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Benedict XVI Calls Christians to Rediscover Chastity
Zenit.org ^ | March 0, 2012 | Kathleen Naab

Posted on 03/14/2012 12:23:34 PM PDT by Salvation

Benedict XVI Calls Christians to Rediscover Chastity


Addresses US Bishops on Issues of Marriage, Sexuality

By Kathleen Naab

VATICAN CITY, MARCH 9, 2012 (Zenit.org).- Benedict XVI says that chastity might be countercultural and challenging, but the entire Christian community should recover an appreciation for it.

The Pope said this today in an address to a group of bishops from the midwest of the United States, who are in Rome for their five-yearly ad limina visit.

The Holy Father's talk, which he presented as a continuation of reflections on "certain aspects of the evangelization of American culture," resonated in the social and political climate of the United States, in the throes of a battle over religious freedom and a government mandate to include abortifacients and sterilization in health insurance as "preventive care."

The Pontiff alluded to his speech to the last group of bishops from the US -- given the day before the health insurance mandate was announced -- and mentioned "our concern about threats to freedom of conscience, religion and worship which need to be addressed urgently, so that all men and women of faith, and the institutions they inspire, can act in accordance with their deepest moral convictions."

In today's address, the Holy Father turned specifically to the issue of "the contemporary crisis of marriage and the family, and, more generally, of the Christian vision of human sexuality."

Benedict called attention to the "powerful political and cultural currents seeking to alter the legal definition of marriage," and he said that the Church needs to give a "reasoned defense of marriage as a natural institution consisting of a specific communion of persons, essentially rooted in the complementarity of the sexes and oriented to procreation."

"Sexual differences cannot be dismissed as irrelevant to the definition of marriage," he affirmed. "Defending the institution of marriage as a social reality is ultimately a question of justice, since it entails safeguarding the good of the entire human community and the rights of parents and children alike."

Catechesis problems

Benedict XVI acknowledged the "deficiencies in the catechesis of recent decades" in regard to the Church's teaching on marriage and family life. He called for strengthening marriage preparation programs -- echoing recommendations he has made in the past, when he has even suggested that parishes need to have support systems for married couples through the first decade of marriage.

He also pointed out the problem of cohabitation, saying couples often seem "unaware that it is gravely sinful, not to mention damaging to the stability of society."

The Pope lauded the bishops' efforts to promote marriage. And he observed: "In this great pastoral effort there is an urgent need for the entire Christian community to recover an appreciation of the virtue of chastity. The integrating and liberating function of this virtue (cf. Catechism of the Catholic Church, 2338-2343) should be emphasized by a formation of the heart, which presents the Christian understanding of sexuality as a source of genuine freedom, happiness and the fulfilment of our fundamental and innate human vocation to love. It is not merely a question of presenting arguments, but of appealing to an integrated, consistent and uplifting vision of human sexuality. The richness of this vision is more sound and appealing than the permissive ideologies exalted in some quarters; these in fact constitute a powerful and destructive form of counter-catechesis for the young.

"Young people need to encounter the Church’s teaching in its integrity, challenging and countercultural as that teaching may be; more importantly, they need to see it embodied by faithful married couples who bear convincing witness to its truth."

He called for support of young people "as they struggle to make wise choices at a difficult and confusing time in their lives" and recognized that society "increasingly tends to misunderstand and even ridicule [chastity,] this essential dimension of Christian teaching."

The Pope concluded by recalling that efforts to present the Church's teaching on sexuality "are ultimately concerned with the good of children, who have a fundamental right to grow up with a healthy understanding of sexuality and its proper place in human relationships. Children are the greatest treasure and the future of every society: truly caring for them means recognizing our responsibility to teach, defend and live the moral virtues which are the key to human fulfillment."



TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; History; Theology
KEYWORDS: catholic; chastity; marriage; sexuality; virtues
A primary virtue to consider for these tumultuous times.
1 posted on 03/14/2012 12:23:37 PM PDT by Salvation
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To: nickcarraway; NYer; ELS; Pyro7480; livius; ArrogantBustard; Catholicguy; RobbyS; marshmallow; ...
Children are the greatest treasure and the future of every society: truly caring for them means recognizing our responsibility to teach, defend and live the moral virtues which are the key to human fulfillment."

Catholic Ping!

2 posted on 03/14/2012 12:26:44 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

He is right, but before we tackle chastity, we will need to restore belief in Christ and the Christian religion in the west. Without that foundation, you have no basis for demands that are unpopular.


