with all eagerness, examining the scriptures daily to see if these things were so.Read More

Romans Chapter 6

16: Do you not know that if you yield yourselves to any one as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin, which leads to death, or of obedience, which leads to righteousness? 17: But thanks be to God, that you who were once slaves of sin have become obedient from the heart to the standard of teaching to which you were committed,Read More

Romans Chapter 10

14: But how are men to call upon him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without a preacher? 15: And how can men preach unless they are sent? As it is written, "How beautiful are the feet of those who preach good news!"Read More

17: So faith comes from what is heard, and what is heard comes by the preaching of Christ.Read More

1 Corinthians Chapter 2

7: But we impart a secret and hidden wisdom of God, which God decreed before the ages for our glorification. 8: None of the rulers of this age understood this; for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.Read More 12: Now we have received not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit which is from God, that we might understand the gifts bestowed on us by God. 13: And we impart this in words not taught by human wisdom but taught by the Spirit, interpreting spiritual truths to those who possess the Spirit.Read More

12: Now we have received not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit which is from God, that we might understand the gifts bestowed on us by God. 13: And we impart this in words not taught by human wisdom but taught by the Spirit, interpreting spiritual truths to those who possess the Spirit.Read More

1 Corinthians Chapter 11

2: I commend you because you remember me in everything and maintain the traditions even as I have delivered them to you.Read More

27: Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of profaning the body and blood of the Lord. 28: Let a man examine himself, and so eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29: For any one who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment upon himself. 30: That is why many of you are weak and ill, and some have died. 31: But if we judged ourselves truly, we should not be judged. 32: But when we are judged by the Lord, we are chastened so that we may not be condemned along with the world. 33: So then, my brethren, when you come together to eat, wait for one another -- 34: if any one is hungry, let him eat at home -- lest you come together to be condemned. About the other things I will give directions when I come.Read More

1 Corinthians Chapter 14 3: On the other hand, he who prophesies speaks to men for their upbuilding and encouragement and consolation.Read More

1 Corinthians Chapter 15 11: Whether then it was I or they, so we preach and so you believed.Read More

2 Corinthians Chapter 13 1: This is the third time I am coming to you. Any charge must be sustained by the evidence of two or three witnesses.Read More

Galatians Chapter 1 8: But even if we, or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to that which we preached to you, let him be accursed.Read More

Ephesians Chapter 3

3: how the mystery was made known to me by revelation, as I have written briefly. 4: When you read this you can perceive my insight into the mystery of Christ, 5: which was not made known to the sons of men in other generations as it has now been revealed to his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit; 6: that is, how the Gentiles are fellow heirs, members of the same body, and partakers of the promise in Christ Jesus through the gospel. 7: Of this gospel I was made a minister according to the gift of God's grace which was given me by the working of his power. 8: To me, though I am the very least of all the saints, this grace was given, to preach to the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ,Read More

3: how the mystery was made known to me by revelation, as I have written briefly.Read More

8: To me, though I am the very least of all the saints, this grace was given, to preach to the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ,Read More

10: that through the church the manifold wisdom of God might now be made known to the principalities and powers in the heavenly places.Read More

Ephesians Chapter 4

11: And his gifts were that some should be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, some pastors and teachers, 12: to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ, 13: until we all attain to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ; 14: so that we may no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the cunning of men, by their craftiness in deceitful wiles. 15: Rather, speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in every way into him who is the head, into Christ, 16: from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by every joint with which it is supplied, when each part is working properly, makes bodily growth and upbuilds itself in love.Read More

1 Thessalonians Chapter 2

13: And we also thank God constantly for this, that when you received the word of God which you heard from us, you accepted it not as the word of men but as what it really is, the word of God, which is at work in you believers.Read More

2 Thessalonians Chapter 2

5: Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you this? 6: And you know what is restraining him now so that he may be revealed in his time. 7: For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only he who now restrains it will do so until he is out of the way. 8: And then the lawless one will be revealed, and the Lord Jesus will slay him with the breath of his mouth and destroy him by his appearing and his coming. 9: The coming of the lawless one by the activity of Satan will be with all power and with pretended signs and wonders, 10: and with all wicked deception for those who are to perish, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. 11: Therefore God sends upon them a strong delusion, to make them believe what is false, 12: so that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness. 13: But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God chose you from the beginning to be saved, through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth. 14: To this he called you through our gospel, so that you may obtain the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. 15: So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter.Read More

5: Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you this?Read More

2 Thessalonians Chapter 3

6: Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from any brother who is living in idleness and not in accord with the tradition that you received from us.Read More

1 Timothy Chapter 3

15: if I am delayed, you may know how one ought to behave in the household of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and bulwark of the truth.Read More

2 Timothy Chapter 2

2: and what you have heard from me before many witnesses entrust to faithful men who will be able to teach others also.Read More

2 Timothy Chapter 3

14: But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have firmly believed, knowing from whom you learned itRead More

14: But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have firmly believed, knowing from whom you learned it 15: and how from childhood you have been acquainted with the sacred writings which are able to instruct you for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. 16: All scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, 17: that the man of God may be complete, equipped for every good work.Read More

Hebrews Chapter 13

17: Obey your leaders and submit to them; for they are keeping watch over your souls, as men who will have to give account. Let them do this joyfully, and not sadly, for that would be of no advantage to you.Read More

James Chapter 1

4: And let steadfastness have its full effect, that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing.Read More

2 Peter Chapter 1

20: First of all you must understand this, that no prophecy of scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation,Read More

2 Peter Chapter 3

1: This is now the second letter that I have written to you, beloved, and in both of them I have aroused your sincere mind by way of reminder; 2: that you should remember the predictions of the holy prophets and the commandment of the Lord and Savior through your apostles. 3: First of all you must understand this, that scoffers will come in the last days with scoffing, following their own passions 4: and saying, "Where is the promise of his coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all things have continued as they were from the beginning of creation." 5: They deliberately ignore this fact, that by the word of God heavens existed long ago, and an earth formed out of water and by means of water, 6: through which the world that then existed was deluged with water and perished. 7: But by the same word the heavens and earth that now exist have been stored up for fire, being kept until the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men. 8: But do not ignore this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 9: The Lord is not slow about his promise as some count slowness, but is forbearing toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance. 10: But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a loud noise, and the elements will be dissolved with fire, and the earth and the works that are upon it will be burned up. 11: Since all these things are thus to be dissolved, what sort of persons ought you to be in lives of holiness and godliness, 12: waiting for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be kindled and dissolved, and the elements will melt with fire! 13: But according to his promise we wait for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells. 14: Therefore, beloved, since you wait for these, be zealous to be found by him without spot or blemish, and at peace. 15: And count the forbearance of our Lord as salvation. So also our beloved brother Paul wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, 16: speaking of this as he does in all his letters. There are some things in them hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other scriptures.Read More 1: This is now the second letter that I have written to you, beloved, and in both of them I have aroused your sincere mind by way of reminder; 2: that you should remember the predictions of the holy prophets and the commandment of the Lord and Savior through your apostles.Read More

1 John Chapter 4 6: We are of God. Whoever knows God listens to us, and he who is not of God does not listen to us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error.Read More 3 John Chapter 1 13: I had much to write to you, but I would rather not write with pen and ink; 14: I hope to see you soon, and we will talk together face to face.Read More

Early Church Fathers

Papias [90-140 AD] Fragments

"Papias [A.D. 120], who is now mentioned by us, affirms that he received the sayings of the apostles from those who accompanied them, and he, moreover, asserts that he heard in person Aristion and the presbyter John. Accordingly, he mentions them frequently by name, and in his writings gives their traditions [concerning Jesus]. . . . [There are] other passages of his in which he relates some miraculous deeds, stating that he acquired the knowledge of them from tradition" (fragment in Eusebius, Church History 3:39 [A.D. 312]).Read More

Irenaeus of Lyons [120-180 AD] Adversus Haereses (Book I, Chapter 10)

"As I said before, the Church, having received this preaching and this faith, although she is disseminated throughout the whole world, yet guarded it, as if she occupied but one house. She likewise believes these things just as if she had but one soul and one and the same heart; and harmoniously she proclaims them and teaches them and hands them down, as if she possessed but one mouth. For, while the languages of the world are diverse, nevertheless, the authority of the tradition is one and the same" (Against Heresies 1:10:2 [A.D. 189]).Read More

Irenaeus of Lyons [120-180 AD] Adversus Haereses (Book II, Chapter 9)

1. That God is the Creator of the world is accepted even by those very persons who in many ways speak against Him, and yet acknowledge Him, styling Him the Creator, and an angel, not to mention that all the Scriptures call out heaven, and no other, as I shall show in the sequel of this work. For the present, however, that proof which is derived from those who allege doctrines opposite to ours, is of itself sufficient -- all men, in fact, consenting to this truth: the ancients on their part preserving with special care, from the tradition of the first-formed man, this persuasion, while they celebrate the praises of one God, the Maker of heaven and earth; others, again, after them, being reminded of this fact by the prophets of God, while the very heathen learned it from creation itself. For even creation reveals Him who formed it, and the very work made suggests Him who made it, and the world manifests Him who ordered it. The Universal Church, moreover, through the whole world, has received this tradition from the apostles.Read More

1. That God is the Creator of the world is accepted even by those very persons who in many ways speak against Him, and yet acknowledge Him, styling Him the Creator, and an angel, not to mention that all the Scriptures call out heaven, and no other, as I shall show in the sequel of this work. For the present, however, that proof which is derived from those who allege doctrines opposite to ours, is of itself sufficient -- all men, in fact, consenting to this truth: the ancients on their part preserving with special care, from the tradition of the first-formed man, this persuasion, while they celebrate the praises of one God, the Maker of heaven and earth; others, again, after them, being reminded of this fact by the prophets of God, while the very heathen learned it from creation itself. For even creation reveals Him who formed it, and the very work made suggests Him who made it, and the world manifests Him who ordered it. The Universal Church, moreover, through the whole world, has received this tradition from the apostles.Read More

Irenaeus of Lyons [120-180 AD] Adversus Haereses (Book III, Chapter 1)

The apostles did not commence to preach the Gospel, or to place anything on record, until they were endowed with the gifts and power of the Holy Spirit. They preached one God alone, maker of heaven and earth.Read More

2. These have all declared to us that there is one God, Creator of heaven and earth, announced by the law and the prophets; and one Christ the Son of God. If any one do not agree to these truths, he despises the companions of the Lord; nay more, he despises Christ Himself the Lord; yea, he despises the Father also, and stands self-condemned, resisting and opposing his own salvation, as is the case with all heretics.Read More

Irenaeus of Lyons [120-180 AD] Adversus Haereses (Book III, Chapter 2)

The heretics follow neither Scripture nor TraditionRead More The heretics follow neither Scripture nor TraditionRead More

The heretics follow neither Scripture nor TraditionRead More

2. But, again, when we refer them to that tradition which originates from the apostles, [and] which is preserved by means of the succession of presbyters in the Churches, they object to tradition, saying that they themselves are wiser not merely than the presbyters, but even than the apostles, because they have discovered the unadulterated truth. For [they maintain] that the apostles intermingled the things of the law with the words of the Saviour; and that not the apostles alone, but even the Lord Himself, spoke as at one time from the Demiurge, at another from the intermediate place, and yet again from the Pleroma, but that they themselves, indubitably, unsulliedly, and purely, have knowledge of the hidden mystery: this is, indeed, to blaspheme their Creator after a most impudent manner! It comes to this, therefore, that these men do now consent neither to Scripture nor to tradition.Read More

