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Life’s Most Important Choices
GracethruFaith.com ^ | January 7, 2012 | Jack Kelley

Posted on 01/08/2012 7:35:38 AM PST by GiovannaNicoletta

Recently I’ve been asked about witnessing to “unsaved believers” as one writer called them. I usually refer to them as Christians-in-name-only. They call themselves Christians and do some things that make them appear to be Christians. They go to Church, make regular contributions, sign up for volunteer service projects, even teach Sunday School, but they’re not born again. Being born again means you know you’re a sinner in need of a savior. You believe Jesus died for all your sins and have asked Him to be your Savior. According to Jesus, people who are not born again will be denied entrance into the Kingdom (John 3:3) no matter how “good” they’ve been on Earth.

Very few Christians-in-name-only have actually refused to be born again, they just don’t think it’s necessary. They were taught that they’re saved because they were baptized as infants, or because they belong to a certain church or denomination, or because they try to live a good life. They’re relying on what someone has told them instead of learning what the Bible says. With all the necessary resources at their disposal, they’ve staked their eternal destiny on the opinion of someone who might not be saved himself rather than do their own homework.

They’re very difficult to witness to because they don’t think they need it. Someone once said, “There is no greater obstacle to learning the truth than the belief you’ve already learned it.” The only thing we can do, which turns out to be the best thing, is pray that the Holy Spirit will open their hearts to the truth while there’s time.

Two Alternatives

They don’t realize that there are only two alternatives available to mankind. We either choose God or we choose Satan. If we fail to choose God we’re choosing Satan by default. There is neither any middle ground nor is there another alternative. In Ephesians 2:1-5 Paul made God’s perspective on this very clear.

As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient. All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our sinful nature and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature objects of wrath.

But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved.

We evaluate people based on how we think they compare to others, but God’s standards are very different (Isaiah 55:8). Even the good things non-believers do are disgusting to him (Isaiah 64:6) and further the enemy’s cause (Matt. 7:21-23). This is not a benign issue, and it’s not a case where someone can sit on the sidelines and not participate. In God’s sight people who fail to personally accept His pardon for their sins have chosen to align themselves with His enemy and will be treated accordingly. They will have failed to meet His only requirement, and nothing else will suffice.

Then they asked him, “What must we do to do the works God requires?” Jesus answered, “The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent.” (John 6:28-29)

Believing there’s a God is not enough. Neither is believing in God. You must believe God sent His Son to Earth to die for your sins so you could go to Heaven to live with Him.

You can’t experience God in your life but reject the pardon He provided for your sins. Jesus said, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father but through me” (John 14:6). If someone is experiencing God in their life, they’re also feeling the call of the Holy Spirit to come to the Son, and by failing to do so they’re rejecting the Father (John 5:23). The Son is the only way.

And Two More

Most of the people who visit this site have made the choice to accept the Lord’s pardon for our sins and have been born again. Once we’re born again there are two new alternatives to choose from and those are to either live the balance of our life in His will or continue living in our own will (Romans 12:1-2, Ephesians 4:22-24). If we choose to live our life in His will we can bear much fruit for the Kingdom and will receive eternal rewards. If we choose to live in our own will we can do nothing of value for the Kingdom, no matter how good our lives and deeds are perceived to be on Earth (John 15:5). We’ll still be saved and we’ll go in the rapture but we’ll have nothing to show for the time we spent as believers here (1 Cor. 3:10-15).

Most believers make the wrong choice in this regard, and there are several ways to do that. Some continue living their lives the same way they always have. To the casual observer they look just like their unbelieving counterparts, except for an hour or so on Sunday mornings. They’re hiding their light under a bushel.

Others set out to show the world just how good a Christian they are. They take on great challenges and appear to do mighty works, but the focus is always on them, not the Lord. Applying the world’s standards of success to their Christian life they completely miss the point. It’s not what we can do for Him that matters, it’s what we allow Him to do through us.

