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Mormon church's racial history continues to haunt Romney
The Grio.com ^ | March 1, 2012 | Edward Wyckoff Williams

Posted on 03/06/2012 5:44:27 AM PST by Colofornian

Mitt Romney, despite a seemingly lackluster appeal to the Republican base, is steadily marching toward the GOP nomination. A relatively private man, Romney has suffered for appearing awkward in public. But the businessman turned politician is learning to be transparent: he has finally released his tax returns, made attempts to clarify a myriad number of changed policy positions, and has even held his own in debates -- fine tuning well-rehearsed attacks on President Obama ahead of their likely general election fight.

Yet there is one subject Romney has consistently avoided -- for good reason -- and that is the sordid history of racial insensitivity in the Mormon Church

theGrio: Black Mormons weigh Romney-Obama match-up

The issue garnered attention this week after the Washington Post published an article, "The Genesis of a Church's Stand on Race". In the article, Randy Bott, a well-regarded religious professor at Brigham Young University, which is owned by the Church of Latter-day Saints, sought to justify the church's previous exclusion of blacks to the priesthood, as well as the disturbing teachings -- and explicitly racist texts of the Book of Mormon.

"God has always been discriminatory," Bott said.

The professor compared prejudiced policies to a young child asking for keys to a father's car and conflated this with the Mormon ban on blacks.

"What is discrimination?" Bott asked. "I think that is keeping something from somebody that would be a benefit for them, right? But what if it wouldn't have been a benefit to them?" Professor Bott tried to explain that though blacks were not allowed into the priesthood before 1978, this meant that they were spared from being sent to the lower rung of hell.

It's a stretch - and a wholly insufficient answer for most reasonable minds - but Bott's comments actually reflected mainstream Mormon opinion for at least 150 years.

Founded in 1830, the Latter Day Saint (LDS) movement was started by Joseph Smith, who claimed to have received a revelation from which he penned the Book of Mormon. LDS theology claimed that people of the black African Diaspora were cursed. Today, Mormons still teach that a war in heaven took place when Jesus and Lucifer, both considered sons of God, disagreed on whether or not humans should be given free will.

According to Smith, Jesus believed that only a select few could be saved, while Lucifer believed that everyone should be given a chance at salvation. Smith's revelation purports that the spirits who sided with Lucifer ended up being born as darker-skinned people, cursed by God, and were undeserving of the priesthood.

Though Smith may have been unduly influenced by the slave-owning society in which he lived -- more than any actual spiritual awakening -- the official doctrine of the LDS Church still views his writings as divinely inspired. And despite the ban being lifted in 1978 -- more than a decade following the 1964 Civil Rights Act -- the Church has never disavowed the scripture or Joseph Smith and Brigham Young's teachings, which are fraught with racial bias.

Further complicating the matter are the dubious circumstances under which Mormon leaders eventually saw the light. In early 1978, the U.S. Department of Justice threatened to revoke the LDS tax-exempt status if it continued to discriminate on the basis of race. It was then that the Mormon "living prophet" declared his new revelation -- thereby protecting millions, if not billions, in potential tax liabilities.

In response to Ricard Bott's claims, the Church of Latter-day Saints issued an official statement yesterday condemning racism, "including any and all past racism by individuals both inside and outside the church."

This represented the most forceful statement the Church has made on the subject to date, but if the story gains more traction -- or if Bott defends his stance -- this will undoubtedly prove to be a mitigating factor for Mitt Romney, forcing him to speak about the racial politics of his faith.

Romney has claimed that he was so moved when the church finally allowed blacks into the priesthood that he broke into tears. Yet he was a full grown man in his 30s and there is no evidence whatsoever that he previously objected to or campaigned against the blatantly racist policies.


TOPICS: History; Moral Issues; Other non-Christian; Religion & Politics
KEYWORDS: inman; lds; mittromney; mormon; racism
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From the article: Romney has claimed that he was so moved when the church finally allowed blacks into the priesthood that he broke into tears. Yet he was a full grown man in his 30s and there is no evidence whatsoever that he previously objected to or campaigned against the blatantly racist policies.

This right here will be the mantra repeated over & over & over & over again if Romney won the nomination.

A race about economics & social issues & world policies would be reduced by the MSM & Obamaites to a referendum on racism...all with the pre-approval of the GOP establishment!

Sickening!

The issue garnered attention this week after the Washington Post published an article, "The Genesis of a Church's Stand on Race". In the article, Randy Bott, a well-regarded religious professor at Brigham Young University, which is owned by the Church of Latter-day Saints, sought to justify the church's previous exclusion of blacks to the priesthood, as well as the disturbing teachings -- and explicitly racist texts of the Book of Mormon. "God has always been discriminatory," Bott said..."What is discrimination?" Bott asked. "I think that is keeping something from somebody that would be a benefit for them, right? But what if it wouldn't have been a benefit to them?" Professor Bott tried to explain that though blacks were not allowed into the priesthood before 1978, this meant that they were spared from being sent to the lower rung of hell.

So, let's see. The Mormons have proxy-baptized racist Hitler see Hitler Baptized as a Mormon...and this BYU prof was claiming that God wanted blacks to live on lower rungs of heaven -- like Hitler's rung -- because this might somehow pre-empt them from winding up in a worse place?

Ah...such Mormon theology from the "most popular" BYU prof on campus in 2008...the year, btw, when he wrote his first blog on a similar topic as this...and one that didn't rile the BYU campus or Mormon hierarchy...showing that BYU & the Mormon hierarchy are still racist!

1 posted on 03/06/2012 5:44:36 AM PST by Colofornian
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To: All
From the article: ...Bott's comments actually reflected mainstream Mormon opinion for at least 150 years.

Well, one would like to think that Mormonism's policy change wiped out its official sanctioning of racism.

Wrong-o, boy-o:

Here's five Book of Mormon verses below talking about how the "skin of blackness" is a "cursing" based upon their "iniquity" (2 Nephi 5:21; Alma 3:6; Jacob 3:5) and how when the curse would be removed, they would again become "white" (3 Nephi 2:15), which the Book of Mormon says is a "delightsome" color (2 Nephi 5:21; cf. older version of 2 Nephi 30:6):

The Mormon "prophets" Nephi, Alma and the Mormon Jacob are racists!

* "And he had caused the cursing to come upon them, yea, even a sore cursing, because of their iniquity. For behold, they had hardened their hearts against him, that they had become like unto a flint; wherefore, as they were white, and exceeding fair and delightsome, that they might not be enticing unto my people the Lord God did cause a skin of blackness to come upon them." (2 Nephi 5:21)

* "...many generations shall not pass away among them, save they shall be a white and delightsome people." (2 Nephi 30:6, pre-1981 versions...changed from unknown reasons in 1981 to "fair and delightsome"...It's not like the Mormon church has the supposed gold plates to go back and look to interpret a word differently)

* "And the skins of the Lamanites were dark, according to the mark which was set upon their fathers, which was a curse upon them because of their transgression and their rebellion against the their brethren..." (Alma 3:6)

* "Behold, the Lamanites your brethren, whom ye hate because of their filthiness and the cursing which hath come upon their skins..." (Jacob 3:5) [Note: The "Lamanites" per Mormonism are Native Americans...so their skin color, says Mormon "scripture" is based upon a supposed curse]

* "And their curse was taken from them, and their skin became white like unto the Nephites." (3 Nephi 2:15) [Note: So...to be "uncursed" is to have your skin turn white...per Romney's Mormonism, that is!]