2. But, again, when we refer them to that tradition which originates from the apostles, [and] which is preserved by means of the succession of presbyters in the Churches, they object to tradition, saying that they themselves are wiser not merely than the presbyters, but even than the apostles, because they have discovered the unadulterated truth. For [they maintain] that the apostles intermingled the things of the law with the words of the Saviour; and that not the apostles alone, but even the Lord Himself, spoke as at one time from the Demiurge, at another from the intermediate place, and yet again from the Pleroma, but that they themselves, indubitably, unsulliedly, and purely, have knowledge of the hidden mystery: this is, indeed, to blaspheme their Creator after a most impudent manner! It comes to this, therefore, that these men do now consent neither to Scripture nor to tradition.Read More

2. But, again, when we refer them to that tradition which originates from the apostles, [and] which is preserved by means of the succession of presbyters in the Churches, they object to tradition, saying that they themselves are wiser not merely than the presbyters, but even than the apostles, because they have discovered the unadulterated truth. For [they maintain] that the apostles intermingled the things of the law with the words of the Saviour; and that not the apostles alone, but even the Lord Himself, spoke as at one time from the Demiurge, at another from the intermediate place, and yet again from the Pleroma, but that they themselves, indubitably, unsulliedly, and purely, have knowledge of the hidden mystery: this is, indeed, to blaspheme their Creator after a most impudent manner! It comes to this, therefore, that these men do now consent neither to Scripture nor to tradition.Read More

3. Such are the adversaries with whom we have to deal, my very dear friend, endeavouring like slippery serpents to escape at all points. Wherefore they must be opposed at all points, if perchance, by cutting off their retreat, we may succeed in turning them back to the truth. For, though it is not an easy thing for a soul under the influence of error to repent, yet, on the other hand, it is not altogether impossible to escape from error when the truth is brought alongside it.Read More

Irenaeus of Lyons [120-180 AD] Adversus Haereses (Book III, Chapter 3)

A refutation of the heretics, from the fact that, in the various churches, a perpetual succession of bishops was kept upRead More

"It is possible, then, for everyone in every church, who may wish to know the truth, to contemplate the tradition of the apostles which has been made known throughout the whole world. And we are in a position to enumerate those who were instituted bishops by the apostles and their successors to our own times-men who neither knew nor taught anything like these heretics rave about.Read More

"With this church, because of its superior origin, all churches must agree-that is, all the faithful in the whole world-and it is in her that the faithful everywhere have maintained the apostolic tradition" (ibid., 3:3:1–2).Read More

4. But Polycarp also was not only instructed by apostles, and conversed with many who had seen Christ, but was also, by apostles in Asia, appointed bishop of the Church in Smyrna, whom I also saw in my early youth, for he tarried [on earth] a very long time, and, when a very old man, gloriously and most nobly suffering martyrdom, departed this life, having always taught the things which he had learned from the apostles, and which the Church has handed down, and which alone are true. To these things all the Asiatic Churches testify, as do also those men who have succeeded Polycarp down to the present time -- a man who was of much greater weight, and a more stedfast witness of truth, than Valentinus, and Marcion, and the rest of the heretics. He it was who, coming to Rome in the time of Anicetus caused many to turn away from the aforesaid heretics to the Church of God, proclaiming that he had received this one and sole truth from the apostles -- that, namely, which is handed down by the Church. There are also those who heard from him that John, the disciple of the Lord, going to bathe at Ephesus, and perceiving Cerinthus within, rushed out of the bath-house without bathing, exclaiming, "Let us fly, lest even the bath-house fall down, because Cerinthus, the enemy of the truth, is within." And Polycarp himself replied to Marcion, who met him on one occasion, and said, "Dost thou know me?" "I do know thee, the first-born of Satan." Such was the horror which the apostles and their disciples had against holding even verbal communication with any corrupters of the truth; as Paul also says, "A man that is an heretic, after the first and second admonition, reject; knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself." There is also a very powerful Epistle of Polycarp written to the Philippians, from which those who choose to do so, and are anxious about their salvation, can learn the character of his faith, and the preaching of the truth. Then, again, the Church in Ephesus, founded by Paul, and having John remaining among them permanently until the times of Trajan, is a true witness of the tradition of the apostles.Read More

Irenaeus of Lyons [120-180 AD] Adversus Haereses (Book III, Chapter 4)

The truth is to be found nowhere else but in the Catholic Church, the sole depository of apostolical doctrine. Heresies are of recent formation, and cannot trace their origin up to the apostles.Read More "That is why it is surely necessary to avoid them [heretics], while cherishing with the utmost diligence the things pertaining to the Church, and to lay hold of the tradition of truth. . . . What if the apostles had not in fact left writings to us? Would it not be necessary to follow the order of tradition, which was handed down to those to whom they entrusted the churches?" (ibid., 3:4:1).Read More

2. To which course many nations of those barbarians who believe in Christ do assent, having salvation written in their hearts by the Spirit, without paper or ink, and, carefully preserving the ancient tradition, believing in one God, the Creator of heaven and earth, and all things therein, by means of Christ Jesus, the Son of God; who, because of His surpassing love towards His creation, condescended to be born of the virgin, He Himself uniting man through Himself to God, and having suffered under Pontius Pilate, and rising again, and having been received up in splendour, shall come in glory, the Saviour of those who are saved, and the Judge of those who are judged, and sending into eternal fire those who transform the truth, and despise His Father and His advent. Those who, in the absence of written documents, have believed this faith, are barbarians, so far as regards our language; but as regards doctrine, manner, and tenor of life, they are, because of faith, very wise indeed; and they do please God, ordering their conversation in all righteousness, chastity, and wisdom. If any one were to preach to these men the inventions of the heretics, speaking to them in their own language, they would at once stop their ears, and flee as far off as possible, not enduring even to listen to the blasphemous address. Thus, by means of that ancient tradition of the apostles, they do not suffer their mind to conceive anything of the [doctrines suggested by the] portentous language of these teachers, among whom neither Church nor doctrine has ever been established.Read More

Clement of Alexandria [150-215 AD] The Stromata (Book I)

"Well, they preserving the tradition of the blessed doctrine derived directly from the holy apostles, Peter, James, John, and Paul, the sons receiving it from the father (but few were like the fathers), came by God’s will to us also to deposit those ancestral and apostolic seeds. And well I know that they will exult; I do not mean delighted with this tribute, but solely on account of the preservation of the truth, according as they delivered it. For such a sketch as this, will, I think, be agreeable to a soul desirous of preserving from loss the blessed tradition" (Miscellanies 1:1 [A.D. 208]).Read More

The Stoics also, whom he mentions too, say not well that the Deity, being a body, pervades the vilest matter. He calls the jugglery of logic "the tradition of men." Wherefore also he adds, virtue is no lover of boys," says the philosopher Plato. And our struggle, accOrding to Gorgias Leontinus, requires two virtues -- boldness and wisdom, -- boldness to undergo danger, and wisdom to understand the enigma. For the Word, like the Olympian proclamation, calls him who is wiring, and crowns him who is able to continue unmoved as far as the truth is concerned. And, in truth, the Word does not wish him who has believed to be idle. For He says, "Seek, and ye shall find." But seeking ends in finding, driving out the empty trifling, and approving of the contemplation which confirms our faith. "And this I say, lest any man beguile you with enticing words,'' says the apostle, evidently as having learned to distinguish what was said by him, and as being taught to meet objections. "As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk in Him, rooted and built up in Him, and stablished in the faith." Now persuasion is [the means of] being established in the faith. "Beware lest any man spoil you of faith in Christ by philosophy and vain deceit," which does away with providence, "after the tradition of men;" for the philosophy which is in accordance with divine tradition establishes and confirms providence, which, being done away with, the economy of the Saviour appears a myth, while we are influenced "after the elements of the world, and not after Christ." For the teaching which is agreeable to Christ deifies the Creator, and traces providence in particular events, and knows the nature of the elements to be capable of change and production, and teaches that we ought to aim at rising up to the power which assimilates to God, and to prefer the dispensation as holding the first rank and superior to all training.Read More

Clement of Alexandria [150-215 AD] The Stromata (Book VI) If; then, we assert that Christ Himself is Wisdom, and that it was His working which showed itself in the prophets, by which the gnostic tradition may be learned, as He Himself taught the apostles during His presence; then it follows that the grinds, which is the knowledge and apprehension of things present, future, and past, which is sure and reliable, as being imparted and revealed by the Son of God, is wisdom.Read More

The liars, then, in reality are not those who for the sake of the scheme of salvation conform, nor those who err in minute points, but those who are wrong in essentials, and reject the Lord and as far as in them lies deprive the Lord of the true teaching; who do not quote or deliver the Scriptures in a manner worthy of God and of the Lord; for the deposit rendered to God, according to the teaching of the Lord by His apostles, is the understanding and the practice of the godly tradition. "And what ye hear in the ear " -- that is, in a hidden manner, and in a mystery (for such things are figuratively said to be spoken in the ear) -- "proclaim," He says, "on the housetops," understanding them sublimely, and delivering them in a lofty strain, and according to the canon of the truth explaining the Scriptures; for neither prophecy nor the Saviour Himself announced the divine mysteries simply so as to be easily apprehended by all and sundry, but express them in parables. The apostles accordingly say of the Lord, that "He spake all things in parables, and without a parable spake He nothing unto them;" and if "all things were made by Him, and without Him was not anything made that was made," consequently also prophecy and the law were by Him, and were spoken by Him in parables. "But all things are right," says the Scripture, observe, according to the ecclesiastical rule, the exposition of the Scriptures explained by Him; and the ecclesiastical rule is the concord and harmony of the law and the prophets in the covenant delivered at the coming of the Lord. Knowledge is then followed by practical wisdom, and practical wisdom by self-control: for it may be said that practical wisdom is divine knowledge, and exists in those who are deified; but that self-control is mortal, and subsists in those who philosophize, and are not yet wise. But if virtue is divine, so is also the knowledge of it; while self-control is a sort of imperfect wisdom which aspires after wisdom, and exerts itself laboriously, and is not contemplative. As certainly righteousness, being human, is, as being a common thing, subordinate to holiness, which subsists through the divine righteousness; for the righteousness of the perfect man does not rest on civil contracts, or on the prohibition of law, but flows from his own spontaneous action and his love to God.Read More

Clement of Alexandria [150-215 AD] The Stromata (Book VII) They say in the traditions that Matthew the apostle constantly said, that "if the neighbour of an elect man sin, the elect man has sinned. For had he conducted himself as the Word prescribes, his neighbour also would have been filled with such reverence for the life he led as not to sin."Read More

Of the heresies, some receive their appellation from a [person's] name, as that which is called after Valentinus, and that after Marcion, and that after Basilides, although they boast of adducing the opinion of Matthew [without truth]; for as the teaching, so also the tradition of the apostles was one. Some take their designation from a place, as the Peratici; some from a nation, as the [heresy] of the Phrygians; some from an action, as that of the Encratites; and some from peculiar dogmas, as that of the Docetae, and that of the Harmatites; and some from suppositions, and from individuals they have honoured, as those called Cainists, and the Ophians; and some from nefarious practices and enormities, as those of the Simonians called Entychites.Read More

