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Priests Accused of Molesting Children Hiding in Plain Sight
NBC California ^ | 2/11/12 | Frank Snepp and Tara Kangarlou |

Posted on 02/11/2012 10:13:46 AM PST by RnMomof7

Some 200 Catholic priests suspected of sexual abuse are living undetected in communities across California, according to an attorney who represents hundreds of plaintiffs who sued the LA Archdiocese for molestation they say was inflicted on them by priests and clergy of the church.

Ray Boucher has mapped sixty locations where suspect priests live, in cities and towns from northern to southern California, and provided those locations to NBC4 exclusively.

“Many if not all these priests have admitted to sexual abuse,” Boucher said. “They live within a mile of 1,500 playgrounds, schools and daycare centers.”

Since none of the priests has actually been convicted of sex abuse, none can be identified under Megan’s Law, or their whereabouts revealed in related public databases.

“What the issue is here, is how you weigh the right of the people,” said Boucher, who is also one of the attorneys representing students in the Miramonte Elementary School sex abuse scandal. “In particular the right of children to be protected from molestation versus the right of privacy."

Among Boucher’s many clients in the church action are Manuel Vega and Dan Smith.

Vega is a former police officer from Oxnard who took special interest in sex crimes investigations because, he says, he was sexually abused as a teenager by his parish priest.

“He forced me to masturbate while he took pictures of me,” said Vega, who believes that the public is often too squeamish to recognize what child molestation actually entails – and thus not properly outraged by it.

“When we talk about sexual abuse we’re talking about sodomy,” he said. “There’s pubic hair, there’s sweat, there’re smells, there’re grunts.”

Dan Smith, another alleged abuse victim, is reeling from the recent collapse of his marriage which he blames in part on the psychological effects of the molestation he says he suffered as a child – at the hands of his local parish priest.

“He would rape me and then say this is what God’s love feels like,” Smith said, struggling to hold back tears more than twenty years after the alleged incidents.

Both men helped make legal history by joining 500 other plaintiffs in suing the LA Archdiocese for sexual molestation, with Boucher as their lead attorney.

In 2007 the LA Archdiocese reached an unprecedented $660 million settlement with many of the plaintiffs without admitting any wrong-doing.

It also agreed to let the courts decide which of the case-related church files should be made public, including those identifying alleged and admitted predators.

But according to Boucher and court documents, the Catholic Church has since engaged in a cover-up. By Boucher’s account, Church officials allowed priests suspected of sexually abusing children to retire, flee the country or hide in rehab clinics until the statute of limitations on prosecution ran out.

“What the church did is take these guys and send them off to facilities where they treat pedophile priests without ever alerting police,” Boucher said. “By enabling these priests to be hidden for so many years the church protected them from being prosecuted.”

Meanwhile legal disputes delayed the release of the promised personnel files, and Donald Steir, an attorney for several priests, went to court to argue that those who’ve been accused but no convicted should have their names and privacy protected.

“They are being punished as if they have been convicted, or at least that’s the desire – to punish them,” Steir said. “That’s not fair.”

“It’s difficult if you represent an alleged terrorist or a pedophile, because people don’t really care about the rights [including privacy rights] for these type of people,” Steir said. “But once we erode the rights of a group of people we don’t like, we effectively have started down a path where other people’s rights can be similarly denied.”

The courts, expressing concern for children, overruled most of these arguments and similar ones by the Archdiocese, which declined to comment for this story.

And a judge has ordered release of some personnel files, set for some time in the coming weeks. But he also credited the church for its increased sensitivity in dealing with molestation cases and decided to withhold the names of church officials who handled the earlier cases.

It is a ruling that reminds Boucher of the breakdown in accountability in the Penn state pedophile scandal. “Look at Penn State and see how important and significant it is when people in authority enable sexual abusers to continue,” Boucher said. “That underscores how significant it is to get these names out.”

Under the judge’s ruling the church can also keep secret, subject to further court review, the names of priests who have not been convicted and who have only one or two allegations against them or have allegations disputed by the church.

To Smith that seems like a formula for further cover-up by church officials.

“If their interests were to protect the kids, they would have released the documents,” Smith said. “As a parent not knowing who your neighbor is -- that is really scary.”