The Book of Abraham verses are 1:24-27..."and thus, from Ham, sprang that race which preserved the curse in the land." (v. 24)...Pharaoh was then supposedly "cursed...as pertaining to the Priesthood. Now, Pharaoh, being of that lineage by which he could not have the right of Priesthood..." (v. 26-27)

Some Mormons talk as if a darker skin color as-a-supposed-curse was just ONLY some talk in the past. Uh, no! Look at the verses above -- Alma 3:6 and Jacob 3:5, for example. They also talk as if the "curse of Ham" being a darker skin color was also just some teaching that's been jettisoned. Well, then why is the Book of Abraham phrasing still there in their Mormon "scripture" -- the Pearl of Great Price?

2 posted on 03/06/2012 5:45:56 AM PST by Colofornian ( Those who militate vs. 'sola scriptura' lack the character of nobility (Acts 17:11))
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To: Colofornian

Ah yes, here it comes.

The much-awaited and predictable attack on Mormonism.

Slimey.


3 posted on 03/06/2012 5:49:27 AM PST by Nabber
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To: All
From the article: ...Bott's comments actually reflected mainstream Mormon opinion for at least 150 years.

It's not just the Book of Mormon & Pearl of Great Price (half of Mormonism's "scriptures") that are openly racist. Consider the following "revelation" from the Mormon god to Joseph Smith...deemed as "scripture" in "Doctrine & Covenants" -- a "sacred" doc embraced & endorsed by Mitt Romney & true-believing Mormons everywhere!

Well, it’s mid-1835. Smith is churning out new “Scripture.” Smith is taking aim at new converts. But in that time, did he believe the Mormon “gospel” to be aimed at slaves? (No, not unless express “permission” was granted by their “owners”).

Could you imagine a verse still applicable today—one similar to the Mormon scripture of Doctrine & Covenants 134:12—which would tell you in effect that yes, the gospel was for women who are sexually trafficked--but only if their Pimp-owner says "Yes?".

I mean, imagine if you will, for a moment, that you are the God of the universe; God of every planet; God of the earth; Creator of every person. Imagine for a moment you are speaking forth universal eternal truth. And then imagine that someone claims you (as God) made the following “Scriptural” statement:

”We believe it just to preach the gospel to the nations of the earth, and warn the righteous to save themselves from the corruption of the world; but we do not believe it right to interfere with bond-servants, neither preach the gospel to, nor baptize them contrary to the will and wish of their masters, nor to meddle with or influence them in the least to cause them to be dissatisfied with their situations in this life, thereby jeopardizing the lives of men; such interference we believe to be unlawful and unjust, and dangerous to the peace of every government allowing human beings to be held in servitude.”

D&C 134:12 is LDS “Doctrine” that has never been removed or rescinded!!! This passages makes it quite clear – in contrast to the apostle Paul who vied for the religious freedom of Onesimus while treating him as a full Christian brother and encouraged Philemon to do the same--somehow, LDS think that "religious freedom" applies to everyone except slaves!

D&C 134:12, written in 1835 pro-slavery America, made it quite clear that instead of the Mormons having a universal god who issued eternal truth applicable to all cultures, he is instead an American-sounding god who speaks only in King James English & was beholden to the American slavery industry.

D&C 134:12 "settles" the issue for the Mormon: Are slaves & trafficking victims worthy of the "gospel?" LDS Answer? Nope! "neither preach the gospel to, nor baptize them..." says LDS "Scripture.

And why not? Well, says D&C 134:12: We don't want ya ta meddle with the Mastuhs' business “property,” or to say it as precisely as LDS "scripture" says it: nor to meddle with or influence them in the least to cause them to be dissatisfied with their situations in this life...

(Nah. We can't have unhappy slaves or trafficking victims now, can we? Too disturbing to their "stations" of life, eh?)

Now what are the ultimate reasons for this again? D&C 134:12 provides the answer:

Reason #1: ...such interference we believe to be unlawful and unjust... (There ya have it...wouldn't want to be "unjust" by giving slaves the gospel & baptizing them, would ya?)

Reason #2: ...and dangerous to the peace of every government allowing human beings to be held in servitude. (And, of course, the "closer": Wouldn't want to disturb the peace & quiet of slavery-sanctioning governments, now would ya?)

4 posted on 03/06/2012 5:50:22 AM PST by Colofornian ( Those who militate vs. 'sola scriptura' lack the character of nobility (Acts 17:11))
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place marker


5 posted on 03/06/2012 6:20:55 AM PST by svcw (Only difference between Romney & BH is one thinks he will be god & other one thinks he already is.)
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To: Colofornian

I don’t think I’ve read anywhere about Mormons being involved black lynchings. Why aren’t the Pubies constantly reminding the sheeple that the Dems were the party against civil rights.


6 posted on 03/06/2012 6:34:14 AM PST by golf lover (going)
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To: Nabber
Do you think the Left wing media will give him a pass on it? Any opposition to Obama is already claimed to be racist. Romney is such an ideal target for the Left, it's hard to imagine a better one. Member of an all white racist church. A rich guy that earns his living by destroying jobs. The boys in Chicago have to be throwing a party today.
7 posted on 03/06/2012 6:42:50 AM PST by throwback ( The object of opening the mind, as of opening the mouth, is to shut it again on something solid.)
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To: Colofornian
Romney has claimed that he was so moved when the church finally allowed blacks into the priesthood that he broke into tears. Yet he was a full grown man in his 30s and there is no evidence whatsoever that he previously objected to or campaigned against the blatantly racist policies.

What a crock.

Never did the Romney family do anything to stop the practice or even reevaluate, oh yea why would they, the lds gods said black people where cursed.

Seriously, if you are a mormon and your gods said blacks where cursed and valueless, why would Romney weep over this.

Curious that mormons don't seem to have a problem with their gods changing ther minds about stuff.

8 posted on 03/06/2012 6:53:14 AM PST by svcw (Only difference between Romney & BH is one thinks he will be god & other one thinks he already is.)
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To: throwback

“Do you think the Left wing media will give him a pass on it? Any opposition to Obama is already claimed to be racist. Romney is such an ideal target for the Left, it’s hard to imagine a better one. Member of an all white racist church.”

Yes, i would expect the MSM to give Romney the same consideration and treatment as they gave BO’s attendance [maybe he was just present] at the Hate America church of the Rev Wright.


