Skip to comments.The hidden exodus: Catholics becoming Protestants
Posted on 05/17/2012 5:40:57 PM PDT by Gamecock
Any other institution that lost one-third of its members would want to know why.....
The number of people who have left the Catholic church is huge.
We all have heard stories about why people leave. Parents share stories about their children. Academics talk about their students. Everyone has a friend who has left.
While personal experience can be helpful, social science research forces us to look beyond our circle of acquaintances to see what is going on in the whole church.
The U.S. Religious Landscape Survey by the Pew Research Centers Forum on Religion & Public Life has put hard numbers on the anecdotal evidence: One out of every 10 Americans is an ex-Catholic. If they were a separate denomination, they would be the third-largest denomination in the United States, after Catholics and Baptists. One of three people who were raised Catholic no longer identifies as Catholic.
Any other institution that lost one-third of its members would want to know why. But the U.S. bishops have never devoted any time at their national meetings to discussing the exodus. Nor have they spent a dime trying to find out why it is happening.
Thankfully, although the U.S. bishops have not supported research on people who have left the church, the Pew Center has.
Pews data shows that those leaving the church are not homogenous. They can be divided into two major groups: those who become unaffiliated and those who become Protestant. Almost half of those leaving the church become unaffiliated and almost half become Protestant. Only about 10 percent of ex-Catholics join non-Christian religions. This article will focus on Catholics who have become Protestant. I am not saying that those who become unaffiliated are not important; I am leaving that discussion to another time.
Why do people leave the Catholic church to become Protestant? Liberal Catholics will tell you that Catholics are leaving because they disagree with the churchs teaching on birth control, women priests, divorce, the bishops interference in American politics, etc. Conservatives blame Vatican II, liberal priests and nuns, a permissive culture and the churchs social justice agenda.
One of the reasons there is such disagreement is that we tend to think that everyone leaves for the same reason our friends, relatives and acquaintances have left. We fail to recognize that different people leave for different reasons. People who leave to join Protestant churches do so for different reasons than those who become unaffiliated. People who become evangelicals are different from Catholics who become members of mainline churches.
The principal reasons given by people who leave the church to become Protestant are that their spiritual needs were not being met in the Catholic church (71 percent) and they found a religion they like more (70 percent). Eighty-one percent of respondents say they joined their new church because they enjoy the religious service and style of worship of their new faith.
In other words, the Catholic church has failed to deliver what people consider fundamental products of religion: spiritual sustenance and a good worship service. And before conservatives blame the new liturgy, only 11 percent of those leaving complained that Catholicism had drifted too far from traditional practices such as the Latin Mass.
Dissatisfaction with how the church deals with spiritual needs and worship services dwarfs any disagreements over specific doctrines. While half of those who became Protestants say they left because they stopped believing in Catholic teaching, specific questions get much lower responses. Only 23 percent said they left because of the churchs teaching on abortion and homosexuality; only 23 percent because of the churchs teaching on divorce; only 21 percent because of the rule that priests cannot marry; only 16 percent because of the churchs teaching on birth control; only 16 percent because of the way the church treats women; only 11 percent because they were unhappy with the teachings on poverty, war and the death penalty.
The data shows that disagreement over specific doctrines is not the main reason Catholics become Protestants. We also have lots of survey data showing that many Catholics who stay disagree with specific church teachings. Despite what theologians and bishops think, doctrine is not that important either to those who become Protestant or to those who stay Catholic.
People are not becoming Protestants because they disagree with specific Catholic teachings; people are leaving because the church does not meet their spiritual needs and they find Protestant worship service better.
Nor are the people becoming Protestants lazy or lax Christians. In fact, they attend worship services at a higher rate than those who remain Catholic. While 42 percent of Catholics who stay attend services weekly, 63 percent of Catholics who become Protestants go to church every week. That is a 21 percentage-point difference.
Catholics who became Protestant also claim to have a stronger faith now than when they were children or teenagers. Seventy-one percent say their faith is very strong, while only 35 percent and 22 percent reported that their faith was very strong when they were children and teenagers, respectively. On the other hand, only 46 percent of those who are still Catholic report their faith as very strong today as an adult.
Thus, both as believers and as worshipers, Catholics who become Protestants are statistically better Christians than those who stay Catholic. We are losing the best, not the worst.
Some of the common explanations of why people leave do not pan out in the data. For example, only 21 percent of those becoming Protestant mention the sex abuse scandal as a reason for leaving. Only 3 percent say they left because they became separated or divorced.