Still others wrap themselves in a cloak of self righteousness. Like the Pharisees before them they make a great show of living a “good Christian life” while condemning those who don’t, at least in their opinion. They’re known primarily for what they’re against, instead of what they’re for.

None of these choices can result in lives pleasing to the Lord because they’re all self centered instead of being God centered.

Those who choose to live in His will discover that He gives us supernatural strength to accomplish His will. In Romans 12:1-2 we’re told to offer our whole lives as living sacrifices to God as our spiritual act of worship. We’re not to conform any longer to the pattern of this world, but to be transformed by the renewing of our mind. This is how we discover His will for us. Right after that is a list of seven spiritual gifts that strengthen us to accomplish His will. Romans 12:6-8 lists gifts of prophecy, service, teaching, encouraging, giving, leadership, and mercy, and He gives each of us one or more of them.

These are all gifts that bring us great satisfaction as we administer them, so don’t get the idea that living in His will means living a life of deprivation and hardship. John 10:10 says He came so we can have life and have it abundantly. Romans 8:28 says God is working everything together for the good of those who love Him and are called according to His purpose. Psalm 37:4 says when we delight ourselves in the Lord He will give us the desires of our heart. And Phil. 4:4-7 says we’re to rejoice always, to pray about everything and not be anxious about anything. In doing so we can live in a state of peace that surpasses human understanding.

Learning to live in God’s will can be scary at times because we’re used to acting independently. But after we get the hang of it, we find it’s one of the most exhilarating experiences we can have. Blessings come in so many different ways and at the most unexpected times, we’re literally driven to our knees in gratitude time after time. There truly is nothing like it.

What Does It Take?

Living in His will takes a little getting used to but it isn’t as difficult as it sounds. It involves letting the Holy Spirit guide us away from obviously inappropriate behavior, and responding to the Lord’s calls for action. In Micah 6:8 He gave us three basic principles to follow in acting out His will in our lives. They’re the guidelines that keep us from going out of bounds.

He Has Showed you, O man, what is good. And what does the LORD require of you? To act justly and to love mercy and to walk humbly with your God.

When we’re in God’s will, we’ll be acting justly toward everyone, knowing He will never involve us in anything that violates His law. When we’re in God’s will, we’ll love to do things for others that demonstrate His mercy. We’re not called to be agents of His wrath, but to show forth His love. And when we’re in God’s will we’ll always be humble, knowing that whatever good we’re doing is at His prompting and in His strength.

With rare exceptions, God doesn’t suddenly uproot people or put them through a time of discomfort when they offer their life to Him. Neither does He suddenly impose a lot of rules or discipline upon us. After all, our sins are already paid for. Living in His will is mostly a matter of learning to listen for His voice and doing what He says. Like everything else, this becomes easier with practice. It’s important to remember we’re only responsible for making the effort. The results are His responsibility.

He won’t have us start telling others how to live their lives, but He will give us guidance on how to live our own. For example, since His word says to give to every one who asks (Luke 6:30) He may start prompting us to respond generously whenever someone comes to us for help. And since it says to not let the Sun go down on our anger (Ephes 4:26), He’ll prompt us to forgive as we’ve been forgiven.

When you first make the commitment to live in His will, He’ll start with small things to get you used to listening, so if you even think you’ve heard His voice, do what you think He said to do, asking Him for the strength to do it. And what ever happens, don’t take any of the credit for a positive outcome. The Lord gets the credit, you’re just following orders.

As you learn to respond to little promptings, you’ll receive bigger ones. Then one day you’ll realize you’ve gained enough experience at living in the Lord’s will that you no longer have to wonder about whether you’re doing it. You’ll find your actions and his will have become one and the same.