3 posted on 03/14/2012 12:28:49 PM PDT by Defiant (If there are infinite parallel universes, why Lord, am I living in the one with Obama as President?)
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To: All
Benedict XVI Calls Christians to Rediscover Chastity
Catholic school suspends student for distributing letter supporting modesty
Catholic Word of the Day: CAPITAL VIRTUES, 01-19-12

The Significance of Humility in the Christian Life
Following The Truth: Letting Your Conscience Be Your Guide(What Jiminy Cricket Didn’t Tell You) [Catholic or Open]
The Virtues [Ecumenical]
Moral Conscience [Ecumenical]
Teaching the Virtues (includes The Lessons of 9/11)
WHAT ARE THE MARYLIKE STANDARDS? (Modesty)
Morality of the Passions [Ecumenical]
Sources of Morality [Ecumenical]
When attending Mass becomes an occasion of sin [Lack of modesty]
Vatican Cardinal Burke: In today’s society ‘morality has ceased to exist’

This Fourth of July, "Confirm thy soul in self-control" and other virtues
[Ecumenical] Lent through Eastertide - Divine Mercy Diary Exerpts: Purity
Heaven and the love of neighbour [Catholic/Orthodox Caucus]
What Does the Bible Say About Honesty? [Ecumenical]
The Beatitudes: Blessed are the Meek
Virtue of Prudence [Michael Voris video]
Tenacity: A Thanksgiving Lesson
Lists Every Catholic Should be Familiar With: The 7 Capital Sins and their Contrary Virtues
Back-to-School Virtues: Three qualities that help your child succeed in class and in life
How to Make All Our Conversations Virtuous [Ecumenical]
Advent -- A Season of Hope

Modesty En Vogue [Another one of the virtues]"
Prudence: Mother of All Virtues
The Virtue of Confidence
Is Courage a Masculine Virtue?
Cardinal Virtues: Obama and the Real American Infrastructure – Part One
Cardinal Virtues: Obama and the Real American Infrastructure — Part Two
Morality is Habit-Forming: The Cardinal Virtues
Life Lessons from the Patron Saint of Scholars [St. Thomas Aquinas]
The Cross Exemplifies Every Virtue [St. Thomas Aquinas]
The Virtue-Driven
Living the Virtue of Humility

4 posted on 03/14/2012 12:31:20 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Defiant

He is right, but before we tackle chastity, we will need to restore belief in Christ and the Christian religion in the west. Without that foundation, you have no basis for demands that are unpopular.


I would gently disagree. My read on what His Holiness is saying is “Lets get our own house in order.”
Get back to a Church that practices what it preaches, with members that don’t just cherry pick but who live their faith.

The popularity or not of a demand is not the point. It isn’t even a demand - just a call to get back to considering sex as a sacred act and trust, not a light snack available from the nearest vending machine.

I grew up in the 60s and 70s - sex was literally downgraded to the level of grabbing an apple from the fridge. There are some encouraging signs that this idea is being rejected (FReepmail me if you want to know) but HH is right.
We need to push it more. Make chastity fashionable, if you like.


5 posted on 03/14/2012 12:55:19 PM PDT by EnglishCon (Gingrich/Santorum 2012.)
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To: Salvation

Tell it, Holy Father!


6 posted on 03/14/2012 1:20:56 PM PDT by Bigg Red (Pray for our republic.)
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To: EnglishCon

I just don’t think a secular society will go along with chastity. So, in order to restore some semblance of morality, we need to restore the basis for morality, which was religion. There are non-religious arguments for our moral values, but it’s an uphill value to win that argument without some religious beliefs underlying them. That’s what I’m saying, not that we can’t overcome a popular social behavior.


7 posted on 03/14/2012 2:43:47 PM PDT by Defiant (If there are infinite parallel universes, why Lord, am I living in the one with Obama as President?)
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To: Salvation

I get very irked when people claim abstinece is not realistic. Both my husband and I ‘waited’ until we were married and have been faithful to each other (not that there weren’t offers). We were 23 when we got married and didn’t live together. He didn’t even move his clothes into my place until after we got back from our honeymoon.

One thing do credit my trip into and out of Mormonism, is it did keep me from sexual sin, even if it was mainly peer pressure. And I became a Christian right after I left the LDS and then had a Christian perspective on sex and marriage and family.


