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Youtube ^ | Jan 30, 2012 | hockeybuss

Posted on 01/31/2012 9:50:22 AM PST by cuban leaf

I often argue that a huge difference between Islam and Christianity is that Islam is a religion of violence. It actually instructs it's members to enslave or kill non-believers. As it turns out, there is some of that in the teachings of Mormonism as well. Go to the video at link.

TOPICS: Current Events; History; Religion & Politics; Theology
KEYWORDS: massacre; mountainmeadows; romney
It's only 3 minutes long, but if you absolutely, positively have to get to the core issue here, go to 1:30. the incriminating info is right out of Doctrine and Covenants.
1 posted on 01/31/2012 9:50:23 AM PST by cuban leaf
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To: cuban leaf

All I ever needed to know on this particular topic I learned on a visit to Mountain Meadows.

2 posted on 01/31/2012 9:51:47 AM PST by MeganC (No way in Hell am I voting for Mitt Romney. Not now, not ever. Deal with it.)
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To: MeganC

I confess I’ve never been there.

3 posted on 01/31/2012 9:56:01 AM PST by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: cuban leaf

You don’t know your history.

4 posted on 01/31/2012 9:58:00 AM PST by ari-freedom (If SOPA/PIPA passes, we will lose our Free Republic.)
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To: MeganC

Mountain Meadows... the original 9/11.

5 posted on 01/31/2012 9:58:05 AM PST by WhistlingPastTheGraveyard (Some men just want to watch the world burn.)
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To: ari-freedom

—You don’t know your history.—

I have not posted what I do or don’t know about history. I don’t understand your post.

6 posted on 01/31/2012 10:01:34 AM PST by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: ari-freedom

—You don’t know your history.—

Do you know your “D&C”?

7 posted on 01/31/2012 10:06:38 AM PST by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: cuban leaf
Read: Under the Banner of Heaven.
8 posted on 01/31/2012 10:08:52 AM PST by CT (Make Mine Newt)
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To: CT

Looking it up now.

Have you ever read Mormonism, Mama and Me?

9 posted on 01/31/2012 10:12:26 AM PST by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: cuban leaf
I know this, but do need to expand my knowledge on the mormon cult. (I will never use capitol letters for that cult name).

It is very easy to see how Voters will be easily swayed toward an Islam President if Romney wins this one, and the mormons will usher them in.

10 posted on 01/31/2012 10:36:05 AM PST by annieokie
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To: ari-freedom
Stuff it Romney-bot !

The very root of your cult is corrupt as can be. The VERY ROOT ! Guess what, that corrupt root did not bring forth a good trunk, righteous branches or healthy fruit.

You guys can't even decide what bible to use, the KJV your god(s) claimed is corrupt, or the Joseph Smith translation that Brigham young claimed is corrupt !

Your allegations ar no more credible than Harry Reid or Mitt Romney....THE FRUITS OF FLDS/LDS "PROPHET" JOSEPH SMITH'S CORRUPT ROOT !

11 posted on 01/31/2012 10:42:24 AM PST by SENTINEL (Romney is to Conservatism what Mormonism is to Christianity.)
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To: All

Here is all you need to know about Moromonism.

12 posted on 01/31/2012 11:43:42 AM PST by troy McClure
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To: cuban leaf

Here’s what I saw:

(No, I did not take that picture.)

13 posted on 01/31/2012 12:05:22 PM PST by MeganC (No way in Hell am I voting for Mitt Romney. Not now, not ever. Deal with it.)
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To: MeganC

If people today wonder why early Mormonism was so reviled, this is one clue. Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it.

14 posted on 01/31/2012 12:34:46 PM PST by TexasRepublic (Socialism is the gospel of envy and the religion of thieves)
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To: ari-freedom
You don’t know your history.

It is quite bad when folks are IGNORANT of history all right!



On July 4, 1838,  Sidney Rigdon gave an oration, which was characterized by Mormon historian Brigham Henry Roberts as a "'Declaration of Independence' from all mobs and persecutions."[30] The text of this speech was endorsed by Joseph Smith, who appeared at the event and participated in the raising of a liberty pole.[31]

In the speech, Rigdon declared that the Latter Day Saints would no longer be driven from their homes by persecution from without or dissension from within, and that if enemies came again to drive out the Saints, "And that mob that comes on us to disturb us, it shall be between us and them a war of extermination; for we will follow them until the last drop of their blood is spilled; or else they will have to exterminate us, for we will carry the seat of war to their own houses and their own families, and one party or the other shall be utterly destroyed..."[26]


On September 20, 1838, about one hundred fifty armed men rode into De Witt and demanded that the Mormons leave within ten days. Hinkle and other Mormon leaders informed the men that they would fight. The also sent a request for assistance to Governor Boggs, noting that the mob had threatened "to exterminate them, without regard to age or sex."[48]


Missouri Executive Order 44, also known as the "Mormon Extermination Order" was an executive order issued on October 27, 1838 by the governor of Missouri, Lilburn Boggs.



15 posted on 01/31/2012 12:47:19 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: cuban leaf

The Doctrine and Covenants


Section 98

Revelation given through Joseph Smith the Prophet, at Kirtland, Ohio, 6 August 1833 (see History of the Church, 1:403–6). This revelation came in consequence of the persecution upon the Saints in Missouri. It was natural that the Saints in Missouri, having suffered physically and also having lost property, would feel an inclination toward retaliation and revenge. Therefore, the Lord gave this revelation. Although some news of the problems in Missouri had no doubt reached the Prophet in Kirtland (nine hundred miles away), the seriousness of the situation could have been known to him at this date only by revelation.

1–3, The afflictions of the Saints will be for their good; 4–8, The Saints are to befriend the constitutional law of the land; 9–10, Honest, wise, and good men should be supported for secular government; 11–15, Those who lay down their lives in the Lord’s cause will have eternal life; 16–18, Renounce war and proclaim peace; 19–22, The Saints in Kirtland are reproved and commanded to repent; 23–32, The Lord reveals his laws governing the persecutions and afflictions imposed on his people; 33–38, War is justified only when the Lord commands it; 39–48, The Saints are to forgive their enemies, who, if they repent, will also escape the Lord’s vengeance.

1 Verily I say unto you my friends, afear not, let your hearts be comforted; yea, rejoice evermore, and in everything give bthanks;

2 aWaiting patiently on the Lord, for your prayers have entered into the ears of the Lord of Sabaoth, and are recorded with this seal and testament—the Lord hath sworn and decreed that they shall be granted.

3 Therefore, he giveth this promise unto you, with an immutable covenant that they shall be fulfilled; and all things wherewith you have been aafflicted shall work together for your bgood, and to my name’s glory, saith the Lord.

4 And now, verily I say unto you concerning the alaws of the land, it is my will that my people should observe to do all things whatsoever I command them.

5 And that alaw of the land which is bconstitutional, supporting that principle of freedom in maintaining rights and privileges, belongs to all mankind, and is justifiable before me.

6 Therefore, I, the Lord, justify you, and your brethren of my church, in befriending that law which is the aconstitutional law of the land;

7 And as pertaining to law of man, whatsoever is more or less than this, cometh of evil.

8 I, the Lord God, make you afree, therefore ye are free indeed; and the law also maketh you free.

9 Nevertheless, when the awicked brule the people mourn.

10 Wherefore, ahonest men and wise men should be sought for diligently, and good men and wise men ye should observe to uphold; otherwise whatsoever is less than these cometh of evil.

11 And I give unto you a commandment, that ye shall forsake all evil and cleave unto all agood, that ye shall live by every bword which proceedeth forth out of the mouth of God.

12 For he will agive unto the faithful line upon line, precept upon precept; and I will btry you and prove you herewith.

13 And whoso alayeth down his life in my cause, for my name’s sake, shall find it again, even life eternal.

14 Therefore, be not aafraid of your enemies, for I have decreed in my heart, saith the Lord, that I will bprove you in all things, whether you will abide in my covenant, ceven unto death, that you may be found worthy.