I know we don’t have much time left, but don’t make the mistake of thinking it’s too late. Begin implementing Romans 12:1-2 in your life today and you’ll be amazed at how much the Lord can do with a willing follower, no matter how short the time is. Selah 01-07-12


TOPICS: General Discusssion
KEYWORDS: evil; faith; god; good; grace; salvation; satan; works
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1 posted on 01/08/2012 7:35:41 AM PST by GiovannaNicoletta
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

“We either choose God or we choose Satan”—wrong. G-d created satan, there is no equal status. this is a pagan concept...We have the ability to choose good over evil, as evil is crouching at the door. G-d has allowed us that choice. But do not be deceived, satan has no equal status with the G-d of Abraham, Issach and Jacob.


2 posted on 01/08/2012 8:04:30 AM PST by richardtavor
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To: richardtavor
snip

"Similar titles are found elsewhere in Scripture concerning Satan. Satan is called the "prince of the power of the air" in Ephesians 2:2. He is called the "ruler of this world" in John 12:31. These titles, and many more attributed to Satan throughout Scripture, signify his capabilities. To say, for example, that Satan is the "prince of the power of the air" is to signify that in some way he rules over the world and the people in it."

"This is not to say that he rules the world completely; only God does this. But it does mean that God, in His infinite wisdom, has allowed Satan to operate in this world (within the boundaries God has set for him) and has allowed Satan to operate with an agenda. When the Bible says Satan has power over the world, it must be made clear that God has given him domain over unbelievers alone. Believers are no longer under the rule of Satan (Colossians 1:13). Unbelievers, on the other hand, are caught "in the snare of the devil" (2 Timothy 2:26), lie in the "power of the evil one" (1 John 5:19), and are in bondage to Satan (Ephesians 2:2)."

"So, when the Bible says that Satan is the "god of this world," it is not saying that he has ultimate authority. It is conveying the idea that Satan rules over the unbelieving world in a specific way. In the case of 2 Corinthians 4:4, the unbeliever follows Satan's agenda. According to 2 Corinthians 4:4, the "god of this world has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ." Satan's agenda includes pushing a false philosophy onto the unbelieving world—a false philosophy that blinds the unbeliever from the truth of the Gospel. Satan’s philosophies are the fortresses in which people are imprisoned, needing to be set free and brought captive to Christ in obedience to the truth."

http://www.gotquestions.org/Satan-god-world.html

So, according to God, unbelievers, by virtue of the fact that they have rejected the only Person Who can give them access to the Father, are by default under the dominion of Satan.

Not a pagan concept at all, but a very Biblical one.

3 posted on 01/08/2012 8:13:16 AM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

My priest talked about this choice this morning. It’s about making choices every day; finding a path lighted by Him and staying on it...no matter what happens or who likes it or doesn’t like it.

As he pointed out...it’s not easy nor should it be...but the result is eternal life...in this life made perfect.


4 posted on 01/08/2012 8:13:50 AM PST by kjo
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
He won’t have us start telling others how to live their lives

Isn't that what this article is about?

/johnny

5 posted on 01/08/2012 8:19:41 AM PST by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: JRandomFreeper
I didn't get that impression.

What exactly in the article do you perceive as telling others how to live their lives?

6 posted on 01/08/2012 8:22:27 AM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
What exactly in the article do you perceive as telling others how to live their lives?

Oh.. most every word of it.

Including the suggestion to not tell people how to live their lives.

That was rich with irony.

/johnny

7 posted on 01/08/2012 8:31:57 AM PST by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: JRandomFreeper
Can you give me anything in the article that wasn't backed up with Scripture, i.e. the words of God?

Can you give me something specific where the writer, without referring to what God said, told people how to live their lives?

8 posted on 01/08/2012 8:35:55 AM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta; kjo

Amen.


9 posted on 01/08/2012 8:43:43 AM PST by wizr (If God isn't on your side, who is?)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

Sooooooo? We’re all to accept Jack Kelley’s judgment and interpretation of the Bible? Thanks just the same, but I’ll pass on having a fellow human judge me. God is the author of my salvation - not Jack Kelley.