8 posted on 03/14/2012 2:44:54 PM PDT by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian "I once was lost, but now am found, was blind but now I see")
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To: EnglishCon

> Make chastity fashionable,

I don’t know... sex is very, very popular.


9 posted on 03/14/2012 3:04:23 PM PDT by BlueLandRed
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To: BlueLandRed

Only if one can “Get ER done”


10 posted on 03/14/2012 3:07:55 PM PDT by the lastbestlady (I now believe that we have two lives; the life we learn with and the life we live with after that.)
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To: EnglishCon; Defiant

The practical benefits of chastity were obvious to many of the pagans. A father doesn’t want his daughters producing children without an economic foundation. A man wants to know his children are his own.

Dr. Elizabeth Vandiver, presenter on “The Great Courses” set on The Odyssey, observed that Penelope had to be chaste through all the years of Odysseus’s absence, or the paternity of Telemachus would have been called into question, because her character would be proven untrustworthy.


11 posted on 03/14/2012 3:15:29 PM PDT by Tax-chick (Oh, good Lord. Pat.)
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To: BlueLandRed

A deacon gave a talk at our Serra club. He said that the first thing he noticed about his wife was her face. And likewise the wife noticed his face.

Now compare that with the sick modern society......cute butt, big boobs, etc.

Sexuality is SOMEONE not something — and it is for marriage alone.


12 posted on 03/14/2012 3:23:33 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

Vice-Grips. That’s the issue. Ever notice how any brand of locking pliers are usually called Vice-Grips?

I think that this is what has happened with modern society’s understanding of marriage. Today, the generic definition of marriage is two people, who have sexual relations, and live under one roof. Somewhere along the line, the religious significance, religious importance, and religious meaning of marriage have been stripped away. Probably about the time civil government started mandating a license to get married. For those who scream of separation of church and state, why not complain about the state getting involved in what was until then, a strictly religious event?

So rather than just a generic married or marriage, maybe a trademarked Married (TM) and Marriage (TM), to denote the difference the generic and the real thing.


13 posted on 03/14/2012 3:27:41 PM PDT by Sergio (An object at rest cannot be stopped! - The Evil Midnight Bomber What Bombs at Midnight)
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To: Defiant

I see what you mean. Yet when people who claim to belong to the Church openly espouse immorality, the struggle gets harder.

Our brethren in the Evangelical churches have a lesser problem, as they have been solid and consistant (mainly) about the vital importance of chastity, to my admiration and respect.

His Holiness has pointed the way. Correctly in my opinion. While I totally agree with you that we need to get God back into society, we also need to give a clear moral compass. It has got blurred recently. To borrow a phrase: “Hey, if it was easy, anyone could do it.”


14 posted on 03/14/2012 3:32:11 PM PDT by EnglishCon (Gingrich/Santorum 2012.)
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To: Sergio

That’s “Vise-grips.” Different language root from vice-sin.


15 posted on 03/14/2012 3:40:44 PM PDT by Tax-chick (Oh, good Lord. Pat.)
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To: Salvation; mrreaganaut

The first thing my husband noticed about me was I was the only other one there that could read (we were 3 and in preschool). Over the years, while we are certainly physically attracted to one another, the biggest attraction to each other was our minds.

Even after all these years of marriage, we recognize sex as a celebration of our love (not lust) and a gift from God.


16 posted on 03/14/2012 4:08:39 PM PDT by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian "I once was lost, but now am found, was blind but now I see")
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To: Tax-chick

Yes, but we are in the age of $9/month birth control. A girl can be a slut without producing children.


17 posted on 03/14/2012 4:22:12 PM PDT by Defiant (If there are infinite parallel universes, why Lord, am I living in the one with Obama as President?)
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To: Tax-chick

Doh! Thanks...spell check doesn’t correct usage.


18 posted on 03/14/2012 4:33:28 PM PDT by Sergio (An object at rest cannot be stopped! - The Evil Midnight Bomber What Bombs at Midnight)
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To: Defiant; Mrs. Don-o
A girl can be a slut without producing children.

In theory ... but it's amazing how often either teenage dingbats or middle-aged feminist ideologues are, whoops, omg, shocking, pregnant.

As I've said before ... you take your little couple ... Taylor and Taylor, for example ... and if she takes a pill every morning at 8 a.m., and he uses a condom every time they have sex, the chance of their conceiving a child is statistically zero. But they don't.