Many of these unidentified priests are included in Boucher’s location map.

“The danger” said Vega, “is that you have a person who has this sickness in them who is amongst the children.”

The plaintiffs in the church scandal are planning to appeal the latest rulings to assure broader disclosure of suspects’ names and locations. But Boucher warned this could take time, allowing suspects to keep their privacy protected, as well as their undetected presence in neighborhoods across California.


TOPICS: Activism; Catholic; Moral Issues; Religion & Culture
KEYWORDS: abuse; calvinismisdead; catholic; predators; priests; sin; threebilliondollars
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To: Hacksaw
It's not "others do it too". I see you people really like fabricating quotes. What it is however, is an attempt to rebut the idea being put forth that child molestation is an exclusively Catholic problem. The problem is, you people get mad when any evidence is presented that shows that it is a lot more widespread OUTSIDE of the Catholic church. It's almost if you people *don't care* when a child is molested outside of the church. But that would be cyncical of me to state, and since you people have *so much* class, I would never make that accusation.

Actually, no. It would seem as if your fervor has put blinders on you. Your answer shows that you have not REALLY read the articles without a pre-determined slant on what they say. Let's see if I can say it plainly in a way you can understand:

Molestation of children is AWFUL - no matter who the predator is. But what is MORE AWFUL (f that is possible) is the coverup and the protecting of these predators by their organization that claims it represents the One True, Almighty God. And that the organization claims that one moment these perverts destroy the lives of children, but at the same time they can still be representatives of God - forever. That is outrage! It gives a most disgusting picture of the god these people and their protectors are serving.

101 posted on 02/13/2012 5:14:38 AM PST by lupie
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To: aruanan
As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction

So you are trying to tell us that you are one of the learned and stable folks who understands the scripture and we are not???

102 posted on 02/13/2012 5:24:46 AM PST by Iscool (You mess with me, you mess with the WHOLE trailerpark...)
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To: Hacksaw
It's not "others do it too". I see you people really like fabricating quotes. What it is however, is an attempt to rebut the idea being put forth that child molestation is an exclusively Catholic problem.

Now you are making stuff up...That's not the issue at all...Never has been...If you are unwilling to discuss the issue, why even post at all???

Oh ya, it's called distraction, isn't it...

103 posted on 02/13/2012 5:30:09 AM PST by Iscool (You mess with me, you mess with the WHOLE trailerpark...)
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Comment #104 Removed by Moderator

To: Hacksaw
>>rebut the idea being put forth that child molestation is an exclusively Catholic problem.<<

No one is saying it’s “exclusively” a Catholic problem. What we are saying is that the Catholic Church proposes to be the “only” church sanctioned by Christ and claim they are the source of all truth in religious matters. They claim the “vicar” of Christ is their head and that their priests can absolve of sin. No other entity claims those things.

Catholics can’t have it both ways. They can’t present themselves as the “only” true church and then cry like babies when they are actually held to a higher standard. It’s hypocritical. So which is it? Are they the "only true church" or are they "any other entity"?

105 posted on 02/13/2012 6:41:38 AM PST by CynicalBear
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To: Hacksaw; CynicalBear; TSgt; RnMomof7; 1000 silverlings; Alex Murphy; bkaycee; blue-duncan; ...
It's not "others do it too". I see you people really like fabricating quotes.

Sure it is. See posts 2,3,4, and 5 this very thread. That's EXACTLY what all those posts say.

What it is however, is an attempt to rebut the idea being put forth that child molestation is an exclusively Catholic problem.

Show us where ANY of us said or implied that.

The problem is, you people get mad when any evidence is presented that shows that it is a lot more widespread OUTSIDE of the Catholic church.

We do? How do you know that?

It's almost if you people *don't care* when a child is molested outside of the church.

It's almost if you people *don't care* when a child is molested outside inside of the church.

But that would be cyncical of me to state, and since you people have *so much* class, I would never make that accusation.

But you did anyway.

Lastly, this is an article about people who *are accused*, not convicted, released by a lawyer who has a finacial interest in children being molested, and seeing that those numbers are as high as possible.

Did you even READ the article? Or did you choose to ignore this line......

“Many if not all these priests have admitted to sexual abuse,” Boucher said. “They live within a mile of 1,500 playgrounds, schools and daycare centers.”