15 For if ye will not abide in my covenant ye are not worthy of me.

16 Therefore, arenounce war and proclaim peace, and seek diligently to bturn the hearts of the children to their fathers, and the hearts of the fathers to the children;

17 And again, the hearts of the aJews unto the prophets, and the prophets unto the Jews; lest I come and smite the whole earth with a curse, and all flesh be consumed before me.

18 Let not your hearts be troubled; for in my Father’s house are amany mansions, and I have prepared a place for you; and where my Father and I am, there ye shall be also.

19 Behold, I, the Lord, am not well apleased with many who are in the church at Kirtland;

20 For they do not aforsake their sins, and their wicked ways, the pride of their hearts, and their covetousness, and all their detestable things, and observe the words of wisdom and eternal life which I have given unto them.

21 Verily I say unto you, that I, the Lord, will achasten them and will do whatsoever I list, if they do not repent and observe all things whatsoever I have said unto them.

22 And again I say unto you, if ye observe to ado whatsoever I command you, I, the Lord, will turn away all bwrath and indignation from you, and the cgates of hell shall not prevail against you.

23 Now, I speak unto you concerning your families—if men will asmite you, or your families, once, and ye bbear it patiently and crevile not against them, neither seek drevenge, ye shall be erewarded;

24 But if ye bear it not patiently, it shall be accounted unto you as being ameted out as a just measure unto you.

25 And again, if your enemy shall smite you the second time, and you revile not against your enemy, and bear it patiently, your reward shall be an ahundred fold.

26 And again, if he shall smite you the third time, and ye bear it apatiently, your reward shall be doubled unto you four-fold;

27 And these three atestimonies shall stand against your enemy if he repent not, and shall not be blotted out.

28 And now, verily I say unto you, if that enemy shall escape my vengeance, that he be not brought into judgment before me, then ye shall see to it that ye awarn him in my name, that he come no more upon you, neither upon your family, even your children’s children unto the third and fourth generation.

29 And then, if he shall come upon you or your children, or your children’s children unto the third and fourth generation, I have delivered thine aenemy into thine hands;

30 And then if thou wilt spare him, thou shalt be rewarded for thy arighteousness; and also thy children and thy children’s children unto the third and fourth generation.

31 Nevertheless, thine enemy is in thine hands; and if thou rewardest him according to his works thou art justified; if he has sought thy life, and thy life is endangered by him, thine enemy is in thine hands and thou art justified.

32 Behold, this is the law I gave unto my servant Nephi, and thy afathers, Joseph, and Jacob, and Isaac, and Abraham, and all mine ancient prophets and apostles.

33 And again, this is the alaw that I gave unto mine ancients, that they should not go out unto battle against any nation, kindred, tongue, or people, save I, the Lord, commanded them.

34 And if any nation, tongue, or people should proclaim war against them, they should first lift a standard of apeace unto that people, nation, or tongue;

35 And if that people did not accept the offering of peace, neither the second nor the third time, they should bring these testimonies before the Lord;

36 Then I, the Lord, would give unto them a commandment, and justify them in going out to battle against that nation, tongue, or people.

37 And I, the Lord, would afight their battles, and their children’s battles, and their children’s children’s, until they had avenged themselves on all their enemies, to the third and fourth generation.

38 Behold, this is an aensample unto all people, saith the Lord your God, for justification before me.

39 And again, verily I say unto you, if after thine aenemy has come upon thee the first time, he repent and come unto thee praying thy forgiveness, thou shalt forgive him, and shalt hold it no more as a testimony against thine enemy—

40 And so on unto the second and third time; and as oft as thine enemy repenteth of the trespass wherewith he has trespassed against thee, thou shalt aforgive him, until seventy times seven.

41 And if he trespass against thee and repent not the first time, nevertheless thou shalt forgive him.

42 And if he trespass against thee the second time, and repent not, nevertheless thou shalt forgive him.

43 And if he trespass against thee the third time, and repent not, thou shalt also forgive him.

44 But if he trespass against thee the fourth time thou shalt not forgive him, but shalt bring these testimonies before the Lord; and they shall not be blotted out until he repent and areward thee four-fold in all things wherewith he has trespassed against thee.

45 And if he do this, thou shalt forgive him with all thine heart; and if he do not this, I, the Lord, will aavenge thee of thine enemy an hundred-fold;

46 And upon his children, and upon his children’s achildren of all them that bhate me, unto the cthird and fourth generation.

47 But if the achildren shall repent, or the children’s children, and bturn to the Lord their God, with all their hearts and with all their might, mind, and strength, and crestore four-fold for all their trespasses wherewith they have trespassed, or wherewith their fathers have trespassed, or their fathers’ fathers, then thine indignation shall be turned away;

48 And vengeance shall ano more come upon them, saith the Lord thy God, and their trespasses shall never be brought any more as a testimony before the Lord against them. Amen.

16 posted on 01/31/2012 12:54:19 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: MeganC

I see that the MORMON leadership STILL wants to drag ‘local indians’ into the killing...

17 posted on 01/31/2012 12:56:58 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: MeganC
The ONLY MORMON ever brought to trail said....

"I am a true believer in the gospel of Jesus Christ, I do not believe everything that is now being taught and practiced by Brigham Young.

 I do not care who hears it. It is my last word - it is so.

 I believe he is lead­ing the people astray, downward to destruction.

 But I believe in the gospel that was taught in its purity by Joseph Smith, in former days.

 I have my reasons for it.


"I studied to make this man's [Brigham Young] will my pleasure for thirty years.

See, now, what I have come to this day!


"I have been sacrificed in a cowardly, dastardly manner." (Lee enun­ciated this sentence with marked emphasis.)



Excerpted from -->

18 posted on 01/31/2012 12:58:22 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: MeganC; cuban leaf

You realize that two other wagon trains were also attacked?

The Shepherd Train and the Miltmore train. Both sustained loss of life. The attackers were “Indians” some with blond hair, beards, and spoke perfect English.

19 posted on 01/31/2012 2:13:54 PM PST by Ruy Dias de Bivar
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To: MeganC; cuban leaf

There is also a memorial stone in downtown Harrison, Arkansas. Fancher, who was murdered at MM, used to own a 200 acre farm about two miles south of me.

20 posted on 01/31/2012 2:16:37 PM PST by Ruy Dias de Bivar
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To: WhistlingPastTheGraveyard; Alex Murphy; Colofornian
The Mountain Meadows Massacre [The Original 9/11 of American History]
LDS Church gives nod to Landmark status for Mountain Meadows site
21 posted on 01/31/2012 2:28:21 PM PST by Gamecock (I am so thankful for [the] active obedience of Christ. No hope without it. JGM)
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To: cuban leaf; CT; annieokie; All

Under the Banner of Heaven is a great book. Also check out American Massacre by Sally Denton. For some online info on MMM and Blood Atonement (which is why Utah had the firing squad so long), check out these links.

The more you know about Mormonism, the scarier it is.

Interestingly, we had a troll here on FR named “neodanite”. To those who know LDS history, the Danites were the LDS hit squad. He got zotted in short order.

22 posted on 01/31/2012 3:05:27 PM PST by reaganaut (If Romney is a conservative then I'm the frickin Angel Moroni.)
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To: ari-freedom

See post #22, I know my history quite well, thank you very much.

23 posted on 01/31/2012 3:08:17 PM PST by reaganaut (If Romney is a conservative then I'm the frickin Angel Moroni.)
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To: reaganaut
The more you know about Mormonism, the scarier it is.

I just started a few weeks ago. The more I look, the more I see westernized islam.

I will not cast a vote for an LDS. Ever.

24 posted on 01/31/2012 3:15:51 PM PST by WhistlingPastTheGraveyard (Some men just want to watch the world burn.)
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To: Elsie

God’s math seems a bit weird!

#25 & #26

25 posted on 01/31/2012 3:20:17 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: WhistlingPastTheGraveyard
The more I look, the more I see westernized islam.