And it doesn't matter if they're high school students in Tahlequah or Harvard grads in fancy jobs in New York City, they still don't. She gets pregnant. And then we're back with Homer in 750 B.C., dealing with the same social fallout.

19 posted on 03/14/2012 4:41:37 PM PDT by Tax-chick (Oh, good Lord. Pat.)
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To: Tax-chick

Hey now, watch it. If slutty girls didn’t get pregnant in Tahlequah, I wouldn’t be here.


20 posted on 03/14/2012 4:45:00 PM PDT by Defiant (If there are infinite parallel universes, why Lord, am I living in the one with Obama as President?)
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To: Salvation
>>chastity might be countercultural and challenging, but the entire Christian community should recover an appreciation for it.<<

What an absolutely awful comment that has to be made about the “Christian community”. He’s totally right but what a shame that the “Christian community” has to “recover” an appreciation for it. My fear is that there will be a pathetically small portion of the “Christian community” that will respond. Narrow is the way is becoming all too real.

21 posted on 03/14/2012 6:07:08 PM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: reaganaut

Wonderful!


22 posted on 03/14/2012 8:15:57 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Tax-chick

And basically isn’t this all saying that girls (and boys, too) do NOT have to follow the crowd and do the sex thing that everyone thinks is so fashionable?


23 posted on 03/14/2012 8:17:27 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: CynicalBear

And the gate is even narrower.

(Is that a word?) LOL!


24 posted on 03/14/2012 8:19:06 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Tax-chick; Defiant
Condoms 33 cents apiece at Wal-Mart, or free by the handful at the County Health Dept or the Student Welness Center, but (according to Alan Guttsmasher) about 1/2 of the women who get abortions were using cotnraceptives, and half were using no contraceptives at all. The sexual reproductive system, which suceeded for 100% of your ancestors and mine going back 20,000 generations, is designed to succeed.

And instead of saying "Praise God," people say "It's so unfair."

25 posted on 03/15/2012 5:13:23 AM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("The first duty of intelligent men of our day is the restatement of the obvious." George Orwell)
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To: Salvation
>> (Is that a word?) LOL!<<

I understood it so it must be. It just struck me that this country has fallen so far from the morals I grew up surrounded by in a little town in Iowa. Living together without being married would have not been considered. Disasters such as a house fire brought the community together to rebuild within weeks. Government help wasn’t something anyone even thought about. If someone found themselves in hard times the farmers in the area would supply everything from milk to meat and vegetables. Oh what a different time.

26 posted on 03/15/2012 5:44:42 AM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: CynicalBear; Salvation; Mrs. Don-o
[Pope Benedict is] totally right but what a shame that the “Christian community” has to “recover” an appreciation for [chastity].

I agree. Unfortunately, it seems that the assurance that sins can be forgiven leads many to a lack of concern for sin, or even the silent agreement that "sin" is just a formal category. Certainly on FR, I often find people who identify themselves as Christians taking the position that fornication is the proper activity of certain stages of life (before marriage, between marriages, after marriage) and that the concept that this is a sin is simply out of the question.

If a good church-going Baptist gentleman ... knows his Bible, teaches Sunday School, works on the disaster-relief team ... can look back on the screwing-around of his college years with nostalgic enjoyment, it certainly doesn't seem that he considers it a sin for which he should repent. What does it tell adolescents/young adults, if the teachers in their lives (parents, school teachers, church leaders) convey the impression that sexually-active single years were the best time in their lives?

27 posted on 03/15/2012 6:10:30 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Oh, good Lord. Pat.)
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To: Tax-chick; Salvation; Mrs. Don-o
>>who identify themselves as Christians taking the position that fornication is the proper activity of certain stages of life<<

There simply is no true born again Christian who takes that position. Attending a church or even reaching the status of “teacher” does not make one a Christian. I think a real and serious problem today is the fact that the title “Christian” is used so loosely that it’s become useless as a description. The true heart change of a born again believer would be indicated by an attitude of regret for past indiscretions. I think it’s time we begin understanding and speaking out about those fake “Christians” among us.

28 posted on 03/15/2012 6:27:54 AM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: Salvation

Next day BUMP! FReegards....


29 posted on 03/15/2012 6:45:42 AM PDT by ConservativeStLouisGuy (11th FReeper Commandment: Thou Shalt Not Unnecessarily Excerpt)
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To: ConservativeStLouisGuy

(Speech in full...below....)