106 posted on 02/13/2012 6:44:00 AM PST by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: metmom; Petrosius; Theo; 1000 silverlings; Alex Murphy; bkaycee; blue-duncan; boatbums; caww

Wait, is he trying to deny that the cover ups or transfers have happened? The Catholic Church is the entity that holds itself as the highest authority as it relates to religion. How can they now want to be compared to other entities in this issue?


107 posted on 02/13/2012 6:56:41 AM PST by CynicalBear
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To: Pyro7480
I observe that many protestants protest mightily against (accused) child molesters who happen to be Catholic ... and also protest mightily against the mere mention of child molesters who happen not to be Catholic.

So ... it seems that some protestants think that child molesting is perfectly fine ... if the molester happens to be a protestant.

108 posted on 02/13/2012 7:04:25 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: Pyro7480

I often pray for the people on FR who are so filled with hatred for the Catholic Church.

Vilifying the Church is a treasured strategy for the left.


109 posted on 02/13/2012 7:38:24 AM PST by Bigg Red (Pray for our republic.)
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To: RnMomof7
Some 200 Catholic priests suspected of sexual abuse are living undetected in communities across California, according to an attorney who represents hundreds of plaintiffs who sued the LA Archdiocese for molestation they say was inflicted on them by priests and clergy of the church.

OK, what's the issue here? I mean flamebait and posturing aside for a moment. Let's talk honestly, if that's possible. These are men who have been accused of committing abuse, right?

So is the Church hiding them? That's what the headline says. "Hiding in plain sight" What's going on here, that shouldn't be going on? Is this illegal? Should these men be locked up? Forced to wear a sign?

Ray Boucher has mapped sixty locations where suspect priests live, in cities and towns from northern to southern California, and provided those locations to NBC4 exclusively.

OK, so these men are "suspects". Good for Ray. He knows where these accused men live.

“Many if not all these priests have admitted to sexual abuse,” Boucher said. “They live within a mile of 1,500 playgrounds, schools and daycare centers.”

OK, so now we're getting somewhere. These men are self-admitted abusers. We'll take your word for it. And they're living too close to places frequented by children. OK, so this could be an issue. But they haven't been convicted and therefore can't be marked with the "sex offender" tag and therefore they can live anywhere they please.

So this amounts to "hiding", to use the phrase coined by the headline? Really?

Since none of the priests has actually been convicted of sex abuse, none can be identified under Megan’s Law, or their whereabouts revealed in related public databases.

Just as I suspected.

So why haven't they been convicted? Is it because a financial settlement was reached and cases were dropped? OK, that's a choice that was freely taken.

Now what?

I mean seriously? Also, are all these men actually still priests? Those that aren't can live where they please. Those that are still priests can certainly be relocated by the Church.

The article is a beat up. Absent a conviction, these men are legally free to live where they want. So what's Boucher's beef? That these men (those who are still priests, that is) ought to be moved to a monastery in the middle of Wyoming? Fine, say so. But this "hiding in plain sight" is tabloid journalism at its finest.

110 posted on 02/13/2012 7:38:30 AM PST by marshmallow (.)
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To: aruanan
And to understand God's word as the final authority in matters of faith and morals you have to understand what it actually says and what those words meant to the writer as he addressed his remarks to ....

NOTHING TO UNDERSTAND beforehand! IT IS WHAT IT IS! God's Word IS The Final Authority. You conform to The Word, you don't conform God's Word to suite your understanding and/or agenda. You read His Word KNOWING that is the only TRUTH and everything else MUST conform to it! If it doesn't it's not from HIM! And don't assign it to HIM.

And don't add to what HE has expressly said to cover man made doctrines/teachings regarding priests, nuns, monks whatever and commands to not eat meat. You either choose to learn from God's Word by being obedient to 'HEAR and OBEY' or you twist it mean something to make yourself feel better. Twisting God's Word is deception and is satan's tactic used to deceive from the very beginning.

1 Tim 4:1-3 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

Forbidding to marry, [and commanding] to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.

Reminder: God's Word is spiritually discerned. Without the spirit, one comes up with that foolish you assigned to that Scripture..this "forbidding to marry" is referring to the practices of sects like the Shakers that declared that no believers, even those who are married, should have sex.