9 posted on 03/06/2012 7:08:30 AM PST by IWONDR
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To: Colofornian
Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton will have a hayday with this one. I'm sure they are in that bull pen as we type, waiting for the chance to pounce forth on this issue should Bishop Romney win. So Be it.

They will simply have to say, "It is not about his mormonISM, but that mormons are RACIST", see how that will work? So be it.

10 posted on 03/06/2012 8:49:26 AM PST by annieokie
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To: Colofornian

11 posted on 03/06/2012 9:01:57 AM PST by T Minus Four
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To: golf lover
I don’t think I’ve read anywhere about Mormons being involved black lynchings

Well, think about it...such lynchings tended to occur where blacks lived...

How white was Utah (territory & state)? Pretty white...a few were slaves during Utah's territory days...(why would you hang your so-called 'property'?)

Mormons deliberately forged their own isolated, insulated communities thruout the 1840s & beyond...they alone were dictating social dynamics...allowing themm to continue practicing polygamy into the 20th century...

12 posted on 03/06/2012 10:07:21 AM PST by Colofornian ( Those who militate vs. 'sola scriptura' lack the character of nobility (Acts 17:11))
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To: Colofornian

“We took from them almost all of their land—the reservations are just a tiny remnant of traditional tribal homelands. We tried to take from them their hunting rights, their fishing rights, the timber on their land. We tried to take from them their water rights. We tried to take from them their culture, their religion, their identity, and perhaps most importantly we tried to take from them their freedom. And what is so amazing about this whole story is that we failed. We failed after hundreds of years of trying to take everything from American Indians. We failed to do that. They are still here and there’s survival; that great saga of survival is one of the great stories of all mankind.” - Dr. Daniel McCool University of Utah

There is no mystery or a plethora of complex reasons why the Black Hawk War happened, it’s very simple really, the Native Ute Indians of Utah were being set-upon and victimized by the United States Government and, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints-—the Mormons. The truth regarding the history of the war has since been cloaked in brilliantly managed rhetoric by the victors who blame and demonize the Ute Nation in every conceivable way, and understanding this aspect of the accounts between the Government, Church and the Native peoples is when the story becomes woefully strange, and convoluted.

There are always two sides to any war. People say, “that’s all in the past we just need to get over it.” Like their forefathers before them, the descendents of the predominate culture of Utah refuse to acknowledge the cruel mistreatment of Utah’s American Indian peoples. That demoralization and racism have become institutionalized. Utahan’s say it’s the Indian people who are to blame, “we gave them every opportunity to succeed... it’s their own damn fault.” And so remember, racism has to be taught. Children learn racism from their families, teachers and community.

What is the Ute Indians’ side of the story? And, why has their history, their account, their interpretation, their version been purposely ignored and long omitted from school curricula and historical accounts?

When people are denied access to their own true history by educators and institutions as both American Indians and non-Indians of Utah have been, when Indian students are forced to accept solely the victors point of view, when cultural traditions and customs of the American Indian are systematically replaced by western beliefs; when they are denied their right to speak their own language and denied their religious freedom, when they are repeatedly denied equal access to justice and protection under the law, when these things happen it then becomes cultural genocide, assimilation, a fulfillment of the Doctrine of Discovery.

“The Time has come when Indian people need to stop being victimized. They need to tell their story and demand that it be told accurately.” - Forrest S. Cuch Former Director of Indian Affairs/Member of the Ute Tribe

A Brief Synopsis of How the Black Hawk War Began
“There was a time when our people were happy and content living in the majestic mountains and fertile green valleys of Utah. Then the Mormons came, and our people were killed—the old, the young, the children, women—and many taken to reservations where many more would die.” - Member of the Ute Tribe

Christian crusaders attempted to reason with the Indian people saying they had the right to take possession of their land because the Indians were heathens, non-Christians, who didn’t believe in the bible or Jesus, the Messiah. And this is the basis for the denial of Indian rights in federal Indian law today, based upon the metaphor that the American Indians are the Canaanites or pagans in the promised land. “Consequently, the current situation of Indigenous Peoples around the world is the result of a linear program of “legal” precedent, originating with the Doctrine of Discovery and codified in contemporary national laws and policies. The Doctrine mandated Christian European countries to attack, enslave and kill the Indigenous Peoples they encountered and to acquire all of their assets” - Steven T. Newcomb Indigenous Law Institute and author of “Pagans in the Promised Land.” Also quotes from WCC Executive Committee 14-17 February 2012 Bossey, Switzerland (see also Doctrine of Discovery)

The early settlers are portrayed by the victor’s accounts as people who were fair-minded and of good intentions when they came to Utah. And upon arriving they were confronted by Indians whom they described as “friendly toward the Mormons” but later they were inaccurately and unfairly judged as barbaric wild savages who terrorized them.

In 1853 Ute leader Walkara (Black Hawk’s uncle) told interpreter M. S. Martenas, “He (Walkara) said that he had always been opposed to the whites set[t]ling on the Indian lands, particularly that portion which he claims; and on which his band resides and on which they have resided since his childhood, and his parents before him—that the Mormons when they first commenced the settlement of Salt Lake Valley, was friendly, and promised them many comforts, and lasting friendship—that they continued friendly for a short time, until they became strong in numbers, then their conduct and treatment towards the Indians changed—they were not only treated unkindly, but many were much abused and this course has been pursued up to the present—sometimes they have been treated with much severity—they have been driven by this population from place to place—settlements have been made on all their hunting grounds in the valleys, and the graves of their fathers have been torn up by the whites.” - STATEMENT, M. S. MARTENAS, INTERPRETER Great Salt Lake City, July 6 1853 Brigham Young Papers, MS 1234, Box 58, Folder 14
LDS Archives - Will Bagley Transcription

The truth is Utah Indian people were a vibrant productive culture, and didn’t have any particular animosity toward early Mormon pioneers, only that they were trespassing on their land, whereas, according to the Book of Mormon, the church believed they had a divine right to the land and an obligation to convert Utah’s American Indians to Mormonism, according to church doctrine, and in so doing the so-called “loathsome” Indians would become a “white and delightsome people” and would be forgiven of the sins of their forefathers. (Book of Mormon 2 Nephi 5:21-23) According to church doctrine, the nature of the dark skin was a curse, the cause was the Lord, the reason was because the Lamanites “had hardened their hearts against him, (God)” and the punishment was to make them “loathsome” unto God’s people who had white skins.

“When the Ute failed to assimilate into Mormon culture, the answer was to exterminate them.” - Historian Robert Carter

“It Was Question Of Supremacy Between the White Man and the Indian”
It was in 1850 when Mormon apostle George A. Smith, cousin to Church founder Joseph Smith, declared that the Indian people “have no right to their land” and he instructed the all-Mormon legislature to “extinguish all titles” and get them out of the way and onto reservations. This set the stage for the infamous Black Hawk War that would follow. Smith was 33 years of age when making decisions affecting the lives of thousands of Native peoples.