“I Will Be a Second Mohammed”

In the heat of the Missouri “Mormon War” of 1838, Joseph Smith made the following claim, “I will be to this generation a second Mohammed, whose motto in treating for peace was ‘the Alcoran [Koran] or the Sword.’ So shall it eventually be with us—‘Joseph Smith or the Sword!’ ”[1]

It is most interesting that a self-proclaimed Christian prophet would liken himself to Mohammed, the founder of Islam. His own comparison invites us to take a closer look as well. And when we do, we find some striking—and troubling—parallels. Consider the following.

  • Mohammed and Joseph Smith both had humble beginnings. Neither had formal religious connections or upbringing, and both were relatively uneducated. Both founded new religions by creating their own scriptures. In fact, followers of both prophets claim these scriptures are miracles since their authors were the most simple and uneducated of men.[2]

  • Both prophets claim of having angel visitations, and of receiving divine revelation to restore pure religion to the earth again. Mohammed was told that both Jews and Christians had long since corrupted their scriptures and religion. In like manner, Joseph Smith was told that all of Christianity had become corrupt, and that consequently the Bible itself was no longer reliable. In both cases, this corruption required a complete restoration of both scripture and religion. Nothing which preceded either prophet could be relied upon any longer. Both prophets claim they were used of God to restore eternal truths which once existed on earth, but had been lost due to human corruption.

  • Both prophets created new scripture which borrowed heavily from the Bible, but with a substantially new “spin.” In his Koran, Mohammed appropriates a number of Biblical themes and characters—but he changes the complete sense of many passages, claiming to “correct” the Bible. In so doing he changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place. In like manner, Joseph Smith created the Book of Mormon, much of which is plagiarized directly from the King James Bible. Interestingly, the Book of Mormon claims that this same Bible has been substantially corrupted and is therefore unreliable. In addition, Joseph Smith went so far as to actually create his own version of the Bible itself, the “Inspired Version,” in which he both adds and deletes significant portions of text, claiming he is “correcting” it. In so doing he also changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place.

  • As a part of their new scriptural “spin,” both prophets saw themselves as prophesied in scripture, and both saw themselves as a continuation of a long line of Biblical prophets. Mohammed saw himself as a continuation of the ministry of Moses and Jesus. Joseph Smith saw himself as a successor to Enoch, Melchizedek, Joseph and Moses. Joseph Smith actually wrote himself into his own version of the Bible—by name.

  • Both prophets held up their own scripture as superior to the Bible. Mohammed claimed that the Koran was a perfect copy of the original which was in heaven. The Koran is therefore held to be absolutely perfect, far superior to the Bible and superceding it. In like manner, Joseph Smith also made the following claim. “I told the Brethren that the Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth, and the keystone of our religion, and a man would get nearer to God by abiding its precepts, than by any other book.”[3]

  • Despite their claim that the Bible was corrupt, both prophets admonished their followers to adhere to its teachings. An obvious contradiction, this led to selective acceptance of some portions and wholesale rejection of others. As a result, the Bible is accepted by both groups of followers only to the extent that it agrees with their prophet’s own superior revelation.

  • Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith taught that true salvation was to be found only in their respective religions. Those who would not accept their message were considered “infidels,” pagans or Gentiles. In so doing, both prophets became the enemy of genuine Christianity, and have led many people away from the Christ of the Bible.

  • Both prophets encountered fierce opposition to their new religions and had to flee from town to town because of threats on their lives. Both retaliated to this opposition by forming their own militias. Both ultimately set up their own towns as model societies.

  • Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith left unclear instructions about their successors. The majority of Mohammed’s followers, Sunni Muslims, believe they were to elect their new leader, whereas the minority, Shiite Muslims, believe Mohammed’s son was to be their next leader. Similarly, the majority of Joseph Smith's followers, Mormons, believed their next prophet should have been the existing leader of their quorum of twelve apostles, whereas the minority, RLDS, believed Joseph Smith's own son should have been their next prophet. Differences on this issue, and many others, have created substantial tension between these rival groups of each prophet.

  • Mohammed taught that Jesus was just another of a long line of human prophets, of which he was the last. He taught that he was superior to Christ and superceded Him. In comparison, Joseph Smith also made the following claim.

“I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him, but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet.”[4] In light of these parallels, perhaps Joseph Smith's claim to be a second Mohammed unwittingly became his most genuine prophecy of all.

[1] Joseph Smith made this statement at the conclusion of a speech in the public square at Far West, Missouri on October 14, 1838. This particular quote is documented in Fawn M. Brodie, No Man Knows My History, second edition, (New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1971), p. 230–231. Fawn Brodie’s footnote regarding this speech contains valuable information, and follows. “Except where noted, all the details of this chapter [16] are taken from the History of the [Mormon] Church. This speech, however, was not recorded there, and the report given here is based upon the accounts of seven men. See the affidavits of T.B. Marsh, Orson Hyde, George M. Hinkle, John Corrill, W.W. Phelps, Samson Avard, and Reed Peck in Correspondence, Orders, etc., pp. 57–9, 97–129. The Marsh and Hyde account, which was made on October 24, is particularly important. Part of it was reproduced in History of the [Mormon] Church, Vol. III, p. 167. See also the Peck manuscript, p. 80. Joseph himself barely mentioned the speech in his history; see Vol. III, p. 162.”

[2] John Ankerberg & John Weldon, The Facts on Islam, (Eugene, OR: Harvest House Publishers, 1998), pp.8–9. Eric Johnson, Joseph Smith & Muhammed, (El Cajon, CA: Mormonism Research Ministry, 1998), pp. 6–7.

[3] Documentary History of the [Mormon] Church, vol.4, pp.461.

[4] Documentary History of the [Mormon] Church, vol.6, pp.408–409.

26 posted on 01/31/2012 3:22:12 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: WhistlingPastTheGraveyard

I did not know any of this when I joined the Mormon church as a teenager. When I was at BYU, I decided I was going to be an apologist for the LDS and was warned by several professors and friends not to look to deeply or I would ‘think myself out of the Church’.

Thanks to one friend, the son of the then prophet, I was able to access several records for a history project that were not normally available. I spent almost a year studying Mormon history and at the end, left Mormonism. I couldn’t stand the thought that my own church lied to me about things and whitewashed their own history.

27 posted on 01/31/2012 4:09:53 PM PST by reaganaut (If Romney is a conservative then I'm the frickin Angel Moroni.)
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To: Elsie
Has anybody done a line-by-line comparison with this and the Koran? It just seems kinda-sorta familiar.
28 posted on 01/31/2012 4:37:23 PM PST by Excellence (9/11 was an act of faith.)
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To: Excellence

The Koran?

It’s Bible-in-a-Blender!

29 posted on 01/31/2012 7:35:17 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

It won’t start until there is no chance left for a conservative nominee, but just wait. The minute Mittens gets the nomination the ‘gee, I didn’t know the moromons believed that,’ story will start. The media will start ‘educating’ people about mormonism and some of the sects that seem to develop around them. How Mitt’s family goes to the BIG church. And how lesser members go to the Outback Steakhouse. Of course the big one will be about how blacks were considered dark skin devils until only recently. I can see Chrissie Matthews getting a thrill down his leg already.

30 posted on 01/31/2012 9:35:17 PM PST by CT (Make Mine Newt)
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To: CT
And how lesser members go to the Outback Steakhouse.

Hey!!! ;^)

31 posted on 02/01/2012 3:33:49 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: CT; Normandy
The media will start ‘educating’ people about mormonism and some of the sects that seem to develop around them.

"I've done more to hold the church together..."

32 posted on 02/01/2012 3:35:13 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: CT; Normandy

And then there is a List of SEX in the Latter_Day_Saint_movement!!