10 posted on 01/08/2012 10:11:32 AM PST by abclily
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To: abclily

Which of the Scriptures in the article are you disputing?


11 posted on 01/08/2012 10:31:38 AM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

I disputed scripture? When? How? Scripture says that Jack Kelley (or any other human) is the author of my salvation or my judge? Please give the Biblical reference for your claim.


12 posted on 01/08/2012 12:01:31 PM PST by abclily
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To: abclily
You are attempting to claim that Jack Kelley is not "the author of (your) salvation or (your) judge" yet he backed up everything he wrote with Scripture.

So which Sciptures that Jack Kelley used to validate what he wrote are you disputing?

13 posted on 01/08/2012 12:05:39 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

The point that I was making is that a lot of people try to make satan coequal with G-d, and that is a falsehood. Satan only does what G-d allows him to do. He was created as the deceiver, which is what he does. Any power that satan has is given to him by the people that fall under his deception. We are given clear choices between good and evil, but G-d gives us the power to overcome evil. Therefore, it is not a battle against satan, but a sprint towards the G-d of the universe.


14 posted on 01/08/2012 12:32:56 PM PST by richardtavor
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To: richardtavor
Yes, some people do attempt to equate Satan with God, but that wasn't done in this article.

The only way a person has the power to overcome evil is if he has accepted Christ as Savior and has the indwelling of the Holy Spirit to equip him with the strength to overcome evil. A person who is unsaved, who does not know Christ as Savior, is a slave to sin and is in bondage to sin and is not only helpless to overcome sin but can never have the hope of meeting God's standards for righteousness and being acceptable to God on his own, without the covering of the shed blood of Jesus Christ.

So, as the Bible says, the enemy of God and all those who know Him and have a personal relationship with Him is indeed Satan, aka the "god of this age" as the Holy Spirit refers to him.

15 posted on 01/08/2012 12:39:44 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

According to Jesus, people who are not born again will be denied entrance into the Kingdom (John 3:3)

ah, but traditionally, this “born again” was not a warm fuzzy experience but baptism.

These people have been baptized, love Jesus, and chose to live in faith, but because they haven’t had a warm psychological experience, you condemn them? So a passive emotional experience is more important than choosing to follow Jesus?

As for Jesus, in Matthew 25:40 he suggests that actions speak louder than words. And those who say “lord lord” will not enter into his kingdom. Matthew 7:21.”but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.{

You need to read the whole bible, not just spout verses out of context.


16 posted on 01/08/2012 12:49:00 PM PST by LadyDoc
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To: LadyDoc
Ah, but tradition is only acceptable and valid if the tradition agrees with Scripture. Jesus said:

Jesus answered and said to him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God.”/b> (John 3:3)

Jesus said nothing there that baptism saves anyone, and, in fact, there is nothing in Scripture anywhere that even hints that a person has to be baptised in order to be saved.

When tradion contradicts the God-written Scriptures, then the tradition has to be discarded. When tradition aserts that one has to be baptised to be saved, but there is no validating Scripure, then we know that the tradition, while giving those who believe it a warm and fuzzy feeling, is false.

17 posted on 01/08/2012 12:57:54 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: JRandomFreeper
I got the impression it was more about calling believers to be judges of other believers who might not be living the christian life in quite the same way as those who feel they're in a position to judge, feel they should be living their christian life. The scripture "if you believe Jesus is the son of God, then God abides in you, and you in God" really doesn't seem to be quite enough of a divine promise for them, or you, in their opinion. You have to play the game of obedience to authority and conformity to those christians who can't seem to make you understand that they are your betters.

We pretended we were having a wedding, but you wouldn't dance. We pretended we were having a funeral, and you wouldn't cry. How can you be christian believer without dancing to our tune and weeping at our disapproval? At least the stake and the rack don't exist any longer...formerly the final word in the 'who's the real believer now' department.