At the age of 49 Church President Brigham Young’s victory was perhaps a hollow one for, in order to fulfill his dream, he had to destroy a civilization. He complained it was “cheaper to feed them than to fight them,” as he was spending millions in church funds equipping his private army to war against them. Brigham paid his Generals as much as $300 a month while soldiers were being paid some $16.00 a month to rid the land of it’s Indian inhabitants. Then in 1866 the United States government reimbursed Brigham some 1.5 million for military expenses. (See Memorial of the Legislative Assembly of Utah)

Brigham Young was quoted by the Denver Rocky Mountain Newspaper as saying, “You can get rid of more Indians with a sack of flour, than a keg of powder.” Just how many of the some 70,000 Indians did he get rid of? By 1909 the U.S. Census reported that the Indian population had decreased to just 2300.

The gruesome be headings of some 40 Ute corpses in 1850, heads stacked in boxes, and hung by their long hair from the eves of buildings at Fort Utah, has long been ignored, “You didn’t see the Indians beheading the Mormons.” - Historian Robert Carter

What was the motivation behind such barbarianism? Money? You guessed it, the severed heads were shipped to Washington and sold for “scientific examination.” Some heads would fetch as much as a $100 each, a small fortune in those times.

In 1863, 593 Shoshone men women and children were brutally massacred at Bear River. “As the Indians tried desperate measures to fight off the U.S. Army *(led by Patrick Edward Connor and supported by Brigham Young), including the use of tomahawks and archery, the soldiers seemed to lose all sense of control and discipline. Hundreds of corpses were left to be eaten by animals and the bones remained uncovered for years to follow”. - Rod Miller Author of Massacre at Bear River - *Words parenthesized are of my own.

“The Bear River Massacre has been ignored. It was not in the interest of key players—the military and the Mormons—to remember..” - Salt Lake Tribune

On the night of April 21, 1866 another heinous crime was committed in Circleville, Utah, led by LDS Bishop William Jackson Allred and his son James T. S.. While being held captive in a below ground shelter, one by one , 24 in all, women, men, and children, their throats were cut . Two young boys and one girl, seven or eight years of age were told by their mother to run for their lives, and when the door was opened for the next victim to be killed the three made a break and forced their way past the guards and ran. The guards fired several shots at the three but were unable to hit them. One was shot in the side but the bullet barely grazed his rib, not enough to stop him. All of the Paiute males, five women, and two older children were murdered. The only crime that history accounts accuses these innocent victims of is that they were Indian. - (As told to me by living descendents of one of the boys who survived.)

“In those early days it was, at times, imperative that harsh measures should be used. We had to do these things, or be run over by them. It was a question of supremacy between the white man and the Indian.” - John Lowry 1894

A Few Interesting Facts To Ponder
The names “Black Hawk” and “Antonga” are they Ute Indian names? The name “Black Hawk” is not a Ute name. It was a name Brigham Young, in jest, called the Ute’s leader. So it became that Brigham Young’s supercilious term, ‘Black Hawk,’ is the name by which he is now most commonly known. In fact there were some three or more Indians the whites referred to as Black Hawk in Utah history. It was a sarcastic joke, a mockery referring to the Sauk and Fox Indian tribes (Mesquaki) under the leadership of the real Chief Black Hawk and the tragic Black Hawk War of 1832 in Illinois, where the Mormons migrated from. It was, perhaps, a sinister message to the Utes that a similar destiny awaited them.

To the Mexicans he was known as “Antonga”, also not a Ute name. Utah’s Black Hawk was born into family of legendary leaders and known to the Utes as Nuch, he was so named in honor of his people the Nuchu, a sacred name the Utes call themselves.

So, why is it called “The Black Hawk War” when there were never any black hawk Indians in Utah, or elsewhere for that matter, when none of the Indians in Utah called themselves Black Hawk? For to do so only serves to perpetuate the dark cynicism that helped to demoralize the Native peoples of Utah. You see, the story gets a lot more interesting when you talk to the Utes.

Before Chief Nuch died in 1870, deathly ill from a bullet wound he received over a year earlier at Gravelly Ford while attempting to rescue a fallen comrade, he traveled 180 miles by horse and visited every Mormon village to apologize for the pain and suffering he and his warriors had caused. He said to them, “you broken your promises, stolen our land, killed our children, men and women, and spread disease among my people.” He then asked for forgiveness and pleaded with the settlers to do the same, and end the bloodshed. “You didn’t see that happening on the part of the settlers”, said Forrest Cuch, “So it took a greater man to do such a thing. And that’s what is overlooked in the victors’ accounts.”

“It was white history that wrote it—that he surrendered. And no, a man like that don’t surrender. He’ll come to terms with reality. I’m done, we’re done, we, we did what we could, we’re done. But it gets written differently... And like any of us, I think you get to a point where it’s like any war, you get in and you do what you’ve got to do. And maybe there’s a family there, and you killed, killed their kids—you, as a human, that thing we all are, is going to at least make you say I’m sorry.” - Larry Cesspooch/Member of the Ute Tribe

Shocking Post War Relations
Was the Black Hawk war over in 1873 as scholars say? The Mormons got their Indian land and the Transcontinental Railroad had come through. Black Hawk died in 1870. Ninety percent of the Indian population had died since the Mormons arrived in 1847. Fifteen hundred Utes were forced to walk to the reservation in the Uintah Basin where they were abandoned, and 500 more died from starvation in the first year. Were the whites satisfied? No, not yet.

On September 20, 1919, an article appeared on the front page of the Deseret News with the headline, “Bones of Black Hawk on Exhibition L.D.S. Museum.” Within the article, the writer explains that first, the remains of Black Hawk had been on public display in the window of a hardware store in downtown Spanish Fork, Utah. Then Benjamin Guarded, the man in charge of the L.D.S. Museum, acquired the remains for public display on Temple Square. For decades, the remains of Black Hawk, and those of an Indian woman and a child, were on display in the church museum on Temple Square in downtown Salt Lake City.

Just 49 years had passed since Chief Black Hawk had been laid to rest in 1870 at Spring Lake, Utah, when members of the LDS Church plotted the robbery of his grave. Accompanying the article is a photo of William E. Croff standing in the open grave, grinning ear to ear, while holding the skull of Nuch (Black Hawk). While the living descendents of Nuch were outraged, their voices fell on deaf ears. Seemingly without conscience or remorse church leaders condoned the practice, in spite of a federal law passed in 1906 called the Graves Protection Act. Descendents of Nuch had no real legal recourse until the enactment of the National American Graves Protection Reparation Act, or NAGPRA, passed in 1994.