Hippolytus [170-236 AD] Against the Heresy of Noetus 17. These testimonies are sufficient for the believing who study truth, and the unbelieving credit no testimony. For the Holy Spirit, indeed, in the person of the apostles, has testified to this, saying, "And who has believed our report?" Therefore let us not prove ourselves unbelieving, lest the word spoken be fulfilled in us. Let us believe then, dear brethren, according to the tradition of the apostles, that God the Word came down from heaven, flesh from her, and assuming also a human, by which I mean a rational soul, and becoming thus all that man is with the exception of sin, He might save fallen man, and confer immortality on men who believe on His name. In all, therefore, the word of truth is demonstrated to us, to wit, that the Father is One, whose word is present (with Him), by whom He made all things; whom also, as we have said above, the Father sent forth in later times for the salvation of men. This (Word) was preached by the law and the prophets as destined to come into the world. And even as He was preached then, in the same manner also did He come and manifest Himself, being by the Virgin and the Holy Spirit made a new man; for in that He had the heavenly (nature) of the Father, as the Word and the earthly (nature), as taking to Himself the flesh from the old Adam by the medium of the Virgin, He now, coming forth into the world, was manifested as God in a body, coming forth too as a perfect man. For it was not in mere appearance or by conversion, but in truth, that He became man.Read More

Hippolytus [170-236 AD] Refutation of All Heresies (Book VIII)

And certain other (heretics), contentious by nature, (and) wholly uniformed as regards knowledge, as well as in their manner more should be kept on the fourteenth day of the first month, according to the commandment of the law, on whatever day (of the week) it should occur. (But in this) they only regard what has been written in the law, that he will be accursed who does not so keep (the commandment) as it is enjoined. They do not, however, attend to this come should kill the real Passover. And this (paschal sacrifice, in its efficacy,) has spread unto the Gentiles, and is discerned by faith, and not now observed in letter (merely). They attend to this one commandment, and do not look unto what has been spoken by the apostle: "For I testify to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to keep the whole law." In other respects, however, these consent to all the traditions delivered to the Church by the Apostles.Read More

Tertullian [160-240 AD] De Corona (The Chaplet) If, for these and other such rules, you insist upon having positive Scripture injunction, you will find none. Tradition will be held forth to you as the originator of them, custom as their strengthener, and faith as their observer. That reason will support tradition, and custom, and faith, you will either yourself perceive, or learn from some one who has. Meanwhile you will believe that there is some reason to which submission is due. I add still one case more, as it will be proper to show you how it was among the ancients also. Among the Jews, so usual is it for their women to have the head veiled, that they may thereby be recognised. I ask in this instance for the law. I put the apostle aside. If Rebecca at once drew down her veil, when in the distance she saw her betrothed, this modesty of a mere private individual could not have made a law, or it will have made it only for those who have the reason which she had. Let virgins alone be veiled, and this when they are coming to be married, and not till they have recognised their destined husband. If Susanna also, who was subjected to unveiling on her trial, furnishes an argument for the veiling of women, I can say here also, the veil was a voluntary thing. She had come accused, ashamed of the disgrace she had brought on herself, properly concealing her beauty, even because now she feared to please. But I should not suppose that, when it was her aim to please, she took walks with a veil on in her husband's avenue. Grant, now, that she was always veiled. In this particular case, too, or, in fact, in that of any other, I demand the dress-law. If I nowhere find a law, it follows that tradition has given the fashion in question to custom, to find subsequently (its authorization in) the apostle's sanction, from the true interpretation of reason. This instances, therefore, will make it sufficiently plain that you can vindicate the keeping of even unwritten tradition established by custom; the proper witness for tradition when demonstrated by long-continued observance. But even in civil matters custom is accepted as law, when positive legal enactment is wanting; and it is the same thing whether it depends on writing or on reason, since reason is, in fact, the basis of law. But, (you say), if reason is the ground of law, all will now henceforth have to be counted law, whoever brings it forward, which shall have reason as its ground. Or do you think that every believer is entitled to originate and establish a law, if only it be such as is agreeable to God, as is helpful to discipline, as promotes salvation, when the Lord says, "But why do you not even of your own selves judge what is right?" And not merely in regard to a judicial sentence, but in regard to every decision in matters we are called on to consider, the apostle also says, "If of anything you are ignorant, God shall reveal it unto you;" he himself, too, being accustomed to afford counsel though he had not the command of the Lord, and to dictate of himself as possessing the Spirit of God who guides into all truth. Therefore his advice has, by the warrant of divine reason, become equivalent to nothing less than a divine command. Earnestly now inquire of this teacher, keeping intact your regard for tradition, from whomsoever it originally sprang; nor have regard to the author, but to the authority, and especially that of custom itself, which on this very account we should revere, that we may not want an interpreter; so that if reason too is God's gift, you may then learn, not whether custom has to be followed by you, but why.Read More Tertullian [160-240 AD] The Prescription Against Heretics CHAPTER 21 All doctrine true which comes through the Church from the apostles, who were taught by God through Christ. All opinion which has no such divine origin and apostolic tradition to show, is ipso facto false.Read More CHAPTER 21 All doctrine true which comes through the Church from the apostles, who were taught by God through Christ. All opinion which has no such divine origin and apostolic tradition to show, is ipso facto false.Read More From this, therefore, do we draw up our rule. Since the Lord Jesus Christ sent the apostles to preach, (our rule is) that no others ought to be received as preachers than those whom Christ appointed; for "no man knoweth the Father save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal Him." Nor does the Son seem to have revealed Him to any other than the apostles, whom He sent forth to preach--that, of course, which He revealed to them. Now, what that was which they preached--in other words, what it was which Christ revealed to them--can, as I must here likewise prescribe, properly be proved in no other way than by those very churches which the apostles rounded in person, by declaring the gospel to them directly themselves, both rivet race, as the phrase is, and subsequently by their epistles. If, then, these things are so, it is in the same degree manifest that all doctrine which agrees with the apostolic churches--those moulds and original sources of the faith must be reckoned for truth, as undoubtedly containing that which the (said) churches received from the apostles, the apostles from Christ, Christ from God. Whereas all doctrine must be prejudged as false which savours of contrariety to the truth of the churches and apostles of Christ and God. It remains, then, that we demonstrate whether this doctrine of ours, of which we have now given the rule, has its origin in the tradition of the apostles, and whether all other doctrines do not ipso facto proceed from falsehood. We hold communion with the apostolic churches because our doctrine is in no respect different from theirs. This is our witness of truth.Read More

Tertullian [160-240 AD] Against Marcion, Book IV Such are the summary arguments which we use, when we take up arms against heretics for the faith of the gospel, maintaining both that order of periods, which rules that a late date is the mark of forgers, and that authority of churches which lends support to the tradition of the apostles; because truth must needs precede the forgery, and proceed straight from those by whom it has been handed on.Read More

Such are the summary arguments which we use, when we take up arms against heretics for the faith of the gospel, maintaining both that order of periods, which rules that a late date is the mark of forgers, and that authority of churches which lends support to the tradition of the apostles; because truth must needs precede the forgery, and proceed straight from those by whom it has been handed on.Read More Tertullian [160-240 AD] Against Marcion, Book V We have it on the true tradition of the Church, that this epistle was sent to the Ephesians, not to the Laodiceans. Marcion, however, was very desirous of giving it the new rifle (of Laodicean), as if he were extremely accurate in investigating such a point. But of what consequence are the titles, since in writing to a certain church the apostle did in fact write to all? It is certain that, whoever they were to whom he wrote, he declared Him to be God in Christ with whom all things agree which are predicted. Now, to what god will most suitably belong all those things which relate to "that good pleasure, which God hath purposed in the mystery of His will, that in the dispensation of the fulness of times He might recapitulate" (if I may so say, according to the exact meaning of the Greek word) "all things in Christ, both which are in heaven and which are on earth," but to Him whose are all things from their beginning, yea the beginning itself too; from whom issue the times and the dispensation of the fulness of times, according to which all things up to the very first are gathered up in Christ? What beginning, however, has the other god; that is to say, how can anything proceed from him, who has no work to show? And if there be no beginning, how can there be times? If no times, what fulness of times can there be? And if no fulness, what dispensation? Indeed, what has he ever done on earth, that any long dispensation of times to be fulfilled can be put to his account, for the accomplishment of all things in Christ, even of things in heaven? Nor can we possibly suppose that any things whatever have been at any time done in heaven by any other God than Him by whom, as all men allow, all things have been done on earth. Now, if it is impossible for all these things from the beginning to be reckoned to any other God than the Creator, who will believe that an alien god has recapitulated them in an alien Christ, instead of their own proper Author in His own Christ? If, again, they belong to the Creator, they must needs be separate from the other god; and if separate, then opposed to him. But then how can opposites be gathered together into him by whom they are in short destroyed? Again, what Christ do the following words announce, when the apostle says: "That we should be to the praise of His glory, who first trusted in Christ?" Now who could have first trusted--i.e. previously trusted --in God, before His advent, except the Jews to whom Christ was previously announced, from the beginning? He who was thus foretold, was also foretrusted. Hence the apostle refers the statement to himself, that is, to the Jews, in order that he may draw a distinction with respect to the Gentiles, (when he goes on to say:) "In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel (of your salvation); in whom ye believed, and were sealed with His Holy Spirit of promise." Of what promise? That which was made through Joel: "In the last days will I pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh," that is, on all nations. Therefore the Spirit and the Gospel will be found in the Christ, who was foretrusted, because foretold. Again, "the Father of glory" is He whose Christ, when ascending to heaven, is celebrated as "the King of Glory" in the Psalm: "Who is this King of Glory? the Lord of Hosts, He is the King of Glory." From Him also is besought "the spirit of wisdom,"" at whose disposal is enumerated that sevenfold distribution of the spirit of grace by Isaiah. He likewise will grant "the enlightenment of the eyes of the understanding," who has also enriched our natural eyes with light; to whom, moreover, the blindness of the people is offensive: "And who is blind, but my servants?... yea, the servants of God have become blind." In His gift, too, are "the riches (of the glory) of His inheritance in the saints," who promised such an inheritance in the call of the Gentiles: "Ask of me, and I will give Thee the heathen for Thine inheritance." It was He who "wrought in Christ His mighty power, by raising Him from the dead, and setting Him at His own right hand, and putting all things under His feet"--even the same who said: "Sit Thou on my right hand, until I make Thine enemies Thy footstool." For in another passage the Spirit says to the Father concerning the Son: "Thou hast put all things under His feet." Now, if from all these facts which are found in the Creator there is yet to be deduced another god and another Christ, let us go in quest of the Creator. I suppose, forsooth, we find Him, when he speaks of such as according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, who worketh in the children of disobedience." But Marcion must not here interpret the world as meaning the God of the world? For a creature bears no resemblance to the Creator; the thing made, none to its Maker; the world, none to God. He, moreover, who is the Prince of the power of the ages must not be thought to be called the prince of the power of the air; for He who is chief over the higher powers derives no title from the lower powers, although these, too, may be ascribed to Him. Nor, again, can He possibly seem to be the instigator of that unbelief which He Himself had rather to endure at the hand of the Jews and the Gentiles alike. We may therefore simply conclude that these designations are unsuited to the Creator. There is another being to whom they are more applicable Undoubtedly he who has raised up "children of disobedience" against the Creator Himself ever since he took possession of that "air" of His; even as the prophet makes him say: "I will set my throne above the stars; ... will go up above the clouds; I will be like the Most High." This must mean the devil, whom in another passage (since such will they there have the apostle's meaning to be)we shall recognize in the appellation the god of this world. For he has filled the whole world with the lying pretence of his own divinity. To be sure, if he had not existed, we might then possibly have applied these descriptions to the Creator. But the apostle, too, had lived in Judaism; and when he parenthetically observed of the sins (of that period of his life), "in which also we all had our conversation in times past," he must not be understood to indicate that the Creator was the lord of sinful men, and the prince of this air; but as meaning that in his Judaism he had been one of the children of disobedience, having the devil as his instigator--when he persecuted the church and the Christ of the Creator. Therefore he says: "We also were the children of wrath," but "by nature." Let the heretic, however, not contend that, because the Creator called the Jews children, therefore the Creator is the lord of wrath. For when (the apostle) says," We were by nature the children of wrath," inasmuch as the Jews were not the Creator's children by nature, but by the election of their fathers, he (must have) referred their being children of wrath to nature, and not to the Creator, adding this at lasts" even as others," who, of course, were not children of God. It is manifest that sins, and lusts of the flesh, and unbelief, and anger, are ascribed to the common nature of all mankind, the devil with the implanted germ of sin. "We," says he, "are His workmanship, created in Christ." It is one thing to make (as a workman), another thing to create. But he assigns both to One. Man is the workmanship of the Creator. He therefore who made man (at first), created him also in Christ. As touching the substance of nature, He "made" him; as touching the work of grace, He "created" him. Look also at what follows in connection with these words: "Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called uncircumcision by that which has the name of circumcision in the flesh made by the hand--that at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world." Now, without what God and without what Christ were these Gentiles? Surely, without Him to whom the commonwealth of Israel belonged, and the covenants and the promise. "But now in Christ," says he, "ye who were sometimes far off are made nigh by His blood." From whom were they far off before? From the privileges) whereof he speaks above, even tom the Christ of the Creator, from the commonwealth of Israel, from the covenants, from the hope of the promise, from God Himself. Since this is the case, the Gentiles are consequently now in Christ made nigh to these (blessings), from which they were once far off. But if we are in Christ brought so very nigh to the commonwealth of Israel, which comprises the religion of the divine Creator, and to the covenants and to the promise, yea to their very God Himself, it is quite ridiculous (to suppose that) the Christ of the other god has brought us to this proximity to the Creator from afar. The apostle had in mind that it had been predicted concerning the call of the Gentiles from their distant alienation in words like these: the Creator's righteousness no less than His peace was announced in Christ, as we have often shown already. Therefore he says: "He is our peace, who hath made both one"--that is, the Jewish nation and the Gentile world. What is near, and what was far off now that "the middle wall has been broken down" of their "enmity," (are made one) make the enmity refer to flesh, as if (the apostle spoke) of a carnal enmity, instead of the enmity which was a rival to Christ. And thus you have (as I have said elsewhere) exhibited the stupidity of Pontus, rather than the adroitness of a Marrucinian, for you here deny him flesh to whom in the verse above you allowed blood! Since, however, He has made the law obsolete by His own precepts, even by Himself fulfilling the law (for superfluous is, on a woman to lust after her;" superfluous also is, "Thou shalt do no murder," when He says, "Thou shalt not speak evil of thy neighbour,") it is impossible to make an adversary of the law out of one who so completely promotes it. "For to create in Himself of twain," for He who had made is also the same who creates (just as we have found it stated above: "For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus"), "one new man, making peace"Read More