Love Jesus. Flee His representatives.

18 posted on 01/08/2012 1:06:35 PM PST by AnTiw1
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To: JRandomFreeper
I got the impression it was more about calling believers to be judges of other believers who might not be living the christian life in quite the same way as those who feel they're in a position to judge, feel they should be living their christian life. The scripture "if you believe Jesus is the son of God, then God abides in you, and you in God" really doesn't seem to be quite enough of a divine promise for them, or you, in their opinion. You have to play the game of obedience to authority and conformity to those christians who can't seem to make you understand that they are your betters.

We pretended we were having a wedding, but you wouldn't dance. We pretended we were having a funeral, and you wouldn't cry. How can you be christian believer without dancing to our tune and weeping at our disapproval? At least the stake and the rack don't exist any longer...formerly the final word in the 'who's the real believer now' department.

Love Jesus. Flee His representatives.

19 posted on 01/08/2012 1:07:26 PM PST by AnTiw1
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To: AnTiw1
Flee His representatives.

LOL!! Especially those who teach Biblical truth, right?

20 posted on 01/08/2012 1:13:00 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
God commands me to love, and I reply to Him, it's easier to love some of Your creations at a distance.

Be happy that you show your holiness before others, because their approval is all the reward you'll ever get. I am happy to be spiritually weak, because God's strength is rendered perfect in my weakness. I thank Him wth gratitude, and hope you enjoy your reward.

21 posted on 01/08/2012 1:23:38 PM PST by AnTiw1
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To: AnTiw1
Be happy that you show your holiness before others, because their approval is all the reward you'll ever get. I am happy to be spiritually weak, because God's strength is rendered perfect in my weakness. I thank Him wth gratitude, and hope you enjoy your reward.

Um, yeah. What part of the article wasn't Biblically true?

22 posted on 01/08/2012 1:25:43 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

Now you get it! Congratulations!


23 posted on 01/08/2012 1:41:38 PM PST by abclily
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To: abclily
So you won't openly produce the Scriptures from the article that you don't like and which shoot out of the water your attempt to make the writer some kind of bad guy.

This is what I was expecting. I appreciate you not dragging this out for a hundred posts before we got down to the truth.

24 posted on 01/08/2012 1:45:24 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: richardtavor

You hit the nail on the head. It is pagan.


25 posted on 01/08/2012 1:46:53 PM PST by POWERSBOOTHEFAN (Straight and proud.)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

I’m hardly under Satan’s dominion.


26 posted on 01/08/2012 1:48:36 PM PST by POWERSBOOTHEFAN (Straight and proud.)
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To: POWERSBOOTHEFAN
So you know Christ as Savior!

Praise the Lord!

27 posted on 01/08/2012 1:49:31 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

I don’t think I left anything unsaid. Continue to be right in your own eyes.


28 posted on 01/08/2012 1:52:50 PM PST by AnTiw1
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

So,as a Jew I am a slave to sin?

I used to be a Christian but I will not go back.

I believe in the one true G-d of Torah. He is the only One I need.

No one can die for the sins of another.


29 posted on 01/08/2012 1:53:44 PM PST by POWERSBOOTHEFAN (Straight and proud.)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

No,I do not know Jesus as the savior.

I am a Jew and I will accept no one but G-d.


30 posted on 01/08/2012 1:55:01 PM PST by POWERSBOOTHEFAN (Straight and proud.)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

Jesus plays no part in my life.


31 posted on 01/08/2012 1:57:33 PM PST by POWERSBOOTHEFAN (Straight and proud.)
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To: AnTiw1
No, you couldn't produce anything from the article that contradicts Scripture.

Personal perceptions don't count. Unless you can give an example from the article that is not Biblically correct, you have no case.

32 posted on 01/08/2012 2:09:17 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: POWERSBOOTHEFAN
Can you give me the list of exceptions to the Scripture where God tells us that those who reject His Son are under the dominion of Satan?