Chief Nuch was again reburied in the year 1996. It took an act of Congress, the help of National Forest Service archeologist Charmain Thomson, and the humanitarian efforts of a boy scout Shane Armstrong to find and rebury the remains of Nuch (Black Hawk). This raises the question why a Christian religious institution and its leaders would have no compassion or respect for the family of Chief Nuch who were members of the church. Was the reason simply amusement for others? Was grave robbing for art, pleasure, punishment, a morbid fascination of death, divine obligation, or, most importantly, was it a question of supremacy between the white man and the Indian?

http://www.blackhawkproductions.com/


13 posted on 03/06/2012 10:16:13 AM PST by AnTiw1 (...sailboat bum ready to expatriate...)
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To: golf lover

Lynchings were mostly about crime, not race, the racial percentages were pretty close to crime statistics today.


14 posted on 03/06/2012 12:14:31 PM PST by ansel12 (Santorum-Catholic and "I was basically pro-choice all my life, until I ran for Congress" he said))
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To: ansel12
MORMONs ADMIT blacks...





"You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind.

The first man that committed the odious crime of killing one of his brethren will be cursed the longest of any one of the children of Adam. Cain slew his brother. Cain might have been killed, and that would have put a termination to that line of human beings.

This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which is the flat nose and black skin. Trace mankind down to after the flood, and then another curse is pronounced upon the same race--that they should be the 'servant of servants', and they will be, until that curse is removed."

Brigham Young-President and second 'Prophet' of the Mormon Church, 1844-1877- Extract from Journal of Discourses.



Here are two examples from their 'other testament', the Book of Mormon.

2 Nephi 5: 21 'And he had caused the cursing to come upon them, yea, even a sore cursing, because of their iniquity. For behold, they had hardened their hearts against him, that they had become like unto a flint; wherefore, as they were white, and exceedingly fair and delightsome, that they might not be enticing unto my people, the Lord God did cause a skin of blackness to come upon them.'

Alma 3: 6 'And the skins of the Lamanites were dark, according to the mark which was set upon their fathers, which was a curse upon them because of their transgression and their rebellion against their brethren, who consisted of Nephi, Jacob and Joseph, and Sam, who were just and holy men.'



August 27, 1954 in an address at Brigham Young University (BYU), Mormon Elder, Mark E Peterson, in speaking to a convention of teachers of religion at the college level, said:

"The discussion on civil rights, especially over the last 20 years, has drawn some very sharp lines. It has blinded the thinking of some of our own people, I believe. They have allowed their political affiliations to color their thinking to some extent.I think I have read enough to give you an idea of what the Negro is after."

"He is not just seeking the opportunity of sitting down in a cafe where white people eat. He isn't just trying to ride on the same streetcar or the same Pullman car with white people. It isn't that he just desires to go to the same theater as the white people. From this, and other interviews I have read, it appears that the Negro seeks absorption with the white race. He will not be satisfied until he achieves it by intermarriage."

"That is his objective and we must face it. We must not allow our feelings to carry us away, nor must we feel so sorry for Negroes that we will open our arms and embrace them with everything we have. Remember the little statement that we used to say about sin, 'First we pity, then endure, then embrace'...."

(Rosa Parks would have probably told Petersen under which wheel of the bus he should go sit.)



1967, (then) Mormon President Ezra Taft Benson said,

"The Communist program for revolution in America has been in progress for many years and is far advanced. First of all, we must not place the blame upon Negroes. They are merely the unfortunate group that has been selected by professional Communist agitators to be used as the primary source of cannon fodder."



We are told that on June 8, 1978, it was 'revealed' to the then president, Spencer Kimball, that people of color could now gain entry into the priesthood.

According to the church, Kimball spent many long hours petitioning God, begging him to give worthy black people the priesthood. God finally relented.



Sometime before the 'revelation' came to chief 'Prophet' Spencer Kimball in June 1978, General Authority, Bruce R McConkie had said:

"The Blacks are denied the Priesthood; under no circumstances can they hold this delegation of authority from the Almighty.

The Negroes are not equal with other races where the receipt of certain blessings are concerned, particularly the priesthood and the temple blessings that flow there from, but this inequality is not of man's origin, it is the Lord's doings."

(Mormon Doctrine, pp. 526-527).



When Mormon 'Apostle' Mark E Petersen spoke on 'Race Problems- As they affect the Church' at the BYU campus in 1954, the following was also said:

"...if the negro accepts the gospel with real, sincere faith, and is really converted, to give him the blessings of baptism and the gift of the Holy Ghost, he can and will enter the celestial kingdom. He will go there as a servant, but he will get celestial glory."



When Mormon 'Prophet' and second President of the Church, Brigham Young, spoke in 1863 the following was also said:

"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God is death on the spot. This will always be so."

(Journal of Discourses, Vo. 10, p. 110)





Yeah; Native Americans are althroughout the Book of MORMON; too.

 

“I saw a striking contrast in the progress of the Indian people today ... they are fast becoming a white and delightsome people.... For years they have been growing delightsome, and they are now becoming white and delightsome, as they were promised.... The children in the home placement program in Utah are often lighter than their brothers and sisters in the hogans on the reservation.

At one meeting a father and mother and their sixteen-year-old daughter were present, the little member girl-sixteen-sitting between the dark father and mother, and it was evident she was several shades lighter than her parents—on the same reservation, in the same hogan, subject to the same sun and wind and weather.... These young members of the Church are changing to whiteness and to delightsomeness.

One white elder jokingly said that he and his companion were donating blood regularly to the hospital in the hope that the process might be accelerated.

 

(Improvement Era, December 1960, pp.922-23). (p. 209)

 



 

15 posted on 03/06/2012 3:02:03 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

Why did you post that to me?


16 posted on 03/06/2012 3:52:10 PM PST by ansel12 (Santorum-Catholic and "I was basically pro-choice all my life, until I ran for Congress" he said))
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To: Nabber

“The much-awaited and predictable attack on Mormonism.”

Wow, you are really behind the times! We’ve been exposing mormonism the cult since before 2008.

Nice to know you were still waiting...


17 posted on 03/06/2012 3:54:23 PM PST by aMorePerfectUnion (I wouldnÂ’t vote for Romney for dog catcher if he was in a three way race against Lenin and Marx!)
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To: ansel12
Why did you post that to me?

You just got lucky I guess!

(it was supposed to be to the PICTURE of the paper with that column heading - #11)

18 posted on 03/06/2012 8:29:46 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

I still don’t get it, but it was an awfully long post.


19 posted on 03/06/2012 8:37:45 PM PST by ansel12 (Santorum-Catholic and "I was basically pro-choice all my life, until I ran for Congress" he said))
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To: ansel12
#11 MORMONs admit blacks: meaning, of course, to allow entrance.

That MORMONism now is going to IGNORE all of the things it has said in the past about blacks - pretending the SCRIPTURE has somehow become invisible.


#15 MORMONs admit blacks: meaning (evidently not obviously) to confess.

That MORMONism thinks thusly about blacks, but are CHOOSING to ignore their own Scriptures.

20 posted on 03/07/2012 4:02:41 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

All I did was post that single sentence in post 14.