111 posted on 02/13/2012 7:46:45 AM PST by presently no screen name
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To: Hacksaw
That's why y'all get so frothing mad when people like Salvation show that your own side of the street isn't so spotless.

Why should I be mad? Again I am glad when the world is made safe from a child molester. I'm just pointing out that the author is playing fast and loose with the numbers.

112 posted on 02/13/2012 7:54:16 AM PST by Gamecock (I am so thankful for [the] active obedience of Christ. No hope without it. JGM)
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To: presently no screen name
"These are the confessors who catholics are taught to obey, force themselves if need be, and never question. That would make it an institutional dilemma."

Hi there --- I have a sincere question which I hope you can help me out with. It is this:

Was it something someone said to you, or was it some book or movie, or where did you get the idea that Catholics are taught to "obey, force themselves if need be, and never question" any member of the clergy?

It is false, and to all the Catholics I know, it is laughably, eye-rollingly false. But on the other hand, I don't want to accuse you of knowingly circulating a falsehood, so I'll assume you believe it to be true because somebody told you, or you read it somewhere.

So, where did you pick up this misinformation? Or who passed it on to you? Do you remember?

113 posted on 02/13/2012 8:45:30 AM PST by Mrs. Don-o ("Justice and judgment are the foundation of His throne." Psalm 89:14)
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To: Mrs. Don-o
It is false, and to all the Catholics I know, it is laughably, eye-rollingly false.

Really? Did you read my post and contact them all? Wonder who is spreading a falsehood.

114 posted on 02/13/2012 9:04:57 AM PST by presently no screen name
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To: RnMomof7
How many kids are abused by their public school teachers? Millions
115 posted on 02/13/2012 9:10:13 AM PST by denydenydeny (The more a system is all about equality in theory the more it's an aristocracy in practice.)
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To: caww
I wasn't denying that priests represent Christ.

I was denying your bizarre assertion that because priests are human and some priests, being human, are bad, that the Catholic Church is therefore EVIL.

You remind me of those Westboro Baptist Church freaks.

Admit it... you're a Westboromite, aren't you?

116 posted on 02/13/2012 9:15:33 AM PST by E. Pluribus Unum (FOREIGN AID: A transfer of money from poor people in rich countries to rich people in poor countries)
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To: RnMomof7
One final thing following on from my previous post, before I leave this execrable thread.

This issue has often been characterized by posters screaming....."defrock him!! .....why won't the Church defrock him!!" You and several others on this thread might have been among them. It's often been a shrill and unthinking shriek.

Due to the law of unintended consequences, your posting of this thread shows very nicely why. Those men who are no longer priests (i.e. they've been laicized) can live anywhere.

Can we now agree that "defrocking" might actually not be such a great idea? If so, that would be progress. At least if they're still priests, the Church can still supervise these men and exercise some degree of control over them, as opposed to none when they've been cut loose. If our concern is truly for the children and we're not simply engaged in a "whack-a-mole" exercise, would it be too much to expect some sort of admission that the "defrocking" route might actually be counterproductive?

Thank you.

117 posted on 02/13/2012 9:24:08 AM PST by marshmallow (.)
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To: ArrogantBustard
So ... it seems that some protestants think that child molesting is perfectly fine ... if the molester happens to be a protestant.

And your proof for that outrageous statement is where?

118 posted on 02/13/2012 9:38:42 AM PST by lupie
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To: E. Pluribus Unum
I stated...."..others don't claim to be Christ's Representatives either, as Catholicism claims their Priests are....and therein is the difference.

Your response was clearly....and twice no less...." No. No it doesn't."

So let's be clear about that.

Further let's just see what evil behaves like within the Priesthood and leadership......

"John Geoghan was engaging in oral sex with boys while instructing them to close their eyes and repetitively recite "Hail Marys,"..... Gauthe was forcing altar boys in Louisiana to repeatedly submit to and perform anal or oral intercourse with him – often molesting several boys in one family..... Estimates of the number of his victims, some of whom were as young as 7, ranged upwards of 100..... Geoghan swore boys to secrecy by telling them what they did was "confessional";... Gauthe, who often carried firearms, warned at least one boy that if he said anything Gauthe would harm his parents..... Inevitably, though, some of these boys did tell their parents. Diocesan authorities simply transferred him to another parish--and another, and another." Now this happened by just two of the many Priests now a matter of record. So yes, using your word, the church could be said as "evil" for enabling and assisting these criminals to continue their dastardly deeds.