What is your church doing to help the male to stay true?

prophet kimball"All of this should be conveyed without having priesthood leaders focus upon intimate matters which are a part of husband and wife relationships. Skillful interviewing and counseling can occur without discussion of clinical details by placing firm responsibility on individual members of the Church to put their lives in order before exercising the privilege of entering a house of the Lord. The First Presidency has interpreted oral sex as constituting an unnatural, impure, or unholy practice. If a person is engaged in a practice which troubles him enough to ask about it, he should discontinue it."
- Official Declaration of the First Presidency of the Church, January 5th, 1982

spencer kimball"Prophets anciently and today condemn masturbation. It induces feelings of guilt and shame. It is detrimental to spirituality. It indicates slavery to the flesh, not that mastery of it and the growth toward godhood which is the object of our mortal life. Our modern prophet has indicated that no young man should be called on a mission who is not free from this practice. What is more, it too often leads to grievous sin, even to that sin against nature, homosexuality. For, done in private, it evolves often into mutual masturbation-practiced with another person of the same sex and thence into total homosexuality...."
- Prophet Spencer W. Kimball, The Miracle of Forgiveness, Pages 77-79, 81-82

"Among the most common sexual sins our young people commit are necking and petting. Not only do these improper relations often lead to fornication, [unwed] pregnancy, and abortions - all ugly sins - but in and of themselves they are pernicious evils, and it is often difficult for youth to distinguish where one ends and another begins. They awaken lust and stir evil thoughts and sex desires. They are but parts of the whole family of related sins and indiscretions. Almost like twins, 'petting' and fornication are alike."
- Prophet Spencer W. Kimball, The Miracle of Forgiveness, page 65

spencer kimball"Also far-reaching is the effect of the loss of chastity. Once given or taken or stolen it can never be regained. Even in a forced contact such as rape or incest, the injured one is greatly outraged. If she has not cooperated and contributed to the foul deed, she is of course in a more favorable position. There is no condemnation where there is no voluntary participation. It is better to die in defending one's virtue than to live having lost it without a struggle."
Prophet Spencer W. Kimball, The Miracle of Forgiveness, page 196

"And Cain said unto the Lord, My punishment is greater than I can bear. Behold, thou hast driven me out this day from the face of the earth." (Genesis 4:9-14.) That was true of murder. It is also true of illicit sex, which, of course, includes all petting, fornication, adultery, homosexual acts, and all other perversions. The Lord may say to offenders, as He did to Cain, "What hast thou done?" The children thus conceived make damning charges against you; the companions who have been frustrated and violated condemn you; the body that has been defiled cries out against you; the spirit which has been dwarfed convicts you. You will have difficulty throughout the ages in totally forgiving yourself."
-Prophet Spencer W. Kimball, "Love Versus Lust", BYU Speech January 5, 1965. Often-used quote still used today in LDS seminary classes.

kimball"I do not find in the Bible the modern terms "petting" nor "homosexuality," yet I found numerous scriptures which forbade such acts under by whatever names they might be called. I could not find the term "homosexuality," but I did find numerous places where the Lord condemned such a practice with such vigor that even the death penalty was assessed."
- Apostle Spencer W. Kimball, "Love Versus Lust", BYU Speech January 5, 1965

"If adultery or fornication justified the death penalty in the old days, and still in Christ's day, is the sin any less today because the laws of the land do not assess the death penalty for it? Is the act less grievous? There must be a washing, a purging, a changing of attitudes, a correcting of appraisals, a strengthening toward self-mastery. There must be many prayers, and volumes of tears. There must be an inner conviction giving to the sin its full diabolical weight. There must be increased devotion and much thought and study. And this takes energy and time and often is accompanied with sore embarrassment, heavy deprivations and deep trials, even if indeed one is not excommunicated from the Church, losing all spiritual blessings."
-Prophet Spencer W. Kimball, The Miracle of Forgiveness, Page 155

"How like the mistletoe is immorality. The killer plant starts with a sticky sweet berry. Little indiscretions are the berries -- indiscretions like sex thoughts sex discussions, passionate kissing, pornography. The leaves and little twigs are masturbation and necking and such, growing with every exercise. The full-grown plant is petting and sex looseness. It confounds, frustrates, and destroys like the parasite if it is not cut out and destroyed, for, in time it robs the tree, bleeds its life, and leaves it barren and dry; and, strangely enough, the parasite dies with its host."
- Apostle Spencer W. Kimball, General Conference Address, April 1, 1967.

33 posted on 02/01/2012 3:37:24 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

Sin & Death in Mormon Country: A Latter-day Tragedy

April, 1986
By Mark A. Taylor*

On March 2, 1982, Kip Eliason, age 16, distraught and filled with self-hate over his inability to stop masturbating, committed suicide. Before asphyxiating himself, Kip left his father a note:

“Dear Dad,
I love you more than what words can say. If it were possible, I would stay alive for only you, for I really only have you. But it isn’t possible. I must first love myself, and I do not. The strange feeling of darkness and self-hate overpowers all my defenses. I must unfortunately yield to it. This turbulent feeling is only for a few to truly understand. I feel that you do not comprehend the immense feeling of self-hatred I have. This is the only way I feel that I can relieve myself of these feelings now. Carry on with your life and be happy. I love you more than words can say.
—Your son, Kip”

Kip Eliason’s five-year struggle to overcome masturbation started at age 11 when his grandmother persuaded him to join the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS), whose members are better known as Mormons. Kip was an intelligent and sensitive young man, perhaps too sensitive. The death of his mother when the boy was six had profoundly affected him. At times he was quiet and reflective, spending hours alone in his room, and yet he was outgoing by nature. He was a born leader. His classmates and teachers admired him for his friendly way and all-American good looks. Kip was truthful and possessed a farm-community naiveté.

He loved the Mormon Church — which has 5.5 million members worldwide — and was devoted to its teachings. His father, Eugene Eliason, a non-Mormon, believes that in some ways the church may have played a substitute-mother role for the boy. (For clarity, Eugene Eliason will be referred to as Eliason throughout this report; his son will always be called Kip.)

Kip was not the kind of youngster you’d think would commit suicide, but when his church told him that he’d find guilt, depression and self-hate if he masturbated, he believed so. When it said he’d go to hell if he didn’t stop, he believed that too. And when he was told that masturbation was a “building block of suicide,” he took the church at its word.

Kip’s death rocked the predominantly Mormon agribusiness community of Boise, Idaho, where he was a high-school senior at Capital High School. Of course, there were the stories that occasionally filtered through the congregation about young people who, like Kip, committed suicide because they couldn’t live up to the church’s stringent anti-sex doctrines. But they were just stories and, if they were true, they didn’t happen in Boise; they happened some 300 miles southeast, in Salt Lake City, Utah.

Salt Lake City is the headquarters of the Mormon Church and the power base from which it wields enormous financial and political influence. (Mormons comprise 70% of Utah’s population.) There Kip’s death was indeed viewed by church leaders as an unfortunate tragedy, but it wasn’t the isolated incident the church would like its brethren in Boise to believe.

Today Kip’s story is one told more and more often in Mormon wardhouses. Behind the scenes the church and community mental-health agencies in Utah are quietly fighting a sex-related mental-health epidemic among Mormon men and women. Mental-health fallout in Utah communities has been substantial and pervasive. Utah has the highest birthrate and the largest families in America. More than 50% of all births are by teenage mothers, with seven of ten out of wedlock, and it has one of the highest divorce rates in the nation.

While the number of teen suicides in America has tripled in the past decade, Utah has consistently been 3.5% higher than the national average. According to that state’s Department of Vital Statistics, it ranks 13th nationally in child abuse, but comparing Utah statistics with those compiled by the National Association for the Protection of Children, the incidence of reported child abuse is six times higher in Utah. The incidence of sexual abuse — including rape, incest and intercourse — is 33% more than the national average, and the child-murder rate is five times higher.

Besides having a powerhouse football team, the Mormons’ very own Brigham Young University — alma mater of Donny and Marie Osmond and 1984 Miss America Sharlene Wells — has one of the highest coed-pregnancy rates in America.

Kip and countless others have fallen victim to guilt, self-hate, mental illness and suicide created by their inability to control healthy sexual desires as mandated by the Mormon Church. Making things worse is its amateurish attempts to provide counseling that utilizes powerful behavioral-modification techniques with inadequate training.