ADDRESS OF HIS HOLINESS BENEDICT XVI TO THE BISHOPS OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA FROM REGION VIII ON THEIR “AD LIMINA” VISIT

9 March 2012

Dear Brother Bishops,

I greet all of you with fraternal affection on the occasion of your visit ad limina Apostolorum. As you know, this year I wish to reflect with you on certain aspects of the evangelization of American culture in the light of the intellectual and ethical challenges of the present moment.

In our previous meetings I acknowledged our concern about threats to freedom of conscience, religion and worship which need to be addressed urgently, so that all men and women of faith, and the institutions they inspire, can act in accordance with their deepest moral convictions. In this talk I would like to discuss another serious issue which you raised with me during my Pastoral Visit to America, namely, the contemporary crisis of marriage and the family, and, more generally, of the Christian vision of human sexuality. It is in fact increasingly evident that a weakened appreciation of the indissolubility of the marriage covenant, and the widespread rejection of a responsible, mature sexual ethic grounded in the practice of chastity, have led to grave societal problems bearing an immense human and economic cost.

Yet, as Blessed John Paul II observed, the future of humanity passes by way of the family (cf. Familiaris Consortio, 85). Indeed, “the good that the Church and society as a whole expect from marriage and from the family founded on marriage is so great as to call for full pastoral commitment to this particular area. Marriage and the family are institutions that must be promoted and defended from every possible misrepresentation of their true nature, since whatever is injurious to them is injurious to society itself” (Sacramentum Caritatis, 29).

In this regard, particular mention must be made of the powerful political and cultural currents seeking to alter the legal definition of marriage. The Church’s conscientious effort to resist this pressure calls for a reasoned defense of marriage as a natural institution consisting of a specific communion of persons, essentially rooted in the complementarity of the sexes and oriented to procreation. Sexual differences cannot be dismissed as irrelevant to the definition of marriage. Defending the institution of marriage as a social reality is ultimately a question of justice, since it entails safeguarding the good of the entire human community and the rights of parents and children alike.

In our conversations, some of you have pointed with concern to the growing difficulties encountered in communicating the Church’s teaching on marriage and the family in its integrity, and to a decrease in the number of young people who approach the sacrament of matrimony. Certainly we must acknowledge deficiencies in the catechesis of recent decades, which failed at times to communicate the rich heritage of Catholic teaching on marriage as a natural institution elevated by Christ to the dignity of a sacrament, the vocation of Christian spouses in society and in the Church, and the practice of marital chastity. This teaching, stated with increasing clarity by the post-conciliar magisterium and comprehensively presented in both the Catechism of the Catholic Church and the Compendium of the Social Doctrine of the Church, needs to be restored to its proper place in preaching and catechetical instruction.

On the practical level, marriage preparation programs must be carefully reviewed to ensure that there is greater concentration on their catechetical component and their presentation of the social and ecclesial responsibilities entailed by Christian marriage. In this context we cannot overlook the serious pastoral problem presented by the widespread practice of cohabitation, often by couples who seem unaware that it is gravely sinful, not to mention damaging to the stability of society. I encourage your efforts to develop clear pastoral and liturgical norms for the worthy celebration of matrimony which embody an unambiguous witness to the objective demands of Christian morality, while showing sensitivity and concern for young couples.

Here too I would express my appreciation of the pastoral programs which you are promoting in your Dioceses and, in particular, the clear and authoritative presentation of the Church’s teaching found in your 2009 Letter Marriage: Love and Life in the Divine Plan. I also appreciate all that your parishes, schools and charitable agencies do daily to support families and to reach out to those in difficult marital situations, especially the divorced and separated, single parents, teenage mothers and women considering abortion, as well as children suffering the tragic effects of family breakdown.

In this great pastoral effort there is an urgent need for the entire Christian community to recover an appreciation of the virtue of chastity. The integrating and liberating function of this virtue (cf. Catechism of the Catholic Church, 2338-2343) should be emphasized by a formation of the heart, which presents the Christian understanding of sexuality as a source of genuine freedom, happiness and the fulfilment of our fundamental and innate human vocation to love. It is not merely a question of presenting arguments, but of appealing to an integrated, consistent and uplifting vision of human sexuality. The richness of this vision is more sound and appealing than the permissive ideologies exalted in some quarters; these in fact constitute a powerful and destructive form of counter-catechesis for the young.