I don't recall. Does God say that some are excluded from the truth that He wrote?

33 posted on 01/08/2012 2:11:30 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: POWERSBOOTHEFAN
Were you born a Jew, or did you make the choice to become one?

If you were not born a Jew, but chose to become one, did that involve you rejecting Christ, or did you never really know Him to begin with?

34 posted on 01/08/2012 2:14:45 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: POWERSBOOTHEFAN
Then the Scripture where God tells us that those who have rejected His Son are, by default, under the dominion and control of Satan applies to you, whether you want to hear it or not and whether you like it or not.

Your problem is with God. And you will never win that battle.

35 posted on 01/08/2012 2:17:17 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
You must believe God sent His Son to Earth to die for your sins so you could go to Heaven to live with Him.

Uh, no Jack.

Repentance precedes faith.

We understand faith as

3[2] For our part, the specifics of faith are these: (1) There is one God, the divine Trinity exists within him, and he is the Lord God the Savior Jesus Christ. (2) Believing in him is a faith that saves. (3) We must not do things that are evil - they belong to the Devil and come from the Devil. (4) We must do things that are good - they belong to God and come from God. (5) We must do these things as if we ourselves were doing them, but we must believe that they come from the Lord working with us and through us. The first two points have to do with faith, the second two have to do with goodwill; and the fifth has to do with the partnership between goodwill and faith, the partnership between the Lord and us. (True Christianity ~ Emmanuel Swedenborg)

36 posted on 01/08/2012 3:01:28 PM PST by DaveMSmith (Evil Comes from Falsity, So Share the Truth)
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To: DaveMSmith

Need Scripture to support the assertion.


37 posted on 01/08/2012 3:02:42 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

quit looking in the rear view mirror and focus towards G-d-—you will be ok. The scriptures that you gave all relate to acknowledgment of the battle that we face,, but if we keep our eyes forward, we will be ok. satan is a tool, and has already been defeated.


38 posted on 01/08/2012 3:05:08 PM PST by richardtavor
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To: richardtavor
I am focused on God and yes, Satan was defeated at the Cross, but he is still very active and still deceiving those who don't know Christ as Savior and still leading people into hell.

Your perception of what this article is about could not be more wrong. It is about the necessity of salvation, then after salvation the choice of the saved person to submit his dreams and desires and will to the will and plan of God for his life.

That's all. And yes, the fact that there is only one road to the Father and to salvation and eternal life hits nerves and makes people uncomfortable and angry, but all we have is the road that God has provided.

That is all this article is about.

39 posted on 01/08/2012 3:11:52 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
Matthew 3:2 NKJV
and saying, "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand!"

Matthew 4:17 NKJV
From that time Jesus began to preach and to say, "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand."

Mark 1:15 NKJV
and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel."

Mark 6:12 NKJV
So they went out and preached that people should repent.

Luke 13:3 NKJV
I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish.

Luke 13:5 NKJV
I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish." Luke 16:30 NKJV
And he said, 'No, father Abraham; but if one goes to them from the dead, they will repent.'

Luke 17:4 NKJV
And if he sins against you seven times in a day, and seven times in a day returns to you, saying, 'I repent,' you shall forgive him."

40 posted on 01/08/2012 3:15:24 PM PST by DaveMSmith (Evil Comes from Falsity, So Share the Truth)
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To: AnTiw1
Yep. It's about control and money. Salvation is a gift. This is about marketizing a gift, freely given.

Grand-dad was a preacher man. He worked construction during the week to earn his daily bread. I have pictures of him on a Cat, but none behind a pulpit.

/johnny

41 posted on 01/08/2012 3:15:24 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
"No, you couldn't produce anything from the article that contradicts Scripture. Personal perceptions don't count. Unless you can give an example from the article that is not Biblically correct, you have no case."