Origen [185-254 AD] De Principiis (Book IV)

"Although there are many who believe that they themselves hold to the teachings of Christ, there are yet some among them who think differently from their predecessors. The teaching of the Church has indeed been handed down through an order of succession from the apostles and remains in the churches even to the present time. That alone is to be believed as the truth which is in no way at variance with ecclesiastical and apostolic tradition" (The Fundamental Doctrines 1:2 [A.D. 225]).Read More

Origen [185-254 AD] Contra Celsus, Book III

But again, that it is not the fear of external enemies which strengthens our union, is plain from the fact that this cause, by God's will, has already, for a considerable time, ceased to exist. And it is probable that the secure existence, so far as regards the world, enjoyed by believers at present, will come to an end, since those who calumniate Christianity in every way are again attributing the present frequency of rebellion to the multitude of believers, and to their not being persecuted by the authorities as in old times. For we have learned from the Gospel neither to relax our efforts in days of peace, and to give ourselves up to repose, nor, when the world makes war upon us, to become cowards, and apostatize from the love of the God of all things which is in Jesus Christ. And we clearly manifest the illustrious nature of our origin, and do not our first converts a contempt for idols, and images of all kinds, and, besides this, raise their thoughts from the worship of created things instead of God, and elevate them to the universal Creator; dearly showing Him to be the subject of prophecy, both from the predictions regarding Him--of which there are many--and from those traditions which have been carefully investigated by such as are able intelligently to understand the Gospels, and the declarations of the apostles.Read More

Origen [185-254 AD] Commentary on the Gospel of Matthew (Book I)

Concerning the four Gospels which alone are uncontroverted in the Church of God under heaven, I have learned by tradition that the Gospel according to Matthew, who was at one time a publican and afterwards an Apostle of Jesus Christ, was written first; and that he composed it in the Hebrew tongue and published it for the converts from Judaism. The second written was that according to Mark, who wrote it according to the instruction of Peter, who, in his General Epistle, acknowledged him as a son, saying, "The church that is in Babylon, elect together with you, saluteth you; and so doth Mark my son." And third, was that according to Luke, the Gospel commended by Paul, which he composed for the converts from the Gentiles. Last of all, that according to John.Read More

Cyprian of Carthage [200-270 AD] Epistle 75

"[T]he Church is one, and as she is one, cannot be both within and without. For if she is with Novatian, she was not with [Pope] Cornelius. But if she was with Cornelius, who succeeded the bishop Fabian by lawful ordination, and whom, beside the honor of the priesthood the Lord glorified also with martyrdom, Novatian is not in the Church; nor can he be reckoned as a bishop, who, succeeding to no one, and despising the evangelical and apostolic tradition, sprang from himself. For he who has not been ordained in the Church can neither have nor hold to the Church in any way" (Letters 75:3 [A.D. 253]).Read More

Eusebius of Caesarea [265-340 AD] Church History (Book IV) "At that time [A.D. 150] there flourished in the Church Hegesippus, whom we know from what has gone before, and Dionysius, bishop of Corinth, and another bishop, Pinytus of Crete, and besides these, Philip, and Apollinarius, and Melito, and Musanus, and Modestus, and, finally, Irenaeus. From them has come down to us in writing, the sound and orthodox faith received from tradition" (Church History 4:21).Read More

Eusebius of Caesarea [265-340 AD] Church History (Book V) Eleutherus holds the office of bishop. In the same order and succession the tradition in the Church and the preaching of the truth has descended from the apostles unto us."Read More

He speaks, moreover, of a tradition that the Saviour commanded his apostles not to depart from Jerusalem for twelve years. He uses testimonies also from the Revelation of John, and he relates that a dead man had, through the Divine power, been raised by John himself in Ephesus. He also adds other things by which he fully and abundantly exposes the error of the heresy of which we have been speaking.These are the matters recorded by Apollonius.Read More

A QUESTION Of no small importance arose at that time. For the parishes of all Asia, as from an older tradition, held that the fourteenth day of the moon, on which day the Jews were commanded to sacrifice the lamb, should be observed as the feast of the Saviour's passover. It was therefore necessary to end their fast on that day, whatever day of the week it should happen to be. But it was not the custom of the churches in the rest of the world to end it at this time, as they observed the practice which, from apostolic tradition, has prevailed to the present time, of terminating the fast on no other day than on that of the resurrection of our Saviour.Read More

Those in Palestine whom we have recently mentioned, Narcissus and Theophilus, and with them Cassius, bishop of the church of Tyre, and Clarus of the church of Ptolemais, and those who met with them, having stated many things respecting the tradition concerning the passover which had come to them in succession from the apostles, at the close of their writing add these words:Read More

Eusebius of Caesarea [265-340 AD] Church History (Book VI) "Among the four Gospels, which are the only indisputable ones in the Church of God under heaven, I have learned by tradition that the first was written by Matthew, who was once a publican, but afterwards an apostle of Jesus Christ, and it was prepared for the converts from Judaism, and published in the Hebrew language. The second is by Mark, who composed it according to the instructions ofRead More

Athanasius, St [296-373 AD] De Synodis (Part II)

We believe(5), conformably to the evangelical and apostolical tradition, in One God, the Father Almighty, the Framer, and Maker, and Provider of the Universe, from whom are all things.Read More

Athanasius, St [296-373 AD] Letter 2

"Again we write, again keeping to the apostolic traditions, we remind each other when we come together for prayer; and keeping the feast in common, with one mouth we truly give thanks to the Lord. Thus giving thanks unto him, and being followers of the saints, ‘we shall make our praise in the Lord all the day,’ as the psalmist says. So, when we rightly keep the feast, we shall be counted worthy of that joy which is in heaven" (Festal Letters 2:7 [A.D. 330]).Read More

Athanasius, St [296-373 AD] Letter 29 "But you are blessed, who by faith are in the Church, dwell upon the foundations of the faith, and have full satisfaction, even the highest degree of faith which remains among you unshaken. For it has come down to you from apostolic tradition, and frequently accursed envy has wished to unsettle it, but has not been able" (ibid., 29).Read More

Basil the Great, St [329-379 AD] De Spiritu Sancto "Of the dogmas and messages preserved in the Church, some we possess from written teaching and others we receive from the tradition of the apostles, handed on to us in mystery. In respect to piety, both are of the same force. No one will contradict any of these, no one, at any rate, who is even moderately versed in matters ecclesiastical. Indeed, were we to try to reject unwritten customs as having no great authority, we would unwittingly injure the gospel in its vitals; or rather, we would reduce [Christian] message to a mere term" (The Holy Spirit 27:66 [A.D. 375]).Read More

John Chrysostom, St [347-407 AD] Homily 47 on the Acts of the Apostles

"[Paul commands,] ‘Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold the traditions which you have been taught, whether by word or by our letter’ [2 Thess. 2:15]. From this it is clear that they did not hand down everything by letter, but there is much also that was not written. Like that which was written, the unwritten too is worthy of belief. So let us regard the tradition of the Church also as worthy of belief. Is it a tradition? Seek no further" (Homilies on Second Thessalonians [A.D. 402]).Read More

Miscellaneous [Unknown] Canons of the Thirteen Holy Fathers (various dates)

"It is needful also to make use of tradition, for not everything can be gotten from sacred Scripture. The holy apostles handed down some things in the scriptures, other things in tradition" (Medicine Chest Against All Heresies 61:6 [A.D. 375]).Read More

Augustine of Hippo, St [354-430 AD] On Baptism, Against the Donatists (Book V)

"[T]he custom [of not rebaptizing converts] . . . may be supposed to have had its origin in apostolic tradition, just as there are many things which are observed by the whole Church, and therefore are fairly held to have been enjoined by the apostles, which yet are not mentioned in their writings" (On Baptism, Against the Donatists 5:23[31] [A.D. 400]).Read More

"But the admonition that he [Cyprian] gives us, ‘that we should go back to the fountain, that is, to apostolic tradition, and thence turn the channel of truth to our times,’ is most excellent, and should be followed without hesitation" (ibid., 5:26[37]).Read More

Augustine of Hippo, St [354-430 AD] Tractate 6 (John 1:32-33)

"But in regard to those observances which we carefully attend and which the whole world keeps, and which derive not from Scripture but from Tradition, we are given to understand that they are recommended and ordained to be kept, either by the apostles themselves or by plenary [ecumenical] councils, the authority of which is quite vital in the Church" (Letter to Januarius [A.D. 400]).Read More

Vincent of Lerins [390-450 AD] Commonitory for the Antiquity and Universality of the Catholic Faith "I received almost always the same answer from all of them-that if I or anyone else wanted to expose the frauds and escape the snares of the heretics who rise up, and to remain intact and in sound faith, it would be necessary, with the help of the Lord, to fortify that faith in a twofold manner: first, of course, by the authority of divine law [Scripture] and then by the tradition of the Catholic Church.Read More