Mormon anti-sex indoctrination start early. Children are taught that sex is dirty and disgusting, that it is the tool of Satan. The church uses guilt and the threat of eternal damnation to drive its message home. When a child reaches adolescence, the conflict between what he or she has learned and sexual feelings experienced can create devastating consequences.

After Kip’s death, Eliason moved to Salt Lake City. He was angry and hurt. There he met parents who had stories like his — youngsters ending up in mental institutions or worse, committing suicide. Eliason worked through his grief and anger by talking to anyone willing to listen and by going to the library and researching teen suicide and the Mormons. In October 1983 he filed a $26-million wrongful-death suit against the Mormon Church, alleging that the Latter-day Saints went a step further than just providing his son with spiritual, moral and personal guidance when they subjected him to sex- and masturbation-counseling. The suit accuses the church of negligence for providing counseling that fell outside the realm of religious teaching and for not requiring or providing training for its counselors.

The suit charges that this counseling, combined with the church’s harsh anti-masturbation indoctrination, were the direct cause of Kip’s depression, self-hate, suicide attempts and eventual death.

Moreover, it alleges that the church knew or should have known that its attempts to indoctrinate and provide sexual counseling for Kip were having a severe and adverse reaction on him; yet they continued. The suit charges that this failure to exercise a proper standard of care was negligent.

The suit also contends that the Mormon Church subjected Kip to what amounted to an intentional attempt at mind control by using brainwashing techniques under the guise of spiritual teaching.

A pretrial affidavit was filed by noted sex-behavior expert Dr. Jack Annon, clinical and forensic psychologist, author of three books on sexual dysfunctions and disorders, and a member of the American Association of Sex Educators, Counselors and Therapists and of other professional societies. Annon stated: “Based upon my review of even a limited amount of literature and on documentation specifically pertaining to Kip Eliason, it appears clear that the LDS Church promoted and engaged in behavior-modification counseling in the specific areas of masturbation.”

In letters to his father and in his remarkably well-written journal, Kip chronicled his fight to overcome masturbation. He wrote: “I know immorality is a very serious sin. I really want to repent and be free of this terrible and degrading burden of masturbation. I am willing to do anything I have to do, even excommunication, to be able to repent and be free of this sin. I would rather go to hell and suffer there than be unworthy.”

Eliason recalls that before Kip became involved with the church, he was happy as a lark: “He got along with everyone just beautifully. We water-skied, boated, fished, snow-skied and did everything together. We laughed and had a ball.”

Mormons are taught that only by achieving perfection on earth will they reach “godhood” and find eternal life in heaven. To reach “perfection” one must first be found “worthy.” Bestowing “worthiness” is a shared responsibility between God and the church’s elders.

For most Latter-day Saints, including Kip, the constant battle to become “worthy” is a hopeless struggle. Becoming “worthy” and ultimately reaching “perfection” means living up to the church’s 4,300 commandments — including those condemning natural sex acts.

To his classmates at Capital High School and fellow Mormons, Kip seemed jovial, outgoing and, well, almost perfect. In many ways he was a model child — highly motivated, voted most inspirational member of the track team, a straight-A student, a seemingly well-adjusted individual immersed in his church beliefs and in striving for perfection. Mormon elders often used him as an example of what a fine young man should be, someone others could aspire to be like. Kip often talked about going to college and earning a degree in a humanitarian field.

Kip’s aunt Janice Ballatore, an active Mormon with whom he lived for two summers, remembers him telling her of his masturbation problem one day while running errands: “I told him not to worry, that all young boys probably do it. He seemed very relieved. Kip was a smart, good-looking kid who took the church perfection business seriously. He really thought he could be perfect. He said, ‘The church told me I could if I really wanted to try.’”

Mormon Sex “Education”

In a devotional speech to young adults in 1974 the late Spencer W. Kimball, Prophet, Seer and Revelator of the Mormon Church, admonished teenagers: “Immorality [petting, premarital sex, adultery, homosexuality and masturbation] brings generally a guilt deep and lasting. These guilt complexes are the stuff of which mental breakdowns come; they are the building blocks of suicide, the fabric of distorted personalities and the wounds that scar and decapitate individuals or families.”

In Love vs. Lust, a pamphlet written for teenagers, Kimball told young men that premarital sex is a serious sin, one just short of murder. He wrote: “The young man is untrue to his manhood who promises popularity, good times, security, fun and even love, when all he can give is passion and its diabolical fruits — guilt complexes, disgust, hatred, abhorrence, eventual loathing, and possible pregnancy without legitimacy and honor.”

Insisting on anonymity, a young, attractive woman sums up 20 years of Mormon sex indoctrinations: “They tell you it’s filthy and ugly. They say you’ll be shamed and damned. By the time you’re 21, you’ve got more sexual hang-ups than you can deal with. It’s crazy.”

Even married people are told that sex for pleasure is out, that the only legitimate purpose of sex is to be the tool of “procreating new spirits.” In a confidential letter responding to an inquiry from a married couple asking if oral sex was permitted, the late Mormon Prophet Harold B. Lee stated: “I was shocked to have you raise the question about ‘oral lovemaking in the genital area among married couples.’ Heaven forbid any such degrading activities which would be abhorrent in the sight of the Lord. For any Latter-day Saint... to engage in any kind of perversions of this sacred God-given gift of procreation would be sure to bring down the condemnation of the Lord whom we would offend were we to engage in any such practice.”

Once known for their practice of polygamy (multiple marriages), today’s Latter-day Saints are ultraconservative, tight-knit, industrious and secretive. The church demands absolute faith in and conformity to all its teachings and doctrines, and it attempts to govern all aspects of its congregation’s lives, including their sex lives.

In a letter to his father, Kip wrote: “I think since you’re my father who I love very much, I can tell you something about me that I have a problem with. It started when I was around nine or ten years of age. I had my first wet dream and was experiencing new feelings. I really don’t know how I got started, but it doesn’t matter. I did it for about a year, then out of fright that I would go to Satan if I did things like that, I stopped doing it. Then about a year and a half later I was starting with it again. It was the first week of junior high in the 7th grade. I really don’t know what it was that got me doing it again. For about a year I rationalized that it was right; it really wasn’t a big problem then. But I did feel guilty. Then through my guilt and what I was learning [from the church] I knew it was wrong for me.”

Eliason remembers: “Initially, Kip came to me and said he’d begun to have nocturnal emissions. He asked if I thought it would affect his church priesthood. I told him, ‘No way! It’s normal, and every man goes through it.’”

Kip desperately wanted to be a good man and prove himself worthy. At first he even tried lying, but he couldn’t lie to himself. He wrote: “I had lied about it to everyone, even the bishop and myself. I would go in for [bishop] interviews, and when the ‘golden question’ was asked, ‘Are you morally clean?’ I looked in his eyes and lied. My life was downhill all the time. I felt horrible inside, and it showed. I didn’t have many friends. I felt too humiliated to see the bishop. I tried a million times to stop on my own. But it was an obsession. A hideous habit that I thought to be totally impossible to quit. I knew Satan had me twisted on his little finger. I thought I would never be able to lose the chains that held me fast.”

When Kip finally told his bishop the truth, the bishop scheduled regular counseling sessions to assist the youth to stop masturbating and to monitor his progress. The church would supply the information he needed to overcome his sin, but he alone would have to stop — that is, if he really wanted to.

Unlike churches that require clergymen to have training and even college degrees before providing counseling, Mormon bishops and elders have little or no training in psychology or sexology. The only instruction they receive comes from either The Bishop’s General Handbook or the litany of pamphlets and instructional manuals pumped out by the LDS publishing arm.

One pamphlet written for teenage boys is titled Steps to Overcoming Masturbation [reprinted on this website—see link below]. It recommends avoiding being alone whenever possible, but “if you have a friend who masturbates, end the friendship immediately — don’t fool yourself by thinking you can stop together; it will only lead to even greater perversions.”

As a reminder of their particular sin, Mormon masturbators are instructed to carry a pocket calendar with them wherever they go. They are told to paint the days they masturbated black. Masturbators are also told not to read about or talk to anyone about their problem.

