Posted on 01/31/2012 6:49:05 AM PST by marshmallow
An elderly French man is fighting to make a formal break with the Catholic Church, in a case that could have far-reaching effects.
Rene LeBouvier, 71, has taken the church to court over its refusal to let him nullify his baptism after losing his faith in the religion.
Though he was raised in a community where Catholicism dominated every walk of life, Rene changed his views in the 1970s after spending time with 'free thinkers'.
As he didn't believe in God anymore, the pensioner thought it would be more honest to leave the church and wrote to his diocese and asked to be un-baptised in 2000.
Ten years later, LeBouvier wanted to go further.
Paedophile scandals and the pope preaching against condoms in AIDS-racked Africa, helped strengthen LeBouvier's opposition to the religion.
He called the pope's position on Africa "criminal."
Again, he asked the church to strike him from baptism records, but when the priest told him it wasn't possible, he took the church to court.
French law states that citizens have the right to leave organisations if they wish and, last October, a judge in Normandy ruled in his favour.
However, the diocese has since appealed and the case is pending.
(Excerpt) Read more at dailymail.co.uk ...
I guess baptism leaving an “indelible mark” on your soul means nothing to him.
Because the diocese shouldn’t have to play let’s pretend games. Unless they’re more fun let’s pretend games at least
I can do it from here. Uh, you’re unbaptized. There you go Frenchie.
I guess that particular denomination looks at membership the same way the Bloods and Crips do.
Once you’re a member, you’re ALWAYS a member. No outs.
Makes you wonder, no? Insisting on humans nullifying something you’ve stated by your actions is a nullity. Sort of, “Hey, God! I don’t believe in You! Now let me go!”.
Hunh?
The man is asking that he no longer be on record as a baptized Catholic (as is his right for his own reasons) so what’s with the “pretend” comment?
He won at court, he has a right to sever any connections with a particular group and the diocese is insisting no.
Seems pretty straight forward, now doesn’t it?
Europe is going broke, but the French Courts apparently have the time to entertain this nitwit. The extent to which the legal profession will debase itself is amazing. In a sane world the judge would have told him: “go away, the adults have serious matters to consider.”
No one has said he sever ties to any group here.
Well no one said “he sever ties to any group here” because it makes no grammatical sense. However, it’s more germane to add that no one said that the man can’t sever ties with whatever group he wants.
I thought it had to be a Trinitarian baptism. Modalists need not apply.
Well put.
It really demonstrates how angry and hurt he was and is. There's no remedy for him in this world. He's made his choice. Only God can help and mend him.
Isn't that why Catholics don't want Mormons claiming dead Catholics have been baptized into the Mormon church?
Being baptized a Christian doesn’t make you a lifelong anything.
Beginning to sound that way.
This man can be, and I am sure already has been, removed from the parishioner roll. To insist that he be removed from the baptismal record is to foolishly attempt to rewrite history through court order. He was baptized, and no judge can change that without a time machine.
I hope all the people who say they were baptized and formerly Catholics read this thread.
They are still Catholics — you don’t undo a baptism by your own will.
It is a church matter, not a civil matter, since a person is baptism “In the Name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.”
That mark of a Catholic baptism is always with someone and they will have to account for their doings throughout life at the moment of their death.
Not all baptisms in my understanding.
No, he is asking to have his Baptism nullified. There is no process to accomplish this in the Church. A Baptism is an act—once a Baptism is performed, it cannot be unperformed. It is an historic fact.
It can be renounced by an individual, and there was until recently a process to do that, Formal act of defection from the Catholic Church.
I don't see how a governmental agency can require a religious organization to create a new judicial process, let alone falsify a record.
Then why not strike the fellow’s name? Put an X beside it and a note...what’s the big deal if he doesn’t want to be listed as a baptized Catholic anymore?
I wonder if France needs more atheist Catholics or what the reason is that his name can’t be removed or at least noted as no longer Catholic.
Because it would be a lie.
Is that clear enough?
"Want" is irrelevant to the discussion.
On a certain day and at a certain hour, water was poured over him and certain words were said.
The Church record attests to that fact. Nothing will ever change that fact.
I'm sure a lot of people would be interested in this issue. If the record of a baptism could be struck from the record, then why not a marriage? That would be nice wouldn't it?
"Your Honor, I want the Church to formally erase the record of my marriage!"
Uh-huh..........like that's going to happen.
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