Young people need to encounter the Church’s teaching in its integrity, challenging and countercultural as that teaching may be; more importantly, they need to see it embodied by faithful married couples who bear convincing witness to its truth. They also need to be supported as they struggle to make wise choices at a difficult and confusing time in their lives. Chastity, as the Catechism reminds us, involves an ongoing “apprenticeship in self-mastery which is a training in human freedom” (2339). In a society which increasingly tends to misunderstand and even ridicule this essential dimension of Christian teaching, young people need to be reassured that “if we let Christ into our lives, we lose nothing, absolutely nothing, of what makes life free, beautiful and great” (Homily, Inaugural Mass of the Pontificate, 24 April 2005).

Let me conclude by recalling that all our efforts in this area are ultimately concerned with the good of children, who have a fundamental right to grow up with a healthy understanding of sexuality and its proper place in human relationships. Children are the greatest treasure and the future of every society: truly caring for them means recognizing our responsibility to teach, defend and live the moral virtues which are the key to human fulfillment. It is my hope that the Church in the United States, however chastened by the events of the past decade, will persevere in its historic mission of educating the young and thus contribute to the consolidation of that sound family life which is the surest guarantee of intergenerational solidarity and the health of society as a whole.

I now commend you and your brother Bishops, with the flock entrusted to your pastoral care, to the loving intercession of the Holy Family of Jesus, Mary and Joseph. To all of you I willingly impart my Apostolic Blessing as a pledge of wisdom, strength and peace in the Lord


30 posted on 03/15/2012 6:46:26 AM PDT by ConservativeStLouisGuy (11th FReeper Commandment: Thou Shalt Not Unnecessarily Excerpt)
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To: ConservativeStLouisGuy

-——Chastity, as the Catechism reminds us, involves an ongoing “apprenticeship in self-mastery which is a training in human freedom” (2339)-——

True freedom is the ability to choose among goods, not to choose evil.


31 posted on 03/15/2012 6:56:05 AM PDT by St_Thomas_Aquinas (Viva Christo Rey!)
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To: Defiant

—— He is right, but before we tackle chastity, we will need to restore belief in Christ and the Christian religion in the west. Without that foundation, you have no basis for demands that are unpopular.-——

Not true. All people know that stealing and adultery is wrong, because the natural law is accessible to reason, and “written on the human heart.” Chastity follows logically from a proper understanding of marriage. But since it’s a secondary principle, the proper understanding of it is more prone to error.


32 posted on 03/15/2012 7:03:42 AM PDT by St_Thomas_Aquinas (Viva Christo Rey!)
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To: CynicalBear
The true heart change of a born again believer would be indicated by an attitude of regret for past indiscretions.

True. However, much more common in society seems to be an attitude that "past indiscretions" were a lot of fun, and people regret that they had to give them up in order avoid hell. Earlier this week, I pointed out to my daughter the sin of presumption in a popular song. The viewpoint character, so to speak, assumed he would have the opportunity to repent before he died - but if you're not sorry you did it - but only sorry it's "against the rules" - it seems to me that is not repentence!

I'm not competent to decide whether anyone else is a Christian; maybe it's just a failure to think things through. It's certainly better to avoid sin out of fear than to persist in sin anyway, but the Scriptures call us to repent of sin with "fasting, weeping, and mourning."

33 posted on 03/15/2012 10:57:58 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Oh, good Lord. Pat.)
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To: Tax-chick
>>much more common in society seems to be an attitude that "past indiscretions" were a lot of fun, and people regret that they had to give them up in order avoid hell.<<

Society is not analogous to a born again saved individual. Nor does a born again saved individual “regret” having to “give up” in order to “avoid hell”. Changed actions do not indicate a changed heart but a changed heart will change actions. A true born again Christian has a changed heart which results in changed actions. Simply changing actions is not what saves.

>>I'm not competent to decide whether anyone else is a Christian; maybe it's just a failure to think things through.<<

We are called to discern however. True repentance is not just giving up the act. True repentance comes from a regretful heart.

34 posted on 03/15/2012 1:44:19 PM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: CynicalBear
True repentance is not just giving up the act. True repentance comes from a regretful heart.

Very true.

35 posted on 03/15/2012 2:14:35 PM PDT by Tax-chick (Oh, good Lord. Pat.)
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To: Salvation

How about the Pope reinstating Father Guarnizo, as it seems his Bisops won’t? Then he can get on with his more lofty matters.


36 posted on 03/16/2012 7:50:01 AM PDT by onedoug
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