In the bathroom, Mormons are advised to always leave the door slightly ajar to avoid being alone, and to never admire themselves in the mirror. “Never stay in the bathroom for longer than five minutes, even to bathe-then GET OUT FAST.” The author recommends never touching the “intimate parts” of the body except during normal toileting.

In the bedroom they are instructed to dress for security. The more layers of clothing, the better. If the urge to masturbate becomes unbearable, yell “STOP!” as a way of changing the subject. Another option is to grasp a Book of Mormon and hold it tightly. In severe cases the masturbator is told to tie his hand to the bedframe so that semi-sleep masturbation doesn’t occur.

In the pamphlet Love vs. Lust, Kimball warned masturbators that if they don’t stop, they will end up homosexual: “Masturbation is the introduction of the more serious sin of exhibitionism and the gross sin of homosexuality.” And in Tools for Missionaries the church states that medical doctors believe masturbation “dulls the mind and has adverse effect on the memory.”

Dr. Vern Bullough of State University College at Buffalo, New York, is the author of many books on homosexuality and masturbation, including Sexual Variance in Society and History. Bullough, who also heads the Society for the Scientific Study of Sex, takes issue with Mormon claims of medical backing: “Obviously, members of the society would take exception to the attempts of the LDS Church to claim scientific backing for their stand on masturbation; their science is about 80 years out of date, and it was questionable even 80 years ago.”

If the church’s stand on masturbation is based on turn-of-the-century science, its controversial treatment for homosexuals might be right out of the futureshock novel and cult-film classic A Clockwork Orange.

The so-called electroshock conditioning starts in the downtown Salt Lake City office of psychologist and active Mormon Robert Card. First, electrodes are strapped to the homosexual’s arms or fingers, biofeedback monitors are attached to his head, and a circular electronic sensor is placed around his penis. Next, the patient sits in a darkened room where he views videotapes of heterosexual and homosexual sex acts.

If the patient gets an erection while watching the heterosexual tapes, a biofeedback digital-display monitor registers a positive numerical reading. But if the patient begins to have an erection while viewing the homosexual tapes, the electrodes strapped to his arms or fingers deliver an electrical shock.

Don Atridge, an ex-Mormon homosexual who was also a member of the famed Mormon Tabernacle Choir, underwent five months of shock treatments conducted by Dr. Card, whom he refers to as Dr. Frankenstein. “Every time I left his office, I was hornier than ever. Many times my arms were red and cut up from the shocks — they looked like hamburger.”

Another ex-Mormon gay, Les (who wanted only his first name identified), is very angry. “It’s horrible having the hell shocked out of you when you get sexually excited. The entire thing was disgusting.” Les even considered suicide. “After a while suicide looked like the most honorable thing to do. Many Mormon gays do it. I had it all planned, an automobile accident on a certain curve in the mountains; it was a way my children and family would be spared.”

In February 1984 the Australian television version of 60 Minutes aired a segment about the treatments, titled “Saints and Sinners.” Utah native and ex-Mormon Gary L. Stone told producer Warren McStoker that be didn’t just leave the church after being treated by Dr. Card. He kidnapped his four-year-old daughter from his ex-wife to get her away from the church and then moved to Australia.

“Getting myself and my daughter away from the Mormon Church was the best decision I’ve made in my entire 32-year life.” About Dr. Card’s treatment he says, “It’s destructive. They are purposely trying to destroy you. If you are a homosexual in the church, you have only three options — you can lie, you can die or you can disappear.”

While publicly abhorring any form of pornography, the church uses porn to treat homosexuality. And although it doesn’t openly embrace Dr. Card’s treatment, many higher-ups endorse the therapy and even refer church members for treatment.

The Mormon instructional pamphlet Homosexuality outlines and suggests specific therapeutic methods to be used in sex counseling. They include establishing rapport and confidentiality, assessment counseling, fantasy-changing, goal-setting, thought-stopping, chain-breaking and aversion therapy. The church believes that all homosexuals started out as masturbators; so counselors are instructed to identify the masturbator, gain his confidence, assess his needs and then design and implement a plan to help him stop before it leads to “more perverse and repugnant sins.”

Although the church encourages the use of these potentially dangerous therapies, it fails to offer implementation guidelines. Bishops have no way of recognizing emotional and psychological problems or even mental illness. Also, they have no way of knowing whether the therapy is helpful or harmful.

Again, Dr. Jack Annon: “It is my professional opinion that the LDS Church has gone a step beyond propounding a certain viewpoint that masturbation is a sin, and has actually instructed its leaders, teachers and bishops to provide counseling and to utilize behavior-’modification skills that can have very dangerous and adverse effects.”

After Kip admitted his “sin,” he felt relieved. “It has been exactly 11 weeks ago that I was called in by my new bishop to have an interview with him for the On My Honor Award. I knew that the question would be asked, ‘Are you worthy?’ I prayed for strength to tell the truth before I went for the interview. I felt a little nervous at first, but then I was relaxed. The question was asked and I told him the truth. I felt as clean as I felt at my baptism. I feel ‘new’ again! I have not masturbated for 11 weeks now. This is after I tried and tried to stop. After I saw the bishop, I knew I would never be immoral ever again. The chains are loose, and I am free.... New doors to truth and happiness have opened up to me.”

Unfortunately, Kip’s hopes were dashed when he eventually masturbated again. He wrote: “It seems I have tried to stop a billion times, but it’s the same old feelings. It affects every part of my life. If I could only get rid of this one sin, I know I could be a better person. I know I will run into a lot more problems in my life, but I think having a good self-image will help a lot through those times. Being rid of this ugly immoral sin will save my life and make it worth living.”

By the time Kip was 15, he and his dad discussed the problem regularly. Eliason continued to try to convince Kip that masturbation was a normal and even healthy part of growing up and discovering one’s own sexuality. He supplied Kip with books by medical experts refuting the information supplied by the Mormon Church. Even though Kip loved him, Eliason’s influence couldn’t match the well-oiled anti-masturbation campaign of the Mormons.

In a letter to his father, Kip regurgitated his indoctrination. “Now I know you are going to say it’s good, it’s natural, and 99.9% of the human population does it. Dad, I have read the statistics; I have read the sex books: I know the authors are professionals with all the ‘facts.’ But for me, it is wrong! For others it may be right, but not for me.”

At school, friends noticed a difference in his behavior. He clammed up and seemed lost in thought. The church was demanding an ever greater commitment from him. If he wasn’t in school or doing homework, then he was at the Mormon wardhouse.

Nearly five years had passed since Kip’s first wet dream and feelings of sexual awakening. For most, adolescence is a time of personal exploration, discovery and excitement, but for Kip it was a time of torment and self-disgust.

Eliason noticed a change in Kip’s personality. “He seemed down in the dumps for no apparent reason. He began spending a lot of time in his room. I found out later he was praying and reading the Scriptures for hours on end.” After Kip’s death he found an extensive library on sex, human reproduction and scores of pamphlets and books that the church had supplied the boy.

In a letter to an unnamed church elder, Kip pleaded for help: “How can I have the confidence that I won’t let myself fall into this temptation ever again? I really want to fulfill my priesthood calling, and I can’t if I am not morally clean. I don’t even deserve it! I am willing to do anything I have to do to be able to repent and be free of this sin.”

By the fall of 1981 the once-active, outgoing and well-liked teenager was withdrawn and profoundly depressed. On December 10, 1981, Kip tried to kill himself by drinking a bottle of iodine mixed with alcohol. He had come to hate himself so completely, he believed that death and damnation were all he deserved.

If there had been any doubt concerning the severity of his emotional conflict or state of mind, Kip’s attempted suicide should have silenced it. The Eliason suit alleges that the Mormon Church was aware of the suicide attempt, but continued to counsel him in complete disregard for his deteriorating mental state.

Dr. Annon believes, “It is my firm professional opinion, based upon information that I have at hand, that the LDS Church attempted to teach very stringent and difficult standards to a boy who was vulnerable to emotional conflicts, and that the counseling was inadequate and appears to have contributed to the boy’s suicidal ideations.”