That was all, I don’t need to be pinged to those long, long, oversized, unpersonalized, all emcompassing, almost pages, of cut and pastes that you do, I don’t read them anyway.


21 posted on 03/07/2012 9:57:39 AM PST by ansel12 (Santorum-Catholic and "I was basically pro-choice all my life, until I ran for Congress" he said))
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To: ansel12
All I did was post that single sentence in post 14.

And I've already explained it should have been posted to someone else in reply #18.


That was all, I don’t need to be pinged to those long, long, oversized, unpersonalized, all emcompassing, almost pages, of cut and pastes that you do, I don’t read them anyway.

Looks like you missed the small, personalized one as well.

22 posted on 03/07/2012 12:26:52 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: All
...I don’t need to be pinged to those long, long, oversized, unpersonalized, all emcompassing, almost pages, of cut and pastes that you do, I don’t read them anyway.

Folks; if I've accidently included you in a reply I make; and you've seen it before, and it somehow offends you; I'm really not trying to aggravate you on purpose.

There are LURKERS who have NEVER seen what I've posted before: it's for them.

23 posted on 03/07/2012 12:29:44 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie
I doubt it.
24 posted on 03/07/2012 1:33:44 PM PST by BlueMoose
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To: BlueMoose

I guess I can still rely on you, Moose!


25 posted on 03/07/2012 2:36:12 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

i doubt it?


26 posted on 03/07/2012 6:07:59 PM PST by BlueMoose
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To: T Minus Four

Carriages without horses shall go,
and accidents fill the world with woe.


27 posted on 03/08/2012 4:41:05 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: T Minus Four

But church leaders
have always said that the time
would come when blacks
would be given the right to
hold the priesthood.


28 posted on 03/08/2012 4:44:03 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: T Minus Four

I, for one, would like to see the above sentiment printed in MORMON documentation; for the stuff that I HAVE seen sure has a strange way of saying it!


29 posted on 03/08/2012 4:45:23 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

“The Blacks are denied the Priesthood; under no circumstances can they hold this delegation of authority from the Almighty.”

—General Authority, Bruce R McConkie


30 posted on 03/08/2012 4:48:05 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Nabber
I find this bigotry fascinating and sad. This forum has a cult calling another
religion a cult.

The anti-Mormon posts are not about religion - - they're about EGO.

31 posted on 03/08/2012 4:49:46 AM PST by Loud Mime (When conceit and anger are part of your religion, it's a political movement, not a religion.)
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To: Elsie
 <em>Mormon Doctrine</em> [Book] 
Mormon Doctrine [Book]
 
 
 
by Bruce R. McConkie - Deseret Book Co (1958.04) - paperback
 

I'll bet it did NOT cost this much when in print!!!

32 posted on 03/08/2012 4:58:19 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Loud Mime
I find this bigotry fascinating and sad. This forum has a cult calling another religion a cult.

It IS sad when one church is found to be doing that, isn't it...



Questions put to Joseph Smith: "'Do you believe the Bible?' [Smith:]'If we do, we are the only people under heaven that does, for there are none of the religious sects of the day that do'. When asked 'Will everybody be damned, but Mormons'? [Smith replied] 'Yes, and a great portion of them, unless they repent, and work righteousness." (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 119).
Joseph Smith: "for the teachers of religion of the different sects understood the same passages of scripture so differently as to destroy all confidence in settling the question by an appeal to the Bible" (from Pearl of Great Price 1:12). "What is it that inspires professors of Christianity generally with a hope of salvation? It is that smooth, sophisticated influence of the devil, by which he deceives the whole world" (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p.270).
 
 
 
Brigham Young stated this repeatedly: "When the light came to me I saw that all the so-called Christian world was grovelling in darkness" (Journal of Discourses 5:73); "The Christian world, so-called, are heathens as to the knowledge of the salvation of God" (Journal of Discourses 8:171); "With a regard to true theology, a more ignorant people never lived than the present so-called Christian world" (Journal of Discourses 8:199); "And who is there that acknowledges [God's] hand? ...You may wander east, west, north, and south, and you cannot find it in any church or government on the earth, except the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.24); "Should you ask why we differ from other Christians, as they are called, it is simply because they are not Christians as the New Testament defines Christianity" (Journal of Discourses 10:230).
 
 
 
Orson Pratt proclaimed: "Both Catholics and Protestants are nothing less than the 'whore of Babylon' whom the Lord denounces by the mouth of John the Revelator as having corrupted all the earth by their fornications and wickedness. Any person who shall be so corrupt as to receive a holy ordinance of the Gospel from the ministers of any of these apostate churches will be sent down to hell with them, unless they repent" (The Seer, p. 255).
 
 
 
Orson Pratt also said: "This great apostasy commenced about the close of the first century of the Christian era, and it has been waxing worse and worse from then until now" (Journal of Discourses
, vol.18, p.44) and: "But as there has been no Christian Church on the earth for a great many centuries past, until the present century, the people have lost sight of the pattern that God has given according to which the Christian Church should be established, and they have denominated a great variety of people Christian Churches, because they profess to be ...But there has been a long apostasy, during which the nations have been cursed with apostate churches in great abundance" (Journal of Discourses , 18:172).
 
 
President John Taylor stated: "Christianity...is a perfect pack of nonsense...the devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century." (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.167); "Where shall we look for the true order or authority of God? It cannot be found in any nation of Christendom." (Journal of Discourses , 10:127).
 
 
 
James Talmage said: "A self-suggesting interpretation of history indicates that there has been a great departure from the way of salvation as laid down by the Savior, a universal apostasy from the Church of Christ". (A Study of the Articles of Faith, p.182).
 
 
 
President Joseph Fielding Smith said: "Doctrines were corrupted, authority lost, and a false order of religion took the place of the gospel of Jesus Christ, just as it had been the case in former dispensations, and the people were left in spiritual darkness." (Doctrines of Salvation, p.266). "For hundreds of years the world was wrapped in a veil of spiritual darkness, until there was not one fundamental truth belonging to the place of salvation ...Joseph Smith declared that in the year 1820 the Lord revealed to him that all the 'Christian' churches were in error, teaching for commandments the doctrines of men" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, p.282).
 
 
 
More recent statements by apostle Bruce McConkie are also very clear: "Apostasy was universal...And this darkness still prevails except among those who have come to a knowledge of the restored gospel" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol 3, p.265); "Thus the signs of the times include the prevailing apostate darkness in the sects of Christendom and in the religious world in general" (The Millennial Messiah, p.403); "a perverted Christianity holds sway among the so-called Christians of apostate Christendom" (Mormon Doctrine, p.132); "virtually all the millions of apostate Christendom have abased themselves before the mythical throne of a mythical Christ whom they vainly suppose to be a spirit essence who is incorporeal uncreated, immaterial and three-in-one with the Father and Holy Spirit" (Mormon Doctrine, p.269); "Gnosticism is one of the great pagan philosophies which antedated Christ and the Christian Era and which was later commingled with pure Christianity to form the apostate religion that has prevailed in the world since the early days of that era." (Mormon Doctrine, p.316).
 
