Posted on 04/11/2012 12:36:50 PM PDT by marshmallow
LOUISVILLE, Ky. (ABP) – Thousands, if not millions, of church members sitting in America’s pews aren’t really born-again Christians, a Washington, D.C., pastor said April 10 to a pastors’ conference in Louisville, Ky. Mark Dever
Mark Dever, senior pastor of Capitol Hill Baptist Church in the nation’s capital, warned on the opening day of the 2012 Together for the Gospel Conference that “false conversions” are “the suicide of the local church.”
Dever was one of four religious leaders – with Albert Mohler, president of Southern Baptist Theological Seminary; C.J. Mahaney, president Sovereign Grace Ministries in Gaithersburg, Md.; and Ligon Duncan, senior minister at First Presbyterian Church in Jackson, Miss. – to convene the first Together for the Gospel event in 2006 to combat what they viewed as false teaching in many churches today. A statement of unifying doctrines includes male headship in the church and home and the need for church discipline of wayward members in local congregations.
This year’s conference, the fourth, was expected to draw 8,000 pastors and ministers April 10-12 to The Kentucky International Convention Center and KFC Yum! Center, with messages uploaded daily on the website t4g.org.
Dever described “members of the church who live worldly, carnal lives” as a “serious problem” in American Christianity.
“The problem I am pointing to is not just that of the occasional hypocrite lost in their own unrepentant sin,” Dever said. “I’m talking about systems which seem to produce false converts so much that it’s not just one man … but whole congregations that like Israel of old are typified and characterized not by holiness but by worldliness.”
Dever said that is a problem for church members who are “deceived about their own state before the Lord.”
“It’s just not right for a congregation to leave men or women made...........
(Excerpt) Read more at abpnews.com ...
A Christian church is not a museum to display the saints of the church, but a hospital to treat the chronic disease of sin.
I feel it’s a matter of churches afraid to confront sin and actually holding people accountable. The Bible says it’s ok to correct someone who is doing something wrong (not Biblical). That’s what the Bible is for. To give us a guildline. Too many churches push sweep sin under the carpet and pretend that everything is fine and that nothing has happened.
ping
But...I’m a good person!
That is true, but we are also called by Christ to “go and sin no more”. I am born-again believer and I regularly need to check myself for sin. Guess what...I’m sinful and I admit I fail regularly in many ways I wish I did not. As Paul said...”Why do I do what I do not want to do...”. We are still wrapped in the flesh and the flesh itself is sinful.
I agree with Dever however...too many people think we can just continue to sin. If people aren’t checking their lives for sinful behavior...then I can see his point. The issue isn’t that Christians cannot sin, it whether they care enough to confess before the Lord that they continue to sin. It’s all about our hearts and unfortunately many people choose to know Jesus but they don’t choose to have a relationship with him. Even the demons acknowledge he is the Son of God. We put too much emphasis on a “decision” and not on our “relationship” with our Lord.
Someone told me you know you’re there when you know you’re a sinner and the very thought of intentionally sinning horrifies you.
So true, so true...!
I often asked myself, “Why do the born agains make the same mistakes again?”
What I found, after years of psychological research into mind control techniques was that the big difference between the real event and the false event is that the individual surrenders their authority horizontally to another person rather than going within, traversing the dark-night-of-the-soul experience and surrendering within to a higher power.
I’m trained as a stage hypnotist, but will never use it. I learned the techniques in order to understand how charismatic pastors controlled their followers. It’s relatively easy to do, even with intelligent educated people. It’s used in the political election process as well!!! Sad to say.
“you know you’re a sinner and the very thought of intentionally sinning horrifies you.”
Very true, or you know it if you are still breathing!
BTTT
The Bible teaches that those who earnestly seek God will find Him and that He is not far from each one of us. When we do find him, we become acutely aware of our shortcomings.
Churches this day and time put way too much emphasis on putting bodies in the pews, entertaining them, and carrying on as if it were a social club.
Being a Christian is about growing in grace and understanding and serving God and fellow man. That is a far cry from what is happening in most churches today.
You are right. If the churches preach the gospel and hold people accountable for their actions, the false converts will fall away.
The problem isn’t the converts; it’s the churches.
It is when you accept the falsely converted into full voting membership of the congregation that you get into trouble. Do that too often, and you end up letting the inmates run the asylum.
These Baptists can start by looking in their own churches for false teachings and the fruit thereof.
These Baptist are looking notice it is a baptist publication. Like all churches when man made doctrine/tradition enters the church sin abounds, if only we would look to scripture.
Agreed. Christians should hold themselves to a higher standard. When one fails, it should not be glossed over, but delt with in Love. Acknowledging something was done wrong is tough to do sometimes, but there needs to be a moral compass (the Bible) that is followed in our churches. That is what is lost in today’s world.
As long as the message is preached and preached correctly, I have no problem with entertaining people. In part, b/c "entertaining" won't be the church's soul purpose. It will be to worship. Whether that be with an electric guitar or piano as long as that purpose is Christ then a church will flourish. Once you start watering down the message and focus soley on Music, Presentation of Sermon, Aestetics of church, then you run into issues.
I’m a Baptist and I like Mark Dever, but he is wrong. The entire point The Savior made in the parable of the wheat and tares is that there will be false believers mixed in with real believers. He said to leave them be. Focus on making disciples, don’t try to police the phonies...they will be sorted at the judgment.
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