119 posted on 02/13/2012 10:02:51 AM PST by caww
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To: denydenydeny
How many kids are abused by their public school teachers?

School teachers don't claim to Represent Jesus Christ to their students or their parents. The catholic church does claim their Priests as Representing Christ.....BIG difference.

120 posted on 02/13/2012 10:06:19 AM PST by caww
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To: lupie
Why, it's on this very thread.

It's obvious to anyone who reads this (and similar) threads with an open mind.

If the folks who are all bent out of shape over molesters who happen to be Catholic are ALSO bent out of shape over molesters who happen to be Protestant they can demonstrate it on this forum.

So far, they have failed to do so.

My statements are not outrageous.

The Protestant blindness to molestation within protestantism is outrageous.

121 posted on 02/13/2012 10:29:01 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: Pyro7480
they quickly turn to their real agenda, which is all their various doctrinal “issues” with the Church. Everyone with eyes to see can see through it.

Yet another diversion from the "real issue" of Priestly criminal perverts being protected and enabled to continue with their perversion by their leadership. It just goes on and on...and evidences that STILL the membership is in denial and in the darkness.

The publics eyes are very much opened and if you recall had the media not brought this out into the open nothing would have changed...and that's just a fact.

Church defenders who typically scream about 'anti-Catholic bias' and 'Catholic bashing' have no ground on which to stand....there is unequivocal evidence of massive cover-ups and a failure within the Roman Catholic Church...and today it's members continue to defend and divert attention to something or anything other than the indefensible.

122 posted on 02/13/2012 10:30:13 AM PST by caww
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To: lupie
BTW, I find it very strange that someone can quote verbatim the second part of my post, while appearing utterly oblivious to the first part.

Such apparent obliviousness does not seem to me to be indicative of honest discussion.

FWIW.

123 posted on 02/13/2012 10:31:21 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: caww

Shouldn’t you be out protesting soldiers’ funerals or something?


124 posted on 02/13/2012 10:42:16 AM PST by E. Pluribus Unum (Government is the religion of fascists and their parasites.)
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To: ArrogantBustard
The Protestant blindness to molestation within protestantism is outrageous.

Another baloney statement! There isn't a denomination out there that doesn't address the issue and move toward convicting the offenders when they are discovered....and every Protestant would be up in arms if it weren't addressed.

The fact is the catholic church was a magnet for these perverts because they knew they would be protected and would not face expulsion or criminal charges....and that's been proved in all these investigations. As well that the membership would turn their heads even when they suspected or knew about these criminal acts.

I lived in a community where the membership refused to address their Priest....in fact it was well known the kid he kept company with was his "Boy" toy. When asked why the membership didn't speak up it was said it's just how things have always been...it's not liked but people are afraid to make an issue about it for fear of the repercussions on the church and the Priest they love.

Once again evidencing that the reputation of the church outweighs the memberships concern for the welfare of their children

125 posted on 02/13/2012 10:44:20 AM PST by caww
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To: caww
I observe that when one throws a rock at a pack of mongrels, the dog that is hit yelps.

I am unimpressed by self-righteous whining.

Those protestants who claim to be outraged at child-molesting in protestant circles can prove by directing their outrage there. They can clean up their own house.

Or ... they can continue to prove my point.

126 posted on 02/13/2012 10:47:53 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: caww
Another baloney statement!

BTW, I have not yet made any "baloney statement" ... so I cannot be accused of making "another" one.

Just so's ya know.

127 posted on 02/13/2012 10:51:24 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: ArrogantBustard; lupie; 1000 silverlings; Alex Murphy; bkaycee; blue-duncan; boatbums; caww; ...
I observe that many protestants protest mightily against (accused) child molesters who happen to be Catholic ... and also protest mightily against the mere mention of child molesters who happen not to be Catholic.

So ... it seems that some protestants think that child molesting is perfectly fine ... if the molester happens to be a protestant.