If you believed liberals, most Catholics who leave the church would be joining mainline churches, like the Episcopal church. In fact, almost two-thirds of former Catholics who join a Protestant church join an evangelical church. Catholics who become evangelicals and Catholics who join mainline churches are two very distinct groups. We need to take a closer look at why each leaves the church.
Fifty-four percent of both groups say that they just gradually drifted away from Catholicism. Both groups also had almost equal numbers (82 percent evangelicals, 80 percent mainline) saying they joined their new church because they enjoyed the worship service. But compared to those who became mainline Protestants, a higher percentage of those becoming evangelicals said they left because their spiritual needs were not being met (78 percent versus 57 percent) and that they had stopped believing in Catholic teaching (62 percent versus 20 percent). They also cited the churchs teaching on the Bible (55 percent versus 16 percent) more frequently as a reason for leaving. Forty-six percent of these new evangelicals felt the Catholic church did not view the Bible literally enough. Thus, for those leaving to become evangelicals, spiritual sustenance, worship services and the Bible were key. Only 11 percent were unhappy with the churchs teachings on poverty, war, and the death penalty Ñ the same percentage as said they were unhappy with the churchs treatment of women. Contrary to what conservatives say, ex-Catholics are not flocking to the evangelicals because they think the Catholic church is politically too liberal. They are leaving to get spiritual nourishment from worship services and the Bible.
Looking at the responses of those who join mainline churches also provides some surprising results. For example, few (20 percent) say they left because they stopped believing in Catholic teachings. However, when specific issues were mentioned in the questionnaire, more of those joining mainline churches agreed that these issues influenced their decision to leave the Catholic church. Thirty-one percent cited unhappiness with the churchs teaching on abortion and homosexuality, women, and divorce and remarriage, and 26 percent mentioned birth control as a reason for leaving. Although these numbers are higher than for Catholics who become evangelicals, they are still dwarfed by the number (57 percent) who said their spiritual needs were not met in the Catholic church.
Thus, those becoming evangelicals were more generically unhappy than specifically unhappy with church teaching, while those who became mainline Protestant tended to be more specifically unhappy than generically unhappy with church teaching. The unhappiness with the churchs teaching on poverty, war and the death penalty was equally low for both groups (11 percent for evangelicals; 10 percent for mainline).
What stands out in the data on Catholics who join mainline churches is that they tend to cite personal or familiar reasons for leaving more frequently than do those who become evangelicals. Forty-four percent of the Catholics who join mainline churches say that they married someone of the faith they joined, a number that trumps all doctrinal issues. Only 22 percent of those who join the evangelicals cite this reason.
Perhaps after marrying a mainline Christian and attending his or her churchs services, the Catholic found the mainline services more fulfilling than the Catholic service. And even if they were equally attractive, perhaps the exclusion of the Protestant spouse from Catholic Communion makes the more welcoming mainline church attractive to an ecumenical couple.
Those joining mainline communities also were more likely to cite dissatisfaction of the Catholic clergy (39 percent) than were those who became evangelical (23 percent). Those who join mainline churches are looking for a less clerically dominated church.
Lessons from the data
There are many lessons that we can learn from the Pew data, but I will focus on only three.
First, those who are leaving the church for Protestant churches are more interested in spiritual nourishment than doctrinal issues. Tinkering with the wording of the creed at Mass is not going to help. No one except the Vatican and the bishops cares whether Jesus is one in being with the Father or consubstantial with the Father. That the hierarchy thinks this is important shows how out of it they are.
While the hierarchy worries about literal translations of the Latin text, people are longing for liturgies that touch the heart and emotions. More creativity with the liturgy is needed, and that means more flexibility must be allowed. If you build it, they will come; if you do not, they will find it elsewhere. The changes that will go into effect this Advent will make matters worse, not better.
Second, thanks to Pope Pius XII, Catholic scripture scholars have had decades to produce the best thinking on scripture in the world. That Catholics are leaving to join evangelical churches because of the church teaching on the Bible is a disgrace. Too few homilists explain the scriptures to their people. Few Catholics read the Bible.
The church needs a massive Bible education program. The church needs to acknowledge that understanding the Bible is more important than memorizing the catechism. If we could get Catholics to read the Sunday scripture readings each week before they come to Mass, it would be revolutionary. If you do not read and pray the scriptures, you are not an adult Christian. Catholics who become evangelicals understand this.
Finally, the Pew data shows that two-thirds of Catholics who become Protestants do so before they reach the age of 24. The church must make a preferential option for teenagers and young adults or it will continue to bleed. Programs and liturgies that cater to their needs must take precedence over the complaints of fuddy-duddies and rubrical purists.