"Thus, because of so many distortions of such various errors, it is highly necessary that the line of prophetic and apostolic interpretation be directed in accord with the norm of the ecclesiastical and Catholic meaning" (The Notebooks [A.D. 434]).Read More

Socrates Scholasticus [379-450 AD] Church History (Book II) In conformity with evangelic and apostolic tradition, we believe in one God the Father Almighty, the Creator and Framer of the universe. And in one Lord Jesus Christ, his Son, God the only-begotten, through whom all things were made: begotten of the Father before all ages, God of God, Whole of Whole, Only of Only, Perfect of Perfect, King of King, Lord of Lord; the living Word, the Wisdom, the Life, the True Light, the Way of Truth, the Resurrection, the Shepherd, the Gate; immutable and inconvertible; the unaltering image of the Divinity, Substance and Power, and Counsel and Glory of the Father; born according as it is declared in the Gospel, and the Word was God, by whom all things were made, and in whom all things subsist: who in the last days came down from above, and was born of the virgin according to the Scriptures; and was made man, the Mediator between God and men, the Apostle of our Faith, and the Prince of Life, as he says, 'I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.' Who suffered on our behalf, and rose again for us on the third day, and ascended into the heavens, and is seated at the right hand of the Father; and will come gain with glory and power to judge the living and the dead. [We believe] also in the Holy Spirit, who is given to believers for their consolation, sanctification, and perfection; even as our Lord Jesus Christ commanded his disciples, saying, the Son, and of the Holy Spirit'; that is to say of the Father who is truly the Father, of the Son who is truly the Son, and of the Holy Spirit who is truly the Holy Spirit, these words not being simply or insignificantly applied, but accurately expressing the proper subsistence, glory, and order, of each of these who are named: so that there are three in person, but one in concordance. Holding therefore this faith in the presence of God and of Christ, we anathematize all heretical and false doctrine. And if any one shall teach contrary to the sound and right faith of the Scriptures, affirming that there is or was a period or an age before the Son of God existed, let him be accursed. And if any one shall say that the Son is a creature as one of the creatures, or that he is offspring as one of the offsprings, and shall not hold each of the aforesaid doctrines as the Divine Scriptures have delivered them to us: or if any one shall teach or preach any other doctrine contrary to that which we have received, let him be accursed. For we truly and unreservedly believe and follow all things handed down to us from the sacred Scriptures by the prophets and apostles.Read More

Socrates Scholasticus [379-450 AD] Church History (Book VI) We must now however make some allusion to the origin of this custom in the church of responsive singing. Ignatius third bishop of Antioch in Syria from the apostle Peter, who also had held intercourse with the apostles themselves, saw a vision of angels hymning in alternate chants the Holy Trinity. Accordingly he introduced the mode of singing he had observed in the vision into the Antiochian church; whence it was transmitted by tradition to all the other churches. Such is the account [we have received] in relation to these responsive hymns.Read More

John of Damascus [676-749 AD] An Exposition of the Orthodox Faith (Book IV)

So, then, in expectation of His coming we worship towards the East. But this tradition of the apostles is unwritten. For much that has been handed down to us by tradition is unwritten.Read More

Moreover that the Apostles handed down much that was unwritten, Paul, the Apostle of the Gentiles, tells us in these words: Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold the traditions which ye have been taught of us, whether by word or by epistle. And to the Corinthians he writes, Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things, and keep the traditions as I have delivered them to you."Read More

12 posted on 12/07/2011 10:17:53 AM PST by johngrace (1 John 4!- declared at every Sunday Mass,Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: Salvation
10. Catholics Don’t Worship Mary And The Saints –

What a list of hogwash.

However, the above one is the most outrageous falsehood as the below quotes document:

ONCE AGAIN,
just a small part of
THE EVIDENCE: .
.
.

Here's the title:

http://www.amazon.com/Ten-Meditations-Mysteries-Rosary-Ferraro/dp/0819801577/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272938246&sr=1-2 .

And it carries the official sanctions of: .

ni•hil ob•stat
n.
1. Roman Catholic Church An attestation by a church censor that a book contains nothing damaging to faith or morals.

2. Official approval, especially of an artistic work.
.

WITH RICHARD CARDINAL CUSHING’S IMPRIMATUR

.
Let me track down the brief portion of quotes upthread . . .
.

Here they are:

.
However, as we've seen through a variety of sources--a pile of them in Ferraro's manual about the Rosary--the Roman Catholic et al/Vatican Edifice disagrees with a lot of the claims of RC's hereon to the contrary. I guess some RC's feel quite comfortable being their own Pope and Magicsterical rolled into one. LOL.
.

p.32
.
[Quixicated emphases below]
.
Mary is crowned Queen of heaven and earth, dispenser of all graces . . .
.

p32
.
4 - She became Queen of Purgatory, where she exercises her power as mediatrix in behalf of these suffering souls.
.

.
5 - She became Queen of us sinners, to assist us through the dangers of this life and to help us in difficulties.
.

.
6 - She became the ruler of hell, that trembles at her slightest gaze and is defeated by her power.
.

.
"Just as a rock extracted from earth will precipitate into the abyss, so will man, left without Mary's help, quickly slide toward hell." --Richard of St Victor
.

p37
.
Sacred Heart of Jesus, Thy kingdom come; Thy kingdom come through Mary! --Partial Indulgence
.

p41
.
"Mary is the tree of life to those who grasp her, and he is happy who hold her fast." --Prov. 3:18
.

p43
.
1 - "Hail Mary, beloved daughter of the Father, Mother of the Divine Son, Spouse of the Holy Spirit, complement of the most august Trinity!"
.
AS THOUGH CREATED MAN COULD ADD ANYTHING TO THE TRINITY! What unmitigated Ashteroth-Mary-Goddess-Cult-Worship UNBiblical blasphemous lunacy!
.

p45
.
6 - To her was granted grace greater than that conferred upon all others, 'that she might vanquish sin in every respect.'
.
[Qx: I guess Christ's vanquishing sin was unnecessary--or ineffectual without Mary's assistance?]
.

p46
.
7 - "Mary is the dawn of God because, just as the dawn marks the end of darkness and the beginning of day, so Mary indicates the end of vices and the beginning of virtue."
.
[Qx: I guess Christ's conquering on The Cross and HIS conquering trip to hell were unncessary? Perhaps Ashteroth-Mary could help Him get His money back on the ticket to hell. /sar]
.

.
9 - God loved Mary so much that He gave her the keys to His heart. 'No one can go to God without Mary drawing him.'
.
.
[Qx: I guess Holy Spirit has been relegated to a 'Walter Mitty' role as spouse of Mary? That's SOME POWER to cancel & take over HOLY SPIRIT'S role to draw men to God!]
.

p47
.
4 - "Mary, trusting in the word of the angel, destroyed the sin Eve committed by trusting in the serpent.'
.
[Qx: Evidently, she beat Christ to the job of vanquishing sin! Or maybe she ordered Him to retire early in the interest of her Ashteroth-Mary !CONTROL! compulsions? /sar]
.

.
5 - "She desired the safety of everyone, went in search of it, and obtained it; it was also through her that this salvation was wrought."
.
.
[QX: What an unnecessary waste of precious Blood and suffering on THE CROSS!!!/sar]
.

p47
10 - "As Noah's Ark saved all the animals that entered it, so Mary saves all the souls that entrust themselves to her care."

.
[Qx: Sounds like Ashteroth-Mary just bumped Jesus to the end of the God-head line-up--in terms of function & usefulness. /sar]

p50
8 - "If she were not so holy as she is, how could God appoint her to be the ladder of Paradise, the advocate of the world, meatrix between HIm and us?"
.
[Qx: Ladder, Super-lap; Super-orbed nurturance of Heavenly milk and goodies; Queen of Heaven; Queen of hell; Ark; Does Ashteroth-Mary also do windows? /sar] .

p50
4 - "By becoming Mother of God, Mary belongs to the order of hypostatic union; hence she participates IN the infinite sanctity of God."

13 posted on 12/07/2011 10:18:32 AM PST by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: Salvation
What a load of ascriptural nonsense.

If Mary or the Saints can "interceed" for us, then Christ's Work on the Cross was obviously left undone, eh? And when Jesus turned to the criminal hanging next to him, on the cross and said, "Today you will be with me in paradise. Your faith has saved you," He was just making it up, right?

Just like John was lying when he said, "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that all who believe in Him shall not perish, but have life everlasting."

Save your tortured mumbledygook for those who truly do not "understand," because among those who do, you're spewing contrived silliness.

I was raised Catholic, through First Communion up to my Confirmation. Then I started really reading the Bible, and found that little-to-none of Catholic dogma was contained in Jesus' teachings, quite the contrary. When Jesus was asked how false teachers could be discerned, His reply was, "By their fruits shall you know them."

Any who deny Christ in any way are of the Enemy. Asking anyone but Christ to be your "intercessor" before God the Father is to explicitly deny the Truth of Jesus Christ.

Knock it off. Christmas is coming.

14 posted on 12/07/2011 10:21:45 AM PST by Gargantua (Men ARE created equal, but 21 years later... you get my point.)
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To: Quix

That is in the context of a Devotional opinion that is not in the catechism. I have to admit it is a nice stanby by the original Q.


15 posted on 12/07/2011 10:26:51 AM PST by johngrace (1 John 4!- declared at every Sunday Mass,Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: Salvation

Great post. Thanks!


16 posted on 12/07/2011 10:29:25 AM PST by karnage
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To: Salvation

Once again, my gratitude for your faithful generosity.


17 posted on 12/07/2011 10:36:45 AM PST by Judith Anne (For rhe sake of His sorrowful passion, have mercy on us, and on the whole world.)
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To: johngrace

That was a huge post. Links are good and may have a better chance of being read. ;-0)


18 posted on 12/07/2011 10:36:59 AM PST by Not gonna take it anymore (Member of the First Church of Christ, I am Catholic)
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To: All; Gargantua
Communion of Saints

Magesterial Quotes

Catechism of the Catholic Church

Note#577 Cf. DS 3839.Read More

Note#465 Ordo Consecrationis Virginum, Praenotanda 1.Read More

Note#467 Cf. CIC, can. 604 Sect. 2.Read More

Note#470 Cf. AG 18; 40.Read More

Note#473 Pius XII, Provida Mater; cf. PC 11.Read More

THE PROFESSION OF THE CHRISTIAN FAITHRead More

CHAPTER THREE I BELIEVE IN THE HOLY SPIRITRead More

Note#505 LG 58; cf. Jn 19:26-27.Read More

1036 The affirmations of Sacred Scripture and the teachings of the Church on the subject of hell are a call to the responsibility incumbent upon man to make use of his freedom in view of his eternal destiny. They are at the same time an urgent call to conversion: "Enter by the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is easy, that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard, that leads to life, and those who find it are few." (see note 618) Since we know neither the day nor the hour, we should follow the advice of the Lord and watch constantly so that, when the single course of our earthly life is completed, we may merit to enter with him into the marriage feast and be numbered among the blessed, and not, like the wicked and slothful servants, be ordered to depart into the eternal fire, into the outer darkness where "men will weep and gnash their teeth." (see note 619)Read More

Note#132 Cf. CIC, Can. 882.Read More

1451 Among the penitent's acts contrition occupies first place. Contrition is "sorrow of the soul and detestation for the sin committed, together with the resolution not to sin again." (see note 50)Read More

VIII. THE MINISTER OF THIS SACRAMENTRead More

1461 Since Christ entrusted to his apostles the ministry of reconciliation, (see note 65) bishops who are their successors, and priests, the bishops' collaborators, continue to exercise this ministry. Indeed bishops and priests, by virtue of the sacrament of Holy Orders, have the power to forgive all sins "in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit."Read More