 
 
President George Q. Cannon said: "After the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was organized, there were only two churches upon the earth. They were known respectively as the Church of the Lamb of God and Babylon. The various organizations which are called churches throughout Christendom, though differing in their creeds and organizations, have one common origin. They all belong to Babylon" (Gospel Truth, p.324).
 
 
President Wilford Woodruff stated: "the Gospel of modern Christendom shuts up the Lord, and stops all communication with Him. I want nothing to do with such a Gospel, I would rather prefer the Gospel of the dark ages, so called" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 2, p.196).

33 posted on 03/08/2012 4:59:56 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Loud Mime
The anti-Mormon posts are not about religion - - they're about EGO.

Yeah; EGOs have a way of making a person or even an organization seem so, so... what is it?

Ah; Self Righteous!




 

MORMON
ATTITUDES OF SUPERIORITY
 

  1. I’m Superior; I have a special gift of the holy Ghost -- you don’t!
  2. I’m Superior; I have God’s true priesthood power -- you don’t!
  3. I’m Superior; I can go in God’s secret Temple -- you can’t!
  4. I’m Superior; I’ve been Endowed with special Gifts and Knowledge -- you’re just normal!
  5. I’m Superior; I’ll have my family with me in heaven -- you’ll be with strangers!
  6. I’m Superior; I’m becoming a God -- you aren’t!
  7. I’m Superior; My women know their place as servants of man and yours don’t.
  8. I’m Superior; YOUR creeds are wrong because they come from man - mine comes from God (you can find each one printed in our Scriptures).
  9. I’m Superior; I don’t HAVE a creed - I’ve got 13 Articles of Faith.
10. I'm Superior; I have 4 "Bibles"-- the standard works (5 if you count the JST) -- you've only got one: in as far as it is translated correctly.
11. I’m Superior; I can lie with impunity about such things as church membership, church growth, church doctrine, church history, church influence, etc. —                           -- You can’t.
12. I’m Superior; I am right (everybody knows) when I say 'evangelical' Christians are lunatics -- 
                           -- You’re a hideous narrow-minded bigot, who is persecuting me by practicing discrimination by saying I'm not a Christian.
13. I'm Superior; I have a testimony about a prophet -- you don't.
14. I'm Superior; I have a Scripture-producing Amos 3:7 prophet -- you don't
15. I’m Superior; I have a Living Prophet who talks to god every day -- you have a dim-witted hireling of Satan who only talks to himself.
16. I'm Superior; I have my calling & election made sure -- you don't.
17. I’m Superior; I have magic underwear to protect me from the bogey man -- you don’t.
18. I’m Superior; I have secret clasps and grips to give the angel so I get admitted to the celestial kingdom -- you don’t ;so you can’t.
19. I'm Superior; I know secret handshake codes for afterlife entrances-- you don't.
20. I’m Superior; I will see Joseph Smith setting on the right hand of GOD, when I get to Mormon heaven, and he will recognize me and judge me favorably                              -- You’re on your own; when you get to wherever you’re going!
21. I’m Superior; I’m going to hie to Kolob -- you’re going to who knows where.
22. I’m Superior; I get to have a harem and act like a celestial stud for time and all eternity -- you don’t.
23. I’m Superior; I have sun stones, moon stones, sky stones, cloud stones, Saturn stones, and the evil eye of Osirus guarding my temple
                            -- You have nothing but a stupid cross.
24. I’m Superior; My church has billions in assets stashed away -- yours has taken a stupid vow of poverty.
25. I'm Superior; Last - we have the power to keep a whole race out of our priesthood if we wanted to reinsert our 148-year legacy  (we ARE still keeping an entire GENDER at bay!)
26.  I'm superior; I have the "higher law" -- everyone else "lives under the "lesser law' because I say so...(over and over).
 
 
Revision 46.5
Semi-Official creed of the EXclusive club of Freeper Flying Inmans.
All rights liable to be abused.

34 posted on 03/08/2012 5:01:31 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Colofornian
A relatively private man, Romney has suffered for appearing BEING awkward in public.
35 posted on 03/08/2012 5:02:27 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Loud Mime
(When conceit and anger are part of your religion, it's a political movement, not a religion.)

The

DOCTRINE AND COVENANTS

OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER-DAY SAINTS

SECTION 71

Revelation given to Joseph Smith the Prophet and Sidney Rigdon, at Hiram, Ohio, December 1, 1831. HC 1: 238–239. The Prophet had continued to translate the Bible with Sidney Rigdon as his scribe until this revelation was received, at which time it was temporarily laid aside so as to enable them to fulfill the instruction given herein. The brethren were to go forth to preach in order to allay the unfriendly feelings that had developed against the Church as a result of the publication of some newspaper articles by Ezra Booth, who had apostatized.

1–4, Joseph Smith and Sidney Rigdon are sent forth to proclaim the gospel; 5–11, Enemies of the saints shall be confounded.

1 Behold, thus saith the Lord unto you my servants Joseph Smith, Jun., and Sidney Rigdon, that the time has verily come that it is necessary and expedient in me that you should open your mouths in proclaiming my gospel, the things of the kingdom, expounding the mysteries thereof out of the scriptures, according to that portion of Spirit and power which shall be given unto you, even as I will.

2 Verily I say unto you, proclaim unto the world in the regions round about, and in the church also, for the space of a season, even until it shall be made known unto you.

3 Verily this is a mission for a season, which I give unto you.

4 Wherefore, labor ye in my vineyard. Call upon the inhabitants of the earth, and bear record, and prepare the way for the commandments and revelations which are to come.

5 Now, behold this is wisdom; whoso readeth, let him understand and receive also;

6 For unto him that receiveth it shall be given more abundantly, even power.

7 Wherefore, confound your enemies; call upon them to meet you both in public and in private; and inasmuch as ye are faithful their shame shall be made manifest.

8 Wherefore, let them bring forth their strong reasons against the Lord.

9 Verily, thus saith the Lord unto you—there is no weapon that is formed against you shall prosper;

10 And if any man lift his voice against you he shall be confounded in mine own due time.

11 Wherefore, keep my commandments; they are true and faithful. Even so. Amen.

 

36 posted on 03/08/2012 5:04:22 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie
11 Wherefore, keep my commandments; they are true and faithful. Even so. Amen.


It must be REALLY scary to be an SLC type of MORMON!!



"Now if any of you will deny the plurality of wives, and continue to do so, I promise that you will be damned;

and I will go still further and say, take this revelation, or any other revelation that the Lord has given,

and deny it in your feelings, and I promise that you will be damned.