Current religious education programs and teen groups appear to have little effect on keeping these folks Catholic, according to the Pew data, although those who attend a Catholic high school do appear to stay at a higher rate. More research is needed to find out what works and what does not.
The Catholic church is hemorrhaging members. It needs to acknowledge this and do more to understand why. Only if we acknowledge the exodus and understand it will we be in a position to do something about it.
In general terms, exCatholics are very bitter. ExProds have very warm feeling towards their former church.
They’re mainly people who didn’t believe anything anyway, but were just on the Church’s rolls because that’s what their family did, 1, 2, or maybe even 3 generations ago.
And there are still a lot more catholics like that. The real issue that the Church fails to address is this: is Catholicism a faith or a culture?
There are mexican hookers with cross tattoos. There is a whole “culture of catholicism” that has nothing to do with Jesus whatever.
And the Church seems to implicitly accept that because they’re “our people”. And this kind of thinking is what leads them to push for greater immigration from the south, whether legal or illegal.
This is an immoral policy. And those who want a Holy Church should shout and scream at their Church representatives until they get back on a Holy path, instead of a political one.
“In general terms, exCatholics are very bitter.”
I agree, and understand why. Regardless of what the “study” says, 100% of the ex-Catholics I know left the Church to get married again after a divorce (in which they or the spouse wouldn’t qualify for marriage within the Church). They are bitter because they know in their heart of hearts that they are “playing church” when they go to a Protestant denomination to “play family”. Also, 80% of them never attend any church again after the faux-wedding.
I stand corrected; 2% of the ex-Catholics I know are former priests who wanted to get married (and did). Only 98% wanted re-marriage after divorce.
The very conservative Reformed church that i attend is filled with former Catholics... can’t think of any where divorce was the reason.
Be warned, however, that this thread will go toxic fast.
Whenever it is discussed here at FR, the Catholic defenders would rather burn the place to the ground rather than permit and allow ex-Catholics who now profess a personal faith in Jesus as Christians "get away with it."
It will always be something. There must be a list somewhere:
- you were never a Catholic
- the Catholics never did this but always did that, you just were too dumb to notice
- you don't "sound or behave like a Christian to me!"
- all the people who profess to be Protesants now are jerks
“Thus, both as believers and as worshipers, Catholics who become Protestants are statistically better Christians than those who stay Catholic. We are losing the best, not the worst.”
I agree 110%
As for the Kennedy Catholics of mid 20th century and thereafter in the USA, good riddance.
Count me in on that.
In general terms, exCatholics are very bitter.
I have not encountered that and I know PLENTY ex-Catholics. Most of them have an attitude like that of bb, as she just commented on another thread.
In all honesty, gc, it sounds like an RC hijacked your screen name.
It's called apostacy, and it's been foretold.
You are correct.
Polled each and every one of them, did you?
For the record, I don’t believe it because almost every Protestant/Evangelical/Pentecostal church is packed with former Catholics and of all the ones I’ve talked to about leaving, not one of them gave wanting a divorce as a reason.
Why should they? They can just get an annulment (aka. Catholic divorce) if they don’t like their marriage and stay in the Catholic church.
Might broad brush there. My wife is a recovering Catholic, was never married, and she is not only NOT bitter, but one of the most loving people I know. She is our Church Secretary and is very active in the ladies ministry.
I think many join evangelical churches to have their sin forgiven while many join liberal mainline churches to have their sin excused.
The Apostacy happened when the Priests and Popes substituted the traditions of man for the word of God.
I left the Catholic church years before I got married. The Catholic church's stance on divorce, remarriage, birth control, etc, had NOTHING whatsoever to do with it. It was because of theology, plain and simple.
I found that Catholic teaching did not line up with the clear teaching of Scripture in way too many areas.
I have to completely disagree with you. I have a LOT of friends who are former Catholics, and they did not leave because of marriage. Almost all of them say that they started reading their Bibles and realized that the Catholic church did not adhere to its teachings.
I believe that in Mexico particularly, the Catholic church is losing a lot of members.
I am not Catholic, but do respect the Catholic church and its faith, if that’s where its members find Christ. But I know on this board the fruit of the Spirit is seldom ever in the responses from the Catholics, and it’s very sad. Often, sarcasm and put downs are the modus operendi.
You can only fix a problem if you dare see it for what it really is.
Because of Christ and Him alone!
There is death in the churches that are overcome with power struggles and unbelief. The churches leftists took over will die out for a lack of spirit in their rejection of God like the Europeans. They will make future atheists.