1465 When he celebrates the sacrament of Penance, the priest is fulfilling the ministry of the Good Shepherd who seeks the lost sheep, of the Good Samaritan who binds up wounds, of the Father who awaits the prodigal son and welcomes him on his return, and of the just and impartial judge whose judgment is both just and merciful. The priest is the sign and the instrument of God's merciful love for the sinner.Read More

1506 Christ invites his disciples to follow him by taking up their cross in their turn.. (see note 114) By following him they acquire a new outlook on illness and the sick. Jesus associates them with his own life of poverty and service. He makes them share in his ministry of compassion and healing: "So they went out and preached that men should repent. And they cast out many demons, and anointed with oil many that were sick and healed them.". (see note 115)Read More

1688 The liturgy of the Word during funerals demands very careful preparation because the assembly present for the funeral may include some faithful who rarely attend the liturgy, and friends of the deceased who are not Christians. The homily in particular must "avoid the literary genre of funeral eulogy" (see note 189) and illumine the mystery of Christian death in the light of the risen Christ.Read More

Note#90 Cf. Jn 19:25-27.Read More

Note#26 Byzantine Liturgy, Pentecost Vespers, Troparion.Read More

2832 As leaven in the dough, the newness of the kingdom should make the earth "rise" by the Spirit of Christ. (see note 119) This must be shown by the establishment of justice in personal and social, economic and international relations, without ever forgetting that there are no just structures without people who want to be just.Read More

Supporting Bible Passages

John Chapter 17 11: And now I am no more in the world, but they are in the world, and I am coming to thee. Holy Father, keep them in thy name, which thou hast given me, that they may be one, even as we are one. 12: While I was with them, I kept them in thy name, which thou hast given me; I have guarded them, and none of them is lost but the son of perdition, that the scripture might be fulfilled. 13: But now I am coming to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they may have my joy fulfilled in themselves. 14: I have given them thy word; and the world has hated them because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. 15: I do not pray that thou shouldst take them out of the world, but that thou shouldst keep them from the evil one. 16: They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. 17: Sanctify them in the truth; thy word is truth. 18: As thou didst send me into the world, so I have sent them into the world. 19: And for their sake I consecrate myself, that they also may be consecrated in truth. 20: "I do not pray for these only, but also for those who believe in me through their word, 21: that they may all be one; even as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be in us, so that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.Read More

Acts Chapter 9 1: But Saul, still breathing threats and murder against the disciples of the Lord, went to the high priest 2: and asked him for letters to the synagogues at Damascus, so that if he found any belonging to the Way, men or women, he might bring them bound to Jerusalem. 3: Now as he journeyed he approached Damascus, and suddenly a light from heaven flashed about him. 4: And he fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to him, "Saul, Saul, why do you persecute me?" 5: And he said, "Who are you, Lord?" And he said, "I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting;Read More

Romans Chapter 8

35: Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? 36: As it is written, "For thy sake we are being killed all the day long; we are regarded as sheep to be slaughtered." 37: No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. 38: For I am sure that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, 39: nor height, nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.Read More

Romans Chapter 12

4: For as in one body we have many members, and all the members do not have the same function, 5: so we, though many, are one body in Christ, and individually members one of another. 6: Having gifts that differ according to the grace given to us, let us use them: if prophecy, in proportion to our faith; 7: if service, in our serving; he who teaches, in his teaching; 8: he who exhorts, in his exhortation; he who contributes, in liberality; he who gives aid, with zeal; he who does acts of mercy, with cheerfulness.Read More

1 Corinthians Chapter 10

17: Because there is one bread, we who are many are one body, for we all partake of the one bread.Read More

1 Corinthians Chapter 12

12: For just as the body is one and has many members, and all the members of the body, though many, are one body, so it is with Christ. 13: For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body -- Jews or Greeks, slaves or free -- and all were made to drink of one Spirit. 14: For the body does not consist of one member but of many. 15: If the foot should say, "Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body," that would not make it any less a part of the body. 16: And if the ear should say, "Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body," that would not make it any less a part of the body. 17: If the whole body were an eye, where would be the hearing? If the whole body were an ear, where would be the sense of smell? 18: But as it is, God arranged the organs in the body, each one of them, as he chose. 19: If all were a single organ, where would the body be? 20: As it is, there are many parts, yet one body. 21: The eye cannot say to the hand, "I have no need of you," nor again the head to the feet, "I have no need of you." 22: On the contrary, the parts of the body which seem to be weaker are indispensable, 23: and those parts of the body which we think less honorable we invest with the greater honor, and our unpresentable parts are treated with greater modesty, 24: which our more presentable parts do not require. But God has so composed the body, giving the greater honor to the inferior part, 25: that there may be no discord in the body, but that the members may have the same care for one another. 26: If one member suffers, all suffer together; if one member is honored, all rejoice together. 27: Now you are the body of Christ and individually members of it.Read More

Galatians Chapter 3

28: There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.Read More

Ephesians Chapter 1

22: and he has put all things under his feet and has made him the head over all things for the church, 23: which is his body, the fulness of him who fills all in all.Read More Ephesians Chapter 4

15: Rather, speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in every way into him who is the head, into Christ, 16: from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by every joint with which it is supplied, when each part is working properly, makes bodily growth and upbuilds itself in love.Read More

Colossians Chapter 1

18: He is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning, the first-born from the dead, that in everything he might be pre-eminent.Read More

Colossians Chapter 3

15: And let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in the one body. And be thankful.Read More

Early Church Fathers

Hermas [60-120 AD] The Shepherd of Hermas (Book III, Similitude 5)

"[The Shepherd said:] ‘But those who are weak and slothful in prayer, hesitate to ask anything from the Lord; but the Lord is full of compassion, and gives without fail to all who ask him. But you, [Hermas,] having been strengthened by the holy angel [you saw], and having obtained from him such intercession, and not being slothful, why do not you ask of the Lord understanding, and receive it from him?’" (The Shepherd 3:5:4 [A.D. 80]).Read More

Clement of Alexandria [150-215 AD] The Stromata (Book VII) "In this way is he [the true Christian] always pure for prayer. He also prays in the society of angels, as being already of angelic rank, and he is never out of their holy keeping; and though he pray alone, he has the choir of the saints standing with him [in prayer]" (Miscellanies 7:12 [A.D. 208]).Read More

Origen [185-254 AD] De Principiis (Book IV)

"But not the high priest [Christ] alone prays for those who pray sincerely, but also the angels . . . as also the souls of the saints who have already fallen asleep" (Prayer 11 [A.D. 233]).Read More

Cyprian of Carthage [200-270 AD] Epistle 7

"Let us remember one another in concord and unanimity. Let us on both sides [of death] always pray for one another. Let us relieve burdens and afflictions by mutual love, that if one of us, by the swiftness of divine condescension, shall go hence first, our love may continue in the presence of the Lord, and our prayers for our brethren and sisters not cease in the presence of the Father’s mercy" (Letters 56[60]:5 [A.D. 253]).Read More

Hilary of Poitiers, St [300-367 AD] On the Councils, or the Faith of the Easterns

"To those who wish to stand [in God’s grace], neither the guardianship of saints nor the defenses of angels are wanting" (Commentary on the Psalms 124:5:6 [A.D. 365]).Read More

Ephraim the Syrian, St [306-373 AD] On Admonition and Repentance

"Remember me, you heirs of God, you brethren of Christ; supplicate the Savior earnestly for me, that I may be freed through Christ from him that fights against me day by day" (The Fear at the End of Life [A.D. 370]).Read More

Ephraim the Syrian, St [306-373 AD] The Nisibene Hymns "You victorious martyrs who endured torments gladly for the sake of the God and Savior, you who have boldness of speech toward the Lord himself, you saints, intercede for us who are timid and sinful men, full of sloth, that the grace of Christ may come upon us, and enlighten the hearts of all of us so that we may love him" (Commentary on Mark [A.D. 370]).Read More

Basil the Great, St [329-379 AD] Letter 243

"By the command of your only-begotten Son we communicate with the memory of your saints . . . by whose prayers and supplications have mercy upon us all, and deliver us for the sake of your holy name" (Liturgy of St. Basil [A.D. 373]).Read More

Gregory of Nyssa [325-386 AD] On the Baptism of Christ (Sermon for the Day of Lights)

"[Ephraim], you who are standing at the divine altar [in heaven] . . . bear us all in remembrance, petitioning for us the remission of sins, and the fruition of an everlasting kingdom" (Sermon on Ephraim the Syrian [A.D. 380]).Read More

Gregory Nazianzen, St [325-389 AD] Oration 18 "Yes, I am well assured that [my father’s] intercession is of more avail now than was his instruction in former days, since he is closer to God, now that he has shaken off his bodily fetters, and freed his mind from the clay that obscured it, and holds conversation naked with the nakedness of the prime and purest mind . . . " (ibid., 18:4).Read More

Gregory Nazianzen, St [325-389 AD] Oration 41

"May you [Cyprian] look down from above propitiously upon us, and guide our word and life; and shepherd this sacred flock . . . gladden the Holy Trinity, before which you stand" (Orations 17[24] [A.D. 380]).Read More

John Chrysostom, St [347-407 AD] Homily 8 on Romans "When you perceive that God is chastening you, fly not to his enemies . . . but to his friends, the martyrs, the saints, and those who were pleasing to him, and who have great power [in God]" (Orations 8:6 [A.D. 396]).Read More

John Chrysostom, St [347-407 AD] Homily 26 on Second Corinthians

"He that wears the purple [i.e., a royal man] . . . stands begging of the saints to be his patrons with God, and he that wears a diadem begs the tentmaker [Paul] and the fisherman [Peter] as patrons, even though they be dead" (Homilies on Second Corinthians 26 [A.D. 392]).Read More Methodius [Unknown] Oration Concerning Simeon and Anna "And you also, O honored and venerable Simeon, you earliest host of our holy religion, and teacher of the resurrection of the faithful, do be our patron and advocate with that Savior God, whom you were deemed worthy to receive into your arms. We, together with you, sing our praises to Christ, who has the power of life and death, saying, ‘You are the true Light, proceeding from the true Light; the true God, begotten of the true God’" (ibid.).Read More

Jerome, St [347-420 AD] To Pammachius Against John of Jerusalem

"You say in your book that while we live we are able to pray for each other, but afterwards when we have died, the prayer of no person for another can be heard. . . . But if the apostles and martyrs while still in the body can pray for others, at a time when they ought still be solicitous about themselves, how much more will they do so after their crowns, victories, and triumphs?" (Against Vigilantius 6 [A.D. 406]).Read More

Augustine of Hippo, St [354-430 AD] The City of God (Book VIII)

"A Christian people celebrates together in religious solemnity the memorials of the martyrs, both to encourage their being imitated and so that it can share in their merits and be aided by their prayers" (Against Faustus the Manichean [A.D. 400]).Read More

Augustine of Hippo, St [354-430 AD] The City of God (Book XX)

"Neither are the souls of the pious dead separated from the Church which even now is the kingdom of Christ. Otherwise there would be no remembrance of them at the altar of God in the communication of the Body of Christ" (The City of God 20:9:2 [A.D. 419]).Read More

Augustine of Hippo, St [354-430 AD] The City of God (Book XXII)

"There is an ecclesiastical discipline, as the faithful know, when the names of the martyrs are read aloud in that place at the altar of God, where prayer is not offered for them. Prayer, however, is offered for the dead who are remembered. For it is wrong to pray for a martyr, to whose prayers we ought ourselves be commended" (Sermons 159:1 [A.D. 411]).Read More

Augustine of Hippo, St [354-430 AD] Tractate 84 (John 15:13)

"At the Lord’s table we do not commemorate martyrs in the same way that we do others who rest in peace so as to pray for them, but rather that they may pray for us that we may follow in their footsteps" (Homilies on John 84 [A.D. 416]).Read More

19 posted on 12/07/2011 10:39:49 AM PST by johngrace (1 John 4!- declared at every Sunday Mass,Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: Heart-Rest

Ironically ,modern enemies make us aware how important tradition was to the forming of the canon. Especially those who love the ancient gnostics and tout the Gospel of Thomas denounce the Church for suppressing this and many other heretical books, which for them the “real” truth.