On January 10, 1982, just a month after his first suicide attempt, Kip was ordained into the Aaronic priesthood. One in a series of Mormon priesthoods, the Aaronic demands greater responsibility, commitment and perfection.

On Valentine’s Day, February 14, Kip made another attempt to end his life by again drinking a mixture of iodine and alcohol. He was taken to the psychiatric unit of the St. Alphonsus Regional Medical Center, where he was diagnosed as suicidal. (The medical facility is a codefendant in the Eliason suit.) Eight days later Kip was released to his father.

Eliason recalls picking his son up at the hospital. “He seemed happy to be going home. Before we left, he introduced me to a 16-year-old girl he had met there. She had told him she was there for the same reason he was. Kip seemed very taken by his new friend and, when they said goodbye, he took her into his arms and kissed her. I’ll never forget it.”

On March 2, 1982, Kip was home alone while his father made an overnight business trip, About 9 p.m. Eliason called him from his hotel. “Kip seemed all right. I asked him if he’d taken his medicine, and he said he had. I told him I’d be home soon, and that was about it.”

Sometime after the call, Kip wrote a suicide note. He went to the closed garage, started the family car and went to sleep.

Dead at 16, Kip Eliason had but two “vices,” masturbation and telling the truth. He was unable to stop masturbating and too honorable to lie — something tens of thousands of other Mormons must be doing right now.

Every time Eugene Eliason returns to Boise, he visits Kip’s grave. Sometimes he drives through their old neighborhood. He feels closest to Kip there. If a Mormon neighbor recognizes him, they pretend not to notice. Now labeled an anti-Mormon, he worries about all those young people who, like Kip, are giving their all to the Mormon Church.

Today Eliason shows his anger less frequently than he did two years ago, even though his precedent-setting clergy-malpractice suit has cost him everything. (After several lengthy delays and setbacks it is slated to go to court this spring [1986].) It’s not that his anger has subsided the way it might have had his son been killed in an auto accident, say. That kind of natural dissipation of anger doesn’t apply to him. Until he can find justice and reconcile the fact that Kip died not only believing himself a failure at age 16, but also believing that he deserved to die as punishment for his “despicable sin,” Eliason’s anger and grieving will continue.

34 posted on 02/01/2012 9:39:15 AM PST by AnTiw1
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To: Elsie


Besides Mormonism and multi level marketing schemes and scams, Utah is also known for its horrible “Troubled Teen”-industry. Reports over and over again tells of appalling atrocities in Mormon run “boarding schools”, teen boot camps, boys and girl ranches, wilderness camps, or “Academies”, that more properly could be called: teen concentration camps. Hundreds of young adults, who were lucky enough to survive the systematic brutal torture and abuse at these camps give disturbing testimonials. Many thousands have been mentally scarred for life by the abuse and torture they survived in those Mormon run teen concentration camps. Children and teens who have been to one of these places - often abducted or kidnapped and duct-taped and thrown in the back of a wan and driven to Utah, will end up having far deeper problems upon release. Most often they will never forgive their parents for sending them to these camps and they and their families will suffer the rest of their lives.

The St. George Utah based WWASP camps in different US States and even off-shore, run by Utah Mormon businessmen have already drawn a lot of negative press and investigations and had many of their facilities and operations shut down and had staff convicted of their crimes and neglect. WWASP have payed millions in lawsuits so far.

Lately another Mormon Utah scandal has blown up: A number of survivors from West Ridge Academy - The Utah Boys Ranch are beginning to raise awareness about the abuse, torture and atrocities that took place at the West Ridge Academy.They have chosen to call their website the Mormon Gulag

One of the young men; Citizen correspondent Eric Norwood published an article “Trapped in a Mormon Gulag” an excerpt from his coming book, that raised awareness about this scandalous facility. With his permission I was allowed to republish his story here:

By Eric Norwood

His filthy digit tasted like rust and fish. “I can hurt you without leaving any marks,” Brent growled as I writhed in agony on the ground. I struggled for breath as he mounted my back, put his finger in my mouth, and pulled back on my cheek, fish-hooking me. The pain was incredible. I tried to beg him to stop, but the words would not come.

After he finished beating and bludgeoning submissiveness into me, he pulled me up by the rope that was lassoed around my waist. The wool army blanket I had fashioned as a skirt had shifted askew and I stood there in my boxers bleeding from my nose, humiliated.

My green Utah Boys Ranch t-shirt had been ridiculously stretched out and looked more like a low cut blouse. I loosened the noose around my waist and pulled the itchy blanket through the loop and folded it over so it looked like a brown bath towel secured by a belt. He wasn’t satisfied, he wanted more. I just wanted out of this classroom. I started to think about how I got here.

The Utah Boys Ranch appears to be a kind of tough-love school with a Christian-esque undertow. My parents thought as much when they employed its services in hopes of corralling their spiritually wayward son.

Being kidnapped was probably the last thing I was worried about at 15 years old. I was staying at my grandma’s house that fateful night. My step-dad and I had been at war since I had refused to go to seminary, a church service for Mormon kids in high school that began at the ungodly hour of six in the morning.

I loathed early morning seminary more than the three hours of my Sunday regular LDS church service consumed, or the three hours on Wednesday nights. My opposition, paired with my step-dad’s religious fanaticism, resulted in being grounded almost to the point of indentured servitude. Grandma’s house was my sanctuary. Ironically, when I looked up at the clock that next morning - as two imposing silhouettes entered the house my mom grew up in - it was five minutes to 6 a.m. on Valentine’s Day.

I was camped out on the sofa bed in the TV room with a plate of leftover lasagna from the fridge. It was half eaten and a Roseanne re-run was playing when they first walked in. They looked around as if they had been told where to go, but hadn’t quite envisioned it right. They looked to their left, saw the terrified eyes of a 15-year-old, and pounced. They shoved clothes and shoes on me and I was gone before I was able to think about which way I should run. They told me very little. Their first names were Paul and Barry.

Barry was a white guy, a big mother. At least 6’5”, and I would not be surprised to hear that he weighed more than 300 pounds, but he was not fat. Paul was shorter and had a darker complexion. He was big too, and meaner than Barry. He turned to me when we first got into their white mid-sized rental car and said, “You have a choice. You can be cool and get on an airplane with us and be there in a couple of hours, or you can sit back there with handcuffs on for the next 12 hours. Non-stop.”

“Where are we going,” I asked, still in shock. “Utah,” Barry answered casually from the passenger seat, without turning his head. “We are from the Utah Boys Ranch, Eric, and your parents have asked us to take you back with us.”

“What?” My head was spinning. I felt like I was going to throw up. There is no way that this was happening. My mom would never allow this. Utah? What the hell is a Boys Ranch? I couldn’t breathe. “I guess we’re driving,” Paul said odiously.

I knew the child-lock would be on and as I saw the familiar houses of my grandmother’s street pass by, I started to roll down the window. We weren’t going fast enough for them to notice yet and the warm Agoura Hills climate didn’t tip them off. I rolled it down enough to fit my arm out and open the door from the outside when Paul paused at the stop sign at the bottom of the hill, looked back at me, and stopped the car.

He shoved the gear into park and pulled handcuffs out of somewhere and told me to give him my wrists. I sat there cuffed for a moment when I realized that I really would die from this feeling in my chest - a physical manifestation of angst. My heart was beating furiously, and I knew that I couldn’t last 12 hours.

“You can take me on a plane. I’ll be cool.” “Now that’s more like it,” Barry said kindly. “My wife will be happy.”

The first person I met in Utah was Senator Chris Buttars

I had no idea who he was until that point. All I knew was that he was to be feared, and I was scared to death of him from the moment I first saw him.

“Sit down,” he squawked in a loud, high pitched, galling voice that sounded like a cross between a buzzard and an old cowboy. He continued to make it very clear that I was at his mercy. He told me who he was - politically - and the influence he had. If I ever wanted to leave I was to do what he said. “How old are you?”

“Fifteen,” I mumbled.

