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To: Jake from AZ

1. General lowering of moral standards
2. A rise in infidelity, and illegitimacy
3. The reduction of women to objects used to satisfy men.
4. Government coercion in reproductive matters.

As for #1, who’s moral standing? Why does Christianity get to determine what moral standards are? Ours are obviously more lax then say fundamental Islam - but even within Christianity morals differ from extreme to non-existent.

The church is the domain of God and men’s souls are the domain of the church — for those willing to acquiesce and believe.

The government is the domain of the people and the laws are the domain of government.

We’ve already tried the Patriarch method of governing and we had the same problem, however they were from the extreme, like it was a sin for a woman to wear a dress above the ankle, wear makeup, dance, sing, celebrate.

Imagine the horror of a woman staining her lips with pomegranate and the thought that that would push civilization over the threshold of moral turpitude.

Each man should look after their own soul and the Church be there, unopposed by the government for those that join the flock. The church should look after itself without imposing its standards on the unwilling.

8 posted on 02/14/2012 9:14:35 AM PST by Usagi_yo
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To: Usagi_yo

> As for #1, who’s moral standing? Why does Christianity get
> to determine what moral standards are?

Is it wrong to murder?

Why? Where do you get the antiquated notion that murder is wrong?

“Birth Control” is better understood as “preemptive abortion”. The same spirit and reasoning is behind it. Sex without responsibility. Sex without children.

Because the government says it’s “legal” does not make it right.

Even worse when the government wants those of us with this perspective to PAY for it.

> like it was a sin for a woman to wear a dress above the ankle

For those of us, admittedly very few, who believe the accounts in Genesis, clothing was intended to conceal, not to reveal.

You can do whatever you want, you are free to make your own choices.

But I should not be made to pay for your choices nor to pay for the consequences of them.

13 posted on 02/14/2012 9:29:26 AM PST by Westbrook (Children do not divide your love, they multiply it.)
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To: Usagi_yo

Silly Usagi...don’t yu know, it’s not the church or it’s people that get to determine moral standards...this comes directly from God. You just don’t listen right.

15 posted on 02/14/2012 9:35:08 AM PST by stuartcr ("In this election year of 12, how deep into their closets will we delve?")
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To: Usagi_yo

So much ignorance is displayed in your post that one is wondering if you are a troll.

It is an historic fact that a culture with a moral standard that approves of indiscriminate sexual couplings is not the best template building a civil society consisting of a prudent people who are capable of upholding any ideals beyond the satisfaction of libidos.

Self occupied in the childish pursuit of pleasure at all costs they really don’t give a fig if the world collapses around them while their freedoms are absconded one by one.

There is no domain from which exclusion of morality has resulted in more prosperity, more liberty, more charity, more happiness and more cooperation. The absence of morality has certainly sowed the seeds of destruction in many domains.

Whenever somebody blathers on about Patriarchy I have a wonderful clue that they do not bother to let facts get in the way of their utterances. You give an example of a very, very narrow time period of history or I should say an imagined history since at no time was it considered sinful for a woman to sing and dance in any and all circumstances. The mores of dress were determined more by what was common to prostitutes making it a common prohibition that godly women not imitate their mode of dress and behavior. Declaring that immodest dress and behavior is wrong is not repressive and narrow minded, it is too have a very good understanding of the workings of the world and how best to encourage and preserve self respect and dignity. What is regarded as immodest will change from culture to culture but the standards applied are usually about protection of privacy, especially of sexual privacy.

If you think the matriarchal method of governing was a kinder, gentler, more tolerant and freedom loving method you are very much mistaken. I’ll sum it up in one word “Moloch”. That is the matriarchal system that the evil patriarchal Hebrews encountered after their long trek across the desert. Butterflies and unicorns it wasn’t. You should also know that “Some anthropologists and authors hold that there are no known societies that are unambiguously matriarchal” though there were exception. It was also the nasty patriarchal system of governance in which concepts such as human rights and personal autonomy developed.

The Church is not imposing anything on the unwilling She is exercising her religion just as the 1st amendment declares She has every right to do so. Those women who want artificial birth control can still lockstep themselves down to PP and get a script or a package of condoms and pay for it themselves or get their own insurance which covers such costs. What they can not do is demand their Catholic employer provide it to them.

26 posted on 02/14/2012 11:14:11 AM PST by lastchance ("Nisi credideritis, non intelligetis" St. Augustine)
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To: Usagi_yo

What exactly are you arguing against? What standards are they imposing on the unwilling? Is the fact that the Catholics comment on their appraisal of the general situation in society, and even express concern about it, some kind of imposition against your rights and freedom?

Sorry if I’m confused, but your arguments, superficially, are sounding like those I hear from the pro-aborts.

44 posted on 02/15/2012 12:03:02 AM PST by Boogieman
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