Well, if the same Protestants who protest against mostleting Cathoic priests also protest against molesting Protestant ministers, how can you then conclude that Protestants think that molesting children is fine if the molester is Protestant?

128 posted on 02/13/2012 11:03:05 AM PST by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: metmom
ROFL!!!!

ProtestantISM is so predictable ...

The Pinging of the Swarm ...

The utter failure to comprehend simple English ...

The colossal missing of the point ...

Try again ...

One is inclined to wonder if any of The Swarm are any better at comprehending the English language than (s)he who pinged them.

129 posted on 02/13/2012 11:32:15 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: presently no screen name
This is not a teaching of the Church. If some pedophile pervert said it, that doesn't make it a teachng of the Church, it makes it a deception and a seduction tactic by the pervert. It is in no way, shape or form a Catholic doctrine.

To make it plain: if a child-rapist tells a child, "You're not allowed to disobey me because the Church says you can't disobey a priest," he is telling the child a falsehood--- and in this case, a damnable one.

130 posted on 02/13/2012 11:51:35 AM PST by Mrs. Don-o ("Justice and judgment are the foundation of His throne." Psalm 89:14)
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To: ArrogantBustard
You said in #108,
So ... it seems that some protestants think that child molesting is perfectly fine ... if the molester happens to be a protestant.

To which I asked (#118)for you to give your proof of that outrageous statement.

And your ambiguous answer to that is: Why, it's on this very thread.

Really? Where??? Which posts? which posters? Please give specific references to such an outrageous claim and why you think they are claing that. And yes, it is an outrageous claim that you make that Protestants think that molesting is fine is the molester is a protestant.

You totally miss the point.

131 posted on 02/13/2012 11:51:45 AM PST by lupie
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To: ArrogantBustard; metmom; Dr. Eckleburg; HarleyD

The Swarm?

Oh come now.....

Please keep your terminology straight here. The Swarm, better known as The Calvinist Swarm, is not engaged here. Besides, Metmom is not even a Calvinist.

What I’m seeing here is the utter failure to understand groups here on FR.

Try again.


132 posted on 02/13/2012 11:56:40 AM PST by Gamecock (I am so thankful for [the] active obedience of Christ. No hope without it. JGM)
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To: lupie
Read the thread. From the beginning. Pay attention to those who whine about the mere mention of protestant molesters.

Or not.

I don't GAS which you do, and I don't jump through hoops for you.

I merely point out the obvious.

And yes, it is an outrageous claim that you make that Protestants think that molesting is fine is the molester is a protestant.

ROFL!!!

What's outrageous is the protestants who protest the mere mention of protestant molesters.

133 posted on 02/13/2012 11:58:51 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: ArrogantBustard
Those protestants

Frankly I won't play the Catholic vs. Protestant game in regards to the catholic churches pedophile/homsexual scandal.....it's not relevant to the fact it's on the catholic churches doorstep to deal with and that IS just the facts.

Attempting to push it off at schools, protestants, the world, attorneys, authors, and the host of other diversions to somehow defend themselves isn't working nor should it. Neither will the comments made on this thread to divert and confuse the issue away from where it belongs.

The catholic church, over decades, supported and enabled the pedophile priests, as an entire institution from the pope on down. Both boys and girls by the thousands were abused over decades, even after being aware of the issue.

Facts are facts and these have been proved in the court of law...that Adult Priests in a positions of power took advantage of children and the entire catholic organization enabled it for decades. .....Even more shameful is that some people still try to deflect the blame..... This is as ugly as it gets.

134 posted on 02/13/2012 12:16:46 PM PST by caww
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To: ArrogantBustard

I didn’t think that you could. It isn’t a matter of jumping through hoops and you know it. And to think that YOU were the one whining about an “honest” discussion. :)


135 posted on 02/13/2012 12:18:55 PM PST by lupie
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To: NakedRampage; Religion Moderator

What’s with the *pronoun removed* phrases?

You are directly demeaning me, but using cute phrases to avoid “technically” doing so. That is not permissible on religion threads. I’ll let the religion moderator decide what to do with you.


