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Missing the Missalís Mass of Potential (New Translation Comments) [Catholic Caucus]
CE.com ^ | December 16th, 2011 | Louie Verrecchio

Posted on 12/16/2011 7:45:36 PM PST by Salvation

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Some bishops and priests need to grow up -- my opinion.

If, we in the pews are happy, what's to be gained by all this needless discussion.

Bite the bullet and do it! Then thank God, because you will notice a change in yourselves, dear priests.

1 posted on 12/16/2011 7:45:53 PM PST by Salvation
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2 posted on 12/16/2011 8:01:04 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: nickcarraway; NYer; ELS; Pyro7480; livius; ArrogantBustard; Catholicguy; RobbyS; marshmallow; ...

Your comments?


3 posted on 12/16/2011 8:03:08 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

Old joke:

Q: What’s the difference between a liturgist and a terrorist?

A: You can negotiate with a terrorist ...


4 posted on 12/16/2011 8:11:57 PM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: Salvation

Some folks simply need to be informed as to “why” the changes were made.

These translations are “formal”, whereas the prior translations were not.
Previously, they were only intend to “convey the intent”.

These formal translations are richer in meaning and content.

To be better informed, you may be interested in the Magnificat, Roman Missal Companion - $4

>http://www.magnificat.com/romanmissal/roman_missal_companion.asp<


5 posted on 12/16/2011 8:17:36 PM PST by G Larry ("I dream of a day when a man is judged by the content of his Character.")
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To: ArrogantBustard

LOL!


6 posted on 12/16/2011 8:23:48 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: G Larry

Good recommendation.


7 posted on 12/16/2011 8:24:39 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation
It's all gnat droppings in pepper.
The crux of the Mass is the Transubstantiation. We have the privelege of taking in the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus. Who cares if there is an extra word or two and we say "and with your spirit" instead of "and also with you"???

People are fixating on the WRONG THING. I wish people would just let it go. It's like the tax people who change the rules, regulations and forms for paying taxes. I just send the papers to the accountant, pay the taxes and get on with it.
Bells and whistles.

Now, aren't you glad you asked? :o):o)

8 posted on 12/16/2011 8:25:38 PM PST by cloudmountain
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To: Salvation

I noticed the word “consubstantial” last Sunday and was puzzled. Surely this is not an everyday English word. Surely, for something this significant, every word was chosen, discussed and agreed upon before publication.

My mother disagrees. She thinks that the Missal is meant to elevate our vocabulary and words like these are welcome. I love her dearly but disagree.


9 posted on 12/16/2011 8:37:28 PM PST by cicero2k
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To: cloudmountain

You are a riot. Thanks for your comments.


10 posted on 12/16/2011 8:39:17 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: cicero2k

Father Jeremy Driscoll of Mount Angel (close to where I live) gave a talk about the Vox Clara committee that he was on.

Tell your mom that Father Jeremy said we would notice three things.

Higher English register — we are no longer Catholic dummies.

Longer sentences — congruent with the Latin.

A greater adhesion to the Latin — your mom can take out her old 1962 Missal and the prayers are practically the same.

BTw.

Con = with in Latin
substantial = substance in Latin

So the phrase means that Christ (is with) has the same substance as God the Father.


11 posted on 12/16/2011 8:43:03 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: cicero2k

Is consubstantial less understandable than “one in being”? That’s not a phrase I have ever used outside of Mass.

I went over the new prayers with my 6th grade CCD students and we spent a few minutes on that word. I think they understand it now and 10 years from now they won’t remember it any other way.


12 posted on 12/16/2011 8:54:47 PM PST by Straight Vermonter (Posting from deep behind the Maple Curtain)
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To: Salvation
I am a simple woman. There were no altar girls when I grew up and now we women can participate in the Mass by being lectors and Eucharistic ministers. We can also be sacristans. How fortunate we are, I think, to be able to do these things.

Why do so many people cavil at some word changes? I had the chance to go to the Holy Land and we saw the Upper Room where the very first Mass was held. I got to see Calvary, Christ's Tomb...and we heard Mass there too. With those things on my mind WHY would I worry about some simple syntax changes?

Life is TOO SHORT to sweat the small stuff.

Ya know what I mean, jellybean?

13 posted on 12/16/2011 9:09:38 PM PST by cloudmountain
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To: G Larry
These translations are “formal”, whereas the prior translations were not.

Previously, they were only intend to “convey the intent”.

Strictly speaking, the prior translations were intended to obscure and contradict the intent of the liturgy, not convey it. That's why the old hippies are so peeved now. That darned hierarchy in Rome is shoe-horning the meaning of the Mass back into it, undoing all their hard work of softening the Mass and making it meaningless.

Was that Bishop Troutman being referred to? That old heretic should protest the changes by taking a vow of silence. It would be a penance for him, alas, but not for us.

14 posted on 12/16/2011 9:34:31 PM PST by SamuraiScot
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To: Salvation

The worst thing about turning the altar around is that we now get to see the priest’s face, all the time. At first I thought it a good idea. The priest could share with us all what was going on. But it soon the priest became the “star”of the drama. Less about HIM, than him. So like any actor, he couldn’t resist interpreting his role. Deadly if he lacks a compelling personality. Dangerous if he does.


15 posted on 12/16/2011 9:36:18 PM PST by RobbyS
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To: Salvation

“Again HE took the cup, gave it to his disciples...’’ It’s worked for 2,000 years just as Jesus said it, correct? It’s all I ever needed to hear. Why the navel-gazing and endless debate? My memory isn’t always the best at my age but didn’t OUR LORD speak of the ‘’prattling of many tongues ‘’ meaning those who would confuse or distort HIS message? I agree with ‘’cloudmountain’’. ‘’gnat droppings(I like that.)


16 posted on 12/16/2011 9:37:59 PM PST by jmacusa (Political correctness is cultural Marxism. I'm not a Marxist.)
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To: Salvation; cicero2k
Consubstantial is also the key word in the Creed. It is the Latin translation of the Greek word devised by the Council of Nicaea to distinguish the teaching of the Church from that of the archpriest Arius.
It is a technical term, criticized by Arius and his friends because it is not in the Bible. It is a shibboleth. If you say it, you are a Catholic; if you don't, you are an Arian. And if you are an Arian, you do not believe that Jesus was truly God, but a highly exalted creature of God.
17 posted on 12/16/2011 9:44:29 PM PST by RobbyS
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To: jmacusa

It never was a cup it was a chalice.


18 posted on 12/16/2011 9:45:48 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

Ah, hate to disagree with you Salvation but every Mass I go to it’s ‘’cup’’. The definition of the word ‘’chalice’’ is ‘’a drinking cup’’.


19 posted on 12/16/2011 9:52:43 PM PST by jmacusa (Political correctness is cultural Marxism. I'm not a Marxist.)
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To: jmacusa
Remember the line about more accurate to the Latin. The 'cup' that Christ would have used was a two-handled chalice. So they are being true to the history -- higher language -- and Latin accuracy.

 
 

20 posted on 12/16/2011 9:58:46 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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