20 posted on 12/07/2011 10:39:59 AM PST by RobbyS (Viva Christus Rex.)
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To: Quix

Oooh, colored fonts, we are so blessed. I see that as usual the posting of color, and bold print, ad nauseum, is still the only way that some can make it seem as if their arguments have merit.


21 posted on 12/07/2011 10:40:45 AM PST by Not gonna take it anymore (Member of the First Church of Christ, I am Catholic)
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To: Not gonna take it anymore
It is from new software. Just single a word then look up by google. I am posting because some of our well intended Indy brethren go to a "william webster' website.

This guy is either dumb or purposely taken the early Church fathers out of context. What ever the intention of this man, he is almost always takes everything out of context from a early church father. I had a book that showed this too. I would read in amazing wonder when this site was shown. Then go back to my early church fathers books.

22 posted on 12/07/2011 10:48:31 AM PST by johngrace (1 John 4!- declared at every Sunday Mass,Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: Gargantua
If Mary or the Saints can "interceed" for us, then Christ's Work on the Cross was obviously left undone, eh?

So you don't pray for others? You don't pray for sick people, or family members, or fellow believers? If you did that would be interceding on their behalf and would meant that Christ's work is then left undone. Is this really what you believe?

23 posted on 12/07/2011 10:53:58 AM PST by cothrige
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To: cothrige

Nicely said! Now if Mary and other Saints HAD to intercede for us, there would be a problem. The fact that souls in Heaven CAN do so really shouldn’t be such a shock, at least not to good God-fearing peoples...With Christmas coming you gave the gift of wisdom; bless ya for it and let’s hope it’s not taken back....


24 posted on 12/07/2011 10:59:36 AM PST by Hegewisch Dupa
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To: Salvation

Woo Hooo!!!!!!!!!

I love this. A very blessed Advent to you!


25 posted on 12/07/2011 11:01:52 AM PST by surroundedbyblue (Live the message of Fatima - pray & do penance!)
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To: Not gonna take it anymore

If anything, the font size, color and repetition just make me speed up and skip to the next post.

Now if they threw in some sparkles and dancing angels, maybe I would be convinced and run from the evils of the Catholic faith after 39 years. </s>


26 posted on 12/07/2011 11:09:50 AM PST by Hoosier Catholic Momma (How long till my Arkansas drawl fades into the twang of southeast Ohio?)
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To: Gargantua
Any who deny Christ in any way are of the Enemy. Asking anyone but Christ to be your "intercessor" before God the Father is to explicitly deny the Truth of Jesus Christ.

Question for you - when Mary made intercession to Jesus for the young couple at the wedding feast at Cana (John 2:1-11), did Jesus know they were out of wine before Mary interceded and told him about it? (The answer, I believe you will agree, is "yes".) However, did that stop Him at that time from allowing Mary's intercession, or make him not act on her request?

If Mary or the Saints can "interceed" for us, then Christ's Work on the Cross was obviously left undone, eh?

Remembering that you weren't even here yet, and hadn't started sinning yet (at the time Christ was crucified), was Christ's Crucifixion appllied to you and your sins yet? In your own system of beliefs, is your own belief/acceptance needed (i.e., your own self-intercession), or does God's work alone cover you in any case, and save you irregardless, without any self-intercession at all on your own part?

Knock it off. Christmas is coming.

Do you know why Christmas is celebrated when it is, and who picked that date? (Hint: "Christ's Mass".) (Have a Blessed Christmas, by the way.)
27 posted on 12/07/2011 11:14:19 AM PST by Heart-Rest (The church is the pillar and bulwark of the truth. (1 Timothy 3:15))
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To: cothrige

I pray to Jesus to intercede for them, as the Bible tells us to. No need to be obstinate and ridiculous. Or is there...?


28 posted on 12/07/2011 11:14:54 AM PST by Gargantua (Men ARE created equal, but 21 years later... you get my point.)
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To: cothrige

Excellent point and example. Thank you and God bless you.


29 posted on 12/07/2011 11:17:33 AM PST by GOP Poet (Time for Bambi and his commie crew to go.)
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Comment #30 Removed by Moderator

To: GOP Poet

LMFFACAO!!!!


31 posted on 12/07/2011 11:26:10 AM PST by Gargantua (Men ARE created equal, but 21 years later... you get my point.)
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To: johngrace; Amityschild; Captain Beyond; Cvengr; DvdMom; firebrand; GiovannaNicoletta; HossB86; ...
I think I understand your perspective, Bro.

However, it doesn't wash, with me.

It's a chronic fall-back rationalization that many RC's use on FR on a long list of doctrinal/dogmatic/behavioral customs etc. within the Vatican system.

It's somewhat akin to the Teaparty saying to OThuga--THAT'S NOT IN THE CONSTITUTION!

What does OThuga care about the Constitution except when he wants to use it for some manipulative, denial ridden purpose.

The facts are that the Ferraro devotional was compiled from TONS of RC stalwarts, leaders, stars, etc. from many hundreds of years worth of increasingly blasphemous Marian idolatry.

That spirit, attitude, meme, mentality, construction on reality has been deeply rooted and growing in the Vatican system for a very long time.

White-washing it; molly-coddling it; excusing it; rationalizing it away just doesn't cut it. It's dishonest.

I don't doubt that many RC's don't think things through far enough to realize that it's dishonest. That doesn't alter the dishonesty of it.

Neither does it wash to claim that's just flowery metaphorical language of no theological consequence beyond providing a warm fuzzy for those seeking to fantasize leaning on Mary's bosom in a great fit of comforting idolatry.

It just doesn't wash.

There's adoration, veneration, WORSHIP wayyyyy beyond anything God's priorities allow for ANYONE other than God the Father, Son and Spirit.

It promotes a list of hideous doctrines fabricated out of thin air from hell that seduce folks away from their proper exclusive focus on Christ in such matters of spiritual life.

I'd prefer to be more warmly mild and charitable toward you in response because I respect your Christianity and trust God with your priorities on such scores. However, the high priority of speaking the truth in Love requires candor on the above.

I wish you God's best this CHRISTmas, nevertheless. And, certainly I care for you deeply.


32 posted on 12/07/2011 11:33:18 AM PST by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: Not gonna take it anymore

Nice dodge of the very incriminating

words

in the examples.


33 posted on 12/07/2011 11:34:49 AM PST by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: Gargantua
Christ was very explicit about how we should pray

Yes, Christ told us to pray the "Our Father". Do you ever say any other prayers than the words of the "Our Father" from the Bible? Or do you just stick to the words Christ explicitly taught others to say in the Bible?

You surely don't mean to question if Jesus died for all our sins, or to imply that He saved only those alive during His brief time on Earth walking as a man?

Of course Christ died for everyone's sins. But do you believe everyone will be saved (contrary to what Jesus said)? Does something else have to be done first on our human side before that salvation is effective for each individual?

You needn't try to question or corner me on this. If you have a sincere question, do what I do. Refer to Jesus' teaching as recorded in the Bible. If you have an insincere question, don't ask it. That vile act urinates on His will for us all.

(My questions are all very sincere. Did you get that last line you used there from the Bible?)
34 posted on 12/07/2011 11:41:26 AM PST by Heart-Rest (The church is the pillar and bulwark of the truth. (1 Timothy 3:15))
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To: Gargantua
I pray to Jesus to intercede for them, as the Bible tells us to. No need to be obstinate and ridiculous. Or is there...?

If a friend of yours is sick, you intercede by praying for them, and this is a virtue and even a Christian duty. Okay, so far so good. But, if the Blessed Virgin prays for that same person that you did, her act is not a virtue. It has now become blasphemy which denies the work of Christ. How do you manage that kind of tortuous reasoning? Do you believe that the saints graduate from virtue and charity?

35 posted on 12/07/2011 11:52:10 AM PST by cothrige
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To: Quix; Not gonna take it anymore
Nice dodge of the very incriminating words in the examples.

There were no incriminating words nor examples to dodge.

36 posted on 12/07/2011 11:52:56 AM PST by GOP Poet (Time for Bambi and his commie crew to go.)
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To: Gargantua

I’ve heard of LMAO, and even LMFAO, but I am wondering what your version LMFFACAO means.


37 posted on 12/07/2011 12:12:49 PM PST by FamiliarFace
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To: GOP Poet; Alamo-Girl; Amityschild; Captain Beyond; Cvengr; DvdMom; firebrand; GiovannaNicoletta; ...
There were no incriminating words nor examples to dodge.

p.32
.
[Quixicated emphases below]
.
Mary is crowned Queen of heaven and earth, dispenser of all graces . . .
.

p32
.
4 - She became Queen of Purgatory, where she exercises her power as mediatrix in behalf of these suffering souls.
.

UNMITIGATED BLASPHEMOUS FARCE, FALSEHOOD.

She has NO power as any sort of special mediatrix. Any such construction on reality is fabricated out of thin air from seductive urgings from hell.

.
5 - She became Queen of us sinners, to assist us through the dangers of this life and to help us in difficulties.
.

UNMITIGATED BLASPHEMOUS FARCE, FALSEHOOD.

She has NOT been assigned any such role. The assertion is UNBiblical and blasphemous. That is HOLY SPIRIT'S ROLE.

.
6 - She became the ruler of hell, that trembles at her slightest gaze and is defeated by her power.
.
UNMITIGATED BLASPHEMOUS FARCE, FALSEHOOD.

Ascribing to her roles, abilities and powers of the God-head is BLASPHEMOUS. There is not a shred of Biblical evidence that she has been given any role over hell to the slightest degree whatsoever.

Having done her task 2033 odd years ago well, I'd think Christ would have insured she had nothing whatsoever to do to bother about hell in the least degree. Sheesh what an idiotic idea.

.
"Just as a rock extracted from earth will precipitate into the abyss, so will man, left without Mary's help, quickly slide toward hell." --Richard of St Victor
.

p37
.
Sacred Heart of Jesus, Thy kingdom come; Thy kingdom come through Mary! --Partial Indulgence
.

UNMITIGATED BLASPHEMOUS FARCE, FALSEHOOD.

Mary has nothing whatsoever to do with the "Sacred Heart of Jesus."

She didn't create it. Christ was BEFORE MARY--HINT!

She is not the gatekeeper on Christ's heart!

She doesn't dispense portions of it for so many toe kisses, indulgences or rosary repetitions. It's not her turf.

p41
.
"Mary is the tree of life to those who grasp her, and he is happy who hold her fast." --Prov. 3:18
.

UNMITIGATED BLASPHEMOUS FARCE, FALSEHOOD.

May God have mercy on such OUTRAGEOUS BLASPHEMY!

First y'all want to pretend that Peter is the Rock though all of Scripture asserts otherwise.

Now y'all pretend that MARY is THE Tree of Life!?