The Catholics are hurt by the leftists and pagan female goddess Mary worshipers in all their organizations constantly making an fool out of that which is holy, loving and good in the church - JESUS. Sometimes I think the Catholic church is doomed unless it starts over from scratch with true believers in the Spirit and truth of Christ and lets the nonbelievers to go their way and leave the church. The spirit of darkness is so entrenched within the organizations and they tell the young people there is no truth nor saving grace in Jesus which is very dispiriting.
Evangelicals are up the creek if they don't turn away from the worship of materialism. Sugar Daddy god has run it's course. The Gospel of Jesus is much more than abundance in material.
“First, those who are leaving the church for Protestant churches are more interested in spiritual nourishment than doctrinal issues.”
Quite so. Spiritual hunger, a desire to be taught and fed from the Scriptures, is basically the reason ex-Catholics have told me they are no longer Catholics.
Doctrinal teachings do matter but that comes later and these ex-Catholics have said they would not return for those reasons.
Theyre mainly people who didnt believe anything anyway, but were just on the Churchs rolls because thats what their family did, 1, 2, or maybe even 3 generations ago.
My wife is ex-catholic. What caused her to leave was her growing understanding of the bible and what it teaches.
The ones who split to evangelical churches have many reasons.
Exactly. In the world stats are important. In Christianity, every single person is a unique entity. Attacking the situation by lumping people into statistical groups is the way of the world, not Christianity. Each person leaving, or coming to the church has their own personal and very nuanced reasons.
the invisible hand
Stay out of this thread, it is a repeat thread of an article by the Jesuit Reese from over 1 year ago. Most Catholics who leave the Church [half go to agnosticism or atheistism] of those that to various forms of protestantism and to various ecclesial communities, it varies many go to mainline liberal protestantism, some to pentecostal types and some of fundammentalism, some to various evangelical stripes and as other studies have shown, you will find most of those Catholics who go to Protestantism will not make 1 change, it will be repeated several times throughout their lives which in a sense is suggest that many of these Catholics go to the ecclesial community of what is happening now.
I don’t most much here any more and will not get involved in these thread as it has many of the “usual suspects”.
THANKS FOR THE PING.
Will send you an email if I can find your current one.
That is absurd. As in MA, most RCs are liberal, which every study i have seen confirms, and i have seen a lot: http://www.peacebyjesus.com/RC-Stats_vs._Evang.html, and it is the evangelicals that they fear the most.
You mean, like Raymond Brown?
That Catholics are leaving to join evangelical churches because of the church teaching on the Bible is a disgrace.
What the Catholic Church has taught about the Bible for the past century is a disgrace.
Too few homilists explain the scriptures to their people. Few Catholics read the Bible.
Oh my goodness. Catholics are becoming Protestants and the stupid author (and many like him) think the problem will be solved by spending more time telling Catholics that the Bible is a fairy tale.
This is Cloud Cuckooland.
See actual stats from many known sources: here. The reality is that Roman Catholic churches covet evangelical converts in order enliven there overall dead pewsl My old priests used to exhorts us, sing like Protestants.
While Islam is the fastest growing, and Nones more so than Christians: http://peacebyjesus.witnesstoday.org/RevealingStatistics.html#Sec2
If by the “church” means the building and the priest, then Catholics are probably not broadly well fed, when they attend only weekly on Sundays. If they were poorly catechized growing up then yes, they are probably found spiritually wanting today.
Sundays in the evangelical churches are rousing, spiritually experiential, with soaring senses, so a poorly fed Catholic ex is comforted there in his own relationship with his God.
On the other hand, for all her flaws and spiritless priests giving boring homilies, there she is, still standing. Christ’s Church. He is there within her, in His tabernacle to be consumed, transferred from the hands of the hands, of the hands of the Apostles themselves to my lips. Beating that? Just impossible, IMHO.
In other words, they want a church service that entertains them, because they go to church to be entertained, because, really, you know, it's all about them, and if it's not fun, they aren't interested.
As someone said above, it's called "apostasy," and it was prophesied long ago.
That sure is a way to ignore the truth, nobody believes that, most of these people are looking for a deeper more Christian involvement, with more conservative parishioners and preachers, and preaching.
I thought we always had to have a live source for a post/story. It appears you don’t have one. Hmmm
I’ve been told the mods like to check on the validy of a thread that way.
Perhaps I’m wrong, but I don’t think so.
You could air that out and fertilize the garden with it. Most of these people either want to contracept, abort their children, divorce and remarry, ordain women, or engage in aberrant sexual behavior. These people want God on their terms, not His.
Catholics vote for what you just described, Evangelicals vote against it, it is why some would leave what you described and seek what they believe to be a deeper, more conservative form of worship, and congregation.
I have been meaning to post for years on something like that, it goes beyond the service, you brought up a very good point that can be much elaborated on.