“Three years might not be enough for you. I can have a judge order you to be here until you are 21,” he croaked. With that he sent me off to be “changed and put on work crew.”

I was led down a long hall of doors with nameplates. I had no clue what kind of place this was. I didn’t see any cows or sign of what I thought a “ranch” would resemble. Paul took me into a small room that was no bigger than a broom closet, which was stacked to the ceiling with three colors of cloth, blue, green and brown. There were green t-shirts, blue t-shirts, and blue jeans.

There were also brown army wool blankets, and I remember thinking that I didn’t want to sleep under such a coarse covering before I was told to “put it on.” I was told to wrap a thick, itchy blanket around my waist like a towel and wear it like a dress.

I was then given a “leash” made of climbing rope and what I think was a square knot to tie around my waist. I had never imagined being tethered and walked like a dog, but here I was, being walked like a dog towards a cluster of about 12 other boys. They were lined up facing a wall while two large men in red sweatshirts watched them from a couple of chairs off to the side.

Some of the boys had camouflage pants on, a few others wore dresses. I wondered how long I was to be in this blanket dress. I was later told that it was so I wouldn’t run away - and they were right - I literally could not run in this humiliating getup. I could barely get a full stride walking.

That’s when I saw Brent - or ‘Captain America,’ as he was called disparagingly - for the first time. My leash was handed off to him, but he told me to wrap it around my waist and go join the group of young men who were standing with their noses touching the wall, all spread out about arms length from each other.

I turned to the boy who was standing to my right and asked him how long he had been here, but before I could get my question all the way out, my forehead careened into the carpeted wall in front of me. A sharp pain stabbed the back of my head, and suddenly bad breath filled my nostrils. “Are you talking on my work crew, boy?” a red-shirted man screamed at me.

My head was ringing. I was still trying to piece together what had just happened when I looked behind me and massaged the pain in my head. Suddenly my legs fell out from underneath me and I was on my back. He had just slammed my forehead into the wall, and now he had put his foot behind mine and pushed me, sending me to the floor flat on my back.

He stood over me and bawled, “Don’t look at me. Don’t look around. Don’t you MOVE without permission! You don’t do anything without permission! If you talk, I think you are talking about running away, and I will restrain you. Do you understand?” I nodded. I knew then that I had to get out of this place. I wasn’t going to last here.

It was only my second week on work crew when Neil Westwood refused to turn his back to Brent and place his nose on the wall, which is what the command “face the wall” plainly meant. It was a Mexican standoff for a few moments. Stunningly it seemed like Brent was going to let Neil get his way. I had never seen an older boy in a pissing contest with a staff member before. The younger kids refused commands, but they were always quickly thumped into docility.

Neil was a big kid, a lot bigger than me - probably 230 pounds or so, and over six-feet tall, but dispelled any image of toughness with his glasses, disproportionately small arms, and frizzy hairdo. Neil was as obnoxious as he was an easy target, but I still can’t believe that no one reacted when Brent stood up in a flash of rage and chucked a full, unopened gallon of milk at Neil’s face from about five feet away, crumbling him to a pitiful puddle of tears, blood, and non-fat milk.

The work crew was depraved. When they didn’t have us facing the wall for hours at a time we were digging ditches with spoons, only to fill them back in again. We made huge piles of heavy rocks taken from the field, the field that both surrounded and contained us, only to be told to move the massive mound to another location. They worked us in ways redolent of Stalin’s gulags.

There was an agonizing week of all-day sod laying - with bits of mud and grass sticking to the inside of my wool dress - in preparation for some ceremony the work crew boys weren’t privy to. The Scarecrow Festival was even worse. We worked for weeks from eight in the morning till eight at night in preparation and to take down that contrived fall carnival/ fundraiser. Boys wished for death. There was also a dry-cleaning service that they operated somewhere in town, which was supposedly much better than any job on campus - even kitchen duty.

Getting off from work crew meant school during the day, and considerably less work. Some sadist there created a t-shirt caste system that involved wearing either a blue t-shirt or green t-shirt. “Blue shirts” could talk, receive letters (which were opened and read first), talk to their parents, and possibly go off campus.

“Green shirts” were allowed into school, but that was about it. No speaking, sitting, or anything but working or reading LDS literature. A “green shirt” was forced to read the Book of Mormon, in particular the first 22 chapters. We were interviewed by one of the four full-time Mormon missionaries that worked there and had to paraphrase all of “First Nephi” before receiving a blue t-shirt. What good derives from reading the Book of Mormon under duress is anyone’s guess, but I did it. I had to. I had to go to church and seminary too.

It turns out that any form of decadence - smoking a little grass, telling your math teacher to sit on it, being gay or bi-curious, sexually assaulting a family member or young girl - is curable by a little hard work, tough love, and Mormon doctrine. Boys with “sexual issues” are housed together in what could only be some cruel showing of satire.

They were constantly being caught jerking each other off onto each other, or, more tragically, assaulting younger boys. Whatever it was, they would be shoved into blankets and thrown on work crew. On Tuesday night they would meet with all the boys with sexual issues and provide remedies like IcyHot on the penis to stifle homosexual urges.

I was kept there until they couldn’t keep me any longer, and on my 18th birthday I walked out the front doors into a cold October morning with nowhere to go and nothing but my freedom. If I didn’t experience it myself I would not believe a place like this exists. A Mormon gulag.

How do they get away with all of the abuse? The forced religion, the stifling of freedom of speech? Was it legal to prevent us from reporting abuse to authorities, or to restrain us with ropes, wool blankets, and duct tape? Is it legal to force young boys to talk about masturbation with Mormon clergy and missionaries? How does all of this go unnoticed? We were young and naive and didn’t know that most of what they did to us was illegal. Buttars was famous for telling us that we had only three rights: food, safety, and shelter. They failed to even live up to those standards.

Besides being callow, we hardly had the chance to report any abuse. They instruct parents to ignore any claims of abuse from their children. They call any complaints from children a manipulation tool - “fear factor” - and instruct parents to be wary of the “tactic” they say they encounter most.

There were also no phones to call the police. No nurses or medical examiners to talk to. No government authorities to check in on us. Incongruously, this Orwellian facility desperately needs government oversight.

Sen. Buttars said it all when he told a reporter, “What sets us apart is that we’re the only residential treatment facility that doesn’t seek or accept government funding. If we did, they’d control us.”

Utah senator Chris Buttars has attracted a lot of negative attention by his racial and anti-gay hate speech - supported by other republican senators and extremists Mormons, who obviously keep voting him into office since he represent their values and opinions and ambitions about a Utah lead theocracy:

Racism that was once the corner stone of the LDS faith still shows its ugly face, but has now been replaced by attacks on the civil and human rights of gays and lesbians, who have become the target and scapegoats for Mormons all over the world, most visibly by their effort to pass proposition 8 in California and the current heated debate about the Common Ground initiative in Utah.

We are outraged by the allegations made against West Ridge Academy. It is our hope that the victims sufferings will be eased and they will fight to bring the perpetrators to justice in criminal and civil lawsuits. So far we have only seen the tip of the iceberg, from what will turn out to become another huge Utah Mormon scandal as more victims and survivors suffering from post traumatic stress syndrome, depressions, suicide attempts and broken lives come forward. I strongly encourage readers to donate money to help the victims get restitution and help to survive the torture they endured at West Ridge Academy.

35 posted on 02/01/2012 9:51:57 AM PST by AnTiw1
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To: AnTiw1
"Although the church encourages the use of these potentially dangerous therapies, it fails to offer implementation guidelines. Bishops have no way of recognizing emotional and psychological problems or even mental illness. Also, they have no way of knowing whether the therapy is helpful or harmful."

Because they're NOT TRAINED, they're NOT professionals in any way shape or form.

They are just average men with no formal or professional training, no schooling, no theological training, etc.

Thrust into a position based solely on checking the right boxes in their progression to godhood.

36 posted on 02/01/2012 11:02:18 AM PST by SZonian (Throwing our allegiances to political party's in the long run gave away our liberty.)
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