What an outrageously blasphemous farce from the throne room of hell! Words are inadequate to protest sufficiently. Not her turf.

p43
.
1 - "Hail Mary, beloved daughter of the Father, Mother of the Divine Son, Spouse of the Holy Spirit, complement of the most august Trinity!"
.
AS THOUGH CREATED MAN COULD ADD ANYTHING TO THE TRINITY! What unmitigated Ashteroth-Mary-Goddess-Cult-Worship UNBiblical blasphemous lunacy!
.
UNMITIGATED BLASPHEMOUS FARCE, FALSEHOOD.

It's like each additional blasphemy is more OUTRAGEOUS than the one before!

Now y'all have Mary elbowing her way into The Trinity! The only proper response to that assertion in one's group would be sackcloth and ashes in REPENTANCE for daring to imagine or think such a thing! And instead of hiding in shame over such, y'all parade it and exalt over such hideousness.

And worse, y'all seem to think GOD APPROVES of such idolatrous blasphemy! It boggles my mind. What rubberized 'Bibles' and history texts has hell seduced y'all with? Sheesh!

p45
.
6 - To her was granted grace greater than that conferred upon all others, 'that she might vanquish sin in every respect.'
.
[Qx: I guess Christ's vanquishing sin was unnecessary--or ineffectual without Mary's assistance?]
.

UNMITIGATED BLASPHEMOUS FARCE, FALSEHOOD.

May God have mercy on such OUTRAGEOUS BLASPHEMY!

Vanquishes sin in every respect? Take a hike, Christ. Domineering Mummy has taken over your post, position & exclusive role! All the suffering and bloodshed was for naught. All ya needed was Magnificent Magical Mummy to carry the ball and win the day! /sarc

Again, words are inadequate to protest with.

p46
.
7 - "Mary is the dawn of God because, just as the dawn marks the end of darkness and the beginning of day, so Mary indicates the end of vices and the beginning of virtue."
.
[Qx: I guess Christ's conquering on The Cross and HIS conquering trip to hell were unncessary? Perhaps Ashteroth-Mary could help Him get His money back on the ticket to hell. /sar]
.

.
9 - God loved Mary so much that He gave her the keys to His heart. 'No one can go to God without Mary drawing him.'
.
.
[Qx: I guess Holy Spirit has been relegated to a 'Walter Mitty' role as spouse of Mary? That's SOME POWER to cancel & take over HOLY SPIRIT'S role to draw men to God!]
.

UNMITIGATED BLASPHEMOUS FARCE, FALSEHOOD.

May God have mercy on such OUTRAGEOUS BLASPHEMY!

Again words are inadequate to even scream in protest.

HOLY SPIRIT'S EXCLUSIVE ROLE IS DRAWING INDIVIDUALS TO GOD.

God made abundantly clear that speaking against The Father or the Son could be forgiven but not speaking against Holy Spirit.

And the above is FAR FAR FAR WORSE than speaking against Holy Spirit--it is utterly displacing Him.

What abject horrific hideousness from hell.

p47
.
4 - "Mary, trusting in the word of the angel, destroyed the sin Eve committed by trusting in the serpent.'
.
[Qx: Evidently, she beat Christ to the job of vanquishing sin! Or maybe she ordered Him to retire early in the interest of her Ashteroth-Mary !CONTROL! compulsions? /sar]
.

UNMITIGATED BLASPHEMOUS FARCE, FALSEHOOD.

May God have mercy on such OUTRAGEOUS BLASPHEMY!

Mary did not destroy a sub atomic particle's worth of sin. Not her turf. NO ONE ELBOWS CHRIST OUT OF HIS ROLE. NO ONE. AND LEAST OF ALL ANY CREATED BEING. What idiocy!

.
5 - "She desired the safety of everyone, went in search of it, and obtained it; it was also through her that this salvation was wrought."
.
.
[QX: What an unnecessary waste of precious Blood and suffering on THE CROSS!!!/sar]
.

UNMITIGATED BLASPHEMOUS FARCE, FALSEHOOD.

May God have mercy on such OUTRAGEOUS BLASPHEMY!

NO SALVATION WAS WROUGHT THROUGH MARY WHATSOEVER. Not her turf--ever. She had a narrowly defined role and filled it well. Fini.

She also did not choose self-aggrandizing spiritual adventures to go gallavanting off achieving on her own or otherwise. She is filling precisely and only the Heavenly role GOD HAS ASSIGNED to her. Multiple reports describe that as teaching aborted babies/children the ways of God. Period.

p47
10 - "As Noah's Ark saved all the animals that entered it, so Mary saves all the souls that entrust themselves to her care."

.
[Qx: Sounds like Ashteroth-Mary just bumped Jesus to the end of the God-head line-up--in terms of function & usefulness. /sar]

p50
8 - "If she were not so holy as she is, how could God appoint her to be the ladder of Paradise, the advocate of the world, meatrix between HIm and us?"
.
[Qx: Ladder, Super-lap; Super-orbed nurturance of Heavenly milk and goodies; Queen of Heaven; Queen of hell; Ark; Does Ashteroth-Mary also do windows? /sar] .

UNMITIGATED BLASPHEMOUS FARCE, FALSEHOOD.

May God have mercy on such OUTRAGEOUS BLASPHEMY!

Souls entrusting themselves to her care vs the care of Jesus The Christ are eternally endangering their souls.

p50
4 - "By becoming Mother of God, Mary belongs to the order of hypostatic union; hence she participates IN the infinite sanctity of God."
UNMITIGATED BLASPHEMOUS FARCE, FALSEHOOD.

May God have mercy on such OUTRAGEOUS BLASPHEMY!

OUTRAGEOUS TO THE MAX.

NO CREATED BEING earns such a position. God does NOT share His Glory with any created being in anything remotely like that fashion or degree.

Any mentality that could even fantasize, imagine, dream, hallucinate such nonsense as the above is extremely out of touch with God's priorities, God's character and God's Word.

And all my words above are putting it extremely mildly and gently compared to what's warranted.

38 posted on 12/07/2011 12:55:39 PM PST by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: Quix
A text without a context is a pretext.

I would need to see the book that was printed in 1964 that you mention and read it for myself to see the context of which you are referring. I cannot find this book's content online so I would like to be sure you are stating and quoting things correctly. After all, this is the Internet.

39 posted on 12/07/2011 1:04:23 PM PST by frogjerk (OBAMA NOV 2012 = HORSEMEAT)
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To: Salvation

Thanks for the ping.


40 posted on 12/07/2011 1:20:05 PM PST by Bigg Red (In this Advent season: Prepare ye the way of the Lord.)
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To: frogjerk

I have scanned some of the pages in and posted them before.

Let me see if I can find them.

The thing is a devotional. Those lines are on their own.

Each page has 10 or so lines/quotes of such stuff. They are just that . . . quotes from RC’s of the modern era and back several hundred years or more.


41 posted on 12/07/2011 1:22:27 PM PST by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: RobbyS

That’s an excellent point. If they didn’t have these Church Councils guided by the Holy Spirit, they probably would have just shoved all those other extra-Biblical documents that were floating around back then into the New Testament too. (Like you are saying, the “New Agers” of today are inadvertently highlighting the importance and necessity of those early Church Councils.)


42 posted on 12/07/2011 1:27:28 PM PST by Heart-Rest (The church is the pillar and bulwark of the truth. (1 Timothy 3:15))
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To: cothrige
"...But, if the Blessed Virgin prays for that same person..."

And you call my reasoning "tortured?" Wow.

In case you didn't know it, the "blessed virgin" is dead, and can't pray for anyone. Me praying to God in the Name of Jesus as my "intercessor" is what the Bible tells me to do. Doing so does not make me the intercessor. I'm just one of the faithful following Biblical encouragement.

That your need to so distort clear fact (i.e., asserting that the deceased Mary "prays" for someone because you errantly ask her to) isn't a hint to you about how far off-base you are is the surest sign that you're in the Enemy's wretched grasp, and doing his vile work.

I will pray that the scales be removed from your eyes, and that your hardened heart be quickened to His perfect Word. I will not continue to dialogue with you, thus encouraging your sinful deceitfulness in this manner.

43 posted on 12/07/2011 1:58:46 PM PST by Gargantua (Men ARE created equal, but 21 years later... you get my point.)
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To: frogjerk
Here ya go:

Photobucket
.
TITLE PAGE

.

Photobucket

.
BACK OF TITLE PAGE

Photobucket

.

[SAMPLE PAGE [B]

Photobucket

.

SAMPLE PAGE [C]

44 posted on 12/07/2011 2:08:08 PM PST by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: Quix

http://www.freerepublic.com/~religionmoderator/

From the Religion Moderator’s page:

Remember this:

The demeanor of the poster says more about his own confession than the post says about yours. When he is being rude or mean it drives people away from his confession and towards yours. That is of course if you can resist the urge to meet fire with fire, in which case neither confession is appealing to the lurkers. The poster who “turns the other cheek” wins every single time.
If the other guy is throwing spitwads at you on an “open” thread it probably means he has run out of ammunition. Take it as a backhanded compliment. You won, walk away.

Spiritual maturity is not a prerequisite for posting on the Religion Forum. If the other guy is being childish, be patient with him.

Abusive spammers contribute nothing other than their spam and they don’t last long on Free Republic.


45 posted on 12/07/2011 3:01:04 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Gargantua
In case you didn't know it, the "blessed virgin" is dead, and can't pray for anyone.

Sorry, but soul sleep is not biblical.

Me praying to God in the Name of Jesus as my "intercessor" is what the Bible tells me to do. Doing so does not make me the intercessor. I'm just one of the faithful following Biblical encouragement.

You declared outright that if the Blessed Virgin prays to our Lord for somebody else it is intercession, and so it seems hard to understand how the same thing being done by you isn't. There is no expiration date on Christian charity, and if we are taught to pray for others in this life we will do the same in the next.

That your need to so distort clear fact (i.e., asserting that the deceased Mary "prays" for someone because you errantly ask her to) isn't a hint to you about how far off-base you are is the surest sign that you're in the Enemy's wretched grasp, and doing his vile work.

This is evidence to you that I am doing the Devil's work? That I have faith that God's own people are with him? What a strange faith you have.

I will not continue to dialogue with you, thus encouraging your sinful deceitfulness in this manner.

Well, whatever makes you happy, but I will reply here anyway as it is the proper and respectful thing to do. I won't look for you to do the same. And your false and unchristian judgement of myself in terms of "sinful deceitfulness" weighs strongly against you. The time is short and you should be mindful.

46 posted on 12/07/2011 3:05:53 PM PST by cothrige
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To: Salvation

THANKS for letting me know that y’all were familiar with that.

It’s virtually impossible to tell from y’all’s postings.


47 posted on 12/07/2011 3:08:57 PM PST by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: Quix

I will pray for you, for despite all our trials of education with you, you still diwown the Blessed Virgin Mary.

I feel sorry for you at the moment of your death when you meet Jesus. What will he say to you?

“Go with the goats because you repeatedly disowned my Mother and in so doing you disowned me. Begone.”


48 posted on 12/07/2011 3:14:00 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: liege

Number seven bothers me particularly since it conflates the Spiritual Bride with the man-made institution.


49 posted on 12/07/2011 3:22:07 PM PST by MHGinTN (Some, believing they cannot be deceived, it's impossible to convince them when they're deceived.)
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To: Salvation; netmilsmom; thefrankbaum; Tax-chick; GregB; saradippity; Berlin_Freeper; Litany; ...
Advent series ping.

Not sure how this ties into Advent but totally enjoyed the post!

50 posted on 12/07/2011 3:28:17 PM PST by NYer ("Be kind to every person you meet. For every person is fighting a great battle." St. Ephraim)
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