I didn't think I had a case, I just thought I was rejecting your control issues...but if I'm defending a case, I guess I'd better get legal help...Good thing Yeshua bar Joseph paid the price to be my defense.

“Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and; behold, a beam is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.”

And

"Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord shall come, who will both bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make known the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise from God."

Wow. A kindly heathen just invited me over to watch a movie and eat dinner. That's cool. Let's see...hang out with heathens, or argue with christian control freaks...heathens...christians...hmmm. Sorry, the free food decided for me. God bless you byeeiieeee.....

42 posted on 01/08/2012 3:18:30 PM PST by AnTiw1
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To: AnTiw1
I just thought I was rejecting your control issues.

I'm definitely going to need an example of my "control issues". Got any evidence to back up the accusation?

Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and; behold, a beam is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.” And "Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord shall come, who will both bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make known the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise from God."

Let's see some proof of your insinuation that anyone is making judgments from both the article and any of my responses.

You know what they say - when you're in a hole, stop digging. So far, you have been able to produce not one bit of support for all of your accusations and assertions.

That kind of wrecks a person's credibility, if you know what I mean.

43 posted on 01/08/2012 3:30:28 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
I'm definitely going to need an example of my "control issues".

There you go.

/johnny

44 posted on 01/08/2012 3:42:05 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: DaveMSmith
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. (Ephesians 2: 8,9)

Repentance is a work that only comes after the gift of faith that is given by God.

None of your Scriptures "prove" that repentance comes before faith. Repentance is a requirement for salvation, but unless a person is given the faith that Jesus can save, then he has no reason to repent.

45 posted on 01/08/2012 3:50:17 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: JRandomFreeper
Yeah, ok.

Your purpose was to hijack the thread and divert attention away from the subject of the article which apparently bothers you and you have failed and been exposed.

It was fun while it lasted though wasn't it? And despite all your efforts, the truth of Scripture still stands.

Except a man be born again, he will not see the kingdom of God. Read it and weep.

46 posted on 01/08/2012 3:55:29 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
Repentance starts the process that we continue to eternity. Born again is regeneration which is also a process - not a one time event. There is always room for improvement and self examination is our willingness to ask for the Lord's help in breaking bad habits.

We don't consider the Epistles canon - they are from the old Catholic church.

47 posted on 01/08/2012 3:58:56 PM PST by DaveMSmith (Evil Comes from Falsity, So Share the Truth)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
you have failed and been exposed.

I'll wait for the final word from on high.

And I'm not big into weeping, renting clothing, and gnashing of teeth.

The universe that God gave me, and the salvation that Jesus gave make me too happy to cringe in front of a preacherman that has control issues. And you do seem to be touchy about that.

/johnny

48 posted on 01/08/2012 4:03:51 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: DaveMSmith
We don't consider the Epistles canon

Well, I don't know who "we" is, but if you're rejecting any Scripture then we have absolutely nothing to discuss. And, by the way, there are many Catholics on this forum who reject anything written by Paul, so why you discard this particular Scripture because it was part of the Catholic church is a mystery.

I have yet to find any authorization given by God to man for man to pick and choose which Scripture is true and which is false. I have to tell you that the fact that you apparently feel that you have the omniscience to throw out any part of God's word puts you in a pretty dangerous position.

At any rate, the Scripture clearly states that salvation comes through the faith given by the grace of God. Repentance is something that comes after a person has received the gift of faith. And there is no Scripture you can find that will contradict that.

49 posted on 01/08/2012 4:08:28 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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To: JRandomFreeper
I'll wait for the final word from on high.

You've already been given the final word. It's called the Holy Bible.

the salvation that Jesus gave make me too happy to cringe in front of a preacherman that has control issues. And you do seem to be touchy about that.

You have produced no evidence and therefore have no credibility. Simple as that.

50 posted on 01/08/2012 4:10:58 PM PST by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking... (2 Peter 3:3))
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