136 posted on 02/13/2012 12:22:09 PM PST by Theo (May Rome decrease and Christ increase.)
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To: ArrogantBustard; Pyro7480; metmom; smvoice; boatbums; caww; RnMomof7; Iscool; ...
>>So ... it seems that some protestants think that child molesting is perfectly fine ... if the molester happens to be a protestant.<<

Find one comment by one Protestant who has ever said or intimated that child molestation by anyone is “perfectly fine”. Surely you aren’t making salacious accusations are you?

Now, as to the condemnation of the Catholic Church as per child molestation. Is there any other organization that professes to be headed by Christ’s “vicar” on earth? Is there any other organization on earth that professes to be able to “forgive sins”? Is there any other organization on earth purporting to be Christ’s only church on earth? Given that the Catholic Church makes all of those claims should they be held to higher standards than any other organization?

Claiming superior status then wanting held to the same standards as other organizations is hypocritical.

137 posted on 02/13/2012 12:24:15 PM PST by CynicalBear
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To: Gamecock

Now it’s time to blame posters for pinging others....lol....does it ever occur to them that we aren’t dpendant on being pinged, but also choose the articles of interest from the sidebars? LOL...

They are really trying hard to divert the topic of this thread.....denial, diversion, and deception might very well be the greater sin in this whole scandal the catholic church brought on itself....God is watching.


138 posted on 02/13/2012 12:24:42 PM PST by caww
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To: lupie
Do try to refrain from making it personal. Really. It's so simple to do. It's almost as simple as reading the first page of posts on this thread.

I have no interest in discussing this thread with anyone who is unwilling or unable to read it.

Bye.

139 posted on 02/13/2012 12:27:10 PM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: caww
I always appreciate the efforts of those who thoroughly demonstrate my points.
140 posted on 02/13/2012 12:29:40 PM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: CynicalBear
Wow ...

I made no accusation whatsoever.

I observed the fact, demonstrated on this forum, that many protestants object to the mere mention of protestant molesters.

I offer one possible explanation of that fact ... not an accusation, merely reporting on appearances.

For what possible good reason would a protestant object to the mention of protestant molesters?

Hmmmm?

The adherents of protestantISM have some explaining to do.

Or, they could resort to expelling the verbal equivalent of squid ink.

Their choice.

The protestant reaction to my comments has been very interesting ... and very damning of protestantISM.

Oh well ...

Back to observing.

141 posted on 02/13/2012 12:36:32 PM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: lupie
totally miss the point.

No lupie...they do get it.. they just are using the usual tactics to beat around the bush and protect themselves from the obvious decisions they would otherwise have to make make regarding their church.

It's not about denominations, schools, the press, lawyers or other institutes who have to address the issue...and they do address it...... It's about the long term cover-up and continued efforts to fight, deny, and move the blame somewhere other than where it belongs....all the while still pro-claiming their Priests represent Jesus Christ while using that position to feed their demented perversions, then finding safe-harbor behind the curtain of church leadership.

142 posted on 02/13/2012 12:38:14 PM PST by caww
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To: ArrogantBustard
my points

The points mentioned in the post had nothing to do with you....rather the article and the sexual perversion within the catholic church and coverup...as well as the denial and blame shifting which catholics continue to do to avoid the obvious.

Once again this lays on the doorstep of the catholic church to address and no amount of diversion is going to let them escape the outcome.

143 posted on 02/13/2012 12:44:24 PM PST by caww
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To: Theo
"Cronos and Petrosius,

I had said elsewhere ( http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/2841532/posts ) that the typical Roman Catholic response to pedophilia was to defend priests who are accused of it, to downplay pedophilia when it’s found within Roman Catholic leadership.

This thread is a perfect example. Instead of damning pedophiles, Roman Catholics defend their priests.

Your religion is sick. You need a reformation. 77 posted on Sunday, February 12, 2012 9:47:18 PM by Theo (May Rome decrease and Christ increase.)"

-------------------------------------------------- http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2831799/posts?q=1&;page=401

And my comment proved your assertion false. I went on to show that Scripture FORBIDS necromancy, or communication with the dead. Those who seek to communicate with those who have died receive terrible punishment. But you go ahead and speak with those who’ve died. Good luck with that. Again, Scripture CLEARLY forbids “praying” to anyone who has died, be they a saint or a sinner. 402 posted on Thursday, January 12, 2012 2:25:38 PM by Theo (May Rome decrease and Christ increase.)