I just posted this in another thread and is appropriate
here. It doesn’t matter the exodus now...
God knows what is going to happen. Its been awhile, in my reading them, for fourteen years the Catholic messages from Heaven and the Protestant point to..are in preparation for one thing...the Remnant is Roman Catholic. The world is close to the Great Tribulation, the end of the 6th Day.
My advise, pray, repent from the heart and confess your
mortal sins. Believe in the Holy Eucharist and any misunderstandings about the faith will fall away.
God has always desired everyone believe the same. He is
going to help (free will is a gift) make it happen with
I put one word in CAPS.
~ ~ ~
God Speaks Will You Listen
...Hence lukewarm Catholics will persecute my faithful Catholics. After the warning, there will only be one church. All Protestant denominations will have no reason to exist. For all Protestants will see the truth in my Catholic Church. Those Protestants who in their pride reject my truth, will become apostate and persecute my true Catholics. Many Protestants will enter my church because of the warning. The ungodly will persecute my faithful remnant because the ungodly rejected my mercy. A fierce persecution will rage like a fire in certain parts of your world. Europe, North America, and Latin America will persecute my faithful severely. My son, the largest number of converts will come from the pagan religions. Many Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, and tribal peoples will accept my mercy and truth because of the warning. My church will experience a large amount of growth in those areas. I will need my faithful to teach these converts. Many miracles will take place at this time. Bilocation and other miracles assisted by my angels will occur. My faithful may be teaching in different areas of the world. After the warning, there will only be a short time given to mankind to repent. If no repentance is done, I will allow Satan and the antichrist to chastise a sinful generation. At this time, many faithful will be: called home, persecuted, martyred, and taken to my refuges. Only those who are not spiritual babies with my divine life residing in their souls will endure those days and enter my era of peace. My son, at baptism all my children receive sanctifying grace, but many do not
progress beyond spiritual infancy. I will not lose any the Father has given to me. My spiritual babies will come home to be with me to prevent the loss of their souls. A soul who does not partake of my Eucharist REMAINS a spiritual baby. Just as a human baby must eat solid food to grow to adulthood, so spiritually you must receive my graces through the sacraments to mature to spiritual adulthood. The body must be fed to grow. Likewise, the soul must be fed to grow and mature. Satan knows this truth. This is why he has deceived many of my people with false interpretations of my scriptures. Many teach the physical nation of Israel is the fulfillment of my scripture. Many teach the antichrist will resume the Jewish sacrifice in a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem to constitute the abomination of desolation. This is a false teaching, not from God, but from human understanding. My son, in the book of Daniel, the persecution by the Jews under Antiochus can be considered a partial fulfillment of the abomination of desolation. But the complete fulfillment has not yet taken place. At my death, the veil in the temple was rent in two and the old sacrificial covenant was replaced by my new covenant. My sacrifice on the cross was the final sacrifice for my peoplesâ sin. I am the fulfillment of the promise to Abraham. I am the seed of Abraham, the son of David, in whom all the nations of the earth are blessed. My nation of Israel is my church, not the modern nation of Israel. My people are now all those who become part of my church through sanctifying grace. The complete fulfillment of the prophecy from Daniel of the abomination of desolation will occur: when the continual sacrifice of the mass is abolished by the false prophet and the anti christ. Acceptance of the protestant doctrine of the mass by an anti pope will be the fulfillment of the prophecy. The temple of God is my Holy Roman Catholic Church. My faithful remnant will be persecuted worldwide...
The people who leave the Catholic Church are badly catechized. If they knew the faith, they would not leave.
The Church is going to experience her crucifixion but after,
in the new time, the Millennium, everyone will believe in
Our Lord’s presence in the Eucharist.
You are absolutely welcome to have all the regular National Catholic Fishwrap (a/k/a NCR) readers that you’d like. If you can do something with them, all the better to you.
I have never met a “former Catholic” who attributed their loss of faith to theology or unfulfillment (though some Catholics complain about both); every “former Catholic” I know (who actually attends services anywhere else, as opposed to just becoming a non-Mass attending Catholic) did it over personal involvement with the divorce/remarriage question.
Here in NJ our former governor did it after leaving his Catholic wife & child; he went to an Episcopal seminary and moved in with his boyfriend.
Now you have.
Wow. In a time when all of Christianity is under attack from our own government, athiests, gays, Muslims, etc. here we are arguing over who has the greater numbers or who’s losing the greater numbers. We’re right, you’re wrong. Pride. Last time I checked, that was a sin.
We should be above this, FRiends.
I’ve seen them on TV, too; cyber-people are whatever they want to be.