Brigham Young - JoD 3:266 (July 14, 1855)

37 posted on 03/08/2012 5:06:05 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

 

I will now give my scripture - "Whosoever confesseth that Joseph Smith was sent of God to reveal the holy Gospel to the children of men, and lay the foundation for gathering Israel, and building up the kingdom of God on the earth, that spirit is of God; and every spirit that does not confess that God has sent Joseph Smith, and revealed the everlasting Gospel to and through him, is of Antichrist.......

- BrighamYoung

 


38 posted on 03/08/2012 5:13:11 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Loud Mime
1 Kings Chapter 18
 
  27 And it came to pass at noon, that Elijah mocked them, and said: 'Cry aloud; for he is a god; either he is musing, or he is gone aside, or he is in a journey, or peradventure he sleepeth, and must be awaked.'
28 And they cried aloud, and cut themselves after their manner with swords and lances, till the blood gushed out upon them.


(Watch for me in about 4 hours...)

39 posted on 03/08/2012 5:19:00 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Nabber

You haven’t been around the Religion forum much, have ya? It’s infested with anti-Mormons.

In before the White Horse !!


40 posted on 03/08/2012 5:21:08 AM PST by magritte (Gladys Knight: Mormon Siren?)
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To: Elsie

There are LURKERS who have NEVER seen what I’ve posted before: it’s for them.


Now THAT’S funny !


41 posted on 03/08/2012 5:22:05 AM PST by magritte (Gladys Knight: Mormon Siren?)
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To: Elsie; All

Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so.

Author: Brigham Young
Source: Journal Of Discourses
Volume: 10
Page: 110

You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind. The first man that committed the odious crime of killing one of his brethren will be cursed the longest of any one of the children of Adam. Cain slew his brother. Cain might have been killed, and that would have put a termination to that line of human beings. This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which is the flat nose and black skin.

Author: Brigham Young
Source: Journal Of Discourses
Volume: 7
Page: 291

It was well understood by the early elders of the Church that the mark which was placed on Cain and which his posterity inherited was the black skin. The Book of Moses informs us that Cain and his descendants were black.

Author: Joseph Fielding Smith
Source: Way To Perfection
Page: 107

The Lord said, I will not kill Cain, but I will put a mark upon him, and that mark will be seen upon the face of every negro upon the face of the earth; and it is the decree of God that that mark shall remain upon the seed of Cain until the seed of Abel shall be redeemed, and Cain shall not receive the Priesthood, until the time of that redemption. Any man having one drop of the seed of Cain in him cannot receive the Priesthood; but the day will come when all that race will be redeemed and possess all the blessings which we now have.

Author: Joseph Fielding Smith
Source: Way To Perfection
Page: 106

Why is it in this Church we do not grant the priesthood to the Negroes? It is alleged that the Prophet Joseph said—and I have no reason to dispute it—that it is because of some act committed by them before they came into this life. It is alleged that they were neutral, standing neither for Christ nor the devil. But, I am convinced it is because of some things they did before they came into this life that they have been denied the privilege. The races of today are very largely reaping the consequence of a previous life.

Author: Melvin Joseph Ballard
Source: Sermons and Missionary Services
Page: 248

The negroes are not equal with other races where the receipt of certain spiritual blessings are concerned, particularly the priesthood and the temple blessings that flow therefrom...

Author: Bruce R. McConkie
Source: Mormon Doctrine
Page: 527

Not only was Cain called upon to suffer, but because of his wickedness he became the father of an inferior race. A curse was placed upon him and that curse has been continued through his lineage and must do so while time endures. Millions of souls have come into this world cursed with a black skin and have been denied the privilege of Priesthood and the fulness of the blessings of the Gospel. These are the descendants of Cain. Moreover, they have been made to feel their inferiority and have been separated from the rest of mankind from the beginning.

Author: Joseph Fielding Smith
Source: Way To Perfection
Page: 101

As a result of his rebellion, Cain was cursed and told that “the earth” would not thereafter yield him its abundance as previously. In addition he became the first mortal to be cursed as a son of perdition. As a result of his mortal birth he is assured of a tangible body of flesh and bones in eternity, a fact which will enable him to rule over Satan. The Lord placed on Cain a mark of a dark skin, and he became the ancestor of the black race.

Author: Bruce R. McConkie
Source: Mormon Doctrine
Page: 102

Now, my brothers and sisters, I would like you to understand that long before we were born into this earth we were tested and tried in our pre-existence, and the fact that of the thousands of children born today, a certain proportion of them went to the Hottentots of South Africa; thousands went to the Chinese mothers; thousands went to Negro mothers; thousands to beautiful white Latter-day Saint mothers: You cannot tell me that the entire group was just designated, marked, to go where they did, that they were men and women of equal opportunities. There are no infant spirits born. They had a being ages before they came into this life.

Author: Melvin Joseph Ballard
Source: Sermons and Missionary Services
Page: 247

Why are so many of the inhabitants of the earth cursed with a sin of blackness? It comes in consequence of their fathers rejecting the power of the Holy Priesthood, and the law of God. They will go down to death. And when all the rest of the children have received their blessings in the Holy Priesthood, then that curse will be removed from the seed of Cain, and they will then come up and possess the priesthood, and receive all the blessings which we now are entitled to. The volition of the creature is free; this is a law of their existence, and the Lord cannot violate his own law; were he to do that, he would cease to be God.

Author: Brigham Young
Source: Journal Of Discourses
Volume: 11
Page: 272


42 posted on 03/08/2012 6:00:44 AM PST by AnTiw1 ("Where Liberty is, there is my country.")
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To: magritte
It’s infested with anti-Mormons.

And ANTI-Christians like yourself.

43 posted on 03/08/2012 9:37:10 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: magritte
It’s infested with anti-Mormons.

And you ARE one of them; right?

44 posted on 03/08/2012 9:37:51 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: magritte
Now THAT’S funny !

And, quite accurate.

I'll bet some of them out there have NEVER heard what a NOAHIDE is.

45 posted on 03/08/2012 9:38:51 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: AnTiw1
You and yer damned FACTS!! --MormonDude(Sorry women; but GOD has NOT seen fit to lift YOUR curse!)
46 posted on 03/08/2012 9:40:11 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

Get some help.


47 posted on 03/08/2012 8:29:52 PM PST by Loud Mime (When conceit and anger are part of your religion, it's a political movement, not a religion.)
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To: Loud Mime; Tennessee Nana
ATTENTION MORMONs!!!



Enroll in the new Apologetics class firing up this summer at BYU!

You, too, will be able to CONFOUND any who would oppose you; just like the Scriptures say!

48 posted on 03/09/2012 4:57:12 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

The Mormans may be nutty. But you have yet to prove the case about your religious beliefs.

Elsie, it called an obsession...


49 posted on 03/10/2012 7:02:37 AM PST by Loud Mime (When conceit and anger are part of your religion, it's a political movement, not a religion.)
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To: Loud Mime
But you have yet to prove the case about your religious beliefs.

To whom?

50 posted on 03/10/2012 10:48:52 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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