_______________________________________________

Um. Yes, of course. So is that the entirety of your reply? Sounds like you’ve acquiesced. Nice.

388 posted on Thursday, January 12, 2012 1:58:06 PM by Theo (May Rome decrease and Christ increase.)

__________________________________________________

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2828933/posts?page=28#28

"

Ping to my reply to Cronos’ whining about my semantic faux pas. 28 posted on Thursday, January 05, 2012 3:58:28 PM by Theo (May Rome decrease and Christ increase.)

______________________________________

I see lots of pronouns in this poster's comments. I thought those weren't allowed? Whatever shall the religion moderator do with him?

144 posted on 02/13/2012 12:52:29 PM PST by NakedRampage (Puttin' the "stud" in Bible study)
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To: caww
ROFL!!!

So typical of protestantISM. ProtestantISM's position may be summarized as: "Let's talk about the filth in your house ... but don't you DARE mention the open sewer that I live in!!!"

ProtestantISM reminds me of Leftism ... the adherents of neither ideology seem capable of self examination.

Pity.

Bye ...

145 posted on 02/13/2012 12:55:12 PM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: Theo
"What’s with the *pronoun removed* phrases?

You are directly demeaning me, but using cute phrases to avoid “technically” doing so. That is not permissible on religion threads. I’ll let the religion moderator decide what to do with you."

FROM THE RELIGION MODERATOR'S HOMEPAGE: "When in doubt, review your use of the pronoun “you” before hitting “enter.”

My comment didn't use the word "you." Not even once.

146 posted on 02/13/2012 1:05:42 PM PST by NakedRampage (Puttin' the "stud" in Bible study)
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To: RobbyS; metmom
Poppycock.You are talking about high profile preachers who get caught. What is the usual practice of congregational churches? To discharge the pastor in order to avoid a split, because he will have his defenders. He will then go away, and is able either to find a new pulpit, or go off and start his own church. He must be discreet of course, but he has little to worry about because a deal has been made just to let him go, A Catholic priest, by contrast, remains a clerk within the Church until he is formally removed. Hence it is possible to trance his history if prosecutors can gain access to the books. With most Protestant churches, the record will have been purged, as part of the deal.

No doubt you have viable documentation of the above.

Patiently waiting........................................

147 posted on 02/13/2012 1:12:46 PM PST by OLD REGGIE (I am a Biblical Unitarian?)
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To: ArrogantBustard
>> I made no accusation whatsoever.<<

Here’s your statement

>> >>So ... it seems that some protestants think that child molesting is perfectly fine ... if the molester happens to be a protestant.<<

Trying to hide behind that carefully chosen word “seems” doesn’t work when making insinuations.

I’ll repeat my challenge.

>> Find one comment by one Protestant who has ever said or intimated that child molestation by anyone is “perfectly fine”.<<

You also said:

>> and also protest mightily against the mere mention of child molesters who happen not to be Catholic.<<

So I will add another challenge. Show where any Protestant “protested mightily against the mere mention of child molesters who happen not to be Catholic”.

You also didn’t answer the question of whether or not the Catholic Church should be held to a higher standard since they claim “vicar” of Christ and that they are the only true church on earth.

You can “observe” all you want but when you make comments without being able to back up your assertions you remove yourself from observer status.

148 posted on 02/13/2012 1:20:09 PM PST by CynicalBear
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To: OLD REGGIE
Do you believe in the Holy Trinity?

I am aware that the Unitarian Church does not endorse the doctrine of the Trinity, but since you've added the caveat 'biblical' Unitarian inyour tagline, I wondered if you disagree with the mainline Unitarian doctrine.

149 posted on 02/13/2012 1:23:25 PM PST by NakedRampage (Puttin' the "stud" in Bible study)
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To: CynicalBear
Incidently, I don't see any Catholics defending pedophiles, but that is a stock accusation made my protestants here.

My challenge; find a comment where a Catholic is defending a pedophile. Not a priest accused but not found guilty, find a comment made defending a convicted pedophile.

150 posted on 02/13/2012 1:27:05 PM PST by NakedRampage (Puttin' the "stud" in Bible study)
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